DUKE 
UNIVERSITY 


LIBRARY 


= E 


EDITED BY 
CLARENCE WALWORTH ALVORD 


UNIVERSITY OF ILLINOIS 


ILLINOIS 
STATE, HISTORICAL LIBRARY 


BOARD OF TRUSTEES 


Ne Evarts BouteLtt GREENE, President 
CHARLES HENRY RAMMELKAMP, Vice-President 
Otto LEOPOLD ScHMIDT, Secretary 


Jessie Parmer WezeER, Librarian 


ADVISORY COMMISSION 


Evarts BouTELL GREENE 
WILLIAM Epwarp Dopp 
_ James ALTON JAMES 
ANDREW CUNNINGHAM McLAUGHLIN 
_ Witiiam Aucustus MEESE 2 
EDWARD CARLETON PAGE 
CHARLES HENRY RAMMELKAMP 
CLARENCE WALWORTH ALVORD, ex officio 


STITUTIONAL SERIES 
VOLUME II ust ee 


‘CONSTITUTIONAL DEBATES _ 


' 


EDITED WITH INTRODUCTION AND NOTES BY 


ARTHUR CHARLES COLE 


UNIVERSITY OF ILLINoIs 


; 


’ parece BY THE TRUSTEES OF THE ; 

“ILLINOIS STATE HISTORICAL ee 
SPRINGFIELD, ILLINOIS 

an F Igt 9 


CopyricuT, 1919 
be Hee IS 2 
Tue Iniinors State Hisrorica 


6} 
+ 


ILLINOIS PRINTING COMPANY _ 
| DANVILLE, ILLINOIS © 


SAB tes ucla i Pua Las ci a 


PREFACE 


; The addition of seventy-two years to Illinois history, 
and a fifth attempt to remodel her fundamental law, 
_ have made apparent the value of publishing the debates 
of the Constitutional Convention of 1847. Working in 
an atmosphere of “economy, retrenchment, and re- 
form,” the delegated representatives of the authority 
of this Commonwealth in 1847 decided to forego an 
official edition of debates and content themselves with 
ae versions. Many were aware of the service 
Which a collection of debates would have rendered to 


os reform; they were not so alive to their obliga- 
_ tions to posterity and to their successors in constitu- 
tional amendment in Illinois. 

____ The present volume is the result of an effort to re- 


~ complete single account available was found in the 
_ tri-weekly edition of the [//inois State Register; strangely 
e enough, however, the weekly edition often contained 
more detailed accounts of certain addresses and debates. 


nor were they always able to hear what was said. . The 
_ Regisier, too, was not always ready to devote space to 
the utterances of party opponents. It left this obliga- 
tion to its rival, the Sangamo Fournal. No other papers 
in Illinois attempted to present a running record of the 
debates. Newspaper correspondents were at the con- 
vention in force but at best they were satisfied with 
; ill 


4 85999 


construct the records of this convention. The most 


The reporters were not always prompt in their arrival 


~ 


iv ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


making daily memoranda of the topics discussed, of the 
trend of the debates, and of the current political gossip. 
The version presented in this volume is the Register 
tri-weekly account supplemented in important omis- 
sions by items from the weekly edition and from the 
Sangamo Fournal. 
The preparation of this volume has been made 
possible by the codperation of Mrs. Jessie Palmer Weber 
of the Illinois State Historical Library and of Dr. W. F. 
Dodd of the Illinois Legislative Reference Bureau. The 
newspaper files.used in the text were those of the Illinois 
State Historical Library. They have been supple- 
mented for editorial work by the files of the Chicago 
Historical Society, of the Newberry Library, Chicago, 
of the Library of Congress, and of the Illinois Historical 
Survey. The index has been prepared for the practical 
use of students of political science by Miss Ethel Gwinn, 
working under the direction of Professor John A. 
Fairlie. I am especially indebted to Miss Nellie C. 
~., , Armstrong, who, in the capacity of editorial assistant, 
~\.*... bls shown the greatest zeal and care in collating and 
| proof-reading. 


at ARTHUR C. CoLE 


Ursana, ILiinots 
January, 1920 


CONTENTS 


eMC ULON IMAM re Al rap Laila ul ire Sekt gh" Ged 


a Monpay, June 7, 1847 Ree Paha Nia Na PMueC ate Barly Nn het 


The convention assembled; credentials of members presented; 
president, secretary, sergeant-at-arms elected; printing of the debates 
discussed; “economy, retrenchment and reform’’. 


REECE AY, PONE O...0 OLN G hh lN 


Employment of additional officers discussed; authority of conven- 
tion to limit pay of members and officers; report of Committee on 
Rules adopted. 


hee: SMELIN NSD Aves MUNE OH iP aaron ohn Wall seta ela 


Legislative powers of the convention discussed; employment of 
_ additional officers considered; pay of members of convention; ad- 
_ ditional officers elected. 


Beelewespsy Jone to) ec ee eh oe es 


_ Length of daily sessions decided upon; presentation of various 
_ resolutions pertaining to organization. 


Reconsideration of the rules of the convention; debate on 
advisability of taking up resolutions on three great departments of 
_ government; resolutions discussed in Committee of the Whole. 


PURE LONDAY .) PUNE IA) ty Wem a a irla ah lurkers Ck tuts 
Standing committees announced; discussion as to form of procedure 
in “the amendment, revision or alteration”’ of the constitution; pres- 
entation of resolutions on subjects of banking, executive authority, 
state borrowing power; discussion as to advisability of printing debates. 


MM PeESDAY PUNE Te ol Peo Nh eas 


" Presentation of resolutions on subjects of judiciary, state borrowing 
power, veto power, manner of elections, term and salary of governor 
and members of General Assembly; discussion on bank question. 


Vv 


25'7999 


XV 


du132 


42 


45 


65 


82 


vi CONTENTS 


VIII... WEDNESDAY, | JUNE 16.0) (005... 1 
Debate on subject of poll tax as remedy for state debt. 


IX... Tuaurspay, JUNE 17) 20. 6) 3, 


Bank question debated; presentation of “equal rights” petition; 
abolition of county commissioners’ court discussed; presentation of 
resolutions on subjects of lotteries, divorces, abolishing office of probate 
justice and county recorder, banking. i 


X) Faipay, JUNE 18 (5.00 00.0 


Resolution prohibiting formation of new counties less than four 
hundred square miles in area; debate on resolution; debate on question 
of limiting numbers of the General Assembly. 


XI. Sarurpay) JUNE 19 8.0) 3. 


Debate on numbers of General Assembly; on county representative 
system; “economy, retrenchment and reform.”’ 


XII.. Monpay, JUNE 20 50 0 3) 


Debate on county representative system; on representation based on 
population; presentation of “equal rights’’ petition. 


XII. | Turespay, JUNE 22/6). es) 


Appointment of committee to apportion state into senatorial and 
representative districts; presentation of resolutions on courts of chan- 
cery and common law; discussion on election of secretary; debate on 
subject of banks; presentation of resolution concerning suffrage. 


XIV. WebneEspay, JUNE 23°. 0620... 


Presentation of resolutions concerning education; debate on inyest- 
ment of school funds in state bonds; discussion on subject of revenue. 


XV. Tuurspay, JuNE 24: . 4.) 3). 7 


Presentation of resolutions from Committee on Organization of 
Departments and Officers connected with the Executive Department; 
on taxation of government lands; on prohibition of dueling; rate of 
maximum taxation; limitation of power of legislature; agricultural 
resources of state; pay of members of convention; amendments to new 
constitution; prohibition of immigration of free negroes. 


MAVEN ORRIBAY, (UNE OG aie cn ene 


Immigration of free negroes; suffrage rights of citizens of other states; 
debate on subject of negro rights. 


itele) 


1m fo) 


127 


153 


171 


190 


210 


CONTENTS vii 


} BRT SATURDAY JUNE QO cal Vilar gle etd ae bes 8) 2289 


Petition prohibiting immigration of negroes to and emancipation of 
negroes in state; debate on subject of negro rights; personal difficulties 
in Committee on Education. 


teu MI GND AM MUON 2S: fic y's, Veh Grek nk Nie uk wh LOT 


Resolutions concerning banking; debate on bank question. 


Pe Ana Ty PUNE QQNy hy Wey lwiian tial lal Gao Mele sy eine LOR 


Debate on the subject of banks; question of absolute or temporary 
prohibition; liability of directors and stockholders. 


REPT EDNESDAY, JUNE (20. 40/6 04i (cf iyc le) a ose bees 284 


Consideration of report of Committee on the Legislative Depart- 
ment; debate on length and frequency of legislative sessions. 


BOTS AN UY) Teo acts vow td. te ascii A Be 
Presentation of resolutions; debate on length and frequency of 
Rha, legislative sessions, continued; on qualifications of representatives and 
senators; on numbers of representatives and senators. 


PME RT AY ULES vig cots vier) mila cate sme ie ne whats ZOO 
Discussion concerning pay of convention members; revision of com- 
mittee report, continued; time of meeting of legislature; officers of two 
houses and quorum; passage of bills. 


BRC NVEONDAYS POLY Biotic tau) WN NEMA ee atkins aoe 


) Report of Committee on the Legislative Department discussed; pay 
; of members of legislature; eligibility to office; suits against the state; 
sale of lands; special legislation. 


RUE ERA PUY Oia. We imide See havooan GN Moe Gee 


Reports from Committee on Incorporations presented; from Com- 
mittee on the Division of the State into Counties; report of Committee 
on the Legislative Department discussed; debate on section 31 of the 
4 report. 


DP NMED NE SEAN: (PULY A ess Ce a ue aii oe. oe 


Report of Committee on the Legislative Department discussed; 
discussion on special legislation; on banks; question of representative 
bi apportionment. 


vill CONTENTS 


XXVI. Tuurspay, Jury 8... . s.r 


Newspaper misrepresentation of convention delegates; limitation of 
length and frequency of speeches of delegates; resolutions of sympathy 
to the families of Hardin, Zabriskie, and Houghton; eulogy; considera- 
tion of report of Committee on the Legislative Department; question 
of representation; state debt. 


XXVIII... Frmay, JULY 9°22 Oo So 


Report of Committee on the Legislative Department; supplies, 
printing, etc., for the legislature; life, liberty, and property guaranteed; 
report of Committee on the Executive Department; governor’s term of 
office, date of election, eligibility to office, age requirement; debate on 
Native Americanism. 


XXVIII. Saturpay, JULY Io .. © .°). > 


Report of Committee on the Executive Department; debate con- 
cerning governor’s salary. 


XXIX. Mownpay, Jury 12.5.) 2 0) 4) 2 


Report of Committee on the Executive Department; governor’s 


salary; resolution concerning Mr. Hale’s denunciation of the Mexican 
War. 


XXX. Tuurspay, Jury 15°. 00.) 9)... 2 


Report of Committee on the Executive Department; pardoning 
power; special sessions of legislature. 


XXXI..) Fripay, Jury 16.20. .),, 


Adoption of additional rules of procedure; report of Committee on 
the Executive Department; special sessions of legislature; duties of 
lieutenant-governor; signing of bills; veto power. 


XXX SATURDAY, JULY 170.207) se. 


Veto power; appointment or election of secretary of state; compen- 
sation of secretary of state. 


XXXII. Monpay, Jury tg! 035 ooo 


Resolutions on the deaths of Lieutenants Fletcher, Robbins, and 
Ferguson; report of Committee on the Judiciary; classes of courts, 
regulation by constitution or legislature; jurisdiction of various courts; 
personnel of supreme court. 


338 


356 


375 


383 


30% 


395 


424 


446 


CONTENTS 


Ni: Tuespay, JuLy 20 Piety Ne se dic 
Resolutions concerning state debt; discontinuance of practice of 


ew gute Gore a: oe ect AS ani pf 


Rica of Committee on the Judiciary; dleneen of judges; district 
$ system or general; term of judges. 


_XXXVL ‘Tuurspay, UGE WT OE rare rent ume RCE ys fo he 


Vy: Discussion concerning treatment of clergymen in the convention; 
_ report of Committee on the Judiciary; number of districts; appoint- 
ment or election of judges. 


eyit.; Wemay, Jury 23. 0). eg SR 


_ Report of Committee on the Judiciary; number of districts; supreme 
court sessions; reference of report to a special committee; report of 
- Committee on the Organization of Departments; auditor of public 
accounts; state treasurer; report of Committee on Elections and Right 
of Suffrage; qualifications for right of suffrage. 


CX Il. Mownpay, Jury 26 . Mark hat foe was Sik Bee 


y ss Resolution concerning restoration of practice of opening convention 
oor Sessions with prayer; discussion as to propriety of printing various 
propositions; discussion on the subject of a new carpet. 


DRM ReSEA GE EUTY AF ct. ON Nek tee ahd 


- Right of suffrage; effect on immigration; right of state to control 
suffrage; Native Americanism. 


BRVRMRLESDAW POUT IN tooo) Ra cen) ie Ae 
poche of suffrage; lengthy debate on extension of suffrage to foreign- 


Bebe RAY. PUTO OS Pe. ue pes OS 


Right of suffrage; debate continued; date of cleticnes oe report 
of ae on the Militia. 


XLII. PREYS PUTWINEL (1 Dh gu miet hits On Set rood! Whe 


Report of Committee on Revenue; debate on subject of poll = on 
its application to foreigners. 


469 


485 


498 


ag 


524 


aa 


581 


615 


x CONTENTS 


XLITI.. Sarurpay; Jury 31.0). 2. 


Discussion concerning date of adjournment of convention; report of 
Committee on the Revenue; taxation of “corporations and govern- 
ments;” minimum land valuation; exemption from taxation. 


XLIV. Mownpay, Aucust2... . 2). ee 


Report of Committee on the Revenue; exemptions from taxation; 
sale of lands for taxation. 


XLV. .\Turspay, AUGUST 3... |). 5) 


Report of Committee on Incorporations; debate on subject of bank- 


ing; liability of corporation members for corporation debts. 


XLVI... Wepnespay, AucuUsT 4. . . ./} a 


Continuation of debate on the bank question; absolute prohibition 
or regulated system of banking; submission of question separately to 
people. 


XLVIIJ. THurspay, Aucust 5... . ». (ee 


Continuation of debate on the bank question; responsibility of cor- 
poration members for corporation debts and liabilities. 


XLVIII. Fripay,Aucust6. :... . > 3) See 


Report of Committee on the Legislative Department, as amended in 
committee of the whole. 


XLIX. Sarurpay, Aucust 7... . . .)) 32 


Resolutions of sympathy upon the death of Captain Franklin Niles; 
report of Committee on the Legislative Department; eligibility of 
state officers to other offices; impeachment; special legislation; ques- 
tion of bank, 


L. ‘Monvay, Aucust 9. . 1.)..2.° 2), 2 


Bank question; limitation upon legislative power; separate sub- 
mission of bank question to people; impeachment; eligibility to seats 
in the General Assembly; oath of office; granting of divorces; suits 
against the state; lotteries; sale of lands belonging to individuals. 


LI. Tugspay, Aucust 10%.) 24)... hee 


Exemption of freehold from execution; division of state into repre- 
sentative and senatorial districts; personal liberty rights; census; 
apportionment of senators and representatives; state appropriations; 
monopolies. 


628 


636 


640 


658 


674 


7o1 


7°7 


722 


CONTENTS xi 


De WIERNESDAY, AUGUSTAET ) isc) We sb Stead SRY a oa FBO 


a Apportionment of representatives; provisions concerning state 
| printing, binding, fuel, etc.; sale of land for taxes; amendment of bank 
charter; review of report of Committee on the Executive Department. 


é 


SE PAORSDAW AUGUST L2G ey ae tae UN wt 4 


Consideration of report of Committee on the Executive Department; 
report of Committee on the Judiciary; mode of selecting supreme court 
ha judges; classes of courts; ‘personnel of supreme court. 


Demme, AUGUST 13.) eee a 


Mode of selecting judges; rotation of terms of office; jurisdiction; 
place of sessions of supreme court; county courts; county justices. 


RR SATURDAY, AUGUST Ta) oi). Me en Bh la he gh 97 


County courts and justices; mode of selecting. justices; court of 
probate; quarterly terms of probate court; jurisdiction; duties of 
county judge; appointment of committee to provide for submission of 
constitution to people. 


ee me ey ie all 


BE VIONDAY AUGUST IG) 284 cd lets ite OL re Re TOS 


County courts; clerk of county courts; authority of legislature to 
reorganize county court system; compensation of judges; justices of the 
peace. 


y Pe RSH AN OM OGUST Deyo ge aie i ean will Ame OT 


Jurisdiction of justice of peace; attorney-general; prosecuting attor- 
‘ ney; county prosecuting attorney; fees of attorneys; clerk of circuit 
court; clerk of supreme court; commissioning of judicial officers by 
governor; form of judicial documents. 


Meni WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 19.3030 Se EO 800 


Division of state into judicial circuits; cost of system; terms of 
court in each circuit; salary of judges; eligibility to other offices; 
requirements for office; length of term; prohibition of banks; report of 
Committee on Commons; poll tax. 


LEG RSDAY AMGUST IG) a fy $e Pee a ee BED 


Division of state into representative and senatorial districts; revenue; 
poll tax; sale of lands for taxes; valuation of property. 


xil CONTENTS 


LX. Fripay, AucusT 20... .. .. . 32) en 


Formation of new counties; report of Committee on Law Reform; 
report of Committee on Townships. 


LXI. Satrurpay, AuGUST21I. . . . . | 


Printing of constitution in German and Norwegian; time of adjourn- 
ment of convention; pay of members; Bill of Rights; right of abolish- 
ng the constitution. 


LXII. Mownpay, AucusT 23 . .2 <> 4. ane 


Bill of Rights; religious freedom; freedom of election; civil and 
political rights of negroes; trial by jury; search and seizure; necessity 
for indictment by grand jury; bail; penalties; imprisonment for debt; 
ex post facto laws. 


LXIII. Tuespay, Aucust 24. .|. 3.) 2a 


Prohibition of dueling; rights of negroes; right of peaceable assem- 
bly; mode of levying tax; right to reform government; freedom of 
press; division of senatorial and representative districts. 


LXIV. Wepnespay, Aucus¥25 ¢ 9... |.) 


Senatorial and representative districts; report of Committee on 
Finance; three mill tax; three grand judicial circuits; appeal from 
circuit courts; report of Committee on Law Reform; codification of 
aws. 


LXV. Tuurspay, Aucusr 26 . .-.-. #2) 


Adoption of new convention rules; report of Committee on Educa- 
tion; duties of superintendent of schools; educational needs of state. 


LXVI. FEripay, Aucust 27. }. ) ip... 


Education; mode of selecting superintendent of schools; govern- 
ment money for schools; report of Committee on Revision; amend- 
ment of constitution; question of finance. 


LXVII. Sarurpay, Aucust 28... 29. . 4) 


Collection of taxes; state debt; printing of constitution; distribution 
of constitution among foreign population. 


LXVITI.. Monpvay, Aucust 30 >.>. 45 4) 


Time of elections; copies of the Fournal of the Convention to each 
delegate. 


821 


839 


854 


869 


879 


897 


922 


93% 


es Sahn 


of constitution; provisions for sig 
t of conv ; ‘i 


4 e ¥ + i a : . ein 2 \ 944 
ing by absent members; 


articles and sections; subject index. 


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INTRODUCTION 


A little over two decades of development under its 
original charter of statehood brought Illinois to the 
point where it chafed at the restraints of its constitu- 
tional swaddling clothes. The movement for a new 
constitution, therefore, received definite recognition in 
the legislative session of 1840-1841 when a joint resolu- 
tion to refer the question of a Constitutional Conven- 
tion to the popular vote received more than the two- 
thirds vote required by the fundamental law. The 
Belleville Advocate soon listed seventeen reasons for a 
convention and in successive issues proceeded to explain 
them to its readers, who seem to have responded 
favorably to the program set forth.t Most of the 
political spokesmen of the day, however, hesitated to 
place specific reasons for a convention before the voters 
with the result that the election of August 1, 1842, 
revealed a serious indifference on the part of the elector- 
ate and the proposition failed to secure the required 
majority. 

Again in 1845 the General Assembly moved to 
submit the proposition to the electorate and this time 
the convention backers carried the day by a vote of 
$7,806 to 18,568.83 There followed a fight between 


northern Illinois and Egypt as to whether the census 


of 1840 or the figures of 1845 should be used as a basis 


1 Belleville Advocate, October 21, December 2, 9, 1841. 

*'The figures in the Secretary of State’s Records of Election Returns, 1:364-365, 
are too incomplete for citation. 

3Records of Election Returns, 1:476-477. The gubernatorial contest of the 
same year drew out 100,847 votes. Both elections were held on August 3, 1846. 


XV 


Xvi ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


for apportionment. In this skirmish the northern 
advocates of the 1845 basis were successful in securing 
for their section the advantage of its rapid growth 
during the forties. On April 19, 1847, the election of 
delegates took place. By this time the party leaders 
were trying to define a strategy which would enable 
them to control the situation. The Democrats became 
‘more and more vocal on the importance of an anti-bank 
provision, of popular election of state officials, including 
even supreme court judges, of an effective veto power, 
and of insuring the infusion of pure democratic princi- 
ples into the fundamental law. The Whigs openly 
accepted the popular demand for economy and reform; 
inwardly they nursed hopes of excluding foreigners 
from suffrage by a citizenship qualification and of 
inserting a clause permitting some sort of a banking 
system. The Democrats hauled out the obligation of 
party regularity while the Whigs concealed their 
ambitions in a subtle insinuating appeal to a “no — 
party”’ stand.* When at length the results of the 
election were tabulated it was found that while the 
Democrats had elected a safe majority with 91 out of 
the 162 delegates, the Whigs were represented in 
sufficient force to occasion a grave element of uncer- 
tainty in the work of the convention. 

The Constitutional Convention which assembled at 
Springfield, June 7, 1847, included only 7 native Illi- 
noisians. ‘There were 26 New Englanders, 38 from 
the middle states, 35 from the South Atlantic seaboard, 
41 from Kentucky and Tennessee, and 10 from Ohio 

4See Campbell’s complaint against this “no party” trick, post, 480: “He 


scorned such tricks, preferring the bold, manly course of a whig like Harry of the 
West, who never said ‘no party.’”” See also [/linois State Register, April 2. 


INTRODUCTION Xvii 


and Indiana.’ Here was eloquent testimony to the 
westward: course of empire. Of the delegates, the 
farmers with 75 were most numerous, but there were 
s4 lawyers, besides 12 physicians, 9 merchants, § 
mechanics, and 7 others. It was a body of young men 
nearer in age to the two twenty-six-year-old delegates 
than the sage of sixty-six. 

Several members brought to the convention valued 
experiences garnered in long and active political careers. 
The most conspicuous of these was Zadoc Casey, of 
Mt. Vernon, whose public services had already included 
a term as lieutenant-governor, and five terms in Con- 
gress. At the age of fifty-one, however, he seems to 
have lost much of his vigor of action, so that the quiet 
influence of his presence was greater than that of his 
utterances before the convention; there was complaint, 
indeed, that instead of participating in the debates and 
giving the delegates the benefit of his age and experience, 
he offered “nothing but continual croaking, adjourn! 
adjourn.”’6 

The group of more active participants in the con- 
vention debates included delegates in various stages of 
their public careers. William R. Archer, a rising young 
lawyer from Pittsfield, displayed qualities of leadership 
which explain his later political activity. Albert G. 
‘Caldwell, a Shawneetown attorney, Charles H. Con- 
‘stable, an influential Whig leader and state senator, 
were frequently on the floor of the convention. Thomp- 
son Campbell of Galena, who had for four years 
rendered capable service as secretary of state, was an 


5 Five of foreign birth included three from Scotland and one each from Germany 
iy Ireland. See list of members; cf. Alton Telegraph and Democratic Review, 
uly 9. 
6See post, 843. 


xviii ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


energetic and eloquent spokesman of the Democratic 
faith. John Dement, the Dixon delegate, by his 
activity qualified for his later services in the constitu- 
tional conventions of 1862, and 1869-1870. Ninian 
W. Edwards, an agressive veteran Whig legislator from 
Springfield, David L. Gregg, an influential Chicagoan 
of opposite stripe, Samuel S. Hayes, the twenty-six- 
year-old delegate from Carmi, and Lincoln B. Knowlton, 


the eloquent Peoria lawyer, were frequently on the 


floor. Samuel D. Lockwood of Jacksonville, and 
Stephen T, Logan of Springfield, two staunch conserva- 
tive Whig veterans, honored the convention with the 
experiences of their long political careers. The young 
lawyer from Carlinville, John M. Palmer, at this 
convention laid the foundations for the brilliant career 
which lay ahead ofhim. Judge Walter B. Scates of Mt. 
Vernon, was one of the most active influences in the 
convention. James W. Singleton of Mt. Sterling, 
Archibald Williams of Quincy, and David M. Woodson 
of Carrollton, aggressively upheld the Whig cause 
against the attacks of various capable Democratic 
opponents, among whom were Francis C. Sherman 
of Chicago, and Hezekiah M. Wead, a lawyer from 


Lewistown.’ ‘ 


The organization of the convention by the Demo- — 


cratic majority with Newton Cloud of Waverly as 
presiding officer, removed the potent influence of this 
preacher-farmer-legislator from the active counsels of 
the convention. The Whigs did not place a party 
candidate in the field but aided in the election of Cloud 

7 During the early days of the session a contemporary critic complained of an 


unwarrantable propensity for making speeches among “the unfledged politicians, 
and embryo statesmen.” Alton Telegraph and Democratic Review, June 25. 


INTRODUCTION xix 


over Zadoc Casey.2 Henry W. Moore, a Gallatin 
County lawyer, was engaged to act as secretary and 
John A. Wilson as sergeant-at-arms. 

The convention was now ready to proceed. The 


- Sangamon County Whig delegates, Edwards and Logan, 


proposed, on the basis of economy, to ignore the legis- 
lative arrangement for the election of a printer with a 
fixed compensation and to let the work to the lowest 
responsible and capable bidder. They also opposed the 
election of assistant secretaries and of an assistant to the 


sergeant-at-arms. The Whig keynote, “economy, re- 


trenchment, and reform,” had already been sounded by 
Benjamin Bond of Carlyle, in a successful appeal to the 
convention to limit the number and pay of officers of 
the convention. The Democrats, unwilling to lose the 
fruits of their victory at the polls, challenged such 
economy and fought to rescind the Bond resolution; 
they claimed that all matters pertaining to the number 


‘and pay of officers had been settled in the legislative 


act which ordered the convention. They challenged 
the brand of economy that involved days of debate and 
a protracted session in order to save a few salary items, 
At length by sheer weight of numbers the Democrats 
won out and later elected the additional officers. The 
four days of debate on these preliminary questions 
seem not to have been entirely wasted. The discussion 
on economy developed into a consideration of the 
relative powers of the legislative authority of the state 
and of the convention; and while certain Democratic 


_ members regarded the Whig economy stand as involv- 


8The Democratic caucus was unable to agree upon a candidate. Casey was’ 
brought forward as an anti-bank man and Dement withdrew in his favor; Cloud 
was supported by the advocates of a regulated banking system. Chicago Democrat, 
June 15, 22. 4 


oi 2 glo Sp OR cag RS A an 
Meee Oe hoe * is Ae » tap i 
Lee 1a SN ; 


YY, 


ILLINOIS HISTORICAL CO, 


ing a waste of time ‘ ‘spent in demagos 
speeches for Buncome,’” others, like ‘ 
Daviess, agreed with their opponents tha 
was worth while because of its value 1 
" questions and enabling members “to arr 
principles on which they should act.’ 
The sixth day of the convention comple 


defined. The original consdtation was to b 
article by article and section by section aia 
ing propositions were to be referred for cons 
"tO appropriate committees. On the fourth « day 
son had presented a set of resolutions def ! 
authority of the three departments of sta 
ment; this proved to be an attempt, on 1 
least certain Whigs, to steal a march on theive oppon : 
and after an extended debate the formas ord yf pr 
dure was agreed upon. 
On June 14, the question of the advi 
printing the debates was raised. _Lanphier 2 


eS 


comprehensive, reflected the lack of fort 
to present an accurate and complete acco 
Register left to its rival, the Sangamo F 


in terms of historical accuracy. But witile the 
ree i Gut 


°See post, 30. ie 
See post, 38; cf. 3I, : : 


INTRODUCTION xxi 


brought out a substantial agreement that “the pub- 
lished reports of the speeches of members of this body, 
as found in the newspapers of this city, are very inac- 
curate and faulty,’ considerations of economy bore 
down the proposition for an official version; and the 
suggestion that the members personally contribute to 
the expenses of publishing the debates was never 
formally considered. 

The convention of 1847 performed its task in a day 


- when party allegiance weighed heavily upon the voter 
-and his representative. The delegates in this case had 


been chosen primarily upon party lines altered to some 
extent by complex sectionalistic forces. The most 
fundamental force was the cleavage between the 
Democratic apostles of human rights and Whig cham- 
pionship of the rights of property. The Whigs trembled 
before the menace of ‘‘radicalism,”’ of “‘Locofocoism;”’ 
the Democrats were kept in a state of terror by the 
incubus of ““bankism”’ and its companion bogies. But 
sectional influences at times not only allayed these fears 
but even produced Whig “‘radicals” and Democratic 
“bankites.”’ 

The Whig delegates went to the convention with a 
strong conviction that it was their duty to “dull the 
edge of radicalism,’ to keep the new constitution from 
being made the “plaything of Locofocoism.”” From 
the very start radicalism seemed to show “‘its cloven 
foot in the proceedings of the dominant party,” but the 


See post, 75. Members frequently found it eecessary to correct the news- 
paper accounts. See note 3, page 20, note 9, page 48, note 17, page 89. As 
influential a delegate as Scates commented on omissions as follows: “‘He would also 
state that there was no fear of his speeches being published; the reporters never 
reported him. He had made no arrangements with them for that purpose.” See 


POSty 792. 
2 Chicago Daily Fournal, April 22; cf. Belleville Advocate, June 3. 


xxii ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Whigs were pleasantly surprised with the conservatism 
that revealed itself in a majority of the body. On 
many points, too, Whigs could not but yield to the 
democratic trend of the age. But on questions that 
permitted a party alignment they rallied their forces 
almost to a man." 


The supreme test of strength between the conven- 
tion parties came over the question of bank or no bank. — 


The Democrats, who had for years been insisting that 
bank charters were “ 
religion,”® who had sought to arouse the people against 
efforts to renew “‘the miserable rag system by which 
they have already lost so much,’ had raised this issue 
in the convention election. The Whigs, fearful of the 
“popular clamor’’ against banks, had evaded the 
question except in their own strongholds.” The 


election revealed not only a remarkable showing for the 


Whig candidates but even the election of a considerable 
group of “bank Democrats.”’ ‘The tendency of leading 
Democratic spokesmen to turn the “bank Democrats” 
over to the opposition,® no doubt consolidated the 
pro-bank party and made it a conservative force by 
which other Whig propositions were carried. 


In organizing the convention. the bank party had 
supported Newton Cloud, as favorable to banks under 


Chicago Daily Fournal, June 14; Alton Telegraph and Democratic Review, 
June 11, 25. The Telegraph actually forecast a constitution “that will be satis- 
factory to the people, and beneficial to the State.” f 

“Illinois State Register, July 31, August 6; Shawneetown Democrat, in 
Chicago Democrat, August 24. 

15 Chicago Democrat, January 26, 1846. 

6 Foliet Democrat, in ibid., July 18, 1846. 

" Chicago Dae ¥ournal, "March 18; Sangamo Fournal, April 29; cf. Illinois 
State Register, July 1. 

8“ We freely turn over to their aid every bank democrat in the State (if there 
is such a white blackbird).” Chicago Democrat, April 6; cf. idid., April 13. 


inconsistent with democracy or 


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Vee ah 


INTRODUCTION Xxill 


proper restrictions, over Casey, a straight-out anti-bank 
man. -So the bank issue was in the foreground from 
the very start. Lines were drawn between those in 
favor of a complete prohibition of banks and those 
willing to accept a properly safeguarded general banking 
system.” 

On June 14, in spite of the fact that the convention 
had voted a regular order of procedure which made such 
action premature, anti-bank resolutions were intro- 
duced by Markley and Pratt and the rules suspended 
to permit their reference. From this time the bank 
question was almost daily before the convention, 
consuming a large share of its time and efforts. On 
fourteen days of the session it was the direct subject of 
debate and was almost as frequently linked with other 
questions that came up. On June 15, Hurlbut brought 
up a resolution in favor of the liberal New York system 
of banking. Opportunity was then afforded to take 
test votes which resulted in a rejection of both the New 
York system and the prohibition proposition.” Only 
fifty-two Democrats and six Whigs from southern 
counties lined up for complete restriction; it was as 
much a case of northern Illinois versus Egypt as Whig 
versus Democrat. On June 22, Gregg of Cook County 
introduced resolutions to inquire into the expediency of 
a highly restrictive general banking law. The fight 
then centered on the question of absolute prohibition 
or a regulated system. The committee on incorpora- 
tions finally brought in a majority report for restriction 


19 According to an early canvass only one Whig, Davis of Bond, was for prohi- 
bition while two Democratic members from Will, two from Morgan, two from Du 
Page, one from Cook, and probably others were opposed to absolute prohibition. 
Chicago Daily Fournal, June 21; cf. Illinois State Register, June 19, 24. 

T/linots State Register, Jane 24, 25. 


Xxiv ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


and a minority report for prohibition.» In the first 
half of August this question was contested to a decision. 
The final result was an article prohibiting a state bank, 
but permitting the legislature to enact laws authorizing 
corporations or associations with banking powers 
provided that they should not go into effect until sub- 
mitted to the popular vote. 

The Whigs made their first offensive move in pro- 
posing a poll taxon June 16. They defended it on the 
basis that every class, and not merely the property 
holders, should bear a share of the public burdens. 
Democratic spokesmen exploded the assumption that 
non-property-holders did not contribute to the support 
of the state and condemned the tax as wrong in princi- 
ple. After a long discussion the poll tax proposition 
was carried, 108 to 49, leaving the levy of the tax to the 
discretion of the legislature. The Democratic support 
of this proposition came largely from southern Illinois.” 

The Democrats had always charged their opponents 
with nativism; the debates at the convention of 1847 
showed that this charge was not without a foundation 
of truth. This was first suggested in the proposal that 
“no person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of 
the United States at the time of the adoption of this 
constitution, shall be eligible to the office of Governor;” 
the Whigs generally took a stand in favor of this 
provision or of Logan’s amendment requiring a fourteen- 
year residence period of naturalized citizens. The. 
party line was even more sharply defined later when the 

*1 Harvey presented the majority report and Kinney the minority. Both were 
Democrats. See post, 312-315. 

22See Chicago Democrat, June 22. Wead and Farwell objected to this 


special burden upon residents of the state while non-residents “by whom the greater 
part of the land in our state was owned, paid none of it.” See post, 622, 624. 


INTRODUCTION XXV 


suffrage question came up and the Whigs insisted upon 
a citizenship qualification for all who should in the 
future immigrate to Illinois. The Democrats generally 
defended the right of foreigners to a voice in elections 
but defection from their ranks enabled the Whigs to 
carry their point for what they considered a true 
Americanism.” 

In the matter of the veto power the Whigs won 


another victory. The Democrats had come to the 


convention with a strong determination to provide for 
an effective gubernatorial veto sufficiently guarded 
from abuse. In general they preferred that a veto 
should be overriden by nothing short of a two-thirds 


vote. The Democratic leaders eloquently expounded 


their position and cracked the whip to bring their 
followers into line; but when the constitution took 


shape, the Whigs rejoiced in an arrangement which 


permitted the same majority which should have passed 
a law in the first instance, to enact it over the guber- 
natorial veto. 

Most Whigs, as well as Democrats, had yielded to 
the democratic tendency toward a popular election of 
state officials, toward even an elective judiciary. 


Largely for political reasons, which received strong 


sectional reinforcement, they advocated the proposition 
of having the supreme court consist of three judges 
elected by the three respective sections of the state. 
The Democrats favored the general ticket system of 
election which would enable them to control the entire 
body by capitalizing their numerical superiority. 
After a long verbal battle it was agreed that the state 


3 Tllinois State Register, July 27, 29, August 26; Fournal of the Convention, 206, 
207. 


XXV1 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


should be divided into three grand divisions and the 
qualified electors of each division should elect one of 
the judges for a period of nine years, with the proviso 
that after the first election the general assembly might 
have the power “to provide by law for their election by 
the whole state, or by divisions,” as it might deem 
expedient. This was clearly a compromise arrange- 
ment. 

A lively skirmish took place over negro immigration 
into the state. A little corporal’s guard of anti-slavery 
men went to the convention determined not only to 
incorporate a slavery prohibition into the constitution 
but also to remove any legal basis for acknowledging 
its existence inother states. The Covenanters of Perry 
County and citizens of Randolph County encouraged 
them with petitions praying the abolition of all civil 
and political distinctions on account of color and the 
motion by Whitney of Boone County to strike out 
““white”’ in the resolution defining the franchise arrayed 
the seven champions of negro rights against the 137 
other delegates. 

Next, Bond of Clinton County brought in a resolu- 
tion in favor of an article prohibiting the immigration 
of free negroes into the state. This precipitated a — 
heated debate with dramatic scenes. Again party lines — 
broke down and northern delegates wrestled against 
the power of southern and central Illinois» The 
committee on the Bill of Rights eventually brought in a 
section instructing the legislature to enact laws to 
prohibit negro immigration. It was later decided, 


24See post, 105 ff., 170 ff. 

25Qn a test vote of eighty-seven to fifty-six, only eleven Democrats voted in the 
negative. Only five votes came from delegates representing counties south of 
Morgan County. ‘Fournal of the Convention, 455-456. 


INTRODUCTION XXvil 


however, to make an independent article of the negro 
immigration restriction with provision for separate 
ratification. A numerous minority tried to secure the 
adoption of clauses prohibiting the extension of suffrage 
to negroes and mulattoes, rendering them ineligible to 
hold office, and prohibiting the intermarriage of blacks 
and whites. It was pointed out, however, that this 
was an implied admission of their possession of such 
rights as citizens of Illinois and of the United States and 
such clauses were accordingly omitted from the consti- 
tution. : 

While the Illinois convention of 1847 worked at its 
tasks, war was raging between the United States and the 
Mexican republic to the south. Abraham Lincoln in 
behalf of Illinois Whiggery, claimed that the war had 
been “unnecessarily and unconstitutionally commenced 
by the President.”’ On July 11, 1847, the Reverend 
Albert Hale, pastor of the Second Presbyterian Church 
of Springfield, delivered two sermons in which he boldly 
proclaimed the injustice of the national cause and its 
demoralizing effect upon the nation. In the course of 
his remarks he was said to have stated that the volun- 
teer, who was just then being welcomed back as a hero, 
had been transformed by the war into a “moral pest 
to society.’’ 

Mr. Hale was one of the local clergymen who had 
officiated in the convention at the opening prayers. 
On July 12, Akin of Franklin county denounced Hale’s 
preaching before the convention and proposed that the 
clergyman “‘be excused from holding prayers in this 
convention for the future.” The convention, however, 


6 See post, 387; Illinois State Register, July 22. 


xxviii ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


by an overwhelming vote adopted a motion to table 
Akin’s resolution. A long debate followed: the resolu- 
tion was renewed, but John M. Palmer, a pro-war - 
Democrat, moved a substitute declaring the principles 
of freedom of worship and freedom of speech and dis- 
claiming “all censorship over the pulpit, or the opinions 
expressed therefrom, inasmuch as such censorship is in 
violation of the rights of the Rev. gentleman.”” The 
resolution virtually sustaining Mr. Hale was barely 
tabled (60-54), but the general declaration in favor of 
the principles involved was upheld (9-102). The 
convention then adjourned in order to proceed to 
Jacksonville to participate in the ceremonies attendant 
upon the funeral of Colonel Hardin, the Illinois war ~ 
hero, in whose memory the delegates were, according 
to unanimous agreement, wearing crépe arm bands for 
a period of thirty days. 

When Mr. Hale next appeared before the convention 
to offer prayer he was “grossly insulted and menaced 
with bodily injury by a member of the convention.” 
On July 20, therefore, it was agreed that “whereas, it 
is alike due to the Convention and the ministers that 
we should not invite them to perform that duty unless - 
we could secure them against such indignities,” the 
custom of opening prayers should be discontinued, not 
“from any dissatisfaction with the manner in which 
they [the clergymen] have discharged their sacred duty, © 
but solely from an unwillingness to subject them to a 
repetition of such indignities.” 

On July 22, Hale’s assailant was given a further 
rebuke in a debate over a resolution concerning the 


27 Fournal of the Convention, 168. 


INTRODUCTION XX1X 


election of a chaplain, which was defeated because it 
might have been interpreted as the result of a desire 
“to get rid of our chaplains and to procure others.” 
On July 26 the resolution of July 20 was rescinded and 
the president was requested to provide for the opening 
of the morning session with prayer. 

By the middle of August the Whigs, with Demo- 
cratic assistance, had carried every point upon which 
they had cared to make a stand. Democratic critics 
of orthodox stripe were completely disgusted. The 
correspondent of the Chicago Democrat suggested that 
the convention ought to be turned out “‘a /a Cromwell:” 
“The truth is, the convention is too horribly conserva- 
tive to be of much use. Liberal principles stand no 
chance whatever. ... True Republicanism is daily 
spurned and trampled under foot.’ There was also 
fear that the plan of apportionment for the senate 
endangered Democratic control of that body, if it did 
not actually turn it over to the Whigs. 

After the convention had finished its work, zealous 
Democratic champions became more and more con- 
vinced that the new constitution was ‘‘a mongrel 
affair’ likely to “make trouble.’*! Inasmuch, how- 
ever, aS 131 Out of 138 members of the convention had 
given a final endorsement to the new constitution, few 
were willing to come out into a position of open hostil- 
ity. Whigs meantime proclaimed the document as 
worthy of support because it was not a party constitu- 


See post, 487. 

29“ Buena Vista” on August 11, in Chicago Democrat, August 24. See also 
“Beuna Vista” on August 6, in idid., August 17; Shawneetown Democrat in ibid., 
August 24. 

39 Chicago Democrat, January 4, 1848. 

51Mark Skinner to Governor A. C. French, February 29, 1848, French papers; 
see also Koerner, Memoirs, 1: 523-524. 


Ne Rn ae 
mA a ek 


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t 


XXX ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


tion. Everyone agreed that many of its provisions 
were a decided improvement upon the old constitution, 
and this made it risky to reject a document wrought 
at so much expense to the state. To the average voter 
the strict regard for economy displayed by the conven- 
tion was an important factor in attracting his support.” 

In the ratification election on March 6, 1848, the 
constitution was adopted by a vote of 60,585 to 15,903. 
The separate negro immigration clause was ratified, 
50,261 to 21,297. The convention, confronting the 
huge indebtedness which spelled virtual bankruptcy for 
the state, had decided not only to practice economy 
but also to stabilize public credit. A two mill tax was 
therefore agreed upon with provision for separate 
ratification. For this feature there was little enthus- 
iasm although it was adopted, 41,349 to 30,945. Thus 
with a narrow gauge economy was linked a device which 
later aided materially in the financial rehabilitation of 
Illinois. , 


8 Belleville Advocate, January 20, 1848; Quincy Whig, February 2, 1848. 


ae i 


ci 


I. MONDAY, JUNE 7, 1847 


In pursuance of the provisions of the act of the General 
Assembly, approved Feb. 20, 1847, entitled “An act to provide 
for the call of a Convention,” the delegates to said Convention, 
chosen under said act, assembled this day in the hall of the House 
of Representatives, in the state house at Springfield, at 3 o’clock, 
P.M. 

Mr. SHERMAN called the Convention to order,! and moved 
that Zapoc Casey be appointed President pro tem.; which motion 
was unanimously adopted. 

On motion of Mr. SCATES, Louts M. Boots was appointed 
Secretary pro tem., and J. A. Witson, doorkeeper pro tem. 

On motion of Mr. SHERMAN, Mr. CLINE was appointed 
assistant door-keeper pro fem. _ 

Mr. THOMPSON moved that the names of the members be 
called. 

Mr. SCATES suggested the propriety of having a magistrate 
to adminster the oath to the members. 

The CHAIR suggested that no oath was necessary; and he 
further suggested that, as the Secretary called the members by 


counties, they present their credentials. 


On motion of Mr. DEMENT, Mr. Moore of Gallatin county 
Was appointed Assistant Secretary pro tem. 

The Secretary then called over the list of delegates, who, as their 
names were called, presented their certificates of election; after 
which they were again called, alphabetically, and the Chair 
announced that there were one hundred and fifty-four delegates 
in attendance. 

Mr. SCATES offered the following resolution: 

Resolved, That each delegate of this Convention, before pro- 
ceeding to the transaction of any business, take an oath to support 
the Constitution of the United States. 


* Biographical sketches of the members and officers of the constitutional 
convention will be found in the biographical appendix. 


I 


2 


In offering the above, Mr. S. said, he was aware that oe ae 


powers of this Convention are elementary, and that the members — i 


‘were not under any obligation to take an oath; yet, while there 
was no form of an oath prescribed for the members, he hoped they 
would take this one-——There was an apparent propriety in the 
oath, as no form of government they could adopt would be valid 
unless it corresponded with the constitution of the United States. 

Mr. THOMAS was not satisfied with the oath proposed to the 


Convention by the gentleman from Jefferson. Where was the — 
necessity for any oath? This Convention represented the sover- 


eignty of the state of Illinois. Its members were not responsible 
to any power for the violation of the oath, if taken. No punish- 


ment could be awarded for a breach of it. He would remind the _ 


gentleman that there were constitutions adopted in other states 
before the United States had a constitution, and, therefore, 
he could see no obligation to swear to support the constitution 
of the United States. This was his present view, but if the 
gentleman could satisfy him that it was proper, he would vote 
for it. 

Mr. MINSHALL said that there would seem a manifest pro- 
priety in taking an oath which, although it might be said, would 
impose no additional obligation, still could work no injury. 
Further, that as no form of government could be established by 
this Convention that would differ in character from that of the 
constitution of the United States, it appeared to him quite proper, 


though perhaps not necessary, to take an oath to support the — 
constitution of the United States. He, however, would move, — 
as an amendment to the resolution, the following, to be added 


thereto: ‘and to faithfully discharge the duties of their office 


as delegates of this Convention, for the purpose of revising and — 


amending the constitution of the state of Illinois.” 


The amendment having been agreed to, the question was put 


on the resolution, as amended, and decided in the affirmative. 


Mr. DAWSON moved that WiL1t14m Lave y, esq., be called i 


within the bar to administer the oath. 

Mr. LOGAN said, that for the purpose of econotatelae time, 
he hoped that the oath would be administered to the body collec- 
tively; which mode would save considerable time, and could be 


‘es 


MONDAY, JUNE 7, 1847 3 


performed by the members without leaving their seats, simply by 
raising the hand. He made a motion to that effect. 

Mr. SCATES hoped the oath would be administered, if done 
at all, in a more dignified manner than that suggested by the 
member from Sangamon. The plan suggested might save a few 
moments time, but would not comport with the proper dignity 
which should accompany the administration of an oath. It 


‘reminded him of the manner in which the oath of allegiance was 


administered by the conquerers of New Mexico. 

Mr. LOGAN then moved a division of the question; which 
was lost. 

The members then were called to the desk by the Secretary, 
ten at a time, and the oath, as adopted, was administered to them 
by Wm. LaveELy, esq. 

Mr. SERVANT moved that the Convention adjourn. Nega- 
tived—yeas 53, nays 92. 

Mr. BOND offered the following resolution: 

Resolved, That we will now proceed to organize this Con- 
vention, by electing a President, one Secretary, and one 
Sergeant-at-arms, and that no other officers shall be consti- 
tuted or appointed until it becomes necessary, in the opinion 
of the President and principal Secretary, to employ some 
competent person to assist the Secretary in the discharge 
of his duties; when the Secretary may employ a competent 


assistant, to whom shall be paid the sum of two dollars per 


day, while necessarily employed; Provided, the Sergeant-at-arms 
may, in his discretion, employ some able-bodied person to assist 
him in discharging his duties, to whom there shall be paid a sum 
of one dollar per day, for each day necessarily employed; and he 
may employ two active, orderly, and competent boys as messengers, 
&c., who shall each be paid the sum of fifty cents per day for the 
time employed. 

In offering this resolution, he had but a few words to say. He 
intended no speech in support of it. If-not all, many of us came 


here for purposes of economy, retrenchment, and reform. This 


proposition at this season can carry out that purpose. We can 
at this season of the year dispense with many officers; for after the 
Convention is organized, the Secretary alone can perform all the 


4 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


duties of the office. We need, at least I think, but one Secretary; 
there is no necessity for an assistant. The resolution, however, 
provides for the employment of one when his services are required. 
—There is not the mass of business, nor the great amount of 
copying to be done, as is the case at a meeting of the Legislature. 
The Sergeant-at-arms, when he required assistance, was em- 
powered to employ it, at two dollars per day. The resolution he 
understood would meet with entire approbation. The boys pro- 
vided for by the resolution can easily be procured here, at the rate 
fixed—fifty cents a day. 

The resolution, upon a division, was adopted. Under it, the 
Chair announced the next business to be the election of a President 


of the Convention, and suggested that the mode of electing him _ 


was as the Convention would direct. 

Mr. WILLIAMS reminded the Chair that the act of the 
Legislature providing for a call of a Convention, directed that he 
should be chosen by ballot. . We might, it is true, repeal the direc- 
tion, but until it was repealed, he considered that we should con- 
form to it.. He moved that they proceed to elect by ballot. 


The reading of the law was called for, and the Secretary read 


the 5th section of the act providing for a call of the Convention. 
The motion was then put and carried. 

The Chair appointed Messrs. Locan, ScaTes, and Dunzap, 
tellers; and they, having received the ballots of the members, and 
counted them, reported as follows: 


For Newton Cxoup, 84; Zapoc Casey, 65; ARCHIBALD 


WILLIAMS, 2; Cyrus EDWARDS, 2. 

Aveo the Chair announced that NEwron Ctoup, esq., 
had been elected President of the Convention, and requested 
Messrs. THompson and Hay to conduct him to the chair. 

Upon taking the chair, the President said— 


Gentlemen of the Convention: It is but proper, on entering 


upon the duty assigned me by the choice just made, that I should 
return you my most sincere thanks for the honor you have con- 
ferred. 

I enter upon the discharge of the duties of President of this 
Convention with much embarrassment, for I feel that I have a 
difficult and important duty assigned me. 


a 


MONDAY, JUNE 7, 1877 5 


I can only promise that my best efforts shall be made to dis- 
charge that duty faithfully and impartially, and that all the little 
ability that I possess shall be devoted to the despatch and further- 
ance of the public-business. I will not allude, however remotely, 
to the great objects upon which we have been called to act, but 
will conclude by returning you again my sincere thanks for the 
honor you have conferred on me. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean moved to proceed to the election of a 
Secretary by acclamation. 

Mr. THOMAS. We are not all in favor of the same man. 


-I object. 


Mr. DAVIS. I, then, move to vote for Secretary viva voce; 
which motion was adopted. 

Mr. WILLIAMS nominated Mr. Burt of Quincy. 

Mr. BALLINGALL nominated H. W. Moore of Gallatin and 
the Convention proceeded to vote for Secretary. 

Mr. Moore received 91 votes; Mr. Burt, 59; scattering, 1; 
and Mr. Moore was declared elected. 

Mr. ALLEN nominated, for Sergeant-at-arms, Mr. J. A. 
WILson. 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved that Mr. Witson be elected by 
acclamation, and, after some debate, withdrew the motion. 

The Convention divided on the nomination, and Mr. WILson 
was declared elected, he receiving 99 votes. 

Mr. THOMAS moved the Convention adjourn. Lost—yeas 
$3, nays not counted. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved that the Convention 
proceed to the election of a printer. 

Mr. LOGAN moved to lay this motion on the table, to enable 
him to offer a resolution in relation to the selection of a printer; 
which motion was carried. 

Mr. LOGAN then offered the following resolution: 

Resolved, That the printing of this Convention shall be let to 
the lowest responsible and capable bidder. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon offered, as a substitute: “That 
a committee of five be appointed by the President to receive 
proposals for the printing of the proceedings of the Convention, 


6 ILLINOIS JHTSTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


and that they be directed to contract with the lowest responsible. 


bidder, and report at as early a day as practicable. 

Mr. SHERMAN asked, are we not getting along a little too 
fast with this resolution? ‘The law provides that we shall elect 
a printer, and that law fixes the price to be paid, with which the 
Convention has nothing to do. ; 

Mr. LOGAN said that, waiving for the present a discussion of 
the right of the Legislature to limit this Convention, look at the 
proposition in another way. Can we not receive the bids of all 


persons who may desire to perform this work, with the rates, &c., 
compare them with the rates allowed the public printer, and then — 


can we not elect that one who will do it the cheapest? 

Mr. DEMENT rose, not for the purpose, particularly, of 
opposing the resolution, but to inquire of some of the members of 
the last Assembly how far the words, “‘shall receive the same com- 
pensation as is allowed by the present Assembly,” have effect 
upon this resolution. He did not intend to argue whether we have 
the power to go beyond the law, but how far, inasmuch as we had 
obeyed the restriction of the law in one case, the election of 
President by ballot, we should still go with that law. As soon as 
we had chosen the President by the mode prescribed in this law, we 


then, when the law requires no form of election, dispose of the 
others in the most summary manner. This was conceded by ~ 


gentlemen for the purpose of conforming to the act of the Legis- 
lature; and he apprehended that the resolution now offered did 
come in conflict with those words of the act in relation to the 


printer, where it says “he shall receive the same compensation as 


the same officer receives from the present General Assembly.” 
He moved to lay the resolution on the table, but withdrew it, at the 
request of 

Mr. SCATES, who said that the act of the Legislature provided 


a compensation to be allowed for printing for the Convention. __ 


i 


The resolution stating what should be the officers of this Con- 


vention had been passed without debate; and he disliked to see © 


resolutions spread on the record appropriating money without 
authority. Where have you the power to do so? He doubted 
very much if the members of the Convention could get paid for 
their services unless the Legislature had provided and appropriated» 


MONDAY, JUNE 7, 71847 7 


the means for that purpose. The constitution of the state ex- 


pressly states how and by whom money shall be appropriated. 


’ The Legislature has fixed our pay; we can take less, but no 


more. The Legislature has provided a printer for us, and'fixed his 
compensation, and states that heshall be elected by the Convention. 
The resolution now before us confers the power upon five members 
of this body to give the printing. We may receive the services of 
the printer, under that contract, but can we appropriate the money 
to pay for it? He disliked to do things where the power to act 
was of a doubtful character. He would like the resolution already 
passed, changing the pay of the door-keepers, rescinded, and the 
present one laid on the table. He moved to lay the resolution 
on the table. 

Mr. LOGAN demanded the yeas and nays; which were ordered 
and taken, and the resolution was laid on the table—yeas 82, 
nays 70. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess renewed his motion to proceed 
to the election of a printer. 

Mr. WILLIAMS stated that one reason why the resolution of 
Mr. Locan had been laid on the table, was to enable members to 


_ reflect on the matter. He was for economy; and if there was any 


person willing to do the work cheaper than another, he desired to 
give it to him. He moved to lay Mr. C.’s motion on the table; 
which was carried. 

Mr. EDWARDS moved that a committee of five be appointed 
to prepare and report rules and regulations for the government of 
this Convention. Agreed to. 

A motion to adopt, for the present government of the Conven- 
tion, the rules of the last House of Representatives, was laid on 
the table. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison offered the following resolution; 
which was adopted: 

Resolved, That the Secretary be directed to call upon the 
clergy of the different denominations in the city, and to solicit 
an arrangement among them for opening every morning, by prayer, 
the meetings of the Convention. 

Mr. BALLINGALL offered the following resolution; which 
was adopted: 


8 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Resolved, That the Secretary prepare ballots, properly num- 
bered, for seats for the members of the Convention, and that the 
members proceed thereafter to draw the ballots for their respective 
seats. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin offered the following resolution; 
which was adopted: 

Resolved, That the editors and reporters of the newspapers 
published in this state be allowed seats within the bar of this hall. 

On motion, the Convention adjourned till to-morrow, at Io 
o'clock, A. M. 


II. TUESDAY, JUNE 8, 1847 


After an appropriate prayer by the Rev. Mr. Barcer? of 
Springfield, the Convention resumed its deliberations. 

Pursuant to the resolution adopted yesterday, the members 
proceeded to draw the ballots for their respective seats in the hall. 

Mr. BROCKMAN offered the following resolution; which was 
adopted: 

Resolved, That for the comfort and convenience of the members 
of this Convention, the Sergeant-at-arms be instructed to have 
removed the railings from the hall, and to place the seats of 
members further back towards the corner of the hall. 

Mr. WEAD offered the following: 

Ordered, That so much of the resolution of the member from 
Clinton, offered yesterday, as provides for limiting the number 
and pay of officers of this Convention, be rescinded. 

In offering this resolution, Mr. W. said, that he was of the 
opinion that the resolution which it proposed to rescind in part, 
had been introduced and passed yesterday without the members 
having had time for consultation, and without their being apprised 
of its effect. That resolution, if he understood it properly, 
limited the number of officers of the Convention, and fixed their 
salaries at a price below the rate provided for in the act of the 
Legislature. True, it allowed the employment of an assistant 
Secretary and an assistant Sergeant-at-arms.—He thought it most 
imprudent thus to limit, by resolution, the officers of the Con- 
vention, when that Convention were the proper judges of what 
officers they required. The Convention would require the 
services of two Sergeants-at-arms; one cannot do all the work, for 
his services would always be required within the hall, while 
another would be required to go elsewhere, and perform duties 
beyond the halJ. I object to our granting the Secretary power to 


_* Probably John S. Bargar, pastor of First Methodist Episcopal Church of 
ene. Inter-State Publishing Company, History of Sangamon County, 


9 


10: ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


name a deputy when he shall deem it necessary. That right 
belongs to this Convention only. The saving proposed by this — 
resolution is but a small matter; the people of the state of Illinois f, 
do not require such economy—the cutting down of the salaries of e 
two small officers. Our object is other than a legislative one; it 4 
is to revise the constitution of the state of Illinois, and not to fix ¥ 


the compensation of her officers. We may place in theconstitu- —_ 
tion that the Secretary and Sergeant-at-arms, hereafter to be a 
appointed, shall not receive beyond the sums provided in the Bi 
resolution, but can we, by a mere resolution, enact a law?—But 4 
the resolution does not intend that it shall be incorporated into i 


the constitution we came here to revise and adopt; and is it any f 
part of our duty to meddle with the pay they shall receive? ‘ 7 

The Legislature might pay them, or fix the sum that they 
should receive at what amount it pleased; it might appropriate — 
them nothing if it pleased, for it was a matter entirely with that 
body. 

It had been said that this provision might be placed in the 
constitution, but how? This resolution contemplates no such 
thing; it has reference merely to the officers whom we shall employ, 
and for the payment of whose services the Legislature has already 
made an appropriation. By what reason, right, or justice, then, — 
can we fix the amount of their pay? ie 

Is it economy for members—or do they think that the soaphe B ; 


require such economy—to reduce the pay of officers who willhave 
to labor the whole day in the faithful discharge of their duties to 

earn one dollar per day, when we take four for ourselves. The 
saving contemplated would reduce the taxes but little; itis a i 
matter the people are not looking at. I hope the Convention will - i 


not rise until it has reduced the expenses of from over $200,000 i 
per annum to something less than one hundred thousand dollars. ne 
Let them but pursue a course to effect that object, and not com- 4 
mence on this matter. Let them reduce the tax below sixty-five % 
per cent. on personal property; let them reduce the county taxes, 
of which but little is used for county Pumpecss and let these small a 
officers alone. A 


He considered that the reselarian had been passed without 5 
being understood by the members of the Convention, and he if 


rete ier ss 


npn 
He. 


TUESDAY, JUNE 8, 1847 ii 


regretted it; for he considered that it frequently took longer to 
undo a wrong action than to defeat or avoid it in the first 
instance. 

Mr. BOND said that he had offered the resolution, and it 
was only because it had been offered by him that he rose to say a 
few words in reply to what had fallen from the member from 
Fulton. That it had not been discussed was very true, but he 
did not think that there was any discussion necessary upon it; it 
bore on its face—in the very words of it was expressed the great 
objects of its introduction—retrenchment and reform. 

We have come here for the purpose of retrenching and re- 
forming the expenses of our government, and he did not think of 
coming here to carry out one thing and do, in fact, another. He 
thought straws showed which way the wind blew. He was for 
economy in all proceedings of the Convention, and would show 
his sincerity if the gentleman would introduce any proposition to 
reduce the pay of members, he would vote for it. The resolution 
had not been intruded upon the Convention: it had been offered 
in good faith, and he believed it ought to meet the approbation of 
the Convention. He asked, who, when the constitution under 
which we now live had been adopted in the first instance, had 
fixed the pay of members? The Legislature telling this Conven- 
ticn what to do, is like the preacher telling God what is right. 

He was confident the resolution was not understood: it did 
not interfere with the pay of the Secretary or Sergeant-at-arms— 
they still receive the pay allowed them by the Legislature; but it 
only prescribes what shall be paid to their assistants, whom they 
are authorized to employ when their services are required. + He 
had experience in the duties of Secretary of legislative bodies, and 
he was convinced that one person could perform all the duties of 
that office for this Convention. There was not that mass of 
copying, nor that interminable labor to be performed as in the 
Legislature. Also, ove Sergeant-at-arms could perform the work 
of that office; but if not, the resolution allowed him to employ an 
assistant, at one dollar per day—and plenty could be procured 
to do the work at that rate; even here they could be procured, as 
well as by searching from the southern border to the most northern 
counties for men, who were to be brought here to fill these offices 


12 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


especially reserved for them. No fires were to [be] built; variousother 
duties usually performed by the Sergeant-at-arms could be dis- 
pensed with. Nor would that officer have to go round looking 
up the members of the Convention, as was often the case in the 
Legislature. He hoped the gentleman from Fulton would aid in 
reforming the constitutional expenses of the government. Let 
him come forward with his proposition to lower the salaries of all, 
and he (Mr. B.) would vote as low as the gentleman from Fulton 
dare. 

He would like to reply to some of the logic of the gentleman 
from Jefferson (Mr. Scates,) if he really knew what kind of logic 
it was that he had used yesterday. He (Mr. B.) had read none, 
and he was disposed to inquire of Mr. S. what kind he had read. 
He had understood the gentleman from Jefferson to say that we 
could reduce the pay of the members, but not of the officers of the 
Convention. 

Mr. SCATES. I did not say that we could reduce the pay 
of the members; the gentleman did not understand me. 

Mr. BOND resumed, by stating that he had misunderstood 
the gentleman. He had occupied more time than he had intended 
when he commenced. The resolution was intended only to govern 
the present officers of the Convention; and a more proper time 
would arrive for the discussion. A committee had been appointed 
to prepare and report rules and regulations for the Convention, 
and they will no doubt report what officers are necessary. When 
they did so, then would be the proper time for the discussion of this 
question. 

Mr. MINSHALL asked, if the resolution to rescind was in 
order. Would not the proper way be to move to reconsider? 

The CHAIR ruled that the resolution to rescind was in order. 

Mr. WEAD said, that it had been insinuated in the remarks of — 
the gentleman that he had argued that this resolution had been 
intruded upon the Convention. He had said no such thing; nor 
would any language used by him justify such a construction. He 
had said, however, that it had been passed without the members 
having had time for reflection. He could not see any reason why ~ 
the Convention should not rescind the resolution of yesterday. 
We had been sent here for the purpose of retrenchment and reform 


TUESDAY, JUNE 8, 1847 13 


of the evils of the old constitution. Was one of the evils of that 
constitution an allowance of four dollars to our Sergeant-at-arms? 
We save, by this resolution, four dollars a day in the pay of 
Secretary and Sergeant-at-arms. Did the people require this of 
us, he would vote for it; but he was satisfied that they were willing 
that we should allow them liberally for their services. Mr. W. 
was as willing as Mr. B. to reduce the county expenses by every 
means in their power, from over $650,000 to less than $300,000. 

He was not familiar with the duties of Secretary, but judging 
from the vast amount of business yesterday, he considered that 
it was impossible for one to do it alone. Gentlemen should 
remember that this is the largest body ever convened in Illinois, 
and that more officers were required than in any other that has 
met before.—He considered the doctrine, that we had a right to 
fix the pay of members or officers otherwise than as directed by 
the act of the Legislature, as perfectly preposterous. That we 
had the right to regulate future officers’ salary, by engrafting a 
direction in the constitution, was perfectly right, but to regulate 
their pay by a simple resolution of the Convention was out of the 
question. 

Mr. BOND read a portion of Mr. Scares’ remarks, of yester- 
day, as reported in the Register, as going to establish that he was 
not alone in his understanding of Mr. S.’s remarks; to which 

Mr. SCATES briefly replied. 

Mr. LOGAN said there was nothing in the question itself, as 
to what pay should be allowed the Secretary and Sergeant-at-arms 
that was worthy of the consumption of the time of the Convention; 
but there was the same principle in it which affected a large class 
of other questions of more importance, and which should be settled. 

Gentlemen, he had observed, in his experience, were never able 
to find the starting point where retrenchment should commence. 
All economy, he always found, was commenced in small matters. 
You may look around in vain for a large one; whenever you raise 
your arm to strike, why the answer comes, “‘that is a small matter, 
let it alone.”” We must make one strong blow. Now is the time. 
The subject is not, it is true, a large one, but we must commence. 
I am in favor of commencing now, because of the peculiar circum- 
stances in which the people of Illinois are situated. I am in favor 


14 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


of meeting that situation and carrying the work of retrenchment 


throughout all its ramifications. Our state is loaded with a heavy 
debt, under which the people and their property are groaning. 
The people call on us to save, in the expenses of their government, 
not hundreds, but thousands. Speak not to them of liberality 
till our state is in different circumstances. Liberality ceases to 
be a virtue when it postpones justice! Whenever we are obliged 
to lay a tax upon the country too heavy for the proper support of 


the government of that country, I am for striking at the root of — 
all unnecessary salaries—reducing them. An enormous debt is 


overhanging us. We are taxed to the full measure which the 


people can endure. We must pay the large debt we owe, and 


which is fast becoming a burden not only upon us, but will be on 
those who shall follow us. Our creditors are demanding payment 
of our debts; can we talk of liberality? Liberality is incompatible 
with the present situation of the country. Were the whole people 
gathered here, they would have no right to give salaries beyond 
what is strictly necessary. I am for saving every dollar that can 


be saved. It is necessary that proper officers should be chosen 


and paid to perform the functions of government; and I am willing 
to pay in every department only just sufficient to procure the 
services of such men. It is not proposed to reduce the pay of the 
principal secretary, and he is allowed to employ an assistant when 
his services are necessary. One will be sufficient, another would 
be supernumary [sic]. At the commencement there was of course 
a greater press of business—of resolutions; that is all over. Here- 
after we will have committees to prepare the business. Discus- 
sions upon the great questions will commence and occupy the 
greater part of the time. The question of a bank will come up 
and be discussed; there will be no bills, no petitions, no local 


legislation. We will have but little use of the Secretary, and less. 


of his assistant. The resolution contemplates the employment 
of an able-bodied assistant and two boys—what do you want with 


more of them? Two boys can receive the propositions of 162 


members as fast as they can be presented. We should give 
salaries only sufficient to procure the services. Can we procure 
them at the prices contained in the resolution? My word for it 


you can. I want this to be a precedent for everything else. 


i ba 


TUESDAY, JUNE 8, 1847 15 


There is a section in the constitution of Vermont, which sets forth 

that every man should have some profession and mode of life, 
and should do everything in his power to aid the government; 
that when his assistance to the government works injury to him 
in his business, he should be remunerated; but when the salaries 
of officers are used as a source of profit, that then they should be 
cut down and reduced. If this is a correct principle it should 
govern us. Are not these offices sought for profit?p—The very 
fact of the applicants seeking and desiring them proves it, not to 
speak of their electioneering. I could scarcely get along the street 
with the constant applications, and I cannot comprehend how 
my democratic friends survive it at all. If we can get persons to 
do the work, that is evidence that the prices are high ae bf 
we cannot, why then we can raise them. 

My constituents desire the most rigid economy in all ae 
which will enable them to pay off their just debts. I am not for 
stopping here, but for continuing it for all time to come, or until 
we are relieved from debt.—Now is the time. Let us begin and 
apply the principle to ourselves and our officers; let it operate 
now.— There is no use in procrastinating. We have been insolvent 
long enough; we have delayed payment of our just debts long 
enough. Apply all you can save to the Honilanes of the state 
debt. 

The next question was the power of this Convention. An 
oath to support the constitution of the United States had been 
proposed and taken, because we can do nothing in contravention 
of that instrument, and because there was no other power to limit 
us. Where is the limitation of the power of this Convention over 
the treasury? Point it out. 

Mr. WEAD explained. 

Mr. LOGAN resumed. It was said yesterday that we could 
draw no money from the treasury because the constitution pointed 
out the manner in which it should be done. I differ in opinion on 
this matter. We have the power to prescribe the powers and 
duties and salaries of all officers. Can we not fix in the constitu- 
tion that money shall be paid from the treasury only on general 
principles? The Legislature has appropriated the money to pay 
us and our officers; to be paid on the certificate of the President. 


16 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Can we not say that our officers shall not draw the money? Can 
we not, by resolution, control the certificate of the President? 
Have we no power, except what is expressed in the act? Does 
that give us the power to make rules and regulations for our — 
government? It does not, yet we have appointed a committee 
to report such rules, and we will adopt them. 

This resolution is right in itself. It advertises the men em- 
ployed what they shall receive. If we are sincere in our professions 
of economy, don’t let us differ as to the mode, the how, or where, 
but let us preserve the principle, and carry it out at all times. 
Let the gentleman who proposes to rescind propose his plan to 
economize, and I shall not be found wanting. Is there anything 
said in the act that we shall not amend the constitution by a 
resolution? Not a word. There are many things to be done in 
this constitution which are but temporary provisions. In our 
present constitution, the judges of the supreme court were to 
receive $1,000 a year, for a certain time, payable quarterly. The 
Convention that formed that constitution made this appropria- 
tion, and no Legislature could repeal it. We may district the state 
for the next Legislature, and make many other alterations of a 
temporary character. I don’t care for the form—for the mere 
saving of a few dollars; but I contend for it as a principle, and 
intend it as a precedent. But when the state is in debt, and 
there are, in those countries now visited by famine, many widows 
and orphans who hold our bonds, and are undergoing the utmost 
privations because the interest of our debt is not paid, I say 
again, this is not time for liberality. 

Mr. BALLINGALL moved that the Convention adjourn till 
the afternoon, at 3 o'clock. Carried. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. HARVEY moved to strike out all after the word 
“resolved,” in the motion of Mr. Weap, and insert “that the 
members and officers of this Convention shall receive the sum of © 
$2.50 per day, each.” 

Mr. PALMER of Marshall moved to amend the proposed 
amendment, by striking out the words “and fifty cents.” 

Mr. DEMENT rose to offer an amendment; but the Cuair 


NG 


TUESDAY, JUNE 8, 1847 17 


ruled it out of order, there being an amendment to an amendment 
pending. He then stated that he did not believe, nor did he 
think any other member believed, that any resolution of this 
body could prevent the members, or such of them as would 
demand it, from receiving the sum of four dollars per day—as 
fixed by the Legislature. He denied the position assumed by the 
gentleman from Sangamon (Mr. Locan,) that the acts of this 
Convention would be paramount to any law of the land, until it 
had been approved and ratified by the people in the manner pre- 
scribed by the law. In case, asked Mr. D., we did make an 
enactment, where would be its power or its force, or its binding 
obligation on any one, if the constitution we shall adopt is rejected 
by the people? It appeared to him that the powers of this 
Convention had been narrowed down to a mere power to propose 
amendments, or a substitute for the present constitution of the 
state; and what we may do may pass as a dead letter from our 
hands, and be received with the contempt of the whole people. 
He had heard much talk about economy; and the gentlemen 
who had made speeches on that subject might have spoken in all 


sincerity, or it might be to add to their already well established 


reputations for eloquence and speech-making. 

He was of opinion that the Convention could appropriate no 
money, unless the clause making the appropriation is made a 
component part of the constitution; nor could the money thus 
appropriated be drawn from the treasury until the constitution 
containing the appropriation had been approved and ratified by 
the people. It was proposed by this resolution to pay the Secre- 
tary four dollars per day, under the law, and the assistant but 
two dollars. 

He was satisfied that we could not alter the salaries of our 
officers from the sum fixed by the Legislature, without making 
that resolution, or proposition containing this alteration, a com- 
ponent part of the constitution, and submitting it to the people 
for their ratification. Our mere enactment has no force whatever. 


- —Our constitution, if we can dignify it by such a name, will not 


be obligatory, in the least, on any one here or in the state, until it 
shall have been approved by the people. And he begged members 
not to encumber that instrument, which they had convened here 


18 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 

to frame, with these small and trifling sections, all of which would 
endanger the adoption of the constitution. He said, that upon 
all of the great and important subjects which would engage the 
deliberations of that body, they were familiar with the feelings, 
sentiments, and opinions of their constituents, and were ready 
and prepared to vote upon them; but upon these little questions, 
which had never been the subject of thought among the people, 
the members of the Convention could not say what were the 
sentiments of their constituents; and by voting for their incorpora- 
tion with the constitution, they endangered its adoption. Had 


we not, then, better go home and leave these light and trivial 


matters for future legislation, and not have these appendages, 
upon which we know nothing of the sentiment of the people? 

Mr. D. then read, as a part of his speech, the proposed amend- 
ment that had been ruled out of order; it was to the effect that the 


members should contribute a portion of their pay, for the purpose 


of employing and paying the Secretary and Sergeant-at-arms at 
the rate of four dollars per day. He said there were one hundred 
and sixty-two members present, who were drawing four dollars 
per day, and employed in a discussion upon the question whether 
our door-keeper shall receive two or four dollars a day, while that 
very discussion was a tax of two hundred dollars an hour upon 
the state. The gentlemen, in their zeal for economy, strike at the 


pay of these petty officers, who have no interest or responsibility - 


other than to perform their duty and receive their pay; yet it 
was said that the mere reduction of their pay was to accomplish 
wonders—relieve the state from all debt, feed the starving suffer- 
ers in Ireland, and many other like brilliant acts. 

Now, he would remind them that, by dispensing with half an 
hour’s debate upon this question, enough would be saved to pay 
the whole additional expense. The speeches of the gentlemen— 
and he would not be understood as meaning to say they were not 


well worth the money—would, then, if dispensed with, pay the 


whole expenses. 

He then proposed that the members should come forward and 
voluntarily surrender a respective share of their own pay, and 
give it to the door-keeper. But in case they were to have speeches 
he was willing to stake their own pay on the fact whether our 


5 Bite 


TUESDAY, JUNE 8, 1847 19 


actions meet the approval of the people; and was willing, if th 
people do not accept the work of this Convention, and return the 
constitution on our hands, that we take it, and not receive any 
other payment for our services. 

This would show our sincerity in speaking so much of economy. 
He hoped, therefore, that they would elect these officers, and a 
printer, and complete the organization of the Convention, and 
proceed with the business. Speech-making cost $100 every thirty 
minutes; let us organize without further debate, and for the future 
- economize both time and money. 

Mr. HAYES moved the previous question. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess asked if the previous question 
was in order? We had adopted no rules. 

The CHAIR said it was in order. 

Mr. WILLIAMS rose to debate the propriety of taking the 
previous question. 

Mr. BALLINGALL called to order; and a discussion ensued 
as to Mr. Wruu1ams’ right to proceed. 

The CHAIR decided in his favor. 

Mr. W. said, that he thought, when he came here today, we 
were ready to proceed with the business; that we were sufficiently 
organized to have started other important questions. But there 
were important questions involved in the present one, which he 
thought should be discussed now and at once. They would have 
to be settled at some time. 

Messrs. Parmer of Macoupin, Tuomas, Loupon, and Locan 
continued the discussion on the propriety of taking the main 
question, a more detailed report of whose remarks we regret our 
inability, from want of room, to give in our present number. 

Mr. HAYES then withdrew his call. 

Mr. DAVIS of Bond promised, as he desired to present a few 
remarks, to do as others had done—to speak of everything else 
save the resolution before them. He did not think the Convention 
had the power or right to appropriate money from the treasury. 
The present constitution of the state, which was the supreme law 
of the land, gives the Legislature the power to call a Convention, 
and under that constitutional power this Convention had been 


20 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


called. He apprehended that if the Convention had the power to 
appropriate money in one case, they had the same power to do so 
in all. The constitution directs the manner in which money shall 
be appropriated; that constitution, and every law under it, is yet 
in full force. Suppose we make an appropriation and attach it to 
the constitution we shall frame, and that constitution is rejected 
by the people, what becomes of the appropriation? He under- 
stood the Legislature had power to call a Convention, and they 
had done so, and made provisions for its comfort and convenience 
by law.—The constitution says, “no money shall be appropriated 
out of the treasury except by law.’’ Can we ascend higher than 
the constitution? If we can, I ask for the book, for the law 
and the precedent. I come here to effect the election of judges 
by the people, limiting the sessions of the Legislature to once in 
four years, and then for sixty days only, and for settling their 
per diem. I can’t say we will do so, nor that the people will 
ratify what we really will propose to them. He asked again 
where was the authority for this Convention to make laws, or 
what act of theirs would be binding unless ratified by the people? 
When we formed our present constitution we were a territory, 
and the instances of appropriation spoken of by the gentleman 
from Sangamon were embodied in the constitution, and pre- 
sumed an adoption thereof by the people. 

Mr. PALMER of Marshall, after some preliminary remarks, 
said he could not think any gentleman would deny the right of the 
members, under the present embarrassed state of affairs, to take 
but two dollars a day; and that our officers, who will be fully as” 
patriotic, will follow our example and give their services for the 
same amount of compensation. He hoped the members would 
reduce their own pay. They could not reduce the pay of their 
officers, of the judges and all others, and then go home to their — 
constituents with four dollars a day in their pockets. He had 
brought money with him to pay his board and all other expenses, 
and was willing to take but the two dollars. He was old, but 
hoped not to be laid in his grave till all our debts had been paid. 

Mr. P. followed the question at some length, but we not having 
room, must close our report of his speech for the present. 


3 See correction made by Davis in his speech on Monday, June 14, pp. 75-76. 


A” ee 
ai Sha 
7 

* : 


ha 
7, 


TUESDAY, JUNE 8, 1847 21 


_ The previous question was again moved, but withdrawn at 
the request of 

Mr. SCATES, who moved to lay the whole matter on the table, 
to enable the committee on Rules to report; which was agreed to. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison, from the committee for that 
purpose, reported a series of rules and regulations for the govern- 
ment of the Convention; which were read and adopted. 

Mr. SERVANT moved that 300 copies of the rules just 
adopted be printed. 

Mr. SCATES advocated a smaller number, but suggested that 
we had not yet chosen a printer, and therefore moved to lay the 
motion to print on the table. Carried—yeas 73, nays 62. 

Mr. WILLIAMS, in order to give the President time to 
appoint the committees moved that the Convention adjourn till 
to-morrow, at Io A.m. Carried—yeas 79, nays 61. 


Ill. WEDNESDAY, HE 9) 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Bercen.! be 
Messrs. Hurysut and Cuoare, delegates to the Convention, 


appeared this morning, presented their credentials, and were 
qualified. 

The Secretary then read the journal. 

Mr. DEMENT moved to admit within the bar of the Cae 
tion the Governor of the State, Secretary of State, and Judges of 
the United States and State Courts. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved to amend by adding 

“and all ex-officers of the state.’ 

Mr. KNOWLTON moved to add “and all officers and soldiers 
just returned from the Mexican war.’ 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean moved to add “and all means of 
Congress.” 

Mr. WHITNEY moved to lay the resolution and amendments 
on the table. Carried. 


: 4Rey. Joe G. Bergen: born November 27, 1790, at Highletane Middle- 
sex County, New Jersey; of Norwegian and Scotch descent; preliminary 


education at academies in Cranberry and Baskin Ridge; 1807, graduated from 
Princeton; March, 1810—September, 1812, tutor in Princeton; December, — 
1812, ordained as ‘Presbyterian minister; ‘December, 1812—September 10, ; 


1828, pastor at Madison, New Jersey; September 22, 1828, left for Illinois, 


sent by the Home Board of the American Missionary Association; November, 


1828, arrived in Springfield; December, 1828—December, 1848, ‘frst regular 
pastor of First Presbyterian Church of Springfield; organized Second Presby- 
terian Church of Springfield, and a number of additional churches; December, 
1848, resigned as pastor, devoting himself to writing for the press over the 


signature of ‘‘Old Man of the Prairies’’ and to missionary effort among feeble — 


churches; several times commissioner to the general assembly of the Presby- 
terian church; assisted in forming first presbytery and first synod in the state; 
first moderator of each, and first moderator of the united synod; for many 
years a director of the Theological Seminary of the Northwest at Chicago; 
1854, given degree of D. D. by Centre College, Danville, Kentucky; died 
January 17, 1872. 

Baran and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois; History of 
Sangamon County, 2: 862, 866; Power, History of the Early Settlers of Sanga- 
mon County, 114-116; Inter-State Publishing Company, History of Sangamon 


County, 515-519; Chapman Brothers, Portrait and Biographical Album of 


Sangamon County, 294, 778. 
22 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 9, 1847 23 


Mr. SINGLETON offered a resolution stating the powers of 
the Convention to be limited. 

Mr. ARCHER offered the following amendment: 

“Resolved, That this Convention has assembled for the purpose 
of revising, altering, or amending the constitution of this state, 
and that the powers and duties of said Convention are limited, 
after its proper organization, to such objects only. 

“Resolved, That, with a view of entering upon the discharge of 
the duties assigned to said Convention, we now proceed to the 
election of an assistant Secretary and assistant door-keeper and 
printer, any resolution heretofore passed to the contrary notwith- 
standing.” 

In offering the above, Mr. A. said, that he did so with a view 
of presenting his opinions upon the matter that had occupied the 
Convention for the past day or two.—In so doing he was very 
anxious to pay all respect to the opinions and views of those with 
whom he differed, and without reflecting in the least upon their 
motives or views. He held true economy to consist, in some 
measure, in the employment of the means sufficient to accomplish 
the end. 

The act of the Legislature has provided officers for this Con- 
vention, to enable us to carry out the objects for which we have 
convened. He thought another Secretary and Sergeant-at-arms 
necessary; and if the Convention, from the want of either one of 
these officers, were detained a single day beyond the time they 
would otherwise have concluded their business, the expense 
attendant on that delay would be far more than the additional 
expense of these officers. He was of opinion that the powers 
of the Convention were expressed correctly in his amendment to 
the resolution of the gentleman from Brown.—The question of 
economy in the pay of the officers of the Convention, or of the 
members thereof, formed no subject in the canvass in the county 
which he (Mr. A.) had the honor, in part, to represent. He con- 
tended that the Convention had no legislative powers; that in 
the way of economy he would go as far as any other in retrenching 
the expenses of the state of Illinois. The original resolution sub- 
mitted whether there should be a Convention, and the act calling 
the Convention contemplated no such purpose as that we were to 


24 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


have legislative powers; and none other than to alter and. revise 
the constitution. Mr. A. would go with any of them in putting 
down to the lowest rates, that would command talent, the salaries 
of all officers. 

Mr. McCALLEN offered the following as an amendment to 
the amendment: Strike out “printer,” and insert, “that the 
Secretary be instructed to receive sealed proposals at his desk, 
until 10 o’clock, A. M., to-morrow, for the printing for this Conven- 
tion; and that the President proceed at that hour to open said 
proposals, and award the printing to the lowest responsible bidder.” 

Mr. SCATES moved to lay the whole subject on the table. 

Mr. CONSTABLE appealed to him to withdraw - motion. 

Mr. SCATES declined. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess hoped that it mer be with- 
drawn, and that the vote by which the rules had been adopted 
would be reconsidered. | 

The vote was then taken on laying the subject on the table, 
and decided in the affrmative—yeas 72, nays 67. 

Mr. DAVIS of Bond submitted some amendments to the rules; 
to which 

Mr. LOGAN offered an amendment. 

Mr. PRATT offered an amendment to the amendment. 

Mr. WEAD moved to lay the resolution and amendments on 
the table; which was carried. 

Mr. ROBBINS offered two resolutions in relation to the number 
and selection of the standing and select committees, and advocated 
their adoption. 

Mr. DEMENT opposed the resolutions. 

_ Mr. WEAD moved to lay them on the table, and print; after- 
wards withdrew the motion to print, and the resolutions were laid 
on the table. Eis 

Mr. ARMSTRONG offered a resolution in relation to addi- 
tional committees to be appointed. Laid on the table. 

Mr. DEMENT moved to take up the resolutions offered by 
Mr. SINGLETON, and the amendment; and, after debate, hey were 
taken up. 

Mr. BROCKMAN advocated the adoption of the amendment 
of the gentleman from Pike to the resolution of the gentleman 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 9, 1847 25 


from Brown. He denied that the @onyeicion had any legislative 
powers; nor any power save that expressly granted by the Legis- 
lature. The Legislature had defined the pay for our officers, and 
we had no power to change it. He was for retrenchment when- 
ever that subject came properly before them. He hoped they 
would immediately elect a secretary, a sergeant-at-arms, and a 
printer, which officers were necessary. He advocated a full and 
immediate organization of the Convention, and that it should at 
once proceed to public business. 

Mr. SINGLETON said, that he had offered the resolution in 
order to bring before the Convention the true question—its 
powers. He thought the power of a Convention was merely to 
propose alterations and amendments to the constitution, and that 
the people had the right and the power to make the changes. 
We had no power to change the law, but we had the power to 
propose the change, and the people to make the change.—It was 
true that, to some extent, the people are here in their sovereign 
capacity, but it was only to inquire whether they should change 
theirlaw. The Legislature is just as sovereign as this Convention. 
This body is clearly bound by the act of the Legislature. The 
people are represented in that body as much, if not more, in their 
sovereign capacity as in this. The people never intended these 
matters relative to the compensation of officers should come 
before us. There was no power by which men are obliged to take 
the four dollars per day, when they think proper to take less. He 
believed the Convention wanted an assistant secretary and another 
sergeant-at-arms, and would vote for their election, and was 
willing to give them the pay provided by law. He had offered 
the resolution for the purpose of bringing the true question before 
the Convention. If there had been no provision in the act of the 
Legislature for the pay of the members, the number and salary of 
its officers; if these matters had not been settled for us by the 
Legislature, he would then be able to discover the propriety of the 
discussion; but as all had been done by that body, he could 
see no propriety in it. As to the pay of the members, he was 
determined to take the four dollars a day, and no less; and would 
not be afraid to go before his constituents and tell them he had 
done so. 


26 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


On motion of Mr. CONSTABLE, the amendment proposed 
by Mr. McCatten was laid on the table—yeas 87, nays 56. 

The question recurring on Mr. ArcHER’s amendment; 

Mr. LOGAN said, that he was inclined to take the vote 
just had as decisive of the intention of the Convention to choose 
the officers, and upon that subject would say no more. But the 
resolution offered by the gentleman from Brown presents a 
principle which he considered a heresy in politics, and as there 
were two‘propositions before them, he preferred the amendment 
of the gentleman from Pike: If the Convention were to say that 
it was bound to do as bid by the Legislature, it would establish a 
most dangerous precedent; and if they were obliged to follow the 
direction of the Legislature in any one case, they are bound to do 
so in all.—The constitution says a Convention may be called “to 
amend, alter, and revise’ —not to propose amendments; alter- 
ations, and revisions. If the Legislature be right in saying the 
Convention has only the right to propose a constitution, they have 


the right to say what amendments, alterations, &c., shall be made. — 


He considered it wrong in principle and bad as a precedent. If 
either of the propositions were to be passed, he preferred that of 
the gentleman from Pike. 


Mr. SINGLETON contended that the Legislature had the ~ 


power to regulate, to some extent, the manner in which the 
Convention should be organized, and to direct its government in 


all things that do not go to the proposed changes in the constitu- . 
tion. The present constitution gives the Legislature power to 


call a Convention, and the Legislature has provided for that call, 
and says we must come here, not with power to make changes, 


but to propose changes to be acted on by the people. They have 


no right to say to us what changes shall be made, but state in 
what manner they shall be made. 


By the constitution, the legislative powers of the state are 


described to be vested in a House of Representatives and a 
Senate, who, together, shall constitute a General Assembly. 
Their powers are not limited, but they may exercise any power 


not expressly limited by 'the constitution of the state, the consti- 


tution of the United States, a law of Congress, or a treaty. Had 
they a right to say that the changes proposed by this Convention 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 9, 1847 27 


should be submitted to the people? If they had no right, I want 
a direct vote on the matter. If they had, I am bound by what 
they have done. 

This Convention has those necessary, natural, inherent powers 
of self-protection that all deliberative bodies possess; no other 
power but what is derived from the Legislature, save the power 
of self-defence. 

Mr. PETERS said, that he had and would continue to vote 
against any and every proposition which would recognize any 
restriction of the powers of this Convention. We are here the 
sovereignty of the state. We are what the people of the state 
would be if they were congregated here in one mass meeting. We 
are what Louis XIV said he was—“We are the state.”’ We can 
trample the constitution under our feet as waste paper, and no 
one can call us to an account save the people. A resolution had 
been passed by the Legislature presenting to the people the 
question of a Convention or not. Ifa majority of the people chose 
a Convention, then the law directed the Legislature to call that 
Convention, and then its functions ceased. If they had named no 
officers in their act, could not this Convention have selected as 
many as they pleased? If they had said we should have no officer 
but a President, could we not have gone on and elected a secretary 


and what officers we thought necessary? We can change any 


organic law of this state that we please. My proposition is that 
we have the power to adopt a constitution which, from the day of 
its passage by this body, will be the supreme organic law of this 
state, without any reference to the people. However, such a 
course as that might not be advisable-—But there are many things 
which I could not refer to the people, for instance, the council of 
revision, and that because we know the sentiments of the people 
on them already. 

I am for economy. But I make no speeches on the subject 
for home consumption. I am for allowing the members of this 


- body but two dollars a day. 


Here the Convention adjourned til[]] 2, p. m. 


28 I LLI NOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. DAVIS of Massac commenced by taking ground against 
the superiority of the powers of the Convention as against the 
enactment of the Legislature—the law-making power, established 
and recognized by the supreme organic law of the state yet in 
force. He reviewed the history of the act of the Legislature pro- 
viding for a call of this Convention, and argued that it was both 
constitutional and proper. As to economy—though in favor of 
it—he scorned to consume the time of the house, so valuable, by 
making speeches about it. He had voted to lay the proposition— 
to let the printing out—on the table, because, in his opinion, they 
had convened there for nobler ends than debating about such 
trifles; they had convened to amend the organic law of the state, 
so that it would conduce to their prosperity and happiness. He 
understood the provision in the present constitution, relative to 
the salaries of judges, very differently from the gentleman from 
Sangamon.—The provision was made in the constitution that 
they should receive a certain salary, but the Legislature of 1819 
made the appropriation whereby the pay, thus fixed and estab- 
lished in the constitution, could be drawn from the treasury. 
And it was by virtue of their act, and not of the provision in the 
constitution, that the money was paid out. That very same 
Legislature, sir, made an appropriation to pay the members of 
the Convention that framed the constitution; they fixed it at 
four dollars a day. The officers and others were also paid by the 
Legislature, who made the appropriation for them all. Not a 
man in that convention of 1818, nor out of it, ever understood 
that they could draw any money under the provisions of the con- “ 
stitution, until the Legislature had made the necessary appro- 
priation. He regretted, and it was universally regretted, that a 
gentleman gifted with such powers, and from whose experience 
and ability so much was justly expected, whose eminent talents 
should lead them and aid the Convention in its important duties, 
should have suffered himself to be led off into a discussion of 
subjects so foreign to the matter before the Convention. He 
alluded to the gentleman from Sangamon. 

The gentleman who had made the most strenuous and potent 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 9, 1847 29 


argument against the law of this Legislature was, if he had not 
been greatly misinformed, in the last General Assembly, one of 
its foremost and ablest supporters. If that law is wrong now, it 
was wrong then; and why did he support it then? He (Mr. D.) 
took a different view of this matter than that of gentlemen who, 
from friends and advocates of the law, had become its denouncers. 

Mr. SCATES offered an amendment—that the Convention 


should proceed to the election of a printer, assistant secretary, 


0 ent 
ie 


and door-keeper. He said this discussion had taken a wide range— 
first it was the employment of a door-keeper, then the question 
of retrenchment, then the powers of the Convention. He wished, 
however, as all had the same object—economy—in view, that 
they could see the means to accomplish it in the same light. 
There might be an economy of time as well as money. The 
question originally was to rescind; from which sprang the question 
of the powers of the Convention, and economy—dquestions which 
did not belong to the original question. While gentlemen were 
discussing this matter, they had made declarations and pledged 
themselves to carry out the principle of economy in all things that 
should come before the Convention. When this came about he 
expected to be in the first rank; none should go higher and none 
lower in the scale of economy than he. He advised, then, an 
organization of the Convention as soon as it could be affected, 
though he did not desire to cut off any gentleman who might wish 
to discuss this matter. He questioned, doubted, and denied the 
power of the members to bind themselves, or their officers, or 
officers of the government, by any simple resolution of the body; 
because, if not embodied in the constitution, it was not and could 
not be a law—therefore, it was not obligatory. 


[We have no legislative powers. Resolutions appropriating 
money by dollars and half dollars is the administration of gov- 
ernment which we have no power to do. 

Suppose we say in our constitution that a certain amount of 
money shall be paid our members and officers for their services, 
will it be any more than an inoperative, inchoate act, until our acts 
shall be confirmed by the people? Let the;President of this Con- 
vention issue certificates to these men and boys for their services, 


30 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS” SS 


wb) 
~ 


will the Auditor, though he may have our resolution on his table, 
pay any attention to it, or refuse to pay what the law of the state 
directs? What an aspect would we present if these boys, receiv- 
ing certificates under an appropriation made by this Convention, 
and the chief officer of the State obeying the behests of the law, 
and setting at defiance the supreme constitution-making power, 
refuse to pay them but in the manner directed by the act of the 
Legislature! What remedy? It is true you might invoke the 
power of the courts of justice, obtain a mandamus to compel him, 
&c. es 

Here we are—one hundred and sixty-two members, gravely 
driving half dollar bargains with messengers and boys. To at- 
tempt to undo the act of the Legislature by our resolution is im- 
possible—We might as well go back and overhaul all legislation 
had under the constitution, as this very law. The gentlemen are 
disposed to make the compensation of these offices so low as to 


take away the inducement to seek the office. He was disposed 


to go as far as any; but he thought that the Convention could not 
fix the price so low but that men will seek it. Men sometimes 
seek office for the honor of it. The pay of the soldiers in the army 
is but $10 per month—and the post is not a very desirable one at 
that, yet we have witnessed the scramble that has taken place to 
get in the army; and there has been as much anxiety to get into 


the ranks as to get into the offices of this Convention. He hoped 
the Convention would now elect these officers and complete their 


organization. 
He regretted that so much time had been spent in demagog- 
ueism [szc]; in making speeches for Buncome; in making speeches, 


for effect upon the constituents of members and others, about — 
economy. In introducing ridiculous resolutions for this purpose,” 


he had witnessed the same at almost every session of the Legisla- 
ture, and he asked why had they been introduced here? It had 


been shown that these speeches about economy of cutting down 


the Door-keeper’s pay cost more than would pay all the officers 
of the Convention for their services.—It was useless to continue 
thus, at an expense of over six hundred dollars a day—of one hun- 


dred an hour—we should only have such discussion as would aid 


us in our schemes of retrenchment, as much as we pay for it. 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 9, 1847 31 


He who first threw this gauntlet is responsible; on his head 
rests the extravagance who first introduced this useless matter. 
This is not the place to make a flourish—nor is it a place for ab- 
stractions like those on your desk. I cannot subscribe to them; 
they are but abstractions, why introduce and discuss them here?]® 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, that as there was some 
disposition to close the discussion, he would take the present 
opportunity of expressing his views in relation to the matter under 
discussion before the Convention, and he deemed that he was not 
doing more than he had a right todo. Those who complained so 
much of the great consumption of time, its cost and its waste, 
should remember that they had occupied their full share of the 
time that had been consumed in making speeches themselves. 
They should remember that there were many here who had never 
before been members of a deliberative body—he was one of them— 
and who were unacquainted with many things that were more 
familiar to others. He had come here to receive information on 
many points, and was in favor of a free and full discussion of every 
subject matter that came before them.—Others had come with 
written constitutions in their pockets, which, if the Convention 
would adopt, as no doubt the gentlemen desired it would, they 
might go home at once, and make great economy of time. 

He thought it his privilege, though one of the humblest 
members of the body, to express his views upon every subject 
that he deemed necessary to discuss; and the exercise of that 
privilege, which is guarantied to every delegate, would not 
be influenced by the time it would consume. He should pursue 
that course which his conscience dictated, regardless of what it 
might cost, or the time it might occupy. If he did not do so, he 
would not be true to the trust confided in him. 

He considered that every subject should be properly under- 
stood before they came to any conclusion; he was opposed to the 
hot haste that some were desirous to follow. 

Gentlemen had made statements in this Convention, had 
made speeches that would be spread before the people, which 


5 The conclusion of Scates’ speech, which was omitted from the tri-weekly 
Tilinois State Register, has been taken from the weekly of July 11. 


hte 2 2 


32 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


might lead to prejudicial results as to other delegates in that body. 
He was unwilling that this should be, unless along with them we 
spread the views of those who happened to - with those 
gentlemen. 

He did not believe in the omnipotence of this body. It was 
necessary, before we could come here, that there should be some 
legislation; that the Legislature should arrange those matters 
which should be done before we could convene. Could the people 
—the entire people—meet here at Springfield, the seat of govern- 
ment, and, without the previous action of the Legislature pre- 
scribed by the constitution, proceed to adopt the constitution? 

No, sir, they could not. We meet here by the authority of a 
supreme power, which has given vitality to this Convention? 
Are not the regulations of that supreme power binding and im- 
perative on us? Suppose a case: Let a vacancy occur in this 
Convention—how would it be filled? Could this Convention pass 
a law setting a day for the election of another to fill the vacancy? 
I hardly think any delegate would say it could. I apprehend it 
is not in our power to do any such thing. We must abide by the 
law which has called us here for a particular purpose. During 
the canvass for the members of this Convention, the tree of public 
sentiment has been shaken, and the fruits are now collected in 
this hall, and I am in favor of selecting the good and sound of ~ 
them, and of engrafting them on the constitutional stock. The 
Convention of the state of New York sat for four months, and 
complained that they had not sufficient time to discharge their 
duties; and I suppose no gentleman will dispute that there was 
as much talent in that Convention as in this. Yet the Legislature 
that called them together had limited the time of their sitting to 
four months, and they, proclaiming that they had not sufficient 
time to perform the duties assigned them, adhered to and obeyed 
that law strictly, as imperative upon them. We are sitting here 
making an organic law for ourselves and for our children; the 
duty is most important, and I am opposed to hasty action.—l 
want to deliberate, to reflect—time to have the aid of others’ 
experience and views to aid me. I desire all the aid and advantage 
to be derived from a full and]free interchange of sentiment of 
every delegate of this Convention. 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 9, 1847 33 


It has been said that the officers could be appointed by reso- 
lution, and such a resolution had been adopted the first day of 
this Convention. I have heard gentlemen of this Convention, 
who were members of the very Legislature that passed this law, 
and who voted for it, now come forward and denounce the law as 
inoperative, and declare we are not bound by it. They go 
further, and declare the Convention is above all law. Strange, 
strange, that gentlemen in the Legislature should vote for a law, 
and now get up here and denounce it, declaring that they had no 
power to pass it. 

Mr. LOGAN. The gentleman will allow me to say that this 
law was passed before the Legislature had fixed the pay of its 
members, and when I voted for it I had no idea the Legislature 
would fix that pay at $4 a day. 

Mr. CAMPBELL. Then I would ask the gentleman if he did 
not vote for the law which allowed members their present per diem? 

Mr. LOGAN. No, sir. I asked to be excused from voting. 
I had motives of delicacy to induce me to do so, which I need not 
repeat. I did not vote at all. 

Mr. CAMPBELL. Well, then, the gentleman says he did 
not vote against the bill, for reasons best known to himself. 

Mr. LOGAN. I hardly think the gentleman desires to mis- 
represent me. 

Mr. CAMPBELL. Certainly not, sir. 

Mr. LOGAN. I did not say that I did not vote for reasons 
best known to myself; but I did say from feelings of courtesy 
towards members who came here from a distance, and who might 
have supposed that, from the fact of my residing at the seat of 
government, I might be influenced in my vote. That was the 
reason, sir.. I would have voted against it if my vote would have 
had any effect. 

Mr. CAMPBELL. Well, the gentleman cannot clear him- 
self yet. He permits money to be taken out of the treasury, does 
not vote against the law, but quietly permits it to be passed, and 


- now gets up here and denounces the appropriation contained 


therein as extravagant.—Now, he had acted wrong, put the 
matter in any shape. If he, (Mr. C.) considered a principle 
wrong, he would be derelict in his duty if he did not resist it to 


34 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


the utmost of his efforts. This would have been his course if he 
had been in the General Assembly. Were these assistant officers 
necessary? If they were, why not vote for them? If they were 
not, vote them down. But, no; they must have a discussion 
upon saving a dollar or two in the wages. They must listen to 
this everlasting retrenchment, whose ghost he really expected to 


see stalking about that hall, and shaking its gory locks at those — 


who were so continually invoking it. 

We are now in debt, say gentlemen. We are all satisfied of 
that. How are we to get out of it? Why, say they, cut down 
the pay of the door-keepers, and employ a few boysas pages! A 
gentleman delivers a speech full of commiseration for the widows 
and orphans who hold our bonds, and who are suffering from 
famine in foreign lands, and declares that we should not have a 
door-keeper, because we owe them money. I am willing that that 
speech shall go there, and the gentleman receive full merit for his 


commiseration for their suffering; but I want another speech of . 


that gentleman to go along with it. I want then to know that 
when an appropriation of $20,000, at the last session of the Leg- 
islature, was made for the completion of a magnificent building in 
Springfield, the same gentleman advocated it most strenuously, 
while at the same time these widows and orphans were famish- 
ing because we did not pay them our debts; and that he now is 


endeavoring to cut down two dollars a day from the salary of a 


man to wait on the delegates. Let these facts all go together, 
and then they can form a true idea of the sincerity of his com- 
miseration for the widows and orphans! Nhat would be said of 
a gentleman who was in debt, largely, to a number of widows 
and orphans—always a fine subject for tears—who would erect 
a magnificent building worth $20,000, for his own comfort and 
convenience, and then say to his servants, I owe a large debt to 
some widows and orphans who are famishing in a foreign land, 
and to enable me to pay them, I must cut down your pay one- 
half; to enable me to relieve their sufferings, I must lay a contri- 
bution on you? 


Look across the way, on the other side of your street, and you 


will behold a magnificent’ edifice, with large fluted columns, and 
Italian marble floors, erected at a time when ‘widows and orphans’ 


¥ 


i 


be 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 9, 1847 35 


held their paper, which they could not, would not, never intended 
to redeem.—[Applause.] Was the gentleman’s voice heard then? 
—Let us, let them, let these ‘widows and orphans’ judge of the 
sincerity of the commiseration by facts. The time will come, the 
day is not far distant, when we may read, on the massive open 
panels of the door of that institution, this inscription, in chalky 
whiteness—“This house to let.” Yet it is hoped by some that out 
of the ashes of this institution, another, phcenixlike, will arise, 
with more brilliant plumage on its wing, a voice more finely toned 
to delusion, but with a keener glance of vengeance in its eye, 
greater strength in its pinion, and more power to destroy in its 
talons, which shall out-Herod its ancient ancestor; but I trust 
that ere this phcenix shall begin to live, these ashes to feel vitality, 
the fiat of this Convention will scatter them to the four winds of 
heaven. 

The sins of omission are not so bad in the sight of the people 
as those of commission. He would prefer, then, to stay within 
our proper undoubted bounds, rather than to venture on doubtful 
questions. 

Where is the restraint upon our powers? If we can appropri- 
ate one dollar, we can ten. So far as altering, amending, or 
abrogating the old constitution is concerned, we are (Mr. C. 
said) sovereign. But when we go beyond that duty, the 
constitution is as binding upon us as ever. That constitution 
Says no money shall be appropriated except by law. Who 
can make the law? Can this Convention? If the Legis- 
lature had not appropriated the money we could not receive one 
cent; nor can we say that any member of this body shall draw less 
than four dollars a day, as provided by the law of the Legislature. 

He had been an attentive observer of the proceedings of the 
Legislature of late. I have watched the progress of their economy. 
I have seen them, when a bill for the reduction of their own pay 
was before their body, voting for its passage, and, when it was on 
its way to the Senate, trembling, like Balthazar of old, with their 
knees shaking one against the other, with very fear that the 
Senate would pass their own bill. I have seen them running to 
and fro, electioneering with Senators to defeat the measure they 
dared not vote against. 


36 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Mr. LOGAN. I hope the gentleman does not allude to me as 
one of them. 

Mr. C. No, sir, no. The gentlemen have a great desire to 
have a starting point in their economy, and I have always noticed 
that they make small officers like door-keepers the starting point. 
When the magnificent building was proposed to be finished in 
Springfield, they found that that would not do for a starting 
point—‘‘you must commence with the door-keepers.” This, sir, 
is saving up pennies with one hand and scattering dollars with 
the other, while “widows and orphans” are famishing in foreign 
lands. He had heard a member in the Legislature declare that, 
during the whole session, he had not voted for an appropriation 
of a single dollar; yet that same man quietly pocketed the four 
dollars a day for his services. 

The gentleman from Sangamon had read an extract from the 
constitution of Vermont, which stated that the salaries of officers 
should not be so high as to induce persons to seek them. That — 
same gentleman, however, when the proposition was to raise the 
salaries of the judges, voted for it. Did he do this because there 
were no applicants for the office? No applicants in Illinois for 
judgeships! As regards the salaries of the judges, he was in 
favor of making them sufficiently large to command talent. 
Would any lawyer, he asked, who had by his talent and ability 
raised himself into standing and reputation, and whose practice 
allowed him to make $1,500 a year, accept a judgeship at one thou- 
sand?—Certainly not, particularly if he had a family to support 
and children to educate. 

He would always be in favor of fair and reasonable salaries to 
all officers. While we should not be prodigal on one hand, we 
should not fix the pay so low that it would not command talent. 
If low, men would seek it; if high, men would seek it; but if the 
pay were reasonable, men of talent would present themselves, 
would come into competition, and the people would elect them. 
He fully concurred with the opinion that this Convention could 
not compel a single delegate to forego one cent of the four dollars 
a day allowed by the Legislature. He was willing to contribute 
his share towards paying these officers, if the Convention would 
not elect them, but not one cent upon compulsion. 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 9, 1847 37 


Let the members obtain the certificate from the President, 
and go to the Auditor with them, and, though he has the resolution 
of this body on his table, he will not refuse to pay them what the 
law allows. If he does, get out a mandamus to compel him. He 
admitted that if the law of the Legislature in any way directed 
this Convention as to what charges should be made, so far it 
would be inoperative—would not be binding. Was it the inten- 
tion of any delegate to adopt a constitution as the organic law of 
the state without submitting it to the people? He was certain 
there was not, and therefore could see no propriety in discussing 
the point. 

The resolution of the gentleman from Pike states the object 
of this Convention to be to alter, amend, and revise the constitu- 
tion. I admit that for this purpose and object, the power of the 
Convention is omnipotent, but no farther. 

In conclusion, he hoped that after every gentleman had ex- 
pressed his opinion who desired to do so, we would proceed to the 
organization of the Convention——He was not for hot haste in 
any thing. The time taken up in discussing preliminary matters 
was not altogether lost; nor had there been more of it here than 
in other Conventions. 

Mr. WOODSON thanked the gentleman from Jo Daviess for 
the very liberal views he had expressed. He agreed with him 
that there was no necessity for haste. The matters that had been 
discussed would, at some future time, have been presented to us; 
and he considered it as well that they should be fully discussed 
and settled now. They had taken a wide range. He regretted 
that one gentleman from Fulton, who had participated much in 
the discussion, had thought necessary to move, to-day, upon 
every question that was presented, to lay on the table; thereby 
cutting off all opportunities for debate. Gentlemen had com- 
plained about the consumption of time. One of them, from Lee, 
had entered into a calculation upon the subject; and if we apply 
his calculation to his own speeches, it would appear that he had 
already cost the state $2,000. The only speeches that had been 
made on their side were those by the gentleman from Peoria and 
Sangamon. The Convention had voted down the proposition to 
have the printing let out to the lowest bidder, and that without 


38 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


debate. The gentleman from Fulton had expressed his determina ' 


tion to cut of{f] all debate, by moving to lay every proposition 
on the table, until the Convention had organized. 

Mr. WEAD explained that such was not his object. 

Mr. WOODSON resumed. He considered that the Conven- 
tion had sovereign power. Gentleman may speak of demagogue- 
ism, but he, when a principle was involved of such importance as 
that advocated by his friend from Sangamon, was of opinion that 
it was immaterial what the cost was, if the discussion would 
enable them to arrive at the true principles on which they should 
act. He had no idea that what he would say would have much 
effect upon the Convention; he spoke with great mistrust of his 
own power and abilities. He denied that this Convention was a 
creature of the Legislature—that it had called the Convention 
into being. They had been called there by a preliminary act of 


a former Legislature, on which the people had passed.—He- 
contended for the right of the Convention to say whether the 


constitution they might adopt should be submitted to the people 
or not. 

Mr. W. pursued the subject at some length, and we regret 
that from the want of space we cannot give the whole of the report 
of his speech furnished us.® 

Mr. WHITNEY advocated, briefly, the imniedenees organiza- 
tion of the Convention by the election of the remaining officers. 

Mr. KNOWLTON had been astonished and amused at the 
course which had been pursued by some gentlemen during this 
discussion. While he admitted that there was such a thing as 


economy of time, he would remind gentlemen that even the world — 


was not made in a day. He knew a man where he came from 
who had a constitution already written out, which, if he had 
thought of bringing [it] with him, might have been adopted, and 
they could now have been on their way home. He spoke at much 
length upon the importance of small matters when a great principle 
was concerned, and urged the necessity of always meeting them 
with an ample discussion. He would tell the gentleman from 
Jo Daviess that if the ghost of murdered Retrenchment came 


®A longer account of Woodson’s og may be found in the Sangamo 
Journal, June 17. 


de fel 
ae 


Bi 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 9, 7847. - 39 


into that hall, the gentleman from Jo Daviess would never be 
troubled by him. He would never be called upon to explain, 


_ with Macbeth, ‘Avaunt! shake not thy gory locks at me, I did it 


ea 


not; because no one would think of accusing that gentleman of 
anything connected with retrenchment. Mr. K. continued the 
subject much further, alluding particularly to the desire of his 
constituents to have the enormous allowances made for printing 
reduced. 

Mr. Archer replied briefly to Mr. K. and urged the views 
presented by him when he offered his amendment. 

Mr. GREEN of Tazewell said that he had come here under 
the expectation of meeting civilized men in Convention; men that 
had been, at least, decently educated. But, no; those whom 
he had heard had given way ‘to the use of that weapon called 
sarcasm. Gentlemen had forgotten that courtesy which should 
teach them to speak to and of each other more respectfully. This 
he said had been the impression made on him. He said that if 
he had come into the hall while one of them was speaking, he 
would most certainly have thought that a certain young man had 
fancied himself a David; that on the other side of the room had 
sprung up a Goliath; and this young man was prepared with his 
small pebble and sling to kill the monarch of the Philistines. 

He had heard the law expounded by judges, doctors, and 
readers of the law, and had heard as many opinions of what the 
law was as he had persons discuss it——What was to be done? ~ 
When doctors disagree who shall decide? Mr. G. denied the 
power of the Legislature to control or limit the powers of this 
Convention. He hoped to hear no more about omnipotencey 
[sic]. There was no omnipotence among frail men—even if there 
were one hundred and sixty-two of them. 

Mr. LOGAN said it was not his wont to discuss questions 
after he had ascertained that such discussion was to have no effect. 
But he desired to say a few words in reply to what had been said 
concerning himself. Gentlemen had cast out insinuations upon 
the motives which had governed the actions and speeches of 
others; they might do so, for they had no effect upon him; he 
passed them by as the idle wind, which he regarded not. It had, 
also, been said that speeches had been made for Buncombe, &c.; 


40 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


but he could assure gentlemen that he had as little use for such 
matters as any others. 

He had stated, when he first spoke, that the door-keeper and 
secretary were the trifling matters, and should not have contended 
on that point if it had stood alone. The gentleman from Clinton 
had offered this resolution, and he should have been the object 
of the gentlemen’s wrath. They had, however, permitted his 
friend to escape, and had poured out all their vials of wrath on 
his (Mr. L.’s) head. When he saw the vote this morning, he 
considered and was satisfied that the matter was decided; but 
the gentlemen had continued their attacks upon him. 

He had no desire to turn upon these gentlemen with angry 
feelings, for the truth was that there was no truth in anything that 
had been said of him, except what the gentleman from Jo Daviess 
had said. He cared nothing for the falsehoods; but when there 
was truth in the attack, he was disposed to admit its effect. 

He had not the least idea that the Legislature would raise the 
pay of the members above $3, and when they said $3.50, and sent 
it to the Senate, he was astonished. The Senate increased it to 
four dollars, and it came back to the House. He was disposed 


to vote against it, but in consequence of the motives of delicacy 


and courtesy mentioned before, and because he had just succeeded 
in getting through an appropriation of twenty thousand dollars, 
for the purpose of clearing away the dirt and rubbage scattered 
around this square, he interposed no objection to the per diem 
fixed. He felt he had done wrong, and he now candidly admitted 
that he was wrong in not voting against that which he considered 
wrong in principle. The law allowed some of the judges $1,500 
and others $1,000, and to make them all alike, and as they were 
to remain in office but a short time, he had voted to pay them all 
alike. 

He still urged that the Convention should exercise the strictest 
economy. The state was insolvent. He had, in consequence of 


endorsing for a friend, become insolvent himself. He had prac- — 


ticed retrenchment in all of his expenses of living until he had 
paid every cent he owed. The state should do the same. He 
was willing to jeopard his popularity, and would go as far as any 
man in so doing, by making the people pay her debt. 


nies 
~> 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 9, 1847 41 


Mr. ARCHER’S amendment was then adopted. 

The question was taken on the final adoption of the first 
resolution, and it was carried—yeas 87, nays 64. The second 
was also adopted. 

The Convention then proceeded to the election of an assistant 
secretary; when, H. G. Reyno ps received 84 votes; J. M. Burr, 
60; J. S. Roperts, 5; and Mr. Reynotps was declared elected. 

The Convention divided on the nomination of Mr. R. Woop- 
RUFF, as assistant door-keeper; when he received 86 votes, and 
was elected. 

The Convention then divided on the election of a printer, and 
Messrs. LanpHIER & WALKER received 88 votes, and were 
elected. 

On motion, 200 hundred [sic] copies of the rules were ordered 
to be printed. And then the Convention ‘adjourned until 9 
o clock, to-morrow. 


IV. THURSDAY, JUNE 10, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Dresser.’ 

Mr. MINSHALL presented a resolution setting forth proposed 
amendments to the present judicial system of the state; which 
was, 


On motion of Mr. MANLY, laid on the table. 

Mr. DUNSMORE presented a resolution. Adopted. 

Mr. WOODSON presented a resolution that the Convention 
should meet at 8, A. M., and adjourn at 12, M., and meet again 
at 3, and adjourn at 6, p. m., each day. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess thought that sessions of six 
hours each day were enough in this crowded hall, and this season 
of the year. He was in favor of meeting in the forenoon, and 
allowing the afternoon for the committees. 


Mr. SINGLETON thought it would be more conducive to the 


health of the members that they should be in the hall during the 
heat of the day. 

Mr. SCATES was in favor of short sessions each day, and that 
the committees should have sufficient time to perform their work. 


He would vote to meet at nine, and leave the Convention to. 


regulate its time of adjournment. 
Mr. SHUMWAY opposed the resolution. 
Mr. ROBBINS was in favor of the proposed hour of meeting, 


but opposed to the fixed hours of adjournment, as such would 


7Rey. Charles Dresser: born February 24, 1800, at Pomfret, Connecticut; 
1823, graduated from Brown University; went to Virginia and studied the- 


ology with Dr. Meade (afterward Bishop Meade); 1829, ordained as minister 


of the Protestant Episcopal church; April, 1838, arrived at Springfield, 
Illinois; 1838-1852 (1855?), rector of St. Paul's Episcopal Church of Spring- 
field; November 4, 1842, performed marriage ceremony for Abraham Lincoln 


and ‘Mary Todd; 1855, elected Professor of Divinity and Belles Lettres in . 


Jubilee College and remained in that position some time; 1858, given degree 
of D. D. by St. Paul’s College, Missouri; returned to Springfield, where he 
died March 25, 1865. 


Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 137; Bateman 


and Selby, Hzstorical Encyclopedia of Illinois; History of Sangamon County, 
2: 889; Power, History of the Early Settlers of Sangamon County, 268, 269; 
Inter-State Publishing Company, History of Sangamon County, 659. 


42 


THURSDAY, JUNE 10, 1847 43 


lead to much inconvenience to the Convention. He offered to 
meet at 8 A. M. 

Mr. PALMER moved to lay the resolution and amendment 
on the table. Carried. 

Mr. CONSTABLE offered a resolution providing that the 
Convention should meet each day at 8, A. M., and 3, P. M. 

Mr. ROBBINS moved to strike out “3, Pp. mM.” Lost. 

The resolution was then adopted. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison offered a resolution increasing 
the number of committees. Adopted. 

Mr. HAYES offered a resolution providing ie a submission 
to the people of every amendment to the constitution, separately. 

Mr. DEMENT moved to refer the resolution to the committee 
on the Revision and Adjustment of the Constitution. 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved to lay the motion of reference on 
the table; which was carried. The resolution was then laid on 


the table. 


ee 
x 


Mr. ADAMS offered a resolution calling on the Secretary of 
State for certain information relative to literary matters and the 
state of the school fund. Adopted. 

Mr. PETERS offered a resolution to amend the rules by adding 
that there shall be [a] ‘“committee on Townships.” Laid on the 
table. 

Mr. HARVEY offered a resolution to increase the number of 
committees by adding a “committee on the State Debt.” Laid 
on the table. 

A resolution was offered, and adopted, providing for a “com- 
mittee on Legislative Business.” 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac offered a resolution that a quorum of 
this Convention, to do business, shall consist of two-thirds of the 
delegates elected, (108 members to constitute a quorum.) 
Adopted. 

Mr. Z. CASEY moved that 200 copies of the constitution of 
the state be printed for the use of the Convention. Adopted. 

Mr. WOODSON presented a preamble and resolution setting 
forth various proposed alterations in the state government. Laid 
on the table. 

Mr. SCATES offered a resolution requiring information from 


44 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


the revenue clerks of the different counties; which, after some. 


debate, and various proposed amendments had been voted down, 
was laid on the table. 

Mr. ARCHER presented a preamble and resolution relating 
to several proposed amendments to the constitution, and moved 
their reference to a committee. 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved to lay the motion to refer and the 
resolution on the table. Carried. 

Mr. SCATES presented a resolution that a select committee 
should be appointed to apportion the business among the several 
standing committees. 


Mr. KNOWLTON moved to lay the resolution on the table. — 


Which was carried. 

Mr. WHITNEY moved to adjourn till to-morrow, at 9, A. M., 
to enable the President to appoint the standing committees. 

Mr. BALLINGALL inquired of the Chair if that time would 
be sufficient. 

The CHAIR replied that he did not think he could appoint 
them before Monday next. 

Mr. WHITNEY then withdrew the motion to adjourn. 

Mr. McCALLEN offered a resolution providing that the 
standing committees should be chosen proportionately from the 
congressional districts. 

Messrs. WHITNEY and Apams opposed the resolution; and, on 
motion, it was laid on the table. 

Mr. DAVIS of Bond offered a resolution in relation to the 
judiciary. Laid on the table. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin offered a resolution on the same 
subject. Laid on the table. 

Mr. EVEY offered a resolution regulating the powers of the 


General Assembly, the pay of its members, &c.—Laid on the 


table. 
The Convention then adjourned till to-morrow, 9 A. M. 


V. FRIDAY, JUNE 11, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. HAte.® 

The PRESIDENT laid before the Convention a petition, re- 
ceived by him through the post office, praying certain reforms in 
the judiciary department of the state government; which was 
read, in part, and laid on the table. 

Mr. NORTHCOTT presented a resolution proposing to give 
the Legislature power to levy a poll-tax, to be appropriated to 
certain purposes. Laid on the table. 

Mr. ROUNTREE presented a resolution establishing a court 
of record, and abolishing certain other offices. Laid on the 
table. 

Mr. JENKINS offered a resolution providing for the election 
of state and county officers, their salaries, members of the Legis- 
lature, and their per diem. Laid on the table. 

' Mr. SCATES presented a resolution limiting the power, sala- 
ries, and term of office of the Executive, members of the Legislature, 
public printer, and other officers, and moved its reference to a 
committee of the whole Convention. He had embodied in it a 
series of questions which would occupy the time of the Convention 
hereafter, and he proposed that we should now go into committee 
where we might at once enter into a discussion of all the various 
subjects; and that the several committees might thereby be aided 


8Rey. Albert Hale: born November 29, 1799, at Glastonbury, Connecti- 
cut; 1813-1821, clerk in country store at Wethersfield; 1827, graduated from 
Yale; agent of American Tract Society in South Carolina, Florida, and Geor- 
gia; returned to Yale and completed theological course; 1830, ordained. to 
the ministry; preached for a few months near Boston, making his home with 
Rey. Lyman Beecher; November 11, 1831, arrived at Shawneetown, Illinois; 
1832-1839, made his home in Bond County, doing missionary work there and 
traveling over the state as evangelist; exercised a powerful influence over the 
Indians in Chicago; 1839-1866, pastor of Second Presbyterian Church of 
Springfield; devoted remainder of life to missionary work “‘among the extreme- 
ly poor and the pariahs of society;’’ died in Springfield, January 30, 1891. 

Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 215; Bateman and 
Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois; History of Sangamon County, 2: 
862; Power, History of the Early Settlers of Sangamon County, 348; Inter-State 
Publishing Company, History of Sangamon County, 605, 671. 


45 


46 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


in arriving at the views of the Convention upon each subject. 


As there were no standing committees to which these resolutions — 
could be referred, he hoped they would adopt his suggestion, and 


refer them all to a committee of the whole. 


Mr. ECCLES agreed with the gentleman from aii and 


supported his proposition. 
Mr. JENKINS opposed it, as the debate on these questions 
would have to be all gone over again when the subject came 


properly before the Convention. He moved to lay the resolu- 


tion on the table. Carried. 


Mr. ROBBINS presented a resolution, that the detente from | 
each congressional district should meet to-day, at 2, P. M., and. 


appoint from their number a select committee of two from each 
district, to aid the Chair in appointing standing committees of 


the Convention; and supported his proposition with some remarks. 


Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved to lay the motion on 
the table; which was carried. 
Mr. SHIELDS offered a resolution, changing the time of 


holding state elections from August to November.—Laid on the — 


table. 


should be authorized to procure such well-bound books as were 
necessary for the keeping of the proceedings of this Convention; 
2, that he should be authorized, when necessary, to employ a 
copyist; the purport of the third the reporter could not catch. 
On motion, the two last were laid on the table. 

Mr. Palmer of Macoupin moved to amend the first, by 
authorizing the employment of an additional secretary to do the 
copying. . 

The resolution and amendment were then withieueyy 

Mr. THOMAS renewed the resolution. 

Mr. LOUDON denied the necessity of the resolution. 

Mr. SINGLETON moved to amend the resolution by adding 
that a committee shall be appointed to inquire into the propriety 
and cost of employing a person to report the proceedings of the 
Convention for the state. 


Mr. THOMAS hoped the amendment would be withabepel ase 


it had no connection with the subject matter of the first. 


Mr. ARCHER offered three resolutions—1, that the secretary © if 


FRIDAY, JUNE 11, 1847 47 


Mr. SINGLETON thought the subject was an important one, 
and that something of the kind should be adopted; but for the 
present withdrew his amendment. 

Mr. KITCHELL moved to amend, by striking out all 
after the word “‘resolved,” and insert “that the Secretary of State 
be requested to furnish the necessary books, and that the Con- 

vention proceed to the election of an assistant secretary, whose 
duty it would be to do the copying.” 

Mr. WHITNEY moved to lay the subject on the table. 

The question was taken on laying the amendment on the table, 
and decided in the affirmative—ayes 87, noes not counted. 

The motion to lay the orig[ilnal on the table was then with- 
drawn. 


Mr. KINNEY of St. Clair moved to amend by providing that 
the additional secretary perform the duty of copying the journal. 

Mr. ARCHER stated that he had not withdrawn his resolution 
because it conflicted with the resolution adopted yesterday. He 
thought very differently. He also considered that the Convention 
had an implied right over its officers, and power to direct their 
duties. 

Mr. KINNEY of St. Clair gave his reasons for offering the 
amendment. He questioned the power of the Convention to 
appoint officers other than by the name stated in the law of the 
legislature; at least, that such officer[s] could be paid without an 
appropriation by the legislature. ' 

Mr. SCATES said, that the Convention had a right to employ 
any officers necessary for the transaction of business, but they 
would have to wait for their pay until the legislature should make 
an appropriation for the purpose. He opposed action in the mat- 
ter at the present time, because there was not sufficient copying 
yet to be done to afford a man sufficient employment. He hoped 
they would postpone the matter. He moved to lay the matter 
on the table. Carried.” 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough offered a resolution providing 
that no negro, Indian, mulatto, or other person of mixed blood, 
or one-eighth blood, should attain, have, or use the rights of 
citizenship under the constitution this Convention should adopt. 


48 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Mr. THOMAS moved to postpone the resolution till the first 
of December next. Carried. 

Mr. BROCKMAN offered a resolution that no new county 
shall be hereafter organized by the legislature, unless it shall 
contain an area of 400 square miles. 

Mr. WORCESTER offered a resolution providing for the 
election of state and county superintendents of common schools, 
&c. 

Mr. SHUMWAY moved to amend, by prohibiting the legis- 
lature from borrowing at any time any of the college or seminary 


funds. 


On motion of Mr. PETERS, the resolution and amendment ~ 


were laid on the table. 

Mr. BOSBYSHELL offered, as an additional rule, that no 
member, when addressing the Convention, shall speak over one 
hour. Laid on the table. 

Mr. KNAPP offered a resolution proposing, as a part of the 
new constitution, that no county shall be entitled to more than 
two members, &c.? Laid on the table. 

Mr. GEDDES offered a resolution providing that all elections 
hereafter shall be by ballot; to which was offered an amendment, 
that no one should vote at such elections except free white male 
citizens and such unnaturalized foreigners as had heretofore 
exercised the privilege. Laid on the table. 

Mr. WEAD offered a resolution calling for information from 


the Auditor about the public debt, the means present and pro- 


spective of paying the same, &c. 
Mr. DAVIS of Bond, believing no such information could be 
obtained, moved to lay it on the table, but withdrew the motion. 
Mr. WEAD said, his desire in presenting the resolution was 
to obtain all the information possible, with a view of putting in 
the new constitution some provision to liquidate the debt. He 


° At the close of the debates for Friday, June 18, the Illinois State Register 

of June 19, published the following correction by Knap 
“Mr. Eprtor: Will you be kind enough to cabhe: this communication 
in your next paper, by way of correcting some errors, which have been made 
doubtless by your reporter unintentionally. Ina previous number you report 
“Mr. Knapp’ as offering a resolution that * no county shall have more than 
two representatives nor less than one.’ That was offered by Mr. BosBy- 

SHELL.’ 


a 


FRIDAY, JUNE 172, 1847 49 


said that, even if all the Auditor knew of the matter had been 
reported, they could get that much information at least. The 
Auditor could tell them what property the state had, what means 
she had of paying the debt, and when the debt was payable. If 
it should turn out, (and this information would be of some assist- 
ance to them in coming at some conclusion,). that a low tax would 
pay the annual interest and finally the debt, they could decide on 
the measure. 

The state was laboring under the stain of not having 
provided for the payment of the interest on her debt, and his 
constituents felt more interest in that than in any other matter. 

Mr. LOGAN was in favor of the resolution, but he suggested 
that part of it was misdirected. It would be as well, indeed more 
proper, to address the first part of the resolution to the Fund 
Commissioner. The amendment suggested was accepted. 

Mr. Z. CASEY suggested that they could perhaps obtain 
more information by directing the inquiry to the Governor, who 
had returned from the east, where he had gone in relation to some 
matters connected with the state debt. He no doubt possessed 
the information. 

Mr. LOGAN said, that he had spoken under the impression 
that the Governor had not returned. 

Mr. WEAD accepted the suggestion as an amendment. 

Mr. SHUMWAY moved to add, that he be requested to inform 
them’ of the result of his negotiation; which amendment was 
accepted. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin suggested that it would be proper 
to amend by asking the information so far as the Governor might 
deem did not conflict with the public interest. 

Mr. WHITESIDE said, neither the Fund Commissioner or 
the Auditor could furnish the information called for by the 
resolution. Those officers had been called upon before, and 
there were no materials in their possession upon which they could 
report. He suggested some other officer. 

Mr. Z. CASEY said, the Governor, if required to furnish the 
information, could call upon all the different officers to furnish 
him with what each particular branch of the government had 
charge of. He hoped the resolution would pass. 


50 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Mr. DEMENT hoped the resolution would pass; and by calling tg ; 


upon the Governor for the information he possessed, we could 
receive all that was possessed by the various officers under his — 


control. 
The resolution was then adopted. 
Mr. GRIMSHAW offered a resolution calling upon the various 


county clerks for information in regard to the revenue of their 


respective counties, &c. Carried—yeas 78, nays 22. 


Mr. WOODSON offered, as an additional rule, that no standing. 


rule of the Convention should be rescinded or suspended, except 
by a vote of two-thirds. Lost—ayes 39, noes not counted. 
Mr. SCATES moved that the rules adopted by the Conven- 


tion some days ago be referred to a committee of the whole, for 


the purpose of amending or altering them. 

.Mr. THOMAS asked if the rules had been adopted by the 
Convention for their government; and, if so, had the vote by 
which they were adopted been reconsidered? 

The CHAIR replied that the rules had been adopted; that 


the vote adopting them had not been reconsidered; and that he — 


did not think it in order to refer the rules, as moved by the gentle- 
man from Jefferson. 

Mr. DEMENT inquired if any delegate were to propose an 
amendment to the rules, whether it would not be in order to refer 
that amendment to the committee of the whole; and, being 
answered in the affirmative, said he hoped they would follow the 
suggestion. 

Mr. Z. CASEY said, he thought there was no necessity for the 
Convention to go into committee of the whole to amend the rules. 


They were the rules of the Convention, adopted by the Conven- — 


tion, and governed by the Convention could do with them as 


they pleased.—They had adopted them, and, at any time, could — 
alter or repeal them. If you refer the rules to the committee, — 


they govern there as well as in Convention, and you could do no 


more there with them than here. He thought it better and ~ 


easier for the Convention to amend the rules than by referring 
them. 

Mr. WOODSON agreed with the gentleman from Jefferson 
last up. He was satisfied that gentleman was right. The 


> > ee Fs ‘ on ‘ 
eS SS cae ge ee Oe ane 


cea 


“ 


we ae ee = Oe Sie A eee eed 


' FRIDAY, JUNE 11, 1847 si 


Convention could, by a bare majority, amend the rules, and 
there was but little to be done in amending them. 

Mr. DEMENT said, that he was not anxious to get the 
matter into committee of the whole, but as the gentleman from 
Jefferson had expressed a desire to that effect, he had only made 


a suggestion as to the proper means of arriving at his object. He 


had voted against the resolution requiring a two-third vote to 
amend the rules, because he knew the rules had been adopted 
without discussion, and that, perhaps, some members desired to 


have them altered. He was satisfied with them, and, when they 
had again been voted on, would be in favor of the two-third rule. 


Mr. DAVIS of Bond had been informed that the rules had 


been adopted by the Convention; there was no necessity of a 


further discussion of them. If it was desired to amend, let the 
proposition be made and voted on. 

Mr. SCATES had no other desire in moving to go into com- 
mittee of the whole than that of economizing time. He had no 
intention to propose any amendment, nor was he in favor of chang- 
ing any of them, except, perhaps, the number required by the 
6th rule to demand the yeas and nays. He might vote to reduce 


- it from ten to a smaller number. 


Mr. PALMER of Macoupin said, that as gentlemen had 


expressed themselves satisfied with the rules, he would move to 


reconsider the vote by which the two-third rule had been rejected. 
He had voted against it because gentlemen desired to discuss and 
amend the rules; there being none such now appearing, he was for 
having stability in them. He made the motion to reconsider. 

Mr. LOGAN thought it too soon to adopt the two-third rule 
in regard to amending the rules. He hoped the members would 
allow the rules to stand a little while longer, until they should have 
time to try them and see how they answered. He knew little or 
nothing about rules—he was no connoisseur in them; he wished 
to try what they had adopted; and if they found anything wanted 
amendment, they could adopt it. 

Mr. PALMER withdrew his motion to reconsider. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to strike out “‘ten,” in the 6th rule, 
and insert “four.” 

Mr. LOGAN said, this thing of calling the yeas and nays 


52 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS | 


occupied great time, and he was sure there could arise no questions ~ 
where it was in the least important to have them, but ten members 
could be found who would second the demand. He could not 
conceive a case where this would occur. There was no charm in 
the numbers ten or four, and he thought ten was small enough. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison opposed the change because, 
from experience, he knew the time uselessly occupied and wasted 
in calling the yeas and nays. 

The CHAIR suggested that it was necessary to reconsider the 
vote by which the rule had been adopted, as it was not in order to 
amend what had been passed. 

Mr. MINSHALL moved to reconsider the vote by which the 
rules had been adopted, and asked the unanimous consent that 
it be passed now, and not lay [sic] over for three days. 

Mr. PRATT thought the proper way to bring the rules before 
them was to suspend the 17th rule, which required three days’ 
notice of every motion to reconsider. 

Mr. LOGAN hoped they would be taken up by unanimous 
consent; they had nothing else to do, and they might as well 
dispose of that matter. 

Mr. SHUMWAY thought still, that, even by unanimous 
consent, they could not be taken up on a motion to reconsider; 
and he moved to suspend the 17th rule, to enable them to do so. 

Mr. PRATT agreed with the gentleman last up, and pressed 
the matter on the attention of the Convention. 

Mr. SHERMAN proposed the reading of the rules one at a 
time, and that all propositions to amend should be made then. 

The CHAIR ruled that they could take a vote on the motion 
to reconsider by unanimous consent. 

Mr. WILLIAMS was willing to take the vote now, as he 
hoped they would get to the discussion of the great questions 
they had been sent here to settle. It would be time enough to 
amend the rules when we had discovered that we had been too 
hasty in adopting them.—If the majority thought proper to change — 
the number in the 6th rule, and put it in the power of a few to 
demand the yeas and nays, they could at any time do so, and he 
would not now object to a vote on the matter; but he was not in 


FRIDAY, JUNE 11, 1847 53 


favor of lessening the number; on the contrary, he would prefer 
that it was greater. 

Mr. BUTLER moved the previous question. 

The CHAIR said that, upon reflection, he thought the motion 
to suspend the 17th rule was the proper one. 

Mr. POWERS advocated the suspension. 

The question was taken on suspending the 17th rule, and 
agreed to. 

Mr. DEMENT called for the reading of the rules. 

Mr. Z. CASEY proposed that they should read the rules one 
after another, commencing at the first and continuing on till done 
with them; and that members, having amendments, should offer 
them at the reading of the rule they desired to amend. He said 
that, as an excuse to the Convention for having interfered 
in this matter so much, he would state that he was a member of 
the committee that had reported these rules, and he was somewhat 
surprised that this Convention adopted them so hastily. It was 
an unusual thing, and he had considered it somewhat of a com- 
pliment to the committee, who had drawn them up in a great hurry. 

Mr. PALMER of Stark said that it was, in his opinion, pre- 
mature to revise the rules of the Convention at this time. He was 
willing to retain them as they were until it appeared that there 
was something in them which impeded the progress of the Con- 
vention in the transaction of its business. 

Mr. THOMAS said, he hoped the vote would be taken whether 
the Convention was satisfied with the rules, as they stood at 
present, or not. As to the number which should be in the 6th 
rule to demand the yeas and nays, he was in favor of 20 instead 
of 10. It reminded him of an anecdote which he had heard in 
the Legislature when it sat in Vandalia. The House of Repre- 


‘sentatives gave one of its members leave of absence till the first 


of March, because he called the yeas and nays so often. 

Mr. BALLINGALL was in favor of an amendment to the 
toth rule; he was in favor of striking from that rule the exclusion 
of the yeas and nays from the proceedings of the committee of 
the whole. In committee, the most important questions would 
be decided, and put in the constitution they would adopt, and 
yet their constituents could not tell how they had voted. 


54. ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon offered two additional rules; 


which were adopted. 

Mr. DAVIS of Bond called for the reading of the rules. 

The PRESIDENT then read the rules one after the other, 
pausing between each for propositions to amend. At the 12th 
rule, 

Mr. McCALLEN moved to substitute for the rule as it now 
stands, the following: “All standing committees shall be ap- 
pointed by the President, to be chosen alternately, two members 


from each congressional district; and that such committees shall, 


by ballot, select their own chairmen.” The amendment was lost. 


Mr. ROBBINS moved to amend the 16th rule, by adding 


thereto—‘‘and each member, while speaking, shall confine him- 


self to the subject matter before the Convention.” 

The House was dividing on the amendment, when the sho 
and nays were demanded, and ordered. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison said, the amendment was entirely 


unnecessary. It was the duty of the President to confine o Ms 


members to the question before the Convention. 


Pending the call of the yeas and nays, the Convention fe +a 


journed till 3, Pp. M. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. ROBBINS withdrew his call of the yeas and nays. 

Mr. PRATT renewed the call. 

Mr. HAY moved to amend the amendment, by limiting all 
speeches to thirty minutes. The amendment to the amendment 
was laid on the table—yeas 80. 


The amendment was then laid on the table—ayes 8 5, noes not | 


counted. 


Mr. MARKLEY moved to amend the 17th rule, by striking 


» 


out all after the word “Convention,” in the 3d line. Lost. 
Mr. PALMER moved to strike out all from the word “except” 
to the word “‘twice,” inclusive, in the 18th rule. Lost. 


A rule, that the rules of the Convention might be suspended ~ 
or amended in part, or in whole, by a vote of two-thirds, was — 
offered by some member (name not known to the reporter) and — 
adopted; also, a rule that a motion to adjourn, the previous 


ee .F 


FRIDAY, JUNE 17, 1847 55 


question, to lay on the table, to refer, to postpone, and to postpone 
indefinitely, should always be in order, to be decided without 
debate, and should have precedence in the order named, was 
adopted; and then the rules were concluded. 

Mr. WILLIAMS hoped that the resolutions offered yesterday 
by the gentleman from Green (Mr. Woodson) would be taken 
up, by the Convention, from the table, and that we would now 
proceed to the discussion of the principles contained in them. By 
so doing, we would be approaching nearer a decision of something. 
Without this, there would be nothing for us to do. 

The motion was carried, and the following resolutions were 
taken up: 

Resolved, That the government of the state of Illinois shall 
consist of three co-ordinate departments, each independent of the 
other; and that the powers of the government should be so divided 
and so distributed among these departments that neither of them 
could, without the consent and co-operation of at least one of the 
others, injuriously affect either of the Baas rights of personal 
liberty and private property. 

Resolved, That the necessary distribution of power for this 
purpose is into legislative, judicial, and executive departments: 
the first is to prescribe general rules for the government of society; 
the second, to expound and apply these rules to individuals in 
society; the third, to enforce obedience to the judgment and 
decrees of the second, and see that the laws are faithfully executed. 

The propriety of arguing and discussing these resolutions, at 
the present time, was urged by Messrs. WiLtiams, Locan, 
Servant, Davis of Bond, Brockman, and MInsHALL, and 
opposed by Mr. Patmer of Stark. 


(Mr. WILLIAMS said, that it would be perceived that if we 
now proceed to the discussion of these resolutions, and interchange 
our sentiments and views upon them, and come to a decision on 
the subjects contained in them, that we will decide the three 
great questions—the executive, judicial and legislative depart- 
ments—to be decided; and that after that we would have but 
little more than a bill of rights. 

It is important that the Convention should commence the dis- 


56 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


cussion. If we took but a single question at a time, and every 
member who desires to do so would express his views and propose 
his amendments, we would soon get through; and in this way we 
will have done the most of what we came here to perform. I 
move, then, that we take them up—these two first resolutions 
and discuss them coolly and calmly, and then proceed to the dis- 
cussion and decision of the others. 

Mr. SERVANT said, that if the Convention was disposed to 
economize both time and money, he would suggest to the gentle- 
man from Adams, to permit these resolutions to be laid on the 
table, to have them printed in bill form, so that members would 
be enabled to understand and see these resolutions before them 
and in such a way that they might examine and weigh the 
matters contained in them. He thought that some of the propo- 
sitions contained in these resolutions could not be better nor 
more in accordance with his views; and to others, also contained 
in them, he was opposed. 

He was in favor of taking up all the great questions one at a 
time. For instance, in the first place, we might discuss the proper 
number of senators and representatives to constitute our General 
Assembly, the length of time they should sit, whether annual or 
biennial sessions, the per diem to be allowed them, &c. After 
we had fully discussed this branch of the government, we might 
proceed to the Executive department; take up the Governor and 
the Lieutenant Governor, discuss the proper time for them to 
hold office, their salaries, powers, &c. Then we might pass to the 
Judiciary, settle the number of judges, the length of their terms of 
service, if elective, their salaries—both supreme and circuit courts, 
and all matters connected with them. 

It would be idle for any committee of this Convsneee to dis- 
regard the expressed views of the members. If gentlemen would 
not speak of the time consumed in debate but had proceeded to 
the organization and pursued the legitimate business of the Con- 
vention; if they who spoke most of the economy of time, had not 
themselves consumed, some of them, five, four, three and two 
hundred dollars worth of time, much might have been done. It 
was not too late yet to retrace their steps. Let them then go to 
work, perform the business they were sent here to transact, and 


(ee z 


FRIDAY, JUNE 11, 1847 57 


then they would not be afraid to go home to their constituents, 
who would receive them with approval of ‘‘well done, good and 
faithful servants.’” Let us do this; let us take up and discuss 
these great questions, and after we shall have expressed our opin- 
ions upon them, nothing will be required but a committee of 
revision to prepare them in detail, and then go home. 

Mr. PALMER, of Stark, said that he held in his hand the act 
of the Legislature which called them together to revise, alter and 
amend the constitution of the State. We had met under that 
call. He also held in his hand the present constitution of the 
State. He supposed the proposition to amend would begin with 
the first article of that constitution, and that, pursuing a similar 
plan as that followed in relation to the rules, we would go down, 
article after article, section, after section, until we had gone 
through with it, amending it as we went along in every place that 
we thought it needed amendments. This, it seemed to him, 
would be the proper course; to follow the other would be to act 
as if there was no constitution of the State now in force nor in ex- 
istence. He hoped they would take it up article by article, and 
amend it so far as they thought it required to be done. Then, 
after having gone through with it and made all the amendments 
necessary, let members propose new articles, to be added to the 
constitution, and we could adopt such as we thought proper and 
conducive to the general welfare and prosperity. He appealed 
to his friends and fellow-citizens of the Convention to adopt this 
course. These resolutions were nothing but the expression of 
individual opinions, to have them printed would cost the State 
a great deal of money, and if they were printed there would be 
others to be printed, for all of which the State would have to pay.]® 


Mr. WILLIAMS said, ithad been suggested to him that it would 
be just as well to lay these resolutions on the table, and have them 
printed, and made the special order for Monday next. 


[Mr. LOGAN. Icansee no benefit in postponing this matter. 
Why not begin now? What else have we to do? Why not pro- 


_ © The detailed reports of these speeches have been taken from the weekly 
Illinois State Register, June 18. 


58 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS Bw 


ceed in the discussion of the questions proposed in these evalu: 


tions? Why not hear the different opinions, views and senti- 
ments of the members and melt them down—amalgamate them 
into one? Hear the views of gentlemen on these principles, in 
opposition to them, and the modifications of them. Here are 
assembled one hundred and sixty-two members, each hasan 
opinion; we had better have them melted down one into another— 


modify one member’s opinion by that of others. He hoped they 


would select some subjects— he did not care what—and proceed 
now, this very afternoon, to the discussion of them. They had 
nothing better to do; nothing else to do. 

Mr. DAVIS, of Bond, said, that the remarks of the gentleman 
from Sangamon were very applicable. He, too, hoped they would 
proceed to the discussion of the various subjects that were open 
to them, and which must be, in some form or another, discussed. 
There must, at some time, be an opinion expressed on these sub- 
jects. There was the election of the judges, how the courts 
should be ‘organized, the naturalization laws, the great question 
of banks. These are questions upon which the Convention would 
have to act. There were 162 members of the Convention, all 


had an opinion, they must at some time be reduced toone opin- — 


ion—why not commence, then, the discussion this afternoon? 
Take up the judiciary—it may be the first question; take up the 


legislative department, that may be the first question. Let us 


get an opinion on any one of these subjects. Take either of them 


up and discuss it, and then pass on to the others, and until in this — 


way we ascertain the sense of the Convention upon them all, and 
the work will be done. 


Mr. BROCKMAN was glad to see the desire of gentlemen to 


get on with the work of the Convention. The best way of serving 


their constituents was to be doing the work they had been sent 


there to perform. There were three leading questions upon which 
they would be called to act—the executive, legislative and judici- 
ary departments of the State—upon either of which we might 
have an immediate discussion. Every delegate had an idea of a 
constitution in his mind, and of what it should be. By commenc- 
ing the discussion now we might get through the labors of this 
Convention in six weeks; but if we get along only as we have done 


=o 


<<. See = 
2° ee oe ee Se 


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eo) 


<p ae 


FRIDAY, JUNE 11, 1847 | 59 


we would not get through in six months. Let us get up those 
resolutions, and then perform our duty by discussing them, which 
is certainly no more than we owe to our constituents. He felt that 
this was his duty as he had sat there in his place and saw the time 
wasted away unprofitably. There was time enough left, and he 
hoped it would be occupied in a proper way.]"! 


Mr. BALLINGALL hoped the motion to print would be 
adopted. They could be printed by tomorrow forenoon, and the 
time between now and Monday would be little enough for the 
President to appoint the standing committees. 

Mr. MINSHALL was in favor of going on now: There are 
no committees appointed yet, and we have nothing todo. Let us 
get at the sense of the Convention upon some of these points, and 
then the committees will have nothing to do but carry out our 
views. We all understand what the constitution should be; there 
is no delegate present but does, or is presumed to, know what the 
general features of the constitution should be. He earnestly 
hoped the Convention would go on with the discussion. 

Mr. ROUNTREE thought the motion was very unnecessary. 
We had passed a resolution to print the constitution, which we 
would soon have before us on our desks. There‘were five' days 
already wasted, and we have done nothing. kets havea starting 


point; and if we would but commence to heat the/views of gentle. 


men on any of the questions before us, we would have'done much: 
He was in favor of the proposition of the gentleman from Stark, 
Mr. WILLIAMS. It is very well to have the old constitution 


printed, but no delegate would suppose that we are to take it ups 


and do no more than to add to and strike from.it. 

He thought Monday next a good day to comtnence the work 
in earnest. Let us have good feeling among the members—no 
crimination nor recrimination about what is passed, nor about 
what has been said by any of the members. He could see no 
reason for it. Let them do the work for which they had come 
there, and that, too, methodically; and if they went to work thus, 
in the second week, no one could complain. We thus could do 


These speeches by Logan, Davis, and Brockman, were omitted from 
the tri-weekly I/linois State Register, but printed in the weekly of June 18. 


aon 


60 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


the work in a shorter time than in any other way.—The delay of 
one day was not much; and then take it up, and go to work in 
good temper until it was done. 

Mr. WHITNEY liked the feeling that had been displayed by — 
gentlemen to expedite the business of the Convention. But he 
did not think they could expedite matters much by commencing 
this evening. If we had these resolutions printed and before us, 
we could then understand, by reading them and examining the 
language ourselves, better than if we had only heard them read 
from the secretary’s table. We cannot get through the discussion 
of these questions in a few days, nor, perhaps, in a few weeks. 

Mr. HARVEY moved a division of the questions to print and © 
lay on the table. 

Mr. DAVIS of Bond was not opposed to the mere motion of 
printing these resolutions, but in them were not contained all the 
questions which would come before the Convention. They con- 
tained propositions relative to the judiciary and Legislature, but 
the questions of banks, the right of suffrage, the naturalization 
law, were not contained in the resolutions. There was a large 
number of resolutions on the table, and to-day we print these 
two resolutions, and to-morrow other gentlemen will call up their 
resolutions, involving questions upon every subject, and then will 
come motions to-have them printed also. 

Mr. KITCHELL ‘said, that the great difficulty in the progress 
"of business appeared to him to be in the presentation of too many 
questions for discussion at one time. Here was a series of resolu- 
tions, with a long preamble, partaking of the character of a speech, 
“and members could not be expected to discuss or vote upon 
Propositions in such a shape. A naked question only should be 
presented. Let it be the abolition of the Council of Revision. 
There was hardly a member but was prepared both to vote on, 
and discuss that proposition; and then so on with others. Let 

the questions be put nakedly to the Convention, and the members 
were prepared to meet them. Let them be presented with the 
question of altering the mode of appointing the judiciary, and the 
various other questions, singly, and they will be prepared for them. 

Mr. LOGAN concurred with the gentleman last up, and had 

drawn up something which would present to the Convention a 


FRIDAY, JUNE 11, 1847 61 


_ single point, something tangible, which they could all understand. 


It was a proposition to amend the resolutions of the gentleman 
from Greene. 

The CHAIR ruled the amendment out of order, while a motion 
to print and lay on the table was pending. 

Mr. Z. CASEY desired to make a single suggestion. Would 
it not facilitate the matter to refer the whole resolutions to the 
committee of the whole, and make them the order of the day for 
to-morrow? Let all the resolutions that had been offered be 
referred to the committee, and then make something out of the 
whole of them if you can. When the committee had got them 
into shape, let that report be printed. He would not make the 
motion, but merely the suggestion to the Convention. 

Mr. ARCHER could not vote upon important principles set 
forth in a series of resolutions without having had time for reflec- 
tion and examination. He did not desire to vote upon subjects 
which he might, upon reflection, have wished he had not done. 
We had a most important duty to perform. We were making 
laws for ages to come. He had heard the resolutions read once 
at the secretary’s table, and could form but a general opinion of 
them; he only recollected part of them. He desired to postpone 
the discussion of them until they could examine them. He 
agreed that we should work with good feeling. We should cast 
no reflection upon gentlemen who might have offered a resolution 
or anything else in the Convention. All were anxious to perform 
the duty that had been assigned them by their constituents; and 
he could not believe that anyone had offered a resolution here for 
the purpose of killing time. He felt that he had a duty incumbent 
on him to go at once to the business of this Convention. In view 
that he might understandingly assume the responsibility of voting 
on the propositions, he thought that he should have time for 
examination. He agreed that they should vote on every proposi- 
tion singly. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin. The proposition now before 
them was to debate a certain series of resolutions containing several 
propositions offered by the gentleman from Greene. It was very 
proper for those who agreed with the views contained in those 
resolutions to desire theirdiscussion. But other gentlemen had 


62 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


\ 


presented a class of resolutions of antagonist character in principle. 


The discussion should be so comprehensivé as to include a debate 


upon propositions of both sides. We ought to have them all 
before us, and, after a full discussion of them all, select such views 
as are best from the variety before us. We ought to have the 
most light we can. What advantage would it be to discuss a 
proposition containing but one view of a question, unless at the 
same time we had the antagonist principle set forth in the same 
shape? : 

To discuss the question, how many members the Senate and 
House of Representatives should contain, what need have we of 
having any printing done? He hoped that if any were printed, 
the Convention would have them all before them. 


Mr. LOGAN said that, if there were any gentlemen ready to 


discuss any other questions, there could be no propriety in de- 
laying. He had sent to the Chair an amendment to the resolu- 
tions of the gentleman from Greene, which presented a single 
point. The resolutions of the gentleman provided that the 
judges should be elected and hold their office for six years. His 
amendment proposed that they should be elected one for four 


years, one for eight, and one for twelve years, having a change 


every four years, but to have the term finally at twelve years. 
This amendment would present the question, and to his view, and 
in his estimation, a very great question, whether the judges of 
the supreme court should be elected at different times 
or all at once. He thought these matters might be discussed 
at once. 

Mr. WILLIAMS then withdrew his motion to lay on the table. 

Mr. THOMAS suggested a reference of the whole matter to 
the committee of the whole, as there these questions might be 
discussed singly. He suggested this plan of operation to gentle- 
men, as there seemed to be a disposition to act now. He moved 
a reference of the resolutions and amendment to the committee of 
the whole; which was agreed to. 

The Convention then resolved itself into committee of the 
whole—Mr. SHERMAN in the chair. 

Mr. BALLINGALL wished to inquire of the gentleman from 
Greene, what he meant by the words in the resolution, “that 


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FRIDAY, JUNE 11, 1847 63 


neither of them could, without the consent and co-operation of 
at least one of the others, injuriously affect either of the great 
rights of personal liberty and private property.” 

Mr. NORTON said, he had been in favor of laying the resolu- 
tions on the table and printing them, to enable members to under- 
stand them correctly. One person would understand them one 
way, and one another. 

Mr. HARVEY moved to strike out the sentence. 

Mr. WOODSON said, he would explain the meaning. Suppose 
the Legislature should pass a law to hang a man without a trial by 
his peers—without the approbation of any tribunal. Is it possible 
that any law should be recognized as a law until passed upon by 
the judiciary? 

The Legislature can pass no law affecting life or liberty with- 
out the co-operation of a co-ordinate branch of the government. 

Mr. WILLIAMS explained further, by saying that the Legis- 
lature might pass a law that a man should be hung without trial, 
and send a committee out to execute it; they are precluded from 
so doing by this provision—They pass laws affecting the rights of 
private individuals, and this provision is introduced to prevent 
an abuse of that power. Why distribute the power of government 
into several branches? Because one branch of the civil magistrates 
may become corrupt, and there should be some provision in case 
that, if one branch should become corrupt, the other should 
control it. 

Mr. DAVIS of Bond. The gentleman from Greene says, in 
the proposition before us, that no one power can affect life or 
liberty without the co-operation of another. He does not say 
which one. Suppose the Legislature did pass a law to hang a man 
without a trial by his peers, and that it should obtain the co- 

operation of the Governor, that would be another branch of the 
government—but not the right one, I should think! 

Mr. Z. CASEY would suggest to the gentleman from Greene 
that his proposition did not materially amend the constitution. 
It would appear, said he, that that article of the constitution 
is not essentially amended by the proposition of the gentleman. 
In his mind, they should not attempt to amend the constitution 
unless they obviously did amend it. The old constitution, as he 


64 I LLI NOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


had hinted before, was, in many parts, better than any thing new 
they could adopt. We had better let it alone unless we did 
materially amend it. 

Mr. WOODSON. If the proposition does not materially 
affect the constitution, there can be no harm in it; nothing objec- 
tionable—nothing to fear in it, if it contains essentially what is in 
the constitution. It is only declaring our opinion that what was 
in the old should be in the new. 

Mr. BALLINGALL moved that the committee rise and report 
that they had had certain resolutions under consideration, had 
made no progress therein, and ask leave to sit again. 

The PRESIDENT took the chair, and the chairman of the 
committee so reported. Several members then rose, and declared 
that it was not their understanding of the report that was to be 
made. The chairman was allowed to amend his report. 

On motion, the Convention adjourned till Monday next, at 
g o'clock, a. M. 


VI. MONDAY, JUNE 14, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. Patmer.” 

Messrs. Greco, of Cook and LasaTer, of Hamilton appeared, 
were qualified and took their seats. 

The president announced the standing committees of the 
Convention; which are as follows: 

Executive Department—Messrs. Lockwood, Rountree, Vance, 
Manly, Swan, Sharp, Huston, Evey, Worcester, Hay and Frick. 
_ Fudiciary—Messrs. Scates, Logan, Henderson, Ballingall, 
Hoes, Harlan, Farwell, Minshall, Wead, Davis of Massac, and 
Hurlbut. 

Legislative Department—Messrs. Dement, Williams, Dale, 
Constable, Thompson, Zadoc Casey, Witt, Servant, Marshall of 
Mason, Peters, Judd, Rives, Pace, Powers, and Heacock. 

Bill of Rights—Messrs. Caldwell, Grimshaw, Cross of Winne- 
bago, Trower, Webber, Knapp of Jersey, Sim, Carter, Atherton, 
and Hunsaker. . 

Incorporations—Messrs. Harvey, Dummer, Bosbyshell, Ed- - 
monson, Green of Tazewell, Anderson, Kinney of St. Clair, Allen, 
Whitney, Spencer, and Lasater. 

Revenue—Messrs. Zadoc Casey, Thomas, Green of Clay, Knox, 
Laughlin, Palmer of Marshall, Stadden, McClure, Eccles, Jones, 
and Vernor. 

Elections and Right of Suffrage—Messrs. Davis of Massac, 
Green of Jo Daviess, Marshall of Coles, Brown, Geddes, Ballingall, 
Hawley, Armstrong, McCallen, Oliver, and Knowlton. 

Finance—Messrs. Sherman, Davis of Montgomery, Hogue, 
Archer, Robbins, Dunlap, Blakely, Brockman, Pratt, Mieure, 
Harper, Roman, Hatch, Adams, and West. 

Education—Messrs. Campbell of Jo Daviess, Edwards of Madi- 
son, Shumway, Smith of Gallatin, Palmer of Macoupin, Pinckney, 


2 This was apparently Henry D. Palmer, delegate from Marshall County. 
“He has frequently been called upon toserve as chaplain.”’ Chicago Democrat, 
August 17, 1847, Springfield correspondence of August 10. See biography in 
appendix. 

65 


66 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Matheny, Choate, Harding, Churchill, Turner, Tutt, Reba 


and Shields. 

Organization of Departments, and Officers connected with the 
Executive Department—Messrs. Archer, Gregg, Edwards of San- 
gamon, Miller, McCully, Lander, McCallen, Church, Akin, 
Loudon, Kinney of Bureau, Sibley, Kenner, and Moffett. 

Division of the State into Counties and their Organization— 
Messrs. Jenkins, Lasater, Blair, Markley, Simpson, Graham, 
Mason, Cross of Woodford, Turnbull, Canady, and Hill. 

Militia and Military Affairs—Messrs. Whiteside, Morris, 
James, McHatton, Deitz, Holmes, Kreider, Huston, Tuttle, Smith 
of Macon, Dawson, Moore, and Jackson. 

Revision and adjustment of the articles of the Constitution 
adopted by this Convention and to provide for the alteration and 
amendment of the same—Messrs. Edwards of Madison, Scates, 
Logan, Allen, Knowlton, Butler, Singleton, Holmes, Caldwell, 
Norton, Farwell, Gregg, Woodson, and Thomas. 

Miscellaneous Subjects and Questions—Messrs. Crain, Bunsen, 
Campbell of McDonough, F. S. Casey, Colby, Cross of Woodford, 
Dunn, Dunsmore, Lemon, Lenley, Nichols, Smith of Macon, and 
Northcott. ‘ 

Law- Reform—Messrs. Hayes, Knapp of Scott, Woodson, 


Thornton, Kitchell, Davis of McLean, Bond, Norton, Thomas, 


Kinney of St. Clair, and Edwards of Sangamon. 
[Mr. CALDWELL requested to be excused from service on 
the committee on the Bill of Rights; which was granted.]® 


Mr. DEMENT moved that 200 copies of the rules be printed. 
Carried. 


The president laid before the Convention a communication 


from the Secretary of State, on the subject of common schools. 
Laid on the table. 

Mr. SHUMWAY introduced a resolution containing the 
following propositions: 

1. That the new constitution shall prohibit the Legislature 
from imposing, continuing or reviving a tax—creating a debt— 
making, continuing or reviving any appropriation of money or 
property; or which releases, discharges or commutes any claim of 

13 Added from the weekly I//inots State Register, June 18. 


MONDAY, JUNE 14, 1847 : 67 


the State except by yeas and nays, duly entered on the journals; 
and three-fifths of either House shall be necessary to constitute 
a quorum upon the passage of such acts. 

2. That no appropriation shall be paid out of the State 
treasury, except in pursuance of law, and within a certain period 
after its enactment. 

3. That the Legislature shall not grant extra pay to any 
public agent after such public service shall have been performed, 
or contract entered into for the performance of the same. 

4. And shall also have power to make deductions from salaries 
of public officers, who neglect the performance of any public duty 
assigned them by law. Referred to committee on Legislative 
Department. 

Mr. DEMENT offered the following resolution: 

Resolved, That the order of proceeding in the amendment, 
revision or alteration of the present constitution of this State, 
shall be the reading of the articles and sections thereof, in their 
order, and referring them, together with such amending proposi- 
tions as may seem expedient, to appropriate committees, for their 
consideration. 

Mr. D. said, that this resolution, or one similar to it, should 
be adopted in order to establish, as early as practicable, some 
system by which the business of the Convention could be expedited. 

Mr. BROCKMAN moved-to strike out all after the word 
“resolved” and insert various amendments to the constitution. 

Mr. ROBBINS was in favor of the resolution of the gentleman 


_ from Lee (Mr. Dement.) He thought that if every member 


should at once present all his views upon every subject embraced 
in and connected with the constitution, it would take several 
months to get through. He thought,the original resolution was 
calculated to establish a systematic mode of procedure. He 
moved to lay the amendment on the table. Agreed to. 

Mr. PALMER supported the resolution. He was for estab- 
lishing order. Without it they could not proceed with dispatch 
in the business for which they had been called together. Order 
was the first law of nature. He thought that the submission to 
the consideration of the Convention, of skeleton constitutions 
embracing every subject, was calculatéd to delay action. The 


68 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


4 


multiplicity of ideas and propositions, thus presented, would 


keep them here, they do not know how long. 


Mr. KINNEY offered a substitute to the resolution, the 
substance of which was as follows:—That so much of the constitu- 
tion as relates to the executive, the judiciary, and legislative 


departments, be referred to the committees on those subjects, and 


so also, in regard to questions of finance, education, elections, 


corporations, &c., each subject being referred to its appropriate 
committee.—He also embodied in his resolution, instructions to 
the committee on incorporations, to report against the creation 
of banks in this State, and that no corporation be permitted to 
issue paper money, and that the property of members of corpora- 
tions be made liable for the debts of such corporations. 


Mr. ROUNTREE offered a substitute to Mr. K.’s substitute, 


and differing from it only in leaving out the instructions. 


Mr. CAMPBELL, of Jo Daviess, advocated Mr. DEmEnt’s : 


resolution. 
Mr. ROUNTREE spoke in favor of his own substitute. 


The discussion was continued by Messrs. Kinney of MET CAN f 


KitcHe tt, Davis of Bond, Dement and Henry. 

Mr. GEDDES also participated in the debate, and moved to 
lay the substitute on the table. 

Mr. Z. CASEY suggested that the two substitutes be 
withdrawn by the gentleman who offered them; which they agreed 
to. 


The resolution offered by Mr. Dement was further discussed — 


by Messrs. THomas, Locan, DEMENT, and RounTREE, when the 
Convention 
Adjourned till two o’clock. 


AFTERNOON 


The Convention took up the resolution of Mr. Dement, which 


was under consideration at the time of adjournment. 


Mr. DEMENT stated that he had modified the resolution 
which was pending at the adjournment so as to read as follows: _ 


Resolved, That in Convention the order of proceeding in the 
amendment, revision, or alteration of the present constitution of 
this State shall be, to take it up and read, in their order, the 


Ce - = 


=. 


hie oe 


~ 


fe 


MONDAY, JUNE 14, 1847 69 


articles and sections thereof, and referring the amending proposi- 
tions to appropriate committees for their consideration. 

Mr. ROUNTREE then moved the amendment submitted by 
him in the forenoon to the original resolution offered by Mr. 
DeEMENT; which was accepted by Mr. D. 

Mr. SHUMWAY offered a substitute to the resolution; which 
was rejected. 

The question then recurring on Mr. DEMENT’s resolution, it 
was adopted. 

Mr. WOODSON offered a resolution that when a committee 
submits a report, it shall be taken up and disposed of before any 
other business. Adopted. 

Mr. MARKLEY offered the following resolution: 

Resolved, That the committee on Incorporations be, and they 
are hereby, instructed to report an amendment to the constitution 
prohibiting, forever, within this State, the incorporation of any 
bank or company for banking purposes, and the manufacture and 
emission, by any company, copartnership or individual, of any 
bank note, or other paper designed to be circulated as paper money. 

_ Mr. PRATT offered the following substitute to Mr. M.’s 
resolution: 

Resolved, That the standing committee on Incorporations be 
instructed to inquire into the expediency of reporting the following 
provisions, to be adopted in the amended constitution: 

1. There shall be no bank of issue or discount within this 
State. 

2. The Legislature shall not have power’ to authorize or 

incorporate, by any general or special law, any bank or other 


institution having any banking power or privilege, or to confer 
_ upon any corporation, institution, person or persons, any banking 
_ power or privilege. 


3. It shall not be lawful for any corporation, institution, 
person or persons, within this State, under any pretense or author- 
ity, to make or issue any paper money, note, bill, certificate, or 
other evidence of debt whatever, intended to circulate as money. 

4. It shall not be lawful for any corporation within this 
State, under any pretense or authority, to exercise the business 
of receiving deposits of money, making discounts, or buying or 


70 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


selling bills of exchange, or to do any other banking business 
whatever. 

5. No branch or agency of any bank or banking institution 

of the United States, or of any State or Territory within or without 
the United States, shall be established or maintained within this 
State. 
6. It shall not be lawful to circulate within this State, after 
the year 1848, any paper money, note, bill, certificate, or other 
evidence of debt whatever, intended to circulate as money, issued 
without this State, of any denomination less than $10, or after 
the year 1850, of any denomination less than $20. 

7. All payments made, or business done, in paper money in 
this State, and coming within the meaning of the last section, are 


declared utterly void; and the Legislature shall, at its first session, — 


after the adoption of these amendments, and from time to time 
thereafter as it may be necessary, enact adequate remedies for 
the punishment of all violations and evasions of the provisions 
of the preceding section. 

The PRESIDENT stated that the presentation of these last 
two propositions was premature, they being inhibited by the 
adoption of Mr. DEMENT’s resolution. 

Mr. MINSHALL moved to suspend the rule for rani oe 
was done, when 

Mr. MARKLEY again offered his resolution on the subjects 
of banks, and 

Mr. PRATT also offered his on the same subject. 

Mr. THOMAS moved to refer both to the committee on 
Incorporations. Carried. 

Mr. ———-——— offered a resolution to abolish the council 
of Revision. Carried. 


Mr. EDMONSON offered a resolution concerning revenue. 


Adopted. 

Mr. DAWSON offered a resolution, that pleasure carriages, 
watches, &c., be taxed, and the proceeds added to the school fund, 
which, after being amended, so as to make fines and forfeitures as 
a part of the School Fund, was adopted. 

Mr. DAWSON offered [a] resolution, that the office of public 
printer be abolished. Referred to the committee on Finance. 


EN ae Sa erg 


r 


MONDAY, JUNE 14, 1847 71 


Mr. ARCHER offered a resolution, that the Executive 
committee inquire into the expediency of limiting the authority 
of the Governor to pardon criminals; which was adopted. He 
also offered a resolution that the legislative committee inquire 
into the expediency of prohibiting the State to borrow, unless the 
bill for such purpose shall have first been submitted to the people, 


_ except in cases of extreme emergency, and then loans only to a 


limited amount may be borrowed. 


Mr. DEMENT offered a resolution, that an article be incor- 
porated in the constitution, limiting the Legislature to one 
hundred members—thirty senators, and seventy representatives. 


Mr. CASEY moved to strike out all after the word “resolved,” 
and insert a provision that there shall be sixty members—forty 
in the House and twenty in the Senate, elected for two years, 
sessions not to exceed sixty days—pay of members two dollars per 
day. 

Mr. EDMONSON moved to amend, so as to provide for a 
biennial session of the Legislature—sessions to hold not exceeding 
sixty days, both branches to consist of one hundred members— 
pay two dollars a day for coming, attending and returning. 
Referred to the committee on the Legislative Department. 


Mr. WOODSON offered as a provision in the constitution, 
that each male inhabitant, over twenty-one years of age, pay a 
capitation tax of one dollar, to be applied in payment of the 
State debt. Referred to the Revenue committee. 


Mr. SHUMWAY offered a resolution, that the Judicial com- 
mittee inquire into the expediency of providing by the constitution, 
that no judge of the circuit or supreme court shall be elected 
during his term of office, to any office of honor, trust and profit, 
except in the case of a circuit judge who may be elected to the 
supreme bench—an offer to be a candidate to be regarded as a 
voluntary resignation of office. 


Mr. CAMPBELL, of Jo Daviess, offered a resolution, that the 
Judiciary committee inquire into the expediency of amending the 
constitution so as to provide that sheriffs shall not be elected for 
alonger term than three years, and they shall not be eligible for a 
second consecutive term; that the officer [sic] of Lieutenant 


Re ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI ON: S 


Governor be abolished, and that an additional secretary ~ 


appointed to report the debates of this Convention. 
Mr. WEAD moved to amend so as to abolish the office of 
Attorney General. He said that he thought that office was 


unnecessary. If the State should be divided in judicial districts, © 


requiring the supreme court to be held in each, the district 
attorneys could perform the same duties. He knew of no reason 
why the Attorney General should enjoy a higher dignity than 
other prosecuting attorneys. That officer had the same duties to 
perform and but few more. Amendment agreed to. 

The question recurring upon Mr. C’s resolutions. 


Mr. SINGLETON said, that he regarded the pispestiad ta. 


appoint an assistant to report the conventional debates, as a most 
important one. He had heard remarks in regard to the expense 
of publishing these debates. Wishing, as much as any member, 
to avoid expense, he would not carry economy so far as to with- 
hold his support from a measure, which had for its object the 
enlightenment of the people in regard to our action in this body, 
and the provisions of the constitution which are to be submitted 


to them for ratification or rejection. By a report of our debates, 


said Mr. S., the people may learn something in relation to the 
motives by which we were influenced, and the ends we wish to 
accomplish in framing the organic law upon which they are 


to pass a final judgment. The volume will, it is true, contain a 
condensed, and perhaps a crude, report of our doings; yet it 


cannot fail to enlighten the people, and he believed that the 
people would consider the cost of the publication well repaid by 
the information they would gain by it. He knew not, neither did 
he care, what it might cost; he believed that it would not be more 
than their constituents would be willing to pay. He thought that 
opposition to it grew out of a penny saving policy and mere 
practical retrenchment, which it was not the duty of the Conven- 
tion to engage in. We have come here, said he, to unfold and 
apply new principles of government; and he desired to submit 
those principles to the people with all the light possible. He cared 
but little how it should be done, whether by the body itself or by 
the contribution of members. He was willing to pay for reporting 
and printing. He would by all means do so if it was to be done 


oe eS a 


MONDAY, JUNE 14, 1847 73 


for the benefit of members; but he did not so regard it. It was 
for the benefit of the people that he urged its adoption. 

Mr. PALMER, of Marshall, could see no necessity for publish- 
ing an official report of the debates. There were gentlemen 
present, whose business was, as he understood, to report for the 
papers the speeches of members, and they would give all the 
important debates; the public can, from these, obtain all the in- 
formation desirable in relation to our proceedings. These, 
besides being published in the papers here, will be copied in other 
papers, and obtain a wide circulation. Thus it is apparent, that 
for us to publish them, would be incurring a useless expense. He 
knew that the congressional debates were sometimes published, 
_ but such a proposition was unheard of in Illinois. In our present 
pecuniary embarrassment, as a State, he regarded it as highly 
improper. It would be showing liberality before justice. Our 
debt is heavy: it will cost something to publish these debates, and 
by not doing it, we may save a little, at least. The globe is 
composed of particles, and our State debt is composed of dollars 
and cents. In the estimation of many, the odium of virtual 
repudiation rests upon us, which it is our duty to remove before 
we indulge in undue extravagance. Though we have but little 
or nothing to show for this debt, we still owe it; and before he 
left the stage of action, he wished to see some measures taken for 
its liquidation. In this view of things, he was unprepared to 
support the resolutions. 

Mr. KINNEY moved to amend the resolution so as to require 
members to pay for reporting their speeches; each member to pay 
in proportion to the number and length of his speeches. (Laughter.) 

Mr. K. made a few remarks, which, owing to confusion near 
the reporter, was [sic] not distinctly heard by him. 

Mr. WEAD was anxious to have the debates published. 
Allusion had been made to taxes. He thought that the expense 
of publishing these debates would not affect the payment of the 
public debt. A mill and a half on the dollar had been appro- 
_priated for that object, and the appropriation for this will not 


' diminish that amount. The only question is, whether it is a 


proper object, and whether the people will be willing to pay a 
reporter. He desired to have the costs estimated by a committee. 


74 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


T; Was been Sardi aeee debate will be published in the news- — 


papers. He had no expectation that they would be published in 
the newspapers; and if they should be, members would hardly 
recognize them as their own. He desired to have them published 
officially, so that they might be transmitted to posterity in a 
reliable form. He scarcely knew of a Convention that had not 
published debates. It was, at the present day, the uniform 
practice. He regretted that the debates of the Conventions of 
other States were not accessible to the members of this Convention. 
They would be most serviceable in affording light and information 
to guide them in their deliberations. The people desire informa- 
tion in regard to the action of this Convention. Will it be pre- 
tended that they will be competent to judge without light? He 
who denies information will do them a wrong. It is a mistake to 
suppose that the people will not be willing to pay for it. They 
will not forego it for the sake of saving money, and he hoped it 
would be furnished in an authoritative form. The newspapers 
will not give it in an authentic shape. Every newspaper reporter 
is more or less influenced by political feelings and party bias, and 
if disposed to report erroneously, we have not the power to 
correct their misrepresentations. For these reasons he desired 
that an official reporter should be appointed, whom they could 
control. The expense will be but little. He had been informed 
that a reporter could be hired for the pay of a secretary, and the 
debates could be printed by the public printers. 

Mr. MINSHALL said, that he had never directed his attention 
particularly to the subject, but on referring to the law he had 
ascertained that the Convention had not the power to appoint an 
official reporter. It is true that gentlemen have adopted a 
different name for such an office, but he considered it but an 


evasion of the law. He thought they ought to be governed by — 


the letter and spirit of the act of the General Assembly which 
provided for the call of the Convention. He concurred with 
gentlemen in the importance of having the debates published; but 


the Legislature had not authorized it, and they, not us, are re-’ 


sponsible for the omission. We have not, said he, the power to 
appropriate money for this purpose, and changing the name from 
reporter to secretary will not give it to us. 


MONDAY, JUNE 14, 1847 fie) 


Mr. SINGLETON proceeded to reply to Mr. M. He said 
that the gentleman was mistaken in his construction of the law. 
The secretary’s business is to report the proceedings of the Con- 
vention, and this body may appoint another secretary to report 
the speeches, which, in fact, form a portion of the proceedings. 
He did not regard it as an evasion of the law; but—[Here the 
president called him to order, stating that under the rules, no 
member could speak twice to the same question when other mem- 
bers desired to speak.] 

Mr. DAVIS, of Massac, said, he would avail himself of the 
opportunity afforded him by the discussion on the resolutions now 
before the Convention, to express his views in relation to the 
election of an official reporter of the debates of this body, to 
correct a misreport of the remarks which he had the honor to 
submit to this assembly a few days since, on the resolution then 
pending, which had for its end, in part, the definition of the 
objects for which the Convention was called, and the extent of 
its powers. 

I think, sir, (said Mr. D.) that the debates of this Convention 
ought to be published and preserved for the use and benefit of the 
people of the State, and I am, therefore, willing to see a competent - 
gentleman selected for the purpose, with reasonable compensation 
for his services, to be paid out of the State treasury, in pursuance 
of law; or, if gentlemen can be induced to do so, to be paid by the 
members themselves, out of their per diem allowance. The 
reasons for the publication of these debates are so numerous and 
weighty, and have been so fully stated by gentlemen who have 
preceded me, that I shall not attempt to adduce any in addition, 
or to urge by other arguments those which have already been 
submitted to the Convention, concluding, as I do, that enough 
has been said by others to convince the members of the great 
importance of the report and publication. 

It was remarked by the member from Fulton, that the pub- 
lished reports of the speeches of members of this body, as found in 
the newspapers of this city, are very inaccurate and faulty, which 
must be the case while the reports continue to be taken down and 
published unofficially. I can myself bear testimony to the 
correctness of this statement; for, sir, in the report of the remarks 


76 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


which I had the honor to deliver to the Convention the other day, 


on the resolution before alluded to, I am misrepresented in a very 
important particular. In that report I am made to say that “the 
act providing for the call of this Convention was both constitu- 
tional and proper.”’ This I did not say, sir, but, on the contrary, 
I remarked, that I had opposed the act on constitutional grounds 
while it was before the Senate, of which body I was an humble 
member at the time of the passage of the law. I argued, however, 
that the Legislature possessed plenary power to make the appro- 
priations which they did make to pay the members of the Conyen- 
tion, and the officers connected with it, and that it was highly 
proper to do so. I said, further, that this was a constitutional 
Convention, brought together in pursuance of the 7th article of 
the constitution, and, as such, limited within certain boundaries 
and to certain objects specified in the said 7th article.™ 

I said, sir, that the people were not here in their primary 
original capacity, but in the persons of their delegates, chosen 
under the constitution and in pursuance of its provisions. 

I hold it to be a fundamental axium [sic] in political science, 
that the people, as such, have a right to abolish government, and 
institute new forms for their better security and greater happiness. 
This is what I said, sir. 

Mr. CAMPBELL, of Jo Daviess, said, that he supposed a: 
he offered the resolution under discussion, that its importance 
would be apparent to all, but he had discovered that, when any 
matter of this kind is proposed, the question of cost and expense 
is at once raised and so strongly urged as to render success almost 
hopeless. Now, sir, it is hard to believe that there is a member on 
this floor who does not appreciate the importance of employing 
an official reporter. Are not the debates of the constitutional 
conventions of other States eagerly sought after? They are, sir, 
and it is a matter of regret that we have not within our reach the 
debates that have taken place in similar conventions in our sister 
States, to aid and enlighten us—to suggest modes of procedure, 


forms, &c. If we seek the debates of the conventions of other 


States, will not ours also be sought for? The constitution that 


we are to adopt, will be presented to the people for their ratifica~ — 


14See ante, 19. 


ae me ee 


~_Se 


A, .— 
5, i an 


MONDAY, JUNE 14, 1847 77 


tion or rejection, and it is due to them, that the motives and in- 


_ fluences that have entered into its adoption by us, should go forth 


t 


with it, to aid the people in forming an opinion in regard to its 


'merits and value. Let them have the same light and the same 


means of forming their judgment that we have. If we do not 
appoint a reporter, they cannot know—they will have no means of 
ascertaining—the motives or influences which gave birth to the 
constitution we present to them. We cannot expect the public 
prints to give a full report of the debates which take place in this 
body. They have not room for them in their columns, and if 
they had, they would give no more than they choose. They are 
irresponsible and beyond our control. It is desirable that we 
have a reporter, to whose reports full faith and credit can be given, 
and if any member should be misrepresented he can have a remedy. 
Gentlemen have said that they have been mis-reported. Adopt 
this resolution and the evil they complain of will be obviated. 
We have no right to expect the public prints to be perfectly accu- 
rate. They do not feel that responsibility which would be felt by 
an official reporter, and if we wish for an authentic record of what 
is said here, we must make provision for it. 

Now, sir, a word in regard to the pay of the proposed officer. 
In traming the resolution, I used the term “‘secretary”’ instead of - 
“reporter.” We have a secretary to record our proceedings. Is 
there anything in the law of the Legislature prohibiting us to 
employ a secretary to record the speeches. They are as much a 
part of our proceedings as those acts which are generally distin- 
guished by the term “proceedings.” A large majority of the 
people elected this Convention to alter and amend the constitu- 
tion; they solemnly declared that a revision was necessary, and 
appointed us to do the work. Did they not, I ask, as solemnly 
declare, that all the expenses attending it should be paid by the 
State? Did they not give us a virtual pledge, that they would 
pay the cost of carrying out the purposes of this Convention? Let 
these debates go out to the people along with the constitution. 
Of what service would the debates of the Convention of 1818 not 
be to us now? Who will say that the published debates of this 
Convention would not, in after times, be regarded as invaluable 
in explaining clauses, sentences and articles which may be of 


78 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS  — 


doubtful construction? This consideration alone is sufficient to 
recommend this resolution to the favor of the Convention. 

He was willing to vote for the amendment of the gentleman 
from St. Clair (Mr. Kinney) if gentlemen were so much afraid to 
take money out of the treasury. He would himself contribute to 
have the debates printed, rather than have the project fail. He, 
however, thought that there was too much of RETRENCHMENT 
in the proposition for its supporters to vote for it themselves. He 
concluded by moving to lay Mr. Kinney’s amendment on the 
table. 

Mr. KNOWLTON wanted to have a reporter elected, but he 
must take occasion to say that he loved consistency. Gentlemen 


were on one side for one purpose and on another for another. 


The other day gentlemen said we had no power beyond what the 
strict letter of the law had given us; now, they say we have power 
beyond that letter. He did not agree with them then, and he 
was glad to see them on his side now; but he hoped they would 
remain where they had got and be more consistent hereafter. 
We have come here for the purpose of being consistent—to send 
out a consistent document, free from party taint or bias. 

Gentlemen called the proposed officer a secretary, to secure 
his pay to him. He did not like anything indirect—liked to hear 
things called by their right names. He should vote for the officer 
because he believed the Convention had the power to elect him. 

Gentlemen had complained of being reported incorrectly. He 
had never noticed any misrepresentations, and he thought they 
were well enough reported. Great men are always complaining 
of being reported incorrectly. He had heard the same complaint 
from his boyhood. David Crockett said that he came near being 
ruined by the reporters. 

Mr. HAYES made an animated speech in favor of employing 
areporter, to be paid by an appropriation by the next Legislature. 
He thought the Convention had no power to create such an officer 
and draw money to pay him out of the treasury. The lateness of 
the hour compels us to condense Mr. H.’s remarks. 

Mr. WEAD explained that he did not intend to accuse the 
reporters on the floor with intentionally misrepresenting members. 
He was aware that the duty was arduous—that they could give 


a 


MONDAY, JUNE 174, 1847 79 


no more than a synopsis of speeches. He had noticed that 
the reports of the different papers did not agree, and this was 
the reason why an official reporter was required. He was willing 
to pay for it. 

Mr. SCATES said that it was his opinion that the Convention 
had not the power to make the treasury liable for the expense of 
employing a reporter. Allusion.had been made to other States. 
So far as his information went, the debates in other States were 
published by private enterprise. We have reasons for economy; 
and he could not support the proposition. 

Mr. PETERS remarked to Mr. Scates, that the Missouri 
Convention had employed a reporter, and recommended the 
Legislature to pay him. 

Mr. SCATES. The gentleman is unfortunate in his example, 
for the acts of the Convention were rejected by the people— 
constitution and all. 


Mr. ROBBINS said, he could not vote for the proposition 
before the Convention. It asks this body to employ an additional 
secretary, to report the debates of the Convention, the speeches 
of the delegates, and that, sir, at the expense of the State. 

The law calling this Convention gives it no such power. It 
authorizes the employment of such secretaries as are necessary in 
the transaction of its legitimate business, and for no other pur- 
poses. Now, if the speeches of the delegates in this hall are 
the business transactions of this body, it is the duty of the secre- 
taries now employed to record them as such, in the journals of the 
Convention. If they are not the business of this body, it has no 
right to publish them, in any manner, at the expense of theState. 
But, why do gentlemen wish to publish these speeches? For 
whose good? They have told us it is for the good of the people 
of this State—to illuminate their minds, to enlighten them in the 


great principles that agitate this body, to acquaint them with the 


reasons that induce this Convention to propose the alterations 
and amendments they are going to offer to the people for their 
rejection or ratification, and thus produce a harmony in action of 
the convention and the vote of the people; and that otherwise the 
people would not approve of the amendments about to be offered 


80 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — aay 
by this body. If this was all true, sir, it is spare ie we. 
speeches to be reported, printed, bound, and circulated among the 
people in time to do any good. There is no probability that 
the Convention will be able to finish their business in time to _ 
present the alterations and amendments of the Constitution be- 
fore the first Monday in August next, and the law requires that the 
people shall vote for or against the amendments proposed, on 
the fourth Monday in October following. The labor of getting 
up such a book would be immense. I hold in my hand, sir, the — 
reported debates of the North Carolina Convention of 1835. 
That Convention met on the 5th day of June, and adjourned on 
the roth day of the following month—not in session more than 
five weeks, and restricted, by law, to only nine propositions; and 
yet, sir, these debates make a volume of more than four hundred 
pages. Taking this for an example, what a volume would the 
speeches of this Convention make, in a session of at least two 
months, and with a range covering the whole Constitution of 
Illinois. Sir, it would be impossible to get up such a book, and 
to get it before the people, before the fourth Monday of October, 
the time required for the people to vote for or against the amend- 
ments. Besides, the expense would be entirely too great for the ye 
people to bear, in their present embarrassed circumstances. 
Nor do I think, sir, that these speeches would illuminate and edify 
the people as much as gentlemen seem to think they would. I 
have heard no better propositions on this floor for altering and 
amending the constitution, and no better arguments offered in. 
support of those propositions, than I heard in the circle of my 
neighbors before I left home—in the workshop, in the store, in 
the groups of laborers collected to rest themselves in the shade. 
Our constituents are not behind us in this matter. They know 
how they want their constitution altered. They told us how to 
alter it before we came here, and so far as mine are concerned, 
they want us, with all reasonable expedition, to make those alter- — ’ 
ations and then come home. a 
I am pleased with the gentlemen’s speeches.—They have dis- 
played much talent and eloquence, and I should be glad to see 
them go before the world. But let them go by way of private — i y 
enterprise, not at the expense of our impoverished State. ButI 


b 
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i Nat ot li aD MEL a ae ha) Ran oe ak A Sa 


MONDAY, JUNE 14, 1847 81 


§ ery efficient in promoting the interests of this Convention. To 
show the estimation put on these “speeches by the community, I 
will relate an anecdote of what happened in an adjoining county a 
a. pp joining 

few weeks since, as a delegate was taking leave of one of his con- 
stituents. ‘‘How long,’’ said the old farmer, ‘‘do you expect to 
_ be gone to the Convention?’ “‘I expect to be home by the first 
_ Monday of August next,’’ was the answer. ‘“‘How many lawyers 
are there in the Convention?’’—‘‘About forty,’ was the answer. 
Coo # 2 ?? . ce 

‘Forty lawyers in the Convention,’’ said the old man; ‘‘then fare- 
_ well, I shall never see you any more!’’]* 


Messrs. SINGLETON, KiTcHELL and others made a few remarks, 


Mr. PALMER, of Marshall, moved the indefinite postpone- 
_ ment of the subject, which was agreed to. 

_ The first two propositions of Mr. Campbell were referred to 
. appropriate committees, and that relating to the reporter only 


_____® Robbins’ speech in detail has been inserted from the weekly JI]linois 

State Register, June 18, in place of the tri-weekly’s notice that “Mr. Robbins 
_ made a humorous speech against employing a reporter, which we have not 
time to give in this day’s paper.” 


VII. TUESDAY, JUNE 15, 1847 


Mr. FARWELL presented the petition of sundry citizens for a 
provision in the constitution providing for the appointment of a 
State superintendent of public instruction. Referred to the 
Education committee. 

Mr. THORNTON presented the petition of sundry citizens 
of Shelby county, on various subjects, which was referred to the 
committee on Miscellaneous Subjects. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to take up his motion made yesterday, 
to re-consider Mr. DEMENT’s resolution in relation to the mode of 
proceeding in the business of the Convention. The motion 


carried, the vote was re-considered, and the resolution was laid ~ 


on the table till the first day of January next. 


Mr. JENKINS moved to take up certain resolutions offered 


by him some days since, which was agreed to; and the question 
being upon referring the resolutions to the appropriate committees, 
a debate arose on the best mode of taking up the various proposi- 
tions submitted. Mr. Dement thought that the order of business, 
as it now existed, would retard the business. Messrs. BRocKMAN, 
Davis of McLean, Jenkins, and Loupov, insisted that the rights 


of members to bring forward their propositions would be con- — 


siderably abridged by the mode of proceeding for which Mr. 
DeEMENT contended. The previous question was here ordered, 
and the resolutions were referred. 

Mr. JENKINS moved to take up the resolution offered by hind 
on the 11th inst., which was done, and the resolutions were re- 
ferred to the appropriate committees. 

Mr. DAVIS, of McLean, offered a resolution that the jute’ 
committee be instructed to inquire into the expediency of organ- 
izing the judiciary on a basis, the substance of which is as follows: 


A supreme court, composed of three members, having appellate - 


jurisdiction only, to be chosen in separate districts by the qualified 

voters thereof, for nine years, one to be elected every third year: 

after the expiration of three terms under such classification, their 
82 


A 


TUESDAY, JUNE 15, 1847 83 


term to be nine years. Salary $1,200. Re-eligible, but incapable 
of holding any other office during term and for two years after its 
expiration. Clerk to be chosen by voters of State at large, for a 
term of three years. The State to be divided into blank number 
of circuits—judge in each circuit elected by people, for six years. 
Salary $1000. To hold no office during term, or two years after 
its expiration. Said courts to have probate jurisdiction. Clerks 
to be elected by the people for three years, who shall be ex officio 


_ recorders of deeds. Circuit attorneys elected by people in each 


circuit. Salary $300. Election of judges to be holden at different 
times from the election of State officers. 

Mr. CAMPBELL, of Jo Daviess, moved to amend, so that the 
State may be divided into ——————— judicial districts: one 
term to be annually held in each. Resolution and amendment 
referred to the Judiciary Committee. 

Mr. SMITH offered a resolution that the committee on 
Revenue be requested to inquire into the expediency of so amending 
the constitution as to prohibit the Legislature from pledging the 
faith of the State for a larger sum than $50,000, without first 
submitting the matter to the people: also, to inquire into the 
expediency of locating the seat of government. 

Mr. SHUMWAY offered a resolution that the Legislative - 
committee inquire into the expediency of prohibiting any member 
of the Legislature from receiving, during his term, any civil 
appointment within the State, or to the Senate of the United 
States. 

Mr. CHURCH offered a resolution that the committee on the 
Bill of Rights be requested to inquire into the expediency of so 
amending the 6th article of the constitution, as to provide that 
there shall be neither slavery nor involuntary servitude in this 
State, otherwise than for the punishment of crimes whereof the 
party shall have been duly convicted; nor shall any person be 
deprived of liberty on account of color. : 

Mr. KNAPP offered resolutions in substance, that the 
Governor shall be invested with the veto power; bills objected to 
by him to become laws if a majority subsequently vote for them. 
2d Resotution. That committees, when they report, do so in 
sectional form, omitting their reasons. 3d Resotution. That the 


84 


committee on Elections be requested to inquire into the expediency __ 
of fixing a different day for the election of judges, from that for 
general officers. 

The resolutions were divided, and the two first tech The | 
last resolution was amended, on motion of Mr. SHumway, so 
as to request the Election committee to inquire into the expe- 
diency of prohibiting persons from voting who have bets on the 
election pending, and passed. 

Mr. DAVIS, of Montgomery, offered a resolasron that the | 
committee on Flccdons: inquire into the expediency of so amending 


the constitution as to have all voting at elections by ballot. ¥ 
Mr. HURLBUT moved to amend so as to request the commit- 
tee to inquire into the expediency of so altering the 27th section . 


of article 3, as to require that all electors shall be citizens of the __ 
United States. cae 
Mr. MARSHALL, of Mason, moved to amend so as to strike 
out all after the word “resolved,” and insert, in substance, that ~ 
the committee be instructed to inquire into the expediency of so 
amending, as to require voters to have lived in the State twelve 
months, and one month next preceding the election: Provided, 
that all foreigners in the State at the time the constitution is 
adopted shall be considered as electors. Resolution and amend- 
ments referred to the committee on Elections. mK; 
Mr. DAVIS, of Massac, offered a resolution that the com- 
mittee on the Bill of Rights be instructed to inquire into the 
expediency of reporting an amendment, in substance, that persons © 
accused of crime, shall be tried in the county or district where the 
crime is alleged to have been committed, which county or district — 
shall have been previously ascertained by law, &c. Ra 
Mr. DAWSON offered a resolution that the committee on the 
Organization of the Departments of State be instructed to inquire 
into the expediency of electing the Governor for three years: mem- 
bers of General Assembly to hold but one session of sixty days 
during Governor’s term, at $2 per day, and $2 for every twenty 
miles’ travel. . 
Mr. CAMPBELL, of Jo Daviess, moved to strike out two 
dollars and insert three. Lost. Resolution adopted. : 


TUESDAY, JUNE 15, 1847 85 


Mr. TURNER offered a resolution, that the Legislature 


inquire, &c, as to abolishing capital punishment. 


Mr. McCALLEN moved to strike out and insert so as to 
abolish capital punishment, and take away the pardoning power 
from the Governor where the punishment is death under the 
present constitution. Referred to committee on Law Reform. 

Mr. THORNTON offered a resolution that the committee on 
Law Reform be requested to inquire into the expediency of so 
amending the constitution, that testimony in courts of equity be 
taken in the same manner as in suits at law. Adopted. 

Mr. MOFFETT offered a resolution that after the first day 


| of January, 1849, no bank bill shall be passed in this State of 


a less denomination than twenty dollars, and, in the event of a 
bank being established in this State, it shall not issue any bill of 
a less denomination than twenty dollars. 

Mr. PRATT moved the following substitute: 

Resolved, That the committee on Incorporations be instructed 
to report such provisions as will effectually prohibit the power of 
the Legislature to create or authorize any individuals, company 
or corporation, with banking powers in this State. 

Resolved, That said committee inquire into and report to the 
Convention such provisions as are best calculated gradually to 
exclude from, and prohibit the circulation in this State, of bank 


_ bills under the denomination of twenty dollars. 


Mr. HURLBUT moved to amend by striking out the word 


_ “resolved,” and inserting the following: 


“That the committee on Incorporations be instructed to 
inquire into the expediency of so amending and altering the 21st 
section of article 8 of the constitution, as to provide for a system 
of general banking laws, similar in principle with the propositions 
lately adopted in the State of New York.” 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to lay the amendment of Mr. Hur.aut 
on the table. 

Mr. DAVIS, of McLean, called for the yeas and nays. 

Mr. MARKLEY modified his motion so as to lay on the table 
to a day certain. 

Mr. DAVIS, of Bond, said that the amendment was a resolu- 
tion of inquiry and that he should not vote against a resolution of 


86 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


inquiry. When the question as to creating banks in this State 
should arise, he would vote for a provision prohibiting them. He 
hoped the amendment would go to the committee. 

Mr. BALLINGALL said that it could not be concealed that 
there was a strong bank party in the Convention, and he was 
willing to have the test question upon banks taken at the present 
time. He hoped the motion would be modified so as to raise the 
issue. He believed that some members favorable to banks would 
receive such instructions from the constituents as would control 
their course, and he wished to know how the Convention was 
divided on the question at the present time. 

Mr. CAMPBELL, of M’Donough, moved to have the sections 
of the New York constitution, on the subject of banks, read; 
which was agreed to, and the sections were read. 

Mr. HURLBUT did not, when he offered the resolution, expect 
that it would evolve an issue on the absorbing question of banks, 
which he was aware was one of the most important that would 
probably engage the attention of the Convention; but if gentlemen 
were desirous of raising the question at the present time, he was 
ready to meet them. If they were anxious to take up this qués- 
tion, without any preparation, he would not object. If they feel 
strong enough to apply the rigid rules of party discipline, let them 
proceed. For his part he did not desire to draw party lines unless 
forced into it. He represented whigs and democrats and was 
determined to do justice to both. This question was one of 
absorbing interest to his constituents—they desired a sound 
currency, and, irrespective of party upon this, as well as other 
questions, he desired to consult their wishes and their interests. 
He did not, however, rise to discuss the merits of the question. 
He would infinitely prefer that the debate should be suffered to 
lie over to a future time; but, as he before remarked, if gentlemen 
wish to test the question zow, he was ready to gratify them. It 
is a resolution of inquiry merely, which he had not expected 
would meet with opposition. 

Mr. GREGG said that the resolution offered by the gentleman 
from Boone was respectful in its terms, and courtesy required that 
it should go to the committee. It was merely a resolution of 
inquiry and he could not vote against its reference. 


TUESDAY, JUNE 15, 1847 87 


ge ceiee Gent fe Teron, Ci. Patz.) 
))) & prokibst bankine im any form, were before the Convention; 
_ Bom the question comes up im 2 diferent shape, wiz: 
=) 2 proposition to adopt the features of the gencral banking lew of 
J New York. He did not care how the question was presented so 
gem He agreed fully with the gentleman 


45 yg ce oe Skee c 
= ae = = crmeticnt, Ex that of New Yout 
Swoeld call into existence? The system is infinitely worse than 
© the old system; for it opens 2 door to the creation of an endless 
 gumber of banks. If ome bank is mischievous, how much more 
so must a hundred be? Past experience has proved to us that in 
@enicaltural commumitics such imstitutions are a cums<c, and we 
Ihave found that the small bills of the thousand and ome banks m 
= Proposition that was presented, related tm smzil balis Now, 
every man ost admit, that thts desorption of crculatng maim 
= of bank bulls of a less demommation than twenty dolls, 2ll boss 
Bess transactions and contracts of a less amount will be carmicd 
on im gold and silver. If we do not prohibit we must necessarily 
have an almost exclusive paper Greoulation. It was so m the 
section where he ved. Before the Ohio and Kentucky banks 
flooded bis resion with thea omes and twos, specie was plenty, 


88 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


but now the metals had almost entirely disappeared. was 
for driving small bills out of circulation. 


Gentlemen had expressed a willingness to vote for referting 


the substitute to a committee; but he saw no impropriety in 
discussing it before it was sent to the committee, if it was to be 
sent at all—We cannot expect the committee to report in such 
a manner as to meet the views of the Convention, unless full 
discussion is had in advance. He desired that the committee 
should enter upon their deliberations with all the light which a 
debate in this body could elicit. 

He had often heard of well regulated banks, but he never 
knew one of that character. We have had in this State experience 
enough on this subject to have learned that they are fraught with 


disaster and ruin. We have had six banks, every one of which 


failed, involving the people in losses which millions of dollars 
would not repair, and now a proposition is brought forward to 
repeat the experiment on a grand scale; to establish a bank in 
every town and village, and deluge the State with paper money. 


If we desire a valuable and reliable circulating medium, we must, 


as all experience shows, exclude bank paper entirely. 

He hoped that the discussion would proceed. 

Mr. CAMPBELL, of Jo Daviess, said, that he had, on a former 
occasion, expressed his views in favor of a full, free and candid 
interchange of sentiment upon every and all subjects that might 


arise in that body; and he would not interpose an obstacle to a 
respectful consideration of every proposition that gentlemen 


might deem proper to submit. The gentleman from Boone (Mr. 
Hurtsut) has offered a resolution, the subject of which he 
(Mr. H.) desired to have investigated by a committee.—He 
(Mr. C.) saw no impropriety in the reference. He would vote 
for referring it, and he hoped that the committee would give it 


their attention. All that the people want on the subject of — 


banking is light. Let us have light, and those opposed to banks 
have nothing to fear. As for himself, he was prepared to oppose 
banks in any form when the question should be properly and 
fairly presented, even though their advocates might “steal the 


%On the question of banks and banking in Illinois, see Dowrie, The 
Development of Banking in Illinois. 


im! 
i 


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, 


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4 


Ba. ae ee 


TUESDAY, JUNE 15, 1847 89 


livery of Heaven” to clothe themin. He hoped that the resolution 
would be permitted to go to the committee. 
Mr. JENKINS thought the merits of the question should be 


_ discussed in the committee of the whole, where every proposition 


relating to it could be considered. When the question should 
come up he would oppose the creation of banks in any form. As 
at present presented, he was not disposed to discuss the merits of 
the question. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon, said, that if gentlemen opposed 
to banks could not be converted, discussion would be useless, and 
a decision of the question upon the test offered by the resolution 
of the gentleman from Boone (Mr. Hurtsut) would settle the 
matter. 

Mr. ARCHER was prepared to vote against banks in every 
form in which they could be presented, yet, out of courtesy, he 
was willing to give the resolution the direction which the gentle- 
man from Boone (Mr. Hurtsut) desired. If the question was 
pressed, he (Mr. A.) would vote to lay the resolution on the 
table; yet he deprecated any attempt to stifle debate. He was 
for discussing, fully, this, as well as every other question. He 
hoped the resolution would be referred to the committee, and 
when it should come up again in a proper form he would be 
prepared to record his vote against it. 

Mr. KINNEY of St. Clair, was also in favor of referring it to 
the committee. He hoped his honorable friend from Fulton 
(Mr. Markey) would withdraw his motion to lay on the table. 
Other propositions relative to banks had been referred to the 
committee, and he trusted that this would also be referred. 

Mr. KNAPP, of Scott, made some remarks against banks and 
banking, and urged the necessity of excluding the circulation of 
small notes.” 

Without taking the question, the Convention adjourned till 
to-morrow morning. 


Mr. Knapp later sent the following correction to the Jilinois State 
Register, which published it in its issue of June 19, at the close of the June 
18 debates: “In your paper of Saturday you report me as having made 
some remarks against banks and banking, and as offering a resolution in 
favor of excluding from circulation small notes. Mr. Morritr was the 
gentleman who made the remarks and offered the resolution.”’ 


VIII. WEDNESDAY, JUNE 16, 1847 


Mr. ECCLES, from the Revenue committee, reported the 
following: 


Resolved, That the new constitution shall provide for a poll tax. 


Mr. ROUNTREE moved to amend by adding, “Provided, 
that the power to lay a capitation tax by the Legislature be pro- 
posed as a distinct proposition for adoption or rejection, by the 
people at the same time and places at which the vote shall be 
taken on the adoption or rejection of the new constitution, and 
if it shall appear that at said election, more votes are given in 
favor of said proposition than are given against it, the Legislature 
shall at its next session thereafter provide by law for levying such 
capitation tax, and continuing in force a law for the collection 
of a capitation tax: Provided, however, that non-payment of 
such tax shall not disqualify persons who are otherwise qualified 
voters from enjoying the right of election.” 


Mr. SCATES opposed the levying of a poll tax. In supporting 
the government, respect should be had to justice. He thought 
that the principal [sic] of a poll tax was unjust. Its advocates con- 
tended, that all those receiving protection from government 
should render an equivalent for that protection. Why not then, 
tax females as well as males—they receive the same protection. 
Why not tax every class—Indians, negroes and every description 
of persons? It is idle to lay a tax when it cannot be collected. 
If you levy this tax, you must provide a means of collecting it, 


and that can be done only by issuing execution or by imposing ~ 


the punishment of imprisonment for a failure to pay it. If you 
do not imprison, but merely resort to the ordinary civil remedy 
for the collection of debts, the proceeds of your poll tax will be 
absorbed in paying the costs of suits against delinquents. If 
imprisonment should be resorted to, is it expected that the public 
sentiment will sanction it? Is it proposed to withhold the elective 
franchise from such as have not their vouchers to prove that they 


90 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 16, 1847 gt 


have paid the tax? Such a denial of privilege is inconsistent with 
. the principles of equality and the freedom of elections. 

It is a great mistake to suppose that the class who own no 
property do not bear a share of the public burthens. They do 
contribute to the support of the government and render an ample 

equivalent for the protection they receive from the laws and the 
institutions of government. They pay an onerous tax in the forni 
of road labor, and this is a capitation tax amounting to from two 
to five dollars per annum. In addition to this they are liable to 
do military duty, and this is in its nature a poll tax. Is not this 
enough? Are they to be asked to pay fifty cents or a dollar more? 
In health they are willing to labor on the roads, and when their 
country calls, they are willing to engage in her service and march 
to the battle-field. They have been misrepresented by those who 
call them pensioners upon the bounty of the government. For 
his part he was opposed in principle to the scheme of easing the 
wealthy of such burthens of government as should properly rest 
upon them and transfer them to the poor. 

As he before said if the tax should be levied it cannot be 
collected. The government may assess it, but it will be optional 
with the class which it is intended to reach to pay it or not. In 
the slave states there is a greater reason for such a tax. There 
the white head and negro head pay alike, and the rich man pays a 
hundred dollars poll tax-where the poor man pays one. Here it 
is proposed to make the poor pay equally with the wealthy. In 
the imposition of taxes, he was in favor of a just rule of apportion- 
ment, and he would not have the wealthy relieved to burthen the 
indigent. ‘ 

In what way is it expected that our debt is to be paid, but from 
our vast natural resources. Is it expected that it can be done by 
laying an assessment upon property? If it is proposed to raise a 
certain sum by means of this tax, let the same sum be raised by 
taxing property. This was what his constituents desired, not 
because they were unwilling to pay a poll tax, but because they 
believed such a tax unjust in principle. If the sum that is pro- 
posed to be raised by it, is all that is wanted, he could devise a 
wiser plan, viz: that of re-organizing the county governments so 


SOR PRY eee ke) ee Te PAD gS aR ee aT oO 


e 


arty Hind Duy aed «ie 


92 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE 01 NS 


that they may be administered at half the raat costs 
leaving a large balance in the treasury. Aete “ 

Mr. SMITH, of Macon, moved to amend the amendment by A 
adding the following: 

Provided, That the Legislature in exercising this men a % 
limited to the sum of fifty cents upon the persons of all able- : 
bodied men, between the ages of twenty-one and forty-five years, 
and the power not to be exercised after the present ae debe of 
the State shall have been liquidated. YA ae 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, that he could not pane a 
with the gentleman from Jefferson, (Mr. ScaTeEs,) who takes the i 
ground that the proposed tax is wrong in principle. Every man 
owes something to the government from which he receives pro- 
tection—the man who owns no property as well as him who does— 
and as a patriot he should be willing to pay it. ee 

He was opposed to making the payment of the tax a p 
requisite to the right of suffrage. He would do nothing to limit 
that right. He believed that no coercion was necessary to 
collect the proposed tax, the people would pay it without ¢ com 
pulsion. 

The gentleman from Jefferson says that the poor pay a roa 
tax and are liable to do military duty. So do the rich. In 
representative governments where all are equal, and participate 
equally 1 in the benefits of government, all ought to contribute. 
its support, in proportion to the benefits they receive; and he did 
not doubt that all would be willing to give a consideration for. ‘ 
benefits. ipo 

He knew that the people of his region were in favor of the tax, 
and if imposed, he doubted not that they would pay it. gna 
and then one should refuse, be it so—he would not fail to be h ¥ 
up to the contempt of the community, which would pro 
powerful incentive to a compliance with the Provisions 
(Mr. D.) would support the last amendment. At aad 

Mr. WOODSON said, that his constituents were in favor - 
poll tax. A vote was taken upon it at the election, and out : 
1500 or 1600 votes, not more (as Mr. W. was understood 
say) than 150 were against the tax, and out of the 150, at 
100 were property holders. This showed how the people 


oo 
reo 
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WEDNESDAY, JUNE 16, 1847 93 


_ Greene stood on this question, and he did not think they 


were more patriotic than the people of other counties. He 
believed that the whole people of the State, without regard to 
location, were in favor of the tax. If he believed with the gentle- 
man from Jefferson, (Mr. Scates) that the provision would be 
unequal, he would oppose it as strenuously as any member; but 
he thought it a just and equal tax. Will any man say that he, as 
an individual, is not as valuable as any other individual, though 
he may not be a property holder? All men, however humble, 
have a certain pride of character, and they would scorn the 
imputation of ranking in a lower grade than their fellow men. It 
is an error to suppose that, because a man is poor, he must be 
unwilling to contribute his just proportion to the support of the 
government. If a man is unable to pay the tax he would not 
exactit. All able-bodied men ought to pay it—the old and infirm 
and disabled might be excused. 

Gentlemen say that the effect of the tax will be to take the 
burthens of government from the poor and impose them upon 
the rich; but he did not regard it in that light. The rich, who 


already pay high taxes, will also pay a poll. No burthen is taken 


from them, but rather one added to those already resting upon 
them. 

He asked gentlemen to examine the question as patriots. 
Can they lay their hands upon their bosoms and justify them- 
selves in returning to their constituents, without having done 
something to relieve the State of the odium of repudiation and 
non-payment which rests uponit? Are they prepared to go home, 
leaving the State burthened with her enormous debt, without 
having made any provision for its ultimate liquidation. 

This proposition is not a novel one. In only two of the States 
is it prohibited. The constitution of all the other States either 
impose it or leave it open to the Legislature. Eight have provi- 
sions imposing it. Our constitution leaves it to the Legislature, 
yet it has not been levied. Politicians in the Legislature have 
had an eye more to popularity than the happiness, prosperity and 
glory of the State. It is'high time that a different system from 
this was established, and it is the duty of this Convention to put 


- forth its power to establish it. 


ee ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


This tax will yield a revenue of not lfelss dias $100,000. _ 


There are in the State 126,000 persons liable to do military duty; 
and taking this as the data—which he thought was as correct as 
any—his estimate of the amount of revenue could not be much 
out of the way. 

The argument of the gentleman from Jefferson, that the tax 
cannot be collected, is no argument against the principle involved 
in the proposition. It is (said Mr. W.) our duty to impose 
the tax, and it will be that of the Legislature to devise the 
means of enforcing its collection. But he saw no difficulty in 
collecting it. He was not in favor of stringent measures, neither 
did he deem them necessary. He would not resort to imprison- 
ment, nor a restriction of the right of suffrage. The end might be 
attained by moral means. Moral suasion was more powerful 
than coercive enactments. That pride, which is inherent in 
human nature, will prompt the payment of this tax, if not from 
patriotic motives, at least, from that apprehension of being held 
up to the public scorn for delinquency. 

To say that the people of Illinois would not pay this tax, was 
an imputation upon that patriotic devotion to the honor of the 
State and the nation, which prompted her gallant sons to march 
forth shoulder to shoulder to meet the enemy of our common 
country. Will any one say that these heroic men, who redeemed 
the honor of the State upon the battle-fields of Buena Vista and 
Cerro Gordo, will not as readily step forward and maintain her 
character in the financial embarrassments in which she is involved? 
He believed that they would, with the same power and in the same 
manner, come up to the work until our State should be free from 
the load of debt which oppresses her. : 

Mr. THOMAS moved to lay the amendments on the table. 
Carried. 

Mr. NORTON proposed the following amendment: 

“Provided, That no capitation tax shall be assessed against 
any person not entitled to vote under the constitution and laws 
of the State. And, provided, further, that said tax shall be set 
apart to the payment of the public debt, until the same be paid.” 

Mr. HARVEY moved the following amendment: 

“That the 20th section of the 8th article of the present con- 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 16, 1847 95 


stitution be omitted in the constitution, to be proposed for adop- 
tion by this Convention.” 

Mr. H. conceived that this subject should be left to the 
discretion of the Legislature. The constitution about to be 
formed may not be changed for many years, and no unnecessary 
restraints should be imposed. He was opposed to a provision 
prohibiting the levying a poll tax, but disposed to leave the ques- 
tion open to future legislatures. 

Mr. WILLIAMS said that the Convention would make more 
satisfactory progress in business, by doing one thing at a time. 
He was of opinion that if the question were submitted to the 
people, they would provide for a poll tax, if so, this Convention 
ought, in reference to the public will. He thought that a direct 
vote should be taken, whether a poll tax is to be provided for or 
not; then we should know what we are to do. If the tax is to be 
levied, we can hereafter settle upon the best plan to pursue. If 
not, there is an end of the matter, and the Convention will not be 
disposed further to discuss it. 

Mr. NORTON said, that he was opposed to the levying of a 
capitation tax but the character of such a measure will depend 
much on the manner and form of its assessment. He desired the 
original resolution to pass, with his amendment. If no law is to 
be enacted to enforce the collection of this tax, such a provision 
would be mere advice—a subscription, depending on voluntary 
payment. The only two modes of enforcing collection would be 
by imprisonment or withholding the elective franchise. He was 
opposed to either of these, and could not consent in any degree 
to sanction the imposition of degrading penalties upon citizens, 
because they might be too poor to pay the tax. The poor are 
the men to fight our battles, work our roads, sit on juries—the 
men who have carried the banner of their country to the battle- 
field, and conferred immortal honor on their State, at Bruna 
Vista and Cerro Gorpo. To tax these men, and deprive them of 
the common rights of citizenship, on account of their inability to 
pay, is unfair, unequal and unjust. 

Mr. DAVIS, of Massac, craved the indulgence of the Conven- 
tion, feeling it due to himself to express his views on the subject. 
He replied to the argument of Mr. Scares, and denied that the 


96 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


levying a poll-tax was unjust in its operation. It would be 
difficult to prove the correctness of such a position in a country 
like this, where every citizen enjoys the protection of the govern- 
ment, and participates in public affairs to an equal extent. He 
thought men who had displayed such patriotism as has been dis- 


played by our people within the last year, will not shrink from so _ 


trifling a tax, which is necessary to save the credit of the State. 
He believed that at no time in our history, from the time when 
our fathers achieved the independence of their country at York- 
town, down to this time, have our people been wanting in that 


patriotism, which has enabled them, and will enable us, to meet 


every sacrifice required to advance the public good. 


He could see no injustice in the proposition. If one man, by . 


industry and frugality, acquires property, and another, in con- 
sequence of his indolence and vicious habits, remains poor, is 
there a reason why one should be burdened and the other released 
from all contribution for the support of the government, the 
protection and blessings of which they equally share? During 
the canvass for his seat in this body, he was often interrogated by 
both rich and poor, as to his opinions on this point, and he found 
few, very few indeed, who were not earnest in their desire that this 
provision, or one like it, should be incorporated in the new consti- 
tution.—Such a principle is incorporated in the constitution of 
every State, save two. Virginia, the great republican leader of 
States, which has given to the nation so many great men—the 


mother of Presidents, has stood in the front rank, and by the - 


adoption of such measures as were necessary to preserve the 
public credit, has set an example which he hoped Illinois would 
follow. Could this measure be proved unjust and oppressive, he 
would oppose it; but believing it in accordance with principles of 
enlightened public policy, he epprowea7 it, and believed the whole 
country to be with him. 

Mr. CHURCHILL said, that he was opposed to taking 
advantage of the generosity of the poor, to pay the State debt. 
He believed that for property protection, the rich were only 
benifitted, [sic] while for personal protection, the rich and poor were 


equal, therefore, he was opposed to the poll-tax. He would have 


A 
ie 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 16, 1847 97 


proposed an amendment, but the state of the question prevented, 
therefore, he would read it for the benefit of the house. 

Resolved, That the committee on Revenue be instructed to 
ascertain the number of males over twenty-one years of age, in 
the State, and report a resolution to this Convention proposing 
to increase the revenue of this State, by a sum in dollars, equal to 
the number of white male inhabitants over the age of twenty-one 
years, by a direct tax on property. 

Mr. KNOWLTON was in favor of the resolution, as it came 
from the committee, and proposed to dispose of the amendments, 
and let the vote be taken on the original proposition. His con- 
stituents were in favor of a poll-tax. He referred to the example 
of Massachusetts, which had a poll-tax of $1.50 each, the right 
of voting being withdrawn, on failure to pay. He always found 
the poor more prompt than the rich; in the payment of this tax. 
He believed that no citizen in Illinois was too poor to pay such a 
tax, and that the poor would, as they do in Massachusetts, feel a 
pride in paying this tax which would serve the end proposed. 
Mr. K. spoke eloquently of the patriotism of our people—their 
State pride; the determination of all to sustain the honor and 
credit of the State—as evinced in the patience with which they 
have submitted to every necessary exaction, and rushed forth, at 
the call of their country, to fight her battles, and sacrifice their 
lives in defence of her honor. 

Mr. SINGLETON was also in favor of the original proposition. 
It was a simple one, and involved in it no difficulty; and should 
be settled at once. He was in favor of a poll tax, and knew 
that his constituents desired its imposition. He deprecated the 
dragging into this discussion the poor, the women and children. 
All men are originally poor; all equal. This equality is in a great 
measure destroyed by misdirected legislation and the customs of 
society. The object of the provision is to increase revenue. 


’ Property holders were willing to pay, not only on their property, 


but on their persons also, in the same manner as the poor. Let 
property pay—let men, each separately, without confounding the 
distinction which should exist between persons and property. He 
believed that this measure would embarrass none—that young 
men would cheerfully pay it. And there is a large class of men, 


98 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


worthless in property and character, who are active in elections; — 
who enjoy the elective franchise; who are under the control of 
politicians. Impose this tax upon such, and, though they pay 
none now, their taxes will be paid, if not by them, by those desiring 
the benefit of their votes. He believed with the gentleman from 
Massac, that three-fourths of the people are in favor of it. He 
wished the decisive vote to be taken on the original proposition, 
leaving the details to future action. 

The discussion was continued with much animation by Messrs. 
Tuompson, ALLEN and Loupon, when the Convention adjourned 
till three o’clock this afternoon. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. ARCHER made a forcible speech of some length against 
the tax, which we are compelled to condense. He said that in 
the county where he resided the people were opposed to the prin- 
ciple of a poll-tax. They thought that property constituted the 
just basis of taxation. It is true that government is instituted — 
for the protection of life, liberty and property, and that all ought 
to assist in supporting it according to their ability, and he insisted 
that the poor contributed largely to it by paying a road tax, doing 
militia duty and juror’s duty. As regards these taxes, the poor — 
stand on the same footing with the rich—they pay and perform 
as much. He would not add a poll-tax. 

Again, he would not enact a law which was not accompanied 
with proper penalties for enforcing an observance of its behests. 
If the payment of a poll tax is attempted to be coerced by taking 
away the elective franchise or by imprisonment, the people would 
revolt. He asked if the poor man was a fit subject for imprison- 
ment? Should he be deprived of his right of suffrage? Any man 
who would propose it would be doomed to private life oe ener 
residue of his days. 

Mr. A. here proceeded to show that our State debt, for the 
payment of which this poll tax was devised, was created by a 
class of speculators who expected to be benefited by the applica- 
tion of the money so borrowed, and that the poor had no part in 
its creation, neither would they have been benefited materially 
had the most sanguine expectations of the internal improvement 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 176, 1847 99 


schemers been realized. We regret that we cannot give all of 
_ Mr. A.’s sound and interesting remarks on this head. We may 
do so hereafter. 
Mr. PETERS addressed the Convention in favor of a poll tax. 
He thought it just. The object of government is two fold; the 
protection of persons and property. He asked if property should 
alone support the government, whilst persons went free. There 
is property in the free air of heaven, and those who breathe it 
ought to pay a tax when it is the air of freedom. He did not see 
any justice in throwing the whole burthen of supporting the 
government upon one class, whilst another enjoyed an immunity 
from all burthens. Persons without property have access to the 
courts of justice and participate in the blessings of government, 
why, then, he asked, should they not be made to bear part of the 
public burthens growing out of it. 

Mr. P. advocated the tax, leaving it to the Legislature to 
enforce its collection. ; 

Gentlemen say that if limiting the right to vote is resorted to, 
it will induce candidates to bribe the voters. This was in his 
judgment a lame argument. [If it is so easy to bribe, could it not 
now be done at the polls by handing fifty cents to a voter. 

He did not believe that penalties of any kind were necessary. 
The people had too much pride to refuse to pay the tax. 

Mr. HAYES made a very animated speech in favor of the 
tax, which we have in manuscript and may publish it when we 
get more space... It was worthy of his distinguished talents. 

Mr. GEDDES made a few remarks in favor of the tax. He 
_ said that in the course of the debate gentlemen had said that the 
people were already taxed four or five dollars in road taxes, 
yet they said that these same people could not be made to pay a 
tax of one dollar. They can be forced to pay five dollars but 
they cannot be forced to pay one dollar. Mr. G. proceeded to 
show that assertions that had been made on the subject of mili- 
tary duty were incorrect. He said that no military duty was 
exacted of any citizen in the State. We must defer the rest of 
Mr. G.’s remarks for want of space. 

The debate was continued by Messrs. M’CaLLen, CamPBELLOf Jo 
Daviess, and PaLmMERof Macoupin, when the Convention adjourned. 


IX. THURSDAY, JUNE 17, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. Hate. 

Mr. BLAIR, a delegate from Pike, appeared, presented his 
credentials, and was qualified. 

The question before the Convention being the amendments 
offered by the gentlemen from Will and Knox, the CHair 
stated that the amendment of the gentleman from Knox was then 
out of order, and it was-withdrawn. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery stated, that upon consultation - 
with some of the friends of the poll-tax they had concluded to 
move that the amendment now before the Convention should be 
laid on the table, which motion he would make before he took his 
seat. He would do so with a view to present the following, as 
a substitute for the original proposition: strike out all after the 
word “resolved” and insert “‘that the committee on Revenue be, 
and are hereby, instructed to report an amendment to the consti- 
tution so as to authorize the Legislature to levy a capitation tax, 
not to exceed one dollar, on all free white male inhabitants over 
the age of twenty-one years, when they shall deem it necessary.” 

He was in favor of this plan, because it left the subject of a 
poll-tax to the people. Gentlemen objected to a poll-tax because 
the people could not at any time change it. This proposed sub- 
stitute would enable the people at any time to instruct their 
representatives to change or abolish the tax. He moved to lay 
the amendment of the gentleman from Will on the table; which 
was Carried. 

The question then recurring on the amendment, it was decided 
in the afirmative—yeas 87. 

Mr. POWERS offered an amendment providing that no road 
tax should hereafter be levied in the form of a capitation tax. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved to lay it on the table. 
Carried. 

Mr. WORCESTER offered a substitute, which the CHarr 
ruled out of order. 

100 


bey 


THURSDAY, JUNE 127, 1847 101 


Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved the previous question, 
which was seconded; and the question being taken on the adoption 
of the resolution, by yeas and nays, it was decided in the afirma- 
tive—yeas 108, nays 49. 

The following resolutions, offered some days ago, by Mr. 
Pratr, together with the amendment, proposed by Mr. 
Hurst, thereto, came up: 

Resolved, That the committee on Incorporations be instructed 
to report such provisions as will effectually prohibit the power of 
the Legislature to create or authorize any individuals, company 
or corporation, with banking powers in this State. 

Resolved, That said committee inquire into and report to the 
Convention such provisions as are best calculated gradually to 
exclude from, and prohibit the circulation in this State, of bank 
bills under the denomination of twenty dollars. 

Mr. Hurizsut’s amendment: 

“That the committee on Incorporations be instructed to 
inquire into the expediency of so amending and altering the 21st 
section of article 8 of the constitution, as to provide for a system 
of general banking laws, similar in principle with the propositions 
lately adopted in the State of New York.” 

The question being on the adoption of the amendment, 

Mr. CHURCHILL moved to lay the whole matter on the 
table. 

Mr. MARKLEY asked a division upon laying the amendment 
on the table, and the vote being taken by yeas and nays, resulted 
as follows: 

yeas—Akin, Allen, Anderson, Archer, Armstrong, Atherton, 
Blair, Blakely, Ballingall, Brockman, Bond, Bosbyshell, Brown, 
Bunsen, Butler, Crain, Caldwell, Campbell of Jo Daviess, Carter, 
F. S. Casey, Zadoc Casey, Choate, Cross of Woodford, Cloud, 
Dale, Davis of Bond, Davis of Massac, Dawson, Dement, Dunn, 
Dunsmore, Eccles, Evey, Farwell, Frick, Green of Clay, Green of 


Jo Daviess, Hatch, Hawley, Hayes, Heacock, Henderson, Hill, . 


Hoes, Hogue, Hunsaker, James, Jenkins, Jones, Knapp of Scott, 
Kreider, Kinney of Bureau, Kinney of St. Clair, Lasater, Laughlin, 
Lenley, Logan, Loudon, McCallen, McCully, McClure, McHatton, 
Manly, Markley, Mason, Moffett, Moore, Morris, Nichols, Oliver, 


ao ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


Pace, Palmer of Maconpin, Palmer of Marshall, Pratt, Peters, 


Powers, Robbins, Robinson, Roman, Rountree, Scates, Sharpe, — 


Stadden, Shields, Sherman, Sim, Simpson, Smith of Gallatin, 


Shumway, Thompson, Trower, Tutt, Vernor, Wead, Webber, © 


West, Williams, Witt, Whiteside.—g9. 


nays—Adams, Canady, Campbell of McDonough, Cross of — 


Winnebago, Church, Churchill, Davis of McLean, Deitz, Dummer, 
Dunlap, Edwards of Madison, Edwards of Sangamon, Edmonson, 
Graham, Geddes, Green of Tazewell, Grimshaw, Harding, Harlan, 
Harper, Harvey, Hay, Holmes, Hurlbut, Huston, Jackson, Judd, 
Knapp of Jersey, Kenner, Kitchell, Knowlton, Knox, Lander, 


Lemon, Lockwood, Marshall of Coles, Marshall of Mason, ~ 


Matheny, Mieure, Miller, Minshall, Northcott, Norton, Pinckney, 
Rives, Swan, Spencer, Servant, Sibley, Singleton, Smith of Macon, 


Thomas, Thornton, Turnbull, Turner, Tuttle, Vance, Whitney, 


Woodson, Worcester.—6o. 


The question then recurring upon laying the original resolu- 


tions on the table; when a division on the first of them was de- 
manded, and the vote was taken. 
Mr. SHumway, Mr. Manty and others expressed ihemmeeives 


most emphatically opposed to banks in any shape whatever, © 


yet they deemed a prohibitory clause in the constitution impractic- 
able, they therefore voted to lay the instructions on the table. 

Several gentlemen having expressed themselves as having 
voted under a misapprehension of the question and desirous to 
change their votes, 

Mr. CALDWELL moved that the vote be retaken; which 
motion was carried. And the yeas and nays being again called 
resulted as follows: 

yEAs—Adams, Anderson, Atherton, Blakely, Butler, Canady, 


Campbell of McDonough, Choate, Cross of Winnebago, Cloud, — 


Church, Churchill, Davis of McLean, Dawson, Deitz, Dummer, 


Dunlap, Dunn, Dunsmore, Edwards of Madison, Edwards of f 


Sangamon, Eccles, Edmonson, Evey, Frick, Graham, Geddes, 
Green of Clay, Green of Jo Daviess, Green of Tazewell, Grimshaw, 
Harding, Harlan, Harper, Harvey, Hatch, Hawley, Hay, Heacock, 
Henderson, Hill, Holmes, Hurlbut, Huston, Jackson, Judd, Knapp 
of Jersey, Knapp of Scott, Kenner, Kinney of Bureau, Kitchell, 


, 


wt 


THURSDAY, JUNE 17, 1847 103 


Knowlton, Knox, Lander, Lemon, Lockwood, Logan, Loudon, 
McCallen, McClure, McHatton, Manly, Marshall of Coles, 
Marshall of Mason, Mason, Matheny, Mieure, Miller, 
Minshall, Moffet, Moore, Morris, Northcott, Norton, Palmer of 
Marshall, Peters, Pinckney, Rives, Robbins, Robinson, Swan, 
Spencer, Sherman, Servant, Sibley, Singleton, Smith of Macon, 
Shumway, Thomas, Thornton, Trower, Turnbull, Turner, Tutt, 
Tuttle, Vance, Webber, West, Williams, Whitney, Woodson, 
Worcester.—1Io2. 

nays—Akin, Allen, Archer, Armstrong, Blair, Ballingall, 
Brockman, Bond, Bosbyshell, Brown, Bunsen, Crain, Caldwell, 
Campbell of Jo Daviess, Carter, F. S. Casey, Zadoc Casey, Colby, 
Constable, Cross of Woodford, Dale, Davis of Bond, Davis of 
Massac, Dement, Farwell, Hayes, Hoes, Hogue, Hunsaker, James, 
Jenkins, Jones, Kreider, Kinney of St. Clair, Lasater, Laughlin, 
Lenley, McCully, Markley, Nichols, Oliver, Pace, Palmer of 
Macoupin, Pratt, Powers, Roman, Rountree, Scates, Stadden, 
Shields, Sim, Simpson, Smith of Gallatin, Thompson, Vernor, 
Wead, Witt, Whiteside.—58. 

Mr. LOGAN said (when his name was called), that as other 
gentlemen had defined their position, he would do so also. If we 
were to have a bad system of banking or no banks presented to us, 
he would prefer to vote for no bank; for the present he would vote 
to lay this proposition on the table. 

The question then recurred on the motion to lay the first of 
the resolutions on the table. 

Mr. HARVEY appealed to the maker of the motion to with- 
draw it for a few moments, and it was withdrawn. Mr. H. then 
said, that the resolutions before them instructed the committee 
on Incorporations to report some mode of prohibiting the circula- 
tion of bank notes within the State, and he hoped it would not be 
laid on the table at present, but discussed. He made this remark 
at the suggestion of the committee. He understood that there 
Was a great difference of opinion in the Convention, as regarded 
the proper mode of excluding paper from circulation, and he hoped 
the question would be discussed. And, inasmuch as there were 
several propositions of this nature before the Convention, some 
of them going so far as to make all contracts and transactions 


104 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


based upon bank notes void, he hoped the Convention would 
decide upon the matter before it came before the committee. 

The yeas and nays were then called, and resulted as follows: 

yEAs—Adams, Anderson, Atherton, Blair, Blakely, Butler, 
Canady, Colby, Cross of Winnebago, Church, Churchill, 
Davis of Montgomery, Davis of McLean, Dawson, Deitz, Dummer, 
Dunlap, Dunsmore, Edwards of Madison, Edwards of 
Sangamon, Eccles, Evey, Frick, Graham, Geddes, Green of Clay, 
Green of Jo Daviess, Green of Tazewell, Grimshaw, Harding, 
Harlan, Harper, Harvey, Hatch, Hawley, Hay, Heacock, Hill, 
Hogue, Holmes, Hunsaker, Hurlbut, Jackson, James, Jones, Judd, 
Knapp of Jersey, Knapp of Scott, Kenner, Kinney of Bureau, 
Kitchell, Knowlton, Knox, Lander, Laughlin, Lemon, Lockwood, 
Logan, Loudon, McCallen, McClure, Manly, Marshall of Coles, 
Marshall of Mason, Mason, Matheny, Mieure, Movia, Nichols, 
Northcott, Norton, Palmer of Marshall, Peters, Pinckney, Powers, 
Rives, Robbins, Robinson, Rountree, Swan, Spencer, Sherman, 
Servant, Sibley, Sim, Simpson, Singleton, Smith of Macon, 
Thomas, Thornton, Trower, Turnbull, Turner, Tuttle, Vance, 
Webber, West, Williams, Whitney, Woodson, Worcester.—Io1. 

nays—Akin, Allen, Archer, Armstrong, Ballingall, Brockman, 
Bond, Bosbyshell, Brown, Bunsen, Crain, Caldwell, Campbell of 
Jo Daviess, Campbell of McDonough, Carter, F. S. Casey, Zadoc 
Casey, Choate, Constable, Cross of Woodford, Cloud, Dale, Davis 
of Massac, Dement, Dunn, Edmonson, Gregg, Hayes, Henderson, 
Hoes, Huston, Jenkins, Kreider, Kinney of St. Clair, Lasater, - 
Lenley, McCully, McHatton, Markley, Miller, Minshall, Moffett, 
Moore, Oliver, Pace, Palmer of Macoupin, Pratt, Roman, Scates, 
Stadden, Shields, Smith of Gallatin, Shumway, Thompson, Tutt, 
Vernor, Wead, Witt, Whiteside.—58. 

The resolutions were then withdrawn. 

Mr. ROBBINS presented a petition from citizens of Randolph, 
praying a constitutional provision exempting from execution a 
homestead of 160 acres of land, and moved to refer it to a select 
committee of five. 

Mr. SCATES moved to refer it to[the] committee on Law Re- 
form. Carried. 

Mr. JONES presented a petition from Perry county, praying 


THURSDAY, JUNE 17, 1847 105 


equal rights and privileges to all persons, without distinction of 
color, and moved its reference to the committee on Elections and 
Right of Suffrage. 

Mr. J. said, it was well known by these petitioners, as well as 
all others who are acquainted with my sentiments upon this 
subject, that I am opposed to the principal object sought to be 
affected by this petition. Nevertheless it comes from a highly 
respectable portion of our fellow-citizens—mostly, I believe, from 
the moral and intelligent denomination of christians called 
Covenanters.—They have a right to make their sentiments known 
in this body, and it is our duty to receive their petitions and treat 
them with respectful consideration. 

Mr. SINGLETON moved that it be laid on the table till 
December next, one year. He extended the time for fear that we 
might overtake the matter. 

Mr. WHITNEY trusted that the petition would be treated 
respectfully, and he hoped no such course would be pursued as 
that contemplated by the motion of the gentleman from Brown. 

Mr. CHURCH thought that in the petition were presented 
some principles that would have to come before the Convention 
at some time, and he hoped the petition would be treated respect- 
fully and referred. 

Mr. PINCKNEY said, he was no abolitionist. That party 
he had always opposed, and they opposed him. They had tried to 
prevent his being here in the Convention. Yet he was willing 
to treat them with all respect. There were reasonable abolition- 
ists, and they were as much entitled to be heard as any other 
reasonable men. 

He was opposed to all gag laws, and was willing to hear the 
petitions, sentiments and views of every one. If that party could 
convince him that such a provision as that prayed for should be 
in our constitution he would vote for it. Gentlemen expected 
him to be and he was open to conviction. on other subjects, 
and why not upon this. 

Mr. KINNEY moved to lay the petition on the table. 

Mr. LOGAN said, he supposed that a man might vote for a 
reference of this petition to a committee without being called an 
abolitionist. He had never had that name applied to him, and 


106: ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


he did not care if it should be. He would further say, that if you — 
wanted to have an abolition party in this State, the best way a ‘ 
commence was by treating them disrespectfully. Five 
The yeas and nays were demanded and they stood yeas 48, “% 
nays IIo. a 
The petition was then referred to the committee on Elections 
and Right of Suffrage. t 
Mr. SCATES, from the committee on the Jadichiene in 
obedience to the direction of that committee, reported to the — 
Convention a resolution calling upon the clerk of the Supreme — 
Court to inform said committee of the number of cases tried at 
each term of said court since 1840, and the number now pending — 
and undecided; which resolution was adopted. 4 
Mr. SHERMAN, from the committee on Finance, reported — 
back a resolution that had been referred to it, in relation to the ~ 
levying a tax on gold watches, jewelry, &c., and the appropriation — 
thereof, together with all moneys arising from fines, to the school 
fund, and asked to be discharged from the further consideration 4 
thereof. 
Mr. DAWSON moved that the resolution be referred to the ‘ 
committee on Education. * 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery made some remarks BO ras " 
of the reasons why the committee had so reported, and if 
Mr. MARKLEY moved to lay the resolution on the table. 
Carried. y 
Mr. SCATES, from the Judiciary committee, Leconen back _ 
to the Convention the resolution which had been referred to it in 


relation to the election of sheriffs, &c., and recommended its 4 
rejection. The committee instructed him to do so, because they ~ 
considered that the subject properly belonged to another committee. 4 
The report was concurred in. ey 

Mr. SCATES, from the same committee, also reported back 
the resolution in relation to the abolition of the county commis- 


sioners’ court, and asked to be discharged from the further con- — 
sideration of the subject. The committee gave as the reasons of — 
the report, that the subject matter of the resolution properly — 
belonged to another committee. ae 


a 


. 


Pe ee ee ee en Se 


THURSDAY, JUNE 17, 1847 107 


Mr. CONSTABLE inquired of the chairman of the committee 
what committee it was deemed more proper to send this subject to? 
Mr. SCATES. The committee on County Organizations. 

Mr. CONSTABLE still thought that the Judiciary committee 
was the proper committee to inquire into the propriety of abolish- 
ing a court. 

Mr. SCATES said, he would add that the committee had 
further instructed him to recommend the repeal of the 4th section 
of the schedule to the constitution. 

Mr. LOGAN said, he was not present in the committee when 
they agreed upon the report just made, but he would have been 
in favor of it. He thought the abolition of the county commis- 
sioners’ court was not in the scope of the Judiciary committee’s 
duties. The court was not a court, except in name. It had no 
power to try an action, or jurisdiction of a case of five dollars. 
No indictments could be found; no other jurisdiction properly 
belonging to a court was given toit. It was nothing more than a 
mere fiscal agent of the county—opening and laying out roads, 
collecting and distributing the revenue; these were its only powers. 
Unless it was a court with judicial power, cognizance and capacity, 
he could not suppose its abolition was a proper subject for the 
Judiciary committee. 

As regarded the abolition of this court, his personal opinion and 
feelings would be to retain it; but he was apprised that his con- 
stituents thought differently and he would represent them. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, that he had the greatest respect for 
what the gentleman from Sangamon chose to express on any 
question, but he must differ from him. In his opinion the county 
commissioners’ court was as much a court as the circuit court. 
If that court was not a court, under what power did they issue 
writs of ad guod damnum? In all cases where the county was a 
party, that court was the first place where the subject was heard; 
and from its decisions an appeal could be taken to the circuit 
and supreme courts. He hoped, that in order that there might 
be no collision or jarring between the actions of the committees in 
relation to this matter, one committee might manage the whole 


judicial affairs. He could not see how the abolition of this court 


was the legitimate business of the committee on the Organization 


108 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


of Counties, unless the court be abolished, and then they 
might, the county having no organization, propose some system. 
After some further remarks from Mr. C., and from Mr. MinsHat 
in reply, 

Mr. CALDWELL asked the chairman of the committee on 
the Judiciary, if his committee intended to take into consideration 
any provision for the future judicial affairs of the counties. 

Mr. SCATES was understood to reply in the affirmative. 

The report of the committee and the resolution were laid on 
the table. 

Mr. SCATES, from the same committee, made a report, 
asking to be discharged from the further consideration of the 
resolution in relation to the establishment of tribunals for arbi- 
tration. The committee gave as a reason therefor, that there 
were, at present, laws in force creating such tribunals. The report 
was agreed to, and the resolution laid on the table. 

Mr. SCATES made a report from the same committee, upon 
another resolution, asking to be discharged from the further con- 
sideration thereof; which was agreed to. 

Mr. CALDWELL moved that the resolution be referred to 
the committee on Rights. Agreed to. 

Mr. ROUNTREE moved to take up some resolutions, offered 
by him some days ago, and refer them to the committee on the 
Judiciary. Carried. 

Mr. BROCKMAN moved to take up some resolutions, offered 
by him some days before, and that they be referred to the com- 
mittee on Organization of Counties. Carried. 

He also asked leave to withdraw some resolutions, heretofore 
presented by him. Granted. 

Mr. WOODSON moved to take up some resolutions, offered 
by him some days before, and that they be referred to the com- 
mittee on Education. Carried. 

- Mr. SCATES moved to take up certain resolutions, offered by 
him, and that they be referred to the appropriate committee. 
Carried. i 

Mr. LOCKWOOD offered several resolutions providing for 
constitutional prohibitions against selling lottery tickets and 


THURSDAY, JUNE 17, 1847 109 


F ‘granting divorces by the Legislature; and moved their reference 


to the committee on Legislative Department. Carried. 
Mr. EDMONSON offered the following resolutions: 
Resolved, That the committee on the Judiciary be instructed 


to inquire into the expediency of abolishing the office of Probate 


Justice, in the several counties of this State, and giving to county 
courts power to do probate business. 

Resolved, That the committee on the Judiciary, be instructed 
to inquire into the expediency of abolishing the office of County 
Recorder, in the several counties of this State; and making the 
clerks of the county courts recorders for the counties. 

Mr. CHURCHILL offered the following resolution: 

Resolved, That the committee on Incorporations be instructed 
by this Convention, to report two propositions, to be submitted 
to the people for their direct vote. One of which shall eventually 
and effectually prohibit the circulation of all paper money as 
currency. The other, giving to the General Assembly power to 
pass, a restrictive general banking law; the resolutions to be em- 
braced in the report. 

Mr. McCALLEN offered a substitute. 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved the Convention adjourn till 3 p.m. 

Mr. VANCE moved the Convention adjourn till to-morrow at 
g A.M. Carried. 


Be 


X. FRIDAY, JUNE 18, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Green, of Tazewell.8 

The PRESIDENT laid before the Convention a letter from the 
clerk of the supreme court, answering the resolution of inquiry 
addressed him yesterday. His letter states that at the July term 
of that court in 741, the cases decided were 59; December term, 


same year, 92; July term, ’42, 140; December term, “43, 119; 


December. term, ’44, 111; December term, ’45, 171; December 
term, 46, 111; and now pending and undecided, 28. 


- 


Mr. SCATES moved to refer the letter to the committee on | 


the Judiciary. 


Mr. NORTON moved that 200 copies of the letter be printed — 


_ for the use of the members. It was desirable that all the members 
should have the advantage of all the information that had been 
called for, and he considered the best mode of so doing would be 
to print the reports. 

Mr. MINSHALL asked the object of the motion to print. 

Mr. NORTON said the committee had called for the informa- 
tion, and he supposed had some object in so doing. If the report 
of the clerk of the court was worth calling for, it was worth 
printing. And the members should have every opportunity of 
examining and knowing the whole of the ne on all 
subjects laid before the Convention. 

Mr. BROWN would like to know from the clerk of the supreme 
court, the number of cases appealed to that court from the circuit 
courts, and with a view of introducing a motion to that effect, he 
moved to lay the motion to print on the table; which was carried. 

Mr. SCATES, in reply to a question put to him, said one 
object of the committee, in calling for the information, was to 


ascertain the amount of business done in that court, to enable — 


them to form an idea of the necessary number of justices required 
to perform the duties. 


8 Henry R. Green, delegate from Tazewell County. See the biographical 
appendix. 


Iio 


peters", 


FRIDAY, JUNE 18, 1847 111 


Mr. HURLBUT stated similar reasons on his part, as a 
~ member of the committee. 

Mr. HAYES, from the committee on Law Reform, reported 
" back the resolutions which had directed them to inquire into the 
. ee diency of reporting a constitutional provision abolishing 
capital punishment, and asked to be discharged from the further 
consideration of the subject. He gave as the reasons of this 


% properly come under the duties of the Convention. The Conven- 
% tion had been called to amend the constitution, to distribute 
_ the powers of government among the proper departments and the 
: remedying of grievances. The report was agreed to and the reso- 
_ jutions were laid on the table. 
Mr. LOCKWOOD, from the committee on the Executive 
‘ Department, reported back a series of resolutions which had been 
_ referred to that committee, some of which they recommended 
_ to be referred to other committees, and others with several 
_ amendments in relation to the constitution to the Governor, 
Lieut. Governor, &c. 
‘a Mr. CALDWELL moved that 200 copies of the report be 
Mg published and that it be for the present laid on the table. Carried. 
. Mr. JENKINS, from the committee on the Division, and 
_ Organization of Counties, reported back the resolution requiring 
that no new county shall be formed unless the same contain an 
area of 400 square miles, with an opinion that no such provision 
ms ae to be inserted in the constitution; and asking to be acre 
from the further consideration of the same. 
Mr. WEST opposed the report of the committee and their 
- recommendation. He said that he had not proposed the resolu- 
tion they had reported back, but had a similar one prepared and 
would have done so had he not been anticipated. The subject 
_ of retrenchment had been much discussed, and though he intended 
_ to make no speech aboutit, this proposition involved the principle. 
_ The session of the Legislature had been always prolonged by the 
_ business growing out of applications for new counties, and changing 
_ the county seats, which were got up and advocated by numbers 
_ of men who come down here to accomplish the object from 
_ personal and interested motives alone. We had come here for 


ae 


“i 


Se SN 


112 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI ON. a 


if 
retrenchment and reform, and in this particular, by abridging the { 
length of the sessions of the Legislature, we would be carrying out 
that principle. A provision, similar to the one embraced in this 
resolution, had been adopted in Indiana, and no one who looked — 
at the matter doubted its propriety. The people in his county 
had felt much interest in this matter, the subject had been agitated 
there, by these proposals to change county seats. He entertained 
the highest respect for the gentlemen composing this committee 
and had hoped they would give this resolution a full deliberation; 
they had no doubt thought they had done so, but he desired that 
they would again take the matter and give it a further examination, 
view it calmly and quietly, and information and facts would be 
afforded them that would, no doubt, incline them to a different — 
opinion.” 

Mr. JENKINS said, that because the committee had asked 
to be discharged from the further consideration of the resolution, 
it should not be presumed that they intended to give the subject 
of county division no further consideration. They wouldendeavor 
by some provisions hereafter to remedy the evils complained of 

Mr. BROCKMAN said, the committee had not had the 
experience which members had who resided in small counties. — 
He represented a small county, and when you come into it and © 
have business with the county officers, you have to look for them 
every where, and why? Because we cannot afford to pay them 
sufficient to allow a man to remain in his office and attend to its 
duties. He must be engaged in something else. 

In case of a reduction of the number of representatives what 
would small counties do? Small counties have to pay almost as 
much taxes for officers as large ones. Small counties would be 
entirely cut off in representation in the Legislature, and the people 
of them could not be sued. Every session there are petitions for 
new counties and the people’s money squandered in legislating 
upon them. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, that he hoped this subject 
would be referred again to the committee, or to a select or any 
other appropriate committee. What scenes would be witnessed 


19 A longer account of West’s speech may be found in the Sangamo Journal, 
June 22. 


FRIDAY, JUNE 78, 1847 113 


here every year, when these petitions come before the Legislature 
on this subject, asking for new counties. Fifty or sixty persons 
came down here and hung round the Legislature at every session, 
begging and endeavoring to carry through some one or other of 


_ these measures; they were round the committee on Counties, and 


affidavits upon affidavits were spread before them, with their 
petitions. Every one knew how they were obtained, and by what 
sort of persons. 

There was but little difference between the expenses of small 
counties and those of large ones and the less the number 
of counties, the less expense it would be to the State. 

This was an evil which the people were everywhere alive to 
and he hoped the Convention would put a stop to it. He 
hoped the provision requiring the 400 square miles to the county 
would be adopted. In nine cases out of ten the petitions for these 
new counties were got up by men looking for the county offices 
to be created; or by men who were anxious to have the county seat 
located on their land, thereby increasing its value. Indiana had a 
provision of this kind in her constitution, and if he was not mis- 
taken, Missouri also had one. No one there complains of it, and 
every one admires the system. We already had one hundred 
counties, and it would be much better if we had but sixty. 

He hoped it would be adopted. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean, agreed with the gentleman last up. 
This was of the greatest interest to the people of the region 
he came from. On no subject were they more united than upon 
this. No evil greater than this do they require this Convention 
to correct. 

Gentlemen cannot deny that great evil grows out of this 
system of creating new counties every year. Indiana had a pro- 
vision against it. Ohio, too, had one, and he believed the area 
was larger in those States than 400 miles. There, every county 
is respectable, and there are not those complaints about taxation. 

The amount of taxation in large counties for the county 
expenses was less than in smaller ones. Sangamon paid less than 
Macon. These petitions were always the work of interested 
persons. He was in favor of a prohibition against new counties 
being formed with the area less than 400 miles, and also that the 


114 


county from which it should be taken should not be left solute a 


than that. The attention of the people had been directed to this — 


question, and it was a’serious one. By adopting this, weeks of 


legislation would be saved. Since he had been in the State, a 
great amount of the time of every Legislature had been wasted 
upon this subject. The Legislature that met two years ago per- 
formed a crowning act by creating no new county, the first time 
anything of the kind had occurred. He moved the resolution be 
recommitted to the committee with the following instructions. 
“To report a provision, to be inserted in the constitution, that 
no new county shall be established by the General Assembly, which 
shall reduce the county or counties, or either of them, from 
which it shall be taken, to less contents than 400 square miles; 


nor shall any county be laid off of less contents, or any line of _ 


which shall pass within less than ten miles of any county seat 
already established.” 

Mr. THOMPSON was surprised, when economy, retrenchment 
and reform were the order of the day, that anything of this kind— 
the creation of new counties—should be heard in the Legislature. 
He was in the Legislature some years ago, and there was a uni- 
versal feeling to arrest the further sub-division of the counties; 
some little arrangement took place between Scott and Morgan, 
which created some local feeling in the Senate. 

The State of New York had only 58 counties; some of them 
had population enough to send a member to Congress. Penn- 


sylvania, too, was of nearly the same area, and the same number 


of counties. I was born in a county which was entitled to two 
members of Congress, six Senators and sixty representatives; in 
an evil day they were induced to cut it into three oblong parts, 
and the expenses were tripled if not quadrupled. 

I have the honor to represent a county of good size, and the 
people are so tenacious of their land that they would not part 
with a single foot of it—If contiguous counties have any desire to 


be attached to us, we are willing to receive them with open 


arms. But before we part with a single inch of our land, we would, 
Hotspur-like, quibble on the ninth part of a hair. 


‘Mr. JENKINS. | The committee intended to incorporate into 


some report, something in relation to this matter, at another time. 


FRIDAY, JUNE 78, 1847 115 


_ He had not said a word about retrenchment, though others had. 
The people do not expect us to retrench by restraining them in 
their privileges. We have no right to restrain them in petitioning 
for a new county when they deem such necessary. We have no 
right to bind them down to silence by saying there shall be no new 
county unless it contain an area of 400 miles. Gentlemen had 
_ said that the petitions for the division of counties were always got 
wp by men with interested or dishonest motives. He admitted 
that this might occur, but were they to presume that all men who 
had a part in such questions were dishonest, and that they could 
cheat the people? No, sir, the people are not so stupid—they are 
not so easily cheated. If they were, they would not be capable of 
self-government. What, then, becomes of the great principle of 
government? When the people petition for a new county we 
must presume that it was got up fairly. What would you say of 
elections, because there may be dishonesty at one, must we pre- 
sume all elections are but schemes of cheating? 

Territory is not the basis of the organization of counties, but 
population is the proper one. Suppose a case, where the territory 
is 20 miles square, with a population of 1,000, and then a ter- 
ritory of 18 square miles, with a population of 20,000; the 
former may be made into a county and the latter cannot. This 
would not be fair, and the basis would be unjust. 

He had never seen a small county unable to get officers, or 
desire to be attached to a larger one. Are we, he asked, to have 
our counties organized only with a view that the officers may get 
rich? ‘The people have a right to petition to be organized into 
new counties, when they do not injure another. This prin- 
ciple perhaps might have been proper when the State was first 
_ organized, but our State being so divided, as regards timber and 
_ prairie land, the people have a right to petition to be organized 
into counties with a view to their advantages. He hoped the 
report of the committee would be adopted. He would repeat 
again that if the people were not to be trusted with a right to 
petition for a new county when they desired it, for fear they might 
be cheated, they were not capable of self-government. The com- 
mittee intended, when they made the report, to have asked that 
some alteration might be made in the shape of the question. 


116 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


[Mr. WEAD said, that he understood we had adopted a rule, 
a few days ago, that committees should not report the reasons for 
their decisions, in writing, but the distinguished chairman of the 


committee on Counties had thought proper to take a different” 


course, and had reported the reasons which governed the com- 
mittee in making the report which had just been submitted. 
Those reasons being now before the house, were a legitimate sub- 
ject of investigation, and deserved to be examined. The honor- 
able chairman had reported, as a reason for the action of the 
committee, that large cities may hereafter arise in the State and 
desire to be incorporated into separate counties, and they ought 


not to be denied that privilege. Mr. W. did not see any connec- _ 


tion between the gentleman’s premises and his conclusion. Large 


cities might desire to be set off into counties, therefore, no pro- — 
vision ought to be inserted in the constitution to prevent the — 


destruction of old counties, or the creation of new ones with a 
less territory than 400 square miles. He did not see the point, 
the pith, of his argument. 


But the honorable gentleman, for whom Mr. W. entertained 
great respect, in his speech, had abandoned the reasons contained ~ 


in his report, and now sought to fortify the action of the committee 
by other reasons. What were those reasons? It was said, to fix 
the size of counties in the constitution is to deny to the people the 
right of petition. Let us look at this argument. We are 
about to limit the powers of the Legislature so that it shall not 
have power to pass any special acts of incorporation. Some man 
desirous of such a privilege may object to the constitution, be- 
cause it will destroy the right of petition! Again, we are about to 
provide for creating a Governor, but according to the gentleman’s 
logic, the people will complain, because they are denied the right 
to petition against the creation of such an office. Some man may 
think we ought not to have a judiciary, and he, too, will complain 
that we have denied the right of petition.—He was willing to sub- 
mit these statements to the people and abide the result. 
Are counties to be made only for the accommodation of a few 
people? Are cities, towns, villages, to have the right of organiz- 
ing new counties at pleasure? Gentlemen contend that this is a 
matter for the people in given limits to decide; why, then, ask the 


- 


FRIDAY, JUNE 78, 1847 117 


Legislature to create new counties? But, Mr. President, the 
creation of new counties is a measure of State policy and govern- 
ment, for the convenience of the whole people, and not for the 
convenience of a few men. The State has to furnish a court for 
each new county and pay the expense, to furnish laws, open new 
books and new accounts with them. The expenses of the State 
depend much upon the number of counties. In the great State 
of New York they have but 56 counties, and in Pennsylvania only 
58. Have gentlemen ever heard complaint that these powerful 
States did not get along well enough with large counties? 

But to leave this matter open is to leave a great and important 
principle undetermined. Counties are continually agitated and 
the people excited upon questions of division. Interested specu- 
lators and designing men, in order to accomplish some sinister 
object, are continually setting such projects on foot, and they 
uniformly beget ill-feeling, suspicion and difficulty. In many in- 
stances the people, oppressed with enormous county taxes, are 
induced to sign petitions for division, in the hope of obtaining 
relief. But when the new county comes to be organized, and they 
are called upon to defray the expense of new county buildings, 
and support a new set of office-holders, they speedily abandon all 
hope of relief. The truth is, the high county taxes and burthens 
arise from our defective system of county government, and the 
people can obtain relief only by abolishing the county commis- 
sioners’ court. 

Again, men settle in large counties for motives of interest and 
pride, they invest their property upon the implied faith that the 
county shall not be shorn of its power, or its influence lessened. 
Have these men no rights as well as the majority? It may be that 
a large majority of the property holders and taxpayers of a county 
may be opposed to a division, ought they to be compelled to pay 
the additional expense of supporting a new county at the will of a 
bare minority? 

As long as this question is left open the Legislature will be con- 
tinually harrassed with applications to divide the large counties, 
and the time of its members will be consumed in listening to the 
petitions and remonstrances, instead of attending to the general 
welfare of the people. 


118 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


In every point of view, then, this question ought to be finally - 
settled. It will relieve the people of the large counties from a load 
of doubts and fears, and put at rest, forever, the hopes and antici-_ i 
pations of a large number of restless and ambitious speculators. 

So long as the counties are large they will have weight and in- © 
fluence commensurate with their population and wealth; divide — 
them and you will strip them of their power. es 

Mr. W. said he gloried in being one of the representatives of a — 
large county, one whose population was exceeded by but two or — 
three in the State, and who paid into the State Treasury a larger 
sum than any other in the State save one. He should regret to | 
see that county divided.]” * 


Mr. MARKLEY. I move to amend the instructions so as to — 
read “inquire into the expediency of &c.” : 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin said, that this question was one 
of some interest to the people in his county and he desired to — 
express his views upon it. He only claimed to be the representa- 
tive of a single county. The people of that county were nearly 
equally divided on the question. He admitted the right of the — 
people to be heard on this and every subject, but the Convention — 
had a right also to make such laws as appeared to them the best. — 
He thought the subject a local one, and not a question of State 
government, and should only interest the counties concerned. © 
He was in favor of re-commitment of the resolutions and that the 
committee should wait till they had heard other propositions, 
which might be presented by gentlemen, and when they had seen 
them and contrasted them one with the other they would be better — 
able to speak of the question. It was true that something should 
be done; but they had better wait and hear all the propositions 
that might be offered on the subject. 

He was personally opposed to the resolution before them, as 
were many of his friends, but he was the representative of the 
county—a single county, and not of the whole State, as other 
gentlemen claimed to be—and should vote as he considered best 
for the interests of that county. 


20 The full report of Wead’s remarks, as printed in the weekly Illinois 
State Register of June 25, is here substituted for a brief general summary. 


FRIDAY, JUNE 18, 1847 119 


The subject involved in the debate was not of a general char- 
acter, but of a mere local nature. It had been his misfortune since 
he had been there, when he had been advocating the interest of 
his own county, to differ from the majority. While he admitted 
that these petitions for new counties were got up by dishonest men 
and speculators in town lots, he did not believe that such was 
always the case; and where a case arose where a division would be 
proper, he thought the people should have the right to petition 
the Legislature in the matter. 

Mr. JENKINS inquired of the Chair whether there was any 
rule forbidding a committee when reporting to give reasons. He 
saw no such rule on the list before him. 

The CHAIR replied that there was, but it had been adopted 
after the rules had been printed. 

Mr. MARKLEY withdrew his amendment. 

Mr. LOGAN offered the following amendment to the instruc- 
tions: 

“And that no county shall be divided, or have any part thereof 
stricken off, without submitting the question to a vote of the 
people of the county, nor unless a majority of all the legal voters of 
the county shall vote for the same.” 

He thought the Convention should now decide the question. 

Mr. GEDDES offered an amendment to the amendment. 

Mr. WEST read an amendment, which the Chair ruled to be 


_ out of order at the time. 


Mr. SINGLETON said, he had come there to represent the 
interest of his constituents. He had come, not to consult their 
will but their interests. They would exercise their will themselves. 
He scarcely ever got up to address the Convention, but what he 
could read in the countenances of gentlemen, speeches upon 


_retrenchment—about the consumption of time. He did not care 


if it should occupy a month in discussing a question when he 
thought it demanded it. He thought the restricting the formation 
of new counties the best step in retrenchment. They did not see 
the dollars uppermost but they were in the back ground. The 
question of creating new counties had occupied much of the time 
of the Legislature. The resolution which had been before the Con- 


~ vention [had] originally come from his colleague, and the people of 


120 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


their county are much interested in the subject.—The people had © 
shown their opposition to the creation of more counties, and it 
was high time a stop was put to it. It was never too late to do 
good.—We are making roads every day, and we do not want the 
county seats changed or county lines altered. This matter costs 
the State every year $10,000, and he looked upon it as a most 
important item. It was a very little object what amount of time 
was consumed in the discussion of this subject; but when a man 
gets up here he is almost frowned down. What were they to do? 
When one of them should go home to his constituents, and they 
should ask him why he did not resist this or that proposition, 
must he say, “why, it was unpopular in the Convention to make ~ 
speeches, and I let it pass”? This was a perfect cut-throat policy. 

Mr. DAVIS, of Montgomery, said, he was in favor of the area 
being fixed at 400 square miles.—This would, if the counties were - 
all of that size, still allow them 140 counties. But he would be in 
favor of changing the instruction, so as to have the line to run 
within six miles of a county seat, if that would suit the gentleman 
who offered them. 

Mr. DAVIS, of McLean. Never in the world, sir. 

Mr. D., of Montgomery, resumed; when 

Mr. MARKLEY called him to order, as he had spoken before 
on the subject, and could not now if any other gentleman desired 
to speak. No member offering to speak, 

Mr. DAVIS said, that he would call the Convention to witness 
that he had never spoken more than fifteen minutes at a time, that 
he always spoke to the point and no more, and that if he violated 
any rule of order he did it unintentionally. . 

He considered that the people of the whole State were interested 
in this matter. The State expenses were increased with every 
new county. He did not view it in the same light with those 
gentlemen who spoke of the right of petition. We had come here 
to act in relation to the judiciary and Legislature, in both of which 
the people had an interest, and certainly by so doing they never 
thought it was depriving them of any rights. 

Mr. CHURCHILL wished to offer some homely, farmer-like 
reasons upon the subject. The county seats were often situated 
upon small streams, and it was frequently more convenient for 


FRIDAY, JUNE 178, 1847 121 


people to transact their business on the banks of those streams 
than in the interior. He was opposed to any law governing the 
location of the county seat. He might also speak of the prairies. 
Mr. C. then read a series of resolutions on the subject, which he 
would have offered if in order at the time. 

Mr. TURNBULL made a few remarks and then the Conven- 
tion adjourned till 3 P. m. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. GEDDES withdrew his amendment. 

Mr. LOGAN rose to explain the purport of his amendment. 
It was not a substitute for the original instructions, but an addi- 
tional one. The State of Illinois now had one hundred counties 
(and a population of 700,000,) nearly double the number New York 
had. She with a population of over two millions had but fifty-six 
counties. Pennsylvania had fifty-eight counties, and they were 
found sufficient for the administration of justice and the manage- 
ment of business. Our Legislature had been continually increasing 
the number of counties, sometimes with not more than 1,500 or 
2,000 souls in the county. The expenses were always increased 
by the formation of new counties, court houses to be built, officers 
to be paid, commissioners to be paid &c. There is danger that 
the Legislature will go on increasing the number, when there are 
now counties that have not sufficient revenue to pay the interest 
on their debt. The resolution reaches the desired object to some 
extent but not entirely. Even with this provision it will not 
prevent an increase. Four hundred square miles is a small 
county. Bond is a small county but it has timber and prairie 
land, and being well settled is very well. As the matter stood at 
present they might reduce an old county to a size which would 
not accord with the views of the people of that county. 

His amendment guarded against this. Suppose an old county, 


’ depending on the resources of the whole county, should build a 


large court house and other buildings, and there was a proposition 
to divide it, should the people of that county not have a right to 


‘say whether they were willing to divide or not? 


Mr. L. then reviewed the manner in which the petitions for a 
division of the counties were generally prepared, and urged the 


122 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI ONS 


adoption of his amendment. He concluded by saying, that he 
felt he was incurring no risk in saying that he was unwilling to 
give the Legislature no power to divide his county, without giving 
the people of that county the privilege of saying whether they 
desired the division or not. 

Mr. MASON said the question before them was, shall 400 
square miles be the area of all new counties to be hereafter formed. 
He was a member of the committee who had reported against this 
resolution, and he proceeded to give the reasons which had gov- 
erned the committee in reporting against the resolution. 

He stated that the committee had not acted hastily in the 
subject, but had given it much deliberation; they had thought it 
better to reject the area of 400 miles because it interfered with the 
townships, and there might be counties that would not contain 
that amount of territory, and yet would be fully entitled to 
organization. 

He continued this question at some length, and urged that 
population and not territory was the proper basis. 

Mr. DAVIS, of Massac, begged the gentleman from Sangamon 
to withdraw his amendment, and allow him to offer a substitute 
for the whole; which was done. 

Mr. D. said, that these propositions continually coming before 
the Legislature for the division of counties was a prolific source of 
evil. He had drawn up a substitute for the original instructions, 
and in doing so, had an eye to the constitution of Tennessee, in 
which was a clause of the same nature as the one now proposed. 
He had copied his substitute from that, making only such alter- 
ations as were necessary under the circumstances. The constitu- 
tion of Tennessee says, the boundary line shall not run within 
twelve miles of any county seat; he had substituted ten in his. 

That constitution says that two-thirdsofthe General Assembly — 
shall concur in making the division: in his substitute he had 
left the matter to the people of the county, and not to the Legis- 
lature. ' 

It had been argued that there should be no constitutional 
provision restraining the people in this question of dividing 
counties. Almost every State in the Union has thought it proper 
to restrain, by constitutional provision, the forming of new coun-— 


FRIDAY, JUNE 18, 1847 123, 


ties ad libitum. The constitution of Indiana asserts a general 
principle only, in relation to this matter. The constitution of 
Ohio provides that no new county shall be formed with a less area 
than 400 square miles; that of Tennessee limits the extent of 
territory at 350 square miles. And most of the States of the Union 
have similar provisions. And then the injustice of these changes 
of the county seats: a man buys land near the county seat, and 
pays more therefor than he would were the county seat not there, 
and the Legislature a few months afterwards moves the county 
seat, is it not an act of great injustice to that man? It is, and 
should not be tolerated, unless the people of that county had 
desired it. He should speak of those persons who got up petitions 
and come down here about the Legislature, hanging upon members 
to have divisions made, but others had said every thing required, 
and it needed no enforcement. 

Mr. D. then read some extracts from the constitution of Ten- 
nessee in relation to the subject. 

Mr. LOGAN said, he was afraid he had got himself into a 
scrape by withdrawing his amendment to enable the gentleman to 
offer his substitute. He was ready at any time to do almost any- 
thing any person asked him, but he would like very much to have 
the matter as it was before. 

Mr. DAVIS then withdrew his substitute, and the amendment 
of Mr. Locan was renewed. 

Mr. BLAIR addressed the Convention at some length in 
support of the restriction. 

Mr. CALDWELL offered to add to the amendment a proviso, 
that nothing therein should affect counties already created. 

Mr. BROCKMAN moved to lay the proviso on the table. 
Carried. 

Mr. KENNER offered an amendment to the amendment. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to lay the whole subject on the table— 
yeas 38, nays 113. Lost. 

The amendment to the amendment was then laid on the table. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved the previous question, 
which was seconded. 

Mr. McCALLEN (by leave) said he was a representative of a 
small county and much had been said about them. The people 


124 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI ONS 


in his county were patriotic enough to take the offices, no matter 
how small the salary. A gentleman had said that the delegates 
from large counties brought with them to conventions like this, 
more weight, respectability and dignity than those of the small 
counties. If so, he wanted his county raised to the dignity - 
standard. — ~ 

The amendment was then carried and the instructions as 
amended were adopted. 

Mr. DEMENT, from the committee on the Legislative 
Department, reported a resolution praying instructions to provide 
an amendment to the constitution, limiting the number of the 
General Assembly to 100 members;—25 senators and 75 repre- 
sentatives; and that they should divide the State into districts 
upon the basis of the census of 1845, their pay to be fixed at $2 
per day and the sessions limited to 60 days, and to hold their 
sessions once in 2 years. 

Mr. WORCESTER moved to strike out 25 and insert 20; 
strike out 75 and insert 60. 

Mr. SCATES moved to strike out 60 and insert 40. 

Mr. Z. CASEY was in favor of the lowest number named. — 
He was for economy, retrenchment and reform, in the proper sense 
of those words. We should incorporate it into every branch of 
the government. 

The great reform must be made in the legislative department; 
to that branch we trace all our evils. If we had had no Legislature 
for the last twelve years we would now be a happy and prosperous 
State. He had lost all confidence in an Illinois Legislature. If 
we reduced their number to 20 in the Senate and 40 in the House, 
one session in two years, and then to be limited to sixty days, their 
per diem fixed unalterably in the constitution, then we would 
have a business body. We would then be spared the curse of all — 
Legislatures—tocal legislation. It might be said that the number 
was too low for the dignity of the State. This was not so. He 
would compare the numbers 20 and 40, and our population with ~ 
the number of the General Assembly of New York, with a popula- 
tion of 2,650,000. In the Legislature of that State there were, in 
the House, 158 members, and 32 in the Senate. Our representa- 
tion, in proportion to the population and upon the same ratio, 


FRIDAY, JUNE 178, 1847 125 


would be 27 in the House and Senate in proportion. In no way 
could we insure economy and reform so well as by incorporating 
such a provision. He would rather give one vote for such a 
proposition than make twenty speeches on retrenchment. 

Mr. MINSHALL said, he did not know whether he should 
vote to strike out or not. He was much surprised to hear the 
motion to strike out 75 and insert a smaller number. He had 
always been taught from his youth that the House of Representa- 
tives—the popular branch—should be large; not so large as to be 
unwieldly [sic], but sufficiently large toavoid corruption. Illinois was 
always running from one extreme to the other. Forty is a very 
small number, and he thought the House should be large. They 
might make the Senate as small and aristocratic as they thought 
proper, but leave the House large. The gentleman had said he 
had lost all confidence in an Illinois Legislature. He would ask 
him if a small body of 40 could not more easily be corrupted than 
a larger one? He was willing to agree with the report of the com- 
mittee. 

Mr. WHITNEY advocated the report of the committee, and 
the number fixed by them. 

Mr. KITCHELL was in favor of the report of the committee, 
except so far as related to districting the State. This, he thought, 
should be left to the Legislature. 

Mr. ROUNTREE advocated a larger number than recom- 
mended by the committee. 

Mr. HARVEY thought the number fixed by the committee 
was about right. If the number should be fixed at 40, every 
representative would have a constituency of 20,000 persons; if 
fixed at 75, he would have something over 10,000. 

Mr. DEMENT said, that the committee had carefully weighed 
all the proposed numbers to constitute the Legislature. They had 
estimated the proportion of the population to each representative, 
according to the various numbers that had been submitted, and 
had, after due deliberation, and a careful enquiry into the many 
difficulties attending a smaller number, agreed upon what had 
been just reported. He continued this branch of the subject at 
much length. He also said that the cost of the State for the pay 
of the members and officers of the last Legislature had been 


6 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


$69,000; add to this, $1,800 for stationery, and some $230 for fuel, 
and it carried it over $70,000. The plan proposed, at $2 per day, 
and limiting the sessions at 60 days, the pay of the members and 
officers would amount to $11,778, a saving in this item alone, of 
$58,900. By fixing the pay of the members at $3 per day, the 
highest amount he had heard mentioned, there still, by adopting 
the other reforms proposed by the committee, would be a saving 
of $53,500; and this was not a small amount. 

Mr. D. continued the subject at considerable length, but owing 
to the late hour at which the Convention adjourned we are un- 
able to insert a more extended report of his remarks, which were 
listened to with great attention. 

The Convention then adjourned. 


XI. SATURDAY, JUNE 19, 1847 


The question pending at the adjournment yesterday was on 
striking out the words “twenty-five” and “‘seventy-five” in the 
resolution reported by Mr. Dement from the committee on 
the Legislative Department. This resolution provided that the 
General Assembly should consist of seventy-five representatives 
and twenty-five senators. 

} Mr. ARCHER said that he was constrained to concur with 
thecommittee and oppose the amendment. He was aware that the 
people were in favor of a reduction of the number of representa- 
tives, but he believed they were not prepared to sanction so great 
a reduction as that proposed by the gentleman from Jefferson, 
(Mr. Scares). He had great respect for the opinions of that 
gentleman, but he thought he (Mr. S.) was in advance of the 
public sentiment. 

Small bodies are more liable to corruption than larger bodies, 
whilst the latter are liable to prolong the sessions of the General 
Assembly and subject the State to heavy expenses. He thought 
these two extremes should be avoided, and that the number 
suggested by the committee was a proper medium between the 
two. He would rather have the General Assembly too large than 
too small, for the reason that popular liberty was the safest in the 
hands of a numerous representation. 

The State of New York had been referred to as an example, 
but he thought it was not applicable to our condition and State 
organization. In New York the population is more compact, and 
the number of counties much smaller than in Illinois. If we 

_ follow their example, one member will represent four or five 
counties, thus placing the representative at too great a distance 
from his constituents, which he thought was impolitic if not 
dangerous. 

If the number recommended by the committee is adopted, a 
reduction of sixty-two members will have been made, which re- 
duction, he thought, was all that the people expected or desired. 

127 


128 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


He thought that each county should have a representative, so that 
he may be acquainted, not only with a part, but all his constitu- 
ents, and faithfully represent their interests and reflect their will. 

Again, it is impolitic to go from one extreme to another. Here- 
tofore the General Assembly had been too large, and delay and 
excessive expenditures have been the consequence. Now it is 
proposed to reduce the number to sixty. He thought that the 
people were not prepared for sosudden and momentous a transition. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, that he thought the number 
proposed by the committee was too small. The great cry has 
always been that the Legislature was too large, and to this cause 
has been attributed many, if not most, of the evils which were 
known to exist. But this was not the source of these evils. They 
proceeded from the excessive power given to the Legislature. 
Mr. D. then spoke at some length about candidates for office and 
individuals seeking favors of the Legislature, hanging about the 
lobbies and consuming the time of members, and entangling them 
in schemes for individual benefit, to the detriment of the public 
interests. Let these things be guarded against and there will be 
no complaints about delay and expense. 

He hoped that there would be a county representation, so that 
the larger counties could not overshadow the smaller. The organ- 
ization of the United States Senate was based upon this principle. 
If, said Mr. D., New York, Pennsylvania and Ohio, had a repre- 
sentation in the Senate according to their population they would 
almost have the entire control of the Union. He asked if it might 
not operate in some such way here, if the representation should 
be based upon population alone. Could not the larger cities and 
towns on the lakes and navigable rivers overshadow the less popu- 
lous and more humble neighboring counties? 

We should have an eye to the future as well as the present. 
In 1840, we had 250,000 inhabitants; in 1845 we had 700,000. Is 
it right to fix the apportionment to suit these counties that are 
settled, leaving those that are not settled unprovided for. He 
was opposed to giving large counties an undue and unjust power 
over smaller ones, and he advocated a larger number than that 
recommended by the committee. 

Mr. DALE said, there was so great a difference in the views of 


SATURDAY, JUNE 19, 1847 ‘129 


gentlemen, as to the number of which the General Assembly should 
consist, varying from 80 to 120, some members desiring even 
greater numbers than these, and some less, that the committee, 
by way of conciliation, adopted a medium number and reported 
to this convention the number of one hundred. 

The last General Assembly having been composed of 162 
members, the reduction to one hundred, as proposed by the report, - 
would be a reduction of more than one-third of the number which 
composed the last General Assembly. 

This is, indeed, a great stride in the system of retrenchment; 
and if this number should be adopted by the Convention, as also 
the recommendation of the same committee as to the pay of 
members of the Legislature, there would be a saving to the State, 
at each session of the Legislature, of near sixty thousand dollars; 
a sum, which though small, yet if properly expended, would go 
some way towards retrieving the credit of the State. 

But though the saving, by this retrenchment of the number in 
the General Assembly, should be large, yet if this saving is effected, 
by losing sight of, or trenching upon the first principles of repre- 
sentative republics, it were a saving of doubtful expediency. In 
the legislation of these governments the views, wishes and feelings 


_of the people should be fully and properly represented. This can 


be done only by allowing to each county at least one representative. 

The intercourse and acquaintance of the people with each other 
are, most generally, limited and bounded by county lines. They 
attend at the county seats of their own counties, courts, meetings, 
conventions, &c., and by constant intercourse and interchange of 
views and sentiments, they so assimilate, that frequently county 
lines are the lines of opposite views, habits and wishes. 

In order, then, to a proper representation, each county should 
have its representative. Our State, however, is, unfortunately 
cut up into small counties, that such a representation might be 
considered unwieldly and burthensome; and as it is highly probable 
that no larger number will be adopted by this convention, and as 
the division between the two houses, of the number reported by 
the committee, seems to be in proper proportion, he should sus- 
tain the report of the committee. But,fat the same time, he would 
say, that when this matter comes properly before the people, and 


130 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


those counties which, under former apportionments, were always 
entitled to a separate representative, shall, to elect one represent- 
ative, find themselves attached to smaller counties, and those 


smaller counties shall find their votes swallowed up in the votes of — 


the larger counties, there will be complaint. 


As, however, an amendment may hereafter be made, provid ng 
for an increase of this number when the people may vote for such 
an increase, he would forego his wishes and feelings and vote in 
favor of the committee’s report . 


Mr. BROCKMAN said, that he was opposed to the amend- 
ment. He advocated a large representation. Every county 
ought to have a representative. He thought that the Convention 
should have an eye to those who should come after us. Geography, 
said Mr. B., does not present a richer valley than that of the 
Mississippi, and there is no State in that valley equal to Illinois. 
It possesses a variety of climate and soil unparalleled. It has 
also a variety of interests which must be attended to, or we shall 
descend into an aristocracy. 


We have a State capable of sustaining a population of 18,000,- 
ooo. Massachusetts had a population of ninety souls to the 
square mile. In the same ptoportion Illinois would sustain a 
population of 5,000,000. Is the number proposed by the amend- 
ment sufficient to represent 5,000,000? Would one representative 
to 60,000 or 70,000 souls be sufficient? By this system one 
member would represent six or seven bodies corporate. It has 
been proposed to increase the number of county commissioners, 
because three men cannot do the business, yet in the same breath 
it is proposed to lessen the number of representatives. He saw 
no propriety or wisdom in this. 


If each county shall not be provided with a representative, 
none but lawyers can get into the Legislature. They travel from 
county to county, and possess facilities for extending their 
acquaintance, which are entirely out of the reach of farmers and 
other classes, whose pursuits confine them at home on their farms 
and in their shops. If each county is allowed a representative, 
individuals, other than lawyers, can find their way to the Legis- 
lature, for they will be well known throughout their own county. 


* 
i ate ieee 


SATURDAY, JUNE 179, 1847 131 


Mr. McCALLEN advocated at some length the adoption of 
the county representative system. 


[Mr. McCALLEN said he did not rise to inflict a speech upon 
the Convention, but briefly to give his views upon the matter 
now under consideration, for he regarded it as being a subject of 
momentous import to the welfare of the people. It seemed to be 
the disposition of every gentleman in the Convention to carry out 
what they were pleased to term retrenchment and reform. He 
would be sorry to doubt the sincerity of gentlemen; he was dis- 
posed to attribute to them the same honesty of purpose, the same 
generosity of motive which he claimed for himself. But, continued 
Mr. McCa ten, are they not mistaken in the means by which 
this economy and this retrenchment are to be brought about? 

It seems to be the disposition of the majority, to leave all the 
important questions which are discussed here open for the decision 
of the people themselves, or for the future action of the legislature. 
What, sir, was it that caused the people to call us together? Was 
it not to settle these questions? To settle and determine princi- 
ples at least? Why then will not gentlemen take the responsibil- 
ity of settling those questions which they were sent here to 
determine; and embody them in the constitution? Gentlemen have 
assembled here to remedy certain evils, yet they seem most 
anxious to shift the responsibility from their shoulders, for fear, 
perhaps, that they might not be able to return again. 

With all due deference to the Hon. member from Jefferson, 
(for there is not a member in this assembly who has a more ex- 
alted opinion of his patriotism, and his distinguished talents, than 
I have; but is not the gentleman as liable to err as some of the 
rest of us?) I entirely disagree with that honorable gentleman, 
in regard to his proposed reduction of the General Assembly. 
The proposition which the gentleman is in favor of, as I under- 
stood him, is that the legislature shall be reduced to forty mem- 
bers in the House and twenty in the Senate, in order that we may 
retrench and economize the expenses of this government. Might 
not the expenses of the government be better retrenched, and 
economized, by setting limits to the action of theglegislature? 
By saying to the legislature, thus far thou shalt go, and no farther? 


132“: ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


If we contend for the principle of a democratic, responsible gov- 
ernment, let us carry it out; and I ask this convention, if that 
principle can be carried out, by limiting the representation in this. 
hall to forty members? If it can, I am prepared to go still further 
_ than the gentleman from Brown, who preceded me in this debate. 
If forty members can do the business of this State, if the great 
and important interests of the people can be intrusted to so small 
a number,—why not bring it down at once to the standard of . 
Napoleon’s republic; reduce it to a council of three, and have an 
aristocratic government, an oligarchy at once? It has been very 
properly suggested here, that the interests of the smaller counties 
will be swallowed up by the greater, in the indulgence of that love 
of power which is inherent in the human breast; that as nothing 
but an imaginary line divides them, the interests of the smaller 
counties will be absorbed and swallowed up by the larger. True, 
sir, there is danger; and yet within those lines there are feelings 
of local interest, feelings which attach every man to his own 
county.—The same feeling which produces State pride, or pride 
of country, will operate in regard to counties. State lines are 
merely imaginary, yet who does not hold his own State first in his 
affections? The same principle will hold good when we refer to 
Europe; imaginary lines, only, separate nations, and yet those 
nations are arrayed in hostile attitude against each other. Sir, 
if you would in accordance with your professions, protect the 
rights of the weak against the encroachments of the powerful, 
then let your small counties be protected in the enjoyment of 
their privileges. Each county in itself possesses a kind of minor 
sovereignty; that sovereignty should be represented, and respect- 
ably represented in this house. It is said that gentlemen who 
came from small counties, should not be entitled to the same 
respect and consideration as those who represent larger ones. If 
this is to be the decree regarding this thing, let gentlemen openly 
avow it. Let them not come here sailing under false colors. Let 
them not come here under the color of democracy, and say that 
that class to which I belong, those whom they opprobriously style 
“‘blue light federalists,’’ and ‘‘Mexican whigs,’’ are those who — 
are trampling on the rights and interests of the people. Let them 
come out under their true colors, and if they are disposed to pro- 


ny 
1 ie 


SATURDAY, JUNE 79, 1847 133 


tect the interests of the great mass of the democracy of this 
country, let them show it by acts and not by words. I am clearly 
of opinion with the gentleman from Brown, that should we adopt 
this policy, and reduce the number of representatives to forty, it 
will drive from these halls the representatives of that very class, 
on whose behalf so much is said, and so many professions made; 


it will prevent the hard-fisted yeomanry of the country from ever 


attaining a seat in your legislative halls. It will shut out from 
participating in the legislation of the State the farmer, the me- 
chanic, and if you please the merchant, whose interest and whose 
welfare are preached from every stump. Another class of men 
must fill your legislature, if this principle be adopted; and what 
class will it be? 

It has been truly remarked by the gentleman from Brown, 


that it will be the lawyers, the nabobs of the country; men who 


can roll in their coaches; whilst the poor man, the farmer, the 
mechanic, though he may have the embryo talent lurking in his 
brain of a Clay, a Webster, or a Calhoun, is ruthlessly deprived 
of all chance of ever arriving at that niche in the temple of fame, 
which his inherent talent would otherwise give him the capability 
of attaining. If we are going to be democratic, let us give every 
county in the State a representative-—But, perhaps, gentlemen 
have promised reform, which they now find it somewhat incon- 
venient to carry out; they have promised more, perhaps, than it 
is agreeable to them to carry out. 

For my own part, I came here bound by no pledges; I am free 
as the air of heaven. That I am honored with a seat here, is but 
the triumph of the principles by which I am governed, and not 
because I was willing to subscribe to what appeared to be the 
wishes of a majority. Rather than beg a seat here, in order to 
carry out doctrines which I disapproved, rather than do this, I 
would dig my political grave deeper than the very caves of the 
ocean. The people whom I have the honor to represent are not 
willing that their right of suffrage—that their right of represen- 
tation here, should be balanced against a paltry sum of dollars 
and cents. There are questions arising, and always will be, in 
the progress of the development of the resources of this country, 
and in the further arrangement of the State, that will require local 


Oa a 


134 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


legislation; and is there a county, in view of this fact, that will 
not be willing to pay the expenses of a member, rather than be 
deprived of the services of a representative in the legislature? 
And another great difficulty which has been raised by many gen- 
tlemen on this floor, is this sectional feeling, this county pride. 
Range two or three of these counties side by side—let them send 
one representative to the legislature, and which among them will 
be most neglected?—Undoubtedly the smallest. The main in- 
terest of the whole will be laid aside, party politics even will be 
laid aside, and these local questions are the ones that will 
be agitated. These are not freaks of the imagination. I come from 
a county which never sent a representative to the legislature, and 
_ it was only by a piece of good fortune that your humble servant 
obtained a seat here. |A laugh.] Though I would be decidedly 
opposed to a curtailment of the representation, yet if gentlemen 
persist in curtailing down to the small number. proposed, for the 
purpose of economizing—if a saving of dollars and cents is to be 
the word—I will go further than they. I will say clothe your 
executive with imperial functions, put the imperial crown upon’ 
his head, and carry out your doctrine in its utmost rigor. Deny 
the people the right of representation in the legislature,—send 
forth from this august body a constitution that will give to your 
large counties clustered around the centre the full power of the 
whole State, and I pledge you my life that the people will respond 
to your acts in a way that will be most unwelcome. The people’s 
rights are not to be bought and sold. 
But gentlemen may enquire, what would be my proposition. 
If we must have a conservative department in this government, 
in order to check the power of the others; make the most numerous 
body of the legislature that conservative department; let the 
sovereignty of every county in the State, which is able to carry 
on a county government be represented; then, select your Sen- 
ators according to the population of the country. It has been 
justly remarked by the gentleman from Bond, that the conserva- 
tive character of the Senate of the United States has more than 
once saved this republic; and I entirely concur with the gentleman. 
Give the numerous body of the legislature this conservative power 
and we shall save perhaps the character of this rapidly growing 


SATURDAY, JUNE 79, 1847 135 


State. Concentrate the power around the capital of the State, 
and you at once have a civil government, more odious in its char- 
acter than was ever the consolidated government of Santa Anna; 
the bordering counties having no more voice in the legislature 
than if placed beyond the Mississippi; swallowed up by the con- 
solidated power collected around your capitol.—Is this what the 
people expect from a democratic convention? Is this the kind 
of democratic doctrine which gentlemen come here to advocate? 
Do they not place themselves in the position of the Jay, who had 
borrowed the feathers of the Peacock? Let me tell the gentle- 
men, there is a breeze of intelligence sweeping over the broad 
savannah’s of this land, that will scatter their brilliant plumes and 
leave them in their naked deformity. Principles will be test 
words, and party names will be unknown. I do not intend to 
consume much of the time of the Convention; I did not come here, 
as I said on another occasion, deeply learned in the law, yet my 
constituents thought me not unworthy of a seat in this assembly, 
and whenever their interests are to be sacrificed upon the alter of 
penuriousness, than I am to be found battling in their cause. I 
am not going to sit quietly in my seat, and see the little county 
which bears the name of that glorious hero, who shed his blood 
upon the field of Buena Vista, sacrificed to serve the purposes of 
the democracy of the State.]?! 


Mr. LOUDON said, that he had just come into the Convention, 
and desired to say a few words on the question, though he did not 
exactly know what the question was. His constituents were 
interested in the matter. He had long thought of the matter. It 
had occurred to him in days past that the Legislature was entirely 
too large. He had heard the people say so, particularly in the 
‘south part of the State. Their sessions were entirely used for 
log-rolling, &c., which took up a great deal of time, and, therefore, 
the sessions were too long. He was for a sufficient number, in the 
Legislature, to carry on the business of government and no more. 
So far as his county was concerned, he was satisfied that not one 
could be found who was not in favor of reducing the number to 


] oe account of McCallen’s speech is taken from the Sangamo Journal, 
une 22. 


136 


50 in the House and 25 in the Senate. The committee had 
reported 75 and 25, and he did not know but that he would vote 
for striking out. He lived in a small county which would lose a ~ 
representative, and he had the best feeling for his county and her 

people, but still he would vote to reduce the number of represent- 
atives. It might be said that Illinois required a greater number 
in her Legislature to represent the interests of all her people; but ‘ 
he would introduce the State of Tennessee, who [sic] had a much ~ 
larger population than Illinois, and a much smaller representation 
in her Legislature. Much had been said of retrenchment, and 
he was of opinion that this was a proper way to make it; in fact, 
the only way to retrench the expenses of the State was to curtail 
the number of representatives in the Legislature, then reduce their 
per diem, and then there would be a great saving to the State. 
This was the only way that it could be done. He had introduced 
a resolution some weeks ago on this subject, which had expressed 
his views and the views of his constituents. A 


But there was apparently a great anxiety, on the part of some 
gentlemen, that if the number of representatives should be 
reduced, and several counties put into one district, that they 
would never get back to the Legislature. He lived in a small 
county, and one which, if this reduction should pass, would lose a 
representative, yet he would rather have the honor to represent — 
three or four counties than one. It was no great thing to 
get into the Legislature! Much better to keep out of it. If he 
could get elected from a large district, composed of several good 
sized and respectable counties, why, then he would consider himself — 
a respectable member. 


It was all a chance to get into the Legislature anyhow. Ifa 
man was respectable and popular in his own county now, and 
would do everything to keep up that character after he was put 
into a large district, and let the people then see him and know 
him, he would stand the same chance, and might be elected. 
Gentlemen should not be afraid. Young men who are now 
squirming and trembling about the loss of their chances to get 
back to the Legislature, should remember that the old ones will — 
die, and get other places, &c., and that they will, in time, have 


SATURDAY, JUNE 19, 18477 137 


all the chances. Many who are now in will die, and they will be 

elected to fill their places. That was his only hope. 

Mr. PINCKNEY said, that if those gentlemen who were afraid 
_ of not getting back to the Legislature would quietly wait till the 


old ones would die, it would be the better course. He did not 


know how others felt, but for himself he had not been much 
enlightened by the speeches of gentlemen upon the principles 
upon which governments were formed, and even if they had gone 
back to Greece and Rome, and informed us how their governments 
had been established, he did not think the result would be much 
_ different. He had read all about them in his youth, but did not 
think he could enlighten the Convention upon the subject at 
present. 

His reasons for rising at all were to have a vote upon the 
question at once. He would prefer the number to be 80 instead 
of 75, and that number, he was of opinion, was not too large, but 
he did not desire to have the number more than that. He thought 
but little of the argument that small bodies were more easily 
corrupted than large ones. If this were the case, how came it 
that the people themselves were corrupted when they met ev 
masse. They were there swayed to and fro by some one man— 
an orator—who, by appealing to their feelings and passions, 
carried them like a wave backward and forward. If the number 
and pay be reduced, it is said that poor men will not be able to 
canvass the districts. Well, he did not care if men never can- 
vassed the districts, making stump speeches, log-rolling, and using 
every means to procure their election. He would not care if this 
were all broken up. The people of his county were willing to pay 
men a reasonable compensation for their services in the Legisla- 
ture—not too high nor too low. 

Mr. WORCESTER withdrew his motion to strike out the 
numbers proposed by the committee and insert less ones. 

Mr. SCATES advocated the motion made yesterday by him 
to strike out the numbers proposed by the committee. In doing 
so he said, that he hoped no one desired to “question” gentlemen 
down who were disposed to present their views to the Convention 
on this subject. He was astonished to hear gentlemen say, when 
great constitutional questions were before them, that there ought 


138 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


to be no more discussion. He had objected, last week, to long — 


discussion upon a very trifling matter of dollars and cents. But 
now, gentlemen who have spoken themselves, like a man after a 


feast, think no one hungry because they are satisfied. Gentlemen — 


had also indulged in personal remarks, in sarcasm, and ridicule of 
those whom they were disposed to silence. He had shared largely 
in these. In reply, he had only to say, as Job said to his com- 
forters, ‘miserable comforters ye are,” and he would add, with 
Job, also, “‘ye are the people and wisdom will die with you.” His 
colleague (Mr. Z. Casey) had been made to say, by one of the 
gentlemen who had spoken, that he had lost all confidence in an 
Illinois Legislature because they had become corrupt. His 
colleague did not say that he had lost all confidence in the Legis- 
lature because it was corrupt. He (Mr. S.) had lost all confidence 
in an Illinois Legislature, because he had lost confidence in its 
ever adopting retrenchment and reform; he had lost confidence in 
it because of its organization. He had no confidence in it when 
it went on increasing its number till it had reached 162. 

Mr. MINSHALL explained, that he had put no such construc- 
tion upon the language of the gentleman from Jefferson. 

Mr. SCATES. Let it pass, then, I so understood the gentle- 
man to represent my colleague. When interrupted, he was about 


saying that he had known candidates for the Legislature to canvass ~ 


their counties, and pledge themselves to carry out retrenchment 
and reform, and to be elected. Yet these same men, who, when’ 
they came here, were resolved to carry out their pledges, have 
been voted down, and, until finding they were unable to do so, 
have abandoned the object. When he saw this, he could well say 
that he had lost all confidence in the Legislature. The Legislature 
was too large, and he greatly feared that in this body of 162 
members it would be found impracticable to carry out the prin- 
ciples of economy and retrenchment. When he had opposed the 
scheme to economize one-half dollar in the pay of the clerks and — 
doorkeepers of this House, he did so because he did not think it 
was in our power to pass a resolution of the kind, and that the 
subject was too insignificant. Now there was a great opportunity 
to introduce retrenchment into the government, and gentlemen 
who had made speeches then upon economy had now an oppor- 


q 
# 
a 


wy : 
SATURDAY, JUNE 19, 1847 139 


tunity of showing their sincerity. Let them vote for. the smallest 
number. He was told that Illinoians were too proud to pay a 
poll tax. This pride would be our ruin. When we propose to 
economize in the legislative department we are told that the 
people of Illinois are too proud to submit; that they will never 
consent to mingle counties into districts, and that the county lines 
must be kept up. And this, too, when we were not in a condition 
to pay the interest on our debt. He was prepared to show that 
we could add to the funds for the liquidation of our debt, by this 
proposed reduction of the number and pay of the members of the 
Legislature, and that, too, in considerable amount, without any 
increase of taxation—The expenses of the last Legislature 
amounted—including per diem, mileage, printing of laws, station- 
ery, fuel and other expenses—to $77,659.59.—This was for 
the Legislature composed of 162 members. Now the question 
was, how much could we retrench of this sum, without injuring 
the public interest? Mr. S. then read several tabular statements 
showing the reduction in the amount of expenses of the Legislature 
that would follow the adoption of a smaller delegation, and the 
annual saving to the State. We give the substance. The cost 
of a session of the Legislature, composed of 60 members, allowed 
$2 per day—session limited to 60 days—would be $13,766.14. 
This compared with the last Legislature would be a deduction of 
$63,872.91. The printing would be reduced, the stationery 
and the number of laws would be reduced. Thus there would be 
an annual saving of over $31,891, to go to the payment of our 
interest on the State debt, without any further taxation. The 
expenses, at the same rates, of a house of 70 members, would be 
$15,500—and the saving would be about $30,000 a year. At 80 
in the Legislature, the expenses would be $16,500, and the annual 
saving would be nearly $30,000.—Fix the number at 100 members, 
and the cost would be $19,000, a yearly saving of $28,500. This 
was a considerable saving, which, under the present circumstances 
of the State, it was very desirable should be made. 
But if gentlemen would calculate the difference between 
the cost and expense that would be incurred by having one hundred 
_members in the Legislature, with that of the number proposed by 
him—sixty—they would find that in thirty years it would amount 


A tat “ew Fi 
- ie. ¢ ee 
Ln ee Me Ara 


140 _ ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


to $144,000. He had no hopes that in thirty years our debt would © 
be paid, yet he thought that our creditors would be rejoiced to 
hear that in that time they would receive that amount. Suppose 
they were to ask us, would we not pay them $140,000 in thirty — 
years, would not we be glad to have it in our power to promise 
them we would? They are now here in the lobby looking upon ~ 
your actions, they are watching whether we will suffer any oppor- 


¥, 


tunity of saving money to pay them their dues to pass by without — 
embracing it. Look at them and think of the large claims they } 
hold against the State, and forget your constituents—Do not 
oppose it because you have too much pride to allow your 
county to lose a representative. Gentlemen say that 60 
members cannot legislate for the whole State of Illinois; cannot 
represent her different interests. How do seven members in 
Congress so well represent this large area of territory and advance ~ 
the interests of the people? When they say that one man cannot ~ 
know and represent the sentiments of several counties is not 
correct, if so, what becomes of the propriety of your present sena- _ 
torial districts? New York has an extent of territory of 47,000 — 
square miles, but little less than our own. We have a population © 
of 670,000, and New York has 1,968,000. New York has fixed as — 
a ratio of representation 11,000 to a delegate. She has a popula- 
tion of 43 to a square mile. Illinois has only 3. Her legislature - 
is composed of only 163 members to represent her large and — 
diversified interests. She has agricultural, manufacturing and 
commercial interests. We have but one—agriculture. Our popu-— 
lation is not so diversified, we have but little mechanical, and 
comparatively no manufacturing interests. We have but one 
principal interest to be represented, and that is agriculture. 
Gentlemen have cited New York as a model. They were willing — 
to follow New York in every thing. If New York adopts a bad 
system of general banking, they immediately gave up and adopted 
it. N. York had adopted it and the matter was settled. New — 
York had a vast amount of revenue arising from the canals; it had 

a large amount of taxable property. Illinois had not been, and 

at the present time was not, able to pay the interest on its 
debt. She was emphatically able to owe it. He would call their 

attention to the State of New Jersey, which had a population of 


<< 


4 SATURDAY, JUNE 19, 1847 141 
i 520,000, and she has a limit in her constitution upon the number 
A of her Legislature to 60. Is New Jersey in debt, or unwilling to 
__ pay whatsheowes, or suspected ofa design to swindle her creditors? 
_ No; but she has thought proper to guard against a too large and 

_ extravagant Legislature, and is an example we might safely follow. 
’ Pennsylvania has provided that her legislative body shall not 
_ exceed one hundred. Are we willing under our circumstances to 
_ goup to the same limit with the great State of Pennsylvania, with 
so many diversified interests. We are still issuing large 
: numbers of Auditor’s warrants to pay these members, they are 
floating all over the State at a depreciated value. You may 
knock in vain at the doors of your treasury for their redemption. 
_ And now there will be a large amount, say $50,000, issued to pay for 
_ this Convention. And gentlemen are talking of paying the 
_ State debt, when they are unwilling to reduce the number of the 
Legislature, and reduce the fast growing amount of Auditor’s 
warrants. Let us go to another State that has prospered under 
her legislation, and which would be a more proper model for us 
than New York. Go to Ohio. A State with a large population 
‘engaged in agriculture, literature, commerce and every branch of 
trade. Her march has been onward. And she has limited her 
Legislature to seventy-two—I am told it is eighty-two. Admit 
it, but compare her population to the square mile with ours; her 
prosperity with ours; and the number of her Legislature with ours. 

_ The constitution of that State says the number may be as low as 36. 
If we follow the example of any State, I think we should follow 
that State. Indiana has limited her number to one hundred. 
Shall we step at once to the maximum? Let gentlemen 
adopt the lowest number now, and let the Legislature advance to 
the maximum when our population shall have increased and our 
State has not creditors. Louisiana has an immense commerce 
compared with Illinois, yet this State—the great cotton State— 
has fixed her maximum at sixty-four members of the Legislature. 
And we are scouted at when we propose to reduce our number to 
the same. Alabama has fixed the limit of her Legislature to one 
hundred, and I believe is now legislating with a less number. 
That State has a territory of 50,000 square miles. The State of 

_ Maine has a larger ratio of representatives than any State in the 


pr 


142 


Union. Her limit is not below one hundred, nor above two 
hundred; but in that State, and I believe in most of the New 


or county paying all expenses of the members. Arkansas has 
limited the number to one hundred.—Missouri, too, has adopted 


the same number. She is larger in territory than Illinois, and — 
though her population is less, the interests of her people are more — 


England States, they allow every town a representative, the town ; 


: 


ne 


q 


diversified. She has a larger commercial and a mineral inter-— 
est to be represented. He thought that if because the State 
had been heretofore cut up into an extravagant number of counties — 
we were to allow each county a representative in the Legislature, — 


we had better go to work and organize the State over again. Did 


you notice the touchiness of the gentleman from Hardin? A 
county that has ever had a representative will never surrender it; — 


the people are too proud to submit to it. Illinoians had become 


so proud because they had had a chance to fight and fought well, — 


that they won’t pay taxes, is another fact of the gentleman. They 
had been favored with panegyrics upon their brave who had 
fallen, and upon the fighting of their troops. Fighting was one 
thing and paying taxes another; and collectors when they called 
on the people for the amount of their tax would not be put off by 
these answers, which gentlemen put into their mouths. Our 
character, as a State anxious and desirous to adopt every means 
in our power to pay our debt, will be served abroad by our reducing 
the number of our Legislature, and the amount of our expenses. 
I hope, for the saving of $144,000 in thirty years—the probable 
length of time this constitution will continue in force—gentlemen 
will adopt the number I have proposed. It is also said, that 
members won’t serve for $2 a day; they get men in the State of 
Kentucky to perform the duties of legislators for that sum. The 
expenses of the last Legislature are yet unpaid, the warrants for 
them are in circulation yet; moreover, there were $100,000 appro- 
priated besides, by the Legislature, all of which are yet out and 
unpaid. 

We could easily see the reduction that could be made, were we 
to have a called session. 

The people of my county say the Convention was called too 
soon; that the day of confirmation is fixed too soon, and I would 


es 
a : 
Me 


SATURDAY, JUNE 19, 1847 143 


prefer that the election should take place so as the result might be 


‘known just before the August elections of next year. He hoped 
_ the Convention would, in justice to the honor of the State, and to 


wipe off the suspicion of a design to cheat that now hangs over us, 
go for the reduction of the number. Now is the time. All the 


people demand it. All speak of retrenchment, and here is an 


opportunity to accomplish it. 

Mr. HARDING. The county I represent has a desire to have 
a representative in the Legislature. The last number proposed 
will deprive us of all chance of amember. We have a population 
of 6,000 and the Legislature has attached us to Knox county. 
Knox county has a population of 10,000, and they give her one 
member. Knox and Warren are entitled to one member, and we 
have to depend-on the magnanimity of the people of Knox whether 
we ever have a member from our county or not. Population is 
not the fairest basis of representation, it should be taxation and 
territory. All counties have an interest as counties—a county 
interest, and it should be represented. Sangamon, for instance, 
has an interest, a county interest, a Sangamon interest, which is 
very different from that of any other county. They, in apportion- 
ing, throw the fraction from large counties and attach it to a 
smaller county, and this is unfair. The gentleman from Jefferson 
may well speak of reducing the representation. His county has 
two representatives, and pays but $1,250a year for taxes. Warren 
county pays $4,000. Jackson county pays $1,800 for taxes and 
has a representative and a half, we pay $4,000 and have none. Let 
every county have one member. Go to Pennsylvania, her con- 
stitution says that every county shall have a representative, no 
matter what the population is. Take Cook county, I can see the 
time when Chicago will have a population of 100,000, and then 
take a small agricultural county which has no representative, but 
is thrown in with Cook, what chance of the agricultural interest 
being represented there? 

Jackson and Williamson counties have a large extent of terri- 
tory but they pay no tax. The rule of putting several counties 
into one senatorial district, is well enough, because the Senate is 
the conservative branch. 

Give every county a representative, and you will avoid all 


144 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


complaints about gerrymandering. A large extent of territory — 
requires a larger representation than a large population. The 
Legislature is to make laws for all the counties, and if the small — 
counties are deprived of their representatives, they have no voice — 
in the assessment of taxes. In the proposed plan property is 
thrown out of view. He who has property has an interest in the — 
country, and the greater part of the taxes comes from the landhold ~ 
interest. There are those who are engaged in professions and other ~ 
occupations who derive large incomes and who pay no taxes, but — 
are fully represented under the population basis. _ _ 

Mr. LOUDON said, he must reply to some of the remarks of — 
the gentleman who had been somewhat personal. He said prop- — 
erty should be the basis of representation. He steps down to 
Jackson and Williamson and there makes some calculations; he — 
then steps up to Cook and there was quite unfortunate. If he — 
carries his principle of a property representation intooperationas a 
basis, he would, standing alongside Cook county, soon find himself — 
like a musquito [sic] in the stern wheel of a steamboat. He 
(Mr. L.) was from a poor county, and was one of the poorest of the } 
poor in that county, yet, he, and the people of his county, were 
perfectly willing to run the chance of being united with other 
countiesand of having a joint representative. Gentlemen should go 
into the canvass then as into a game, take all the chances, enter into 
the spirit of the game. Let him present himself as a candidate; the 
people will ask him is he qualified to go to the Legislature. He 
answers, I think I am; then the people will say, we'll examine you 
and see if you are. Let him go then into the contest, and if he 
struggles, if he has hope, even as large as a grain of mustard seed, 
he can remove anything, he can remove mountains. Let him go 
to Williamson county, and he will find that there are as many 
there, who are as anxious to go to the Legislature as anywhere else. 
Don’t be discouraged; don’t be frightened at the chances of not 
getting back. The argument of gentlemen don’t hold good, sup- 
pose you do give every county a representative, the large counties 
will then have more—two or three—in proportion and the small 
counties will be in exactly the same minority. No man repre- 
senting several counties dare neglect to represent the interests of 
the small ones. 


SATURDAY, JUNE 10, 1847 146 


He need not be afraid of gerrymandering, there will not be any 


‘more of that in one way than in another. Though Williamson 


county is poor and her population is small, she has raised some 
cute chaps, who, when they grow up, move off into other parts of 


the State and become rich; they cannot get rich down there. Let 


them put Williamson county along with some others and give them 
all one representative, why, there will be a number of candidates 
from all countiés, and the longest pole will knock the most per- 
simmons. All the people required was a sufficient number in the 


Legislature to do the business, and a surplus was just as great a 


nuisance as any other article on a man’s hands for which there 
was no demand. 

A motion was made to adjourn till Monday next. 

Mr. CHURCHILL demanded the yeas and nays. Which were 
ordered. 

Mr. HURLBUT and others appealed to him to withdraw the 
demand, that the object was to enable the committees to hold 
their meetings; the demand not being withdrawn, the motion was 


‘withdrawn, and the Convention adjourned till 3 Pp. m. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. WHITNEY differed from the gentleman who had said 
there was a manifest desire on the part of the Convention to close 
the debate on the question. He thought not. Retrenchment 


and reform had been sounded in his ears so much, had been the 
subject of so many gentlemen’s speeches, that he even heard 


retrenchment and reform at the corner of the streets. It was now 
proposed to carry out retrenchment and reform by depriving the 
people of the right of representation, the grand characteristic of a 
free government, and the most sacred of all privileges, and that 


for the purpose of paying the public debt in thirty years. He was 


certain the people would pay every dollar of the debt; they were 
anti-repudiators; they desired to pay it, but not by giving up their 


right of representation. He did not think that the debt could be 


paid in thirty years, nor would any one there now, who might live 
thirty years, see the debt paid. He was no repudiator, he paid 
his taxes and would continue to do so, but would never consent to 
give up any of the people’s right to be heard in their legislative 


146 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS _— 


halls. He was opposed at the time, to the passage of the act by 
which that debt had been created. It had been said that it was 
unwise legislation. He thought so too, but knowing well the 
manceuvering that had been practised by people about here to — 
procure the passage of that bill, he was greatly of opinion that the 
Legislature that made the law was not only unwise but a little 
corrupt. Unwise they certainly were. He did not care if the 
State creditors were in the lobby looking at the acts of the Conven- 
tion. He had heard the same cry before, when the great internal 
improvement bill was before them. Then it was said that the 
capitalists were here in the lobby with the money in their hands 
and that the eyes of the world were upon us to see if we would be ~ 
such fools as to let that opportunity pass by, of enriching our State 
by means of canals and railroads, &c. I am unwilling, even for — 
the purpose of paying the debt, to say that a republican form of 
government shall be abandoned. To forego the right of repre- 
sentation to pay men, who were as much to blame for the creation 
of that debt as we are. How are we to save this $144,000 in 
thirty years?—by cutting down the number of representatives of 
the people? He would not even say he was willing to cut down 
the pay of the members of the Legislature to $2 a day—$2 a day 
in Auditor’s warrants! Farmers and mechanics who may come 
here cannot afford to pay for board equal to what they have on 
their own table, at that rate. He would go for restricting the 
amount they should receive each session.. If gold and silver were 
paid, then there might be something saved, but not when they 
were paid in Auditor’s warrants. I hope to see no longer the 
sheriffs running about the counties, buying up the Auditor’s 
warrants with the gold and silver they received from the people’s 
pockets for taxes, and then making returns in the warrants. New 
York had been cited. N. Y. was his native State and he loved her, 
but he loved Illinois more; if a good plan was proposed he did not 
care where it [had] come from. New York has 128 members in 
the lower house, and they are apportioned by territory. She has 
fifty-nine counties and each county has one representative, then — 
after that population is the basis, and 37,680 is the ratio for 
representatives. When I first came here I lived in Peoria, and 
our represe[n]tative had so great an extent of territory to repre- 


SATURDAY, JUNE 19, 1847 147 


sent that he might as well have been in the British Parliament so 
far as our interests were concerned, as at Vandalia. He remem- 
bered the time when Jo Daviess county furnished representatives 
for nine counties, and they generally forget our interests in that 
of the interests of Jo Daviess. The whole of those representatives 
_ went in for that bill against the wishes and opinions of the people 
_ of my county, as well as of the adjoining counties. 

If the report of this committee be adopted, eighteen counties 

will hold the balance of power in the house, and control the whole 

_ State; and the rest of the counties may as well not be represented 

_ at all. These eighteen counties will be entitled to thirty-eight 

_ representatives—a majority of the whole—if population be made 
the basis of representation. He hoped every county would have 
a representative-—He was not to be frightened because of what 
had been said about small counties. He had seen too much, since 
yesterday, of gentlemen making calculations of how many repre- 
sentatives their counties would have. He was sure every county 
would be willing to pay the per diem of its member, rather 
than go without one. 

Property, also, should be the basis of representation, and the 
unanswerable speech of the gentleman from Warren, showed this 
fact. If this reduction be adopted, and there should be other 
exceptions to the constitution, it will endanger its confirmation by 
the people. His county, with 1200 voters, would go against it. 
He would like to see the constitution adopted by an overwhelming 
majority, but this would endanger it. He meant this not as a 
taunt, but as a fact. No manso poor as would be willing that the 
bed should be taken from under him, and his wife’s and children’s 
clothing should be sold for taxes, to pay our debt, nor did he 
think our creditors would think the better of us if we refused 
to have an aristocracy here, and abandon the right of the people to 
be represented in the hall of the Legislature. It was one of the 
great essentials of a free government. A representative govern- 
ment was the terror of tyrants. If gentlemen pass this law, he 
would go for a total abandonment of representation, and have the 
administration of government in the hands of the executive and 
the supreme courts, it would be just as well for the small counties 
as to have no representation. 


148 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


Mr. WILLIAMS was greatly astonished to hear a single 
member on that floor declare himself ready to attach the pruning 
knife to the salaries of the judges where but a small sum was to be - 
saved, and not touch the Legislature at all. He was in favor of j 
sixty members, and was satisfied that they could administer the © 
government with justice and fidelity to all the interests in the 
State. He thought that if the people desired to guard against — 
bribery, they should select men of integrity, to represent them, — 
that is the proper guard and not the number. He would 7 ; 
against striking out. : 


Mr. KENNER was not in favor of a large representation, a x 
thought that every county should have a representative. Every 
county had an interest of its own to be represented, and he thought — 
that if we once denied that interest a representation in the popular — 
branch of the Legislature, that you might as well abolish the house 
altogether. If each county should not be allowed to have a 
representative, he would vote for the smallest number that would — 
be proposed. If one member could represent four counties, why 
not represent twenty? We see one branch of the Legislature 
representing county rights, the other representing the interests of 
the State, at large, thus operating as a check, one upon the other. 
Once destroy this principle of a representation of county rights, 
and why not throw both houses into one, and thus’save the whole 
expense. As it is the interest of the State to have a general repre- 
sentation, why not let each county have one representative-—We 
would then steer clear of aristocracy and anarchy. Hehad merely 
risen to express his views. | 

Mr. THORNTON represented a large and a small county, and ~ 
desired to make some remarks explanatory of the reasons which | 
should control his vote. If he knew the sentiments of his constitu- 
ents upon any subject, he thought he did upon this. They were, 
and so was he, in favor of a smaller number to compose the Legis- 
lature than that reported by the committee. To hear gentlemen 
talk, one would suppose that there was a Chinese wall between — 
' the several counties of the State. There are not those diversified 
interests here, as in other States. He would vote against striking 
out, for fear of getting a large number; but if the motion to strike © 


ft 


i 
i 

‘ 

’ 


4 


SATURDAY, JUNE 19, 1847 149 
out prevailed, he would vote for the smallest number. He would 
vote for the report for a compromise. 

Mr. KNAPP of Jersey read a proposition which contained his 


__ own views of the question, yet he would vote for the report of the 
x 


committee. He could not agree with the gentlemen who desired 


_ that each county should have a representative-—Such a course 


would increase the number beyond that which was necessary. 


_ Speaking of retrenchment, our constituents are looking to us for 


no greater move in retrenchment than that which can be affected 


in the legislative department. He represented a county which 
_ would, under the plan reported by the committee, lose its repre- 


R 
A 


sentative, yet, he was willing to forego the privilege of represen- 
tation, for the purpose of lessening the number of the Legislature. 
He agreed with much that had fallen from the gentleman from 


_ Jefferson, but he feared that even after adopting all the economy 


proposed, we would not realize the promised reduction of the State 
debt. He would vote for the report of the committee, fearful 
that if the numbers therein should be stricken out, that a larger 


one might be adopted, and for fear, also, that if reduced so 


suddenly, we might lose the constitution. And then, in addition 
to all the evils which we experience now, will be the great cost of 
this Convention. 

He did not think that the census of 1845 was a proper basis 
upon which to district the State; because under it we cannot do 
justice to the great increase of population that has taken place 
since then. He was in favor of fixing the number low at present 
and increase the representation according to the increase of the 
population. We should embrace every opportunity that is offered 
to save money, and I think there will be no one where we can save 
so much as in the present case. Let us reduce the number of 
representatives in the Legislature, which, as has been shown, is 
the greatest of all extravagances. He agreed with the gentleman 


‘who said he was in favor of allowing a fair and reasonable 
compensation to the judges; let us leave those places which are 


small in themselves and where there is a fair return of services 
for the pay, and turn our attention to the curtailment of the ex- 
travagancies of the Legislatures. 


Mr. SINGLETON. The committee have reported the very 


150 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


number I advocated when a candidate before the people for a seat 
in this Convention. Still I am in favor of a smaller number. He © 
was greatly surprised to hear gentlemen say that territory should 
be the basis of representation. What do we represent—the people - 
or the naked territory? The population as a ratio was said to be 
democratic doctrine, and he, though not a democrat, at least of the 
present day, was in favor of it. He could not see the difficulty in 
reducing the number of representatives or of putting two or more 
counties into one district. He would be perfectly satisfied to 
have the gentleman from Pike, or the gentleman from Schuyler, 
represent Brown in the Legislature. He did not think Brown 
possessed all the capacity. This would break up this local legis- 
lation, and it was this local legislation which had involved us in 
all our difficulties. If gentlemen were so extremely democratic 
as to declare that territory is the only true basis of representation, 
why not extend the right of representation not only to counties 
but to townships also. Why, at present, if a man is elected from 
one side of a county, the people on the other side say they are not 
represented. The town of Quincy has an interest different from 
that of Mt. Sterling, yet if their representative should be elected 
from Quincy he did not know that it must affect Mt. Sterling. If 
we give a representative for territory, it is a property qualification, 
a land representation, and then why not estimate every species of 
property and give it a representation. Territory was no more 
than a land or real property qualification, and not more entitled to 
a representation than any other species of property. Gentlemen 
had said that if we made the districts so large, that none but 
lawyers could get elected as representatives. This was but a poor 
argument, and one of those long standing means of raising prej- 
udices against lawyers or doctors. He thought that clerks of 
circuit courts were as fond and as desirous of coming to the Legis- 
lature, of holding an office, or two or three of them, if they could 
get them, as anybody else. He thought it very undignified in his 
colleague to speak in this manner. It required judgment and 
discretion to administer the government and not numbers; theonly 
advantage in having large bodies is that the wants of the people - 
can be made known; if sixty can do this, then sixty 1s 
enough. If a less number can do it, why then a less number is 


SATURDAY, JUNE 19, 1847 151 


sufficient. He was not in favor of a large number and then 
reducing their pay to the very lowest, but he was in favor of a 
small number, and allowing them a fair compensation. If the 
State was in good circumstances he would be glad to see them 
receive good pay. 

Mr. THOMPSON wished to define his position before his 
constituents, and to offer a few remarks in justice to the committee, 
of which he had the honor to be a member. There were a num- 
ber of propositions before the committee, none of them, however, 
exceeding one hundred. The number for the Senate was gener- 
ally low, three, and sometimes four, to one. He thought at first 
that the number as reported by the committee was a little too 
large, and would have voted for the motion to strike out, but, 
now, fearing that he might hazard the reduction, he would vote 
against striking out. Gentlemen had alluded to the State of 
Massachusetts, which he did not think was a fair example. The 
large number of representatives in the State of Massachusetts was 
the result of incorporations. When that state was first settled 
the inhabitants were nearly all gathered into small communities 
on the coast; these soon were made into incorporations, and after- 
wards, when the State became more closely settled, and the people 
in the interior increased, they were incorporated and were allowed 
a representative. And when the corporations were increased, 
they, too, claimed a representative and obtained it. In this way 
then, had that State increased her representatives to a great 
number. 

In this discussion, he had observed the same two great traits of 
human nature—pride and interest. It was my county, my town- 
ship, and my people. It reminded him of a toast given by a 
Connecticut farmer at an agricultural dinner, given in that State. 
It was this; ““Here’s to the United States, the garden of the world; 
here’s to the State of Connecticut, the garden of the United States; 
here’s to the County of Wyndam, the garden of the State of 
Connecticut; and here’s to my farm, the garden of the County of 
Wyndham.” 

There was a burst of patriotism! 

Messrs. Locan and Scares continued the debate at much 
length; the former advocating the adoption of the report and in 


152 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Caer 4 . . ad y 4 
opposition to the motion to strike out. The latter, in reply to ~ 


Mr. L., in support of his views as expressed by him in the morning, — 


and in advocacy of the motion to strike out. The great length to 


which the debate was extended, has compelled us to defer the © 


publication of the remarks of these gentlemen. ~% 


Mr. HOGUE was satisfied that if he understood the senti- 
ments of the people whom he represented upon any subject, that 
he did on the subject of the number of the Legislature. His con- 
stituents were of one opinion and that was that the number should 


be reduced below one hundred. He was in favor of striking out, — 


and would go for the number of eighty—ninety as the excess. 
He would oppose all over ninety and vote for any number less. 
He was satisfied that the gentleman from Edwards had not 
expressed the views of his constituents. We had spoken together 
before the people upon this subject, and he had agreed with me 
that the number should be reduced. 

Mr. KENNER. No, sir, we did not. 

Mr. HOGUE reiterated that they had. 

Mr. CALDWELL asked that the question should be divided 
so as to [be] taken, first on striking out 75, and then onstriking out 25. 
And the vote being taken separately, both motions were lost. 

Mr. DEITZ moved to amend the resolution so as to s|t]rike 


out “Legislative committee” and insert “that a committee of one — 
from each of the senatorial districts shall be appointed, who shall 


proceed to divide the State into senatorial and representative 
districts.” 

Mr. SHERMAN moved to amend the amendment by striking 
out “one” and inserting ‘“‘three,’’ and striking out “‘senatorial”’ 
and inserting “judicial.” 


, 


fs 


And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned till Monday — 


next. ; 


XII. MONDAY, JUNE 21, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. BEerceEn. 
Mr. ROBBINS moved a suspension of the rules to enable him 


"to offer a resolution, that the Convention should now proceed to 


the election of an assistant secretary, to copy the journal for 


_ publication; and the rules were suspended. The vote was then 
_ taken on the adoption of the resolution, and it was lost—yeas 40, 
_ Nays not counted. 


_ A motion to re-consider was made and lost—yeas 38. 

Mr. MINSHALL offered (the rules being suspended) a resolu- 
tion; which was laid on the table. 

Mr. SCATES offered a resolution calling for information from 
the clerks of the circuit courts of the State. 

Mr. DAVIS, of Montgomery, opposed the resolution because 
of the impossibility of its being satisfactorily answered, and 
because of the great cost which it would be to the State. 

_. Mr. DEMENT moved to lay the resolution on the table. 
Carried. 

Mr. SHERMAN (the report of the committee on the Legis- 
lative Department and the amendment thereto being taken up,) 
said, that his object in moving the amendment proposed by him 
on Saturday was, that it was more usual to select the committees 
from the judicial districts of the State—there being nine judicial 
districts, and taking three from each would make the committee 


- consist of twenty-seven members. This was large enough, and 


they ought to be able to arrive at the proper apportionment. He 
had not made this proposed amendment from any feeling of 
distrust in the committee on Legislative Business, but because he 
thought this committee would be better able to perform the duty, 
they coming from all parts of the State, and their labor might be 
“more satisfactory to the people. He was of opinion that no 


_ standing committee, unless selected for the purpose, could give 


the same satisfaction as one chosen from the several sections of 
the State. It was well known that the districting the State would 


153 


154 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


create much feeling any way, and he thought the mode which — 
would be the least objectionable would be the better. — . 

Mr. WHITNEY was in hopes that the amendment would — 
prevail. By the selection of the committee in this way, territory 
would be more likely to be represented. He advocated the 
appointment of this select committee, not from any feeling of 
distrust in the standing committee, but because he thought a 
committee selected from each judicial district could better repre- 
sent the views and interests of the several counties than one 

selected in any other way. 

Mr. DEITZ withdrew his pauniioea 

Mr. SINGLETON offered an amendment to the amendment. 

Mr. KITCHELL explained the reasons why he had moved, 
on Saturday, to lay the amendments on the table. It was not 
for the purpose of defeating the appointment of a select committee, 
but to test the propriety of the Convention undertaking the task 
of districting the State, instead of leaving it to the Legislature. 

Mr. THOMAS moved to lay the amendment to the amend- 
ment on the table; which motion was carried—yeas 76, nays 55. 

Mr. HARDING offered an amendment to the amendment, 
which, on motion, was laid on the table. 

He also offered another amendment to the amendment, pro- 
viding that no one county shall be entitled to more than one 
representative nor one senator. 

Mr. SINGLETON moved to lay this amendment to the 
amendment on the table; which was decided in the afirmative— 
yeas 69, nays 60. 

Mr.HARDING offered another amendment to the amendment. 

Mr. EDWARDS, of Madison, moved to lay the whole subject 
on the table; a division of the question was demanded, and the 
vote being taken on laying the amendment to the amendment on 
the table, it was lost—yeas 49; and then the motion to lay the 
amendment on the table was decided in the negative. 

Mr. HAYES offered the following as a substitute for the 
amendment to the amendment, which was accepted: 

“Provided, That when more than one county is thrown into 
one representative district, the entire number of representatives 


MONDAY, JUNE 21, 1847 155 


to which those counties may be entitled shall be elected by the 
entire district.” 

Mr. GEDDES advocated, briefly, the adoption of the proviso. 

Mr. WEAD considered that the amendment, as it was proposed 
by the gentleman from Warren, contained the true and correct 
principle in relation to the matter, but that the modification 
offered by the gentleman from White, and which had been accept- 
ed, did not; but a principle that was calculated to do much injury 
to the rights of the larger counties. 

Mr. TURNBULL agreed with the gentleman last up, and 
opposed the principle of representation or apportionment as pro- 
vided by that amendment. 

Mr. ARCHER, also, opposed the amendment as one not at 
all calculated to do justice to the rights of those counties who had 
a fraction of population above the ratio entitling them to a repre- 
sentation.—He stated several examples wherein he thought the 
injustice of the plan was fully demonstrated. 

Mr. McCALLEN was a representative of a small county, and, 
under the present system, was not represented in the Legislature. 
At present the county of Gallatin was entitled to two representa- 
tives, and Gallatin and Hardin one. The people of Gallatin had 
the right to vote for three representatives and the people of Hardin 
but for a half a representative. Under the proposed plan of the 
amendment, the people of Hardin would have nothing more than 
what was just, the right of having a vote of equal weight with 
that of the people of Gallatin. 

Mr. CHURCHILL was not in favor of the apportionments by 
the committee. He had drawn up his views, and were it not now 
out of order would offer them as an amendment. He would read 
to the Convention his plan, as a part of his remarks: Provided 
that the Senate districts shall be composed of entire counties, 
and that the county commissioners of each county composing the 
several Senate districts be authorized, either by themselves or one 
of their number, to meet at some proper place in the district and 
organize the Senate districts into separate representative districts 
according to population, as near as may be. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery was in favor of the plan suggested 
_ by the amendment proposed by the gentleman from White. He 


156 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


thought it not only just to the large counties, but the best mode 


of apportionment for those small counties that had not 


sufficient population to entitle them to a member. 


Messrs. Brockman and Woopson, both, advocated the amend- 


ment to the amendment, as the best thing for the interests of the 
smaller counties. 


Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess opposed the amendment as 
containing a plan to elect the General Assembly by general ticket, 


and as unjust to the larger counties, by permitting the small — 


ones to vote for the whole ticket, and thereby controlling, per- 
haps, the election 'of the representatives of that county to which 


they might be attached. Thus giving the voters of a county ~ 


which had not sufficient population to entitle them to one mem- 
ber a voice in the election of three or four. 
Messrs. Hurtsut and Dement, both, opposed the amendment. 
Mr. HARVEY agreed with the gentleman from Jo Daviess in 
his view of the matter. He looked upon it as nothing more than 


a plan to elect the General Assembly by general ticket. The 
county of Knox had a population of ten thousand and would be. 
entitled to a member, then by adding to it the county of Warren. 


and the fraction of some other county, they, together, would be 


entitled to another; this was not anything more than just. But 


by adding those two to the county of Knox they would be entitled 
to two members, which under the plan proposed would have to be 
elected by a general vote of the three counties. By this Knox 
county might be controlled in the choice of her representatives, 
and that for the gratification of Warren. He had no particular 
desire that his county should be married forever to Warren, and 
hoped that some way would be discovered that he might procure 


a divorce. He moved the indefinite postponement of all the 
amendments, because he thought the discussion at present 


premature. 
Mr. LOGAN did not agree with the plan proposed by the 
gentleman in all its details. He had drawn up an amendment 


which he would like to see carried out. He read it to the Con- 


vention. It proposes that when one or more small counties shall 
be added to a large one having a surplus over and above the ratio, 
that the large county shall vote for its own representative and for 


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MONDAY, JUNE 21, 1847 157 


the one to which the joint fractions are entitled. But before the 
judges shall proceed to give a certificate they shall count all the 
votes and after calculating the proportion the whole vote of the 
county bears to the fraction over and above the ratio, in the same 
proportion shall the vote cast by the large county for the repre- 
sentative for the smaller ones and itself, bear in the general vote 
between the candidates. Mr. L. explained the proposition and 
urged that the only thing required was to have sheriffs and judges 


- of elections competent to work a sum in the rule of three. 


Mr. HAYES defended the plan of apportionment submitted 
by him and pointed out the difficulties attending the practical 
operation of the plan of the member from Sangamon. 

The Convention than adjourned till 3 P. . 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. DEMENT opposed the plan of the gentleman from White 
in a few remarks. 

Mr. GREGG was opposed to the Legislature undertaking the 
task of districting the State at all; but if it was to be done he was 
in favor of the amendment. 

Messrs. Kinney of Bureau and Knapp of Jersey opposed the 
amendment. 

Mr. WILLIAMS replied briefly to Mr. K. of Jersey, and 
declared himself in favor of the amendment. 

Mr. CHURCHILL still further opposed any mode of appor- 
tionment of the State by the Convention and read a series of 
propositions that he had prepared on the subject and which he 
had submitted to some friends for their approval. 

Mr. DEITZ advocated the adoption of single districts. 

Mr. SHUMWAY expressed his opposition to the plan of 
apportionment before them, and was followed by Mr. FarweELi 
on the same side. 

Mr. LOGAN was in favor of an apportionment by the Conven- 
tion, but he thought that before we discussed the mode, we had 
better take a vote to ascertain whether the Convention would 
undertake to apportion the State or not. With that view he 
moved to lay all the amendments and that portion of the resolution 
which provides for the districting the State, on the table. 


158 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Mr. HARDING withdrew his modified’ amendment for the — 
present; and the vote being taken on laying the amendment Sis 
SHERMAN’S) on the table, it was lost. 

Mr. HARDING then renewed his amendment and it was — 
adopted, and then the amendment as amended was adopted, and 
the resolution passed. 

Mr. SERVANT presented a petition from a large number of 
citizens of Randolph county praying an extension of all rights to 
every class without distinction of color, and moved its reference 
to the committee on elections and right of suffrage. Carried. 

A communication from the Auditor, in reply to a call for infor- 
mation was read: it contained an account of the expenses of the 
last Legislature. 

Mr. THOMAS moved that it lie on the table and 200 copies 
thereof be printed. 

Mr. LOGAN moved that the number be I,o00. Ordered. 

Mr. HENDERSON moved that the Secretary of State be 
requested to furnish the Convention with a statement of the last 
census, and that when furnished 200 copies be printed. 

On motion, laid on the table. 

On motion, the Convention adjourned. 


XIII. TUESDAY, JUNE 22, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. BaiLey.” 

The following gentlemen compose the committee to district 
the State into senatorial and representative districts: 

Gregg, Whiteside, Whitney, Archer, Armstrong, Davis of 


- Massac, Sim, Hogue, Davis of McLean, Kitchell, Knapp of Jersey, 


Palmer of Macoupin, Dummer, Edmonson, West, Farwell, Pratt, 
McClure, Shumway, Vance, Harvey, Pinckney, Harlan, Hunsaker, 
Jackson, Minshall and Hill. 

Mr. ARCHER, from the committee on the Organization of 
Departments, and Officers Connected with the Executive Depart- 
ment, reported back sundry resolutions which had been referred 
to said committee, and asked to be discharged from the further 
consideration thereof. Agreed to. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin moved to take up certain reso- 
lutions, offered by him some days before, and refer them to the 
Judiciary committee, which after they had been modified, were so 
referred. 

Mr. SCATES moved to take up the resolutions offered by him 
yesterday calling for information from the circuit court clerks, &c. 

Mr. WHITNEY advocated the adoption of the resolution, 
because the committee were of opinion that the information was 
needed, and the Convention should pass the call for the same. 

Mr. MARSHALL of Mason could see no necessity for the 
adoption of the resolution. The information required by it would 
impose an immense amount of labor on the clerks of the courts, 
which could not be performed for many weeks, so that it was 
highly probable that whatever information would be furnished, 


Gilbert S. Bailey: October 1, 1846-October, 1849, pastor of the 
First Baptist Church of Springfield; November 7, 1850, assisted in the organ- 
ization of the First Baptist Church of Pekin, Tazewell County; 1852-1855, 
pastor and school teacher at Pekin. 

Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois; History of Sanga- 


mon County, 2: 880; Inter-State Publishing Company, History of Sangamon 


County, 606; Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois; History 
of Tazewell County, 2: 924-925, 


159 


160 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS emia 
would not be ready for the use of the Convention for six weeks, a 
period when he expected the duties of the Convention would have 
been performed. He hoped it would not be taken up, and, on a 7 
division, the motion to take up the resolution was lost. 4 

Mr. HAYES offered a resolution referring certain parts of the 
constitution to the committee on Law Reform, and also instructing — 
that committee to inquire into the expediency of abolishing all — ? 
differences between courts of chancery and common law, also the : 
modification of the laws and the abolition of all English statutes 
now in force. { 

Mr. CHURCH thought this resolution properly belonged to 
the consideration of the committee on the Judiciary; he thought — 
there was a manifest inclination to deprive that committee of its — 
proper subjects by giving them to the committee on Law Reform. © 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean thought the committee on Law — 
Reform was peculiarly the proper committee to take charge of the 
inquiry contemplated in the present resolution. 

Mr. HAYES said, that in offering the resolution he did not 
think of committing himself in its favor; the subject was one which 
had been spoken of by many persons, and by legal men, and he. 
hoped the reference would be made so that the subject might be ~ 
examined. Motion carried. 

Mr. KENNER moved to take up a resolution, offered by him 
some days ago, with a view of referring it toa committee. Motion 
lost. 

Mr. WEST offered a resolution that the Convention phere 
to the election of an assistant secretary to copy the journal of the 
Convention. 

Mr. THOMAS offered a substitute providing that the secretary 
shall select an assistant secretary at a compensation of $3 per day_ 
whose duty it shall be to copy the journal; and that the’ same be 
printed and bound &c., and that the president and secretary, after 
the adjournment of the Convention, should attach thereto a 
certificate of its authenticity; which substitute was accepted. 

Mr. LOGAN offered an amendment, that the Secretary of 
State be requested to furnish them with a book or books in which 
to keep the journal, and after the same shall be printed, that he 
issue a notice for proposals for binding, &c. 


TUESDAY, JUNE 22, 1847 161 


Mr. BROCKMAN opposed the resolutions. He thought 
some weeks ago we had settled this question of the right of this 
Convention to limit the pay of the officers of the Convention. He 
was no lawyer, but he thought he was able to give a common sense 
interpretation of a statute, and the act which called them together 
allowed them certain officers and fixed their pay. He considered 
that our power in this respect was a delegated one, and we had no 
authority to delegate that to another, the act of the Legislature 
conferred upon the Convention the power of appointing certain 
officers, and he did not believe we had the right to delegate that 
power to the secretary or anybody else. 

Mr. THOMAS thought that a person who chose to accept the 
appointment of an assistant secretary, at the rate fixed by this 
resolution, was bound by his contract. He did not admit that 
our powers were delegated. 

Mr. PRATT agreed with the gentleman from Brown, that the 
powers of the Convention in relation to the secretaries and door- 
keepers, were delegated to it by the Convention, and that the well 
established legal maxim, that delegated powers cannot be dele- 
gated, applied to the resolution now before them. He was opposed 
to the resolution, though he desired to have the journal printed, 
in order that it might be placed daily on their table, and that it 
might progress with their progress. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery sincerely hoped that they would 
have no more legal arguments about delegated powers, &c. One 
week of the Convention had already been wasted upon that 
subject, and he knew that if they did elect a secretary, or authorize 
‘the appointment of one as this resolution contemplated, it would 
be of very little importance; neither their acts, nor the constitution 


they might form would, in either case, be void. He was in favor 


of the resolution, because it looked to the performance of the work 
—the printing of the journal and the binding of it in strong books— 
in accordance with all past legislation. The only difference was 
the pay at $3 a day, while he understood the Legislature allowed 
a copyist last year $3.50. If gentlemen would move an amend- 
ment changing the pay to that amount, he would have no objection 
to voting for it. There was, however, no such thing to be expected 


“ee! ' SUF 


162 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS. 


as having the journal upon the table every day, there was no 
precedent for such a course. 

Mr. THOMAS made some remarks, when the vote was taken 
on the amendment and adopted, and the resolution as amended 
was decided in the affirmative—yeas 76, nays 43. 

Mr. GREGG moved to take up the report of the committee 
on the Executive Department, made some days ago; which motion 
was carried. He then, the chairman of the committee being 
absent, moved that it be made the special order for Tuesday next. _ 
Carried. 

Mr. PRATT said that Mr. Markey had been called home 
on particular business—sickness in his family—and had requested 
him to beg a leave of absence for him for ten days. Granted. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon submitted a resolution instruct- 
ing the committee on the Legislative Department to inquire into 
the expediency of incorporating a number of stated provisions on 
several matters, into the constitution. 

Mr. WITT moved to amend by striking out so much of the 
resolution as required the committee to inquire into the modes of 
taking the census hereafter. He said that the committee had 
agreed upon that matter and upon a very different mode than that 
contained in the proposition of the gentleman from Sangamon. 
It would be well to have a vote upon the matter now, in order that 
the question might be tested, whether the plan proposed by the 
committee would meet the views of the Convention, if not, then 
the committee would feel themselves instructed and would report 
accordingly. 

Mr. THOMAS suggested that the resolution was one directing 
an inquiry by the committee only, and, even if the committee 
had determined upon a plan, could do no harm; moreover 
many would vote for the reference who might be opposed to the 
propositions contained in the resolutions and that could be no 
test vote. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon said that he had hoped the 
resolution would have been permitted to go to the committee 
without debate. He was opposed to the amendments offered by 
the gentleman from Greene. His object in presenting the reso- 
lutions was to direct an inquiry as to the best mode of stopping all 


TUESDAY, JUNE 22, 1847 163 


: electioneering for offices either under the State or general govern- 
_ ment, by members of the Legislature, or through the friends of 
_ the members, or by reason of their weight or influence, also, that 
“no member of the Legislature should hold or be eligible to any 
_ office created by the Legislature of which he was a member, or the 
_ salary of which had been increased by that body while he was there. 
He had offered them, because he thought that perhaps the com- 
mittee might not have had all these subjects under their consider- 
ation. 

_ Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, that he had no doubt but 
the Convention, when the committee should report, would agree 
with them in the main principles set forth. But the present 

‘resolution was merely one of inquiry, and there could be no harm 
in adopting it, nor would it interfere in any way with the report 
of the committee, which he understood had been agreed on. 

Mr. CHURCH said, he would like to see the form of the oath 
contained in one of the resolutions amended. 

Mr. EDWARDS explained that it was only an oath to support 
the constitution. 

Mr. DEMENT said, that the committee had inquired into 
the matters contained in the resolutions, and that the subject of 
the first of them—the time and mode of taking the census—had 
been settled by that committee, and if the Convention had no 
objection it was desirable that a vote should be taken upon the 
subject at once, and the matter tested. He had no objection to 
the inquiry, but the committee had inquired into the subject, and 
had come to a conclusion, and why not have a test vote now, and 
say whether this resolution contains the views of the Convention. 
He asked that the vote might be taken on this esol tice separately. 
The yeas and nays were demanded. 

Mr. LOGAN said, that he could not see how this vote could be 
atest. Many were in favor of referring the resolutions who might 
be in favor of the report of the committee. 

Mr. NORTON said, he was desirous to give his reasons why 
he should vote in the affirmative. He was not prepared to vote 

for the proposition of the gentleman from Sangamon, but if any 
gentleman proposed a mere resolution of inquiry, as he understood 


resolution passed. a 
Mr. CHURCHILL moved a suspension of the she to enable 


him to present a resolution. Lost. 


BANKS 


The resolution of instruction to the committee on Incorpora- 
tions, and the substitute therefor—offered on acd a 
came up in order. 


Resolved, That the committee on Incorfiaralone be i thsheacta 
to inquire into the expediency of so limiting the power of the 


or associations, with banking Sinelene except on the basis ord the 
following provisions: 

tst. The General Assembly shall have. no power to pass any 
act granting any special charter for banking purposes, but corpo- 
rations or associations free to all the inhabitants of this State may 
be formed for such purposes under general laws. " 

ad. The General Assembly shall have no power to pass any 
law sanctioning in any manner, directly or indirectly, the suspen- | 
sion of specie payments by any person, association, or corporation, 
issuing bank notes of any description. 

3d. The General Assembly shall provide by law for thal 
registry of all bills, or notes, issued, or put in circulation as money; 
and shall require ample security, by the pledge of public stocks, 
or otherwise, for the redemption of the same in specie. 

4th. The stockholders in every corporation and joint stock 
association, for banking purposes, issuing bank notes, or any 
kind of paper credits to circulate as money, shall be individually 
responsible for all its debts and liabities; and to make provision ; 
for the Poet of such debts and liabilities they shall be required | 


_ TUESDAY, JUNE.22, 1847 165 


to furnish Pegi yricnisite security of twice the amount of their 
respective share in any such corporation or association. 
_ 5th. In case of the insolvency of any banking association, the 
pel holders thereof shall be entitled to preference of payment over 
all other creditors of such association. 

6th. The embezzlement of the funds or property of any corpo- 
“ration or joint association, for banking purposes by any officer or 

_ agent thereof, shall be deemed felony, and it shall be the duty of 
. “the General Assembly to provide for the punishment of such 
felony, by imprisonment in the penitentiary. 

7th. No act of the General Assembly authorizing corporations 
“or associati[olns with banking powers shall go into effect, or in 

_ any manner be in force, unless the same shall be directly submitted 

_ to the people at the general election next succeeding the passage 
thereof, and shall be approved by a majority of all the votes cast 
at such election. 

S 8th. Any general law of this State authorizing the creation 
of corporations, or associations, with banking powers may be 

"piggy by the General Assembly. 

Mr. GREGG said, that he desired to express, briefly, a few of 
Fiche considerations which had induced him to present the propo- 
sition. He was opposed to banks in any shape or form. He 
_ would be in favor of an entire prohibition of them. He was one 
_ of those who believed banks, in any shape, manner or form, to be 
an unmitigated evil, and that their consequences were always 
disastrous and destructive to the people. He was not prepared 
_ then to go into a discussion of the question of banks and banking, 

but when the matter should come before them, from the hands of 
_ the committee, then he would enter into the subject more fully. 
It had been indicated by votes that had been taken—a manifest 
“intention has been shown by the Convention, that there should 

be banks of some description. A majority of the Convention had 
made this manifest declaration. The question then presented to 
us was, “shall we leave the power to create these banks, or to adopt 
a system of banking, with the Legislature or with the people?” 

_ Should we leave the Legislature with a power so great, which 
will, if put into force, affect the wealth and prosperity of the 

whole State. 


4 


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166 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


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He was opposed to this. He was unwilling to leave the powe 
to adopt this dangerous and destructive system with any body i) 
but the people themselves. If there was a determination on the 
part of the Convention to adopt some system of banking, let us — 
present it to the people in the most modified form, and permit the 

evil in the least objectionable shape, and it will go to the people ; 
who will vote understandingly upon the subject. He thought his f 
proposition presented the odious evil in the least objectionablel 

form; people could vote upon the proposition itself, instead of 
panne for men to frame the system. He believed banks to be 
great evils in any shape and any form. If the Legislature was { 
to be trusted with the power to credit those institutions, let us 
place restrictions upon them, so that they may clearly see their 
powers and limits; but if the people are to be afflicted with any F 
system of evil, he thought they should have every opportunity of ij 
voting understandingly upon the subject and of saying in what — 
way it should be done. He was not prepared now to enter further © 
into the discussion of the question, but would at some future time, 4s 
go into a full exposition of his views and of the proposition sub-— 
mitted. He did not think the convention was prepared to discuss — 
the matter now, and he was in favor of referring all the propositions — 
to the committee on Incorporations. 

Mr. CHURCHILL was in favor of referring the whole subject — 
to the committee of the whole. 

Mr. THOMAS would prefer that we should have the report 
of the committee on Incorporations on the subject, and then go 
into the committee of the whole, and discuss the propositions to- 
gether. He would suggest that when such things as a system of © 
banking were to be referred to the people for their approval or 
condemnation, you denied the people the right of selecting a 
system they might be in favor of, and if allowed a choice, would 
select,a system very different from that which you presented to 
them, as contemplated by the substitute offered today; the sub- — 
mitting to the people whether they would adopt a particular plan, 
was not extending to them much of a privilege. 

Mr. GREGG said, that when the committee should make a 
report, the whole subject would again be discussed, and he saw — 


9 


TUESDAY, JUNE 22, 1847 167 


no use in such a course as debating the subject now, and when the 
report was made, to discuss it all?over again. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery thought the question might be 
discussed now as well as at any other time, and he was in favor of 
proceeding atonce. He was in favor of an unqualified prohibition 
to be inserted in the constitution. He was not willing to declare 
or admit that the majority of this convention was in favor of 
banks. Nor was he one of those who acting thus would propose 
a system of banking. He did not believe in gentlemen asserting 
that they were opposed to banks in any shape, and then proposing 
a system of banking! Let those who say that banks are evils, 
come out boldly and meet the question, and first say that there 
shall be no banks. He would vote to make it the special order 
for 2 o'clock this day. He was afraid they would get less in 
number by delaying the question; the prohibition party was 
already in a small minority. He was certain they would get less 
by postponing the debate, particularly when we see those who say 
that they are opposed to all banks proposing schemes of banking 
without showing any sort of fight. There were some ready to 
come up to the rack anyhow, and he hoped the debate would go 
on now. 

Mr. LOGAN said, he rose to defend the gentleman from Cook 
(Mr. Grece) from the attack of the gentleman from Montgomery 
(Mr. Davis.)—There was little or no difference between the plan 
proposed by the gentleman from Cook and an entire prohibition, 
for he was sure that if there was to be no bank in the State except 
according to the plan proposed, no application would ever be 
made for a charter. He was in favor of taking up some one of 
the questions now, and, before the committee blocks out the 
system, or the article go[es] into the constitution, we could give them 


- some intimation of the opinion of the Convention on the subject.— 


If the Convention should come to the conclusion to have no banks, 
why, they could so inform the committee; if they determine to 
have banks, they could agree in some way upon the restrictions; 
and again, if the power to charter banks is to be given to the Legis- 
lature, say whether it shall be given with or without restrictions; if 
with restrictions, define them. He thought. this question of banks 
the most important—the main question—to be decided by the 


168 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Convention; that is, the most important controverted subject 


they would be called to act upon. He moved to refer it to the com- 


mittee of the whole, and made the special order of the day for Fri- 
day next. 


Mr. HAYES hoped the resolutions and amendments would all 


be referred to the committee upon Incorporations instead of the 
committee of the whole, when gentlemen were not prepared to 
discuss the matter at so short a notice. The gentleman who had 
proposed the substitute was in favor of referring it to the commit- 
tee on Incorporations, and he thought the Convention should do 
so. He differed from the gentleman from Bond, in supposing that 
the number of those whom they voted with on this subject, would 


grow less by delay: on the contrary, he thought it would be better 


for them to fight some definite plan, and to have some scheme to 
rally against. 
Mr. GEDDES was rather astonished to hear his friend from 


Montgomery charge upon the gentleman from Cook. There ap-. 


peared to him but little difference between them; they both looked 
upon banks as a hydra-headed monster; the gentleman from Mont- 
gomery proposed to kill him right out; the gentleman from Cook 


proposed to chain him, and the gentleman from Jefferson . 


offered to knock him in the head after he was chained. It was 
all one thing. He would vote for referring the matter to the 
committee on Incorporations. 

Mr. HENDERSON said, he would prefer that the committee 
should first make a report, so that the Convention might have 
something tangible before them to discuss. He moved a refer- 
ence to the committee on Incorporations. 


Mr. DAVIS, of Montgomery, was still in favor of giving the 


whole subject to the committee of the whole, because he thought 


that those who were opposed to banking would have the best — 


way of meeting all the propositions for and against banks and 
banking. He saw that the great objection to going into a dis- 
cussion now comes not from those who are opposed to banking, 
but from those tender-footed gentlemen who are more than half 
in favor of banks and yet are opposed to them. 

Mr. PALMER, of Macoupin, differed from the peudicinan 
last up in this particular, though not on others. That gentleman 


TUESDAY, JUNE 22, 1847 169 


was orthodox upon the real subject. He was not in favor of pro- 
i ceeding now with the discussion. He thought the friends of 
the banks ought to come forward with their proposition, and then 
we could oppose it. We were altogether on the defensive, and 
_ he much preferred a regular field fight to this system of guerrilla 
. warfare. This question of banks was the most important one 
7 ‘that would come before the Convention, as it would affect the 
_ future interests and prosperity of the State, and it depended on 
" our resistance to defeat the evils. If they were to be beaten, and 
§ the State was to have banks, he would prefer that the friends of 
" these institutions should prepare that system which their wisdom 
_ and experience would allow. If the rights of the people were to 
_ be invaded let it be done by the friends of the system. 
_ Mr. THOMAS said, that it was much better that the committee 
should first report before we commenced the discussion, and 
_ when the committee had reported one plan, these propositions of 
the gentlemen, or any others, might be offered as amendments, 
- and in this way the whole subject would be regularly before them. 
_ He would say to the gentleman from Macoupin that upon this 
_ question he might find himself in a position not altogether on the 
_ defensive. We may adopt banks or a system of banks, and then 
when the gentleman comes to put restrictions upon them, he will 
find himself attacking the right of the people to have such an 
_ institution as they thought proper. If this matter was to be dis- 
_ cussed, he desired to have the whole subject before them and 
_ gentlemen would be obliged to show their hands. 


Mr. PALMER, of Macoupin, said, so far as he understood the 
sentiments of the people of Illinois, he considered that those who 

_ spoke of having banks should always speak of restrictions upon 
_ them.—He was certain that no one dare send to the people a 
system of banking without attaching to it many restrictions. He 

_ stood there on the side of the people, behind a prohibitory clause, 
_ and while his party presented a perfectly invulnerable barrier to 
_ protect the people from any such system as banks or banking, the 
_ other party were compelled to come forward with a restrictive 
policy; something put around the plan to sweeten the dose, and 
_ showed that they were unwilling to turn the monster unrestricted 


_ 


ee aS 
2 


170 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS —— 


upon the people. He thought that the proper mode of discussing 
the question was to have some definite plan or proposition before — 
them, for if we turned the Convention out upon the sea of banks — 


and banking systems, they would be weeks at it before they came — 
to any conclusion upon the subject. 


Mr. HURLBUT was in favor of referring the whole subject _ 
to the committee of the whole, as he thought it would shorten the — 
discussion and have a principle decided at once. a 

And the question being taken on referring the propositions on | 
the subject to the committee of the whole, it was decided in the 
affirmative—yeas 71, nays $0. 7 

Mr. KNOX offered a series of resolutions in reference to the 
qualification, &c. of free white male inhabitants of the State to 
vote; which he moved to refer to the committee on Elections and — 
Ride of Suffrage. q 

Mr. WHITNEY moved to strike out the word “white” 
wherever it occurred in the resolutions; and the vote being taken 
by yeas and nays, was decided in the nega ee 7, nays 137. 4 
The resolution was then referred. 4 

Mr. DAWSON offered a resolution directing an inquiry, by: 1 
the committee on Finance, in relation to the school fund. 

Mr. HOGUE offered a substitute; which was accepted. ‘ 

Mr. LOGAN offered an amendment; which was accepted. _ 

And then, on motion, the Convention aden till to-mor- _ 
row atg A. M. . 


XIV. WEDNESDAY, JUNE 23, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. Barcer. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean presented a petition of a number of 
citizens of McLean county, praying the Convention to adopt some 
constitutional provision, for the appointment of a superintendent 
of public instruction with a liberal salary; which was read and 
referred to the committee on Education. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison, from the committee on Educa- 
tion, reported the following resolutions: 

Resolved, That the committee on Education be instructed to 
consider and report as to the propriety of a constitutional provi- 
sion for the security of the college, seminary and common school 
funds from conversion or destruction by the Legislature; also, for 


the establishment of such a system of common schools as will, by 


taxation, combined with the State funds, afford the means of 
education to every child in the State, and for the appointment of a 
State Superintendant [sic], with an adequate salary to give effect 
to such a system. 

In presenting the reported resolutions from the committee 
Mr. E. said, that the first object contemplated by the resolutions 
was to secure the fund belonging to the college, seminary and 
common schools from all misappropriations from its true and 


sacred object. 


The second was to establish some sure and permanent system 
of appropriation and distribution of the fund, combined with a 
fair and reasonable taxation and the State funds, give such credit 
and security that every child in the State of Illinois may have the 
invaluable and incalculable advantages of education. The third 
branch of the resolution had reference to the appointment of a 
State Superintendant of education. There could be no 
question of the necessity of providing for the security of the 
college, school and seminary fund—which necessity arose from 
the large amount of the fund—from being squandered by the 
Legislature for purposes different from the object of the fund. 


171 


172 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


The amount of the fund was $800,000 and was fast accumulat- 
ing from the 3 per cent. fund provided by the general government. » 
It was true that one-sixth of this 3 percent. fund was appropriated 


by the general government for the purpose of building a university, _ 


but fortunately for the State no time had been prescribed by law 
for the completion or commencement of this work, and the Legis- 


lature has wisely appropriated the whole of it to the school fund. 


The greatest care should be kept of this fund, and its purposes 
and objects should be guarded and protected from any control or 
disposition of [it] by the Legislature. It should be esteemed by all 
as a sacred trust in the hands of the State, whose duty and interest 
it was to see properly administered. 

He would cite one instance of this kind—the Transylvania 
Institution, which was at one time one of the most promising and 
flourishing institutions of the character in the country, but which, 
by improvident legislation, owing to the curious state of politics 
of the time, had been reduced and dwindled down to an institution 
but little above a common school. It was an essential element in 
the establishment of common schools with a large fund, that it 
should be so provided that the fund should be permanently and 
safely invested and the interest distributed all over the State, and 
thus secure the benefits of education to the youth of every town 
and village in Illinois. He would appeal to the experience of the 
president and other members of the Convention to the danger of 
improvident legislation, of the attempts to distribute the fund to 
the several counties, and thereby to lose the whole; while the best 
and only safe plan was to have the fund all remain permanently 
invested and the interest only to be distributed. He was not 
prepared to say that the Convention can make any such provision 
as to secure permanency of this fund. The great difficulty with 
the people was the many changes, and the uncertainty of the 
present system; the spirit of innovation was forever at work and 


the people are always in the dark; the changes were so often and © 


repeated that they could not know how the matter stands. He 
hoped that something would be done. The last part of the reso- 
lution looks to the appointment of a State Superintendant 
of instruction, and in support of that appointment he would refer 
to the example and experience of other States; and he had no fear 


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WEDNESDAY, JUNE 23, 1847 cen vei3) 


of contradiction when he said that in no State had they succeeded 
with their school funds, without establishing such an office. New 
York, Massachusetts and Ohio, all have an officer of this kind, 
and through his influence, labors and experience every township 
_and village in the State had a school. He would like to present 
to the members of the Convention the report of the superintend- 
ant of public instruction of Ohio, and when the Convention 
would see the labor of that officer and its results, upon the system 
of education and the fund, he would think the matter settled. 
Let them look at the complicated machinery of the administra- 
tion of this office, its various sources of information and the facil- 
ities with which all errors could be corrected, and no man could 
deny the utility of the office. But he was met with the expense 
of such an office. Sir, said he, we are met here in the capacity of 
a convention to reform our system in all its branches; we may 
save an immense amount of money by applying the pruning knife 
of retrenchment to the several departments of our government, 
and in so doing he was willing to go as far as any man in the 
principle of economy, but not in a niggardly picayune system. 
Let us apply a portion of this amount saved to the payment of 
‘this officer-and the people will not complain. We may then go, 
after saving this amount from other branches of the government, 
before the people and show them that we have economized all the 
expenses of the State, and saved them annually much more than 
the salary of this officer, and in view of the immense benefits they 
will derive from the administration of the school fund by him, no 
county will receive his appointment without approbation. 

The labors of the office of Secretary of State are too much and 
too arduous to enable him to do justice to the exofficio office of 
superintendant of public instruction. 

Mr. E. here read an extract from the report of the Ex-Secretary 
of State, now a member on this floor. Mr. E. pursued the subject 
for some time pointing out the many advantages flowing from a 
general diffusion of knowledge and a complete system of education 
among the people, he painted the beneficial results of such insti- 
tutions in the most vivid and glowing terms, and hoped that some 
encouragement would be given by a constitutional provision, to 
young men who were poor and now in obscurity. In conclusion 


° 


174 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


he said that since he had been here he had listened with pleasure 
and profit to the maiden efforts of several young men, who had 
themselves derived benefits from education, and he appealed to 


them to lend their aid in laying the foundations of a good, sound 


and perfect system of common schools, which would afford other 
youths an opportunity to become a benefit and ornament to their | 
country. To the older ones he deemed such an appeal unnecessary. 

The PRESIDENT said that he had suffered the debate to 
proceed, being unaware that there was a resol[u]tion pending at 
the adjournment of the Convention yesterday. 

The following resolution, as modified, then came up before 
the Convention: 

Resolved, That the committee on Education be instructed to 
inquire into the expediency of adopting a constitutional provision 
for increasing the common school fund, and to prevent the Legis- 
lature from borrowing any portion of the school, college or seminary 
fund in [the] future. 

Mr. LOGAN offered to amend by adding thereto, “to defray 
-the ordinary expenses of the government,” also the following: 

“And that the same committee be instructed, also, to inquire 
into the expediency of providing by the constitution that the 
moneys hereafter received from the school, college and seminary 
funds shall be invested in the bonds of this State at their market 
value; and, also, that the interest on bonds so purchased shall be 
punctually paid, to defray the ordinary expenses of the State debt.” 

Mr. DEITZ moved to add, after the first amendment of Mr. L., 
the following: 

‘“‘And that hereafter the first moneys that shall come into the 
treasury in each and every year shall be set apart for payment to 
the proper authorities, or persons entitled by law to their respec- 
tive proportion of the interest annually accruing upon the school, 
collegé and seminary fund.” 

Mr. LOGAN advocated his plan of adding to the school fund. 
He illustrated the operation of it thus: His proposition was, that 
the State should authorize the commissioner of the school fund to 
go into the market and invest it in bonds of the State of Illinois. — 
Thus with the school fund you could buy, with one hundred thous- 
and dollars, two hundred thousand dollars worth of the bonds— 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 23, 1847 175 


" putting the market value of the bonds at 50 cents.—The State, 


_ then, would pay the interest on two hundred thousand dollars 


_ into the school fund, the school fund would be doubled, the 
_ bonds would be out of the hands of foreign creditors, and no one 
_ would be injured. Mr. L. expatiated at length on this plan of 


_ increasing and benefitting the school fund. 


Mr. DAVIS, of Montgomery, opposed the plan as reflecting 


_ on the honor and integrity of the State. He thought that it was 


not honorable or just for the State, after having, by unwise, if not 
worse, legislation become in debt, and then depreciated her own 


bonds, to go into the market and buy them up at half their value, 


and appropriate the profits of the shaving to pay its debts to 
another fund. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, he was in favor of the resolution of 
the gentleman from Sangamon for three reasons, and would be 
glad to see the whole of the school fund invested by the school 
commissioner in the State bonds. His reasons were, that the 
school fund would be doubled or greatly increased; that the debt 
would become a domestic instead of a foreign one; and that the 
people would gladly and willingly pay the taxes to meet the interest 
upon the bonds, when they knew they were contributing to a 
fund so beneficial to themselves and children. 

Mr. WEST made a few remarks in opposition, which led to an 
explanation by Mr. C. and Mr. Locay. 

Mr. THOMAS was not only in favor of the plan proposed by 
the gentleman from Sangamon, but he would go further and 
require that the fund belonging to every township in the State 


should be invested in State bonds, and then the people would 


more readily pay their taxes, being conscious that every cent they 
paid would be going for the advancement of their own interest 
and the benefit and education of their children. It would 
also lead to the permanency and perpetuity of the institutions 
of the State, to have her debt all owing to the various townships 


_ and funds and citizens of her own State. He cited the cases of 


France and Great Britain, whose debt was held by her own citizens, 


and to this he ascribed the safety of England from a revolution. 


Mr. TURNBULL opposed, briefly, the adoption of any system 


176 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


compelling the townships to invest their money in State stock or — 
in any way other than at present, or than the people desired. . 

Mr. BROCKMAN said, that he approved of the plan if he 
understood it properly. If this money was invested in the school 
fund and the interest paid out to the townships in gold or silver, or © 
in par funds, he was with them; but if the interest was to be paid 
out as it is now, in Auditor’s warrants of depreciated value, he 
would oppose the whole system. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG was opposed to any such disposition off 
the township funds as had been shadowed forth by the gentleman ~ 
from Morgan, because it was now invested in good mortgaged — 
property, and the interest was paid in gold and silver. He was © 
opposed to the system of furnishing the counties with their — 
respective shares of the school fund in Auditor’s warrants, when | 
the people paid their taxes in gold and silver. . 

Mr. CHURCHILL said, that for the past two years, at least, 
the Auditor sends the money to the school commissioner, and if 
they receive nothing but Auditor’s warrants it was the fault of 
the officer. He was opposed to any distribution of the fund in 
any shape, manner or form. . 

Mr. KENNER made a few remarks in relation to the difficulty ; 
in obtaining teachers for the schools, when they were to received 
nothing but Auditor’s warrants for their pay. : 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean was in favor of the plan of the gentle- 
man from Sangamon, and also that spoken of by the gentleman ~ 
from Morgan. He could see no possible objection to the former, 
as it was the most feasible plan of increasing the school fund with — 
advantage and without doing the least injury to anyone. 164 
might be called a crying shame were the State to send a man into 
the market to buy up her own bondsata depreciated value, and thus 
avoid the payment of half her debt; but not so if the commissioner — 
of the school fund make the purchase of the bonds at the market — 
value, as the State would still have to pay the whole amount of — 
her bonds with interest. He would show how much the school — 
fund would be increased, by supposing a case. Say the commis- : 
sioner with $100,000 of the school fund bought up, at the market — 
value, bonds of the State amounting to $200,000. In the first — 
place, the amount of the school fund would be doubled, and when — 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 23, 1847 177 


the interest on the $100,000 would be $6,000 that on the $200,000 
would be $12,000, thereby increasing to double the amount the 
sum to be distributed for the purposes of education. And who 
was tolose? Noone. And the children all over the State would 
be greatly benefitted by this increase of the means of education. 
Mr. D. then pointed out the vast benefits which, in his opinion, 


would follow from the investment of the township funds in this 
‘stock, in comparison to the present system of loaning it out to 


private individuals. 

Mr. SHERMAN opposed everything like a provision directing 
the investment of the township fund in stocks of the State. In 
his county they had an excellent fund, upon which they received 
I2 per cent. interest; they paid their teachers in cash, and he did 
not want the Convention to come there and make them invest it 
in State bonds bearing 6 per cent. only—and that, too, in Aud- 
itor’s warrants. 


[Mr. DEMENT said, admitting, for the sake of argument, that 
there is nothing immoral or improper in the State using her school 
fund to pay up her own bonds at their present depreciated market 
value, the resolution seemed to him to be placing the character of 
the State in a most unenviable position. The whole project, when 
taken together, contemplates, under the agency and action of the 
State, by solemn constitutional provision, not only to provide for 
purchasing the bonds, at a brokerage rate, from the creditors, but 
it carries with it a determination to make a palpable distinction 


in the payment of interest in favor of the bonds held by the State. 


Mr. D. said, I say State, for I cannot separate the State from the 
people—or make a distinction between one fund, owned by 
the people of the State, and another. Any act which may be per- 
formed by the State, for the benefit of the people of the State, and 
their children, and particularly in the most imposing of all forms— 


by a convention of the representatives of the people of the State, 
_ assembled to remodel their organic law, will never be viewed in 


any other light by the civilized world than the act of the State— 
the people of the State. 

It will be useless for us to say that it is intended for a separate 
department of the State government—that is for a special purpose. 


178 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


In the minds of the disinterested we cannot make a distinction, — 
particularly when the proposition is coupled with the provision 
that the interest on the bonds, bought by the State, shall be punc- 


tually paid out of the first money in the treasury, while at the same _ 


time we cannot pay more than ome per cent. on bonds of a similar 
character held by our creditors, who have the public faith solemn- 
ly pledged for their redemption. 

When our creditors contemplate the character and full force 
of this project, it does appear to me that quite a different impres- 
sion will be created upon the minds of our bondholders than some ~ 
gentlemen anticipate. I think it more likely that they will see 


in the scheme a disposition to speculate and shave our own obli- 


gations, and that having the power to ‘‘prefer our creditors,” we 
unblushingly prefer ourselves as a creditor of ourselves. After 
we have taken this step, so partial to ourselves—so yielding to a 
feeling of unjustifiable cupidity, it will be useless for us to allege 
that it was done for a laudable purpose—for the enhancement of 
a sacred fund. 

I am aware, said Mr. D., that it is a forcible appeal to the 
popular impulses—an appeal in favor of the education of the 
youth of our State, but the objections I urge are an impassable ~ 
barrier between myself and the project. I would gladly support 
any feasible plan for the augmentation of the school fund, but it 
must be an honorable one. We all, doubtless, have the same 
object in view, but differ as to the means of attaining that object. 

There is another objection which I have, which is, to the prac- 
tical effect which this mode of increasing the school fund must 
and will have upon the people in the way of a tax; not direct, but 
which seems to me not altogether indirect. For illustration: 
say we now raise a direct tax of $50,000 per annum, and pay it 
out as interest on the school fund. Now suppose, to make the 
illustration clear, that we were in a situation to invest all the - 
school fund in States bonds, at fifty cents to a dollar, with a view 
to double the principal nominally, and to double the interest sub- 
stantially, and in fact, and at the same time contemplate the 
prompt payment of the whole amount of school fund now doubled 
by this honest(?) speculation, as gentlemen please to consider it, 
will we not have to provide for the payment of the additional 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 23, 1847 179 


$50,000 of interest per annum, by a direct tax upon the people? 
which must be in addition to the present heavy rate of taxation, 
or by absorbing that much of our present means of paying the 
interest we are now paying on our bonds. I think this will be 
well understood by our bondholders as, to some extent, practi- 
cally repudiating the interest, at least, on our debt; and the 
people will, understand, distinctly feel the additional tax. But 
gentlemen say this is only to effect the subject so far as the school 
fund shall hereafter be received, but, sir, if the principle is not 
right in the whole extent, it cannot be because the transaction is 
small or limited. 

I object, also, said Mr. D., to sending an agent into the market 
with this sacred fund, intended to store the minds of our youth 
with knowledge, and an appreciation of correct morals and princi- 
ples, subjecting it to the losses and misfortunes heretofore ex- 
perienced in our monetary transactions. I doubt the propriety 
of risking this money in this wild speculation, when I am im- 
pressed that it is more than suspected that there are large amounts 
of spurious bonds in circulation so like the genuine that the men 
who made them can hardly distinguish the true from the false.]? 


Mr. LOGAN asked if the gentleman from Montgomery, who 
opposed this amendment, was prepared to say that the debt to 
the school fund should fare the same fate as the other debts of the 
State and that no provision should be made towards its payment. 
We were not able to pay our debt, but should we neglect to advance 
or increase our school fund, until we were able to pay that debt. 
We had a right to prefer debts. It was a well established legal 
principle that a man can prefer a debt in one creditor’s hands to 
that of another. If this plan be adopted and we purchased these 
bonds the people will have no hesitation to pay the whole interest 
when they know it is to be applied to the advancement of educa- 
tion, and the means of improving the morals and integrity of the 
people. The present question before them was a single one; the 
propriety of appropriating the school fund to the purchase of these 
State bonds. It had nothing to do with the township money. 


3-The full report of Dement’s remarks printed in the weekly Illinois 
State Register of July 2, is here substituted for a brief general summary. 


be prejudiced by having other subjects connected with the dis- 
cussion of it. He had lived in this county fifteen years, and h 
out profitable or otherwise depended on the sort of men you choose 
for your commissioners. During the whole of the time he ha 
years, then the commissioner squandered a large slice of the fund. 
He might also instance a case of the same kind that occurred 1 in 
Mr. GEDDES was in favor of the plan of the gentleman from 4 
Sangamon, because it made the fund permanent and safe and 
man from Morgan. q 
Mr. KNOWLTON expressed himself at some length in favor — 
could see no dishonesty in the plan and would view it merely as a __ 
business transaction. Those who held the bonds might or might ~ 
less than the full amount, and they might retain them till the a 
proposition that the township fund should be used up in the pur- ; 
chase of the State bonds. __ t 
the plan if carried out affect the honor or integrity of the State. — 
He did not think that anyone there believed the State could with — 
> 
; 


was certain that the question whether the township funds turned — 
lived here, they had had prudent commissioners, except for two 
Macoupin. ¢ 
increased it. He was also in favor of the suggestion of the gentle- 
of the amendment and in reply to the gentleman from Lee. He © 
not sell their bonds at 50 cents, no one could compel them to take 
State was able to pay the whole sum. He was opposed to the = 
Mr. KNOX said, that the only question with him was did i 
its present resources, ever be able to pay the interest on the State 


debt. And how was it to be paid? When, by the increase of 
population the wealth and means of the State were enlarged. And — 
in his opinion the proceedings of this Convention had much to do — 
with it. Suppose we go to our creditors and tell them our circum-_ 
stances and ask them shall we make a provision in our constitution z, 
for the education and moral improvement of our children, he was - a 
sure they would reply, yes, do so, and let it be a liberal one. — 
There is a provision in our law, made by the Legislature to build : 
school houses, and the property of non-residents was taxed to pay — 
it, and he had heard some of them say they were glad that such a — 
tax had been levied, because it would increase the value of their — 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 23, 1847 181 


on. 


Mr. MASON thought that so far from the present question 
involving a principle of dishonesty, on which ground objections 


had been made, that it presented itself most favorably in a moral 
_ point of view. There were many who held ourstock, which was now 
_ yery low, and who could not afford to live on fancy stocks or upon 
_ promises to pay, which never were redeemed, and, if in case this 
__ passed our stock would rise in the market as he was sure it would, 


_ these persons might dispose of it to some advantage. 


Mr. THOMAS moved the previous question. Ayes 65—Noes 
66; not seconded. 

A motion to adjourn till to-morrow was lost. Ayes 48. 

On motion, the Convention adjourned till 3 o’clock, P. m. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr.DEITZ briefly explained the nature of his amendment. 

Mr. ROUNTREE said, he was not in favor of binding the 
Legislature to invest this fund in the State bonds, but he would 
like to see it so amended as to read—“‘in stocks most safe and 
productive,” and the interest only to be distributed. He thought 
it very probable that in twenty years the proposition of the gentle- 
man from Sangamon might appear a little exceptionable. 

Mr. WILLIAMS thought it sufficient only to understand the 
proposition to be in favor of it. 

Mr. LOGAN apologized for speaking again upon thisquestion, 
inasmuch as he felt a great interest in it; it was one of his hobbys 
[sic]. After some remarks upon the practice of the Legislature 
in drawing the gold and silver belonging to this fund for the purpose 
of paying their per diem, he said he thought we were on the eve of 
some great speculation. And he appealed to the Convention not 
to leave with the Governor and Legislature, the power of investing 
this fund in any scheme they thought proper. Very soon some 
person or another would have a railroad or a plank road company, 
and it could be calculated up that by investing this fund in the 
stock that it would yield some 18 per cent. The Governor would, 
if permitted to act according to the suggestion of the Legislature © 
be sure to invest it in some moonshine stock which, like when the 


182 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


system of internal improvements was before them, would be shown 
by figures “which could not lie,” would yield immense profits. 


The fund would be safe in the State stock, but if you left the power 


to the Legislature, to invest it as they thought proper, they would 
run mad as they had run mad before. . 

Mr. DAVIS, of Massac, inquired what was to be done for the ~ 
interest on those bonds not bought up by this fund? And being 
answered that it was to remain as at present, he opposed the dis- 
crimination as unjust to the other holders of the bonds. 

Mr. BROCKMAN said, he thought when he told the gentlemen 
in the morning that he was with them, that the bonds were to be © 
purchased at par, and not at the market price. Understanding 
now that this was contemplated he would vote against it. States, 
in his opinion, were like individuals, and what was dishonest inan _ 
individual was dishonest in a State. Things cast their shadows 
before them. It was said we were on the eve of a speculation, 
and the first thing going that way was a proposition to swindle 
the creditors of the State. It had also been said that the consti- 
tution would not live long enough to see the State debt paid; he 
was afraid it would not live at all, although it was yet in embryo, so 
many odious plans and provisions were to be engrafted upon it, 
he did not think it would be adopted. He supposed another part 
of the speculation would be in relation to a bank, but when that 
come[s] before the Convention we will attend to them. 

Mr. PALMER, of Marshall, said, that he had listened to all 
that had been said upon the question, and his mind had come to 
the same conclusion before the discussion that it had now. He 
had looked at the foundation of the two debts of the State of 
Illinois; the first was contracted by the State with individuals who ~ 
lent us the money, they at the same time acting as their own 
agents, and he had always thought that both parties were in fault 
in relation to the matter. Though not in the Legislature, he read 
the newspapers and journals of the day—indeed, they were his 
reading except when engaged with the bible and other religious — 
works. He thought the State unwise in the undertaking, and the 
gentlemen who loaned the money should have known that the — 
works could never be completed.—The other is a sacred debt—it is 
a debt of the orphans and widows. It always took two parties to 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 23, 1847 183 


acovenant. Illinois had an agent who stood up for her, but the 
orphans had no one. The State laid hold of this sacred fund, and 
appropriated it to pay their own expenses; and now, when they 
call for their share of the fund, they receive Auditor’s warrants. 
He was in favor of honesty, and could see no injustice or dishonesty 
in the plan now before them. The stocks of the State were not in 
the hands of the original holders, but were held by brokers and 
stock-jobbers, and if any person desired to buy them up they 
were at liberty [to] do so, and at the very lowest price, and why 
not Illinois do so with her school fund; particularly when the 
fatherless and the orphan, who can never expect a schooling except 
by the school fund, were in numbers throughout the State. He 
hoped gentlemen would all take it upon themselves to assist the 
widow in educating the rising generation, and after that he would 
vote for taxation to pay the whole debt. He had been a stickler 
for 40 years on the side of honesty, and had fought in the cause of 
honesty and religion, and almost 66 cold winters had rolled over 
his head while engaged in the study of honesty, yet he had been 
unable to discover the least dishonesty in the whole plan. 

Mr. ARCHER said, that as this was a mere resolution of 
enquiry, he would vote for it. This was a question of the utmost 
interest, and this debate which has ensued on a mere resolution 
of enquiry gave evidence of the deep feeling on the subject. He 
was not disposed to discuss it in its present shape, but would 
remark that he could not see those glaring faults in the plan, which 
others pretended to have discovered. 

Mr. WOODSON advocated the adoption of the resolution, 
because, by investing the school fund in this way, no harm could 
be done. If he understood the plan, it was to invest a portion or 
the whole of the school fund in State bonds, which could be pur- 
chased, say at 40 to 50, and thereby double the amount of the 
fund, and of the interest that would be distributed for the purpose 
of education. Who could be injured by such a plan? Illinois 
would be greatly benefitted. The bondholder could not complain, 
for the very fact of this investment would enhance the value of 
the bonds. If, therefore, it was not unjust to them, was it immoral 
to make use of the fund. If not unjust nor dishonest, we have 
a right to prefer the credit or whom we will pay.—This was a principle 


184 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS sy Ne 


of law, so well settled that no lawyer would deny it. This fund 
belongs to the children of the State, and she has a right to invest 
it in such a way asis best for their interest. If this plan was not 
dishonest, enhanced the value of the bonds, was not unjust, injured 
no one, and increased the fund—why should not the Convention 


act in the matter? The Legislature had been dishonest in appro- 
priating the money, and the Convention should adopt some 


measures to close the door against anything further of the kind. 

Mr. NORTON was in favor of giving this resolution the course 
of all resolutions of enquiry; he would vote for it, but he was not 
altogether prepared to vote for the plan set forth by it, because 
he feared there might be many serious and unsurmountable 
objections to it. He thought well of the school fund, and was 
ready to go with anyone, in furthering and advancing the cause, 
but he was unwilling to adopt anything unjust or dishonest. If 
he understood the proposition correctly, we were to go into market 
to buy up our own stock at a depreciated value, and at the loss of 
our creditors.—Would they not say to us, it is your duty to educate 
your children at your own cost and not ours. He supposed that 
no one would say that it would be just were we to buy up our 
bonds and thus get rid of the debt, but the excuse for the present 
plan is, that it is not for the benefit of the State but.for the youth. 
Mr. N. then stated the plan in detail, and said, suppose we did 
buy up one hundred thousand dollars of the bonds, on which the 
State was now paying two per cent., and add it to the school fund, 


where we will have to pay six per cent., where would this difference 


of four per cent. come from? It would come from our other 


creditors and bondholders, for if we were now able only to pay two — 


per cent. of interest on our debt, would we not be reducing our 
means to pay even that, if we paid six per cent. on that portion of 
our bonds thus purchased by the school fund. Well might our 


creditors say, that we should educate our children ourselves, and 


not by using their means. And, sir, there may be persons holding 
these bonds who are not able to contribute to the education of our 
children, and how can they educate their own children? He said 
the same principles would apply to the State as to individuals. 
Suppose, said he, I had a quantity of my paper afloat which I 
was unable to pay, and it was worth but 40 cents, at the same 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 23, 1847 185 


ne there was in my hands a legacy belonging to my child, would 
be honest in me to buy up with this fund a portion of my own 


Mr. KINNEY of Bureau advocated the plan contained in the 
_ amendment. 

_ Mr. THORNTON made a few remarks in reply to Mr. Norton, 
and the question was taken on the amendment proposed by Mr. 
_ Derrz, and it was carried—yeas 76. 

_ The two other amendments were then adopted, and the reso- 
_ lution as amended was passed. 

The report of the committee on Education, submitted this 


i Mr. GREGG hoped the resolution reported by the committee 
- would be postponed till Saturday, as the gentleman from Jo 
‘4 Daviess, who was chairman of the committee, was absent and 
_ would be till that day. He was in favor of the resolution, and 
concurred with the gentleman from Madison in every word he 
had uttered. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison hoped the resolution would be 
a _ postponed. 
ry Mr. CHURCHILL moved to postpone till Tuesday. 
a Mr. WILLIAMS thought it unnecessary to postpone as the 
_ resolution was one of simple inquiry only, and which might as 


___ well be passed now as at any other time. 

# Mr. EVEY expressed a similar view. 

ch Mr. GREGG then moved that the subject be postponed till 
_ Monday next. 


x Mr. KNOWLTON did not think it was necessary for the 
ae chairman of the committee to be here, for a proper discussion of 
__ the subject. 

Mr. SERVANT thought the resolution might be referred 
__ without debate, but if they were to debate it he thought courtesy 
_ would favor a postponement. 


186 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS © 


Mr. PINCKNEY advocated a discussion at once, as he under- 
stood that the committee had reported the resolution to elicit from 
the Convention an expression upon the subject. 


Mr. CONSTABLE offered the following ance to the 


resolution: 


“Also, as to the propriety of creating a sigkiew fand connected 


with the debt due from the State to the college, school and semi- 
nary fund, so as to provide for its early repayment, and the 
investment of that fund in the bonds of this State at their market 


value, at the same time contemplating the prompt payment of 


interest on the bonds so purchased by the said fund.” 

The amendment was adopted, and the resolution as amended 
was passed. 

Mr. JONES made a report of the majority of the committee 

-on the Revenue; which he moved to lay on the table and two 
hundred copies be printed. 

Mr. THOMAS made a report from the minority of the com- 
mittee on the Revenue, which was laid on the table and two 
hundred copies order to be printed. 

Messrs. THomas and Z. Casey made some remarks, each 
upon the nature of the reports. 


[Mr. THOMAS moved that it be laid upon the table and 
printed; and accompanied the motion with some remarks in rela- 
tion to the views entertained by the minority of the committee. 
Revenue, he remarked, lay at the very foundation of government, 


and without it a Government could not exist. This being ad- — 


mitted, he said, the great consideration was in regard to the sub- 


jects or objects of taxation. The minority had attempted to 


make some specifications in regard to this matter; and their 
reason for doing so was, that it was a thing which was not usually 
found in the constitutions of other States; and the consequence 
was that disputes more frequently arose in the legislatures of 
those States, upon the subject of taxation than upon any other 
subject. It was desirable, as far as possible, to place this subject 
beyond dispute. There had also in this State, been great difh- 
culty and much controversy in regard to the mode of taxation. 
That difficulty had grown out of a provision in the constitution of 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 23, 1847 187 


Illinois which was not found in many, if in any, of the constitu- 
tions of other States, and that was, that property was to be taxed 
according to valuation—so that every one should pay a tax in 
__ proportion to the value of the property which he possessed. 
This provision of the constitution it was argued by some, excluded 
from taxation the persons of citizens, and it was contended that 
it took away the right of the State legislature to levy a poll tax; 
ey and that was the reason, perhaps, why no poll tax had been estab- 
‘e lished since the organization of the State government. Another 
question of great difficulty had arisen, and [was] discussed very 
extensively, in the courts of law, in regard to the manner of ascer- 
taining the value of property, and what taxes were to be assessed. 
There was great difficulty in ascertaining the value of property, 
in a large taxable district, because its value was so much a matter 
of opinion, that it was hard to get an agreement of opinion from 
even three persons in the same county. 

It had therefore been contended by some that under the con- 
stitution, as it now exists in Illinois, the legislature had no power 
to fix a valuation upon the lands throughout the State in any 
other manner than by appointing persons to make a valuation; 
and the laws which had been passed, and imposed upon the State 
ever since it was a State, fixing a valuation and classifying the 
lands, were unconstitutional, because, as it was said, the legisla- 
ture had no power to do it. That provision of law had been 
changed, he believed, in 1828 or ’29, and the lands were valued 
thereafter according to their true valuation. It was then found 
that the revenue of the State fell short, and that we had not the 
means of going on with the State government. This made it 
necessary for the State government to fix a minimum valuation; 
and they fixed it at three dollars per acre. This, he had no doubt, 
was done with an honest intent; and it was very possible that the 
men who voted for that minimum were satisfied that by doing so 
they placed a large quantity of the lands of the State at a valua- 
tion greater than they were really worth; but they had no other 
mode of getting along. They had to adopt some method, and 
this was deemed the most expedient. He supposed that if, in the 
same minimum law, there had been a provision that all the lands 
should be taxed in proportion to their true value, there would have 


188 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION Sv 


been an equality of taxation; because, if eh poorest eat was 
valued at three dollars per acre, it would be easy to calculate 
what the richest land would be worth. It was desirable to get — 
rid of the difficulty under which the government had so long labored — 
in regard to this matter; and this was the object of the minority 
of the committee in reporting a classification, and a valuation hy 


the legislature. The operation of it would be, that the legislature 


would provide for the classification of lands, and there would be 
one man appointed in each county to classify it according to 


quality and situation; and when this had been done, its valuation — a 
would be found prescribed in the law. This provision, it would 


be perceived, was expressly intended for the raising of revenue; 
but he hoped that gentlemen would not take fright at it until they 
had examined it, and considered the true situation in which the 
matter stood, because without some such provision, by which 
revenue could be collected, we might as well give up our system 
of government at once. A government could not subsist upon 
credit. Our auditor’s warrants were down to eighty cents in the 
dollar, and now the school fund was about to be taken away from — 
the legislature; without such a provision, therefore, this conven- — 


tion might as well adjourn, and give up the State. He made “i : 
these remarks by way of apology for introducing into the conven- 


tion a proposition which looked so strongly for raising a revenue. — 
It was true that the legislature might so provide as to make — 
the valuation very small or very large; but there were limitations 


on the power of the legislature, and upon the power of the county Ao 


officers executing the law, which were essential to certainty in the 
assessment and collection of revenue. If these provisions were 
omitted in the constitution which was to be formed, the legislative - 
department would have unlimited power over the subject; and 
they would be in the same condition in which they had heretofore 
been. He hoped that no gentleman would form an opinion 


against the proposition without looking at the consequences bares a 


would result from a different course. 

Mr. Z. CASEY said he imagined that the question upon Hie 
merits of the proposition was not now properly before the Con- — 
vention, the present question being to lay upon the table and print 
the report of the minority of the committee. He might be per- — 


that, while one proposed to ascertain the worth of property 
aluation, to be made by inspectors appointed for that pur- 


te of tax sufficient to answer the purposes of government; 
other contemplated that there should be an arbitrary valuation 
d upon the property. He was opposed to an arbitrary valu- 
. It seemed to him that the other mode was the proper one; 
other respects he approved of the report of the majority of 
aoe ne would not oppose the aes of the report 


DEMENT, from the committee on the Legislative 
ment, made a report—a motion was made to print—and 


XV. THURSDAY, JUNE 24, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. Hate. . 
The motion pending, to print 200 copies of the report of the 
Legislative committee, made yesterday, was decided in the 
affirmative. — 


Mr. CONSTABLE introduced a resolution directing the Mg 


door-keeper to contract for a sufficient amount of ice for the use 
of the members of the Convention. : 

Mr. SCATES offered an amendment a such members as 
choose to pay therefor.” 

Mr. SERVANT offered an amendment—“that no person shall 
use any of the said ice unless he furnish his portion of the money 
to purchase the same.” 


Mr. WITT moved to lay the amendments on the table. — : 


Carried. 

Mr. SERVANT was opposed to laying the resolution on the 
table. If he thought that his constituents were not willing that 
he should have a lump of ice in this hot weather he would leave 
the Convention and go home in disgust. A motion was made to 
lay the resolution on the table, and the yeas and nays were — 
ordered. They resulted—yeas 108, nays 34. 4 

Mr. ARCHER, from the committee on Organization of 
Departments and Officers connected with the Executive Depart- 
ment, reported back sundry resolutions, with amendments to the 
constitution—that the Auditor of Public Accounts shall be 
elected every four years, and a salary of $1,000; a State Treas- 
urer elected for a term of two years, and a salary of $800; a 
Secretary of State to hold office same time as Governor, with a 
salary of $800; and that the General Assembly should authorize 
the advertising for proposals for public printing, to be let out to 


the lowest bidder; and that the subject of a State’s Attorney be is 


referred to the committee on Judiciary. Which report, on motion, 
was laid on the table, and 200 copies ordered to be printed. 
Mr. GREGG, from the committee on the Division of the 
190 


THURSDAY, JUNE 24, 1847 19! 


State into Senatorial and Representative Districts, reported a 
resolution calling for 30 outline maps, and printing 200 copies of 
the census.—He stated, that the committee were unanimously of 


opinion that the maps should be had. It had been ascertained 


that no copies of the census were in the office of the Secretary of 
State, as had been suggested the other day, and it would be 
conceded that it was necessary they should have the census 
printed for their use. 
Mr. ECCLES doubted the necessity of procuring the maps. 
Mr. WEST said, he had inquired at the Auditor’s office and 
had been informed that the maps could be furnished by Monday 
next, at a cost not exceeding six bits each. 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon said, he had a map that had 


___ been furnished him at the last session of the Legislature, which 


had cost but 50 cents; it was at the service of the chairman of the 
committee. His map had the population of every county marked 
upon its face. 

Mr. SHUMWAY offered an amendment, “that the number of 
free white population in each county should be marked on the 
maps.” Carried, and then the resolution was adopted. 

Mr. SCATES offered a resolution, that the committee on 
Finance be directed to inquire into the expediency of reporting a 
provision to tax the government lands; which resolution, after 
explaining it, he moved be postponed till Wednesday next.— 
Carried. 

Mr. DAWSON offered a resolution directing an inquiry by 
the committee on Rights, to report a prohibition of duelling 
Carried. 

Mr. WEAD offered a resolution appointing a special committee 
of eleven to inquire into the expediency of abolishing the county 
commissioners’ court, and report a plan of organization of town- 
ships. Carried. 

Mr. GEDDES offered a resolution that the committee on 
Military Affairs should inquire into the expediency of adding to 
the 2d section of the sth article of the constitution a provision 
that all persons who do not perform military duty should pay a 
fine of from fifty cents to a dollar, which should be added to the 
school fund. 


192 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


He said, that from his little experience in such ae he ‘ 
had come to the conclusion that our present military organization 4 
was a mere farce. Nine-tenths of the people do no military duty; — 
he did not know, but supposed it was owing to the inefficiency of © 


the law. It had become so now, that no one but those who 


pleased did military duty. If the constitution of the United States 


did not require otherwise he would like to see the whole system 
abolished. These fines would amount to a considerable amount, 


and if added to the school fund would be a good increase. Military — 
training had become useless, for if they desired to effect anything © 


they should be kept together a week and do camp duty. 


Mr. CHURCH offered an amendment—“that any poll taki 


levied and collected shall be in lieu of military duty.” 
Mr. BROCKMAN opposed any fines for a non-performance 


of military duty; he was in favor of a full organization. In his — 
county they were organized better than in any other in es M 


and they collected no fines. 
Mr. SHIELDS moved to lay the resolution and amendment 
on the table. Carried. 


Mr. ROUNTREE offered a resolution that the committee — 
on the Revenue should be instructed to inquire into the expediency ~ 


of reporting a provision in the constitution fixing a maximum rate 
of taxation to continue for years. 


He said, that he desired that the committee should renee ae 
maximum rate of taxation, beyond which the Legislature could 


not go. This course would, in his opinion, do away with much of the 
prejudice now felt by emigrants against settling in our State, and 
which, owing to our large debt and the necessity for taxation, 


deters many from coming here who otherwise would. It would 
allay all doubt and uncertanity about the amount of interest each ~ 
man would be called upon to pay, and our citizens would be able — 


to fix a real value upon their land. It would throw light upon the 


pathway of the emigrant, and he may be induced to settle in 
Illinois instead of seeking more favored lands unburthened with a — 


public debt. In fixing this maximum, a due regard should be 


had to the rates as fixed by our adjacent States, so that we should ~ 


not exceed theirs, and turn the tide of emigration from our own 
soil into theirs. This was manifest, for if we fixed it at $2 and 


THURSDAY, JUNE 24, 1847 193 


, 


Missouri at $1, she would get all the emigration, and if we fixed 
‘it too high we would be adopting the best plan of rendering the 


surrounding States more advantageous for emigrants than our 
own. He thought that, inasmuch as retrenchment would be 


carried into the various branches of the government, our present 


rate would be sufficient. 
Mr. ECCLES suggested that the object of the gentleman 
would be accomplished just as well when the reports of the 


committee, made yesterday, came before the house, by offering 


his plan as an amendment. The majority of the committee had 
reported a system of taxation ad valorem, and the minority a 
classification and a minimum; when these came properly before 


_ the Convention, if he thought proper to change either, he might 


move in the way of amendment. 

Mr. ROUNTREE replied, that we had the ad valorem 
principle now, and the rate fixed was two mills. The object of 
the resolution was to inquire into the expediency of fixing the rate 
of the maximum. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery, thought the resolution ought to 
pass. He was in favor of fixing in the constitution a rate of taxa- 
tion above which the Legislature should never go, and another 
rate below which it should not fall. We should settle this matter 
permanently and break of[f] the system of demagogueism 
practised by candidates for the Legislature. The great theme on 
the stump was that we were taxed to death, and that the taxes 
should be reduced, and these men came here to carry out this 
scheme, and the matter was never settled. It would also 
serve the character of the State abroad, when it would be known 
that we had fixed in our constitution a permanent rate of taxation 
to be applied to the payment of our State debt, and to wipe out 
the black stain of repudiation which was upon us. 

Mr. SCATES had no objection to a resolution of inquiry but 
he was satisfied that this Convention would never adoptamaximum 
rate of taxation. Revenue was as vital to a government as blood 
is to the human system, and in attempting to measure the amount 
of it was too often destructive to the whole system: suppose in a 
case of rebellion or civil insurrection, or of a foreign invasion, 
when the whole and the utmost means of the people would be 


194 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


required for the defence of the State, we are stopped by a consti- 
tutional provision from raising the necessary means to meet the 
emergency, a constitutional provision restraining us from in- 
creasing the taxes. The only maximum he would vote for would be 
so cents on the dollar, because he believed that half of our property 
would be sufficient for any emergency. A maximum by law was 
not so bad, because that could be repealed, but not so with one 
in the constitution. 


Mr. THOMPSON said, that he had had an opportunity of 


testing this matter two years ago when travelling in the Eastern © 


States. He had then an opportunity of becoming acquainted with 


the opinions entertained in relation to this State, and was 


astonished to hear the deep rooted objections and prejudices 


against emigration to this State, on account of ourdebt. He 


returned and on the boat he met some six or seven hundred emi- _ 


grants, and they said they were going to Michigan; he asked them 
why not come to Illinois; why not stop at Chicago? They answer- 
ed, Illinois has a debt too great. And to carry out what the gen- 
tleman from Jefferson said about the life blood of the system— 
they added—you touch one jugular, with your heavy taxes, the 


very moment we come there. After he had got home, he looked — 


over some statistics, to see how Illinois stood, in this respect, with 
other States in the Union, and found that we stood much 
lower than many other States. He believed that if this matter 
was left with the General Assembly, it, being governed by patriotic 
desires to encourage emigrants, would never have high taxes. He 
said that he believed that the prejudices existing against Illinois, 
was [sic] the work of other States, and their agents. He would vote 
for the resolution. 


Mr. Z. CASEY said, that perhaps it would be proper in him 
to state that this subject had been enquired into, and discussedin 


committee, and they thought it would be better to report, and let 


the Convention fill up the rate of the maximum, below or above 
which the Legislature should never go, or at least until certain 
objects had been accomplished. He would suggest that as the 
committee had reported, it would be as well, when that report 
came up, for the gentleman to present his plan, and not to ask the 
committee to re-enquire into a question which they had acted upon. 


THURSDAY, JUNE 24, 1847 195 


Mr. ROUNTREE said, he would rather the resolution 


should go back to the committee. 


Mr. HARVEY said, that he was always in favor of voting for 


_ resolutions of enquiry, but his mind was so made up, and his 


opinions so fixed, upon this subject, that for once he would vote 
against even a resolution of enquiry. If we were to fix a rate in 
the constitution, and the people were to become more able to pay 
their debt, here was a barrier against their paying it, except 
in the slow means which this rate would allow. He was not afraid 


of the debt, or of the people’s not paying it. The idea of repudia- 


tion is not entertained by any of the people, and he was prepared 
to say, for he had not the information before him nor did he know 
the amount of the debt, but that the people now were able to pay 
the whole amount of interest. He hoped the resolution would 
not even go to the people. 

Mr. HARDING said, he hoped the resolution would pass. He 
was not willing to give the Legislature unlimited power of taxing 
the property of the people. 

Mr. LOUDON made a few remarks, when the previous ques- 
tion was moved and seconded. 

And the vote being taken on the adoption of the resolution, it 
was carried. 

Mr. KENNER offered a resolution, directing the committee 
on the Legislative Department to enquire into the expediency of 
drafting a provision prohibiting the Legislature from passing any 
law the power to pass which is not expressed in the constitution. 
And also that the yeas and nays should always be taken on the 
final passage of every bill, and that a majority of all the members 
elect shall be necessary to pass a bill. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, that as the committee have already 
reported on this subject, he moved to lay the resolution on the table. 

Mr. THORNTON asked him to withdraw, and he said there 
was a difference between the report and resolution. 

The resolution was then laid on the table. 

Mr. KITCHELL offered a resolution, directing &¢., the 
committee on Law Reform to provide for a prohibition of the 
Legislature amending any general law, till the same be published. 
Carried. 


bas gee ed v4 ; a 


196 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI ons 


Mr. CHURCHILL offered a resolution, appointing a com- 
mittee to inquire into the agricultural, mineralogical and other 
resources of State; which was carried. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough offered a Feneleitien 
directing the president to issue certificates to the members for the 
amount of their pay and mileage to the 24th inst. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean, moved to lay the resolution on the 
table; which was lost. 

Mr. CONSTABLE hoped the resolution would not pass till 
its propriety had been discussed. Though he did not admit that 
we were governed by the law of the Legislature, still as it was the © 
opinion of the Convention, we should conform to its provisions. 
He doubted whether we had the power to withdraw money from ~ 
the treasury until we had completed the session. 

Mr. GEDDES, though not himself in want of money, there 
might be some gentleman who had need of the money, and they 
ought to be permitted to have it. 

Mr. PALMER, of Macoupin, read from the law, and said, 
there was no force in the objection and the only question was, 
should the members have it. He thought they ought, and the 
objection was untenable. 

Mr. WOODSON offered an amendment to the resolution, 
“that such sum should not exceed two dollars a day.” 

Mr. DAVIS, of Massac, moved to lay the amendment on the 
table; the yeas and nays were ordered, and resulted, ree 78, nays 
60. 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved to amend by adding that “the 
president should issue such certificates every Saturday.” 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, he was not wealthy nor 
had he much money, but in case he did, he had friends from whom 
he could obtain what he wanted. But he could not understand 
how gentlemen, who had voted in the Legislature for four dolls. 
a day for themselves and for this Convention, and who had voted 
to take the gold and silver from the treasury, belonging to the 
school fund, and to the children of the State, to pay themselves 
with, should now be found voting for this amendment. He 
regretted this proposition to take $2 a day had been introduced. 

He would,'in due course of time, introduce a resolution pro- 


‘hb 
Vs 
7) 
Mi 


THURSDAY, JUNE 24, 1847 197 


viding that those who voted for and presented resolutions allowing 
members $2 a day should be compelled to take only what they 
voted for, and then let gentlemen come forward with their patriot- 
ism and Buncumbe resolutions in proper style. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, it was not very difficult to see that 
the remarks of the gentleman were directed to him; and he wished 
to say a few words in explanation of his course in the Legislature, 
not because any feeling had been excited, for he felt not in any 
way the force of the remarks. He had performed his duty as a 
member of the Legislature; the manner in which he had performed 
that duty had been before his constituents, and he flattered himself 
that they had shown their approval of his conduct. He was not 
a $2 a day man. He had voted for paying the members of the 
Legislature $4 a day, and had voted for allowing the members of 
this Convention $4 a day, because he thought that sum not 
too much. 

He then explained at length in relation to the appropriation 
of the money belonging to the school fund. He said that there 
were men here who held Auditor’s warrants—speculators and 
brokers—and who hearing that the money was in the treasury 
were about to demand it; and the Treasurer had recommended 
them to appropriate it to the payment of their expenses. 

Messrs. MINSHALL, DAVIS, of Montgomery, and CON- 
STABLE continued the debate. 

Mr. WILLIAMS thought that the Convention should feel 
themselves under great obligations to the members of the last 
Legislature, for their kind provision for them of $4 a day. And 
that we should be more kind and tender towards them in our 


speeches. They had assumed all the responsibility of making 


this provision for us and we should feel quite comfortable under 
their provision, and should speak more kindly of them. He had 
voted for our receiving but $2 a day, because if we were going to 
cut down the pay of all future Legislatures we should fortify our 
precept by our example. 

Mr. BOND explained the object he had in view in offering the 
resolution which he did at the opening of the Convention. 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac said, that he was in the last Legislature 
and had voted for $4 a day, because he thought that sum 


198 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


was not too much. He had not voted for the bill calling for this 
Convention, because he considered some of its provisions uncon- 
stitutional; however, if the item appropriating $4 a day for the — 
pay of the members of this Convention had been an isolated item, 
he would have voted for it. The course of the gentleman from _ 
Wabash was highly honorable, and tended to break up the spirit 
of demagoguism. He hoped that they would not leave this — 
Convention until they had fixed the pay of the members of the 
Legislature at a permanent sum; and thus break up all this — 
contrivance and management about the pay of the members of — 
the Legislature. He was now as he was at the session of the ~ 
Legislature, and when the appropriation came up to pay the © 
members $4 a day, he had voted for it, because he thought it was _ 
not too much for a faithful member of the General Assembly. He 
did not think we had power to repeal that part of the act of the 
Legislature which provides for the pay of the members of this — 
Convention; and he had no doubt that if such an act were done 
that a madamus could be got out and the officer compelled to pay 
the sum fixed by law. He believed that there were but a very ~ 
few of the members of the last Legislature in the Convention, but ~ 
a majority of those who were here were $4 men. 

Messrs. Woopson, Davis of Montgomery, Locan, ConsTABLE 
and SERVANT, continued the debate; which, between the two first, — 
became rather excited and warm, and which was prolonged to 
much length by explanation, queries, &c. 

A motion to adjourn was taken and lost. 

- Mr. PALMER of Macoupin, said, it was to be regretted that 
so much feeling had been shown—they should learn to take every 
thing in good feeling, and to give back in the same spirit. He 
came here from a county where they took and gave everything. — 
He had come here to receive $4 per day, and when he was elected — 
his constituents knew how much he was to receive, and they knew 
also that he would not take anything less. Gentlemen had ~ 
insinuated that those who were disposed to take the $4 per — 
day sheltered themselves behind the act of the Legislature. He — 
sheltered himself behind no law. If there was no law, he would ~ 
vote for $4 a day, because he thought it was no more than just. 
He would use no special pleading, but he would meet them in the ~ 


THURSDAY, JUNE 24, 1847 199 


general issue. He had listened with his accustomed admiration 
to what had fallen from the gentleman from Sangamon and 


- admired its ingenuity. He had admired that gentleman from the 


first time he made his acquaintance, for his never-failing ingenuity, 
and he did not know but that it was, in some degree, owing to the 
fact that the very first case he (Mr. P.) had in the supreme court 
the gentleman from Sangamon had trembled him out of it. 

He hoped the resolution would pass. Many of the members 
may want the money, and he appealed to the gentleman from 
Wabash to withdraw his amendment. Although, said he, I would 
not care if the money could be drawn out weekly. He knew what 
he could do with it. And there were many of his constituents 
who would be very glad to receive weekly remittances from him. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, that after the good natured speech of 
the gentleman, he would withdraw his amendment. 

And the resolution was passed. 

Motions to adjourn till to-morrow at 8 1-2 and g and Io, a. M., 


_and till this afternoon at 7, 6 1-2, 6 and 5 were made and lost. 


And then the Convention adjourned to meet at 4 P. M. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. ROBBINS offered the following resolution: 

_ Resolved, That the committee to provide for the alteration and 
amendment of the constitution inquire into the expediency of 
amending article 7th of the constitution, by substituting in place 
thereof, the following, to-wit: Whenever two-thirds of the 
General Assembly of this State shall think it necessary to alter 
or amend this constitution, they shall propose such alterations or 
amendments to the people, and it shall be the duty of the Governor, 
by proclamation, to lay the same before the people, at least four 
months before the next ensuing election for members of the General 
Assembly; and if a majority of all the members of both branches 
of the General Assembly, elected at the said election, shall approve 
of all or part of the said proposed amendments, the amendment 
or amendments so approved of, shall be submitted to the people 
for their ratification or rejection, and such amendments as shall 
be so ratified by a majority of the legal voters of this State shall 
become a part of the constitution. 


200 a ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Mr. KITCHELL offered a substitute, instructing the com- — 
mittee to report an article, &c., differing slightly with the original. — 

Mr. ECCLES moved to amend the substitute by making i ita 
resolution of inquiry. f 

Mr. KITCHELL said, he had drawn this onbeaeae witha view 
of taking the sense of the Convention. The vote being taken, the — 
amendment was carried. a 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac moved to lay the subject on the table. 
Lost. ‘ 

Mr. DEITZ offered an amendment, that amendments to 
the constitution should not be submitted but once in five years. — 
Lost. ‘ 

And the vote being taken on the substitute, it resulted—yeas 
40, nays 41. No quorum. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison moved to lay the substitute on ~ 
the table—yeas 61, nays 37. No quorum. 

Mr. WITT moved a call of the Convention, and aftarwatde 
withdrew it; and the vote being taken on laying the Bias oo on. 
the table was decided in the affirmative. 

Mr. KENNER offered an amendment. : 

Mr. SCATES said, he had no objection to a resolution of 
inquiry, but he would oppose the principle of giving the Legislature 
power to propose amendments to the constitution. They would 
never let it alone, but at every session would be tinkering at it. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, if there was any force in the remarks 
of the gentleman they would apply as well to the constitution of 
the United States, which allowed amendments to be proposed at 
any time; yet he did not see that Congress was very often tinkering 
the constitution. The gentleman seemed to think that the con- 
servative principles of the State was [sic] collected in that Conven- — 
tion, and that when we went away it would be forever lost; that 
the Legislature nor anybody else would ever go right; that all the — 
wisdom of the State was centered in that Convention, and in 
the gentleman from Jefferson (Mr. Scates) particularly. 

Mr. BROCKMAN agreed with the gentleman from Jefferson. 
He thought stability was required for our safe government, and ~ 
that our constitution should not be left open for amendment. He 
felt confident that the Legislature would be always at work upon it. 


THURSDAY, JUNE 24, 1847 201 


Mr. WHITNEY, though he admired the gentleman from 
Jefferson for the ardor and sincerity with which he supported every 
view taken by him in the Convention, he was compelled to disagree 
with him on this subject. He (Mr. W.) had lived in a State where 
such a provision was in the constitution, and from the years 1821 
to 1836 there had been but few amendments proposed—not more 
than four or five. 

Mr. CROSS of Winnebago moved the previous question— 
seconded and the resolution was adopted. 

Mr. McCALLEN offered a resolution in relation to military 
affairs, but withdrew it at the suggestion of Mr. WHITESIDE, who 
said the committee were ready to report. 

Mr. CONSTABLE offered a resolution, that the committee 
on Bill of Rights inquire, &c., of omitting the restrictions upon 
those people who had rights in common in certain lands, and con- 
tained in article 8, section 8, of the present constitution. 

Mr. SERVANT said, that he had several petitions on the sub- 
ject, and had written home for some information, and when it 
arrived he would like them all to go together before the committee. 

Mr. CONSTABLE then withdrew his resolution. 

Mr. SPENCER offered a resolution that the committee on 
Rights be, &c., report a provision that property of married women 
be exempt from execution. Adopted. 

Mr. LOGAN offered an additional rule that two-thirds of the 
members shall be necessary to constitute a quorum for business, 
but that a less number might order a call of the Convention and 
adjourn. Carried. 

Mr. BOSBYSHELL offered a resolution calling upon the 
Auditor for certain information. Adopted. 

Mr. VERNOR offered a resolution that the committee on 
Legislative Business should inquire, &c., and prohibit any person 
holding two lucrative offices at one time. Carried. 

Mr. KENNER offered a resolution referring to county organ- 
ization; which on motion, was laid on the table till 4th of July, 1849. 

Mr. BOND offered a resolution that the committee on Rights 
be instructed to report a provision prohibiting free negroes from 
emigrating into this State, and that no person shall bring slaves 


202 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS = 


/ 


into this State from other States and set them free, and that 
sufficient penalties be provided to effect the object in view. 

He said, that he thought this the proper time to give this 
question a fair and calm discussion, and had so framed the resolu- 
tion as a test. He proceeded to give his reasons for introducing 
the resolution, and to state the grounds he occupied on this 
question. In doing so, he said, he had no desire to wound the 
feelings of any delegate, or impugn the motives which governed 
other gentlemen who occupied a different position. There was 
no one who had a greater desire to do justice to that class of un- 


fortunate individuals, called free negroes. But they already had — 
become a great annoyance, if not a nuisance, to the people of ~ 


Illinois. While he would do the utmost to protect the rights of 
those who held this kind of property, which was recognized by the 
domestic institutions of sister States, he would do nothing to 


fasten more tightly the bonds by which these people were held in 


slavery. In his part of the State he had seen little settlements of 


these free negroes spring up, and their object was to aid slaves 


from the south to escape their masters. This was not right. But 
while he would not go to a man’s stable, unlock it, and steal there- 
from a horse, he might, if he met a negro whom he thought was 
escaping from his master, not ask the man to give an account of 
himself, and thereby stop him in his flight. He considered that 
there was no use of extending our philanthropy in favor of these 
people, unless we were willing to admit them to the privilege of 


the ballot box, and give them all the rights of freemen and citizens 
of a free republic. Can we, or ought we to, do this? He would ~ 


answer nay. After alluding to the objects of colonization, he 
said, that he wanted no persons to come into this State, unless 
they came with right to be our equals in all things, and as freemen.” 


Mr. LOUDON offered an amendment; which was ruled out — 


of order. ; 
Mr. BROCKMAN said, that the people of his county were 


unanimous in theiropposition tothe emigration |[sic]ofnegroes. The — 
people of Schuyler and Brown were nearly all opposed to it. The 


negroes have no rights in common with the people, they can have 


*A much longer account of Bond's speech may be found in the Sangamo 


Journal, July 1. ‘ 


THURSDAY, JUNE 24, 1847 203 


_ no rights; the distinction between the two races issogreat as to pre- 
clude the possibility of their ever living together upon equal terms. 


Mr. ADAMS moved to amend by striking out all after the 


word “resolved” and inserting the following: “the Legislature 
shall have no power to pass laws of a severe or oppressive character 


applicable to persons of color.” 
A motion to lay the amendment on the table was made, and 
the yeas and nays were ordered and taken—yeas 92, nays 46. 
Messrs. CHurcH and Pinckney explained their position on 
this question. 


Mr. CYRUS EDWARDS’ name being called, he rose and said, 
that if the vote were taken without a word of explanation, it 
might be inferred that those in favor of laying the amendment on 
the table, would be in favor of the adoption of the converse propo- 
sition to that contained in the amendment. He wished to exclude 
that conclusion, as far as he was concerned, and he would there- 
fore state that he should vote for laying the amendment on the 
table, under a rule which he had prescribed for himself, that in 
those points where he considered the constitution to be correct 
as it stands, he would make no attempt to alter it; and in relation 
to this subject, he considered the constitution as it stands could 
not be improved by any alteration. 

Mr. LOGAN’S name: being called, he rose and said that he 
thought it was necessary to make a brief explanation. It was a 
subject of a good deal of delicacy and one upon which it was diffi- 
cult at all times clearly to distinguish between judgment and pre- 
judice. He should vote to lay this amendment on the table, 
however, upon the ground that he regarded it more in the light 
of an abstract proposition than anything else. The question as 
to what laws would be oppressive, was one for the consideration 
of the legislature, and one which ought to be left to their judgment 
to determine. 

Mr. MINSHALL’S name being called, he observed, that he 
considered such a provision as that embraced in this amendment 
wholly superfluous, and, he thought, the constitution, therefore, 


_ ought not to be encumbered with it. He would vote for laying 


the amendment on the table. 


204 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 4 


Mr. SERVANT’S name being called, he said he adopted the 
reasons stated by the gentlemen from Madison and Sangamon, 
and would vote yea. 

The yeas and nays being taken they resulted as follows:— 
yeas 92, nays 46. 

The question then being on the adoption of the resolution— 

Mr. BOND desired the yeas and nays. c 

Mr. CHURCH would not make a speech, but desired to offer 
a few remarks. Gentlemen characterized what he deemed sound ~ 
principles on the subject under discussion, as abstractions. His 
object was not to deal in abstractions, but to view matters in the 
light of common sense. It had been stated that nature had set — 
up a barrier against blacks as a race, and that the privileges of 
common humanity should not be extended to them. If this be 
so, nature was wrong; which he was not willing to admit. This 
doctrine was behind the spirit of the age, and if we were to sustain 
it, we should be the objects of scorn to the world. Would emi- 
grants from Pennsylvania and others imbued with sentiments of 
humanity, come to this State, if the proposition made here in 
relation to blacks were to become a part of our organic law? No, 
sir; and they would regard such a provision as violating, not only 
the plain dictates of humanity, but the principles contained in the 
great charter of our rights—the Declaration of Independence. 
He desired that on the subject of slavery, the Constitution should 
leave it where it was left by the Ordinance of ’87—that there shall 
be no slavery or involuntary servitude in the State. Our present 
constitution provides for slavery as it existed when adopted; and 
although susceptible of a different construction, slavery was con- 
tinued for years, under the juggling of courts in their judicial 
decisions. Gentlemen here have gloried in this as a free State. 
He would indeed glory in such a State. And he was therefore 
opposed to engrafting in the constitution any doubtful provision, 
or one which required every officer of the government, from the 
Governor down, to be a picket guard, to oppress the colored race. 

He wanted the constitution to be worthy of a free State—and 
to render it so, he would not have it, in the remotest degree, nor 
by any possible construction, sanction slavery, or oppress the 
colored race. He was opposed to laws on this subject, which 


THURSDAY, JUNE 24, 1847 205 


were a blot upon our statute book, but would leave that matter 
with the legislature, with the confident hope that the dictates of 
humanity would control the action of that body, when it shall 
convene under the amended constitution, if we shall be so fortu- 
nate as to perfect a constitution which shall receive the sanction 
of the people. 

Mr. CHURCH moved to lay the resolution on the table. 

At the request of Mr. PINCKNEY the motion was with- 
drawn. 

Mr. PINCKNEY said: Mr. President, I hope the motion to 
lay upon the table will be withdrawn, that I may have an oppor- 
tunity of explaining. 

It was not my purpose to agitate this question unless it were 
forced upon me; and I should have said nothing upon these resolu- 
tions of the gentleman from Clinton, had not the ayes and nays 
been called. 

But as the case now stands, and driven as I now am, and have 
before been into a kind of dilemma, I claim and shall take the 


_ privilege of explaining myself. I have been, by what I consider 


the indiscreet zeal of gentlemen from the North and South, called 
upon to place my vote upon the journal, on questions that it did 
not suit my views either to favor or oppose, in the shape in which 
they were presented to the convention, but nevertheless, I voted 
unflinchingly, and without any effort at an explanation. 

I am willing, sir, to occupy this position in silence no longer; 
the position is one forced upon me. It is a very singular position. 
How does it happen that at the North I am termed a pro-slavery 
man; and here, by some, an Abolitionist? How does it occur that 
in passing from my home to this place, about 200 miles, I find my 
principles identically the same, viewed in so different a light? I 
know not, except it be that I occupy a middle ground between 
two parties contending with each other, and as all mediators are, 
I am obliged to receive the blows and balls of both. 

An Abolitionist! Why, Mr. President, I would as soon be 
called almost anything else on earth as a political abolitionist; 
and yet, I suppose I must patiently bear it, as there is no remedy. 

The gentleman from Clinton has again sprung this question 
upon me, and the ayes and noes are called. To let it pass as I 


206 


have others touching the same points, I cannot; ae yet, I will 
barely explain. 

The gentleman says, the time for action upon this Ess has 
come, and we must defend our State. My own opinion was that 


the time had not come, and therefore I wished to let the matter. 


rest; but, if the gentleman is correct, and the proper time is here 


in which we should act, it would seem as though we should first 


wipe out the dark stain that now rests upon our State. It be- 


comes us to remove the foul stigma, which some of our odious 
laws have brought upon us. I most unhesitatingly assert here — 


before this body, and am willing to declare it before the world, | 


that some of our late laws touching the treatment of negroes are — 
a disgrace to our State; they would be a disgrace to any people ~ 


claiming to be free, enlightened and humane. 
The gentleman has an object in view in moving these resolu- 


tions—he would show by making them a part of our constitution— 
by keeping negroes out of our State under a heavy penalty, that 


we are determined to protect the rights of our sister States. 
Rights! What rights? The right to chase an oppressed and un- 


fortunate fellow being through our territory; to drag him to 
prison; to beat him, and at the same time to prohibit me, or any 
man on this floor from giving him a morsel of bread or meat, 


though he be starving? A right to compel us to force a perishing 


woman from our door; and drive her forth into the pitiless peltings 


of the midnight storm! Are these their rights? I can not admit 


them; they conflict with higher authority. They fly in the face 
of Jehovah. His law calls upon me to feed the hungry and succor 


the distressed. This with me settles all; and I shall endeavor ro 


obey it, notwithstanding these rights. 

Do not misunderstand me; while I would feed the unfortunate 
hungry negro, I would take no part in stealing or secreting him. 
The gentleman would put a stop to the system of stealing negroes 
and running them off through our State. He cannot more strong- 


ly disapprobate the “under ground railroad” than dol. It is a 


disgrace to any man to be aiding or abetting that system. I look 


with supreme contempt upon that man who enters the premises — 


of a master for the purpose of enticing away his slave; who teaches 


that slave to escape at all hazards; to cut his master’s throat; to 


= 


THURSDAY, JUNE 24, 1847 207 
s ‘steal his best horse, to ride him to death, and then steal another. 
_ These things I cannot approve, nor can I commend; nay, I must 
censure those who countenance them. 

____ The gentleman says, if among us, they are not to have a vote, 
ig nor to hold office. My vote stands recorded upon this subject, 

_ and it agrees with his views. I am not for passing laws to give 
' them the right of suffrage, but for a different reason from the 
gentleman’s. It is simply this: no class of men in our popular 
‘government can enjoy equal rights and privileges with us, until 
_ the mass are willing to grant the same, all legislation to the con- 

trary notwithstanding. This alone is sufficient to determine my 
- course with reference to the African suffrage. The people will 
not yield it. If any man propose to keep these unfortunate per- 
sons from our State by just and humane measures, I shall not 
object. Iam in favor of removing them not only from this State, 
but from all the States, that they may in some other place enjoy 
__ human rights and privileges, in truth as well as in name; but I 

desire it not to be done by violence. I therefore concur with the 
gentlemen in giving the Colonization Society great praise; it 

___ deserves it; it has my best wishes and my warm support. 

Pe The gentleman from Brown expressed a view that I was sorry 

- tohear on this floor. Is it possible that he would rather see this 

a slave State, than have it longer exposed to the ingress of negroes? 

Is it true that God has made so broad a mark of distinction be- 

tween blacks and whites, that the latter cannot endure the prox- 

imity of the former? My observations here teach me that they 
are somewhat intimate; but I forbear to dwell on what is so appar- 
ent to all, and I leave the subject. 

Mr. TURNBULL said he considered this matter as properly 
belonging to the legislature, if it were necessary to make any en- 
actment in relation to it; but he was of the opinion that as it 
stood at present it was about as well as they could make it. 
_ Nothing was to be gained, he thought, by agitating the question.]* 


= 


7 


Mr. ALLEN said, he saw nothing in the resolutions to call out 
this discussion. He had listened to the gentleman last up (Mr. 


: _  *This account, the closing debate of the afternoon session of June 24, 
is taken from the Sangamo Journal, July 1. 


f 


208 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


7 


PrncKNEy) in his effort to define his position, but really did not 
know where he stood; on which side, or on both sides. He could 
not see what this resolution had to do with the present statute 
laws of the State. It only provided that no negroes should come 
here for the future. He was in favor of a prohibitory clause 
against their emigration [sc] into the State, for those that were 
here were good for nothing, either to the state, the church, or 
themselves. They were all idle and lazy and the part of the State 
that he came from was overrun with them. It had been the custom 
for some time for the people of Kentucky, Alabama and other 
states to bring their old and worn out negroes, and those whom 
they emancipated, into this State and into his section of country, 
and the people desired to prevent this, and to get rid of those 
already there. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin thought the introduction of this 
subject was unwise and productive of no good. Almost all the 
evil growing out of the excitement upon this question had been 
produced by the persons occupying the extremes of both parties. 
On the one side were those who were honest, sincere and consistent 
in their opinion, and men of the most respectable character, who 
devote all their zeal, ardor and means for the accomplishment of 
their object; men of the one idea principle; and on the other side 
was a class of persons who, to check abolition, used the most 
violent language and often occupied very untenable ground, and 
they together have contributed, more than anything else, to create 
the great excitement on this question. He would ask gentlemen 
to reflect upon the consequences of this resolution. If it was 
adopted and its provisions inserted in the constitution, a large 
class of the community would be against its adoption. Why then 
unnecessarily provoke a battle against the constitution. Intemper- 
ance ononeside wasasbadasonanother. Everyimpulseofhis heart 
and every feeling of his, was in opposition to slavery, and if his 
acts or votes here would do anything to ameliorate the condition 
of those held in bondage no man would exert himself more zealously 
than he; no one would do more to remove the great stain of moral 
guilt now upon this great republic—but he looked upon every 
proposition either for or against that object as checking the good 


XVI. FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Barcer. 

Mr. THORNTON offered an amendment to the coin 
pending at the adjournment yesterday—providing that the Legis- 
lature should have power to make all necessary laws in relation to 
negroes. In presenting the amendment he said, that he did so 
because he thought we should leave the matter with the Legislature 
for their action, and to public sentiment. i 

Mr. NORTON said, that he desired to state the reasons which 
would govern him in his vote upon this question, and why he © 
should vote against the resolution and the amendment. He was 
happy to say that he did not find himself in the dilemma in which 
other gentlemen were placed. He opposed this resolution because 
he deemed it wrong in principle and wrong in practice, and could 
give the reasons for going against it without feeling himself called — 
upon to define his position. He would give his views, founded, — 
as he thought, upon principles of right. The resolution, as he — 
understood it, had two objects—the first, the exclusion, by penal 
enactments, of all free negroes; the second, a prohibition against 
their emancipation and settlement in this State. The first of 
these he considered a direct infringlelment of the constitution — 
of the United States, which he, as a member of the Convention, — 
had taken an oath to support, and which was regarded as the 
glory of the country, and gave us a character abroad. No one 
would contend that we had the power to infringe that constitution 


in any of its provisions. That constitution says, “that the — 


citizens of one State shall be entitled to all the privileges and 
immunities in the several States.” 

This resolution prohibits free negroes from coming into the 
State. Does that sacred instrument—the constitution of the — 
United States—say “white” citizens. No, sir, you may — 


search in vain in that instrument for the word white, or black, or — 


yellow. What citizens does the constitution recognize?—All 
native born and naturalized citizens. He would refer gentlemen 
, 210 ; 


FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 1847 211 


to the State of Vermont, no distinction is made in her constitution; 
there these people have all the priv[iJleges possessed by the whites; 
they have property and a right to vote. Go to Massachusetts, 
where he thought they had a little notion of what was liberty— 


government and right, and there they are entitled to hold property, 


aright to vote, and, in theory, if not in practice, a privilege of a 
' seat in the General Assembly. These men are citizens of those 
States. Can we say then that a citizen of Massachusetts, Vermont 


or New York shall be prohibited from settling in the State of 
Illinois, in direct violation of an article of the constitution of the 


United States? If that constitution can be violated in one provi- 


_ sion, itcan bein another. Was any such distinction contemplated 


at the adoption of that constitution? Do you think that the men 


_ who framed that constitution would ever have permitted the word 


“white” to go into the constitution? Every delegate in the 
Convention that framed that constitution from the North—from 


_ Virginia and Maryland, would have voted against it. And if they 


had putitin, the constitution would never [have] been adopted by the 
people. He came not there to produce excitement by a discussion 
on this subject. He would rather have avoided it, but by the 
introduction of this resolution the question had been forced upon 
them. He would ask the gentleman who introduced this resolu- 
tion, if he remembered the time, when it was attempted to put 
such a provision as this in the constitution of Missouri, how the 
whole north opposed it, and that Missouri could never have been 
admitted into the Union with that provision in her constitution, 
without some explanatory clauses. The people would have let 
her fall into the dust before they would have consented. He was 
not prepared to say that those born in servitude and yet slaves are 
citizens, this question did not arise, and he was not disposed to 
argue it. The first principle of this resolution is unequal, unjust 
and opposed to the first principles of free government. These 
colored people came to this country not of their own accord, we 
brought them here, they cannot get away; it is said to colonize 
them, how? they cannot colonize themselves. He would not 
insert a provision inviting them to our State; nor would he have 
one to prohibit them. Is it just, equal or republican to say in our 
constitution that an honest colored man, with property and per- 


212 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


haps education, shall not come to this State because some men 
of color who are here are lazy? Our armies were now fighting at 
the south and the probability is that we will extend the area of 
our freedom, and that States are to come into the Union with 
people of every stripe and color, and can they come in without 
full and equal rights? If this clause be inserted into the consti- 
tution he would guaranty 10,000 votes against it, and in the 
county of Will he would guaranty a majority of 1,000. The 
whole north would oppose it. This resolution was the very thing — 
to produce excitement; such things had been always the cause of 
it all over the length and breadth of the land. Having thus 
justified his vote, he did not consider he should define his position. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery was not desirous of discussing 
this subject; but while he was sitting there, willing to let resolu- | 
tions of inquiry, to which he was opposed, pass in silence, he was 
not willing that gentlemen should tell him that the green north 
was opposed to this and that subject, and if it passed, the green 
north would defeat it. Gentlemen get up here and unblushingly 
say that negroes are equal to them, and unblushingly say that 
they should enjoy all the privileges of life, social and political, and 
then charge the south with having caused the excitement. Who 
first introduced this matter by a motion to strike the word 
‘white’ out of a resolution, and then moved the yeas and nays 
upon it. A gentleman from the north. It was the north 
that had caused this excitement and not the south. When, 
sir, 1 get up here and advocate that negroes are entitled to 
all the privileges of citizenship—social and political—I hope the 
tongue which now speaks may cleave to the roof of my mouth. 
There is a barrier between the two races which it is vain to attempt 
to destroy. He had not arisen to discuss this matter and create 
excitement, but to repudiate the assertion that our morals should 
justify us in admitting negroes to the enjoyment of our social and 
political rights. The gentlemen from the north speak their 
sentiments, and those of the south have the same right. He said 
that the object of the abolitionists was to dissolve the Union. 
He had no more confidence in the abolitionists than he had in the 
dark and damnable demons of the lower regions. 


Mr. NORTON rose—but 


‘ 


FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 7847 213 


Mr. WILLIAMS claimed the floor as a peacemaker. He said 
the people had gone to great expense in calling this Convention to 
reform and revise the government, and not for the purpose of 
speaking or making provisions about negroes or other little things. 
There was [sic] the Legislative and Judiciary Departments which 
required reformation, and it was for this object that the people 
sent them there. He regretted that in carrying out these prin- 
ciples they had permitted those subjects to be introduced. He 
had no fault to find with the mover of the resolution or with those 
who differ from him. 

The question was not an abolition one, nor one to admit 
negroes to social and political equality—but simply, will we permit 
negroes, after they have given security not to become a burden 
upon the State, and complied with our laws, to the poor privilege 
of cultivating our soil and breathing our air. He was not inviting 
them to come to the State. The African race had been degraded, 
not from their own crimes, but they had been raised in servitude 
and without education. Take the heroes of Buena Vista and 
Cerro Gordo and carry them into a foreign land, and subject 
them to servitude, and the 4th generation will be as degraded as 
the negro race. Mr. W. cited several cases which had come under 
his notice of negroes working and toiling for money with which 
they desired to purchase friends and relations then in slavery. 
In conclusion he said, the resolution was more suited for the 14th 
than the 19th century. 

Mr. WITT moved the previous question. 

Mr. LOGAN said, that this was a subject which he had always 
expected would agitate this Convention. At the same time, it 
was one which he hoped gentlemen would learn to discuss with 
temper.—He hoped that the discussion would proceed and with 
good temper, and that the Convention would listen calmly to 
what was to be advanced for and against the proposition. He 
trusted that the gag law would not be put in force on a question 
which a large number of the people considered of vital importance. 
He was not afraid to discuss any question on God’s earth. He 
respected the abolitionists and believed them to be honest and 
sincere, and was willing to listen to what they had to say. He 
Was certain the result would be to leave the constitution as it now 


214 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


is. The question was one which affected the interests and feelings — 
of a large population of the State, not only abolitionists but 
others, and he was desirous that their representatives might be — 
heard. Mr. SHIELDS thought that as the question had been © 
discussed so fully in Congress and in other places, no new light 
could be thrown upon the matter now by a longer discussion. 

Mr. HURLBUT hoped the previous question would not be ~ 
seconded. There was no use in dodging the question, which might 
as well be settled now as at any other time. He was not to be 
affected by taunts from the north, nor will he suffer them to 
be thrown in his teeth from the south. He would discuss it on | 
principles of law and morals. 

Mr. DEMENT said, he would vote to sustain ae previous 
question, because he intended to vote upon the question with those © 
gentlemen who desired to be heard. He had heard sufficient from - 
them, even before the discussion, to induce him to go with them 
on this particular subject. He hoped, therefore, they would not ~ 
think hard of him when he voted for the previous question. He 
did not care for hearing an argument when his mind was made up. 

Mr. SERVANT opposed the previous question. | 

Mr. WEST said, that although he was a young man, he did 
hope the previous question would not be seconded, because he had 
a desire to express his views on the subject. The county he 
represented had more of this population than almost any other, 
and he knew his constituents desired that their representatives — 
might be heard. He would discuss the question with a omer 
temper. 

Mr. MINSHALL was not afraid to hear the discussion upon — 
this or any other subject; and he thought that if any steam had 
been engendered that it would be better to let it off at once. 

Messrs. Hocus, Davis of Montgomery, and Mason, all 
opposed the previous question, and advocated a discussion now. 
And the vote was taken and the previous question was not 
seconded. feet 

Mr. MASON moved to lay the resolution on the table, and ; 
that all the laws in relation to negroes be printed. 

Mr. KITCHELL moved to lay the motion on the table. A 
division of the question was demanded, and the motion to print 


FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 1847 215 


was laid on the table. The question was then taken on laying on 
the table the motion to lay on the table, and decided in the 
negative. 

Mr. HURLBUT said, he desired to discuss this question 
without branching off into a discussion of collateral subjects, or 
exciting angry feelings. He said he would rather vote for the 
resolution than for the amendment, because it was more direct; 
but he would vote against both upon principle. The constitution 
of the U. S. says, a citizen of one State shall be entitled to all the 
privileges and immunities of citizens of the other States. Itis not 
in the power of the Convention to infringe this—they cannot get 
over it. A citizen of Massachusetts was entitled to become a 
citizen of any other State. The south had raised an enquiry 
whether the colored persons have the rights of citizenship; that 
question was not applicable here. The question was, have we the 
power to say that citizens of those States shall not come here. It 
will not do for Illinois to say that other States have not the power 
to make citizens, when she has made citizens of a class of persons 
in a way unknown to other States. Suppose we should pass a 
law that a citizen of New York shall not come into this State, how 
will you enforce it? The constitution of the U. S. directly over- 
rules it. As to the policy of the law: the gentlemen from the 
counties on the Mississippi, say they suffer from these free negroes 
—that is one of the evils of all frontier States; that they come 
there and are a bad population. But have we the power to make 
a penal law applicable to one class of citizens, and not generally. 
No doubt the State has power to pass a general law requiring all 
persons coming into the State, to give a bond not to become a 
burden on the State. N. York has the power to pass a law, 
requiring captains of emigrant vessels to observe certain restric- 
tions, but that is only the exercise of an internal police regulation 
and is general. Let us make a law as applicable to those who 
come into the State at the north, as well as those at the south, 
one is as good as the other and the only difference is, that one is 
white and the other black. Let the law be general; but if we pass 
a sweeping general law, which is special in its application, it must 
be apparent that it is unconstitutional. It was a thing which he 
never would consent to. He was not sufficiently acquainted with 


216 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


those parts of the State affected by these people to know if these 
laws are required; but he would believe the statements of the 
gentlemen, as it was not his design to impugn the assertions of — 
anyone. He would vote against the resolution, if on no other 
ground, because its adoption would endanger the ratification of 
the constitution. 

Mr. KINNEY of St. Clair said, that the present question was _ 
one in which his county felt a very lively interest. It was situated 
near St. Louis; they had already nearly five hundred free colored 
persons collected there from Missouri, and they were perfectly — 
familiar with their habits. He was satisfied that a large majority — 
of the people of his county would vote to sustain the resolution of — 
the gentleman from Clinton. Those members from the northern 
part of the State did not know how lazy, and good-for-nothing 
these people were. If they did and could witness their worth- — 
lessness their opinions would be changed. He was in favor of a 
fair and calm discussion of this question and saw no necessity for 
excitement. It had nothing to do with abolition and abolitionists, — 
and appeared to him a mere question of State policy—a political 
question. It has been said by the gentleman from Will (Mr. 
Norton) that he has objections to this resolution because it 
infringes the constitution of the United States. He says that it 
guaranties to citizens of one State the rights and privileges of 
citizens of other States. He forgets that that article of the consti- — 
tution has been construed to mean that citizens from other States 
shall be entitled only to the rights enjoyed by the citizens of the 
State into which they came. Have we not by our present consti- 
tution prohibited them from voting—a right enjoyed by citizens 
of our State—and has not that constitution been ratified by the 
Congress of the United States. He says we have the power to — 
put these negroes under bond not to become a charge upon the 
State—this admission is all we want. Suppose a citizen of 
another State should come here, could we compel him to give this 
bond? No, sir; we could not. His argument, therefore, is ground- 
less. To-carry it out, suppose in another State a negro was 
entitled to hold an office, and he came here to this State, would he 
not be entitled to hold office here too? The supreme court of the 
United States says that citizens of one State shall enjoy the same 


FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 1847 217 


privileges as are enjoyed by citizens of the other States. The 
gentleman from Boone says he holds not to the grounds of the 
abolitionists, yet, he, (Mr. K.) was much surprised to hear him 
say that the foreigners, who come to our State, were no better 
than the negroes. It is not good policy to engraft upon our 
constitution—the fundamental law of the State—a prohibition 
against this class of worthless population, and his reason for it 
was that we are surrounded by a number of slave States, all of 
whom had an exclusive provision in their constitution against 
these free negroes. Where, then, do they go? They cannot 
reside in those States, and they all come into Illinois. When they 
get old, decrepid [sic] and good-for-nothing, their owners emancipate 
them and send them into this State. We may have laws upon 
our statute books against persons bringing or sending them here, but 
howcan we enforce itagainstamaninanotherState. Hewouldask 
gentlemen to look at Ohio, the greatest abolition State in the 
Union, and when Randolph’s negroes were emancipated the agent 
attempted to settle them in that State, but the people rose in a 
body and drove them back and would not allow them to come 
there. They did not want them, they knew what sort of a popu- 
lation they were, and how worthless and degraded they become, 
and how troublesome they always were. If we would allow the 
negroes any kind of equality we must admit them to the social 
hearth. It was then that equality commenced. We must live 
with them and permit them to mingle with us in all our social 
affairs, and, also, if they desired it, must not object to proposals 
to marry our daughters. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to lay the substitute on the table, 
so as to get at the original resolution and make it a resolution of 
inquiry; but withdrew it at the request of 

Mr. WEST, who desired to express his views. He said, that 
the gentleman last up had alluded to what was correctly the con- 
struction to be placed on the article in the constitution of the 
United States. He said, that it could hardly be presumed that a 
citizen of the State of Massachusetts should be entitled to the 
privileges of our citizens. He believed that free negroes living 
amongst our people was a great evil, and that the best way to 
remedy that evil was, by a prohibitory clause in our constitution, 


f , 


218 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


to confine them to those free States where they could find a secure 
and a more equal home. One of the primary influences which 
induced the people of his county to settle in Illinois, was that they — 
might not only be relieved from the evil effects of slavery, but, also, — 
of a colored population. These negroes were, mostly, idle and 
worthless persons, and his people were very anxious to get rid of 
them. He had received a letter from one of his constituents this 
morning, which said that several horses had been stolen, and that 
to guard against these negroes, it was almost necessary to keep — 
a watch. 3 
Allusion had been made to Massachusetts. He loved and — 
venerated that State, but there were principles contained in some — 
of her laws which he never could recognize. The gentlemen from 
the north, who had spoken on this question, had come from coun- 
ties which have but five, ten, or fifteen negroes; in our county 
there were 500, and he would say that the evil was 500 times 
greater. He hoped some provision would pass, so as to have this 
matter settled and prevent scenes of violence. We had already 
had such scenes—the scenes of 1837—and they were to be regretted, 
and they must ever cast a shame upon our State. He had heard — 
it said in the Convention that in the canvass, the tree of public © 
sentiment had been shaken, and that the fruits had been gathered 
in that hall; and when he looked around him he felt proud of his 
State, on account of her representatives, and he must be permitted 
to say, that he never before beheld such an august assembly. 
Mr. DAVIS of McLean did not agree with the gentleman from 
Madison. He could not believe that the evil existed to such an 
alarming extent. He said that he was in favor of leaving the mat- 
ter stand as it does in our present constitution, and was unwilling 
to pass any provision which would endanger the adoption of 
the constitution. He had no desire to engraft anything in that 
constitution which would offend the people of any portion of the 
State. He was satisfied that he was sent here to remedy certain 
great evils in the government, and after having done so was not — 
disposed to have the work rendered useless or endanger its adop- 
tion by this or any other such provision. He would leave the 
matter for future legislation and public sentiment, to dispose of it 
as the times should require. He was opposed to allowing people 


FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 1847 219 


of color the right to vote, and he regretted that the gentleman from 
Boone had said that people from other countries were to be put 
upon a par with negroes. This was casting another fire-brand 
oe into the Convention. 
st Mr. CHURCH said, he desired not to make a speech for the 
__ purpose of making one, but merely to allude to some parts which 
had not yet been touched upon. He asked if such a provision 
__ were inserted, how could it be enforced? The laws they had 
already were not sufficient to keep these people out. He would 
_ like to hear some gentleman define this. He had been a little 
_ amused, when this question came up yesterday, to hear the 
gentleman from Sangamon say it was nothing but an abstract 
principle. [He read from the constitution of the United States, 
Mr. Locan explained.] The gentleman from Montgomery had 
said there was a barrier between the two races—the blacks and 
the whites—if there was, why attempt to raise it higher. If 
nature had placed it there, leave it to nature, and not, by your 
laws, make the difference wider. Put this provision in the consti- 
tution and you exclude more whites from the State than you do 
blacks. We are unable to extend the report of Mr. C.’s remarks 
further. He advocated that the matter should be left to the action 
of the Legislature, and deprecated the introduction of this provi- 
sion into the constitution as unsafe, unjust, and impolitic. He 
also asked, if the ordinance was in force, and Illinois a free State, 
how was it that, at the last census, 380 slaves were returned? 
Mr. LOGAN replied to the gentleman last up, and told the 
gentlemen of the north that when they said that if this provision 
was inserted in the constitution, that they would all vote against 
it, they should remember that the north was only a part of the 
State; that the State had two ends, and if the north voted against 
the constitution because of this provision, the south had the same 
right to say they would vote against it if it was not inserted. He 
advocated for some time a midway policy of leaving the matter 
to the Legislature. He was opposed to making this provision the 
_ all absorbing topic that was to influence the people’s votes upon 
the adoption of the constitution. This would be the case in many 
of the counties, if this provision was inserted. 


Mr. BROCKMAN said, that he was sorry to hear gentlemen 


(ie » 


Wa aa hate 


tise iy), eke ae \ ny 
’ ‘ all Le se a 


220 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


throwing out threats that if such a provision was adopted that 
they would defeat the whole constitution. The people of his 
county were much concerned in this question, but they would not 
reject the constitution upon this or any one subject. If we are 
to cling to some favorite question, and if we do not succeed defeat 
the whole, we had much better adjourn and go home. He had 
been opposed to the reduction of the members of the Legislature, 
because it affected his county, but if the Convention had reduced 
the number down to 60, he would have submitted, and would have 
voted for the constitution. The majority should govern, that 
was the true democratic principle. He had never heard before 
that negroes were citizens under the constitution of the United 
States, and entitled to all the rights and immunities of citizens. 
Would gentlemen like to see their posterity sitting in a legislative 
assembly with a mixed delegation, as was the case in other places? 
We must either admit these negroes as citizens or exclude them. 
He would vote for the exclusion forever. On motion the Conven- 
tion adjourned. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. JENKINS said, it was perhaps necessary for him to 
define his position. If the naked abstract question of the right 
of one man to hold another in slavery were presented to him, he 
would very probably answer no. But no such question was now 
before them. He considered that the slaves were in a better 
condition now than if they were in their own country. He 
believed the negroes were a degraded race, and could not agree ~ 
with the gentleman from Adams, that the heroes of Cerro Gordo 
could ever be reduced by servitude to any such degradation. He 
conceived this could not be the case, and he would cite the Indian 
race, which never could be reduced to slavery. The question of 
slavery was the one which would, if at all, divide the Union, and 


it must be discussed.—But he considered the question before them _ 


as a political one—one of State policy only; and it was, whether, 
in the present state of circumstances, we should introduce a pro- 
vision into our constitution to exclude negroes from coming into’ 
our State. It had been agreed that we should restrict the Legis- 
lature in many things, so as they might not hereafter be disturbed; 


FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 1847 221 


and he asked if there were any questions which would be more 
difficult to settle by a Legislature than the present one, and if 
there was a more proper time to settle it than the present?—If a 
man votes for this resolution, he can hardly escape the charge of 
being inhuman, and of a desire to render the negroes more degraded 
than at present, but self preservation was the first law, and for the 
purpose of peace and harmony, it was our duty to so fix the con- 
stitution so that this matter should be forever settled. We had 
only to look at our sister States, and see that this population had 
led the people into tumult and violence, to know that it was our 
duty to put astop upon it. It might, for a while, be a punishment 
upon them, but eventually result in their own good. It would 
compel them to fix their residence in those States where they 
belonged, and the people of those States might do something to 
benefit their condition. Our friends at the north do not under- 
stand our position at the south. They think us wrong, because 
they cannot see the evils of this class of population among us. 
They have in their counties but few negroes, whose interest and 
policy it was to behave themselves. But we have them in large 
numbers, whole settlements of them, who do nothing, idle away 
their time, and are as trifling, worthless, filthy, and degraded as 
in any part of the Union. It had been said that if we put this into 
the constitution that the people of the north will go against 
the constitution. Now, suppose we say that if they put into the 
constitution a power to create banks, which our people are opposed 
to, will they hesitate because it may endanger the adoption of the 
constitution? They do not change their course, but insist upon 
such a provision. If the provision contained in the resolution be 
put into the constitution and thereby it is defeated, let it be so; it is 
much better to have this question put at rest. It has been said 
on all sides that there was no confidence to be put in the Legis- 
lature. Why leave this question, then, with them, where it will 
forever be open to agitation, and by the abolitionists, whose policy 
was always to agitate. 

Mr. PALMER of Marshall opposed the resolution in a few 


words, and then addressed the Convention upon the benefits of 
colonization. 


222 


Mr. MOFFETT offered an amendment, that if the resolution 
passed it should be submitted to the people in a separate article. 

Mr. BOND said, that it might appear strange that he differed 
from the gentleman from Adams, (Mr. Witttams) because people 
had often said that in case that gentleman should drop off first, he 
(Mr. B.) would be obliged to think for himself. He then replied, 
at length, to the gentleman from Will, and reminded the Conven- — 
tion that his resolution was only applicable to those negroes who — 
may hereafter come into the State. 

Messrs. CHURCHILL, KircHELL and Know tron, each, made — 
some remarks on the question; which we are unable to give for 


want of room. 
Mr. SINGLETON advocated, in a speech of some time, the 


adoption of the resolution; and while we have a report of his 


remarks, we regret that want of space precludes their insertion. 
Mr. GeEppDEs advocated the resolution, and Messrs. Deirz 
SHARPE and Powers opposed it. 


Mr. KITCHELL, who proceeded to address the Convention. — 
He desired to see such steps taken by the Legislature as would 
arrest the increase of the negro population in this State; and he 
was for leaving the subject to be disposed of by that body. 

Mr. KNOWLTON addressed the Convention, in opposition 
to the resolution. He was opposed to any alteration of the pres- 
ent constitution in relation to this matter. He was opposed to 
the introduction of any subject that would excite sectional feel- 
ings, and he was extremely sorry to hear the terms north and south 
so often reiterated in this debate. They were not assembled to 
make a constitution for a particular latitude; they were not here 
to consider the interests of one particular portion of the State to 


the exclusion of another. For his own part, he was for pursuing 


the course which, to his judgment, seemed the best calculated to 
promote the interests of the whole State. He could say, as some 
other gentlemen had done, that he had come here free and un- 
trammeled upon this question, as well as almost every other; and 
he should endeavor to act entirely free from prejudice and sec- 
tional bias. He was for leaving the present constitution exactly 
as it stood in relation to this matter. 


i ~ 
La 


FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 1847 pees 


Mr. SINGLETON said, that he had a proposition which he 
desired to submit, and he would have submitted it, had he been 
here, when the resolution now before the body was presented, and 
before the pending amendments had been offered. As he was 
not, he would not be able to present his proposition at this time; 
but he desired, before the vote was taken, to make a few remarks 
explanatory of the position which he occupied upon this subject, 
and of the views which his constituents, and nearly all the inhab- 


_itants of that region of country in which he resided, entertained. 


A great deal had been said about the effect which the incor- 
poration of such a provision as that contained in the resolution 
now under consideration, was to have upon the North and upon 
the South. It seemed to him that gentlemen should not consider 
the effect which the incorporation of a principle in the constitu- 
tion was to have upon any particular portion of the State. The 
only enquiry should be, was it a correct principle? Was it calcu- 
lated to advance the interests—to preserve the peace and quietude 
of the State? These were proper inquiries. But if there was to 
be a system of log-rolling, if a principle was to be adopted because 
it was desired by any one portion of the State as an offset for some 
advantage to be granted to, or gained by another portion, then > 
he thought it would be better to adjourn and go home. No good 
could be accomplished by acting upon such a system as that. He 
would vote for what he considered to be right, no matter whether 
his constituents coincided in opinion with him or not. If he be- 
lieved that a principle was right, he would not stop to inquire 
whether it was so considered by the people at large. If he was 
convinced of its correctness it was all that was required to secure 
his vote. His own feelings had always been upon the side of 
slavery. He came from a slave State. He had lost none of his 
sympathies for slave-holders and slaves. He had a deep sym- 


_ pathy for slaves, for he knew that the conduct of those men in his 


State and in others, who pretended to be endeavoring to better 
the condition of slaves, instead of bettering their condition, was 
involving them in deeper degradation. This question ought to 
be met with an honest endeavor to preserve and promote as far 
as possible the happiness of the unfortunate negro, and to set at 
rest all those animosities which have heretofore disturbed the 


224 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


country. There was no question which had disturbed, and which — 
would in future disturb and agitate this country so much as this 
question of slavery. He feared it was to be the power which was 
to break the cord which had bound us together as a nation. The — 
federal cords he feared were to be broken by it. This union, © 
unless a different course were to be pursued, would be dissolved, — 
and it would be by means of this very question. It would not — 
be so if we were to come up and meet the question as we ought. 
We were told that we would build up an abolition party, here by — 
the adoption of such a resolution as the present. He cared not 
though this should be the result.—Were we to be deterred from 
the avowal of our principles, because by doing so we might array _ 
a party against us? This was not a sound doctrine. It was right 
that there should be some constitutional provision upon this sub- 
ject. It should not be left to the uncertainty of future legislation. _ 
We came here professing to have in view retrenchment.—This he 
conceived would be a very important step towards that object; 
for if the question were left open for the next ten years, one-quarter 
of the time of the sessions of the legislature would be consumed 
by legislating upon this very question. Petitions would come in, 
asking for the abolishment of existing laws, and the subject would — 
be continually agitated. 

The object of the resolution, as he understood it, was to pro- 
vide some permanent rule by which both parties should be gov- ~ 
erned upon this subject. He was aware that a great number of 
persons had come to Illinois for the purpose of getting rid of 
slavery, not for the purpose of interfering with their neighbors, 
and of breaking down the institution of slavery; but to avoid the 
evils attending that institution, seeking repose, and endeavoring 
to get rid of the annoyances to which they were subjected in a 
slave State. Such men had a right—it was their duty to use 
every means in their power to keep free negroes, as well as slaves 
out of the State. Now, if we are to have, continued Mr. S., any 
slavery, that is negro slavery (for God knows we have enough of 
of every other kind), it is useless for gentlemen to talk about mak- 
ing this a free State. The States have agreed among themselves 
that no person who is bound to labor in one State, shall escape 
into another and be protected in consequence of any law in force 


FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 1847 225 


in that State to which he has escaped, and this has laid the foun- 
dation for a constitutional provision. The United States upon 
the adoption of a federal constitution, thought it best that a gen- 
eral rule should be laid down upon this particular subject. It 
was then expected that individual States would each carry out the 
provision thus inserted in the constitution of the United States by 
the enactment of State laws. But we see that it has not been 
done. Pennsylvania at one time decided that'the legislature had 
no power to carry out the provisions, and Illinois decided that it 
had. For myself, I believe that each of the States had the power, 
and that we have the power to enforce it by legislation as well as 
by constitutional provisions. But I prefer that it should be a 
constitutional provision, in order to give it permanency, in order 
to avoid that fluctuation to which the laws of Illinois are very sub- 
ject. Now, are we to leave this subject open, and permit Illinois 
to be a receptacle for all the worthless, superannuated negroes that 
slave-holders may chance to send into the State? Sir, it is not 
because that I dislike the negroes that I object to their coming 
into the State. I feel a sympathy for them; but this is a matter 
of self-defence. We are bound as a defensive measure to incor- 
porate some provision of this sort into the constitution. We do 
not know how soon the question may come up in the legislature, 
in such a manner as will endanger the peace of the whole State. 
We know that it is a most exciting question, and by whatever 
method we can most effectually avoid its recurrence, it will be the 
best policy for us to adopt that course; and nothing less will do, 
it appears to me, than the insertion of a provision in the constitu- 
tion, which will settle the question as long as the constitution 
remains in force. 

Now, it has been contended by those who are opposed to the 
resolution, that we have no power to do it, because the constitu- 
tion of the United States provides that the citizens of each State 
shall be entitled to all the privileges and immunities which are 
enjoyed by the citizens of another State to which they may emi- 
grate. Now, suppose a person acquired citizen-ship at the age of 
seventeen in the State of New York, and should then come to this 
State; would he be entitled to the rights and privileges of a citizen 
here? No sir, he would be subject to the limitations and restric- 


bral Pia val fy ae ae LN dy Be Ae Bie as be" 


226 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 
tions which are imposed by the laws of Illinois, in regard to citizen 
ship. Well, have we not the same power to limit as to color that 
we have in regard to age? Unquestionably. 
It is a curious argument that has been used by some gentle- é 
men, that by excluding negroes we exclude white men. I do not — 
know how this is to operate, unless it apply to some particularly 
attached friend of the negro, who may feel disposed to follow him. — 
If that be the case, then we should express it fully in the provisions _ 
which we adopt. Now, if there are men in Illinois who prefer — 
the society of negroes, if there are men so extraordinarily anxious 
to associate with negroes, let them accompany their favorites to 
some locality where their presence may not be objectionable. — 
But in this State, there are men who prefer the society of white — 
men, and who have come here to get rid of an intolerable nuisance. 
Sir, I could with some patience listen to a proposition for the toler- 
ation of the presence of the negroes in this State, if it came from 
the negroes themselves, but when I have it coming from those who 
are acting from motives of interest, who are contemplating profit 
from the presence of negroes in the State, I have no patience. 
The distinction which God has made between the races can never _ 
be abolished. Sir, I do hope that the resolution will pass, and I 
have here another which I intend to bring before this Convention 
at the proper time. a 
Mr. SincteTon here read the resolution which he had intended. : 
to offer. \ 
The objections which will be brought up against a proposition | 
of this sort are the very same as those which are urged against 
the proposition now before the convention. That this convention 
ought not to legislate upon the subject, for it is legislating. It is 
high order of legislation, and those are very questions for this — 
body to legislate upon. Now, I ask is it not proper that we should 
adopt some permanent provision on the subject? Is it not a 
question of sufficient importance to demand the action of this — 
body? If not, then let the subject be disposed of at once. If it — 
is, let us say to those who are advocating the introduction of 
negroes here, and for extending to them all the privileges to which 
citizens are entitled, that we are not disposed to engage in any 
thing of the sort either now or hereafter. 


FRIDAY, JUNE 25, 1847 227 


But it is said, it is better to postpone the consideration of this 
"subject. Now, I think every man’s mind must be made up in 
“regard to it. What would you think of a man who would say to 
_ you, | have a negro and you have a pretty daughter, I should like 
‘a marriage contracted between them, I do not want you to decide 
= postpone your decision until some other time? Now, this is 
saa is proposed here. It is an indirect proposition that the 
people of this State shall abolish all these distinctions which have 
é eee iofore preserved and protected society for the benefit (I do 
"not know whether it is for the benefit, whether it is for the amel- 
" ioration) of the condition of the negro or degradation of the white 
population. I did not intend when I arose to detain the conven- 
_ tion so long as I have, but it is a subject on which I feel deeply, 
"and it is a question of more importance, I think, than it seems to 
_ be considered by gentlemen who have been discussing it. I hope 
at least that gentlemen will consider well, before they give their 
_ votes, whether it is not better to adopt a permanent rule on the 
subject, than to leave it open to future legislation. 
Mr. GEDDES next addressed the Convention. He was desir- 
ous that some prohibition against the introduction of a black 
_ population into the State should be enacted, but he was appre- 
hensive that the insertion of such a provision into the constitu- 
tion would create much difficulty, and might endanger its final 
adoption. If he were here in a legislative capacity, he would feel 
himself called upon to sustain such a proposition as the one now 
offered, but he thought it would be better that it should not be 
made a constitutional provision. He felt deeply for the condition 
of the unfortunate negro. He regarded slavery as a moral evil, 
but he did not believe that it could be abolished in the United 
States without creating ten-fold greater evil. The people of the 
_ South he regarded as the best friends of the blacks, and the climate 
of the South was best suited to them. He thought, therefore, 
that there would be no hardship or inhumanity in prohibiting 
them from entering this State; and he would be glad, therefore, to 
see such a prohibition enacted by the Legislature.]” 


Mr. LEMON was in favor of a prohibitory clause against 


*1 This insertion is taken from the Sangamo Journal, July 1. 


228 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


negroes coming into the State for many reasons, which we hays 
it not in our power to furnish. In conclusion, he said, that he 
did not believe they were altogether human beings. If any 
gentleman’ thought they were, he would ask him to look at a 
negro’s foot! (Laughter.) What was his leg doing in the middle 
of it? If that was not sufficient, let him go and examine their _ 
nose; (roars of laughter) then look at their lips. Why, their 
seutls [sic] were three inches thicker than white people’s. a 
Mr. WEAD briefly opposed any provision in the constitution, 
as the Legislature had full powers to legislate on the matter. 5 
Mr. McCALLEN opposed leaving this matter for future . 
legislation, and advocated the adoption of the provision. 
Mr. VANCE moved the previous question. 
Mr. PALMER of Macoupin moved to lay it on the table. 
Mr. SINGLETON moved an adjournment. Lost. The yeas 
and nays were taken on laying the subject on the table—and 
resulted—yeas 80, nays 55. a 
Mr. LOGAN moved that Mrs. Brown and daughters have 
the use of the Senate chamber on Saturday evening, for a concert 
Carried. - 
And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned. 


XVII. SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. Patmer. 

Mr. SINGLETON presented the petition of H. G. Grimsley 
and others, for a provision in the constitution to prevent the 
emigration of negroes to, and the emancipation of, slaves in this 
State. Referred to the committee on the Bill of rights. 


[Mr. §. said: It would be a reflection upon the sagacity of the 
House to attempt to conceal his object in presenting, at this time, 
the petition that had just been read. The subject had been large- 
ly discussed, and on yesterday laid upon the table of this house, 
where gentlemen intend it shall remain. He was not content 
with this discussion, or satisfied with the course taken upon the 
subject of this petition, by honorable gentlemen on this floor. 
He was determined not to be satisfied. It was a question of im- 
portance to the people of Illinois, and so considered by his con- 
stituents, and for them he should speak. He had, therefore, 
availed himself of this method of reflecting the will of his constit- 
uents, and of expressing his own deep feelings upon the subject. 
If I had asked this house to reconsider their vote of yesterday, 
upon the resolution of the honorable gentleman from Clinton, and 
that reconsideration had, the proposition would not have been in 
a shape most acceptable to its friends. In order, then, to present 

this question to the convention in another and different shape, 
and at the earliest moment allowed by its rules, the form of peti- 
tion has presented itself as the only practicable mode. 

My object, continued Mr. S., is not to abridge the privileges 
of the unfortunate negro, except as incident to the assertion of a 
principle and the correction of a most dangerous and diabolical 
practice. I speak, sir, upon this floor for my constituents and for 
“myself, leaving to the superior ability of each friend of the prop- 
osition, contained in the prayer of the petitioners, the expression 
of their own views and the feelings of those they represent. 

The petitioners have indicated in their prayer to this body, 

BIH Sis 


(Bidets ion bing Wis sb MED bat nM adh bela Ao 
CO Aes STE ete aan Ca Rah Cc ateay ee 


their desire for such a permanent constitutional ile: upon ~ 
subject of free negroes, as will of itself effectually prevent their 
introduction amongst us, and at the same time prohibit the inter- 
ference of our citizens with the negro property of our neighboring 4) 


against any violation, by the inhabitants of this Stiles, of coon 
rights which have their foundation in the constitution of the United 
States, and acknowledged and respected by their laws. a 
But, Mr. President, it has been objected upon this floor, and — 
elsewhere, that this is not the proper subject of constitutional 
law. And this objection, sir, comes from a quarter hitherto re- 
spected. Shall I believe, sir, that gentlemen who urge this objec- 
tion are sincere? Shall I be thus free to yield up this question— ~ 
my high opinion of their legal learning and sagacity? Or shall I 
concede that it was made for the mere sport of the breeze, and 
when the storm should rage, new counsel would be heard? Sir, 
I cannot consent to be guilty of such gross injustice to those gen- 
tlemen as would result from an acknowledgment of their sincer- 
ity. Do gentlemen who support this objection see that if i 
prevails, that they have contributed to the attainment of a most 
important and desirable object by the abolitionists—that it — 
lays the foundation, is the basis, the very platform of all their — 
future operations—that without this foundation no substantial _ 
fabric can be erected by them in this State—but upon such a — 
foundation they would erect a superstructure that would last” , 
until the hour of a bloody revolution? FS Se 
But at this point I am met by the arguments of gentlemen on. 
‘the other side, ‘‘that the legislature will have ample power to 
correct this evil.’’ Sir, I ask the gentlemen in reply, whether 
this is not a subject worthy of a permanent rule, and that it ought 
not to be subject to the changes that characterize the legislation 
of Illinois? And I ask gentlemen, whether the legislature, influ. 
enced by the example of this convention, would not rid themselves 
of the responsibility by postponing the subject to a succeed 
ing legislature, and so on, until the evil shall have subdued our — 
strength, and conquered all our hopes? If this matter is left open — 
for the action of the legislature, away with all hopes of domestic 
happiness in Illinois. If this subject, of such high importance to 


i 


SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1847 231 


the social condition of Illinois, is not worthy of a place in our con- 


stitution, then had we better return to our constituents, never 


again to ask the honor of their trust and confidence. 

Gentlemen have said, that the principles asserted by the reso- 
lutions were correct, but could not be enforced without legisla- 
tive enactments. Sir, the friends of this measure desire for many 
reasons to take the matter out of the hands of the legislature en- 
tirely. Hence, the resolution provides that ‘‘the constitution 
shall of itself contain sufficient power to correct the evils com- 


-plainedof.’’ Asa matter ofretrenchment, aconstitutional provision 


would be eminently useful to bring the expenses of the legislature 
within proper limits. All these exciting and time-absorbing 
questions should be excluded from its jurisdiction. If the question 
should be left to the legislature, it would become the subject of 
barter and exchange in adjusting the various interests of the State. 
Gentlemen representing counties where the evil did not exist, 
would readily exchange their votes for or against the black laws, 
as they are called, for the purpose of securing some favorite meas- 
ure of his [sic] constituents. It would at once hoist the food-gates 
of corruption, and from the fountain of power would our country 
be overwhelmed. 

But two other objections have been urged to the proposed 
provision, and with much energy upon the part of their respective 
friends. The honorable gentleman from Sangamon objects, be- 
cause in his opinion, it would endanger the adoption of the 
amended constitution. Thegentleman from Boone objects, because 
in his opinion, the North would reject the constitution, and for 
the additional high and weighty consideration, that we should be 
contravening the constitution of the United States. Sir, the con- 
stitution of the United States has laid the foundation for this pro- 
vision; the States conceived it necessary in justice to each other, 
for their mutual peace and good will, and for the perpetuation of 
national harmony, that it should be so laid. The second section 
of the fourth article of the constitution of the United States, is 
intended to operate upon those only who are held to service or 
labor in any State or territory within the limits and under the 
jurisdiction of the United States, and who may escape from such 


_ service or labor into this or any other State or territory within the 


232 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


prescribed limits. The States owe it to each other, that this pro- © 
vision should be strictly enforced, by the adoption of such per- 


manent and constitutional provisions as will effectually prevent 
the interference of the inhabitants of each, with the negro property 


of the other. But, Mr. President, this is not the constitutional 


provision by which thehonorable gentleman from Boone (Mr. 
Hur gut), seeks to establish the want of power in this Convention 
to enforce the proposition before it on yesterday; that provision 
is in these words: ‘“The citizens of each State shall be entitled 
to all the privileges and immunities of citizens in the several 


States.’? ‘The gentleman supposes that all distinctions of color 


are, or may become unconstitutional,—that if a negro, who by the ~ 


laws of New York is a citizen, and may exercise the right of suff- 


rage, should emigrate to this State, he would in consequence of the — 


laws of New York, and his emigration to the State, be entitled to 
all the privileges and immunities of free white citizens of Illinois. 
Sir, this doctrine is too absurd to excite the least alarm. I 


apprehend that the gentleman would not insist that a boy of the 


State of New York, who was by the laws of that State entitled to 
vote, would upon his arrival here, in consequence of the New York 


laws, be taken out of the limitations and provisions of our own — 


laws concerning minors? Has New York the right to fix an age 


of majority for us, and the qualifications of our electors?—Have 
we not full power to limit the rights of suffrage to those who have © 


resided twelve months in this State? And have we not, sir, a 


perfect and indefeasible right to limit it to free white men over the ~ 


age of twenty-one years? The objections of the honorable gen- 
tleman from Sangamon (Mr. Locan), do not apply to the proposi- 
tion now before this Convention, nor sir, did they well apply to 


the proposition which was laid upon your table on yesterday. — 


Sir, we have no desire to encumber the various amendments that 
will be submitted to the people:—or rather, sir, we wish this prop- 
osition not to be encumbered or endangered by any other amend- 
ment, and therefore the proposition now before the house is, that 
it shall be submitted as a distinct and separate amendment. Its 
friends rely upon its own intrinsic merit, and upon the high sense 
of popular honor and popular justice. But, sir, suppose it was 
not proposed to submit this to the people as a distinct and sepa- 


SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1847 233 


rate provision—as was the case with the proposition of my honor- 


able friend from Clinton, are we Sir, to be deterred from doing our 
duty here, because the gentleman objects that the North will 
reject the constitution? Has Illinois no other point but the North? 
Is there no South, no East, no West to the State? Have these 
‘points no power, no votes to give, for or against, the constitution? 
Is the voice of the North to prevail upon this floor to the exclusion 
of every other interest? Then, sir, let the south, the east and the 
west unite their feeble voices for their mutual security. If it is 
the determination of northern men to draw a line of distinction 
between the north and the south,—if the north is resolved upon a 
mixed society of free blacks and white population, with equal 
privileges, then, sir, let the line be formed that my constituents 
and myself may seek repose upon its southern side. 

What, Mr. President, are we to think if gentlemen are truly 
representing the north upon this subject? How monstrous the 
declaration they have made! How threatening to the peace and 
all the sacred virtues of the State! Have gentlemen who would 
claim for New York negroes, or the negroes of any other country, 
the privileges of free white citizens of Illinois, sir, inquired into 
the extent of these privileges? If they have not, sir, let them 
divide the sovereign power of this State into as many parts as 
there are free white male citizens over the age of twenty-one years, 
and each part will be found to contain the privileges of a citizen, 
they will be astonished at the extent of privileges they claim for 
that degraded race. Sir, the fairest daughter in the land is not 
beyond their reach; the highest pinnacle of power and station, is 
accessible to their ambition; all the refinements of society are 
crushed and swallowed up in their progress, till not a virtue is left 
to mark our once exalted and dignified race. There are, sir, upon 
this floor undisguised abolitionists, who have in this hall voted 
directly upon the subject of abolishing the distinction of color. 
Sir, I admire the manly independence of those gentlemen, the 
color of their flag is not concealed, whilst I hate and despise their 
principles; but, sir I cannot express the slightest approbation of 
the conduct of gentlemen, who from various motives have voted 
with the abolitionists in securing a most important advantage to 
them and alike dangerous to us. If gentlemen have been actu- 


234 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION ire 


ated by their regard for northern men, and hee are here Hebe 
sented as northern principles, then let us have an open avowal,— 
throw off the flimsy cover of specious theory, and frankly acknow! 
edge their degeneracy, that southern opinion, and southern prin 
ciples may see and know by what they are opposed. oh eam 

I cannot, sir, from my knowledge of northern gentlemen and 
ladies, believe that they are truly represented in all things upon 
this floor. Among them are many I feel proud to call friends, and 
to whom the idea of being reduced to the society of negroes wouk 
be most frightfully revolting. But, sir, If I did believe it, my 
course here would not be changed. I have made the proper in 
quiry of my conscience, and my constituents; they answer tha 
am right. They are not willing that a handful of abolitionist 
should trample over the great body of the people of this State, 
because they threaten to vote against the adoption of the con- 
stitution. Gentlemen should not be deterred by such threats from, 
giving their support to correct principles, irrespective of men or 
places. 

The effect of a principle upon a given portion of the ‘Stat 
ought not to be considered. Enquire and learn the general ten 
ine effect and correctness ofa principle, and apply 1 it alike tor 2 


abolitionists without the desired prohibition. If gentlemen per- 
sist in arguing that it is not the duty of this Convention to act 
upon the question, then, sir, am I willing to meet them upon ha 
way ground, and strike out from the constitution everything 
which relates to slavery and involuntary servitude, if nothing but 
_the society of negroes will suit gentlemen. Then, sir, leave ever 
citizen of the State at liberty to introduce slaves if he pleases, and 
those who do not like the relation of master and servant will have 
an opportunity of indulging their taste. J 
The honorable gentleman from Winnebago added one other to 
the objections already noticed, that if this provision is adopted, 1 
will drive many of our best citizens from the States. Truly, Mr. - 
President, a most deplorable event that we shall lose that portion — 
of our population who prefer the society of negroes to that of th 


SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1847 235 


own race and condition! Sir, if there are such men in this State 
as the honorable gentleman speaks of, they can now have my leave 
of absence. Is the time of this Convention to be employed in 
attempting to reconcile men of this kind? Sir, the world is large 
enough for us all, and I have no desire to impose any restraint 


upon the taste of any men, if they are anxious to become the 
associates of negroes, or if they desire to establish any other rela- 


tion between themselves and the negroes. I hope they may be 
indulged, but not at the expense of those who have no such taste 
or ambition. 

When a petition was presented a few days since, praying among 
other things, that this Convention should abolish all distinction 
between the white man and negro, I moved to lay the petition on 


the table until December a year, because sir, it was an insult to 


this body, who were asked by the petitioners to degrade them- 
selves; abolish all distinction between ourselves and the worthless 
herd of innumerable wretches that would flock to our State; but, 
sir, that petition was referred. For what, sir? For mere formal 
respect to the petitioners! Gentlemen thought and declared that 
it was right it should be considered. I will again refer to the case 
I supposed on yesterday—that there are two men living in the 
same neighborhood, one has a beautiful and interesting daughter, 
the other, had a well bred negro man in his employment; the latter 
proposes to his neighbor, sir, I wish you to receive my negro man 
into your family as a gentleman; extend to him the society of your 
daughter, and encourage their marriage together. Now, sir, I 
ask, could such a request be listened to by any man of ordinary 
self-respect with any degree of patience? Would he indulge the 
audacity of his unprincipled neighbor by delaying his answer? 
No, sir! Time is not necessary for the consideration of subject, 
and the answer, no, with a corresponding action, would put the 
contaminating wretch to flight. All such petitions contain in 
substance the same request, and ought to be as summarily dis- 
posed of. Members’ minds were made upon this subject and they 
were ready to decide, but out of show of respect the petition must 
be referred. I have no respect, sir, for such petitions, or those 
who sign them, nor would I have them believe from this deceptive 
policy of referring that I had; and I am grateful to know that my 


236 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


name stands among the independent spirits of this body who 
voted against its reference. 

Allow me Mr. President, to return for a moment to that ob- 
jection which seems most popular and plausible with gentlemen 
who have opposed our views on this discussion. It has been 


reiterated upon this floor, that this subject more properly be- 


longed to the legislature. If it does, then let me ask if this body 
does not constitute the supreme legislative or law-making power 
of this State? It is the highest legislative power known to civil 
society, for whose good government and laws have been insti- 
tuted—an object worthy of our action and patient deliberation— 
upon the organization of society governments were erected for 
their security and protection, and as society lies at the foundation 
of government, all laws, either supreme or subordinate, should be 
framed with reference to its preservation and protection. It is 
our duty to see that it is not crushed and destroyed by the blight- 
ing curse of neglect. Society has given birth to power, and in the 
exercise of that power, its claims should first command our atten- 


tion, and be the last to be postponed. Whilst the time and 


attention of the Convention is employed in arranging the length, 
breadth and power of office, and officers, the mere details of gov- 
ernment is a great and paramount principle, to be overlooked, the 
influence of which is felt everywhere, extending itself to the family 


altar and the peaceful fireside. Sir, I cannot be content with such ~ 


neglect of such a principle. 


I now come, Mr. President, to consider the effect of leaving - 


this question open, having already adverted to the effect of such 
a course upon the legislature, and the possibility of a further 
postponement by that body. I will consider briefly, its 


influence upon the question of equality as presented by abolition-— 


ists, and its moral effect upon the community at large. 


Illinois has already been the theatre of outrages which brand 


her with almost indelible disgrace. The rights of neighboring 
States have been openly disregarded, the property of our neigh- 
bors forcibly taken, and forcibly withheld. Our own halls of 
justice have been invaded to inflict this violence, and now, sir, the 
public peace and tranquility, public and private justice, a due re- 
gard for the compact between the States, our self-respect, our 


= 


on Re gle 


aeoalies 


SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1847 237 


peace at home and our character abroad, all unite in demanding 
a remedy. If this question is postponed, an important point is 
gained by the abolitionist, without which they could not succeed 
with their iniquitous schemes; hence they are emboldened by this 
temporary triumph, they see their influence is felt and acknowl- 
edged, they will come out from their hiding places, and that which 
has been done under cover of night will be openly transacted. 
The negroes, sir, will be emboldened, and the public highways will 
scarcely afford them room to pass, such will be the rapid increase 
of their numbers and consequence. 

The States that surround us have taken measures to rid them- 
selves of this nuisance whilst Illinois, with open arms, invites them 
to her embrace. It is substantially an invitation to the super- 
annuated and worthless free negroes of the south to come within 
our borders; it gives them assurance of present liberty, and future 
equality. Itisin effect, a license to those who wish to engage in 
the lucrative business of negro-stealing from our sister States. It 
furnishes such men with facilities that could not be otherwise 
supplied, free negroes, thus introduced, become the agents and 
willing instruments of designing abolitionists; their depots will 
be erected upon each line of ‘‘underground railway,’’ under the 
superintendence of some bold and enterprising free negro; and 
Illinois become the receptacle of this worthless and refuse popu- 
lation of all the States—And we shall not find good citizens from 
abroad coming here, sir, to seek their society; but, on the contrary, 
those good citizens of IIlinois, not lost to all the finer feelings of 
their nature, will seek another home. That equality here boldly 
proposed, will gradually but imperceptibly fix itself upon the 
institutions of the State. A Nat Turner will spring up to conduct 
a war of extermination against the whites. 

If, sir, in the slave States an attempt to exterminate the whites 
should have been made, is it beyond the limits of probability, that 
in Illinois, where all legislation tends to encourage it, that it would 
also be attempted? The scenes of South Hamptonin Virginia, 
will be re-enacted in Illinois; and the blood of our citizens be the 
alarming sacrifice. A minority of this body have demanded a 
remedy, without it their voice can never be still; though small in 
number, I am proud to be one of them; our position now is that 


238 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


of sentinels upon the outer walls of the ramparts of social liberty, — 


and our exertions will ever be to awaken Illinois to a sense of her 
danger. History presents to us an example that gives us hope; 
the example of our revolutionary fathers forbids us despair. 

The patriotism of our glorious revolution first found in the 


hearts of a few, resisting the waves of British vengeance that __ 


lashed our shores, strikingly illustrates the power of the few, when 
coupled with unconquerable determination; but, sir, there is still 
another and broader foundation for our hopes, to be found in the 
‘more calm and deliberate consideration of this subject, by honor- 
able members of this convention; when they look at the tendency 
of this great question to break the cords that bind us together as 
a nation; when they consider the inevitable tendency of their 
decision, they cannot consent to return to their constituents with- 
out repairing the insult and the wrong they have done them. 
The effect of this question may be seen in the condition of our 
federal Union. The strength of our government has so far been 


equal to every internal division; but, sir, it owes its success to the 


concentrated power of a united people. The odious doctrine of 
abolition will ‘‘divide and conquer,’ and too much reliance on 
the strength of our government exposes us to.a weaker power; 
broad, deep and firm as this government may be in its foundation, 


bold and commanding in its superstructure, it is not beyond the 


reach of such odious steps as have been allowed to abolitionists 
upon this floor. And when the time comes, sir, who will sympa- 
thize with Illinois, when the hideous shouts of exultation rise from 
a victorious negro population in Illinois? What sound but the 
death shrieks of liberty? Shall we hear it?]8 


PERSONAL 


Mr. CAMPBELL, of Jo Daviess, asked to be excused from | 


any longer serving on the committee on Education. He assured 
the Convention, that in making this request, he was not influenced 
by any change’ of feelings or abatement of zeal, in regard to the 
great cause of education. Whatever situation he might occupy, 


his best efforts should continue to be directed to the advancement 


°8 This speech by Singleton is taken from the Sangamo Journal, July 8. 


ee 2 ee oe 


F3 
Se 7 as, 


= 


SATURDAY; JUNE 26, 1847 239 


_ of that cause, upon which depends in an eminent degree the moral, 
_ religious and political prosperity of the people. 
Mr. GREGG said, that the course of the gentleman from 
Jo Daviess (Mr. CampBELL) was not unexpected to him (Mr. G.) 
_ after what had occurred the other day during the absence of that 
_ gentleman. I hope, however, said Mr.G., that what hasoccurred 
wil not cause him to withdraw from the committee where his 
_ experience may be so serviceable to the Convention and the State. 
3 [In order to make the report intelligible, the reporter would 
, here state, that Mr. Campsett is chairman of the committee on 
_ Education, and for the purpose of obtaining information and 
"4 Statistics, relating to the questions which had arisen and were 
_ likely to arise in the committee and the Convention, he went to 
Jacksonville on Wednesday last, after having apprised the com- 
' mittee of the object of his visit. On the following morning, 
_ Mr. Epwarps of Madison, from the committee on Education, 
- introduced a resolution, that that committee be requested to 
consider and report provisions for the security of the school fund; 
_ for a system of common schools, calculated to furnish Education 
to every child in the State; and also for the appointment of a 
: superintendent. After submitting the resolution, Mr. Epwarps 
__ made a long speech upon it, which, after it was concluded, the 
_ chair ruled out of order, on account of a resolution then on the 
table, which was entitled to precedence. Further action upon 
Mr. E’s. resolution was then postponed till the resolution entitled 
_ to precedence was disposed of; when that of Mr. E. again came 
‘up, Mr. Grecc moved to postpone it until Saturday, when Mr. 
_ Campzse_t would be present. Messrs. Epwarps of Madison, 
4 CHURCHILL and Servant, also advocated its postponement. 
_ Messrs. Wittiams, Evey, Davis of Montgomery, Pinckney and 
_ Kwowtron opposed it, and, after being amended, the resolution 
was adopted.] 
Mr. EDWARDS, of Madison said, for one, Mr. President, I 
exceedingly regret that circumstances have occur[rled to produce 
_ anunfavorable impression upon the mind of the honorable member 
i _ from Jo Daviess (Mr. CampsELL) in relation to what transpired 
ae - during his absence. There is no gentleman in this State for whom 
wT entertain a more profound respect, than the gentleman who 


See eee 


240 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


stands at the head of the committee on Education, and I assure 
him and his friends, that the part I bore in the action of the — 
committee which was had during his absence, was not prompted j 
by the least disrespect to him, but a desire to settle certain pre- — 
liminaries and to pave the way to the consideration and investiga- : 
tion of questions which it was expected would come before the - 
committee. I sincerely thought that the presentation of the — 
resolution and the reference of the subjects included in it to the com- i 
mittee, would be approved by the honorable chairman of that 
committee. It was agreed by the committee, that no final action ¥ 
should be had upon those subjects, until after the return of the — 
chairman, in order that he might participate in the deliberations — 
which might be had. i 

So far as I was concerned, Mr. President, I had but one desire, i 
that of settling preliminaries necessary to enable the committee 4 
to enter upon the duties appropriately belonging to them. I was 
but an humble pioneer in the important matters involved in the ~ 
resolution, and it was not my purpose to act upon them, in the — 
absence of the chairman, whose experience and information were 
-indispensible to an efficient performance of the duties assigned 
to the committee. I was too deeply impressed with a sense of 
that gentleman’s capacity, to attempt to act without the aid of - 
his abilities. The high estimation in which he is held by the 
people, and his past services in the cause of education, entitle his — 
opinions and suggestions, on all questions before that committee, — 
to more than ordinary consideration. 

In conclusion, Mr. President, I will repeat, that the 1 imputation 
that the committee acted in any manner inconsistent with a 
sentiment of the highest respect for the honorable chairman, is 
undeserved, and I hope that he will be induced to remain on the 
committee where his services are so much required. 

Mr. DEMENT said, that the course of the member Frou 
Jo Daviess (Mr. CampBELL) was not unexpected by him (Mr. D.). 
I have, said Mr. D., heard the explanation of the honorable — 
gentleman from Madison (Mr. Epwarps) with much pleasure, 
and I should regret to have the member from Jo Daviess persist 
in his application to be excused from serving on the committee. — 
I hope that he will reconsider his application, and not withdraw — 


SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1847 241 


from a station which he is so eminently qualified to fill, with honor 
to himself and advantage to the State. I hope that he will be 
satisfied with the explanation of the member from Madison. 

I think that the difficulty has arisen in consequence of a desire 
on the part of the committee to act seasonably upon the matters 
before them; but I think, inasmuch as the chairman was absent 
for a day or two, for the purpose of collecting data and information 
to aid the committee in their investigations, that they ought to 
have awaited his return. I did think that there was ground for 
disagreeable feelings until I heard the explanation of the gentle- 
man from Madison. 

It is well known to the Convention that the subject of educa- 
tion is one in which the member from Jo Daviess takes the deepest 
interest. He was the first to present the propositions embraced 
in the resolution, and he has distinguished himself for the zeal he 
has manifested in an improvement of the school system. These 
facts are well known, and will account for his desire to participate 
in the action of the committee upon subjects that may be referred 
to them. 

I am satisfied that there are no bad feelings on the part of the 
committee towards him, and I hope that he and his friends, of 
whom I am proud to be one, will be satisfied with the explanation 
that has been made. 

Mr. CHURCHILL said, that he supposed, when the resolution 
was introduced, that the committee was doing what the chairman 
would approve of.—He was, at the time, opposed to any final 
action upon the matters embraced in the resolution, but he did 
not then object to their being referred to the committee. 

Mr. PINCKNEY said, he hoped that the gentleman would 
remain on the committee. He (Mr. P.) did not know, when the 
gentleman was absent, that he was engaged in the business of the 
committee. 

Mr. CAMPBELL said, that he had apprised the committee of 
_ his intended visit to Jacksonville, and the object of it. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, that if the gentleman from Jo Daviess 
__ had been present when the resolution was offered he would not 
_ have taken exceptions to what took place on that occasion. The 
resolution was merely one of inquiry, not intended to be acted 


Se aL aaa bre PAG CAA ah Sonam iy Tita 


242 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


upon by the Convention at that time; and when the gentleman ~ 
from Cook (Mr. Grecc) proposed to postpone the debate till the — 
chairman of the committee should have returned, no member on ~ 
the floor was more warmly in favor of a postponement than the 
honorable member from Madison (Mr. Epwarps). He thought 
that his friend from Jo Daviess was under a false impression in — 
relation to the treatment he had received at the hands of the ~ 
committee, and he desired that he would withdraw his application — 
for a discharge, and consent to continue to serve as chairman. 
Mr. SHIELDS said, that he was persuaded that the committee — 
intended no disrespect to the gentleman from Jo Daviess. He — 
had told the gentleman from Ogle (Mr. Pinckney) that the ~ 
chairman of the committee was absent, and that he (Mr. S.) © 
thought it proper to defer action until his return. ay 
Mr. PRATT. As a friend and colleague of the member from | 
Jo Daviess, it may not be regarded as improper in me, to express _ 
my views in relation to the subject which has given rise to this 
debate. In doing so, sir, I will not say that 1am prepared tourge — 
him to persist in his request to be discharged from the committee, — 
after what has been said; but I will say, that I approved of his 
application, because I deemed it the only step he could take to 
maintain his own dignity and that of his constituents. It is 
known to this body, that my colleague had been absent from the 
people he now represents, for a period of four years, and that he 
returned to them only a few days before his election. He had 
been, during the period of his absence, serving the people in the - 
capacity of Secretary of State, to his own detriment, so far as 
pecuniary matters are concerned, and it was his purpose, when — 
he returned to Galena, to engage in the practice of his profession — 
and repair the pecuniary loss he had sustained by accepting office. 
Independently of the ardent friendship entertained for him by the 
people of Jo Daviess, he had other pretensions to a seat in this — 
body, among which were the services he had rendered in behalf — 
of education. These, together with his great personal popularity, 
led his constituents to urge him to return to Springfield as a 
delegate to this Convention. He consented to make the sacrifice, — 
and it is but natural that a desire should be felt to sustain the high — 
estimation in which he is held by his constituents. In this, how- — 


SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1847 243 


ever, he is doomed to disappointment, if the newspaper report of 
_ the proceedings of Wednesday last, is to go abroad without expla- 
_ nation. In these reports there is no explanation of the cause of 
his absence from his seat.—[Mr. P. here read the reports of the 
Journal and Register newspapers, which did not state that Mr. 
_ Campse.t was absent on the business of the committee.] His 
_ constituents (continued Mr. P.) might infer from this report, that 
he was absent from his post at the very moment when his services, 
as chairman of the committee on Education, were required; and 
this circumstance, unexplained, might go far to prejudice him in 
the confidence of those whom it is his highest aim to faithfully 
_ represent. This, together with a refusal by the Convention to 
postpone action on the resolutions offered by Mr. Epwarps, until 
_ the chairman of the committee could be heard, would in the absence 
_ of explanation be a poor compliment to that gentleman, and in 
_ addition, would furnish to his enemies, abroad from here, quite 
too ready a weapon, which they might wield to his i injury. These 
things were well calculated to mortify his feelings. 
i It is due to the honorable gentleman from Madison to say that, 
at the time the motion to postpone was made by the gentleman 
from Cook, it was seconded by him and urged in an appropriate 
manner; but I must say, sir, in this connection, that the gentleman 
from Ogle did not, in my judgment, act in this matter with that 
delicacy and courtesy which some years’ acquaintance with his 
good name and reputation had taught me to expect from him. 
When my colleague, the chairman of the committee on Education, 
notified the committee of his intended absence, it was but courteous 
to postpone any action in the Convention on subjects previously 
brought by him before that committee, until his return; yet the 
gentleman from Ogle, when the gentleman from Cook proposed to 
‘postpone the resolution, opposed the postponement. If wrong in 
this, the gentleman can now correct me. The course of gentlemen, 
___who opposed the suggested postponement, together with the final 
action of the Convention upon the subject, I cannot, if I would, 
deny was a source of mortification to me, and especially so when 
I recollected that when the report of the committee on the 
‘Executive Department was printed and laid on our tables, the 
consideration of the report was unanimously postponed on account 


244 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


of the absence of the honorable chairman, who was away at he. 
same time and for the same purposes as my colleague. 

When I said, sir, that I regarded my colleague’s withdeseatl 
from the committee as an act due to himself and his constituents, — 
I did not mean to be understood as advising him not to re-consider ~ 
his application for a discharge. My desire was that he might be ~ 
placed in a proper light before the country, and it is a matter — 
within his own discretion, whether he shall, after what has been : 
said, deem it proper to yield to the general wish of the Convention ~ 
and consent to remain on the committee. 4 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, I do not recollect that the ae 
from Ogle urged an unqualified discussion of the question on 
Wednesday last. I understood that he desired, if discussion was 
to be had, that the honorable chairman should be present. I 
think that the member from Jo Daviess (Mr. Pratr) does not — 
recollect the precise position taken by the member from Ogle. 

Mr. SCATES. I think that the honorable chairman’s course 
is right. It was proper for him to call the matter up in some fore ! 
and place himself right before his constituents. I am satisfied, 
from what has been said, that no disrespect towards him was in- 
tended, and I sincerely hope that he will now be satisfied and ~ 
consent to remain on the committee. 

Mr. SERVANT said, that as he had partaken in the debate at 
the time the committee had reported the resolution, he thought it — 
would not be wrong in him to say a few words upon the matter 
before the Convention. He thought the matter was not viewed 
in a proper light. He never imagined that the least disrespect 
was intended by the committee, nor shown by any member of the 
Convention, towards the honorable gentleman from Jo Daviess, 
whose services and labors in the cause of education were so highly 
valued and esteemed. He hoped that gentleman would withdraw 
his request and that he would continue to afford the committee 
the benefit of his great talents and information. He thought the 
cause given for the request was without foundation, and he trusted 
the gentleman would be satisfied with the manifest opinion in which ~ 
the house concurred that no disrespect was intended. 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac hoped the gentleman from Jo Daviess — 
would yield’ to what appeared the almost unanimous request of — 


SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1847 245 


~ the Sis and withdraw his request to be excused, particularly 
_ when it was manifest that every member desired him to retain his 
pppoe. upon the committee, and known that his great abilities were 

required upon the committee. The committee of which the 
4 gentleman was chairman was one of the most important character, 
_ and of the greatest interest to the State, and he repeated his hope 
_ that that gentleman would retain his position and withdraw his 
request. 

Mr. ALLEN joined in the request that the gentleman from 
Jo Daviess would withdraw his motion to be excused. Although 
he was much surprised at the time the resolution was reported, 
while the chairman of the committee was absent, and also surprised 
that it was not postponed till his return; he was satisfied, how- 
_ ever, that no disrespect was intended by the action of the members of 
' the committee, or of the Convention. He believed that sufficient 
had been said by every member of the committee to satisfy 
_ that gentleman that no disrespect was intended, and to induce him 
_ toremain on the committee. It was the desire of the country that 
- he should do so; the gentleman’s talents, and the much thought 

which he had given to the subject of education, had led the people 
to expect much from him. His able report on this question, and 
‘in relation to the appointment of a superintendent of public 
“instruction, had awakened much interest, and had directed public 
attention to him as one pre-eminently qualified to be at the 
_head of a committee on that subject. He hoped the gentleman 
from Jo Daviess would withdraw his request to. be excused. 
Mr. LOUDON said, that he entertained the highest respect 
_ for the gentleman from Jo Daviess, and he earnestly hoped that 
the request to be excused would be withdrawn. If the committee, 
_ however, had thoughtlessly reported in the absence of the chair- 
‘man, he knew that none of the committee intended the least dis- 
_ Tespect, to mar his feelings or injure his honor. The gentleman 
from Jo Daviess had a standing high in the estimation of the 
Convention and of the country, and he hoped their unanimous 
desire would induce the gentleman to continue in his post, as 
chairman of the committee. 
Mr. LOGAN repeated what he deemed the universal desire of 
the Convention, that the gentleman from Jo Daviess would con- 


ine adc 


ee ee 


Sane ST ae Ue BAL Bia Ah 


246 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


tinue on the committee, and withdraw his request. He felt sure, 
from what had been said, that the gentleman from Jo Daviess - 
must feel now that no disrespect was intended by the gentleman — < 
from Madison, or the other members of the committee, in what 
had taken place in relation to the report. 

Mr. HARDING said, he was a member of the committee Sale 
Education, and was confident that the course of the committee _ 
had not been dictated by any feelings of disrespect towards the ~ 
chairman. The committee had held two meetings; at the first, 
the chairman was present and presided. They met again last ¥ 
Tuesday, the chairman was not present, the members came with — 
several propositions, none of which were offered or acted on — 
because of the absence of the chairman. It was, however, agreed — 
that a resolution should be offered, as it was understood that no — 
question should be inquired into without first having the matter a 
come from the Convention. He had voted for that resolution, — : 
although he was opposed to the principles contained in it. In all — 
this, no one, so far as he knew, intended the least disrespect towards 
the chairman. aq 

Mr. ARCHER hoped that the gentleman from Jo Daviess j 
would, after the explanations that had been given, and the dis- : 
claimers of all disrespect, withdraw his application to be 
excused from serving on the committee. The cause of education — 
was one in which the people of the whole State felt the greatest — 
interest, and one on which they looked to this Convention to 
bestow great deliberation; and as the talent and abilities of thea i 
gentleman from Jo Daviess had been, heretofore, somewhat 
directed to this subject, the people of the State looked to him for 
much of the care and benefit to be secured by this favorite question. © 4 
He hoped, sincerely, that the request would be withdrawn. — 

Mr. SHUMWAY said, he was a member of the committee, 
but was not present at the meeting when this resolution was} 
directed to be reported. 

Mr. KNOWLTON said, that it was, perhaps, proper in him, 
as he had taken part in this matter when the committee reported - 
the resolution, to say that his course and his remarks were not, in 
the slightest degree, intended to be disrespectful to the distin- 
guished chairman of the committee—the gentleman from Jo 


4 


: 
“4 


SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1847 247 


Daviess. Nor did he think that any was intended or shown by 
the action or language used on that occasion by the gentleman from 
Madison. He hoped the request would be withdrawn. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, that it was a matter of 


_ extreme regret to him that so much of the time of the Convention 


had been occupied by this subject. He did not expect this when 
the request was made. It was true that he was absent when the 
committee met, he had gone to Jacksonville. He had not gone 
there to attend to business of his own alone; not for his own amuse- 
ment, but to get certain documents, which could not be had here, 
in reference to the very subject before the committee. When he 
returned he heard of what had taken place, and from the reports 
of the proceedings published in the papers, and the effect which he 
knew they would have on his constituents, he felt that they were 
as much calculated to injure his character, as they were deeply 
poignant to his feelings. Without being advised to do so by any 
of his friends, and without consultation with them on the subject, 
he, of his own accord, determined to withdraw from the committee. 
Accordingly, he made the request, but now, from what had taken 
place, he concluded to withdraw that request. 

Mr. EDWARDS, of Madison, approved of the highly honorable 
course of the gentleman from Jo Daviess, and feeling what was due 
to his own character, he asked to be excused from serving on the 
committee. 

Mr. DEMENT said, that he hoped the same reasons that had 
induced the gentleman from Jo Daviess to withdraw his applica- 
tion to be excused from serving on the committee on Education, 
would also induce the gentleman from Madison to do the same. 
I know not, said he, who the other gentlemen are that compose 
that committee, but I do know that there are none in the State 
whom I would rather see on that committee than those two gentle- 
men. I know not what the gentleman from Madison may have 
thought required him to make this request, but I hope that he will 
continue to serve, so that the Convention and the State might 
have the united talents of the two gentlemen. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, that while he approved of the honor- 
able course of the gentleman from Jo Daviess, he would hope the 
gentleman from Madison would not withdraw his application. 


id 


248 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS _ 


He was the friend of both parties, still he thought that, after what 
had fallen in the remarks of gentlemen, that his friend from 
Madison ought not to continue on the committee. 

Mr. CHURCHILL agreed with the gentleman last up, and 
considered that the conduct of the committee had been unjustly 
alluded to, and he would not continue to serve; he, therefore, asked 
to be excused from that committee. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery was of opinion that the gentle- 
man from Madison should not withdraw his application. 

Mr. SCATES, not being much versed in matters of etiquette, 
could not see, from what had transpired, any necessity for the 
request of the gentleman from Madison. He was sure that no one 
had intimated that that gentleman had acted in any way the least 
unworthy of his distinguished reputation. 

Mr. WHITNEY, after speaking in the highest terms of both 
gentlemen, and in approval of their conduct, said that, while 
he anxiously desired that the gentleman from Madison would with- 
draw his application, he would vote for excusing him if he persisted 
that his withdrawal was necessary. 


Mr. DAVIS of Massac sincerely hoped that the gentleman - ad 


from Madison would adopt the same course pursued by the 
gentleman from Jo Daviess and withdraw his application. Neither — 
the gentleman from Jo Daviess nor any of his friends desired to 
injure the feelings or the honor of the gentleman from Madison, 
and he hoped he would continue on the committee. (uy 
Mr. EDWARDS of Madison said I respect the course of the — 
honorable gentleman from Jo Daviess, and I wish not to be under- — 


stood as entertaining the least feeling of disapprobation of the 


course of the gentleman or any of his friends on this floor. 
But I hope they, and the Convention, will respect my feelings, for — 
I cannot act on that committee and rest under the imputation — 
that must, from this discussion, be placed upon my actions. 

Mr. LOGAN explained that when he had requested the gentle- 


man from Jo Daviess to withdraw his application, that he in no 


wise admitted that the conduct of the gentleman from Madison, ~ 
or the committee, had been wrong. He appealed to the gentleman 
from Madison to withdraw his application. He (Mr. L.) could — 
not be shoved off any committee by what anybody said. 


SATURDAY, JUNE 26, 1847 249 


Mr. KNOWLTON was extremely gratified when the gentleman 
3S from Jo Daviess had withdrawn his request to be excused, because 
he was satisfied that no disrespect to him had been intended. He 
: would not, however, desire the gentleman from Madison to with- 
draw his application. 

_ Mr. HAYES said, that he was one of those friends of the gentle- 
- man from Jo Daviess who had requested that gentleman to 
_ withdraw his request, and he did not wish to be understood as 
having in any way thrown any imputation upon the honorable 
“se gentleman from Madison. He offered the following resolution, 
and asked its unanimous adoption. 

Resolved, That it is the unanimous desire of this Convention 
that the Hon. Cyrus Edwards shall retain his position as a member 
of the committee on Education. 

Messrs. Pinckney, ARCHER and Brockman hoped the appli- 
cation made by the gentleman from Madison would be withdrawn. 

Mr. CONSTABLE repeated his opinion that the gentleman 
from Madison should not withdraw his request. 

Mr. DEMENT made some remarks in reply to Mr. C. 

Mr. CONSTABLE made a rejoinder, which drew forth a sur- 
rejoinder from Mr. D. 

On motion, the Convention adjourned till 4 P. m. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess appealed to the gentleman 
from Madison to remain on the committee. He and his friends 
were fully satisfied of the purity of the motives of the gentleman - 
from Madison in what had taken place. 

Mr. EDWARDS, of Madison said, he had no feeling of resent- 
ment towards anyone in that hall. He had acted only in obedience 
to a sense of duty towards the committee. The cause of his 
request was not here, for he felt that no one then would suspect his 

- motives or attribute to him anything dishonorable, but when the 
published proceedings of this day are sent forth with such com- 
ments as might be made, the imputation that he had endeavored 
to supplant the honorable gentleman as the head of that com- 
mittee, would be placed upon him. This is why he desired to be 


20 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


excused from the committee. He would leave the matter with 
the Convention. © . 

The resolution offered by Mr. Hares being withdrawn at the 
request of Mr E., the request of that gentleman to be excused 5 
was unanimously refused. ae 

Mr. CHURCHILL’S application was also refused. 

Mr. Z. CASEY, from the committee on Revenue, to which had — 
been referred the resolution directing them to inquire &c., of fixing — 
a maximum rate of taxation, reported the same back and asked to 1 
be discharged from the further consideration of the same. path, ‘ 
to. 

Mr. SHARPE offered the following resolution; which was 
adopted: : 
Resolved, That the 11th section of the 2d article of the piece | 
constitution be referred to the committee on the Organization of — 
Departments and Officers connected with the Executive Depart- : 
ment. . 

Messrs. MarsHAtt of Mason, VERNOoR, SCATES, Soran, E 
Davis of Massac, Kinney of St. Clair, Cross of Winnebago ang 
Powers offered resolutions of i inquiry which were referred to 
appropriate committees. No copies of the same having beat : 
furnished, we are unable to give them. 

Mr. SERVANT offered the following resolution; which was — 
adopted: 

Resolved, That the committee on the Judiciary be ESSE : 
to inquire into the expediency of exempting persons having con- 
scientious scruples, from serving on juries, upon such terms as } 
shall be deemed reasonable and just. : 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess’ offered the following; which 
was adopted: i 

Resolved, That the Executive committee be requested to inquire ~ 
into the expediency of inserting in the constitution a clause pro- — 
viding for the election of sheriffs for term of years, and making 
them ineligible for more than one year consecutively. ] 

And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned. | 


biel, DaaT, Ute Le 


XVIII. MONDAY, JUNE 28, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Green, of ‘Tazewell. 
Mr. CANADY offered a resolution, that the committee on 
- Incorporations report a clause, to be incorporated into the consti- 


tution, granting banking privileges upon certain conditions. 


Mr. MARKLEY offered a substitute, that said committee 
_ should report a clause prohibiting banks. 
~ Mr. McCALLEN moved to lay the subject on the table. 


a " Lost—yeas 62, nays 49. [sic] 


_ Mr. SINGLETON offered a resolution of inquiry in relation 
to officers for life. Carried. — 
BANKS 


Mr. SCATES moved that the Convention go into committee 
of the whole, and take up the subjects made the special order of 


' the day for Friday last; which motion was carried, and the Con- 


_ vention resolved itself into committee of the whole, Mr. E>warps 


of Sangamon, in the Chair. 


The propositions submitted by Messrs. CourcHILL, McCaLLen 


and Grecc, were taken up by the committee. 


Mr. SCATES offered the following: 

Whereas, the power “to regulate commerce with foreign nations, 
and among the several States, and with the Indian tribes,” and 
“to coin money, regulate the value thereof, and of foreign coin, 


and fix the standard of weights and measures” has been granted 


exclusively to the United States, and the power “‘to coin money, 


emit bills of credit, make anything but gold and silver coin a 
_ tender in payment of debts” has been prohibited to the States; 


therefore, 

Resolved, That the States ought not to attempt to do indirectly 
what they have no power to do directly. 

Resolved, That the committee on Incorporations be instructed 
to inquire into the expediency of submitting, for the consideration 
of the people at the polls, whether they wish or desire to place a 

251 


252 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


total prohibition upon the Legislature to attempt to create, extend — 


or authorize any banking powers or privileges in this State, or any 
exclusive powers or privileges not common to other citizens. — 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, that he did not rise to 
detain the Convention by any lengthy remarks, but he desired 
to express his views upon this question.—He was one of those who 
were opposed to banks of any kind or under any system; and he 
came from a region in this State where the people were all opposed 
to banks. He, himself, had always been opposed to banks, either 
local or State banks. He looked upon the present as one of the 
most important questions that was to be decided by this Conven- 
tion, indeed, it was more important than any other, for it would 
have a great weight upon the interests of the people, their pros- 
perity and trade. It would, also, affect, more than any other 
single question, the fate of the Constitution which this Convention 
would adopt. The Convention had a different task to perform 
than had the Convention which framed the constitution of the 
United States. The delegates to that Convention came from 
different States, and endeavored to retain all the power to the 
States which was possible, and they gave Congress the power to 
pass no laws the power to pass which was not expressly stated in 
the constitution. Our duty is different. Our Legislature may 
pass any law which is not forbidden by the constitution, or which 
does not come in conflict with the constitution of the United States. 
This great power, thus vested in the Legislature, pointed out the 
necessity of placing some restrictions in the constitution upon 
their committing any acts affecting the happiness, wealth and 
prosperity of the people. He remembered the time when there 
was but one bank in the State, and he remembered, also when 


there was but one newspaper—published at Edwardsville. He, 


also, well remembered how this paper would publish lists of the 
banks whose notes would be received at the land office, and that 
when men in Kentucky and other States would bring those bank 
notes here to invest in land, they would find that the list published 
the week before had been stricken out and new banks inserted. In 
1819 the Edwardsville bank closed. The Legislature then tried 
their hand again, and created the bank at Vandalia, whose notes 
bore 2 per cent. interest. These went for some time, and after 


MONDAY, JUNE 28, 1847 - 253 


_ and then three for one. The Legislature finally passed a law to 
cut the notes in half so that each end of a dollar bill should be 
aq taken for half a dollar, and the halves of a $3 bill for $1.50. This 
state of things continued a long while, and the notes became so 
_ depreciated that they sold for a trifle; speculators made fortunes 
by buying them up. The treasury finally redeemed them.—From 
1824 to 1835 we had no banks, and I ask any man if, during that 
time, we were not prosperous and out of debt? Drovers from 


_ Pennsylvania and elsewhere came here and bought up the stock 


of our people, and paid them in cash for it, and all things went on 
well. We were prospering slowly but surely. There were no 


_ suits going on, except litigated cases; no suits before justices of 


the peace, except when parties disputed, or where men were unable 
to pay the debt. 

In 1834 or 35 the Legislature chartered a State bank, and 
revived the Shawneetown and Cairo banks, and these institutions 
scattered their branches all over the State; and then we commenced 
the internal improvement system, which would never had [sic] 
been the case had it not been for the inflated currency of these 

_banks—then came the rise in the prices of everything—pork went 
up suddenly to 53, cows to $10, and labor from $10 per month to 
$20—all the people made calculations upon the existing prices, 
and all embarked in speculation. Such always are the calculations 
made by people under such a sudden change of affairs, even 
experienced merchants commenced speculating. But, sir, the 
system of internal improvements was broken up. Then came the 
reaction. Everything went down faster than it had come up. 
Pork to 14, labor to $7.50, and the whole people became in 
debt. Not because they had not the property, but because they 
had no money, and their produce would not bring what they had 
calculated it would. The banks are all broken up, and we now 
feel the consequences of the evils they worked. We find ourselves 
in debt to the amount of thirteen or fourteen millions! They had, 
also a demoralizing effect upon the people. Many young men 
(indeed, all turned speculators,) threw off their jeans coats, became 


too proud to work upon their fathers’ farms, and might be seen 


dressed in the finest style, looking like physicians or the greatest 


254 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION: 


aristocrats. All upon credit! We come here to reform our Sta 
government; we are about to adopt measures to relieve the Stat 
of her debt—farmers are realizing fair prices for their products, the 
State, so far as individuals are concerned, is out of debt—though — 
every thing heretofore has been tending to our ruin—and we are 4 , 
fast going out of difficulties into which that system had led us. 
If these things really are, if farmers are receiving the best prices, ee 
where the necessity of banks? I hope the gentlemen will point 
us to the necessity for banks. They ought to do so, for they ~ 
propose'a system filled with horrors, and they should show the — 
necessity for its adoption. It is too late in the day for aati i, 


The demand always regulates the value of an article. 
What is the staple of Illinois? Pork, beef and flour. Are 4 
banks necessary for the sale and purchase of these? Are we not ‘ 


These products find a market elsewhere and not in ie Sse 
Banks cannot raise their price, people must come here from 
abroad to purchase those articles, and the price will always be ~ 
regulated by the demand. Gentlemen say they are opposed to — 
banks, yet will not vote for a prohibitory clause; and I must reply ~ 
to what was said by the gentleman from Christen the other day i 
when the vote was taken on this subject. He said, that he was — 
opposed to banks, that they were a curse and an evil, that they — 
were horrible. to his feelings, but that he would vote against a — 
prohibitory clause because it would endanger the adoption of the — 
constitution. Does that gentleman think that the people are in 
favor of banks? Does he think that the majority of his party are _ ih 
in favor of them? I represent two counties—Bond and Mont- — 
gomery—both counties, without distinction of party, are opposed — i ? 
to banks in any form. Gentlemen should remember that no- 
petition for banks has been presented to the Convention, and no 
petition against a prohibitory clause. The whole difficulty was, 3 
that these fears had taken possession of the brains of these gentle- 
men—How do they act on other questions? It is asked, must — 
we cut down the number of the Legislature? They answer “Oh, ~ 
yes!’ Must we reduce their pay? “By all means, yes.” Must — 
we reduce the pay of the judges, of the Governor, and regulate — 

ti 


MONDAY, JUNE 28, 1847, 255 


the duties of all other officers? They unhesitatingly answer, 
“Oh, yes.” But on this question of the banks, they cry out, “you 
ould not bind up the hands of the people on that subject, but 
‘leave it for future time.” They say, further, that though the 
people now may be opposed to banks, and we would vote against 
them, but perhaps the people may change their minds hereafter 
_ and want banks, and we should not close the matter by a prohibi- 
tory clause. Why, sir, the very same reason would allow all Parts 
_ of the constitution to be left open to suit every change of opinion. 
_ The people of his county said that the Legislature already had 
4 too much power, and, among other reforms, desired it to be 
‘4 restricted. He understood that on the table was a proposition to 
-adopt the New York banking law, which had been introduced 
because it was said that there was a majority against the prohibi- 
_ tory clause. Sir, if Illinois was composed of materials that would 
_ burn, I would rather see her destroyed by fire than such a system 
of plundering and robbing introduced in this our own prairie 
State. Ifa general banking system be spread over this State, we 
_ may look for ruin, blast, blight and mildew to come upon us. If 
__ we are to have banks, let us have no general laws throwing open 
the State and extending an invitation to shavers and brokers to 
_ come amongst us; if we do, we will have the scenes of Wisconsin 
over again, and we will have red dog, worse than red dog, banks 
amongst us.—He was not desirous to misrepresent or criminate 
gentlemen who, no doubt, represented the views of their constitu- 
ents as well as he, but we must judge of the future by the past. 
_ We are ripe for speculation, and he asked gentlemen not to throw 
out to the people these inducements to forsake their business and 
employments, to enter into this scheme of speculation, which 

_ would bring upon them nothing but blast and blight. 
i _Mr. GREGG said, that when he had introduced the proposition 
_ submitted by him and now on the table, he did so with reference 
to the peculiar state of circumstances existing at the time. From 
_ the vote taken a few days before, he thought it was the intention 
_ of the Convention that some system of banks should be adopted. 
_ I thought that if this was to be the result that we should close the 
_ door to a general and unrestricted system. I thought we had 
_ better leave the abstract question alone and judge things and act 


256 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


on them as we find them; hak we should take into consideration! 


_how our resources, condition and facilities stood and leave theories — 


out of the question. The people of my county are divided on this — 


question, but I believe that a majority of them are opposed to 


banks and banking, because they believe they are prejudicial and 


injurious to the whole country and people. He, after weighing 
all these matters, had come to the conclusion that if we were to 
have banks we should so restrict them by our constitutional — 
provision that they would be as little of prejudice and injury as 


possible; and that the floodgates should not be left open and all 
the evils flowing from an unrestricted system of banking to come 
upon us with all its evils and calamitous consequences. If there 
be any inconsistency in what had been done he saw it not in his 


position nor in the proposition he had introduced, but in those — 


2 


who, failing in a prohibition, will leave this matter to the Legis- — 
lature. Was not his course more in accordance with their duty — 


as men not legislating for the present time, but for the whole State, 


and for all future time? He thought we should study the banks — 


in their consequences, and in such a manner as will allow us to 


deliberate understandingly, and with the best views to the advance- 
ment of the prosperity of the people. We are now without banks; 


we have had an experience—and he might say an experience of 
ruin, misfortune and disaster—of them, and shall we bring thatruin 


and misfortune upon the people again? Do we need them? 


We are an agricultural State and not a commercial one. It was 


the intention of the framers of the constitution of the United 


States that there should be no currency but gold and silver. There — 


had been issued during the revolution over 300 millions of paper 
money and it had been the currency during that time and much 
depreciated. Its evils were so apparent that they introduced 


into the constitution a regulation that the government should — 


emit no bills of exchange. But means were soon found to evade 
this, and the country has been since flooded with this kind of a 
currency. How is it, he would ask, that our prosperity is peri- 
odical, and ‘‘good times” occasional? It was owing to the creation 
of these monopolies, who [sic] raised and depressed the trade and 
commerce, and the means of the people, by their schemes of specu- 
lation. We ought to be always prosperous, we have the means 


7 Noa? Aad The: eR ee Pe ea ee Le WR At Aerie) Sweat Om Aken ORE e soe PO ee ad ee 
Pee \ ‘ * 2 nae pe 5 “as 


MONDAY, JUNE 28, 1847 257 


_ and resources within us, to have that prosperity continued, and it 
_must be owing to these monopolies created by our Legislature, 
- which conferred upon them privileges and rights which were not 
enjoyed by the people in common. He would prefer that all 
i privileges and rights should be distributed that, like the dews of 
heaven, all might share alike. The benefits are not equally dis- 
_ tributed to all classes alike, but special privileges are granted to 
Ri special persons to eat out the substance of the people. To these 
_ chartered monopolies we may trace all our misfortunes. Mr. G. 
_ then refer[rled to the banking operations in England, where he 
_ said there had been from 1793 to 1826, 381 failures in a brief 
*. period of 34 years, after which he proceeded to review the history 
‘of the banks, their failures, suspensions, and the losses caused by 
j them to the people and Government of the United States. He said 
_ that from the time of the war to 1819—the paper currency was in 
a most wretched condition, that in 1819, there came a general 
_ suspension; in 1825 the panic was universal. In 1837, the paper 
4 currency system had become inflated to its utmost capacity and 
’ the bubble burst, and ruin was universal; every man’s fortune was 
_ affected by it. Let us carry out an unrestricted system of banking, 
and panic and ruin will come upon us in all its unmitigated 
_ horrors and evil consequences. 
In 1839 banks again suspended, and similar consequences 
_ ensued—and thus from 1817 to ’39 there had been no less than 
_ eight general suspensions of this inflated paper currency. Have 
the people suffered nothing from a paper currency? Mr. G. read 
_ from the report of the Secretary of the Treasury of the United 
_ States, made in 1841, by which it appeared, that the loss sustained 
__ by the federal government up to February, 1841, by the employ- 
_ ment of banks and paper money was $15,492,000! That since 
1789 there had been three hundred and ninety-six bank failures 
in the United States, with the following capital: Capital of 
twenty banks failed before 1811, $3,000,000; between 1811 and 
4 *30, one hundred and ninety-five banks with a capital of $36,787,- 
309; since 1830 upwards of 181 (including the Bank of the United 
_ States) with an estimated capital of $95,000,000. Making an 
_ aggregate amount of capital of these banks of $134,787,309. He 
_also read the following as losses sustained by the people since 1789: 


ene SS. et ee 
ie ee ee 
, 

: 


258 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


By bank failures on capital, circulation, deposites, and bank 4 
depreciation of notes, $95,000,000; by destruction, war and acci- 
dents, $7,127,332; by counterfeit notes beyond losses by coin, — 


balances, $108,855,721; by suspension of specie payments and 


$4,444,444; by fluctuation in bank currency, &c., $150,000,000; 
making an aggregate of $365,451,497; to which add the capital of 


the United States Bank of Pennsylvania, $35,000,000, and the ~ 
total loss will be $400,451,497. Are not these, he asked, matters — 


of a startling character, and which are undoubtedly a history of 
the evils of an unmitigated nature, bringing destruction and ruin 
upon the people. And any system which contains within it the 
principles of such ruin, and which may produce all these alarming 
consequences, should be well inquired into, and he thought they 
should hesitate long in adopting it. There were at present up- 
wards of nine hundred banks in the country. Their universal 
rule was to over-issue notes in a proportion of three dollars to one 
on-their capital; and in this way they fabricate their own wealth, 
and who does not see that they thus have conferred upon them 
an inconceivable advantage, and that they can go into market 
with this increased capital and drive away all competition, and of 
necessity must monopolize all the business and trade of the country. 


Another thing in the system of banks, was that the capital is 


not usually paid in, a small proportion only is paid and the balance 


secured by the notes of the stockholders. For instance—the first — 


United States Bank had a capital of $10,000,000, of which was 


paid in, one-half a million; the second Bank of the United States 


had a capital of $35,000,000, and only two million was paid in. 
Yet upon this small amount of capital actually paid into the bank, 
the discounts and dealings in exchange during one year and a 


little over, amounted to $43,000,000. And this, sir, is but a 


specimen of the transactions that are carried on under this system— 
styled banks and banking. In 1840 the total amount of bank 
capital in the United States was $360,000,000, and the total 
amount of specie collected in their vaults was $33,000,000. Their 


loans and discounts on notes amounted to $460,000,000. It was — 


also their practice to make large loans to presidents and directors, 
without security, and in 1840, there was due by directors of the 
banks to the several banks the sum of $150,000,000, and one-third 


MONDAY, JUNE 28, 1847 259 


of this was due on loans. By a report of a committee appointed 
to examine the affairs of the United States Bank it appeared that 
there was due that bank by one Thomas Kidwell, a broker in 


_ Philadelphia, over $11,000,000, which had been loaned out to him 


for the purpose of shaving. At the same time that that bank was 


- loaning out this great sum to that man, loans were refused to good 


men of that city and upon responsible paper; and they were obliged 
to go to this broker and pay him large discounts, thus forcing men 
to pay them indirectly by this shaving, what they could not charge 
directly, and this too, upon well secured paper. He thought it 
would be conceded by all that any system of banking was highly 


dangerous. Is there, he asked, in the whole system of government 


a greater power conferred than that of creating a currency? And 
if this power is to be exerted it should be in the hands of the govern- 
ment and not placed in the control of irresponsible corporations, 


institutions or associations. It is a power not to be conferred 


upon any body of incorporated individuals, no matter now respect- 
able they might be, or the standing they occupied in the world. 
It is destructive upon business, it creates uncertainty in trade, 
and makes the business of the country a mere lottery. It is also 
destructive of the morals of the community. In 1824 the banking 
issues in the U.S. was[s7c] $40,000,000; in 1837 they had increased to 
$140,000,000, and at this time was the great suspension. In 1843 
they had decreased to $53,000,000, and in 1846, they had gone up to 
$105,000,000, nearly doubling in the last three years. I shall use these 
facts, when more properly in order, to show the great uncertainty 
which these enlarged bank issues create. It had been admitted 
by the head of the U. S. Bank, a man who certainly had great 


experience in banking, and with all its business, that the tendency 
_of all banks was to create an over issue of paper. And thus it 


gave them a great advantage over the rest of the community, while 
the over issue was thrown out into the market. When this occurs, 


it produces over-trading, and every man embarks in business and 


speculation—prices increase—the laborer receives higher prices, 
and so with all other business. The currency is inflated, and 
business becomes inflated just as unnaturally as is everything'else. 


Wherever this happens to be the case, then the,importations,in- 


crease and immense quantities of goods are brought into the 


260 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


country. After a while these goods are to be paid for, and the — 


currency of this country—these bank notes, which they can have 
so plentifully, will not answer to pay for them, and the specie which 


is hoarded up in the banks must be drawn out, and goes abroad — 


to pay for these very goods. Then commences the ruin. The 


banks deprived of their little specie, are cramped in their business 


and forced immediately to curtail. Then follows the distress and — 
ruin, and panic. This, sir, is the consequence of over trading, 


which is always followed by a reverse, and then is destroyed the 
fancied prosperity of men’s speculations. Can it be attributed to 


anything else than the over issues by these chartered monopolies? _ 


In 1837 the indebtedness to the banks of the Union was 525 
millions, the specie in their vaults, and on which their issues were 
based, was 38,000,000. On this small sum of 38,000,000 was the 
great paper money bubble based, and which when exploded cast 
ruin, misfortune and destruction upon all classes of the community. 


When these banks are obliged to make these forced collections — 


they generally so manage it as to become the purchasers of all the - ' 


§ 


property, particularly of the real estate of their creditors, which — 


gives them a power and influence which is highly dangerous to 
the people, and the State. 
What necessity have we for them? Why should we desire to 


obtain a currency or encourage institutions which have within — 


their system the elements of so much ruin and destruction? 

It is said that there is not specie enough in the country, to buy 
our goods and enable us to carry on our trade. This is not the 
conclusion I have come to after an examination of the subject. 


Mr. G. here read an extract from some work, which treated of the - 


subject, which stated that according to Mr. Gattatin’s calcula- 


tion, made in 1831, there was in the world $400,000,000 in specie, — 
that of this sum there was over $277,000,000 in Europe and 


U. States, and that if divided there would be $16 [for] every man, A 


woman and child in the country. 


He here read an extract from ‘Gouge on Banking’ to sustain — 


this position. He said that he thought this sufficient to prove 
that banks were not needed for the purpose of creating a currency, 
and that there was enough of specie to transact all business. 

The experience of other countries was not to be disregarded, 


MONDAY, JUNE 28, 1847 261 


and he would refer the gentleman to France, at the time of the 
‘revolution. They had a paper currency, which had sprung up 
during that time, more trifling and depreciated than was our own 
during the revolution. 

_ Assignats were issued all over the country in large and danger- 
_ ous quantities, and had become worthless and depreciated. 
Napoleon, when he became first consul, with intuitive sagacity 
and profound knowledge of such things, the moment he had the 
power, broke up the whole system of paper money and introduced 
a new order of things. He established a metallic currency. He 
said no paper for a less amount than five hundred francs should be 
issued; and gold and silver flowed in in abundance, and to this 
day they have a metallic currency. 

Such would be the case here were we not cursed with these 
banking institutions. Look at Cuba, she is not cursed with paper 
or bank issues, and has nothing but gold and silver. I may be 
met with the remark that these countries are not republican, that 
their forms of government and institutions are different from ours. 


a 
ae Mn 


= 
>A 


ie 


iD: 


a 


Is this a proper answer? If the people of France live not under a 
___ system of government like ours, must we not follow them in any- 
_ thing? We must not look to them for examples of wisdom, 
_ moderation, science, or justice, because they live under a monarchy 
Nor must we look to Europe for such examples, nor refer to Cuba. 
vy 


No matter if the autocrat of northern Europe, or the sultan from 
_ his harem, gives us an example of wisdom, must we throw it away, 
reject it, put it behind our backs, because it comes not from the 
_ same kind of government! Sir, good examples and just principles 
_ belong to no nation or creed, or State, or form of government. I 
take leave, before I conclude, to refer briefly to the plan I have 
proposed, and which is now before the committee. It is divested 
' so far as possible of the features of monopolies, and I have pre- 
__ sented it in this shape so that, if these banks or some system is to 
__ exist, and its blighting effects are to be cast upon the people, its 
rough and rugged features shall be thrown away. It is not the 

New York system of banking, as has been said—it goes beyond 
_ that system. Another safe-guard, I think, is, that it leaves the 
3 matter with the people; the action of the Legislature is not final, 
and after they shall have acted upon it it must go to the 


262 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


people, and there fiat must be passed upon it. Here we have a 
double safe-guard—the wisdom of the Legislature, and the action 
of the people, who may trample on foot any act of the Legis- 
lature. Again, if; after it shall be thus approved of by the people 
and the Legislature, it shall appear to be more productive of evil 
than was anticipated, it is placed in the power of any Legislature 
to repeal or abolish it. iz 

If any system is to go from this Convention to throw its blight- 
ing influence on the people, their business and their resources, let 
it go without throwing open these safeguards upon its actions. 
I think it would be better for the Convention to adopt a system 
of banking and a prohibitory clause—an alternate proposition, — 
and submit them to the people; let them be discussed in the © 
primary assemblages of the people, and I have no fear of the result; 
no fear of the adoption of the prohibitory clause by alarge majority. 
But if we are to have any system, let me have choice of one which 
is the least calculated to work injury. 

Mr. LOUDON said, that he had listened with pleasure to [the] — 
very good speech of the gentleman, and he, Mr. L., were he an 
anti-bank man, would now try and make an antelanle speech, but _ 
as he was a bank man he would make a bank speech. Mr. L. 
spoke for some time, inreply to Mr. Grece, and in support ofa good ~ 
banking system. His remarks are unavoidably crowded out. “a 

Mr. SCATES said, he did not expect to throw much light on © 
the subject, but the question, it was not to be denied, was one of all 
absorbing interest, and one on which the two political parties were 
divided. Much as gentlemen might regret the introduction of 
party questions in a Convention assembled to frame a constitution, 
they must not expect to see parties forget their party principles. 
This was a question on which there could be no compromise. — 
Those opposed to banks would not consent to any form of a bank 
that would be acceptable to the friends of a bank, and these bank 
men would not vote for a prohibition. 

If I attempt to give my views on the subject, gentlemen must _ 
not think me desirous to be too wise, when I say that in my opinion 
the people of Illinois have spoken solemnly, firmly and positively, 
that there shall be no banks in the State, and no compromise will 
be acceptable to them. I remember to have often read and heard 


MONDAY, JUNE 28, 1847 263 


of such a thing as a judicious tariff, and that it was soon found 
_ out that a judicious tariff means nothing definite, for every man 
"undertook to define and judge what sort of a tariff was a judicious 
-one. It is something the same way with a “well regulated bank,” 
_here is the same difficulty—no two will agree what is a well regu- 
. lated bank. Sir, there never was such a thing as a well regulated 
_ bank submitted to the people; nor can any man propose one. 
i The gentleman from Cook, who says he is opposed to all banks, 
__ has submitted a plan of what he considers a well regulated bank. 
_ But are there no objections to it? I know one, sir, and an impor- 
_ tant one, which for fear I may forget it, I will repeat it at once. 
_ His plan will not prevent a suspension of specie payments; I ask 
him if it is not so? 
Mr. GREGG said, that there was an express provision that 
the Legislature should pass no law permitting a suspension of 
specie payments. 
i Mr. SCATES. I understand it correctly. But does the law 
_ prevent the bank from suspending? and that currency becoming 
depreciated in the hands of the bill holders. There is no way to 
prevent the bank from suspending; no remedy for the loss to the 
bill holder. Will any gentleman propose that the loss to the bill 
holder shall be put into his pocket from the treasury of the State, 
The winding up of a bank may be a punishment, but will it remedy 
the evil? The fact of suspension, is a fact that no written prohibi- 
tion can avoid, and no parchment prohibition can pay the loss on 
paper depreciated, perhaps, 50 cents in the dollar. Nor can we 
say that the bank, if it fails and its paper becomes depreciated, 
shall pay the bill holder, unless we give the bank the means to do 
so with. The gentleman’s position is an enigma to me, and [ll 
not undertake to unriddle it. He has portrayed in the most vivid 
colors that the banks are evils, and has said that the people will 
sustain a prohibitory clause, yet he has come to the conclusion 
that we must have banks. This is truly an enigma to me. One 
objection to a prohibitory clause is, that it forever binds the 
_ people who may hereafter desire a bank. If we were to recognize 
the principle that we must act, in framing this constitution, with 
due regard to the changes of the popular mind, we had better go 
home at once, for that would defeat the ends of all constitution.— 


264 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS i 


ie 


The bill of rights says, that no man shall be dis[sleized of fis encokinl Es, 
no man shall be punished without a trial by his peers; no ex post 
facto law shall be passed; the people’s mind may change on eith 
or all of these principles, and why should we place them in our 
supreme law of the State? Who will advocate this? But gentl 
men desire this loose action on the bank question, which will be ~ 
as great a tyranny as any other. If I have any idea of the opinion — 
of the people of Illinois upon this subject, if I have not definite _ 
information of their views, then say I have no information at all. ; 
They are opposed to banks. Sir, for the last several years the — 
whole democratic press of the State—with perhaps one exception— 
spoke out openly their opposition to banks, and the politicians g 
throughout the State have opposed the banks, and I have thought 4 
that the people have sustained them in their position. But iq 
come here, and what do I find? The democratic party divided — 
upon this subject, here with instructions to vote against a prohibi- 
tory clause, and the party arein a glorious minority.— We have been — 
told that the democratic party have the majority in this State, in” 
the Legislature and in the Convention, that they are responsible for — 
everything that has been done and which this Convention shall do, © 
because they have the strength and the numbers torule. I admit 
that the democratic party had the majority and the power, but 
not at present and I cannot illustrate its position better than 
relating an anecdote. It is said that there was one John Thompson 
who had been up to the market and had started on his way home. 
Unfortunately, however, John fell asleep, and the oxen pulled the a" 
cart into a mud hole; while it was there two yoke of the oxen broke ; 
from their cart, ateayed away and are now looking with anxious | 7 
eyes into the rich pasture of banks and banking privileges to 
which they and their friends are about to be admitted. Johalg 
Thompson was unable to get his cart out because of the loss of his — 
team, and gentlemen must not throw the responsibility on the 
democratic party. Our team has been stolen, and they must not q 
expect us to pull the government cart out of the mud until we 
get back our team; and others after starting on this metallic _ 
road, their feet have become cut and a little tender and they too ' 
have gone off and refuse to pull. a 
The position of certain gentlemen reminded him also of another , 


MONDAY, JUNE 28, 1847 265 


i! anecdote: Two gentlemen went out hunting, after some time one 
of them fired at a deer, his friend hearing the rifle shot, came up 
and asked him what he had shot at, he replied, “‘At a deer, there 
_ itis.” “Why,” said the friend, “that is a calf; have you shot your 
' neighbor’s calf?” “No,” answered he. “I shot so that if it 
was a deer I would kill it, and if a calf I would miss it.”? So it was 
with those who were against a bank—if it was a bank, but for a 
calf &c. Let gentlemen aim so as to shoot but not to kill their 
_ neighbor’s calf. And these gentlemen who were so anxious to 
preserve their neighbor’s calf, to them he could wish no greater 
punishment than did Aaron and the other idolaters receive when 
_ they built their golden calf, from the hands of the Almighty. 
_ Mr. S. then said, the question was not whether the banks wi// 
suspend, it should be, can they? Yes, sir, they can, and may 
suspend, no constitutional provision can avoid it; the power is in 
banks to cause losses of millions to the community, and there is 
no way to prevent it but one—that is, not to allow them to be in- 
corporated. Another way in which these banks caused losses to 
the community was, that all bank paper, at any distance from the 
banks, was at a discount of 5 per cent., and the loss to the people 
upon the amount of the total issues of the bank was immense. A 
_ note is at 5 per cent. discount, it is passed at that depreciated 
_ value, one hundred times a year. Say the discount is at two 
per cent., the loss is, therefore, 200 per cent. on the face of the 
_ note, and all this loss is paid for the use of a paper currency. 
_ Mz.S. illustrated this view by several examples, and then examined 
_ many facts in relation to the management, frauds and evils result- 
_ ing from banks in general, and the bank of the United States in 
_ particular. In one single year, he said, the defalcation by presi- 
’ dents and directors of these banks amounted to forty-two millions 
_ of dollars and over; and if gentlemen were prepared to go for 
___ the adoption of such a system, which could produce such results, 
he doubted their statesmanship. Half that loss would pay the 
whole expenses of the Mexican war, or support a war against a 
"more powerful enemy; yet it was all borne without complaint. 
The loss to the government up to the year 1842, was $131,000,000, 
a sum equal to the expenses of the last war with Great Britain. 
_ Mr. SCATES, after alluding at great length to the fact of the 


266 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI: ONS 


losses by banks and banking speculations in the United States, — 
which he read and exhibited by statistical references, differing but — 
little from those mentioned by Mr. Grecc, and applyingthealarm- 
ing consequences of them to the state of the people and the finances — 
of Illinois, he most earnestly and forcibly deprecated the adoption ~ 
of any system of the kind in the State, or the granting to the Legis- — 
lature any power to create the same. ‘ 

He said, that he hoped, in case the Convention, watched by ~ 
bank harpies and beset by sharks, shall spawn forth upon the ~ 
public a shoal of banks, that it would be rejected by the people — 
and the system be an abortion. If they were to have banks — 
with chartered privileges, why not allow every man to be a bank, — 
and grant him permission to issue $3 to every one of his capital? 
This would be nothing more than equal rights. But then, again, — 
poor men have not the means to enter into this plan, which confers — 
upon those who can engage in it, the power to make their less 
fortunate neighbors hewers of wood and drawers of water. 

Mr. S. then entered into an able argument to establish that by © 
the constitution of the United States the States had no power to — 
create banks, which, he said, indirectly governed, created, and © 
ruled the currency—regulated, by their issues and over issues, the — 
value of money—governed and controlled the commerce among ~ 
the States of the Union, raising the value of our property by the 
extent of their issues, and depreciating it again by the contraction © 
and lessening of them. He thought it dangerous to create these 
institutions, possessed of these great and powerful means of power — 
over the interests of the people. 

He thought that they had just as much right to issue imitation 
half dollars and eagles 1 in base metal as to issue paper imitations | 
of the current coin of the country. 

At 12, M., without concluding, he gave way to a motion to 
adjourn till to-morrow, at 9, A. M. 


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XIX. TUESDAY, JUNE 29, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Dresser. 
Mr. HAYES, from the committee on Law Reform, reported 
back sundry resolutions, and asked to be discharged from the 


_ further consideration of the same. Agreed to. 


‘Mr. Z. CASEY moved to take up certain reports made by the 
committee on the Revenue and the committee on the Legislative 
Department, and refer the same to the committee of the whole. 
Carried. 

Mr. ARCHER moved to refer the report of the committee on 


_ the Organization of Departments to the committee of the whole. 


Carried. 
Mr. Z. CASEY then moved that the Convention resolve itself 


into committee of the whole to take up the subject of banks. 
Carried. 


BANKS 


The Convention then resolved itself into a committee of 
the whole, Mr. Epwarps of Sangamon in the Chair. 
Mr. SCATES resumed his speech, commenced yesterday, by a 


recapitulation of the arguments presented by him. He said that 
_ the power of the States to create banks, with powers to emit bills 


of exchange, &c. was one that was sanctioned by general practice. 
Yet there were many questions arising out of constitutional pro- 


visions that had been settled by practice, but upon which the 


public mind was not settled. The power of the general govern- 
ment to charter a United States bank, though two had been 
created, and the supreme court had decided in favor of the power, 


_ was still a question upon which the public mind was not settled; 
_ and the same was the case in regard to the issues of State banks. 
_ He then examined the constitution of the United States, and 


- 


_ argued against the power of the States to issue such notes, or the 


_ power to incorporate any institution to do the same. 


He said that we had the power to limit the circulation of 
267 


268 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


bank notes from other States in this State. It was an eri to eit 
our own issues in circulation, it was certainly no less an evil to — 
have the notes of banks, over which we had no control, circulating — 
amongst us. We might not be able to compel a bank in another © 
State to stop her issues; but should we, to stop their circulation, — 
issue our own notes? This was like giving a man, suffering from ~ 
the effects of poison, a larger dose of the same kind. He read — 
some tables which showed that the people paid yearly for the use 
of bank paper, in the shape of interest, $28,000,000 more than the 
annual expenses of the government. There was also a deprecia- 
tion on the amount of their issue of 5 per cent., which, togeth 
with other losses by counterfeiting and wearing of notes, made an 
aggregate annual tax to the people of over $50,000,000; more — 
than double the amount required for the support of this vast — 
government. The loss to the people, since the formation of the — 
government, by taxes for the use of bank paper, amounted to ~ 
$1,197,000,000. Bi 

His recollection of the politics of Illinois for many years had © 
been, that the democratic party were opposed to all banks. Every ~ 
democratic meeting that had been held sent forth a condemnation © 
of them. There had been a meeting held in this hall some three ~ 
years ago, and then this question came up. No man was for 
banks. It was made a sine gua non in each candidate, to be © 
opposed to all banks. The democratic party now required from 
their representatives a condemnation of them. The people were 
not, however, truly represented here; if they were, there would 
go forth a universal condemnation oe them, as he was sure the — 
voice of the people was for a prohibition. He was in favor of no 
experiments to elicit the voice of the people, by proposing any 4 
alternate proposition. The sentiments of the people were ¢ known, 4 
and the Convention should carry them out. a 

Mr. HARVEY said, that he, perhaps, should define his posi- i 
tion. He looked upon this question as one of deep and lasting ~ 
importance, and one which bears more upon the daily transactions ~ 
of the people than any other which the Convention would be © 
called to act upon. He thought that when the Convention would — 
meet, the members would come there with their minds made up — 
to act without political feeling, and with a desire to accomplish ; 


4 


TUESDAY, JUNE 29, 1847 269 


Begehentional work for the people. But he had been sadly mis- 
taken. The gentleman said it must be a political question; that 


tution the ultra spirit of party. The gentleman said that one 
John Thompson was like the democratic party, and that John 
had once got drunk and had been run into a mud hole; that while 
there a part of his team had got away and had gone ane in search 
of green pastures. He would like to know why John Thompson 
got drunk, or if, when asleep, he dreamed of this metallic currency? 
. And was it not wiser for the cattle, when John was in this 
- condition, to get out of the mud hole, and go off to the green 
pasture? He would tell the gentleman, that if he wanted these 
_ cattle back to pull this democratic cart out of the mud he must 
not get drunk. He claimed to be a member of the democratic 
party, but he came there a free one, to act for himself and not to 
‘ bow his neck as a slave to any leader. He was not one of John 
4 Thompson’s cattle. He was a representative of the people of 
_ Knox county in this Convention to form a constitution. And, 
sir, what have we met here for? Not to take care of the interests 
_ of one little political party, but of one million of people. Asa 
_ member of the committee on Incorporations he was anxious to 
_hear this question discussed, and for one he was opposed to a 
‘prohibitory clause. And the party who advocated this, were 
they united? No, sir. 

_ Mr. H. said, that one portion of this prohibitory party said 
_ that banks were an evil, and that all things of an evil character 
_ should be prohibited. By inserting in the constitution a prohibi- 
_ tion, and then adding a clause that that prohibition should be 
_ forever unalterable, how, he would ask, would any man vote for 
‘i ‘such a provision—John Thompson could not do it—if he did he 
would render himself immortal. Another of the party said, that 
Ry he was for an exclusively metallic currency. Does he intend to 
_ exclude from circulation Auditor’s warrants and Treasury notes, 
which looked to him very much like paper money? He would 
‘not say what he wanted—but he desired to know what kind of a 
‘prohibition that party wanted? He did not believe the demo- 
Re “cratic party was in the hands of fifty or forty men in that Conven- 
4 tion, but were scattered all over the Union, and in no State had a 


Jarties must be divided, and that we must congeal into the consti-, 


det ee ies 


270 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI say S 


prohibitory clause been inserted in the constitution against banks. 
He believed that the people of any State, by a majority of the 
yotes, might have what kind of government they pleased, and 
that they alone had the right to say whether they would have 
banks or not. He was forleaving the question of banks open to the 
people’s opinion, and he was met by a question, why not leave 
the whole question open. He replied by saying, that all things - " 
wrong in themselves should be prohibited, but a mere political : 
question should be left open to the people. Public opinion was 
stronger than any constitution: a prohibition was no more than — 
a rope of sand against it, and who could say that in five years the © 
people’s opinion would not be changed. Our duty was not to 
inquire what kind of a bank we should have, but whether we ~ 
should have a bank at all or not. We have no banks to decapitate, — 
but gentlemen seem disposed to decapitate a possibility of a bank. 
He would prefer the Legislature should not have the power to — 
create, but was willing that when they thought a bank necessary - 
that they should pass a law and submit it to the people, and if a 
majority of them approved of it, it might go into force. Individ-_ 
ually he was opposed to all systems of banking. They all seemed 
in favor of abridging the powers of the Legislature, and he was in j 
favor of it; but was any man in favor of abridging the powers of _ 
the people? 
Mr. ARCHER desired to define his position on this question, 
and he hoped that when he had concluded, the Convention would , 
be more happy 1 in arriving at what his position was, than he had_ 
been in arriving at the position of the gentleman from Knox. He | 
was not one of those who felt disposed to follow in everything that — 
was laid down by those who set themselves up as umpires of what — 
was true democracy; he was a member of the democratic party of — 
the whole Union, and claimed to think and act for himself in all 
things; and bowed to no leader on this floor or any where else. He — 
knew no one who aspired to that leadership, nor could he think — 
or believe that any man, either whig or democrat, had come into ~ 
that deliberative body with a desire to prescribe the course which © 
they should follow. If any one did aspire, however, to lead the — 
party, he would follow him only so far as his principles and opinions ~ 
agreed with his, and no further. He was, individually, opposed — 


al in et a altoid cals ik a a ah ad Gal ia A as 


TREES 


TUESDAY, JUNE 29, 1847 271 


tained these opinions, he fae no desire to hold Pas opinions 
as a beacon light to others, nor to give a guide to his seniors in 
re actions here. His experience had been that the system of 
king was but the granting of privileges to a few tocommit piracy 
ink masses. In using this language he intended to cast no 
imputation upon others, but he hoped they would consider him as 
“sincere in what he said. 

_ He thought States were like individuals in many cases. Let 
look back for a period of ten years in the history of this then 
f g and thriving State, at that time a Legislature, driven to 
_ madness by the evidences of prosperity to be seen all around them, 
oa reated an extensive and wild scheme of internal improvements, 
al nd the result was that the scheme failed and the hope of the 
_-young State was blasted and blighted. It was only after the 
destruction had come upon them that the people became 
a larmed—then that the State credit sunk abroad—and the unholy 
doctrine of repudiation received countenance in the State, and I 
ae to say that even, in this State, though for a short time only, 
‘did this doctrine receive encouragement. We have in part 
thr Echo the effects of that time, and have somewhat remedied 
‘the evil, and from this Convention, is expected something to 
remedy still further the evil consequences of that day. While I 
give my hearty approval of some of the remarks of the gentleman 
om Cook, I regret he did not plant himself entirely on the ground 
prohibition. He had displayed by statistics the innumerable 
evils of these banks. I am in favor of a prohibitory clause, but I 
would prefer that it should be submitted to the people sep- 
erately [sc] from the constitution in order that the latter may 
not be affected by the vote upon the proposition. Let those in 
r of banks bring forward their plan, and those who desire the 
rohibition, let them go forth to the people and fight side by side, 
by the result of that fight will I be satisfied. He was opposed 
) all banks and in favor of the utmost restrictions. How much 
e and money have been wasted in Illinois by legislating for 
pension laws; and we cannot too strongly guard against failure, 
I think failure is a consequence of incorporation. When these 
ures come, who is it that hold the notes—the poor and laboring 


> 
No, but you may find them in their hands when depreciate : 
bought up at half price from the poor and laboring classes. Where 
do you find the losses? In the cabins of the poor, and the profi 
in the gilded palaces of the rich. Banks never pay money, never 
issue money—it is always “the president &c. promise to pay” ” &e.. 
And when they make loans it is of their own indebtedness. Thi 
when a man borrows $500, they receive from him interest on wh 
they owe; and if any person else than a corporation owes $500, - 
pays interest on what he owes. The whole order of things As 
reversed in favor of these chartered nee and for this 
reason, I am opposed to them. 

Mr. A. here read a plan which he would like to see adapted 
He said, that from a sense of right and of principle, sanctioned b 
experience, he could not yield to any opinion that a well regulated 
bank can exist in any community. He believed that if a general 
banking system were adopted, that evils in the most incompr 
hensible numbers would follow, and throw ruin and misfortu 
again on the State. . 

The motion to strike out all the resolutions was put and carrie 
and then the motion recurred upon inserting the Propee as 
Mr. Scares. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin said that it was a matter of regret 
that there was not before the committee some definite propositio 
which would be more comprehensive; also, it was to be regretted 
that feeling had been shown in relation to a leadership. The 
may be men who might aspire to leadership in this Conventio: 
but if there were he had not seen any of them. He had come 
there to follow no leader, but an independent representative of an 
independent constituency; and was willing to take all the roots - 
bility of his own acts. 

I agree that the questions growing out of this subject are | 
greatest that will come before the Convention. The evils of ban’ 
have been shown by the gentlemen from Montgomery, Cool 
Jefferson and Pike. The system of banks heretofore existing i 


jad’ cian 5 did Ueki te Eek cal. at 


TUESDAY, JUNE 29, 1847 273 


ere at war with the just and equal rights of the whole people. 
e theory of all true government is, that the whole people should 
oy equal rights—political rights. The system of banks here- 


d rich corporatees. How is this, and how is it withothers? When 
1e bank fails, the members of the corporation are not affected; but 
en private individuals meet with misfortune, their doors are 
ited by the officers of the law. While ruin and destruction are 
cattered all over the country by the operations of the bank, its 
officers are revelling in the wealth gained by the banks. I object 
banks because they enjoy rights, privileges and immunities not 
scured or allowed to others engaged in business. When an 
opportunity for speculation occurs, these banks are given the 
a _ means of risking what is not their own, and if the speculation fails 
_ they lose nothing. The masses are opposed to these corporations, 
and are gradually wresting power from these chartered monopolies, 
and step by step will reduce them to a level with other business 
- men. He objected to the New York system, because that con- 
_ ferred the same unequal privileges upon a few which were denied 
hag the many. In the language of the resolutions offered by the 
gentleman from Jefferson, the power to coin and make money has 
i a secured to the United States, and why? Because the power 
_ to create a currency affects the people, enters into all their business 
_ transactions—a power greater than even the right of government. 

_ Give me the purse strings of a nation, and I don’t care who has 
_ the power of government; I then would be the master not only of 
- the people, but of their government. In view, therefore, of the 
ie importance of this power—the sole power to regulate the currency 
was reserved to the general government. In time, however, this 
utary provision was got around, and the power of regulating 
_ the currency was conferred upon individuals in the shape of 
charters, not responsible to the people. Was it the intention of 
the framers of the constitution of the United States to give to 
_ irresponsible men or soulless corporations the power to cause woe 
_ and sorrow, or smiles and joy to the whole people? At one period 


ii hare 


274 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS ; oe 


of our history the banks had a circulation of sicereoeent wid 
transactions of the country were based upon that amount of fa 
capital; in one year this amount of money in the country, by the — 
aid of the engraver, printer and bank officer, can be increased 
three-fold, and the business of the country is deranged.—Is no 
the intention of the constitution to fix the value upon the currency 
defeated? Those reasons, if no other, would induce him to vote — 
against any plan of banks. I belong to this party—the demo- 
cratic—which, it appears, has occupied so much time in this 
discussion. It has been said that there are those here who aspir 
to lead us. I would, sir, select as my leader, if we are to have am 
from that other party which had shown so much judgment and ~ 
discretion as to keep silent, and leave this war entirely in the 
hands of the “harmonious” democracy, and not from among those ~ 
who claim to be democrats, and get up here and carry on a fight — 
for the amusement of their opponents——The term “harmoniou 
democracy” may be and 1s often used as a sneer, but upon the ~ 
great principle of human liberty they are harmonious; and I would 
say to those who anticipate the game of the Kilkenny cats by thi 
democrats, that they need not lay the “flattering unction to thei 
soul,”’ for that party will remember their responsibility to thei 
constituents. And if there is to be a bank, and if they cannot 
strangle the monster in his cradle, they will unite and chain him ~ 
so that he can do no harm. If that party desired to know upo 
what the democrats will unite, I tell them to select what is just 
and right, and they will there find the democratic party. This 
much, sir, have I said on my own responsibility. 

Mr. GEDDES replied, briefly, to the remarks of the gentleme 
who had opposed banks and attributed to them such evils._ Hey 
entered into the question and argued differently. ¢ 49 

Mr. BOSBYSHELL said, that long previous to the adoption — 
of the State constitution, the currency of the confederated States — 
had been confided to the general government, which, also, was — 
intrusted with the power of regulating commerce, faeuiad a 


of credit, or to change the legal tender in payment of debts. ee 
from the evils of paper money which had been necessary during 


TUESDAY, JUNE 29, 1847 275 


‘the revolution, and the funding of which had caused so much 
j discontent between the speculating and substantial citizens of 
e nation, any other standard of value than precious metals was 
_ deprecated by all the patriotic of the time, who endeavored to 
guard it by adequate provisions. There can be no other substi- 
tute, all attempts to substitute are delusive and fraudulent, and 
‘snares for the public prosperity. The effort to coin money out of 
"paper was abused. Nothing can make a promise to pay on Paper, 
like the dollar itself. Mr. B. (we are sorry we cannot give his 
remarks more full [sic] took the following positions: 
That great commercial operations are accommodated by paper 
“money issues, as did the credit system, but unless convertible into 
_ gold was worthless. Its use was like the substitution of ardent 
spirits for food—it intoxicates and ruins. That the reason given 
_for the use of paper money—the scarcity of coin—should be the 
cause of an exclusive metallic currency, because the latter was 
_ more valuable as it become [sic] scarce. He alluded to the incon- 
_ veniences of paper money in trade. The shocking vicissitudes of 
_ unconyertible paper money had cost this country more than its 
__ wars; they were the greatest difficulty in the revolution, and now 
E more oppressive than all the public burthens. That the issuing 
_ of paper money by authority of acts of the legislatures of the 
_ several States was an usurpation of power unfor[elseen by the 
_ framers of the constitution. The first Secretary of the Treasury, 
_ when he introduced the conveniences of a national bank, never 
contemplated that paper should supersede gold and silver as 
currency. He traced the history of State banks, and admitted 
_ that the supreme court had decided that when they were not made 
a legal tender they were not unconstitutional; but that this great 
_ power to control, value and regulate price, unfor[e]seen by the 
_ framers of the federal constitution, has grown up one of our most 
_ important institutions and demanded the serious attention of a 
H body convened to re-organize a government. This power to 
_ create a currency was so important that no government ever 
_ parted with its sole exercise. It controlled everything. It was 
_ the life blood of the body politic. It was fortunate that every 
laborer was familiar with the little value of these bank notes; 
_ which the regular recurrence of periodical convulsions so clearly 


- 
a 
‘+ 
“ 
‘ 


276 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIOI 


demonstrated. If public sentiment advanced En. as. it | has 
for some time past, the deeply rooted evils of banking will soon 
alleviated, if not entirely removed. The farmers, mechanics and 
others who lived by industry, and without trusting to pa 
facilities, are now free from trouble, and have plenty of hard mo 
Interest is moderate. They knew not the distress which was 
where banks, credit and speculation predominated; and w 
would be the case where the power was given to a few to exercise 
one of the privileges of sovereignty. Fifty years ago the Bank c 
England disclosed the terrible secret that banks might dispen 
with hard money. Possessed of that secret our banks havea 
followed it up by pushing it on to a despotic supremacy. -Prepaee 

terous luxury, insolvency and crime are the certain followers of 
the bank mania. Bad currency, speculation and monopoly can 
only account for the sudden vicissitudes, the most devouri 
usury, controversey [sic] and litigation, panic, clamour, conv 
sion, and at last the unlawful refusal of the banks to pay their oy 


the justice, right, propriety or honesty of conferring spec! 
privileges upon any body of men. The nent and original offi 


banks proceed from what courts of j sects punish as fanaa: 
the using of trust funds. The Bank of Holland was ae 
for this. 
We find that our space will not allow us to go further even with 
our condensed report of Mr. B.’s able and logical speech. 
Mr. SINGLETON offered an amendment to the grey 
of Mr. ScaTEs. 
Mr. PETERS offered an amendment to the adiendmndan? 


And then the committee rose, reported progress, and had lea 
to sit again. And the Convention adjourned till 3 P.M. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. Z. CASEY offered a resolution, that from to-morrow t 
Convention would daily resolve into committee of the whole, a: 
take up the reports of the committees and dispose of the Sai 
Adopted. 


) meet the opinions of all those who were opposed to a prohibitory 
use. He said, that he had intended to present his views in 
nso, but it was evident, from the number of propositions that 
d been introduced, that the members of the Convention had 
me to some conclusion, and that all had made up their minds; 
bic ebate and argument were, therefore, unnecessary. He explained 
propositions to be as follows. 1st. That there shall never be 
-a State bank—he was opposed to State banks—State college, 
State printer, State anything. 2d. That there should be no 
pecial charters. This, he thought, was in accordance with the 
neral sentiments of the people. jd. It leaves it with the 
egislature to establish a system of banking with certain restric- 
ms. He laid it down that, looking at the fast increasing popula- 
n of the State, our growing interests, &c.,we must have a 
Yaper currency, and cannot get along with an exclusive metallic 
rrency. Another principle of his plan, was that there shall not 
be more than one bank placed in each judicial district of the State. 
_ Mr. KITCHELL said, he had drawn up certain resolutions 
containing a set of restrictions, which he could support consistently 
vith his view of his duty to his constituents. 
_ It was nearly the same as had been presented by the member 
from Madison, and others. Though out of order to present it, it 
vas not out of order to allude to it in his remarks. He supposed 
"he was one of those whose position was said to be an enigma, and 
‘not consistent with democracy. He thought he knew the opinions 
the people he represented, and he felt it his duty to support 
hat opinion, unless it was wholly inconsistent with honesty and 
ropriety. This question was not regarded in his county as 
ettled; not one upon which public sentiment was regarded as ripe 
mature. We have and use a paper currency; not so much 
ie as in other places, but the bank paper happened to be good 


278 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI on S 


a paper currency, when at a par, is a safe and proper sscliare 
circulation. They cannot recognize any argument that it 
immoral or improper to use it. They will refer you to those State: . 
where banks have existed from the time of the formation of their 
government, and ask why cannot Illinois have a good bank as well — 
as others. One of the first political subjects to which he had — 
turned his attention was the state of the people of Illinois, 
regard to the consequences of the inflation of the currency and — 
the ruin, havoc and disgrace which followed the suspension; and 
I thought that I would take the ground occupied by other gentle- 
men, in open opposition to all banks, but I have considered better ~ 
of it. What are our county organizations but exclusive privileges 
for certain purposes. Gentlemen who take the broad ground — 
against all privileged corporations go too far. Our county organi- 
zation is but a part of the system. You cannot vote out of you: 
own precinct. Every college is a corporation. The arguments — 
of gentlemen have been directed against the abuses of banking. — 
As well might they take ground against steamboats, that they 
should not be permitted to navigate your rivers because they 
contain such engines of destruction. As well prohibit physician 
practising because quacks have dealt out death and destruction” 
in the land. You may as well say there shall be no religion 
because, at some time or another, it has been united to State, and ~ 
has oppressed the people. He thought this a fair statement of the ~ 
arguments, and that it was not extravagant to compare thei 
arguments against the abuses of banking with the steambo 
dangers. He was opposed to the system of banking heretofo 
carried on in this State, but thought that we might adopt sor 
system; it was impossible to exclude bank notes from circulati 
in this State. There are now laws upon the statute book of t 
State, which are as a dead letter. They cannot be enforced, a’ 
it would have been better that they had not been enacted than 
not in force. When it can be shown that it is a curse upon the — 
State that we ever had bank notes, or that we can exclude them ~ 
from circulation, then I will abandon the position I have taken, 
and go for their exclusion. It had been said that bank notes were 
an unfair representation of the amount of money in the country, 


ew! ge D1 Se Pee Tan) weet. “ND bee) oe Pee ee ee a 
ite ee ‘ ie Se as ; 


TUESDAY, JUNE 20, 1847 279 


“argument is that it is a paper currency, that the corporations are 
é ae the privilege of issuing seven or eight dollars in notes to 
ne in capital—in specie. These things are an abuse of the privi- 
lege, and are privileges which should not be granted. Heretofore 
it has been so provided that in case of a failure nothing but the 
4 porate property could be touched, though it might be that the 
_ officers, directors, and stockholders were immensely rich, nothing 
" of their private wealth was liable. But we came here to adopt a 
different order of things; we came here to lay down an organic law 
_ for the land, and questions of a doubtful character, of expediency 
- and policy, and one which has been decided differently in every 
_ other State of the Union, should not be put in the constitution of 
_ the State and become the unalterable law of the land. He was 
_ not in favor of any particular system of banks, there might be 
| banks required by the people. And suppose the people of Chicago, 
_ or of Quincy, or of Springfield desire a bank of deposite, of 
__ which no one could complain, the prohibitory clause would prevent 
_ it. He was opposed to any prohibitory clause in the constitution. 
_ Mr. K. here read his plan, which was a mere statement of restric- 
_ tions to be placed upon banks, and applicable to any and every 
system. He said he was not, as he had said before, in favor 
_ of any particular system, but he was satisfied that the people of 
__ his part of the country were opposed to any unqualified prohibitory 
_ clause being inserted in that constitution, and he felt himself 
__ bound to carry out their views and sentiments. While I am not in 
_ favor of any particular system of banking, I know that it is im- 
possible to exclude from circulation in this State the bank notes 
ss of New York, Indiana, Kentucky, Missouri, and other States, so 
long as they are at par, and answer all purposes of business, and 
_ that all our efforts to do so will be in vain. He thanked the 
; _ Convention for their attention and hoped he had defined his 
B ‘position sufficiently explicitly. 
> Mr. BROCKMAN addressed the Convention for a consider- 
able time in favor of a prohibitory clause and against banks of 
_ every description. A full report of his speech has been taken and 
will be given in another form. 
_ Mr. DEMENT said, that as the day was nearly spent he 
__ would not take up much of the time of the Convention, but would 


280 I LLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI ON s As 


merely define his position in as few remarks as vdsatite aud dire 
out a few of the suggestions which had occurred to his mind on 
the question now before them. He was aware that it was the 
belief of many there, that the question of banks was the all ab 
sorbing question of the day, not only in the Convention, bu 
amongst the people, in all sections of the State of Illinois. This 
would be the impression forced upon the mind of anyone who had 
heard the discussion on that floor, yet such was not the case 
among the people. This question of a bank was not considered 
by the people of his county before he came. there—banks were 
considered by them to be an obsolete idea. It was said there by 
the whigs that the former State banks, which had brought upon 
them so much ruin and misfortune, had been created by the demo- 
crats, and they, the whigs, threw them off as no part of their 
policy; the democrats threw them off, and the whole people, with- 
out distinction of party, admitted them to be an obsolete idea. — 
All were opposed to them where he came from, and the question 
was not alluded to in the canvass except, perhaps, to ask a candi- 
date if he was opposed to them, which he answered in the affirm- 
ative, and this was all that was said. But if a person were to hear 
the discussion here, he would think that the people were alive on 
this subject. It was but a few years ago that this question o 
banks was a party question, the democrats were opposed to a 
banks and the whig party was in favor of them, but as has been 
shown by the gentleman who has just taken his seat (Mr. Brock- : 
MAN) the whigs have receded in this as in many other things, so 
much so that there is no whig in our part of the State who wi 
pretend to favor them. And now it is said that it is no political 
question; but becomes with us one of mere expediency—except 1 
regard to a bank with special privileges. The evils of banking he 
considered consist more in the embodiment, in one corporation of — ny 
a few men, of peculiar and special privileges, and the cutting off © 4 
all competition, in the way of trade and business, by.men who are ~ 
not possessed of those rights and privileges which give their char- 
tered opponents so great an advantage. The evil, therefore, is in 
the sespecial privileges which they have enjoyed, and the want 
proper and necessary restrictions upon them. On this questio 
of expediency, he would say that he was opposed to the creation of 


TUESDAY, JUNE 29, 1847 281 


ak with power to issue any bill of credit, promissory note, 
ning else intended as a currency; and he was opposed to 
oration issuing three or four dollars in paper to each one 
it capital. He thought that Illinois did not need any banks 
nrich her people or to raise the value of her property. He 
idered that the country was only enriched as we improve our 
by the increase of our products, or as we raise means of 
tence by labor. Nor did he think there was at present any 
lus capital in Illinois to be vested in banks, and that if any 
ks were now to be created it would be embraced by men more 
ous to borrow than by those who desire to invest their surplus 
tal. There is no excitement anywhere on this question of 
ks except in this Convention, and, so far as my information 
tends, it did not enter into the canvass. This was the case in 
the northern part of the State. A few years ago the people of the 
ate were depressed and in debt, and all kinds of property was 
of little value. Now our property has become enhanced, and we 
- now in a state of comparative prosperity; these good results 
d been produced without banks. Every farmer, mechanic and 
tisan, and all others whose avocations tended to contribute to 
he wealth of the country, have together produced this prosperity. 
t there were those in the community who had been laying on 
- their oars watching for their opportunity, now come forth, and 
ng advantage of that ambition, which prosperity always 
in the bosom of men, are desirous to have banks, and a 
titious currency wherewith to run into wild and extravagant 
schemes of speculation, and in due course of time will possess 
themselves of all the property of the country, and in due course of 
ne their bubble will burst, and in the scramble will take care to 
rich themselves on the loss and substance of others. The 
eople of Illinois do not want these banks. It is true they exist 
New York and other States, but he believed that if the people 
that State were like us, once rid of them, they would never 
‘them again; but such is the influence on the trade and busi- 
of the community, and the power they are enabled to exercise 
er the people themselves, by means of their privileges, that 


282 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


like water, will always find its level, but paper money will always 
drive gold and silver from the market. One part of the State has — 
now an exclusive metallic currency of gold and silver; this is in 
the northern part of the State, in the mining region. There was 
at one time nothing but paper circulated there, and so great was 
the confidence of the people that a note was never examined but — 
taken without hesitation. After a while the banks burst, and — 
these people felt the loss more severely than others who had less — 
of that kind of currency. They then declared and resolved for 
the future to have nothing but gold and silver. e. 

There English sovereigns constituted nearly the whole currency, - 
because they were worth more there than anywhere else; they — 
passed current in that region for $4.90, while at the east the[y] 
were taken for only $4.83, and at St. Louis for $4.85; the 
difference, therefore, between the $4.90 and $4.83 paid well 
for the exchange between that quarter and the eastern cities. 
The difference in the value was far greater than the cost of trans-— 
portation. Gold and silver must find its level, and though in ~ 
other States they may have banks and paper money, State lines — 
are no barriers to the exportation of the precious metals, which - 
will naturally flow where it is worth most. Our produce will go © 
eastward, and their gold must flow back to us, and one will be 
the exchange for the other. Suppose we send three millions of - 
dollars worth of our produce—beef, corn, flour, pork, lead—to the — 
east, it is not necessary that that amount in specie shall be returned © 
at once, because as our producers have the coin, which is paid by 
them to the merchants, and those merchants trade for their goods — 
at the east. What is more easy and simple for the manufacturers — 
or purchasers of our produce there to pay for it in drafts upon our — 
own merchants, and thus the money is again paid out to the farmer 
and the miner in metallic currency; and all this can be done without | 
banks. Where is the necessity for them in our State? 

I oppose the proposition of the gentleman from Madison, even 
if we are to have banks. One objection is, that it does not provide ~ 
that the directors and stockholders of the banks shall be personally — 
liable for the debts of the institution. Here is no remedy against — 
men setting apart a certain amount of their money to bank upon, © 
and when that is lost, with thousands belonging to others, sitting — 


TUESDAY, JUNE 29, 1847 283 


down with a private fortune exempt from all liability, and which 
may have been the accumulated result of accommodation in the 
_ shape of loans to him by the bank. I also object to it because it 
does not provide that any bill which may pass the Legislature, 
_ creating a bank, shall be submitted to the people. In conclusion, 
__ I will say to those fifty-eight who voted for the prohibitory clause 
_ that we want but twenty-three more to make a majority; and I 
say that, in case ofa failure to carry that, I believe there are those 
here who are opposed to banks yet opposed to a prohibitory 
clause, and who come nearer us than others, and with whom the 
i fifty-eight may vote; that there is a probability that they may 
+ unite with us on some plan which will, in effect, accomplish the 
ends of a prohibitory clause. If I can’t get a total prohibition, I 
_ hope to see something adopted that will approach it as near as 
_ possible. I had no expectation that what I have said will have 
_ any effect upon members here. I anticipate no such results from 
_ my speaking, but I have thrown out these suggestions to those in 
_ the Convention who approach nearer the doctrine of the fifty- 
_ eight in principle, and who, I believe, may unite with us upon 
something. 

_ Mr. GREEN of Tazewell addressed the Convention in 
_ deprecation of the introduction of party topics, and in defence of 
__ the whig party. 

The Convention then adjourned till to-morrow at 9g A. M. 


RUN eat a Cunt ag 


XX. WEDNESDAY, JUNE 30, 1847 


Mr. BUNSEN offered a resolution of i inate Refered 
the committee on Education. 


dese the amendment was laid on the table? He the resolu 
adopted. a 
Mr. Z. CASEY moved that the committee of the whole De 


one subject will be again discussed. Carried. 

Messrs. KircHeLtt and ARCHER presented Rien’ “f 
relation to banks; which were referred to the ie 
Incorporations. 


the hots and take up reports of committees as per iO: radoy 
yesterday. Carried. 


Mr. Woopson in the chain, . 
Mr. CASEY said, that he wished to suggest that the ch 
the committee on the Legislative Department and the 
of the committee on the Executive Department were both a 
from the city; but they had requested that the reports may n 
postponed on account of their absence. He moved the repo tH 
the committee on the Legislative Department be ta 
Carried. 
The committee then proceeded to consider the report ¢ 


284 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 30, 1847 286 


he elected once in every two years, &c.” 

ir. SHUMWAY moved to strike out “two” and insert 
ir. ROUNTREE moved to insert “four.” 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery advocated the adoption of the 
‘number. He said the opinion of the people of the counties 
epresented—Bond and Montgomery—had been fully expressed 
n this subject. They were satisfied that we had been cursed 
y too much legislation. He thought that one session every four 
years, with power to the Governor to call them together when 
my emergency arose, was sufficient for all the legislation the 
ople required. The people there, and even the members of the 
egislature, would be able to know what laws were passed by one 
islature before the next met; which is not the case at the present. 
_ Mr. DALE begged leave to differ from his friend of Mont- 


on. But not the remedy of electing members for four years, as 
posed by the gentleman. 

They complain of over-legislation and the expenses attending 
t. The remedy for this, and it is the one which they wish, is 
fully furnished in the report of this committee. This report 
mits the time of holding sessions, so that, instead of ninety days, 
as heretofore, the Legislature will be able, in future, to remain in 
‘session but little over forty-two days, and too, at a pay so small 
o remedy all the objections that the people of his county have 
nst over-legislation and its heavy expenses. 
This reduced pay and the short time allowed for legislation 
ll induce the Legislature to enter immediately upon the business 
of legislation, and to legislate only on matters called for and 
essary to be legislated on. And this is the reform which the 
e of his county desired. 


286 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS _ 


Mr. GEDDES was in favor of the four years—He thou 
that we had had too much legislation, and that it would have ~ 
been much better for Illinois if there had been no Legislature: for 
the last twelve years. rf | 

Mr. HAYES said, that it might be assumed, ae the remarks 
of gentlemen, that Legislatures had become nuisances, which, 
though not the term used, was no stronger than some that were 
uttered by gentlemen. He admitted that there had been bad 
legislation, but was there not bad legislation in every State? If 
they so much feared bad legislation, would it not be as well to 
abolish the Legislature altogether? The gentleman had said that 
it would have been better had there been no Legislature for the 
last twelve years. Perhaps we might have avoided some of the % 
evils of bad legislation, but would it not have been depriving og 
people of their share in the government? If he had understood — 
anything of the nature of government, the whole conservative 7 
power of the people was in the Legislature—there they were heard, © ‘ 
there they spoke in the administration of the government. They y 
had a latent power in themselves to overturn the government, and 
establish law and order where law and order did not exist before. 
But the only legal power the people had was vested in the Le 
lature. Much had been said about bad legislation, and that it 
had been conducted by men who acted not to promote the purposes” 
of the people, but rather to advance their own. Here we have 
large State with a large annual revenue coming into the hands 
your Auditor and Treasurer, and unless we have a Legislature, ' th 
Governor will have millions under his control; and there is ne 0 
power to direct the disposition of it. 4 % 

He denied the benefits of a long interval between the sessior 3 
of the Legislature. It was not tobe expected that our public sery- 
ants will always be pure. That was a presumption in favor 
human character. But if they had had bad legislators, we m 
have a corrupt executive, and the government exercised wi 
tyranny. Many people in thle] State thought two years 
long. He thought the Convention, in carrying out reform 
might go too far, and might defeat their action by attemp daa O 
do too much. tg 

Mr. KNAPP of Scott inquired witeches the long incervall of 


.. 


WEDNESDAY, JUNE 30, 1847 287 


the revenue was easily Enawered by saying, the Legislature can 
_as well distribute at its session the revenue for four years as it 


__ Mr. LOGAN endorsed the views of the gentleman from White 
(Mr. Hayes.) Though no democrat, he would oppose, as our 
_ government was mixed, the executive, judiciary, and legislative 
_ or democratic departments, the abridging of the democratic part. 
Auditor of Public Accounts and the Treasurer, who had large 
sums coming into their hands, are not responsible to any but the 
Legislature. Again, in case the Governor becomes corrupt, what 
good was the power he possessed to call the Legislature together? 
He would not call them to revise his acts, and we would-have but 
4 ‘one session of the Legislature during the term of the Governor. 
; ‘He opposed it further, because it was putting it out of the power 
_ of the people to be heard more than once in four years, while the 
3 "other parts of the government went on administering it. 
Mr. BOND was in favor of striking out, and inserting four 
years. He differed from the gentlemen from Sangamon and 
_ White, because when this Convention had done with clipping the 
_ powers of our executive, his duty will be but little more than to 
‘ ‘see the laws executed. The Governor, even at the present, has 
_ no power to draw money from the treasury, except when author- 
_ ized by the Legislature. The only difficulty was the election of 
United States Senators, and he supposed they would have to 
~ elect them four years before. 
Mr. LOGAN. They may die or resign. 
Mr. BOND. They but seldom die and never resign. 
Mr. MINSHALL advocated a shorter term of interval, 
_ because he thought the representative should be responsible to 
r Othe people at short periods. If we adopt the term of four years, 
each man elected a Senator would hold the office for eight years. 
_ Mr. Patmer of Macoupin and Mr. Davis of Montgomery 
Be intinced the debate, the former in opposition to, and the latter 
in favor of, the amendment. 
On motion the committee rose and asked leave to sit again; 
which was granted. 


Convention, to the Ciivcneant to yn 


The PRESIDENT laid before the Conventio 
from the citizens of Springfield to attend | e barba 
to the volunteers returned from Mexico, 
On motion, both invitations were exten 

On motion, Messrs. Ecctes, Epmons 


; ARCHER were excused for ten days. 


atgQ A. M. 


XXI. THURSDAY, JULY 1, 1847 


e Prayer by Rev. Mr. Barcer. 

i Me. HOES presented a petition from a number of citizens of 

: gston county in favor of a superintendant [sic] of common 
: Referred to the committee on Education. 

‘Mr. ‘MANLY moved to take up certain petitions, presented 

him some weeks ago, and refer them to the committee on Law 

orm. Carried. 

_ Mr. WHITESIDE, from the committee on Military Affairs, 

‘to. which had been referred the 5th article of the constitution, 

“reported the same back, with a recommendation that it be adopted 

_ wit out amendment. The report and the article were referred 

_ to the committee of the whole. 

_ Mr. THOMAS, from the committee on the Revenue, reported 

_ back a resolution recommending the appropriation of the taxes 

the 16th section in each township to school purposes, and asked 

be discharged from its further consideration. Report concurred 


_ Mr. HAYES, from the committee on Law Reform, reported 
ck a resolution in relation to excusing certain persons having 
nscientious scruples, from serving on juries, &c., and asked to 
oo from the further consideration of the same. Con- 
=@ in. 

Mr. KITCHELL asked leave of absence for seven days for 
Dr. Turr. Granted. 

_ Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess gave notice that on next 
Monday week he would introduce the following propositions: 

_ Resolved, That the committee on Incorporations be instructed 
report the following propositions, to be submitted to the people 
arately, viz: 

irst. There shall be no bank or banks, nor any branch of 
bank or banks, of any description whatever established in 
State, for the term of ten years. Ifa majority of all the votes 
‘by the qualified electors of this State, shall be in favor of such 
289 


290 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


clause being inserted in the constitution, it shall then be mad 
the duty of the Legislature, at the expiration of said term of t 

years, to submit the same question to the people, to be voted on 
in the same manner; and it shall be the further duty of the Legis- 
lature to submit the same question every ten years thereafter, 
unless said proposition shall be rejected, then and in that case said My 


“ 


clause shall be stricken from the constitution. ae 
Second. If a majority of the qualified electors of the State 
shall decide against the foregoing proposition being made a part 
of the constitution, then it shall be made the duty of the Legis- 
lature, if at any time it shall be deemed necessary, to create by ig 4 
law any bank or banks, or to establish within the limits of this 
State any branches of any bank or banks of any other States, to 
submit any and every such law, so creating or establishing any — 
such banks or branches, to the people for their approval, at least 
one year previous to the time fixed for voting on the same; and in 
case said law shall receive a majority of all the votes given at said 
election, then it shall be in full force and operation, otherwise to. 
be of no force or effect whatever. 
Mr. KNOWLTON offered a resolution directing an nq i 
by the committee on Education. Carried. 4 
Mr. HAWLEY offered a resolution, that a special committee 
be appointed to report some provision for the amelioration of ~ 
lunatic, deaf, dumb and blind persons. ‘hg 
Mr. HARDING moved to add the word “black;” which a 
amendment was laid on the table. yy 
Mr. SCATES moved to add “‘insane.’ 
Mr. HARDING suggested that, as the Conventie wer 
determined to do nothing for the negroes, he a it had bett 


a 


Be 


was it would be applicable to all colors. 
Mr. SCATES replied that, in cases of humanity he knew no 4 
difference in color. ¥ 
Mr. ADAMS moved to lay the whole subject on the table. 
Carried. a 
Mr. WEAD offered a resolution, that the committee ont 
Miscellaneous Subjects be directed to inquire into the expediency 


THURSDAY, JULY 1, 1847 291 


of providing for fixing the seat of government of the State at 

Peoria. Laid on the table. 

_ Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery offered a resolution that the 

' committee on Incorporations be instructed to report a clause 
prohibiting a State Bank. Carried. 

_ Mr. HOGUE moved to go into committee of the whole. 

_ Decided in the affirmative. 

_ And the Convention resolved itself into committee of the 
whole, Mr. Woopson in the chair, and took up the report of the 

“committee on the Legislative Department. 

H _ The question pending was on striking out “two” and inserting 

_ “four” in the second line, and the vote being taken the committee 
refused to strike out. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to amend the same section by 

"striking out the words “first Monday in October” (the day 

‘ provided for the election of members of the Legislature) and insert 
_ “first Monday in November.” 

j Mr. HENDERSON moved to insert the “Tuesday after the 

_ first Monday in November.” 

Y The vote being taken, the word October was stricken out. 

Mr. WHITESIDE moved to fill with “first Monday in August.”’ 
~ Mr. SINGLETON moved to fill the blank with “3d Monday 
in August.” 

y _ A conversational debate ensued, in which Messrs. WHITNEY; 

_ Davis of Montgomery, Campsett of Jo Daviess, HENDERSON; 

_ Kwox, Harvey, Cuurcuiii, Scares, Geppes, Locan, PETERs; 

_ Anperson, WuirTesipE, Know.ton and ATHERTON participated. 

_ And the question being taken on inserting the “first Monday in 
_ November,” it was decided in the affirmative—yeas 86, nays not 

i counted. 

i Mr. ROUNTREE moved to add “and continue for ten days” 

_ after the word eight in 2d line, and at the end of the section, to 

_ provide that the elections shall continue for two days.” 

i He said that if all our elections, for General Assembly, 
_ Presidential elections, and county officers, are to be held on one 
day, and by the viva voce system, it would be impossible to get 

_ through in one day. If we, however, adopt the ballot system, his 


292 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL sir. ‘ON 


proposition would be unnecessary. The queseigie was taken 
the amendment and decided in the nee 
Mr. SHARPE moved to strike out “eight” and insert cae 
in 2d line—that the first elections shall be in 1849. Lost. 
Mr. ROBBINS moved to insert in 4th line—“and for s 
length of time,” so as to have the elections continue for a time t 
be fixed by law. Lost. 


ee wn 
QUALIFICATIONS OF REPRESENTATIVES 


The next section was then read and 
Mr. MARSHALL moved to strike out “inhabitant of th 
State,” as unnecessary. Lost. 


in firat: line, and insert “one” (in the age of the Representative) 
which motion was lost. ae 


unless a resident of the State five years and of the county one y\ 
Lost. . 


QUALIFICATIONS OF SENATORS ce 


“forty.” 
Mr. WHITNEY opposed any such aia and NY 
question was taken on the motion and it was lost. 
Mr. SHUMWAY moved to insert “and an inhabitant of 
State,” after the words “shall be a citizen of the United State 
Carried. 
Mr. SINGLETON moved to insert after the wards “she 
have resided” the words “‘five years in this State.” "Carried — Y 
70, nays 56. 
Mr. HAY moved to amend so as the age should be 36 y 
instead of 30. we 52, nays not counted. Lost. 


a §. ALLOTMENTS OF SENATORS 


. . . ae 
This section was passed without any amendment. 


THURSDAY, JULY 1, 1847 293 


. 6. NUMBER OF SENATORS AND REPRESENTATIVES 


ie section reads—‘“The Senate shall consist of twenty-five 
ers, and the House of Representatives shall consist of 
nty-five members, never to be increased or diminished, to be 
portioned among the. several counties as herein provided for; 
until there shall be a new apportionment of Senators and 


entative districts, and the Senators and Representatives 
s nal be apportioned as follows:” 

oe Mr. HARVEY moved to insert after the word “diminished,” 
“until the Legislature shall deem it necessary.” Lost. 

Mr. HOGUE moved to strike out “five” after “seventy.” 
40. Lost. Z : 

_ Mr. HOGUE moved to strike out “five” after “twenty.” 
Race. 

Mr. HARDING moved to strike out “seventy-five members, 
ver to be increased nor diminished” and insert “one member 
each county in the State at the time of the election.” 


ea (Mr. HARDING said, that the committee having decided that 
the legislature should consist of two branches, and that it should 
convene once in two years, it was necessary in fixing the number 
of which that legislature should be comprised, to have some refer- 
“ence ce to the decision of the committee in regard to those points to 
which he had alluded—Had the committee determined to strike 
out from the first section ‘“the Senate,’’ as proposed by the gentle- 
7. an from Gallatin, then it was probable, that the committee 
ould also be prepared to strike out the number seventy-five, and 
ert a much larger number; but it was determined by a vote of 
committee, without debate, that there should be a Senate as 
as a House of Representatives in the legislative department 
le government, and although he had voted against the propo- 
sition of the gentleman to strike out the Senate, from the alarm 
whi h he felt at this attempt at innovation upon the mode of 
nization adopted in other governments, more than from con- 


ae 


Z 


294 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


government, unless we might have the substance and excelle 
which ought to appertain to such a government? Why 1 incur the : 


such a form of government, unless the benefits which Lene to bel 
derived therefrom could be secured. If the members of the two ~ 
branches of the legislature were to possess like qualifications, to be 
vested with like powers on all subjects of legislation, to be elected | 


in the same manner, and for the same term, why should they bat 
divided into two branches? It was not enough to be told that ; 
one branch was intended to be a check upon the pid unless by is 


assumed a legislative shape. An unchecked and unrestraine 1 
legislature, concurring as they generally do in our times, with oF 


the Miles of the legislative deparunente into two brane <i 
branches may have a tendency to check the action of each other; 
but, Sir, that tendency is as chaff before the wind, when they ar 
all elected upon the same basis of representation, and two of then . 
according to the same apportionment. All are the offspring of 
the throes and labors of party strife and passion. This legislature » 
is to be clothed with all the sovereign powers of the State, governed 
only by the restrictions of this constitution. What interest, sit, 
important though it may be, unless it can wield many votes, i S 
safe in a government of this character? Private right and cor- 
porate right may be safe so long as shielded by an enlightened and 
- independent judiciary. But, sir, how long can we hope that the 
judiciary under the proposed mode of its creation, shall withstand 
the sway of unscrupulous and eager party. The constitution 
itself, Sir, before the united flood of these streams may be over- 
whelmed. May not some of the able statesmen of this conven- 


THURSDAY SJULY 1, 7847 295 


z om bring forward and insert in this place, or in some other portion 
of this article, a provision which will in practice, to a greater ex- 
i _ tent than this section proposes, give a House and a Senate dissim- 
ilar in character? I do not desire to make any such distinctions 
as we find in the British Parliament; but, sir, I do believe that we 
_ ought at least to imitate the mode of apportionment which pre- 
_ vails in regard to the two branches of Congress. The conserva- 


_ they come to possess a majority, then if unchecked by a proper 
_ organization of the departments of government, the rights, the 
_ property and the persons of those who are obnoxious to them 
_ must yield to the irresistible force of the torrent. 
_ When this subject was before the Convention in the form of 
_ resolutions of instruction to the committee on the Legislative De- 
‘partment, I opposed this number by my vote. I proposed that 
‘the number of members in the house should correspond with the 
. _ number of counties; and that each county should elect a represent- 
ative, and that they should be paid out of the treasury of their 
respective counties. This, sir, although it would save more 
_ money to the State treasury than any other plan, was voted down; 
_ it was defeated through the superior address and ability of the 
gentleman from White. 

But, sir, there is another consideration, and I much regret my 
_ inability to do more than refer to it. Could I enforce it with the 
arguments with which it is fraught, then, sir, I should hope to see 
_ this mode adopted; and there is no doubt that it would aid much 
_ in preserving the faith and stability of the government of this 
State, and it is this:—The tillers of the soil, under such an appor- 
_ tionment, would control in a great degree one branch of the legis- 
lature. The men who bear the burthen of taxation, upon whose 
_ broad acres rest the debts and expenses of the State, must feel the 
necessity, if they would be relieved of this incubus of debt, of 
checking extravagant legislation, of adopting a system of strict ~ 
_ economy in regard to all the expenses of the government. A 
Le Fs Tepresentation by counties in one branch of the legislature, would 
r be by no means so unequal, in respect to this interest, as gentle- 


es nl * ne 


i 


depot and entrepot, where the bands of the ae badoehe sind 
congregate, are settled by the farmer and mechanic, whose stead 
habits and principles would not be so readily overwhelmed by th 
unsettled, speculative and often unprincipled population alo 
the public works and in your large cities. Is it too much to a 
sir, that this vital, and in Illinois, most important interest shou 
in this slight degree be favored? Sir, had this unassuming, un- 
obtrusive, virtuous and patriotic portion of the population—this — 
bone and sinew of the State—been more frequently consulted, had — 
it been allowed to exert greater influence, and the busy-bodies o 
towns and cities less, well would it be now and hereafter for this Stat 
Gentlemen have often on this floor declared what were th 
complaints and wishes of the people. Sir, have not all the met 
bers of this Convention repeatedly heard the voice of the people 


justly lamenting that the country was too much influenced 


party, and do we not know that unchecked, unrestrained, faul 
action has hurried the country into numerous acts of legislatio 
which are deeply to be regretted? The representation in one 
branch, by counties, will check the headlong course of party. 
For, sir, although there may be a party governor, and a_ 
party majority in the Senate, yet it requires a majori 
of counties to give free scope to party bias on the part 
the other two branches. Would you have the representati 
faithful to his trust? Then pay him out of the treasury of t 
county which he represents. Does he linger too long at the capi-— 
tol? The accounts at the county treasury will show his delin- 
quency, and thus another tie is established between the member 
and his constituency. Another advantage which will arise fro 
allowing each county to elect a member is, that it will save mu 
clamor and much expense in making apportionments hereafte: 
Make this the basis of representation, and we shall hear no mor 
complaints of apportionments being made with reference to party 
interests and party objects. This will give us a stable Bove 
ment.]” 

2 This speech by Harding is taken from the Sangamo Journal, Ful Sh 


THURSDAY, JULY 1, 1847 297 


some words in favor of the amendment by Messrs. 

and McCatten, and by Messrs. Scates and Davis in 

Hon; the committee rose, reported, had leave to sit again, 
Convention adjourned till 3 p. m. 


AFTERNOON 


-Z. CASEY moved the Convention resolve itself into 
of the whole. Carried. 

‘question pending when the committee rose was on the 
ent of the member from Warren; and being taken, was 
in the negative. 

. HARVEY moved to insert “by the Legislature” before 
rds “the State shall be” &c. Lost. 

. CHURCH moved to insert after “diminished,” the words 
after the year 1860.” 

. KINNEY of Bureau offered as a substitute for the 
iment “until after the year 1860, or till the payment of the 
st on the State debt shall be secured, and the Senate shall 
seed 33 members nor the House 100 members.” 

essrs. KINNEY and Mason supported, briefly, the substitute, 
on a division was lost. 

PALMER of Macoupin offered as a substitute “until the 
lation of the State shall amount to one million of souls, and 
House shall never exceed one hundred members.” Yeas 76, 


54. 
Ar. ‘SERVANT moved to amend the substitute as adopted, 


“one million” and inserting “two millions.” 


CAMPBELL of McDonough moved to lay the amend- 
on the table. 
r. THOMAS raised a point of order, whether the committee 
chnically any table, and whether such a motion was in order. 
e chairman, after a consultation with the President, decided 
notion in order; whereupon ensued a debate between Messrs. 
: Tuomas, Epwarps of S., Coup, Casey and others, after 


298 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


which the chair withdrew his decision and ruled the motion ou 
order. a 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough said, that if they fan's no ta 
to lay such amendments on, he hoped the Convention would 
one at once. 

The amendment was then lost. Yeas 58, nays 59. 

Mr. LAUGHLIN moved to amend the substitute by ma 
it read “until the year 1860 when the Legislature may increa 
the House to one hundred members.” Lost. Yeas 49, nays 

Mr. DEITZ submitted the following as a substitute for 
substitute:—‘‘until 1860, when the Legislature may increase 
members and the same number every five years thepeay aes till t 
House shall reach one hundred in number.” st 

Mr. SINGLETON moved the committee rise. Lost. 

The question, after a brief debate, was taken on the last’ pro- 
posed substitute, and it was carried. Yeas 71, nays 57. f ‘a 
The amendment as amended was then adopted. Yeas 66, 6, 
nays 57. o 

Mr. WHITNEY moved the committee rise. Carried. 
chairman reported and it had leave to sit again. 

Mr. SHARPE asked leave of absence, for six days, for 
Cuoate, of Hancock county. Granted. a 

Mr. SINGLETON asked leave of absence for Mr. MAnsHaus i 
of Mason for five days. Granted. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough offered a resolution ah no 
member shall receive pay for time not given to the Conventio on, 
except when absent on account of sickness. ia 

Mr. THOMAS moved to lay it on the table. The yeas and 
nays were demanded and ordered, and then the motion to lay 
the table was withdrawn. 

Mr. SCATES renewed it, and the question being Laken on 
laying the resolution on the table by yeas and nays resulted— 
yeas 49, nays gI. ’ 

The use of the Hall was given to Mrs. Browne and déeivte ‘Sy 
for a concert to be given on Saturday night to the returne sd 
volunteers. And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned till 
to-morrow at 9 a. m. an 


re: 


eth 


- 
ae 


XXII. FRIDAY, JULY 2, 1847 


Betryer by the Rev. Mr. Battey. 

; Mr. SCATES moved that leave of absence be granted to 
Mr. Canapy, for six days. Granted. 

ar _Mr. KNOWLTON asked leave of absence of four days for 
Mr. Lanper. Granted. 

~ The resolution pending at the adjournment yesterday, was on 
‘the 2 resolution, as amended, of Mr. CampsBELt of Jo Daviess, and 
Mr. GEDDES offered a substitute for the resolution, and the 
. vy bote being taken thereon, resulted—yeas 67, nays 20; no quorum. 
_ Mr. Z. CASEY moved a call of the House. Ordered. 

_ The call was then made and 130 members answered to their 
mes. On motion, further proceedings under the call were 
d isp ensed with, 

And the substitute was laid on the table. 

f Mr. BUTLER offered the following as a substitute for the 
te esolution: 

_ _ That each member of this Convention give in the number of 
‘days of his attendance upon honor, including the number of days 
‘he has been absent on leave, and on account of sickness, and those 
he has actually attended in this Convention, and the same be 
“cel paaed to by the President. 

_ Mr. WHITNEY moved to lay the whole subject on the table; 
or which motion the yeas and nays were ordered and resulted— 
yeas 59, nays 70. 

‘= _ Mr. CAMPBELL then accepted the substitute. 

ig _ Mr. SINGLETON offered an amendment—“that each member 
e in the number of days for which he is entitled to pay and the 
sident certify to the same. 

Mr. KNOWLTON offered as an amendment, that when any 
s embe shall be absent at prayers, he shall be docked in his per 
diem 25 cents; at the reading of the journal, 10 cents; at the time 
° ome a speech by any member, two dollars; at the offering of 


299 


300 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT. 


any resolution, thirty-seven and a half cents; a at ‘thes cali 
the yeas and nays, five dollars. 

On motion, the previous question was ordered, and the. ve 
being taken on the last amendment by yeas and nays, resulte ; 
yeas Ig. Lost. . 

Mr. WORCESTER moved that the Convention adiounat 
Tuesday morning. The yeas and nays were ordered, eee 
motion was withdrawn. 

A motion was made that the Convention adjourn till Mor d 
next; and the yeas and nays being ordered and taken, resulted— 
yeas 8, nays 122. The question was taken on the amendment of 
Mr. SIncLETON, and decided in the negative. ; 

And the question being taken on the resolution as amende 
by yeas and nays, it was decided in the affirmative. 

Mr. BUTLER offered the following preamble and resoluti 2 

Whereas, incorporations, clothed with exclusive powers ar nd 
privileges, are contrary to the spirit and fundamental principles of 2) 
our republican institutions; oppressive to the best interests of t 
people at large; and tend to unequal, unjust and oppressive mon 
olies; making the rich richer, and the poor poorer; and whereas, 
such monopolies and exclusive privileges, the capitalist is enab 
to control the particular branch of business in which he may engz 
and conduct the same to the exclusion of the truly worthy a 
deserving; making wealth predominate over merit, virtue 
integrity; and whereas, the chartering by law and protecting 
corporations in the exercise of such exclusive, unequal and unj 
power and privileges, tends to the concentration of capital and | 
business of the country in the hands of the few, and to the est 
lishment of an aristocracy of wealth, and to the subjection of » 
many to mere dependents and servile operators; therefore, 

Resolved, That the committee on Incorporations be instru: 
to enquire &c. of prohibiting the Legislature from hereafter cre 
ing any companies, associations or corporations—by special act 
with exclusive powers and privileges, except for municipal purpos 
and except in such cases where the objects of such associatio 
company or corporation cannot be accomplished under the provi 
sions of a general law which may apply equally to all persons. 

Mr. LOGAN said, he had no objection to the resolution, as 


UTES hye BUD aN EN Kee yan ye tite ere AE RIERA ap IF NP | a 
ip Duna Reval a Mee d aR , are ; ene 
aa 7 > N . ¥ , 


FRIDAY, JULY 2, 1847 301 


as one directing a mere enquiry; but the preamble contained 
ertain principles which he did not think the Convention would 
ypt. He asked a division of the question. And the vote was 
en on the adoption of the resolution, and it was adopted. 
‘Mr. McCALLEN then moved that the preamble be laid on 
the table. The yeas and nays were demanded, and were ordered, 
and resulted yeas 64, nays 67. 
Mr. LOGAN said, it was evident John Thompson had been 
junting up his stray cattle and had been successful; and as this 
question would lead to debate he moved its postponement till 
fonday week, when the resolutions of the gentleman from Jo 
aviess would come before the Convention. Carried. 
_ Mr. SHUMWAY moved a resolution instructing the committee 
n Incorporations to report a clause prohibiting the establishment 
f a United States bank or any branch thereof in the State. 
-_ Mr. SINGLETON offered as a substitute for the resolution 
hat no member of the Convention be allowed for his own use, any 
_ of the paper or ink furnished by the State; and that no member 
4 be allowed pay for fractions of day’s Wee 
« _ Mr. VANCE moved to adjourn till 3 p. m. 
Mr. ATHERTON moved to adjourn till Monday ieee, 
Mr. BROWN moved to adjourn till Tuesday next. 
_ The motion to adjourn till Monday week was lost. 
_ The motion to adjourn till Tuesday next was decided by yeas 
and nays as follows: Yeas 4, nays 128. 
Mr. BROWN moved to adjourn till Monday, and the vote was 
taken by yeas and nays, as follows: Yeas 7, nays 121. 
_ The motion to adjourn till 3 p. m., was lost. 
Mr. GREEN of Tazewell made a few remarks on the state 
Af pines in the Convention, and 
_ Mr. SINGLETON withdrew his substitute. 
Mr. DEITZ moved to add to the resolution, “without first 
__ obtaining leave of the Legislature.” 
mi | Mr. SHUMWAY moved to lay the amendment on the table. 


302 ILLINOIS Ania ple COLLECTIONS an 
Mr. LOGAN moved to lay it on the cables The yeas mac nays” 
were demanded, ordered and taken, and resulted—yeas 76, nays 50. a 
Mr. HILL offered a resolution that the Convention shall mee P 
daily hereafter (Sundays excepted) at 8 a. m., and 2 p. m. sf 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess offered as an anion diet hi 
that, in computing the pay of members for attendance, Sundays — 
be not included. A motion to lay the amendment on the table — 
was made, and the yeas and nays demanded and ordered. 
Mr. GEDDES moved the Convention adjourn till 3 p. m. 
The yeas and nays on the motion were taken, and resulted 4 
yeas 56, nays 69. . 
Mr. HAYES moved to adjourn till 2 p. m. Lost. 
The yeas and nays were then taken on laying the amendment a 
on the table, and resulted—yeas 62, nays 46. sa 
Mr. SERVANT offered a resolution that when this Conventen 
adjourn, it adjourn till ony next. 


on the qaile: till 3 p.m. Yeas 80. Carried. 
Mr. LAUGHLIN moved the Convention adjourn till 3 p. m. Om 
Carried. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. GEDDES moved to take up the resolution to adjourn till — 
Monday. Carried. Yeas 77, nays none. And it was ee 
Mr. THOMAS moved the Convention adjourn. Lost. 


eed to Mrs. Browne and daughters on Saturday night for a , 
concert to be given to the returned volunteers. Carried. “a 
Mr. BROWN moved the Convention adjourn. Lost. 4 
Mr. LOGAN moved the Convention resolye anto committee f 
of the whole. Carried, and Mr. Z. Casey was called to the chair. — : 
The committee took up the report of the Legislative Committee, — 
at the 6th section which was under consideration when the com-— 
mittee rose on yesterday. j 
Mr. HARDING moved to amend said section by inserting 4 
after the word “districts” where it first occurs, the following: “no — 
county shall vote for more than one member of the House of — 


FRIDAY, JULY 2, 1847 303 
ntatives.[”] Decided in the negative. Yeas 24, nays not 


- HARDING moved to insert after “apportioned,” where 
‘st occurs, “‘so that no election district shall be enlarged unless 
fraction over the ratio of population, exceed one-third the ratio, 
ad then not unless with contiguous territory.” Yeas 55, nays 61. 

_ Mr. LOGAN offered the same amendment except instead of 
“one-third,” it read “one-fourth.” 

_ Mr. ROBBINS moved to add to the amendment “so that each 
ounty having not less than three- fourths of the ratio shall be 
entitled to one representative.” Which amendment to the 
amendment was lost. 

_Mr. LOGAN then withdrew his amendment. 

¥ Mr. HAYES moved to strike out the words “as hereafter 
provided for” and insert “‘in all future apportionments when more 
n one county shall be thrown into a representative district, all 
representatives to which said counties may be entitled shall be 
elected by the whole district.”” Which was adopted. 

‘ ‘Mr. SCATES moved to strike out “twenty-five and seventy- 
five” and insert “thirty-five and sixty-five.” Lost. 


SEc. 7- TIME OF MEETING OF THE LEGISLATURE 


_ Mr. THOMAS moved to strike out January, 1849 (the time 
of the meeting of the first Legislature under the constitution) 
insert December, 1848. Lost. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved to add that the Legis- 
Tature “shall not continue in session for a longer period than 
xty days.” 

_ Mr. BROCKMAN moved to add to the amendment, “and 
the Governor shall have the power to prolong the session, if in his 
ion the public interests demand the same.”” The two amend- 
ts were decided in the negative. 


' Sec. 8. OFFICERS OF THE TWO HOUSES AND QUORUM 


_ Mr. WEAD moved to strike out “two-thirds,” with a view to 
in inse ert a larger number to constitute a quorum. Lost. 
~ Sec. g- Yeas and nays on any question shall at the desire of 
ny two members be entered on journal. 


i Pe PO ee tet ta 
REN Cs? Se Oe 


304 


Mr. GRAHAM moved to strike out. “two” a 
Lost. ‘ vst 
Sec. 10. Any two members may protest &c., and ave t 
reasons entered on the journal. 
Mr. McCALLEN moved to strike out t “two” and i insert ‘ 
Lost. 
Sec. 11. Each house may, with the concurrence Br nee 
expel a member &c. ‘3 
Mr. LEMON moved to strike out Boots andi insert : 
majority.” Lost. AF | 
Mr. VANCE moved to insert after “eworthirds” “of all the 
members elect.” Carried. 
Mr. PALMER of Macoupin moved to add: “and ne O 
for such expulsion shall be entered on the journal, with the 
names of members voting for the same.’ Yeas 65 nays 
Carried. ly “ 
Secs. 12, 13, 14 and 15, were eee ihe any amendme oI 


Src. 16. PASSAGE OF BILLS gt, 


Mr. KENNER moved to add, “and no bill shall conte 
without a concurrence of a majority of all the members elec 
from each house.” Yeas 62, nays 28. hae 

No quorum. The committee rose and the chairman repor 
to the Convention that the committee was without a quorum. 

Mr. LOGAN moved that the committee have leave to 
again on Monday. Yeas I00, nays 10. 


4 


XXIII. MONDAY, JULY «, 1847 


y, praying certain reforms in the Legislative Department; 
1 were referred to the committee on that department. 

_ And, also, a petition from the same source, praying the election 
istrict attorneys, &c., by the people. Referred to committee 


Also, a petition, from the same source, praying the abolition 
“eee commissioners’ courts. 


JERSON, and Mr. Davis of Melcan, presented ances. 
ying the appointment of a State school superintendent. 
ferred to committee on Education. 

‘Mr. VERNOR presented petitions from citizens of Washington 
in relation to naturalization of foreigners. Referred to 
mittee on Bill of [Rights.] 

r. SCATES moved that the Convention resolve itself into 
mn biietoc of the whole on the report of the committee on the 
gislative Department. 
_ The Convention then resolved itself into committee of the 
iole—Mr. Z. Casey in the Chair. The question pending when 
he Committee rose on Friday was on the amendment to the 16th 
ion of the referred article, and being taken was decided in the 
‘mative. 
Sec. 17. All bills for raising revenue shall originate in the 
e of Representatives, &c. 
t. CHURCH moved to strike out the section. Lost. 
‘Section 18. Every bill shall be read on three different days in 
ch House, unless in case of urgency, when three-fourths of the 
°) use where such bill is so depending shall deem it expedient to 
spense with this rule; and every bill, having passed both Houses, 


305 


3o6 «ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


shall be signed by the speakers of their respective Houses; and no — 
private or local law which may be passed by the Legislature shall — 
embrace more than one subject, and that shall be expressed in the ‘_ 
title; and no general law shall be in force until published. u) 
Mr. BALLINGALL moved to insert after the words “genera 
law,” the following: “shall contain any matter not pertnen uae 
the title and first section [t]hereof.”’ Lost. ' 
Mr. HOLMES moved to strike out “published” and insert 
“sixty days after its passage.” Lost. a 
Mr. PETERS moved to insert after “Houses,” where it : 
occurs last, “‘nor shall any bill become a law until the same shall 
have been printed for the use of the members.” Lost. 
Mr. KNOX moved to strike out the words “private and 
local; which was carried. 
Mr. WEAD moved to strike out “‘and no general law shall hed q 
in force until published.” And he gave as a reason for this, that — 
the fact of “publication of a law would, hereafter, lead to great 
uncertainty. The motion was afterwards withdrawn. 


LA 
. 


strike out, i was decided in the negative. 

Mr. SINGLETON offered an amendment, which bette! modi 
fied at the suggestion of Mr. Locan, was adopted as follows: 

Strike out all after the word “title,” and insert “and - 
private or public act of the General Assembly shall take effect, 
be in force, until after the expiration of sixty days from the ei 
of the session, at which the same may be passed, unless in case o 
emergency, the Legislature shall otherwise direct, by a vote 
two-thirds of each branch of the Legislature.[”’] 

Mr. THOMAS moved to strike out the words “‘private and. 
Carried. 

SEC. 19. STYLE OF LAW 

No amendment. 

Sec. 20. The sum of two dollars per day, for the first for 
two days’ attendance, and one dollar per day for each da 
attendance thereafter, and ten cents for each necessary mile’s 
travel, going to and returning from the seat of government, shall 


Pot ae A 7) W) i anaes’ whet DAS samase = 3 rus, gf Pe = Ve 


MONDAY, JULY 5, 1847 307 


be SE tlowed to the members of the General Assembly, as a compen- 
; Benon for their services. 


The | committee then rose, and the chairman reported to the 
Convention that the committee was without a quorum. 
__ Mr. Z. CASEY moved a call of the Convention. 

Fx _ Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess suggested that as the object 
a of the call was only for the purpose of ascertaining whether 
"a quorum was present or not, he hoped that the President would 
count the members present. 

_ Mr. CASEY withdrew his call. 

Mr. THOMAS renewed the motion for a call, and it was 
ordered. And one hundred and twenty-eight members answered 

_ to their names. The Convention then resolved itself into a 
committee of the whole—Mr. Casey in the Chair. 

And the question being on striking out, the same was decided 
in the negative—yeas 51, nays 64. 

Mr. CROSS of Winnebago moved to strike out “‘two dollars” 
and insert “not exceeding three dollars.” Lost. 

Mr. SCATES moved to insert before the word “‘attendance,” 
wherever it occurs, “actual;” decided in the negative. 

Mr. WILLIAMS moved to add to the section, “and no more.” 
Carried. 

Mr. ROUNTREE offered an amendment allowing the Speaker 
of the House of Representatives $1 additional pay each day; the 
clerk of the House and secretary of the Senate to be allowed $3 a 
day; the assistant secretaries, door-keepers and engrossing clerks 
$2 per day. 

Mr. LOGAN moved to amend the amendment by allowing the 
Speaker $2 per diem additional. 

Mr. KITCHELL moved the committee rise; decided in the 

_ affirmative—yeas 58, nays 50. The committee rose, reported 
progress, and asked leave to sit again; which was granted. 
And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned. 


bic UNL 


308 ILLIN Ol S HISTORICAL COLLEC rIO. 


AFTERNOON Meade ie 


The Convention met, but few members being prespile a 
was ordered and made; and after the absentees had! Here ag 
called a quorum appeared. 

Mr. THOMAS moved the committee go into colueiende fo) 
whole. Carried, and Mr. Z. Casey was called to the Ch 
The Convention then resumed the consideration of the report 
the committee on the Legislative Department. The que: 
pending was on the amendment proposed by Mr. Locan to 
amendment of Mr. Rountree; and the question was taken ther 
and decided in the negative. . 

Mr. WILLIAMS moved to amend the amendment by stril 
out all except so much thereof as related to the pay of the Spe 
which was adopted—yeas 65, nays 44. 

Mr. SCATES moved to allow the President of the Senate 
same pay as the Speaker of the House of Representatives. 

Mr. McCALLEN moved to insert, after “two dollars a da 
the words, “in gold and silver, or its equivalent;”’ decided i tk 
negative. Yi 
Mr. ADAMS offered, as an sihouel section to be numbe 
21, the following: “The per diem and mileage allowed ea 
member, shall be certified by the Speaker of each House, and s S 
be entered upon the journal.” Carried—yeas 80,nays not cou 

Mr. DEITZ moved to strike out the words “‘ten cents for 
necessary mile’s travel,’ and insert “fifteen cents,” &c. Lo: 

Section 21. No amendment. 

Sec. 22. No senator or representative shall, aan the tim 
for which he shall have been elected, or due one ist a 


of which shall have been increased, during site time. ee 
Mr. WHITESIDE moved to strike out all after oy 
“elected,” where it first occurs, and insert, “be eligible a 
civil office under the authority of this State.” Kid 
Mr. WEAD moved to insert in the amendment, shies . 
office,” “or place of trust;” which amendment was accepted; < 
the question being taken, it was lost. a ae 


MONDAY, JULY 5, 7847 309 


Mr. THORNTON moved to insert, as an additional section, 
the foilowing: “And no person who has been or may be a collector 
or holder of public moneys, shall have a seat in either house of the 
_ General Assembly until such person shall have accounted for, and 
_ paid into the treasury, all sums for which he may be accountable.” 
_ Mr. WEAD moved to insert after the words “civil office,” 
“or place of trust.” Carried. 
Mr. HILL moved to strike out “one year after the expiration 
 thereof.”’ Lost. 
Sec. 23, The House of Representatives shall have the sole 
_ power of impeaching; but a majority of all the members present 
must concur in an impeachment. All impeachments shall be 
___ tried by the Senate; and when sitting for that purpose, the senators 
shall be upon oath, or affirmation, to do justice according to law 
and evidence. No person shall be convicted without the concur- 
rence of two-thirds of all the members present. 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved to strike out the word 
“present” and insert “elected.” Carried. 
ai Mr. SCATES moved to strike out “‘two-thirds,”’ and insert 
ie mmajority: Lost. 
Section 24. No amendment. 
Sec. 25. No judge of any court of law or equity, secretary of 
_ State, attorney general, attorney for the State, register, clerk of 
any court of record, sheriff or collector, member of either House of 
Congress, or person holding any lucrative office under the U. 
_ States or this State, (provided that appointments in the militia, 
__ postmasters, or justices of the peace, shall not be considered lucra- 
tive offices,) shall have a seat in the General Assembly; nor shall 
any person holding any office of honor or profit under the govern- 
ment of the United States, hold any office of honor or profit under 
the authority of this State. 
; Mr. BALLINGALL moved to insert after “shall’’ where it 
_ first occurs, “during the time he shall hold the office, be eligible,” 
mince. Lost. 
Mr. DAVIS of McLean moved to strike out ‘‘Postmasters.” 
Carried. 
Mr. HURLBUT moved to strike out “Register” and insert 
“Recorder.” Adopted. 


310 «ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


Sec. 26. No amendment. i 
Mr. SCATES offered as another section a long series of defi 
powers to be conferred upon the Legislature. He pe briefl 


on the powers of the Legislature, and the question bette taken 
thereon, it was lost. 
Mr. WEAD offered as an additional section the folly: 
The Legislature shall never grant or authorize extra comper 
sation to any public officer, agent, servant or contractor, after t 
service shall have been rendered or the contract entered intc 
Adopted. 
Mr. WILLIAMS moved to re-consider the vote by wh 
Mr. ScaTeEs’ amendment was lost. And the same was re-consid-— 
ered. After a short discussion upon the proper mode of bringing — 
the matter understandingly before the Convention, by Messrs 
Minshall, Servant, Peters, and Davis of Massac the propo 
section was withdrawn. 
Mr. HARVEY moved to add “that the Legislature shall ney 
have power to appropriate more than ————— dollars for con 
tingent expenses.” Lost. 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon offered | as an addition section 
the following: t 
The General Assembly shall direct in what manner suits may k b 
brought against the State; and no claim against the State st al 
be allowed until proven and established before some tibunal: anc 
afterwards approved by the Legislature. sy 
Mr. KITCHELL moved to strike out all after the word ¢ 
“tribunal,” which was decided in the negative; and then t 
proposed section was adopted. 
Sections 28 and 29. No amendments. 
Sec. 30. The General Assembly shall have no power tay 
authorize, by private or special law, the sale of any lands or other © 
real estate belonging in whole or in part to any minor or 
minors, or other person or persons, who may at any time be under 
any legal disability to act for themselves. 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved to strike out all ait 
the words “in whole or in part to any,” and insert “individuals, 
and the amendment was adopted. ae 


MONDAY, JULY 5, 7847 Bit 


Src. 31. The General Assembly shall have no power to sus- 
pend any general law for the benefit of any particular individual, 
nor to pass any law for the benefit of individuals inconsistent with 
the general laws of the land; nor to pass any law granting to any 
individual or individuals rights, privileges, immunities, or exemp- 
tions, other than such as may be, by the same law, extended to 
any member of the community who may be able to bring himself 
within the provisions of such law; nor shall the Legislature pass 
any law whereby any person shall be deprived of his life, liberty, 
property, or franchises, without trial and judgment. 

Mr. BUTLER moved to insert after the word “individual,” 
where it first occurs in the section, “‘corporations or associations.” 
Lost. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved to insert after “indi- 
vidual” where it first occurs, “‘nor to pass any law authorizing any 
proceeding in any court affecting the property or rights of any 
individuals other than is allowed under the general laws of the 
State.” Yeas 62, nays 41; no quorum voting. By unanimous 
‘consent a second vote was taken and the amendment was adopted. 

Mr. SCATES moved to strike out all after the words “‘provi- 
sions of such law.” Before any question was taken thereon 
Mr. GeppEs moved that the committee rise, and ask leave to sit 
again; which motion was granted, and the committee rose, the 
chairman reported progress and asked leave to sit again; which 
was granted. 

Mr. SCATES moved that certain amendments to the report 
of the Legislative committee, be laid on the table and printed; 
which motion was agreed to. 


And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned till to-morrow 
ato A. M. 


XXIV. TUESDAY, JULY 6, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. Dresser. 
Mr. ROBBINS presented a petition of sundry. Ciuc 
Randolph county, praying the exemption of a homestead 
execution; referred to the committee on Law Reform. =—— 
Mr. SERVANT presented a petition of sundry citize 
Kaskaskia in relation to certain commons granted to. 
Referred to a select committee of five. “f 
Mr. WEAD presented a petition of 62 citizens ey Fu 
county, praying the appointment [of] a State superintenden 
Education; referred to the committee on Education. 
The PRESIDENT laid before the Convention a commu 
tion from the Auditor of Public Accounts, in reply to a resol 
of the Convention, requiring information of the amount of r: 
since 1839, with reports from the clerks of 17 counties. = 
Mr. THOMAS moved that the report and accompany 
documents be laid on the table and 500 copies printed. = 
Mr. KITCHELL suggested that the report and abba 
referred to the committee on Revenue, for the age 


a 
nt 


sented ‘the report of the majority of the committee; aoa 
he moved be laid on the table and 200 copies be pre a 


Banxks—INcCORPORATIONS 
Majority Report 
ARTICLE—————__ CORPORATIONS. 


Sec. 1. Corporations not possessing banking powers or 
leges may be formed under general laws, but shall not be ¢ 
by special acts except for municipal purposes, and in cases wher 
in the judgment of the Legislature, the objects of the corpot 
cannot be attained under general laws. ; 

312 


TUESDAY, JULY 6, 1847 313 


_ Sec. 2. Dues from corporations, not possessing banking 
powers or privileges, shall be secured by such individual liabilities 
of the corporators, or other means, as may be prescribed by law. 
Sec. 3. No State bank shall hereafter be created, nor shall 
ie the State own, or be liable for, any stock in any corporation or 
joint stock association for banking purposes. 
Sec. 4. No banking powers or privileges shall be granted either 
_ by general or special acts of incorporation, unless directed by the 
Ys _ people of the State as hereinafter provided. 
_ Sec. 5. The Legislature may, at any session, but not oftener 
' than once in four years, direct the vote of the people to be taken, 
on the day of the general election, for or against the absolute pro- 
___ hibition contained in the fourth section of this article, six months’ 
notice having first been given; and if a majority voting shall decide 
against the prohibition contained in the said fourth section, the 
_ Legislature may authorize the forming of corporations or associa- 
__ tions for banking purposes by general acts of incorporations, upon 
_ the following conditions: 
+ tst. No law shall be passed sanctioning in any manner, 
directly or indirectly, the suspension of specie payments. 
2d. Ample security shall be required for the redemption, in 
_ specie, of all bills and notes put in circulation as money, and a 
__ registry of all such bills and notes shall be required. 
ji 3d. The stockholders in every corporation and joint stock 
association for banking purposes issuing bank notes or any kind 
of paper credits to circulate as money, shall be individually re- 
sponsible to the amount of their respective share or shares of stock 
in any such corporation or association for all its debts and liabili- 
ties of every kind. 
4th. In case of insolvency of any bank or banking association, 
the bill holders shall be entitled to preference in payment over all 
_ other creditors of such bank or association. 
sth. Non-payment of specie shall be a forfeiture of all bank- 
ing rights and privileges, and the Legislature shall not have power 
to remit the forfeiture or relieve from any of its consequences; and 
provision shall be made by law for the trial, in a summary way,by 
the judicial tribunals, of all contested questions of forfeiture of 
banking privileges. 


i 


314 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS by % 


Sener al or peeved may at any time be altered, pele o 
pealed, and all general acts granting corporate powers of any | 
other than for municipal purposes may at any time be alter 
amended or repealed. But such alteration, amendment or repr 
shall, unless the right to make the same be reserved, operate P 
pectively. 

Mr. HARVEY, from the same committee, reported 
sundry resolutions, (Mr. Pratt’s resolutions,) in relation 
provision to be inserted in the constitution, that all contra 
based upon paper currency shall be void, and asked leave to be« 
charged from the further consideration of the same. Concurred 

Mr. KINNEY of St. Clair presented a report from t 
minority of the committee on Incorporations. 

Minority Report 


) 2 

Sec. 1. No corporate body shall be hereafter created. 
newed, or extended, within this State; with banking or discou 
ing privileges. A 
Src. 2. Corporations shall not be created in this State 
special laws, but the Legislature shall provide by general 
uniform laws, under which corporations, or associations of persons 
may be formed, and not otherwise, except corporations with b: 


State, any bill, check, ticket, certificate, or other paper, or t 
paper of any bank or its branches, or any evidence of debt, i 
ed to circulate as money. 
Sec. 4. No branch, or agency, of any bank or bomen 
tution in the United States, or any State or Territory, withi 
without the United States, shall be established or mainta 
within this State. ee 


resulting therefrom. 
On motion ordered that 1,000 copies be printed. 


TUESDAY, JULY 6, 1847 315 


Mr. HARVEY, from the committee on Incorporations, to 
_ whom had been referred various propositions in relation to banks, 
reported the same back to the Convention, and asked to be dis- 


: charged from the further consideration of them. Concurred in. 


Mr. JENKINS, from the committee on the Division of the 


__ State into Counties, and the Organization thereof, made a report, 
_ which was laid on the table and 500 copies ordered to be printed. 


Mr. TURNBULL presented a report of the minority of the 
same committee, which was laid on the table and ordered to be 


printed with the other. 


Mr. JENKINS, from the same committee, made a report in 


accordance with certain instructions from the Convention, and 


recommended that the same be not adopted. Ordered that 500 
copies be printed. 

Mr. JENKINS offered a resolution of inquiry; referred to the _ 
committee on Judiciary. 

Mr. LOGAN moved the Convention resolve itself into commit- 
tee of the whole. And the Convention went into committee of 
the whole—Mr. Woopsown in the chair, and resumed the considera- 
tion of the report of the Legislative committee. The question 


' pending at the time of adjournment yesterday was on the striking 


out of the latter clause of the 31st section, all after the words 
“such law.” 

Mr. HARVEY advocated the motion to strike out, on the 
ground that the clause as it stood now would effectually deprive 
the State of the power to sell land for unpaid taxes. He contended 
that if this were done, the State would be deprived of one of her 
main sources of revenue; and of the only means of collecting taxes 
due by non-resident landholders. 

Mr. WILLIAMS followed in opposition to the motion. He 
thought that the introduction of the question of tax upon land, 
into the question was unnecessary and uncalled for. He thought 
the only proper question was, should the Legislature have power 
to pass laws whereby a man’s liberty or property could be taken 
away, without first obtaining for that law the sanction and 
approval of the judicial branch of the government. This was 
secured by the words “‘a trial of judgment,” now proposed to be 
stricken out. He then went into an elaborate discussion of the 


316 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION 


nature and propriety of selling a man’s property ‘to pay 
thereon; thus depriving and disseizing a man of his freehold, wit 
out a (at and judgment of a court; which he said was in violatic 
of the great fundamental Uinehitten of our government. 
pointed out the great length the courts of Illinois had gone te 
sustaining tax titles, and the unjust and unrighteous consequent 
thereof upon the land owner. . 
Mr. LOGAN opposed not only the last clause, but the ne 
section. Its language was new, and unfamiliar to the courts ar 
to the people; it could not be so readily understood as the old, lo: 
known and sufficient language contained in the bill of rights. 
thought we would be going too far in thus binding and prohibiti 
the Legislature from doing anything which that section might 
construed to embrace. 
He then explained at some length, the clause SE to 
stricken out, and said that the words “the Legislature shall r 
pass any law whereby any person shall be depres of his 


might. be) by attachment. He argued for some time on the in 
convenience and disadvantages of such a law. He put this ca: 
among many others: that no man could be put in jail upon 
charge, and detained there for a moment, without depriving 
of his liberty. Now, the clause proposed to be stricken out, 
no man could be deprived of his liberty without a “‘trial an 
judgment;’’-and how, he asked, was this to be done. How coul 
a man have a “trial and judgment,” be tried and adjud 
unless he appear and be tried. He proposed that in the bi 
rights, and not in this article of the constitution, there shoul 
inserted the well known provision, found in all constitutions 
taken from Magna Charta, that “no man should be deprive 
his life, liberty, &c., unless by a trial of his peers and the la 
the land.” After entering into the bearing this clause had wi 
the question of a sale of land for unpaid taxes, he no that 

whole section be stricken out. , 


TUESDAY, JULY 6, 1847 317 


_ Mr. PALMER of Macoupin was in favor of the section 
remaining as it had been reported by the committee. He thought 
a ‘that the provisions in the first part of the section, were wise, and 
F ‘should be adopted; and the mere fact of their not being in familiar 
inguage was not sufficient for him to vote against them. He 


in some other part of the constitution. 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said that at first he was in favor 


_ how in opposition to that motion. He was wholly opposed to 
' striking out the first part of the section, where it prohibits the 
"suspension of general laws for the benefit and convenience of private 
individuals; and put to the Convention an example of its operation. 
_- He said the Legislature had been for many sessions beset by appli- 
_ cations for extension of time to sheriffs and collectors, in which to 
make their returns. In one case in his county the time had been 
extended to a sheriff, and that extension had released his sureties, 
and now the same man was more unable to account with the State, 
than he was at the time of the suspension. He was also opposed 
to the passage of any special law, suspending general laws for the 
benefit of any individual. He did not care much whether the 
provision should be retained in this article, but he desired it should 
_ be somewhere in the constitution. 
* Mr. WEAD said, that he had known for years, and had heard 
_ and witnessed much of the extraordinary ingenuity of the gentle- 
_ man from Sangamon, and the influence he exerted over men’s 
_ minds by his perseverance and ingenuity where he had some 
particular object to carry. He never dreamed that any member 
__ of the Convention could be induced to reject the section, until he 
heard the argument of that gentleman, and remembered his great 
talent in carrying out his views, and accomplishing what he under- 
_ takes by special and ingenious argument. He says that this pro- 
vision is contained in new language and difficult to understand; 
that it will lead to confusion and chaos in the interpretation of it 
__ by courts of law; that it cannot be comprehended unless it shall 
_ be passed on by courts of law. Mr. W. read the clause: “Shall 


318: ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI 


not suspend any general law for the benefit of any parti 
individual.’’ Cannot this be understood by any man? Doe 
require a court of justice to pass on this to enable the gentlema 
from Sangamon to understand it? We all know the gentleman 
ability to comprehend such things, and measuring this langu 
by the gentleman’s ability to understand, must we not believe 
that he can understand it without the aid of a court of justice 

We must come to that conclusion. Now, sir, if he can and do 
understand its meaning, and advocates that it be stricken ou 
should we not infer that he is opposed to the restriction, and 1 
favor of granting the power to the Legislature to create lav 
bestowing this evil of special privileges? Does he understand th 
clause, or is he in favor of granting the power? On which hor 
of the dilemma is he? Mr. W. read the next clause: “Nor to 
pass any law for the benefit of individuals inconsistent with the | 
laws of the land.” Is there anything in this difficult to be undet- 
stood? Cannot the gentleman from Sangamon understand thi 
plain language of that clause, or is he in favor of leaving with the - 
Legislature the power which this clause prohibits? What is it ; 
but a prohibition against the granting to one man privileges and — 
powers not conferred or enjoyed by all. The same argument will 
apply to the whole of the first part of the section. He then came 
to the last part of the section: “Nor shall the Legislature pas K 
any law whereby any person shall be deprived of his life, liberty r 
property or franchises, without trial and judgment.” 
heard the able and ingenious argument of the gentleman agai 
this section, and upon its effect upon the titles to land derr 
under tax sales, and notwithstanding their ability, &c. he wo 
attempt to answer them. He said that in other States it 
been over and again decided that no man should be disseized of h 
freehold and his land sold except on a judgment of law; that t 
had decided that no land should be sold for non-payment of taxes ~ 
except on a judgment. But the supreme court of Illinois | 
decided otherwise. Here was a great difference in opinion upo 
great principle of right, and in judicial interpretation of the pox 


TUESDAY, JULY 6, 1847 319 


a view to preserve, inviolate, the right of property. It is said that 


the question is, shall land be sold for taxes or not? That, said 


Mr. W., is not the question. If I understand the provision now 


before us, or the views of the honorable author of it, the question 


is, shall land be sold for taxes without having first a judgment? 
_ Mr. W. then went into an inquiry of the nature of the titles by 
which the greater part of the land in the military tract were held, 
and advocated the adoption of the clause proposed to be stricken 
out, because it would require a judgment before a sale of property. 
He cited several cases showing where this provision would operate 
advantageously.—Without concluding, he gave way to a motion 
that the committee rise. 

The committee rose, reported progress and asked leave to sit 
again. : 

The Convention then, on motion, adjourned till 3 p. m. 


AFTERNOON 


The Convention met, no quorum appearing, on motion, a call 
of the Convention was ordered. After a quorum appeared and 
further proceedings were dispensed with, 

Mr. MARKLEY moved the Convention resolve itself into 
committee of the whole—Mr. Woopson in the chair, and resumed 
the consideration of the report of the committee on the Legislative 
Department. 

Mr. WEAD resumed his remarks. He denied that it would 
be more difficult to overturn or set aside a deed given under a sale 
_ after judgment, than it would be under a deed without a judgment, 
and as had been previously the case in this State. He proceeded 
to give a history of the various laws passed by the Legislature in 
relation to taxes. In 1823 the first law was passed for the sale of 
land for taxes. It required that, before the sale, they should be 
advertised, and then the Auditor might go on and sell them without 
any judgment. That law said the Auditor’s deed should convey 
a perfect title to the purchaser, no matter how it had been adver- 
tised, or whether anything had been done according to law. The 
deed was sufficient—it conveyed a perfect title. In 1827 this law 
was changed. It required the land to be advertised in a particular 
manner, but when the Auditor gave a deed, it vested in the 


tax payer without any trial or judgment. Our courts a 

formly decided that the mere deed shall be full and conclu 
evidence of title, without requiring any proof of the exe 
of the deed, or of any of the pre-requisite facts, mentioned 


Pee &c. And in 1839 the legislature passed a 10% s 
that a judgment should be had before a sale of a man’s prop 
But our supreme court said, that the provision, said to be in t 
Magna Charta, did not apply to such cases, as the deed w 
patent. Mr. W. then read from the law of 1839, the various | 
which the tax deed shall be conclusive evidence of, and throw 
upon the man claiming the property under the original ie 
necessity and difficulty of disproving them. This latter he cor 
tended it was almost impossible to accomplish, in consequenc 
no records being kept by the officers, of those transactions, neces 
for him to make out his case. He contended that the po 
all legislation in this State, from 1823, had been to make 
deeds the strongest kind of titles, and conclusive evidence 
facts necessary to establish them. But the supreme court had 
length decided that.a judgment was necessary, and then a law ve 
passed requiring a judgment. ; 
Before this law the deed of the Auditor was omnipo 
changed a man’s property at once; now you must first - 
judgment and an execution. It was to secure this, tha 
present provision was inserted; strike it out and you take ay 
last safeguard a man has over his property. In the ct 
Mr. W’.s remarks, he replied to the argument of Mr. 


argued by Mr. L. 
Mr. Logan repeated his former views of the question i in 


TUESDAY, JULY 6, 1847 321 


bearings upon the tax question, and deprecated too much action 
_ on the part of the Convention in providing a remedy and a pro- 
hibition for every imaginary evil. He thought, as has been said, 
_ that all the wisdom of the State had not been exhausted in forming 
_ that Convention, and that we should trust much to the discretion 
and judgment of the Legislatures to come after us. He thought 
that while we were complaining so much of too much legislation, 
there was also a danger of our performing too much constitutioning. 
He said the present provision was in the words “trial and judg- 
ment,” which were very different in their import and effect from 
the former and well known phrase—“trial by his peers and the 
law of the land:’ and he argued at length that the words “law 
of the land” should be inserted after the clause as it now stood; 
or, if the clause were stricken out, that those words, with such 
other provisions as might be deemed necessary, should be inserted 

in the bill of rights. He objected to a prohibition being inserted 

in the constitution restraining the Legislature from suspending 
any general law for the benefit of private individuals. He had 
voted for suspending such laws in more instances than one; and 

if such cases should arise again, and he denied that he could say 
they would not, he would always vote for it. He alluded to the 
cases where the whole American bottom was overflowed by the 
great freshet in ’44, and when the people of that section of the 
country lost everything they had, or only secured so much as to 
enable them to live till such time as they could regain in some 
measure the means of subsistence, then the sheriffs of those 
counties applied to the Legislature for an extension of their time 
for making their returns, because they could not, in many cases, 
collect taxes without seizing upon what little had been spared the 
people by the flood. The Legislature had suspended the law upon 
these circumstances, he had voted for it, and would any man in 
the Convention oppose it, or refuse to grant an extension of the 
time under such terrible and afflicting circumstances? He had 
also voted for an extension of time to collectors and sheriffs when 
the offices in which their books and accounts had been kept were 
destroyed by fire, and they were unable to account with the Audi- 
tor. He pointed out that under this section no charters could be 
granted to individuals to construct railroads or any other kind of 


322: ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


improvement, for if they did it was conferring upon age persons” 
chartered privileges which other persons did not enjoy.*° ta 
Mr. PALMER of Macoupin said he could not see the: great { 
difficulties in this section which had been pointed out by the 
gentlemen, and which they had discovered to be so alarming. an 
The language appeared plain to him and not in anyway to be — 
misunderstood. It was a prohibition against special laws and 
a suspension of general laws for the benefit of particular individuals. 
He thought the cases mentioned by the gentleman last up—the 
cases of the flood—and of fire, might be provided for by a general 
law, giving the Legislature a power under certain circumstances | 
which would enable them to meet these cases. It had been said 
that this prohibition would put an end to all railroads bein 
constructed by private individuals. Now, when an object can be 
obtained by a general law, as well as by special laws, general laws 
should be adopted. Suppose a law be passed that A. and B. shall — 
have the privilege of constructing a railroad from Alton to Spring-_ 
field, it is a special law, and the same object can be obtained by a ~ 
general law, that any person may construct that road, thu 
bringing all persons who have the means of bringing themselves 
within the provisions of the law, into competition and permitting 
them to make the road. 
Mr. THOMAS. Will the gentleman show me how a man can, 4 
under a general law, obtain an exclusive privilege? be. 
Mr. PALMER. Suppose the gentleman and I are desirous: y 
to have a certain quarter section of land, and we both start to. 
night to Edwardsville for that purpose; I arrive there first an 
‘have the land entered in my name. I thus, under a general law ~ 
obtain a peculiar special privilege and right in that land, to the 
exclusion of every one else. I hope the gentleman considers 
himself answered. I obtain this right under no special act, but 
simply from superiority of speed with which I started. This same 
rule, if applied to railroads, would be found to act as well; for it ‘4 
would then enable every man, with means, to enter into the 
business. ; 
Mr. WILLIAMS made some remarks in reply to shiek had 


M 
is 
a 


309A longer account of Logan’s speech may be found in the Sangamo 
Journal, July 15. 


i, 
: 
4 
A 
a 
: 


TUESDAY, JULY 6, 1847 323 


the retention of the last clause. He also alluded further to the 

question. The question was then taken on the motion to strike 

out the whole question, and decided in the negative. 

The question was taken on the motion to strike out the last 
_ section, and decided in the negative. 

Mr. WILLIAMS moved to add to the section the following 

a words: “in court, provided nothing herein contained shall prevent 

the passage of any law for seizing and holding persons or property 

by mesne process until such trial can be had.” 

Mr. HARVEY moved to insert after the words “trial and 

_ judgment” the words “‘or law of the land.’’ And the question 

_ being taken on the last amendment, it was decided in the negative 
—yeas 46, nays 63. 

Mr. THORNTON moved to insert after the word “law” where 
it last occurs, “provided the General Assembly shall have power 
to grant such charters of corporation as they deem expedient, and 

not prohibited.” 
; And the question was taken on Mr. WittiaMs’ amendment, 
__ and it was decided in the affirmative. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved that the committee rise. Carried. 

The committee rose, reported progress and had leave to sit 
again. 

Mr. LOGAN asked leave for the ladies of the Episcopal church 
of this city to occupy the Senate chamber on Thursday next. 
Granted. 

The Convention, on a adjourned till to-morrow, at 
g A. M. 


XXV. WEDNESDAY, JULY 7, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Hate. 
Mr. CROSS of Winnebago presented a petition praying the 


appointment of a superintendent of common schools. Referred 


to the committee on Education. 
Mr. HOLMES presented a report from the minority of he 


committee on Military Affairs; read, laid on the table and 200° 


copies ordered to be printed. 

Mr. LOGAN moved the Convention resolve itself into com- 
mittee of the whole. And the Convention went into a committee 
of the whole, and took up the report of the committee on the 
Legislative Department—Mr. Woopson in the chair. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean moved to strike out all after the 
word “‘to,”’ where it first occurs in the section, to the word “pass,” 
where it occurs last. : 


Mr. LOGAN said, he would be glad if some member of the © 4 


y 


committee who had reported this section would explain the 


meaning of the words “‘nor to pass any law granting to any indi- _ 
§ p y § § WA 


viduals rights, privileges, immunities or exemptions other than 


such as may be, by the same law, extended to any member of the ~ 7 


community who may be able to bring himself within fen provisions — 


of such law.” 


Mr. SCATES said, that he would state ae his BL Eh: ; 
standing of the language was. Suppose a railroad was wanted — 


from Alton to the Indiana line, and the Legislature should pass a 
bas <6 ile 
general law authorizing the same, but requiring that a subscription 


should be opened and let every man subscribe to the stock who 


had the means. This would be a law open in its privileges to all 
who had the means of bringing themselves within the provisions 
of the law, and not a special charter to a few individuals. The 
language of the section is to prohibit special acts of incorporations. 
If gentlemen will understand it all, it means then all these things 
are to be accomplished by general laws, instead of special acts of 


legislation. He was not opposed to the Legislature passing laws 


324 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 7, 1847 325 


allowing persons to make roads or canals, but he wanted those 
laws to be general in their nature and not special. He alluded at 
some length to the great cost which it had been to the State in 
consequence of these acts of special legislation being continually 
before the Legislature and the great amount of time wasted in 
their deliberation. 

Mr. LOGAN thought it meant no such thing. He thought it 
offered no check to special charters of incorporation by the Legis- 
lature. As to the case of the railroad subscription, that case did 
not come under the language of this section, for if a charter of in- 
corporation, granting certain rights, privileges and immunities to 
those who subscribe, were passed by the Legislature, those only 
then who first subscribed, would be entitled to the rights, benefits 
&c., for no one else can bring themselves within the provisions of 
the law after the stock is taken. Does this prevent special 
charters? Suppose the Legislature should grant an act of incor- 
poration to the Chairman and Judge Scates, to make a road—no 
one can bring himself within the provisions of the law, but those 
two; it is then left with the Legislature to say who shall bring 
themselves “within the provisions of the law.” This would be 
nothing more than a special act of incorporation. He did not 
desire this kind of provision, if gentlemen desired that no special 
charters should be granted, why not say so plainly, in language 
which every man could understand; and leave out these ambiguous 
terms. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean said, he had made the motion to strike 
out for a two-fold purpose. No one could foresee the great diffi- 
culties which this ambiguous language contained in this section 
would cause hereafter, and would throw in the way of private 
relief, in meritorious cases, by the Legislature. The case men- 
tioned yesterday of the suspension of the time for a sheriff’s return 
in consequence of the great freshet in ’44 was conclusive to 
his mind, and should be so to all. He objected to the binding 
down of the Legislature by constitutional provisions, against 
granting any relief from a general law in meritorious cases. He 
protested against the wholesale abuse that gentlemen were con- 
tinually throwing upon the past legislatures of the country. They, 
it might be, had done wrong, but they were not to blame, they 


326 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS _ 


represented public opinion and were driven by the force of that — 
public opinion into what they had done. He did not desire to see — 
incorporated into the constitution any provision which shall require _ 
legislation and judicial interpretation upon it. If gentlemen 
desired to say that no special charters should be granted, let them 
come out and gay so in terms that any man can understand. 


uectlens except the words “such as may be able to bring thea 
selves within the provisions of the general law;” for he did not 
believe there was a man in the State who was unable to avail him- ~ 
self of the privileges of a general law. Gentlemen saw something 
important in this provision; it was full of meaning. Why should a ‘ 


general law be suspended for the benefit of a private indie inate 


was left to the Legislature. They say this provision will weal ah 
the making of any more rai/roads through the State! lathe 4 
think and feel that this provision will act on their favorite—the 4 
bank question! And so it does, sir; and for that very reason I will — 
vote against striking out. This section is full of meaning. Sup- 
pose we reverse its language, and let it read, the Legislature shall — 
have power to suspend general laws for the benefit of private — 
individuals. It would then be easily understood by the cen 
and it may be as easily understood in its present shape. He said, 


> 


it interfered with the primary arrest of persons charged with 
crime, &c., but as that had been amended he would vote for it. 

Mr. SCATES still could not see any objections to the section, — 
as had been argued by the gentlemen. If those gentlemen who 
think it does not prevent special charters and special legislation 
would vote for it he would be satisfied. The cases put yesterday, 
where a suspension had been made, could be provided for in ~~ 
another section; they could insert a power in the constitution, that 
the Legislature could, in case of the destruction of a sheriff’s books 
by fire, extend the time for that officer’s accounting, to the next 
session of the Legislature. He pointed out many cases where 
losses had occurred by an extension of time to these officers, and 
the releasing thereby of their sureties. He objected to the many 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 7, 1847 327 
ae 
reprimands that had been delivered to him in consequence of his 
_ having spoken of the evils of past legislation, and because he had 
. endeavored to have adopted certain necessary remedies of the 
_ evil, and guards against a recurrence of it. The people had called 
this Convention to remedy that evil, and their representatives 
_ should be heeded when they asked that these things should be 
done. If everything was to be left open for the patriotism, dis-_ 
cretion, and purity of future legislatures, it would be better to have 
__noconstitution. But the people required a constitution and that 
in it the powers of the Legislature should be limited, and the evils 
of past legislation remedied. 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac said, that various opinions had been 
_ expressed as to the meaning and proper interpretation of these 
"provisions in this section. He was firmly of the opinion that 
nothing contained in it prohibited, but authorized, a general 
_ banking system, and this he was sure was not contemplated by 

the gentleman from Jefferson. 

Mr. SCATES said, that he supposed there would be other 
provisions in the constitution upon the subject of banks, and had 
no thought of it in respect to this section. 

Mr. DAVIS. It is thought by many that these provisions will 
restrain the acts of the Legislature, and to prevent the General 
Assembly from passing acts which tend to impair the public good. 
He did not entertain a doubt but that they authorized a general 
banking system, and that every man who could bring himselt 
within the provisions of the law, will be entitled to enter into that 

_ system. If he thought it would prohibit such a thing he would 
vote for it; but believing that it would allow that system, he would 

_ vote against it and for striking it out. He was extremely sorry 
. to differ from the gentleman from Jefferson, but he felt satisfied 
that if that gentleman would give the subject some consideration 

-- and mature reflection, he would come to the same conclusion. He 
was in favor of a single, plain provision, that the Legislature should 
grant no special charters or acts of incorporation, and would prefer 

it to one which will lead to so much difficulty, debate, and strife, 

as this provision would when it came to be acted on by the Legis- 
lature.—He had a different opinion in relation to the duties and 
objects of this Convention than that entertained by some gentle- 


ned Re | 
wes 
“te y 


328 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


men. He thought they had not come there for the sole purpose 
of saving a few dollars, but for the nobler and higher object of 
making an organic law of the land, which was to govern the peop 
and secure them the greatest prosperity. Government should be 
so established as to give it the power to do everything necessar 
for the public good; and he thought we should not restrict the ~ 
Legislature within limits too narrow to enable them in all cases to 
act for the good of all the people. 

He had no doubt but that this provision will authorize general 
banking throughout the State; he was satisfied that this will be 
the undoubted and a enene common sense—interpretation : 
that will be placed upon it. Is the gentleman from Jefferson — 
ready to go for it after having declared banks of every description 4 
a curse upon the land? He thought that when gentlemen under-_ 
stood this, the provision would not have so many advocates. q 

He asked, is it prudent to divest the Legislature of all power? ¥ 
He thought more evil would result from this prohibition, than | ' 
would if the whole matter was left open. He explained the forcel 
of it, under the interpretation which he said would certainly be \ 
placed upon it, to be: A and B are authorized to bank, &c., and 
any man who can bring himself within the provisions of the ithe is-f 
authorized to carry on banking, this would be the sure and positive 
result. Is there anything in this section providing that A and B 
shall not be incorporated? Not a word. Again, any man who ~ 
can subscribe to stock in a railroad company, brings himself — 
within the provisions of the law, and there is no preventive against 
such incorporations, and thus are brought about the very conse- 
quences which the gentleman from Jefferson has opposed, and ~ 
again will the prosperity of the State be blasted and destroyed.— ~ 
It was his serious conviction that it would be better to leave the ~ 
constitution as it is, than to have any provision which will author- 
ize a general banking system, allowing the creation of these 
monsters all over the State, leaving its impress on the prosperity — 
of the people forever.*! 

Mr. WILLIAMS said, he was not present at the meeting of 
the committee when the section now before the Convention was 


3A longer account of ie ea by Davis (of Massac) may be oa in 
the Sangamo Journal, July 15 


SS ee Oe ee 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 7, 1847 329 


_ adopted. He felt more interest in the principle contained in the 
- last clause, and in committee he brought it forward, and the 
_ committee tacked it on the end of the section. That matter 
having been settled, he thought that the first provisions of the 
a section ought to be stricken out. It would be remembered that 
__ hehad not advocated the first part of the section, but had confined 
’ himself to the latter clause. Let those, said he, who are in favor 
of such a provision and prohibition go to work and make up some- 
_ thing and have it inserted, in some less ambiguous terms, in the 
_ bill of rights, or some other part of the constitution; and not have 
this section burdened with language and provisions so ambiguous 
in their expression as to lead to much difficulty hereafter, and to 
so many different interpretations. 

Mr. POWERS said, he was a member of the committee, and 
Was present when this part of the section was adopted. The 
committee thought it proper to guard against a suspension of 
general laws for the benefit of private individuals; but for one, he 
was satisfied that the case mentioned yesterday by the gentleman 
from Sangamon, in relation to the suspension in favor of the 
sheriffs of that part of the State which had suffered so much from 
the great rise in the river, showed conclusively that cases might 

_ arise when such suspensions would be just and proper. He did 
not see, however, that under the second provision of the section 
that the Legislature would have the power to authorize general 
banking. That provision, in his opinion, would defeat all special 
charters; and if any doubt was entertained the other provisions 
in the constitution, in relation to that subject, would settle the 
matter. 

Mr. HARVEY said, that on yesterday he was in favor of the 
first part of the section, but now he was ready to vote against all 
of it, and would state his reasons. There were many in the Con- 
vention who were in favor of a prohibition against banks, to be 
inserted in the constitution. Now, if he understood the gentleman 
from Massac, general banking might be established under this 
section, and for that reason he would vote against the section. If 
he (Mr.H.) wasin favor of a general banking system he would vote 
against the section, and if opposed to such a system he would 
vote against the section. It was too ambiguous and indefinite, 


POS dak cae 


_ this sentence, and therefore thinks no one else can unders 


the principle be stated plainly, and not shelter the apse yeh 
a provision couched in ambiguous language. The prohibi 
and the anti-prohibitionist, each, see their object in this se 
it blows hot, and it blows cold, Brit he thought that it would 
found to blow neither. Now, if this section came to be pas: od 
by the judiciary what would be the decision? If the gentlen 
from Jefferson was the judge of the supreme court, we should f 
a total prohibition interpretation; if the gentleman from Sangan 
was the judge, we would have a general banking interpretati 
for he believed that both of these gentlemen have one a 
true opinions on the subject. 


a man to establish a ferry on our rivers, because every man h: 
not the same right; and he asked, were they prepared to say 
should have no ferries because their owners enjoyed rights 
enjoyed by all? 

Mr. SERVANT was of opinion that this provision wa ; 
little understood, either by its friends or opponents, and it 
minded him of an anecdote told of an Irishman, who was as! 
what was the meaning of metaphysics. He replied, “whe: 


tion to the provision was its ambiguity. So far as tha 
concerned he thought it plain enough to be understood by any o 
who was disposed to do so, and he would say to the gent 
from Knox that he, hor any of those “fifty-eight” with whor 


fight behind any ambiguity; they sought no cowardly 1 me 
accomplish their ends; they desired to fight no bush fight. 
the gentleman’s position could be compared with that of a 
who came into town one day, very drunk, and sat down in 
street, declaring that the whole town was drunk and he only sobs 
so with the gentleman from Knox, he cannot see the meant: 


it. He thinks everybody else is drunk and does not see hi 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 7, 1847 331 


1 some other part of fg constitution, im some other section, 
be inserted a aries. in relation to incorporations; and 


tha ‘express provision on i particular subject? It is a well 
lished legal rule, that where there is any provision in a law 
and plain upon any particular subject, that any other section, 
a, if it stood alone, might have a bearing upon that subject, 
mot affect the question as settled in the section upon the 
ar subject. Now, the questions of ferries and banks, if we 
de for them specially, will not in any way be affected by any 
mg this section may have upon those subjects. Again, 
spose we say that nothing contained in this section shall have 
reference to the subject of banks or ferries, would it not be 
mitted that such a declaration would obviate the difficulty? 
fell, if a well established legal principle of interpretation 
las the same effect, then the objections of the gentleman from 
jox, from Massac, and from Sangamon and other objectors fall 
the ground. The gentleman from Randolph has, as we some- 
aes say, taken water; he says this section may be perverted to 
t purposes than intended by the committee or the Convention. 
= committee who reported this section, knew that the subjects 
Masks and incorporations had been referred to another com- 
ere. and supposed that a provision would be reported to be 
srted in the constitution, which wouldsettle the matter. Mr. P. 
again repeated that the “fifty-eight,” were no bush fighters, and 
u _ would be found ready to meet their opponents on the subject of 
banks, in a fair and open field. 
: ‘eg LOGAN said, he had taken the meaning he placed on 
eK 


provisions from the gentleman from Jefferson, who said it 
was to prevent special charters; but it appeared that even the 
friends of the section were not of one opinion as to its meaning. 
me ‘He said he believed the interpretation of the gentleman from 
-Macoupin was the correct one. But there was no general law 
os would not have to be suspended in some cases, or acts should 
“ae passed which would protect certain persons; for instance, the 
Judges of our courts should be privileged from arrest, the members 


332 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI NS 


of the Lesa jurors and witnesses, while in atten 
should be privileged from arrest. These persons all en 
rights, privileges and immunities not enjoyed by the res 


community. Would any man be in favor of depriving thos 


arrested and taken away, and a man might lose his case in. 
quence. These were cases, and there were many others > 
this section did not provide for, and which would be defeated 
it allowed to pass. 

Mr. SCATES explained vies his interpretation of the si 
was—to prevent special legislation—and renewed his oprs 
to the motion to strike out. 

Mr. KNOWLTON said, he was sick of this 31st section. 
had heard all that had been said upon it and his opinions hac 
been changed in anywise. He did not understand the secti 
first nor did he now. Organic law should be plain in its provisi 
so plain that all might understand it clearly; there should 
ambiguity in its language. If the object was to prevent s 
legislation, let the section read—“‘there shall be no special 
tion” and then we would know what we were speaking abo 1 
The gentleman from Macoupin was uncharitable to those ~ 
could not comprehend this section, and he had compared tl 
with the drunken man who thought all others were drunk and - e 
alone sober. He (Mr. K.) would inform the gentlemen that if. th 
were drunk on this question they had used a little better 4 ic 
than had John Thompson. 

Mr. THORNTON withdrew his amendment. ~ 


[Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon said that his desire w 
avoid all i inconsistency, and to prevent the possibility of any 


by the proposition which he had Sncnded to offer. [Mr. Edw: 
read the proposition referred to.] His proposition was en 
different, he said, from the one now under consideration. I 
vided that no charter of incorporation should be granted, ne 
private act passed, when the object could be as well attained | 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 7, 1847 333 


f , 
te general law. And the proposition went on to provide that no 
private act should be passed at the expense of the State. He held 
that there had been an abuse of this power on the part of the legis- 
_ lature, and he thought that the exercise of the power ought to be 
restrained. It was true that it would have to be left to the dis- 
cretion of the legislature to say what should be considered to be 
an act of public necessity, requiring special legislation, as in the 
regulation of the police of towns, which was now a custom to be 
provided for by general enactment. It had been very properly 
‘said, that it was necessary to restrain legislation in regard to 
private enactments. Nine-tenths of the laws at present passed 
by the legislature, were purely private acts, in which the people 
at large had no interest. His resolution provided that in case of 
the application for the passage of a private act, all the expenses 
attending it should be borne by the party for whose benefit it 
was intended.|*” 


Mr. CALDWELL moved to strike out all between the word 
“exemptions” and the word “nor,” in the last sentence, and to 
insert after the word “pass,” “any special or private.” 

Mr. HAYES thought the question, as it presented itself on 
these two last amendments, was open for a better discussion than 

at any time before, and he hoped gentlemen would express their 
views upon it. 

The question was taken on the motion to insert, and decided 
in the negative; the motion to strike out was also decided in the 
negative. 

The question then was on the motion to strike out the whole 
of the section except part of the last sentence, as made by the 
gentleman from McLean, and being taken separately on each 
paragraph, was decided in the affirmative. 

Mr. GEDDES moved the committee rise. Lost. 

Mr. WILLIAMS moved to add to the section, “‘or for collecting 
taxes by distress and sale‘of personal’ propery without judgment.” 
Carried. 

Mr. HOGUE moved to strike out the whole section as it 
now stood; pending which motion, the committee rose, reported 


* This insertion is taken from the Sangamo Journal, July 15. 


334 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE( 


&c., and had leave to sit again. And then on moti 
tion adjourned to 3 p. m. R. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. Z. CASEY offered the following resolution: 


Resolved, That this Convention will adjourn sine ee poe 
3 Ist inst. 


tee of the whole; decided in the affirmative an ee Cone 
resolved itself into committee of the whole—Mr. Woopson 
chair, resumed the consideration of the 31st section of the | Ye 
of the Legislative committee. ; 

Mr. LOGAN said as this section was a pet ee his. fried 
Adams, who was sick, he hoped it would be laid aside fe 
present. Agreed to. 

Sec. 32. In the year one thousand eight hawdted an fe 
five, and every tenth year thereafter, an enumeration of a 
white inhabitants of this State shall be made, in such manne! 
shall be directed by law; and the number of senators and 1 re 


or districts to be established by law, according to the nu 

white inhabitants. vie 
Mr. MARKLEY moved to amend by inserting after the we 

“law,” where it first occurs, the following: 


year thereafter, the census taken by authority of hi tie 
of the United States, may be adopted by the General a 
the enumeration of this State. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon offered the allowing 
substitute: 


made according to the census, which may be ai 
of Congress, next preceding the making such apporti 
among the several counties or districts to be established b 
in ae to the number of white inhabitants. Rae 


_ WEDNESDAY, JULY 7, 1847 335 


2 to those counties whose population was increasing, 
yocated the amendment first proposed. 
question was taken on we substitute, and the same was 


‘WILLIAMS suggested that under the proposed amend- 
a extra session of the Legislature must be called to appor- 


at and Barremeaic districts shall be composed of 

as territory, bounded by county lines, and only one 
allowed to each senatorial, and not more than three 
nta atives to any one cee district; Provided, that 


in a Boies. bat the ratio of cquteeutivies in cae 
towns shall be equal to one and a half of that required for 
and not more than two Representatives shall be allowed 


rt. NORTHCOTT moved tostrike out “three,” in the pro- 
section, and insert “one.” Lost. 

question was then taken on the section, to the word 
;” and it was adopted—yeas 79, nays 40. 

-MINSHALL moved to strike out “and town,” in the 
pa of the section. Lost. And the question being 


> forming senatorial and representative districts, counties 
taining a m of not more than one-fourth over the 
cist NORM enh soparace districts and the excess shall 
rt gs computed, but shall be added together and given to such 
seni or counties in the same judicial circuit not having a 


336 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Senator or Representative as the case may be, which has 
largest white population. 

Mr. HARDING offered the following as a substitute: ; 

Whenever a county shall be entitled to a separate Senator or 
Representative, and has an excess of population over the existing ‘ 
ratio, such excess, unless it amounts to more than one-fourth of 
such ratio, shall be disregarded; and whenever a county has two 
Representatives, and has an excess, such excess, unless it amounts" f 
to more than one-half the existing ratio, shall be disregarded. a 

Mr. HAYES opposed the substitute as unjust, atrocious and — 
unfair in its provisions, and as depriving one portion of the people 
of the right of representation. He opposed any arbitrary rule, 
which would restrain the people in having their most sacred right 
of representation, and throw away in the apportionment a large 
body of the people. | 

Mr. LOGAN advocated the adoption of the substitute, which 
although it might deprive a fraction of the people of a represen- 
tative, it would also prevent any apportionment for party purposes, — 
by the dominant party in the Legislature. He alluded to the 
apportionment made by the Legislature in 1840, when counties in — 
reference to the state of parties had been tacked together, for the ~ 
purposes of securing a political majority. He cited several cases — 
of this kind, particularly the joining of Randolph and Monrc 
counties. . 

Mr. CALDWELL moved to lay the subsea on the table. 4 

The CHAIR decided the motion out of order. Pe, a 

Mr. CALDWELL said, he would vote against the propositior ad 
and the substitute because he deemed them unjust and oppressive. — 
Unjust because it deprived a part of the people of the right 
representation, and of a sacred franchise. ; 

Mr. SERVANT advocated the substitute, as it prevented s su 
iniquitous and atracious apportionment as had been made by 
Legislature in 1840. He alluded to the case of attaching Randol 
and Monroe, which had been put into one district, for par 
purposes; and that democrats had acknowledged that such was — 
the object. ee 

Mr. HAYES. The secret is out. The object of this rule has — 
been divulged—it is the welfare of the universal whig party! If 4 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 7, 1847 337 


‘ that apportionment was iniquitous, it was in the power of the 
‘Legislature to alter and change it. Mr. H. pursued the subject 
% at some length, and alluded to the fact, that a few days ago the 
_ gentlemen were loud in their condemnation of party spirit in the 
ir ‘Convention, and that they desired it should be dispersed, like the 
_ mists of morning before the rising sun. But now their song had 
\* changed, and their object was to secure whig representatives in 
the Legislature, which might be defeated if this rule was not 
_ adopted—Mr. H. argued at some length on the subject, and in 
‘opposition to a rule which had been admitted to be unjust and 
unfair. 
_ The discussion was continued by Messrs. Davis of Mont- 
_gomery, TuRNBULL, GeDDES, and Locav, in favor of the substitute, 
and in disclaiming for their party, the introduction of party 
spirit; and by Messrs. Brockman, Davis of Massac and Hayes, 
in reply. 
Mr. PALMER of Macoupin agreed with the gentleman from 
Sangamon, that it was right to restrain a dominant party from 
doing evil, but he differed from him in the mode of so doing. 
Not one of the advocates of the rule insisted that the principle 
contained in it was just or correct; they did not deny that it will 
disfranchise part of the people. He had illustrated this same 
thing a few days ago, when the same principle was before them, 
by showing that a county might lack one vote, or a fourth of the 
fraction, and thus lose its representation. The gentlemen from 
Sangamon and Morgan this morning were in favor of leaving the 
legislature unrestrained—of giving them full rope, but now they 
introduce a proposition which they acknowledge is based on a 
false principle, and desire that it be incorporated into the 
Constitution, which will prevent the Legislature from so appor- 
tioning the State as to give all the people a representation. 

Mr. POWERS moved the committee rise and report progress. 
Carried. The committee had leave to sit again; and then, on 
motion, the Convention adjourned. 


La et pf. ee 


Register) in favor of the poll tax—for he took ground in its die 


PNK MG ene, 


XXVI. THURSDAY, JULY 8, 1847 — 
Prayer by the Rev. Mr. Barcer. 


PERSONAL 


Mr. HAYES said, He 
Mr. President, I would ask the attention of the Conventi 


misrepresentation. 

I find in the Shawneetown Gazette, of the 3oth of he 
letter, dated June 17th, 1847, which is known to have be 
written by one of the editors of that paper, occupying a seat « 
this floor by the courtesy of the Convention. In that pie 
besides some comments which I do not purpose to notice at 
time, I find the following passages: “I must, Hisar, a 
Mr. Hayes the advantage of one remark which he made duri 
the course of his speech (which you wil! see reported in th 


But having gone thus far in approving the effort itself, let me now 
introduce for your reflection, one sentiment with which | 
ornamented it. In advancing the opinion that the people of Illinois 
were willing and disposed to pay the tax, he thought it was n 
oppressive upon the poor—the poorer classes owed it as a duty 
their government to submit to this tax—hey now paid no tax 
support the government, (the rich paid it all)—and they ( 
poor) were therefore a parsimony upon the bounty of the rich.” 
much of this letter as purports to be a report of the remarks w 
I made upon the poll tax, is an entire misrepresentation, both 
my language and its spirit. I did not discriminate invidious 
between different portions of our people. I did not say, “the 
(the poor) now paid no tax to support the government, the rich 
paid it all.”’ I did not use the language, printed in italics, “ 

(the poor) were, therefore, a parsimony upon the bounty of the 
rich.’ Nor did I use any expression which could be construed — 
into such ridiculous nonsense. The obvious effect of this letter is 


338 


THURSDAY, JULY 8, 1847 339 


to create the impression that my speech was an abusive harangue 
_ against poor men. 

It is true I have never played the demagogue or claimed to be 
__ the especial champion of the poor, either on this floor or elsewhere; 
_ but i submit it to every member of this Convention whether I 
have at any time ridiculed poverty. I have experienced its dis- 
_ tresses, and know how to sympathize with those who suffer them, 
_ and would be the last to say anything in disparagement of them. 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, that in that paper—the 
Shawneetown Gazette—there had appeared an article in relation 
_ to himself; though he cared nothing for what was said in any 
paper, he took occasion to say, that the article alluded to was 
unqualifiedly, prematured and basely false, in every part, from 
beginning to end. 

The reading of the newspaper article was called for by many 
members, and was read by thesecretary. It consisted of a number 
of letters, purporting to give an account of the proceedings of the 
Convention. After the reading, 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac said, that he had risen not only to 
complain of the injustice of that report in relation to himself, in 
the misstatement it contained in reference to what he had said on 
the subject of a poll tax, but of some things said in it which re- 
flected on the character of this body, and which might require 
some action on the part of the Convention. He said, that the 
remarks made by him on the question of a poll tax were misrepre- 
sented, wholly misrepresented, by that reporter. 

Mr. KNOWLTON said, that he desired to say a few words in 
relation to this matter. In the preceding number of that paper 
just read he had come in for a larger share of abuse than had been 
dealt out to any other member. The reporter had represented 
him as saying that the heroes who had fought from Bunker Hill 
to Yorktown never murmured at taxation, with some comments 
upon my knowledge of history and acquaintance with dictionaries 
and Murray’s grammar. He would say to that man, whose form 
he had seen moving about the hall, that there was one book which 
he (the reporter) had never opened, and that book was the history 
of truth, that to him was a sealed book, the language therein was 
to him unknown! Mr. K. cared nothing about what a man writes 


340 i LLI Nol S HISTORICAL COLLECTI IONS 


into the papers at his home, te thought his friends Eneyr enou gh 
of him to disregard them; and he would have said nothing no 
unless this subject had Bee introduced, and because he thought t 
this due to set himself right i in the eyes of strangers. Any man. 
who is permitted to sit in this hall, and states in regard to the ~ 
members what is false, basely, maliciously false, and then turns 
‘round and attacks the Convention as a body, is unworthy to be 
allowed here, and almost too low to notice. a 

I would say to that man, that when he advises the Convenes nm 
to adjourn to the other State house, twenty miles above St. Louis, Ri 
that it would be more proper for him to go there and engage in the 
works of that place, and give us the benefit of hisexample. = 

Mr. KITCHELL thought that the writer of those letters was _ 
unworthy of the least notice on the part of the Convention or of 
its members. mi 

Mr. CALDWELL rose to make an inquiry. He hotel ei * 
it was advisable that the name of the writer should be known. ~ ty 
had been said that he sits at a desk on this floor, and it is presumed do 
that his name is known to the President. y, 

No reply being made, the subject dropped. 

Mr. SERVANT presented a petition from a number of citizens 
of Kaskaskia, in relation to commons; referred to the select 
committee on that subject. f 

Mr. Z. CASEY, from the committee on the Revenue, to shoul 5) 
had been referred the communication of the Auditor and certain 
documents in relation to the amount of county revenue, & 
reported the same back, and asked to be discharged from t 
further consideration of the same. Agreed to, and laid on t 
table. ne 
Mr. PRATT offered as an additional rule—that no memb 
shall be allowed to speak on any one subject longer than 30 minu' 
at one time. A motion to lay it on the table was lost—yeas 3 
and the question being taken on its adoption, it was decided ini 
the affirmative—yeas 84. wi 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to amend the 18th rule, by striki 
out that portion which allows members, in committee of the 
whole, to speak more than twice on any subject. After a short — 


THURSDAY, JULY 8, 1847 341 


iy Miicbate, i in which Messrs. Pratt, MARKLEY, BRocKMAN, ALLEN, 
and Z. Casry advocated the motion, and Messrs. MINsHALL, 
_ Txompson, Hurzsut, CampBett of Jo Daviess, Davis of McLean, 
_ and Kinney of Bureau, opposed the motion, the question was 
_ taken by yeas and nays, and resulted—yeas 58, nays 78. 


[Mr. PRATT advocated its adoption. He was not disposed, 
he said, to place any improper restraint upon discussion, but he 
would suggest the fact that nearly two-thirds of the time in com- 

“mittee of the whole, was occupied by six or eight gentlemen, 
prompted apparently by an ambition to lead. There was no 
doubt whatever about the salutary nature of free and full discus- 
sion, but so far from having a free interchange of thoughts and 
opinions the debate as he had observed, was chiefly confined to 
a few gentlemen, to the exclusion of those who were less ambitious, 
but whose opinions he had no doubt, were of as much value as 
those which they were forced to hear so frequently reiterated. 
He thought that unless gentlemen who were so prominent in de- 
bate on all occasions had a greater fund of thought than had yet 
been developed they would experience no difficulty whatever in 
affording all the light, and in shedding all the intelligence which 
it was in their power to furnish upon any given subject, without 
speaking more than once. He trusted it would not be supposed 
that he offered these remarks in a censorious spirit, but he con- 
fessed that he had found it very irksome to listen to so many 
editions of the same speech, and in order to avoid, if possible, a 
repetition of the evil which he thought had become sufficiently 
apparent to all, he was in favor of the motion of the gentleman 
from Fulton. 


Mr. MINSHALL said, he was not a talking man himself, and 
was not much in favor of long speeches, at the same time he could 
not see that much advantage would result from the alteration of 
this rule. It was one which had been in practice he believed, from 
time immemorial, ever since anything like deliberative bodies had 
been known. If gentlemen were not disposed to listen to much 
speaking they might attain their object by refusing to go into 
committee of the whole. 


342 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


The debate was continued by Messrs. Bia of Nietood a, 
ALLEN, THompson, MARKLEy, Mason and Brockman. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, he hoped the motion 
would not prevail; he was opposed to it for the same reason that 
he was opposed to the resolution which had been passed this 
morning limiting the duration of the speeches of delegates to 
thirty minutes each. He was opposed to it because he did no 
desire to see any innovation made upon the principles of par 
mentary law, which had been established and confirmed by 
wisdom and experience of ages. a 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean said, he believed the rule which ha d 
been adopted restricting the speeches of members to thirty min- 
utes, had passed without attracting the notice of the conventi 
generally. He was of opinion that if it had been reflected w 
it would not have been adopted. He did not suppose that 
would himself desire to occupy more than thirty minutes at ¢ 
time, but he protested against the assumption that no gentlem 
in the convention would need a longer time to express his vie 
upon certain subjects. There were subjects to be discussed w 
which some gentlemen were pre-eminently familiar; subjects - 0 
which they had devoted their lives, and upon which they were ei 
qualified therefore to enlighten the convention; but it would be 
in vain to expect anything like a full elucidation of the subject’ 
the speaker was limited to thirty minutes. They were assemble 
for the purpose of consulting together upon the common good 4 
of bringing their labors to a certain result, and before a sin 
article of the constitution had been adopted, before they had co 
pleted one solitary item of their work a proposition was introduced 
that the convention should adjourn in the space of about three 
weeks. He must be permitted to say that if a proposition of thi 
kind had come from a young man he would have considered the 
it had been brought forward for the purpose of making capital 
home, but coming as it did from a gentleman of established sta 
ing and reputation, a gentleman who held so large a share in 
estimation of the community as did the gentleman from Jefferson 
he could not of course suppose that it proceeded from any suc 
motive. Would it be within the range of possibility to get through 


‘4 


b 


it 
% 
i? 
os 


i 


THURSDAY, JULY 8, 1847 en 43 


/ in three weeks? He certainly thought it would not. The Louisi- 


“ana convention, consisting of seventy members, were engaged for 


- four months and a half in forming the constitution of that State. 


_ The New York convention was in session one hundred days, and 

they acknowledged that they had not time sufficient to perfect 
their work. He believed that if in three months time they suc- 
ceeded in framing a good constitution, it would be considered by 
everybody that they had done well; but if they adjourned within 
three weeks and made an imperfect constitution, as must nec- 
‘essarily be the case, they would have done worse than nothing. 
The sessions of the legislature although they recurred every two 
years lasted three months, and yet this convention which was 
assembled for the purpose of forming an organic law to last for 
centuries, was expected to complete its work in a few weeks. He 
was opposed to all propositions to adjourn until they had finished 
the work which they came to perform. 

After some remarks from Mr. KINNEY of Bureau, 

_ Mr. Z. CASEY observed that he did not desire to continue this 
discussion, but merely to make a single remark in reply to the 
gentleman from McLean. He was sincerely desirous that the 
labors of the convention should merit and receive the approba- 
tion of their constituents, and in order that they might merit and 
receive that approbation, he thought they should be performed 
within a reasonable time. It seemed to him that it should be one 
object, at least with the convention, to do up the business for 
which they were assembled, within a reasonable time. He was 
inclined to the belief, and he thought that almost any gentleman 
would concur with him in this, that if the mode of discussion which 
had been hitherto pursued in this body, were to be continued 
through all the ramifications of the various subjects to be con- 
sidered, they would find themselves sitting for the next eighteen 
months. He was perfectly sincere when in offering the resolution 
yesterday upon the subject of adjournment, he had stated that 
before he had left home he believed the business of this conven- 
tion might be finished in six weeks. He was now convinced that 
it could not under two months; but he was inclined still to believe 
that if gentlemen would confine themsleves within reasonable 

bounds in debate, it could be concluded without exceeding two 


344 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — ( 


months. He would inform the gentleman from McLean that 
had no desire to act for bunkum. He had no future aspiratio 
here or elsewhere, to be gratified. He desired to see the conver 
tion form a constitution that would be acceptable to the people, an 
that would tell upon the future destinies of the State; but he was 
convinced that if they sat there for six months, engaged in this 
_ wild (perhaps he had better take that word back,)—in this wi 
range of debate that had been indulged in, he doubted very mu 
whether they would be able to succeed at all in accomplishing ths 
object for which they were assembled. He thought, therefore, 1 
would be better that they should be confined to a reasonable tim 
for finishing the work; and he was convinced that in this way 
would be more satisfactorily accomplished. He, for one, was 
expediting the business of the convention, and in order to do this 
they, ought to limit the duration of the session to a reasonabl . 
time. /)° ae 
Mr. SINGLETON said he was opposed to any sue that would — 
restrict in any degree the expression of opinion : i ptnaidibe om 
to set asrule adopteds if)". 75.23.5/2 now in existence, whi. . . 
the ques-...-.-, admit, *... 0... beeasaurmaee onli sa Rhee 


He was for a full and free discussion. He had not come. hes ( 
the purpose of saving time. If that had been the object of th 
constituency of this body, they would have refrained from se 
ing them here. If time and expense were what they wanted to” 
economize, the convention would not have been called together: 
They had in view a higher purpose; they were assembled for the 
purpose of amending and improving the organic law of the Sta 
for the purpose of changing and improving their form of gove 
ment. This was a matter to be done with very great deliberation. 
He would ask if any gentleman would be prepared to decide upon | 
question from merely hearing it read at the clerk’s table? Some 
gentlemen after having expressed their own opinions, would n« 
doubt be quite willing that the question should be taken witho 
further debate; but he for one was not disposed to constitute him- _ 
self the judge as to when a question had been sufficiently debat 
the constituents of other gentlemen had reposed confidence in 
their discretion, and he might be permitted to say in their talking ~ 


a. 


_ powers, to do something for them—something to forward their 


* 


_ THURSDAY, JULY 8, 1847 345 


_ views and to promote their interests, and he was not for depriving 


them of the opportunity of exercising these powers; and if it were 


to take until December, he was for giving to every member an 


opportunity to express his views upon every subject that was to 
be determined upon. He hoped the proposition would not be 
adopted.|** 


Mr. EDWARDS of Madison presented the following preamble 
and resolutions: 

Whereas, we have just learned, with deep emotion, that the 
remains of Col. J. J. Harpin and Capt. Jacos ZasBriskIE have 
reached St. Louis, and that preparations have been made to inter 
them with funeral honors at Jacksonville; and whereas, these 
events excite afresh the grief with which every heart was pene- 
trated when the mournful intelligence of their fall on the bloody 
field of Buena Vista was first spread among us; and whereas, 
it is the custom of all civilized nations to honor their illustrious 
dead, and especially those who have gallantly fought and [who] glo- 
riously fellin the service of their country; and whereas, it is deemed 
highly right and proper in itself, as well as promotive of the spirit 
which ought to animate a free people, that we should commemo- 
rate, if not by costly monuments, at least by a spontaneous ex- 
pression of feeling, the heroic deeds and manly virtues of the 
deceased; it is, therefore, by this Convention, 

Resolved, ‘That we do cordially sympathize with the friends and 
families of the slain, who, by this awful visitation, have sustained 
a loss which all the honors of the world cannot deprive of its 
bitterness. 

Resolved, That we sincerely mourn the loss of the State, in the 
death of Harpin, ZABRISKIE, HoucuTon, and others who have so 
largely contributed to the lustre of her arms and the glory of her 
name. 

Resolved, That in the death of Col. Harptn, we sincerely mourn 
the loss sustained by the State, in being deprived of a citizen who 
has deservedly acquired the affections of the people, and a states- 


38 This insertion is taken from the Sangamo Journal, July 15. 


FARA Bef 


346 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT 101 


man, whose distinguished ability and integrity were justly adm 
by all. ‘ 

Resolved, That this Convention, i in honor of those who have 
gloriously fallen in the service of their country, do adjourn so so 
as information is received of the arrival of the remains of t 
deceased at Jacksonville, for the purpose of joining in the cek 
bration of the funeral ceremonies of the lamented Harvin and 
ZABRISKIE. 

Mr. EDWARDS in presenting the above resolutions said: 

The preamble and resolutions, which I haye had the honor to ~ 
submit for the consideration of the Convention, explain themselve: 
We are not called upon, by the tenor of these resolutions, to testi 
our high sense of the important services of the living heroes of the — 
Mexican war, to tender to them our congratulations for the 
splendid victories achieved by their valor, or to cheer them onward. 
in their brilliant career of glory and renown; but to render a mourn- 
ful tribute to the memory of those gallant spirits who have foug 
and bled and died in their country’s cause, to mingle our tears 
with those of their desolate friends, their stricken widows and their 
bereaved orphans. We are not allowed the pleasing task of 
weaving the crown of unfading laurel to invest the brows of t 
living Taytor, Scotr, Woo1, Baxker, Bissett, Morriso: 
Leavitt, Pope and a hundred others who have encircled, with 
halo of glory, the American name; but to perform the sad office 
entwining the cypress wreath in mournful remembrance ob d 
dead Harpin, ZABRISKIE and HoucuTon. 

As for myself, Mr. President, I find it vain to > apempt 
analyze my own feelings. I know not, indeed, what feeling, 
this moment, predominates in my ownbosom, But, this Ido know 
that when I would rejoice with the living, I am ready to weep 
the dead—when I would sound the note of congratulation, it 
hushed in the sadness of sorrowful condolence. And such, 
doubt not, are the mingled emotions of this Convention. It is 
right, sir, that it should be so. It is right to contemplate t 
desolating havoc of war, blighting the rich fruits of peace and — 
prosperity, spreading sorrow and dismay throughout the land, 
scathing the widow’s heart, and withering the orphan’s hope. 
is right, too, to soften these manifold horrors of war, by the soothing 


THURSDAY, JULY 8, 1847 347 


_ influence of sympathy, to dry up the tears of mourning friends, to 
_ mitigate the sorrows of the widowed wife and to light up the beam 
_ of hope in the languid eye of orphanage. And what so well 
calculated to dry up those tears, to alleviate those sorrows, and 
hy _ to enliven those hopes, as to point them to the noble bearing of the 
_ lamented dead—to the deathless fame that awaits them; that the 
husband, father, brother, friend is not dead, but lives enshrined 
in the hearts of his countrymen. Death, which comes to all, has 
come to them with a crown of imperishable honors. Their names 
are not only the theme of contemporary praise, but enrolled on 
the page of history, as a memento, to their latest posterity of their 
illustrious lineage. Where, sir, is the sting of such a death? To 
behold the gush of sympathy in the tearful eyes all around her, to 
hear the admiring accents, poured forth as the spontaneous tribute 
of both whig and democrat, to the memory of her honored husband. 
Is not all this a healing balm to the crushed spirit of the accom- 
plished widow of the ever to be lamented Harpin? May it prove 
an all-sufficient solace to her bleeding heart. HARDIN! A 
name ever to be remembered. The name of Joun J. Harpin will 
never, can never, be forgotten by him who now addresses you. 
Sir, I knew him well. He was my friend, personal and political, 
through good and through evil report. I knew him as the husband 
and the father amid the endearments of the family circle. I knew 
him as the light and life of the social party, diffusing a joyous 
hilarity through every bosom. I knew him as a neighbor, dis- 
charging all the kind offices of that relation in a spirit of courtesy, 
of generosity, of open-hearted hospitality. I knew him in the 
halls of legislation as the bold, manly, independent, consistent 
politician—alike beloved by his friends, and respected by his 
‘opponents; for enemies he had none. And we all know him as the 
ardent patriot, the gallant soldier—ever the first to advance, and 
the last to retreat; a soldier by right of inheritance, mingling in 
his veins the best blood of the Hardins and Logans, the bravest of 
the brave sons of Kentucky. His devotion to his country is 
written with his blood and sealed with his life.— 
But, in mourning the loss of our beloved Hardin, shall we forget 
those choice spirits of Kentucky, McKee and Clay, worthy sons 
of noble sires—or that distinguished scion of revolutionary stock, 


call, forsook the halls of Congress, for the tenth field: all of ee 
mingling in the hottest of the fight, and, by their deeds of no 
daring, shedding such a lustre upon the name and character of t 
nation—have, side by side with our Hardin, offered up iy 
lives as a sacrifice upon the altar of their country. ' 

And, Mr. President, as citizens of Illinois, knowing’ an id. 
appreciating their worth, shall we be said to disparage these grea 
names by associating with them, in mournful remembrance t 
namesof our fellow citizens, Zabriskie, Houghton,Fletcher, Robbi 
Ferguson and others? Though moving inan humbler sphere, their _ 
hearts were warmed with a glow of patriotism as intense, and 
their hands were nerved by a spirit as dauntless. They fought as 
bravely, bled as freely, and died as gloriously. Honor to thei 
memories, and the solace of our heart-felt sympathies to thet 
mourning relatives. 

But, sir, what could not be achieved by such officers, sustain ‘ 
by such soldiers as were under their command? It were invidious — 
to discriminate where all have proved themselves so wort! 
And yet, may I not as a Kentuckian, be pardoned for alluding 
the gallant Kentucky regiment, led on by their brave and chiv 
rous commanders McKee and Clay? Does not the number o 
slain in this memorable action attest their indomitable courage 
Have they not proved themselves true scions of the old stock wh 
watered the plains of Raisin with [tlheir blood, and who bol 
bared their bosoms to the murderous tomahawk and scalpi 
knife, of the ruthless savage at Tippecanoe? Sir, the spirit whic 
animated them in their death struggle for liberty, was breathed ~ 
into them by the soul-stirring eloquence of McKee and Henry ~ 
Clay, in the halls of Congress. And these, their noble hearted 
sons, and their brave companions in arms—fired by the sam 
spirit and borne onward by the same impulse—have as freely 
watered with their blood, the field of Buena Vista, and have 
deservedly won for themselves and for their native State, an im 
perishable fame. 

And now, Mr. President, I ask not your indulgence, _ 1 crave 
not the pardon of this Convention, for placing side by side with — 
this gallant Kentucky regiment the no less gallant 1st and 2nd ~ 


THURSDAY, JULY 8, 1847 349 


regiments of Illinois volunteers—nor for claiming for them as high 
_ honors and as imperishable renown. As nobly have they earned 
_ it—for they have poured out their blood as freely upon the same 
field. Their loss, too, equally attests their invincible courage and 
their devoted patriotism. Add to these, sir, the brilliant achieve- 
_ ments of the 3d and 4th regiments at Cerro Gordo, led on success- 
fully by the gallant Shields, and by the high-spirited, the chivalrous 
Baker, both favorite sons of Illinois—and is not the measure of 
our glory full to overflowing? Sir, proud as I may be of the name 
of Kentuckian, I feel this day no less proud of the name of IIlinoian; 
and have chosen it as the State of my adoption, I ask for me and 
mine no higher privilege than that of living and dying an IIlinoian. 
And to whom, sir, am I, and you, and all the members of this 
Convention, indebted for this just sentiment of State pride? To 
whom do we owe it that Illinois stands, this day, foremost in the 
estimation of all the States of this glorious confederacy? To those 
very names whom we are called upon by the resolutions under 
consideration, to go in a body and convey to their last resting 
place on earth. And shall we hold back when a neighboring city, 
in a neighboring State, is pouring forth its thousands to pay the sol- 
emn tribute of their respect, when all, the high and the low, the rich 
and the poor, the aged and the young, the native and the foreigner, 
the men of all parties, trades and professions, are gathering in 
mournful procession around the bier, not of citizen soldiers of St. 
Louis or of Missouri, but of our own Hardin, Zabriskie, and 
Houghton? Sir, we ought not, we will not, we cannot, fail in 
meeting the invitation of the citizens of Jacksonville to unite with 
them in this last sad homage to the memory of our beloved Hardin, 
and his brave associates. 

Mr. CAMPBELL, of Jo Daviess, presented the following 
resolution; which was unanimously adopted: 

Resolved, That this Convention, in testimony of their deep 
sense of the loss the State has sustained, in the death of the 
lamented Harpin, and other volunteers who have fallen in the 
service of their country, will wear crepe on the left arm for 30 days. 

In offering the above resolution Mr. C. said, that after the 
eloquent remarks just made by the venerable and eloquent gentle- 
man from Madison, which had sunk deep as the untimely sorrow 


for the illustrious dead, in the heart of every delegate, he fear 
that what he could say would rather disturb than | deepen 
feeling. 

We see, sir, that in other states, that in the patriotic city 
St. Louis, that they think, and they have a right to think, th 
glory of the name of Hardin and his companions, belongs not alor 

to their own State, but that it sheds a halo round our nation 
glory. On this question all party spirit is forgotten! All pa 
asperities are lost sight of as we kneel in sympathy and patrio 
and shed tears of sorrow upon the graves of those who have fa 
in the cause of their country. This resolution is offered not | 
ostentation; the occasion requires it, patriotism demands it, andI 
sincerely hope the Convention will adopt it. i : he a 

Mr. BROWN offered the following; which was unanimous 
adopted: 

Resolved, That copies of the foregoing preamble and msolige 
signed by the President and Secretary, be transmitted by th 
Secretary, to the families of the deceased. 

Mr. KNOWLTON said, that from what had just taken plac 
and the deep feeling excited in every breast, he knew the Conver 
tion were unfit for business. Our thoughts now are not her 
they are upon the battle field of Buena Vista and Cerro Gord 
And the Convention was not in a state of feeling to transa 
business, he, therefore, moved the Convention adjourn till 3 p. m 
And the Convention adjourned till 3 p. m. 


=" 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. SINGLETON moved leave of absence for his. colleagu 
Mr. Brockman, for six days, on account of sickness n his famit 
Granted. 


the Ee and the committee resumed the cankidergia hee th 
report of the committee on the Legislative Department—Mr. 
Woopson in the chair. The question pending was on the sub-— 
stitute offered by Mr. Harpine for the additional section “ 
posed by Mr. Tuomas. 

Mr. ARCHER said, he desired to say a few words on th 
question now before the committee, and would give his reaso. 


THURSDAY, JULY 8, 1847 351 


_ why he should vote against the substitute and the proposed 
section. He had some difficulty at first in arriving at the proper 
view of and in coming at the proper conclusion and construction 
" of the proposition of the gentleman from Warren; and he yet felt 
_ some difficulty in doing so. The substitute proposed that, when 
a county had a fractional excess over one-fourth of the ratio, that 
‘that excess should be given to the county in the circuit having the 


largest white population. There seemed to him to be no sort of 


"propriety in adding this excess to that county having the largest 


white population in the circuit, when that county might have 
enough without the fraction to entitle it to a representative. He 


thought the effect of the substitute would be to disfranchise a 


large portion of the people of the State, and could not give his 
consent to any proposition which would deprive any portion of 
the people of the right of representation, or tend to their dis- 
franchisement. We may as well, if we deprive them of the right 
of being represented in the government, excuse them from paying 
any taxes or bearing any of the burdens of government. We are 
told that the principle contained in this provision, is not to have 
any effect upon the apportionment to be made at the present 
time. This argument made no difference with him. If the 
principle was wrong, it was no argument in its favor with him to 
say that its operation was to be kept for the future, that it was to 
be delayed. He understood that the gentleman from Sangamon 
supported this proposition; yet if not much mistaken he heard 
that gentleman a few days ago read a severe lecture to the gentle- 
man from Jefferson, on account of his great distrust of Legislatures. 
A great change must have taken place since then in that gentle- 
man’s views. He made them a long speech, in favor of the legis- 
lative department of the government, which he said was the right 
arm of the people. And now he is in favor of taking away from 
the Legislature the power to apportion the State. He is in favor 
of binding it down by an arbitrary rule. He (Mr. A.) thought this 
matter should be left open for the Legislature, and not attempt to 
do too much, by entering into details. If we entered into details 
at all we should do so with great accuracy, but we were not familiar 
with the views of our constituents upon all these trifling matters 


and he thought it best that they should be left to the Legislature. 


352 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIG 


apportionment were adopted, although it was said that it w 
intended to operate on the present apportionment, that gentlema 
in order to preserve consistency, might endeavor to make t 1s 
rule apply to the present apportionment. 


Mr. POWERS could never recognize the justice of any 1 
which would deprive the people or any part of them of the righ 
of representation. Population is generally admitted to be t 
only true basis of representation, and any rule going to depri ive 
any part of the population of the privilege of being represent | 
was, in his opinion, wrong. He referred to the present state 
things in relation to Highland and Adams counties, and said, t 
he did not believe that this rule, admitted by those who introduc 
it to be arbitrary and unfair, would be at all satisfactory to. 
people of Adams county. He had examined facts in respect 
the operation of this rule, and had ascertained that there wei 
twelve counties in the State that would have an average 7 
two thousand white inhabitants, over the ratio; and the w 
of this large excess would be entirely unrepresented; and this 
excess would be given to the smaller ones. They propose to gi 
Adams county, with a population of 18,000, two representativ 
and throw the large excess over the ratio into a small count 
adjoining with a population of 5,058, thereby giving the sma 
county a sufficient number for a representative. Thus, inst 
of adding the small county to Adams and allowing them j joir t 
three representatives, they give the excess to the small cou 
and give her a representative. The effect is that a county wi 
19,000 inhabitants is entitled to two representatives; and th 
county with 5,058, a little over one-half the ratio, is encitledl 
one—making each vote in the small county equal to two in t 
larger. How gentlemen can reconcile the injustice of this pr 
ciple with their sense of fairness and justice is more than he co 
comprehend. 

Mr. BOND and Mr. PALMER of Macoupin followed in 
opposition to the substitute. 4 


Mr. HARDING made some remarks in defence of his subst 
tute and then withdrew it. 


“THURSDAY, JULY 8, 1847 353 


Mr. BOND moved to amend the proposed section by striking 
_ out the word “such” and insert the “nearest.” 

Mr. McCALLEN said, he was opposed to the whole plan. If 
any county was to have a member through charity, he thought it 
should be given to a small county in preference to a large one. 

_ Much had been said about principle, and long speeches had been 
made to prove that all our actions should be guided by principle 
alone; and he called on gentlemen to carry out the principle of a 
fair and equitable representation, by dividing the State into 
seventy-five election districts, without any reference to county 
lines, and thus have everyone represented, and avoid all fractions. 

The question was then taken on Mr. Bonp’s amendment, and 
decided in the affirmative—yeas 71, nays 39. 

Mr. McCALLEN offered an amendment, “that no district 
shall have more than one representative.” Lost. 

The question was then taken on the proposed section of Mr. 
Tuomas, and decided in the affirmative—yeas 76, nays 49. 

Sec. 33. The State may, to meet casual deficits or failures in 
revenues, contract debts, but never to exceed in the aggregate 
fifty thousand dollars; and no debt for any other purpose, except 
to repel invasion, suppress insurrection, or defend the State in war, 
for payment of which the faith of the State shall be pledged, shall 
be contracted, unless the law authorizing the same shall, at a 
general election, have been submitted to the people, and have 
received a majority of all the votes cast for and against it at 
such election. 

Mr. ARCHER moved to amend by adding at the end of the 
section, “and the Legislature shall provide for the publication, 
for three months at least, of each law, before the time of the vote 
thereon.”” And the question being taken thereon, it was decided 
in the afirmative—yeas 95. 

Mr. KENNER moved to strike out all before the word 
“anless,” and insert “the State shall have no power to contract 
debts.” 

Mr. SIM offered as a substitute for the amendment—strike 
out all so as the section will read, ‘ the State shall have no power 
to borrow money, except to repel invasion, suppress insurrection, 
or defend the State in war, for payment of which the faith of the 


354 


State shall be pledged, unless the law autho the ‘same, : and 
setting forth the purposes for which the same is’ borrowed, shall, : 
at a general election,” &c. And the question being taken on — 
submitting this for the amendment, it was decided in the affirm- 
ative. 
Mr. EDWARDS moved as a substitute for the amendment a 
strike it all out and prefix to the section the following: “The 
expenditures of the government for any given périod shall never 
exceed the amount of revenue authorized by law to be raised in 
such period, provided the State may,” &c., and strike out the § 
word “‘but’’ in section. R 
Mr. THOMAS moved to strike out the word ‘ ee and 
insert “‘year.” Lost. And the question being taken on the 
adoption of Mr. Epwarps’ substitute, it was, on the third count, 
carried—yeas 57, nays 54. . 
Mr. HAYES moved to strike out all of the section after the . 
word “‘contracted.’”’ Lost. , 
Mr. SHARPE offered a long amendment, which we had no am 
time to copy, and which was rejected. 
Mr. SHumway, Powers and Perrers offered amendments 
which were embodied in the follow|ing]—and added to the sec— 
tion: ‘‘And provision shall be made at the time of contracting — 
the debt for the payment of the interest thereon, by revenue to be 4 
raised by tax, or otherwise, for that purpose.’ a 
Mr. HAYES moved to add to the amendment: “Provided 
that the law authorizing the debt to be contracted shall be sub- 
mitted to the people, with the law levying the tax for the same.” 
Mr. HARVEY moved to add to the first amendment, “which 
law shall be irrepealable.” Carried. And the amendment of 
Mr. Hayes was adopted; and the amendment as amended was | 
also adopted. 
Mr. SCATES moved to strike out “contract debts.” Lostill 
Mr. THORNTON moved to insert after “fifty thousand - ? 
dollars,” ‘and the moneys thus borrowed shall be applied to the 
purpose for which they were obtained, or to repay the debt thus 
made, and to no other purpose.”’ Carried. it 


Mr. KENNER moved to strike out the words “against it,” 


XXVII. FRIDAY, JULY 9, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. BEercEN. eo. 

Messrs. HAWLEY and SPENCER presented petition 
praying the appointment of a State superintendant of schoo 
referred to the committee on Education. o) 

The PRESIDENT laid before the Convention, a communic ; 
tion from the Governor, enclosing a statement of the public deb bt, 
which will appear in our next. 

Mr. CASEY moved that 1,000 copies [be] printed. — 
and 5,000 copies were suggested, and voted down; and the 
number was adopted. 

Mr. HOGUE moved the Convention resolve itself into oa m- 
mittee of the whole. Carried, and Mr. Woopson took the Cha 

Mr. SHARPE moved to take up the 31st section, which had 
been passed over nformally the other day. Lost. a) 

Section 34. No amendment. 

Sec. 35. The Legislature shall provide by law that the fi 
and stationery furnished for the use of the State; the copyit 
printing, and distributing the laws and journals of the Ge 
Assembly shall be let, by contract, to the lowest responsible 
bidder, and that no member of the General Assembly, or other 
officer of the State, be interested either directly or indirectly i in 
any such contract. 

Mr. THOMAS moved to insert “binding” after ‘the os 

“printing.” Carried. Ag 

Mr. CHURCHILL moved to insert “lights” afte hei) wot rd 
“fuel.” Lost. 

Mr. NORTHCOTT moved to amend by adding at chi: oie 
the section the words: ‘“‘no private act shall be printed at t 
public expense.” Yeas 77, nays 23. No quorum. A se 
vote resulted—yeas 57, nays 65. Rejected. y 

_Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon proposed the same amend- 
ment, with the following words added thereto—“unless by a voi 
of three-fourths of the General Assembly.” . 


356 


a 
‘ 


oes, 


FRIDAY, JULY 9, 7847 ES 


Mr. TURNBULL offered as a substitute—“no private act 

shall be published, except at the cost of the party for whose benefit 
it is passed.”” Lost. 

_ And the question being taken on Mr. Epwarps’ amendment, 
_ it was decided in the negative. 

Mr. DAWSON moved to insert “shall” after “State,’”’ in 4th 
line. Adopted. 

- Mr. BROWN moved to strike out “copying,” in 2d line. 
Lost. 

“Mr. SCATES moved to insert after “journal”—“‘and all other 
printing ordered by.” Carried—Yeas 83. 

Mr. BUTLER moved to strike out all of the 35th section. 

-Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, he thought the better 
way would be to leave this whole question open to the action of 
the Legislature, who could fix in the law, authorizing the printing, 
binding, &c., a statement of the prices to be paid for the work. 

_ He had some knowledge of this system of letting the work out to 
the lowest bidder, and knew from experience, that there would 
be no saving to the State. This matter of the binding had been 
let out by contract some time ago, to the lowest bidder, and what 
was the consequence? Why there were several binders in this 
city, yet there was but one bid, and the contract was given to 
them at prices but very little less than those before paid, and 
stated in the law. There was no competition, men could not come 
here from other places, and establish offices for the mere purpose 
of obtaining this State work; and he again stated his opinion was 
that the question should be left open for the Legislature. 

Mr. LOGAN said, he did not agree with the gentleman last 
up, in his views of this question. He thought that if a “little” 
only was saved, it still was so much saved to the State by this 
means. He would point out to the gentleman, that in one case— 
the revised code—the contract for binding was let out to the 
lowest bidder, and the amount paid was only one-half the price 
that was fixed in the law. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess replied, that in the case cited 
by the gentleman, the contract was taken at prices so low that the 
man could not perform the work without a loss. For, after they 
had undertaken the work, and after the adjournment of the Legis- 


VOR WS TEL asa ee Tey es a a eee he ek 


358 ILLINOIS AISTORICAL COLLECTION 
lature, they had addressed a letter to the pee of 
(Mr. C.) in which they state[d] the prices were too low; sipca: 
explained to them that they had entered into a contract, a 
was not in his power to annul it. If he was not much mist 
the gentleman from Sangamon (Mr. Locan) introduced, 
the next session of the Legislatu[rle, a bill for the relief of 
contractors, in consequence of their losses by-this contract. 
Mr. LOGAN explained, that the bill for relief had 
introduced because there was a difference in the kind of bindi 
done, from what had been contracted for. The relief was g 
They also had petitioned for relief in consequence of the a 
of binding done was not as great as was anticipated when | 
contract was taken, for this however they received no relief. 
said this much in explanation of his course in the Legislature. 
. WEAD said, it was a matter of regret that we should 
have to hear explanations of the gentleman’s legislative cour 
often; and it was also a source of much greater regret that it 
not een published in a book, so that we should not be obliges 
hear it at the expense of the people. a 
It had been shown by the gentleman from Jo D. that not! 
could be saved in the end by this plan of having the binding 
printing done, and he could see no objection to leaving the m 
open to the Legislature, to be provided for by them. Gentlem 
had opposed all restrictions on the Legislature, had declared 
with this Convention had not been exhausted the wisdom of 1 
State, and that we should go into details. But now, gentle 
say that the legislature shall have no power, no discretion in 
matter, and that we must bind them down by the most strict lit 
and provisions? He was in favor, as he had’ before stated, 
leaving the question with the Legislature. 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon said, that in pi to mee 
views of gentlemen and to carry out the suggestions of the ge 
man from Jo D. he would offer the following Proviso: “Tha 
Legislature shall fix in the law a maximum price for se prin 
binding &c.”’ ae ee 
‘Mr. BUTLER was in favor of striking the nde section 
it was a reflection upon the honesty and integrity of all fu 
Legislatures. To say that they cannot make a contract abo 


FRIDAY, JULY 9, 1847 359 


| ae A 

the printing and binding the laws of the State, without wronging 
_ the State was a reflection upon the honor and integrity of the 
Legislature. He was not a little amused at the course of the 


~~. 


7a ° 


gentleman from Sangamon, he was afraid a day or two ago that 
the Convention was doing too much, that it was legislating and 


_ leaving nothing for Legislatures to do hereafter. To-day he is in 


favor and desirous of binding them down by constitutional pro- 
visions upon this trifling matter. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery expressed himself in favor of 
the section as it is. 

Mr. KNAPP of Jersey offered the following as a substitute: 


“Provided, the Legislature shall have the right to determine 


whether the lowest responsible bid, as contemplated in the 
section, shall be reasonable in its amount and as low as could be 
obtained by private contract.” Lost. And the question being 
taken on the amendment of Mr. Epwarps, it was carried—yeas 
76, nays 43. The question was taken on striking out the section, 
and decided in the negative. 

Mr. SHARPE moved to insert after “‘bidder,” “‘so that said 
bidder is a resident of this State.”—Lost. 

Mr. SINGLETON moved to re-consider the vote by which 
an amendment offered by him on Wednesday last, to the 3d 


_ section, had been lost; and the committee refused to re-consider— 


yeas 54, nays 55. 

The committee then took up the 31st section as it was amended; 
which had been laid over. 

Mr. SHARPE offered the following as a substitute for the 
section as amended: ‘““The Legislature shall not have power to 
provide by law for the sale of non-residents’ lands for taxes, until 
judgment shall first be had against the same.” 

Messrs. SHarpe, Wiiiiams, Davis of Montgomery, and 
ScATEs made some remarks thereon, after which a motion was 
made that the committee rise; which was decided in the negative— 


_ yeas 40, nays not counted. 


Mr. ARCHER hoped the vote would not now be taken on 
this amendment, till the members had had sufficient reflection 
on the subject. He renewed the motion to rise—yeas 60, nays 61. 
Lost. 


360 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


The question was taken on the amendment, and decided nt 
the negative. a: 
Mr. WILLIAMS moved to insert after the word “process,” 
the words “‘or otherwise.” 
Mr. McCALLEN was not ready to vote upon the ua 
now, and he renewed the motion that the committee rise. 
Mr. PETERS thought we might vote now upon this section 
now and report it to the house, have it printed, and then members 
could have time to vote deliberately upon its acer me! 
motion to rise was decided in the negative. } 
Mr. WILLIAMS’ amendment was then adopted. 
Mr. LOGAN moved to insert after “court,” “in some usual 
and regular tribunal.” Carried. . 
The section then stood as follows: “— 
“The General Assembly shall have no power to pass any la y 
whereby any person shall be deprived of his life, liberty, property, — 
or franchises, without trial and judgment in court, or some usual 
and regular tribunal; provided, that nothing herein contained sha 
prevent the passage of any law for seizing and holding person 
and property by mesne process or otherwise until such trial c 
be had; or for collecting taxes by distress and sale of perso 
property without judgment.” . 
Mr. Z. CASEY moved the committee rise and report to 
Convention their proceedings; and the chairman reported, 
committee had had under consideration, &c., and reported the sa 
back with various amendments, and asked “ee concurrence of th ‘ 
Convention therein. eet 
Mr. THOMAS moved the report and amendments be bis on 
the table, and 200 copies printed. Carried. ‘; 
And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned till 3 P. 


4 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. LOCKWOOD moved the Convention resolve itself 
into committee of the whole; and the Convention resolved itself int 
committee—Mr. Crain in ‘the chair—and took up the report of ; 
the committee on the Executive Department. A 


Sec. 1. No amendment. 
Sec. 2. Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to amend by providin 


is) 
i: 
C 

a 


FRIDAY, JULY 9, 1847 361 


that the next Governor shall commence his term on the 2d Monday 
in January, 1849, and the next in January, 53, and every four 

years thereafter, &c. Carried. 
_ Mr. DALE moved to strike out “1853” and insert “1850.” Lost. 

Sec. 3. The Governor shall hold his office for the term of 
four years, and until another Governor shall be elected and 
qualified; but he shall not be eligible for more than four years in 
any term of eight years. 

Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to amend by prefixing thereto 
the following: 

“The first election of Governor shall be held on the first 
Monday in November, 1848, and the next election shall be held 
on the first Monday of November, 1852, and forever thereafter 
elections for Governor shall be held once in four years on the first 
Monday of November.” 

Mr. CROSS of Winnebago moved to strike out all after 
“qualified.” Lost. 

Mr. FARWELL opposed the amendment as it put the present 
Governor out of office before the expiration of his term. The 
question being taken the amendment was adopted. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved to add to the section 
**nor any other officer till the expiration of the term.” Carried. 

Sec. 4. No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen 
of the United States at the time of the adoption of this constitution, 
shall be eligible to the office of Governor; neither shall any person 
be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of 
thirty-five years, and been ten years a resident within this State. 

Mr. PRATT moved to strike out the section and insert the 
following; which was lost: 

“No person except a citizen of the United States, and who 
shall have been a resident of this State for the pe[riod] of five 
years next preceding his election, shall be eligible to the office of 
Governor; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who 
has not attained to the age of thirty years.” 

Mr. LEMON moved to strike out “thirty-five,” and insert 
“forty-five.” Lost. 

Mr. SCATES moved to strike out the words “‘a natural born 

. citizen,[’’] and “‘at the time of the adoption of this constitution.” 


362 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


Mr. HENDERSON was in favor of the amendment 
gentleman from Jefferson. He thought that the article as 
stood now would exclude many individuals worthy the offi 
from being chosen by the people. There were several cases w 
the exclusion, contemplated by this section, would operate u 
justly; one of these was in the case a person came here wher 
child, was raised here, with all the feelings and sentiments of : 
American, and he would be excluded from office. He saw 
necessity for the restriction and hoped the amendment aa 
adopted. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said that he rose, not for t 
purpose of making a speech, but merely to say that when 
question would come before them properly for action, and 
the ayes and noes could be called, then this section shall not ] 
without a contest. This section as reported by the committe 
a “Native American” principle carried into effect. Why. was 
old constitution changed? Why was this new theory introdu 


particulars as the people desired to sea changed. Where 
did the people ask for this restriction? Had any apa: beens 


Which of the States that had adopted new banka 
introduced this restriction upon the right of the people to : 
who they may? as 
He was in favor of allowing all citizens the same privil 
Mr. LOCKWOOD said, that the committee had been ur 
mous in their action upon this section, and he knew none of tl 
to be called “Native Americans.” For himself he would say 
he had no prejudice against foreigners, and if the gentleman v 1 
look at the old constitution he will find that this section is mc 
favorable to them than that. 
By the constitution, no foreigner could be eligible to the o 
of Governor, until he had been thirty years a citizen of the Unit q 
States. NG 
Mr. NORTON said, he did not propose, at the present s 
of this question, to enter into any argument upon it. He: she 
vote for the amendment of the gentleman from Jefferson. 


FRIDAY, JULY 9, 71847 363 


should do so for the reason that he would make no distinction 
between American citizens whether native or naturalized. He 
desired to see no such distinction incorporated into our constitu- 
tion. He would desire the people of this country to become in 
- truth one people, and when foreigners leave their native lands, 
and have settled amongst us, he would hold out every honorable 
inducement to them, to become Americans in deed, by conforming 
to the naturalization laws of the United States, and, when they 
have done this, he would offer no obstruction to their advance- 
ment in the State. This is what is contemplated by the amend- 
ment, and he should therefore vote for it. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, he would vote for the report 
as it came from the committee, and would state his reasons for so 
doing. The gentleman from Jo Daviess said, that popular opinion 
was not in favor of this restriction upon foreigners holding the 
highest offices; now he did not know what popular opinion was in 
Jo Daviess, but he knew as well as Mr. C. what it was in Bond 
and Montgomery, and he was sure he was supporting the popular 
opinion of those counties, when he voted for this report. Gentle- 
men say that this is placing an unjust restriction upon the citizens 
of our country, why did those men of the revolution, those who 
signed the Declaration of Independence, and who framed the 
federal constitution, introduce this same provision into it, by 
prohibiting any but a native born citizen of the United States from 
being President? And who desired it to be stricken out? If to 
preserve that principle which should be incorporated into our 
State constitution, and he who desires it not to be stricken out is a 
“Native American,” then I am ‘Native American!” He was 
in favor of giving to foreigners, against whom he wasnot prejudiced, 
all privileges of our citizens they can properly claim, but not to 
the exclusion of Americans; not to raise them above the heads of 
our own countrymen, into high and important offices, before they 
are sufficiently acquainted with our language to speak it plainly. 
They were told that when this question came before them at 
another time, that the ayes and noes would be called, if so, he 
would not be afraid to record his vote in favor of the report. 

Mr. GEDDES said, the friendship expressed for our European 
friends who came to our State, reminded him of certain tribes of 


364 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Indians, who gave to their guests their wives and daughters 
sleep with. Now, while he was ready and willing to give foreigners — 
meat and drink, he was not disposed to give up his bed. He was” 
willing that they should kneel at the same altar with him, but not 
to be his priest. He was willing they should live in the country 
but not to be his rulers. My 

Mr. PRATT stated that he had offered his amendment to 
effect the same object as proposed by the gentleman from Jee 
son, in the amendment now before them, but as it had been voted 
down so quickly, he would like now to state his reasons for pre- 
senting it. He thought that any restriction like that contained 
in the section as reported, was.a reflection upon the intelligence 
of the people—it doubted in them the capability of selecting their 
own rulers, it denied them the right of so doing when their choice” 
fell upon one whose birth was in a different land. No matter wh 
public service, what eminent talent; no matter how capable he 
might be to perform the duties of the office, he was excluded by 
this provision, and the people denied the privilege of elevating 
him. There were many cases where its effect would operate 
unjustly, and one had been cited by the gentleman from Will, “ 
(Mr. HenpErson) of a child who might have been born in a 
foreign land, but who had been reared under our fostering insti- 
tutions, and who had learned to love and revere them, and, no 
matter how eminent and distinguished he might become, was 
forever prohibited from holding the station of Governor of 
State. He had no love for foreigners, but he had ever known 
them to make good citizens, men as devoted to the interests and 
welfare of the country as any others, and as well entitled to the . 
confidence and respect of the Convention as any other class. The. 
old constitution was a virtual prohibition of foreigners from ™ 
holding the office of Governor. It provided that he should bi 
citizen of the United States for thirty years, which, supposing 
foreigner came here at twenty-five years of age, then five yea 
before he became a citizen, and it would make him sixty years 
age before he was eligible to the office of Governor.—That 
an age at which men seldom aspired to such an office, and they 
were, therefore, virtually prohibited. Now if this rule was to be 
changed at all, it should be because it was wrong, and if it was 


FRIDAY, JULY 9, 1847 365 


wrong, why should it be presented in its present shape as a remedy? 
Another objection he had to the section was the proposed increase 
_ in the age of the person to fill the office. Thirty-five years was 
proposed. Why increase it from thirty, as it stood in the old 
constitution? Had any evils resulted from the age being fixed at 
that period? He referred the committee to the fact that when 
DeWitt Clinton, Daniel D. Tompkins, and Gov. Seward were 
chosen Governor of New York, neither had attained the age of 35. 
No one had ever complained of these men, or their administrations, 
because of their age. 

After some further remarks on this subject, he returned to the 
subject of foreigners, and said that in the whole thirty States 
_ there were but three that had a provision in their constitutions 
like this reported by the committee; and neither of those States 
would he cite as an example for this State to follow in the formation 
ofagovernment. Not one of the States which had lately formed a 
constitution had anything of the kind contained amongst their 
provisions. lowa had not; Louisiana and Michigan had not; 
New York had not—her provision is in the very words of his 
amendment which had been voted down. 

Mr. LOGAN said, that when in order he would offer an 
_ amendment changing the section so that fifteen years citizenship 
should be required before a foreigner shall be eligible to the office 
of Governor. He was sorry that so much feeling had been shown 
on this question, and also sorry that the Convention had been 
threatened with the yeas and nays on this question. He had no 
fears himself to have his vote recorded, and he did not think that 
any others were to be influenced by any such proceeding. He had 
no love for foreigners, nor was he prejudiced against them; he 
never regarded foreigners in the community as foreigners through 
fear, favor or affection. He was not disposed to proscribe them, 
while at the same time he was unwilling they should have privi- 
leges, which, in his opinion and in his conscience, he thought they 
were not entitled to. Foreigners are becoming a powerful body 
in this Union; in some States they have a great influence, being 
what is called the balance of power party, and it was no more than 
prudent to guard against danger from an increase of that power 
and influence. 


PE hye 8 eR LE a Seek ee) tee eau 


366 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION 


As to the question of age, for Governor, he was not in favo 
a reducing the period below thirty-five years. An age when 1 
Be generally arrived at that necessary judgment, ric £ 


: office with fidelity and satisfaction. They had fixed the time 

i voting at an age when it was presumed that a man’s mind hai 
iS 

Bt become sufficiently matured to be entrusted with that privileg 
“a and he thought a time should also be fixed at a period when 


A: similar presumption would exist, that his mind had been forme 
and his judgment and capacity so settled that there would be no” 
danger in committing to his hands the guidance of the government, - 
He knew that age did not give more energy to the mind, nor 
oh increase the brightness of the genius, but every day that a m 
approached thirty-five he was improving in steadiness, experie 
and judgment. It was said that young men had been selected 
i for this office, and that there were young men in the State who 
" could fill the office, he would not deny; but it is well known that * 
a: boys have, for a long time, their wild oats to sow, and that, ge 
3 ally, they were more easily influenced by friends and advis 
; and did not possess that stability which age and experience conf 
as Exceptions to this rule may be found, but generally such was 
case. Thirty-five years was a low period to fix, and the yor 
man who has the ability to discharge the duties bf that office, will 
z not be any less qualified when he arrives at that age. 

A man may have a good mind, may shine in the Legisla 
hall, his genius may display itself with more pipes Toe 


: around him; but for the sober discharge of the important duti ie 
a the chief executive office of the State, more than these are requi 
eke —he wants steadiness, calculation, experience and sound judg- 
| ment. You might as well say that we restrict the right of suffrage, 
when we exclude an intelligent boy of eighteen from voting, as to 
complain of our excluding a man from the office of Governor 
he has arrived at thirty-five. The same principle applies to b 
cases. And’so with a foreigner. The man who comes here fi 
a foreign land knows the policy of the government of England, of 
Ireland, and of other countries—and when he comes here, he has” 


ig 


ST OER 
- an 


Pe ee Ree ee R Ty EE Ee te eS ee 


FRIDAY, JULY 9, 1847 367 


ns, to be entrusted with the privilege of voting, is it unjust or 
easonable to require that he shall remain here fifteen years 
before he can be eligible to an office of so much importance as the 
“executive of a State. Another thing. He thought the man who 
“would be selected to fill this office, should have been here a sufficient 
length of time for the people to know him, to become acquainted 
with his principles, and his character; he might be a man of great 
“power of speech, of great conversational powers, of great brilliancy 
‘of intellect, and the people should have time to see through all 
this, not by a casual view, but by a thorough examination into the 
foundation of his character. That time should be given for the 
first blush of a bright appearance to wear off, and then the people 
to say whether he was worthy of their confidence. 

_ This, he thought could be accomplished by the amendment he 
‘would offer. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, he intended to enter 
into no argument upon this subject at the present time. He rose 
now, as he had done at first, to ask the committee, before they 
decide this question, before they commit themselves even upon 
the informal vote here, to pause and reflect, before they 
placed any restriction upon their future action, upon the 
consequences of this proposed change in the old constitution. 
He was in favor of abolishing the restriction of thirty-five years as 
a qualification of the office of governor, and in favor of abolishing 
all and every distinction, now, or at any time, existing between 
the elector and elected. These, sir, are restrictions upon the 
people, they are restrictions upon the right of the people to say 
who shall be their choice to perform the duties of this office. 

He would say that any man at the age of twenty-one years, 
should have full power to do that himself which he is authorized 
to do by an agent. This restriction says he shall not. It says 
that a man can vote for a Governor and shall have the power to 
rule by another, at the age of twenty-one years; but it precludes 
him from doing so, and the people from choosing him to do the 


368 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO. 


same. It says to him you may govern the State by an agent 
you shall not govern it yourself. 

He was in favor of destroying and onde from the | 
stitution every restriction upon the free and untrammel ed 
of the people in the choice of their rulers. But it is said that the 
is great danger of the people selecting a man for Governor, wh 
ignorant, a foreigner, and incompetent to perform the du 
of the station. This is an un-worthy reflection upo 
intelligence and capacity of the people. To say that they 
not intelligence to select men capable and worthy 
deserving of the office, is, he said, a reflection upon 
powers of self-government. Why give them the right 
vote at all, if it was feared they had not the capacity to select 
It is unjust, too, to the naturalized citizen, to exclude him 
account of his birth. Shall it be said in this day that a man whe 
leaves his native land and the home of his youth—who renounce: 
all allegiance to his own and all other foreign princes, poten 
and powers— who comes here to live in a land of freedom- 


enjoy all the rights and privileges of other citizens of our | 
Mr. C. then alluded to the age required for the office of Gove 


to the old and the young—the impetuosity of youth rising 
might and struggling for the mastery, and the calm sobriety 
venerable experience of age—blending together, and displ: 
the same great and correct principles he had been advoc 
when he proposed to open to all, of every age and birth, the r 
and privileges of citizenship, and leaving the people unrestri 
in their free choice. 
Mr. BALLINGALL addressed the Convention in oat oO 
amendment; his remarks will probably appear hereafter. 
‘ Mr. HURLBUT said, that like some others who had spok 
he did not propose to enter into an argument upon this que 
but merely to say a few words in reply to those who compl 


FRIDAY, JULY 9, 1847 369 


of this section because it was a restriction upon the people. What 
is the restriction upon voters in Illinois? Is it not now a rule that 
no man shall vote till he is twenty-one years of age, and that is a 
restriction upon the right to vote, which he did not suppose gentle- 
men desired to abolish. 

Mr. BALLINGALL said, that at common law the right to 
vote was a privilege secured to a citizen. 

Mr. HURLBUT said, he would like to know if that was the 
common law of Illinois? He would like to know if foreigners were 
not now allowed to vote and enjoy all the rights of citizenship 
upon a mere twelve months’ residence in the State? 

A Memser. They are not allowed to sit on juries. 

Mr. HURLBUT. I know they are not called upon to sit on 
juries; jury and militia duties are burdens upon citizens—voting 
is the privilege!—The right to vote is the greatest that can be 
conferred; it is that which makes a man feel that he isa man. In 
rising, he had another object, and that was, to say that a well 
known individual who represented his district in Congress, had 
called him a “Native American,” or, at least, certain remarks 
made by him had been wholly misrepresented by some small petty 

representative of a very small man, and the charge was based 
thereon. He was sure that no one who had listened to his remarks 
had discovered in them anything of the kind represented, and he 
would say to the reporters—no, he would excuse the reporters; 
none of them had done it—he would say to the man, be he who he 
may, who panders to that small man, that he was at liberty to 
state anything he thought proper, which he (Mr. H.) had said; 
but that if he undertook to misrepresent, even as humble an indi- 
vidual as himself, he would find he had mistaken his man. 

The question was then taken on the amendment proposed by 
Mr. Scares, and decided as follows: yeas 74, nays 49. 

Mr. LOGAN moved to add to the section, “and shall have 
been a citizen of the United States for fifteen years.[’’] 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said that he hoped the amend- 
ment just proposed by the member from Sangamon would pass. 
He would like to have this question settled now. Why was there 
so much fear expressed of, and so many warnings against, the 
committee committing themselves by a vote on this question? 


370 «ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Why are not the members as well prepared to vote and act 
upon the subject as at any other time? He would always 
against anything allowing a foreigner to become Goverr 
Illinois, of being appointed a judge of a court, or of holdi 
other important post, after having been only five yearsi in the coun: 
He was not, as he said before, prejudiced against foreigners 
he would always oppose the system pursued by some, of ru 
to them the moment they reach our land, and telling 
“oh, you understand our laws, you understand our governm 


institutions as anybody else, and you must have a vote.” 
they know nothing about our institutions; they are familiar wit 
the political government of the land where they spent their sch« 
boy days; their minds are stored with recollections and view: 
policy imbibed in foreign lands, and they, when they come 
have no true conception of the character of our institutions. 
can they form an idea of our system of government? They 
not read our books, they have no knowledge of our custom 
laws, and in many cases are ignorant of our language. 

We are a progressing people, and our country is fast filli 
Now is the time to apply these wholesome restrictions, which ' 
prevent citizens—born and reared on the soil—from being exch 
by foreigners from the enjoyment of these high offices. Shall 
say that those who framed the constitution of the United St 
were wrong in imposing a restriction in that instrument exch ‘ 
foreigners from holding the two chief offices of the national g 
ment? Sir, this Convention has this day, by the vote just 
and by a large majority, said this restriction imposed in t 
stitution by the fathers of the country was wrong—all wro 
He had no fears of expressing his sentiments. He spoke wha 
believed to be true and correct. He would read to the Co 
tion the opinion of Washington on this subject, and upon | 
views he would make no comments, for he believed the d 
cast; that the question was settled, and he would not be st 
if the time was reduced to five years. He then read a letter 


to foreigners, and one from Mr. Jefferson on the same subj 
He was willing to admit that the circumstances under 


FRIDAY, JULY 9, 7847 371 


those letters were written were different from our present. He 
"was not a “Native American,” but he would say to the Convention 
that the want of such restrictions as is contained in that section 
‘now upon the table, had been the cause of such a party in our 
country. Foreigners came to our land and remained in our large 
cities; they were seized upon by both parties—whig and democrat 
—and for the purpose of forwarding the interests of their respective 
parties, were put into high and important offices, to the exclusion 
of free American citizens, and whose every feeling was for their 
country;—this had driven the people in those cities to unite in 
these associations, formed to protect themselves and countrymen 
from the encroachments of the foreigners. He had no personal 
hostility to any foreigners, but he had seen instances of their being 
elevated over the heads of competent Americans and appointed 
to judgeships, and one of these was in his own county. He 
alluded to Judge Korrner—who was the judge in his circuit, 
who was a foreigner, and he alluded to him, not out of any want 
of respect, for he was a gentleman, a sound lawyer, and an honor- 
able man, but he was unable to charge a jury understandingly, 
because his language was so broken and difficult to be understood. 


Mr. BUTLER thought this was a restriction upon the people. 
Gentlemen would liken it to a restriction upon the Legislature, 
but it was very different. The restriction contained in this 
amendment was upon the people themselves, and questioned their 
capability of judging who should have the offices to be received 
at their hands. We might as well say that we should declare in 
this constitution all the qualifications the Governor should possess, 
and we should say whether he must have received a common 
school, an academical, or a collegiate education; whether he should 
have a classical education or not; whether he shall be acquainted 
with Latin or Greek. This rule, sir, would not be more arbitrary 
than that proposed by the gentleman fromSangamon. Hethought 
that we should place no restrictions in the constitution, but leave 
the matter with the people. 

Mr. GREEN of Tazewell followed in support of the amend- 
ment. He thought that the restriction of fifteen years upon a 
foreigner was not more oppressive than that placed upon native 


before they could vote. 
Mr. see ean of Marshall advocated the amendment 


who had Cited him. 

Mr. GEDDES repeated the views expressed by ied earlie: 
in the debate. 

Mr. ARCHER was opposed to the amendment proposed ; 
the gentleman from Sangamon. He took the same view of it a 
others who had declared it to be a restriction upon the electi 
franchise of the people. He had no sort of doubt of the capabili 
of the people to exercise that right, and was opposed to any pr 
vision restricting it, in the least particular, as he believed it wou 
be safe in their hands, and that the better course for the Conv 


He had no great love for foreigners. He was an Amecicaniiil 
birth, but he had always been proud to believe that the institt 
tions of his country afforded a home for the opressed of all la 
without distinction. He thought that the land of a man’s bi 
was not the test of his right to the privilege of citizenship, but 
merit was the true test to be applied to him. He had no de: 
to dwell upon the acts of foreigners who had taken an active pa 
in our revolution, nor of the many who had rendered such valua 
service, but he would say that he had never heard of an adop 
citizen betraying his country, or of any act unworthy of a citize 
He did not desire that offices should be open to them as soon | 
they arrive in this country, but when they had renounced t 
allegiance to other powers, and had remained here for 
term of five years, and complied with all the requirements whi 
Congress, in their wisdom, had provided as necessary for them t 
become citizens, he desired then to see them become citizens wi 
all the rights and privileges of citizenship without any restrictio 
or distinctions. It had been said that they came to this count 
with recollections of their native land fresh in their mind, and th 
their views and sentiments are influenced by associations of whe 
they had experienced there. He thought this was true in on 
sense. They do come here with a vivid recollection of the lan 
where they have been oppressed, and minds well calculated 


FRIDAY, JULY 9, 1847 373 


“appreciate the freedom of our laws and the beauty of our institu- 
tions, because of the associations of government and tyranny they 

have experienced at home. The amendment would establish that 

the land of a man’s birth, not the man, should be the test by which 
he should be judged. It had well been said, that a man who had 
just arrived here, unknown to the people, ignorant or unqualified, 
would not be selected by the people for the office of Governor. 

Public jealousy, distrust of strangers, will always excite a scrutiny 
into the character of any man offering himself for that office, and 
no danger need be felt that they would select such a person for 
that important office. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin advocated the adoption of the 

amendment. He was opposed to the section as it first was report- 
ed; but thought that the restriction of fifteen years upon a foreigner 
before he could hold the office of Governor was not too great. He 
thought those who denounced all restrictions upon the right to 
vote and hold office had gone too far. There were restrictions 
upon the ladies, precluding them from the enjoyment of these 
rights, and he did not think it was proposed by any to remove 
them. He thought that the period of five years fixed in the con- 
stitution, as the time for a foreigner to reside in this country, had 
been fixed as a period in which he might become acquainted with 
our language; and did not believe that fifteen years was too long 
a term for him to acquire a knowledge of the complicated machin- 
ery of our system of government. He thought that the privilege 
of living under the government of the United States, and enjoying 
the rights and privileges of a citizen of a free republic, should be 
sufficient for any foreigner, without the right to hold office.*4 

§4The following correction was printed in the weekly Register, July 30: 

SPRINGFIELD, July 27, 1847. 
“Editors of the Register: 

In the report in your paper of the 13th inst. of my remarks upon the 
amendment offered by Mr. LoGan to the report of the committee on the 
Executive Department, by which fifteen years’ citizenship is required to 
render a foreigner eligible to the office of Governor, I am made to say in the 
report, that ‘the privilege of living under the government of the United States, 
and of enjoying the rights of a citizen of a free republic, should be sufficient 
for any foreigner, without the right to hold office.’ 

__ The report is incorrect. My language on that occasion was: ‘Even 
_ without the privilege of holding office, foreigners gain immensely by their 


immigration to this country. Here they live under free and equal laws, may 
easily acquire an interest in the soil, and can participate in the power belonging 


- native-born citizen until he has exercised the right of voting 


‘and republicanism from his mother, after he is entitled to a 


374 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


what different from those advanced on the same be au mi 
offer as an apology for this brief allusion to his remarks, the crov 
ed state of our columns. 


[Mr. TURNBULL said that the gentlemen who were oppo 
to the amendment of the gentleman from Sangamon, (Lo 
from their remarks appear to be in favor of making fore 
eligible to the office of Governor as soon as they are entitled 
vote, while they are for preventing the people from electi 


fourteen years to that high office. I ask gentlemen, w! 
opposed to the amendment, how they will answer to the peo 
this State, or to the world, for requiring fourteen years of a na ative 
born citizen—one who has imbibed the first principles of free 


before he is eligible for the office of Governor—and make the 
eigner eligible for that high office as soon as he is entitled to a vot 
Mr. President, I shall vote for the amendment of the gentlem 
from Sangamon, which requires fifteen years residence in 1 
United States after he is entitled to a vote, before the forei 
is eligible for the office of Governor.]** 


Mr. PRATT resumed the subject and spoke at much le ng 
against the amendment and against the restriction upon it 
selection of a young man for the office. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved the committee : 

And the committee rose, reported progress, and asked 
to sit again. Granted. j4,: 

- And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned. 


in monarchies to kings—a voice in the government of a great people; a 
when to this is superadded the fact that, by waiting for a reasonable te 
until they can acquire a knowledge of the construction of our comp 
system of government, they may then aspire to the highest offices in 
of the people. It seems to me that this amendment should satisfy them; 
under this view, I shall vote; and by such of my constituents as are foreig 
I am willing to be judged.’ 
Yours, &c., 
Joun M. PALMER. oP 


gale 


XXVIII. SATURDAY, JULY 10, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. Hate. 

The Convention resolved itself into committee of the whole— 
Mr. Crain in the chair, and resumed the consideration of the 
report of the committee on the Executive Department. 

The question pending was on the amendment of Mr. Locan, 
which was modified by him to read “fourteen” instead of “‘fif- 

_teen”’ years, and being taken] was decided in the affirmative. 

Mr.MARKLEY gave notice of a motion to reconsider the vote. 

Sec. 5. The Governor shall, at stated times, receive for his 

_ services the sum of twelve hundred and fifty dollars per annum; 
which shall neither be increased nor diminished (during the period 
for which he shall have been elected;) and he shall not receive, 
within that period, any other emolument from the United States 
or any of them. 

Mr. SHUMWAY moved to strike out “$1,250” and insert 
“$1,000.” 

Mr. CROSS of Winnebago moved to amend the amendment by 
striking out “$1,000” and inserting—two dollars a day for the 
first forty-two days, and one dollar a day, for each days actual 
service thereafter; which amendment was carried; and the 
question being taken on the amendment as amended it was 
decided in the negative. 

Mr. KNAPP of Jersey offered the following as a substitute for 
the section: 

“That the Governor shall receive the sum of fifteen hundred 
dollars per annum, for his services as Governor, and which sum 
shall not be increased nor diminished.” 

Mr. DALE moved, as an amendment to the amendment, to 
strike out “fifteen hundred dollars,” and insert “one thousand.” 

In presenting the amendment Mr. D. said, that it behooved us, 
in view of the present pecuniary embarrassments of the State, 
to study economy—to introduce it into every department of 
government—and to act with an eye to it, in all our proceedings. 


375 


376 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


The people have clamored loudly, and with justice, against 
heavy expenses of government; and gentlemen, here, would b 
him out in the assertion, that, whilst we had a soil which yi 
its fruits with less of labor and toil of man than did the sa 
amount of territory anywhere else; whils[t], too, our harvi 
were, generally, very abundant, and our farms daily impro: 
and presenting new beauties to the eye, yet, that the citizen, t 
tiller of the soil, did not exhibit that cheerfulness and contentn 
which these outward appearances would seem to indicate and 
justify. The citizen was not entirely satisfied with the admini 
tration of his government—he complained that it was an expenst 
one—that notwithstanding a heavy debt hung over the Si 
which was not, in any material degree, being reduced, yet t 
the taxes of his labor increased and were increasing on him fro 
year to year—he believed and held that a frugal people, who w 
chiefly agriculturists, and whose wealth was dug, by the labor « 
their hands, from the earth, should have an efficient governm 
but a frugal and economical one. To effect reforms which sho 
insure such a government, was a consideration with the peop 
in calling this Convention. In curtailing expenses he was pleas 
to. say that thus far our action had come up to the views < 1 
expectations of the people. The expenses of a State census is 
be saved by adopting the census taken by the U. S. governi 
elections are designed to be held in November and thus the 
sity for two elections in a year avoided; the legislative sessic 
is limited and the pay of members is reduced and thus this hea 
item in former appropriations, will henceforward be comparative 
alight one. Let the same reform be carried into every departn eI 
—our circumstances call for rigid economy—the credit of th 
State demands it. 

If, then, the experience of other States has shou t 
office of Governor can be filled consistently with the p 
interest—can be well filled—at an expense less than that prop 
by the resolution, the people will hold us answerable if we aes 
profit by that experience. . 

The State of Ohio, with a population double that of this St 
allows to her Governor a salary of one thousand dollars; 
Hampshire the same amount; Vermont seven hundred and f 


SATURDAY, JULY 10, 1847 377 


} dollars; Rhode Island four hundred dollars. If, in these States, 
where wealth and luxuriance abound, and some of which are free 
_of debt, these sums are considered compensation, might they not 
well be considered such in this agricultural State—this State of 

" simple manners and frugal habits? 

He was disposed to allow the holders of the office of honor 
little more than a plain citizen required for the support of himself 

and family. The amendment, however, offered by him proposed 
an allowance equal to that reported by the committee as a salary 
for the Auditor. This ought to be sufficient. For a house is 
provided by the State for the Governor—none for the Auditor— 
the office of Auditor, too, is one of more labor and less honor. 
The argument that the Governor must have his levees and give 
his dinners might be a consideration to be entertained if the State 
were differently circumstanced, but should not while she continues 
in her present embarrassed condition. These things are not abso- 
lutely necessary, and if agreeable to the feelings of the Governor 
or any citizen let them be done at their private expense, not at the 
expense of the public. 

Under these reductions of salaries and other expenses, the 
condition of the treasury would improve. Auditor’s warrants 
would no longer be discounted and shaved and hawked about in 
search of buyers—jobs to be done for the State would not longer 
be contracted for at the present ruinous rates to which the State 
is forced, by reason of her paying in miserably depreciated war- 
rants of the Auditor. These moderate salaries too will make it 
the object and the interest of officers and legislators to give 
an eye to the finances of the State and provide against any depre- 
ciation of her paper in the future. : 

But a great gain to the State from this reduction in the salaries 
of officers and pay of members of the Legislature will be in this, 
that the compensation allowed to them will form a standard of 
value, and that, in all contracts made by them in behalf of the 
State with agents, commissioners &c., the sums agreed to be paid 
for services will be regulated by this standard—the compensation 
which members and officers themselves receive. Countenance 
extravagance in them, by giving them large salaries and 
this extravagance will characterize all their appropriations and all 


ee = ee 


378 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT 


contracts made by them for the State. Make, real the 
of members of the Legislature such as has, here, been voted 
them, and the salary of Governor such as proposed by the ai 
ment, and there will be an end to these extravagant expendi 
of which our books are so full—an end to the exorbitant a 


agents to protect canal lands &c., there will be an zee to | 
eternal speculation on the State. . 
Mr. THOMPSON opposed the reduction. 
Mr. WEAD said, his vote upon the sum to be sliowalia L 
Governor would depend entirely upon the duties which would 
assigned him in this constitution; and he would, also, like’ 
know whether it was intended that the Governor should resid 
the seat of government—which in his opinion was an importa 
consideration. The present Governor is, also, fund commission 
and before he could vote to fix the salary of the office, he woi 
like those questions to be answered. Fifteen hundred dollar 
year was not too much for the office, if the Governor was compelle 
to reside here. If allowed to remain at his home, so large 
salary was not needed. In the eastern States, in Massachusett 
New Hampshire—certainly in Vermont, the Governor was : 
required to reside at the seat of government, and that seis 
for the small salaries allowed them. The Governor who is con 
pelled to reside at the seat of government was, in a great measu 
obliged to keep an open house, for members of the Legislature, 1 
receive strangers, and was to some extent the official organ 
the State. He would be obliged to neglect his own business at 
home, and devote himself entirely to public business, while if 
home, he could attend to his ordinary business without any pec 
niary loss. He could see no necessity for our providing that | 
Governor should reside here, and thought that by attending h 
occasionally, at the time of the meeting of the General Assembly, 
that the duties of the office could be administered as well. HE 
would vote for the $1,500. 
Mr. ARCHER was in favor of allowing a good salary to 
Governor and having him reside at the seat of government. — 
Mr. LOGAN was like the gentleman from Fulton, unable 


SATURDAY, JULY 10, 1847 379 


 yote upon this question until he knew what duties the Governor 
_ would be required to perform. He was in favor of the fifteen 
hundred a year. 

_ Mr. PALMER of Marshall was in favor of the sum reported 
by the committee—say twelve hundred and fifty dollars a year, and 
" thought that quite sufficient. He alluded to the State of Indiana 
where he had resided a number of years, and where the salaries 
of the Governor and the judges were very low. 

Mr. BOND was in favor of the one thousand dollars a year. 

The question being on Mr. DaLe’s amendment to strike out 
$1,500 and insert one thousand, the question was divided; and 
being taken on striking out was decided in the affirmative—yeas 
86, nays not counted; and then being taken on inserting, was 
decided in the negative—yeas 44, nays not counted. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess offered the following as a 
substitute for the amendment of Mr. Knapp, to strike out the 
original section and insert—“the Governor shall reside at the seat 
of government, and receive at stated times, as a salary for his 
services, the sum of two thousand dollars per annum, which shall 
not be increased nor diminished; and shall be ex officio fund 
commissioner.” 

In offering the above, he explained the many duties which the 
Governor would be obliged to perform. He was obliged to be at 
the seat of government, as duties required the actual presence of 
the Governor every day. Requisitions from other States for 
persons charged with crime, were coming here, and the Governor 
and he alone was obliged to act upon it; for they required his 
personal action upon them. He was to decide upon their legality 
and could not delegate the power to do so to any other individual. 
They were cases requiring the exercise of his own judgment, and 
unless he were here to attend to them, the parties would have to 
hunt him up in all parts of the State, and the end of justice would 
be defeated by the escape of the accused. The same would apply 
to petitions for pardons, requiring an exercise of power, judgment 
and discretion which could not be delegated to any other person. 

He alluded to the fact that no man of any ability could be 
selected to fill the office at one thousand dollars a year, and it was 
not to be expected that the Governor was to live in a style beneath 


Something must be allowed for the refinements of mind: somet in 
must be allowed to the accomplishments of thought, for th 


State, would occupy a post where such things would be lo 
for, and there should be an allowance for something more 
for the level of society. True these accomplishments of the 
the aristocracy of intellect, were open to all, and should de 


recollected that a man gave up all other business to attend to’ 
office of Governor—and had he a family, had children to ed ate 
how could it be done with such a pittance? He had a right 
educate his children and it should be every delegate’s ambi 
to place it in the power of every man to give his children an 
cation equal to their standing. He (Mr. C.) had lived 
at $1,000 for four years—that is he did’nt live at all. — 
$1,000 for two years, and then was cut down to $800, and h 
speak from experience that the salary was not sufficient to 
a man a living. He had remained here four years in office, 
went home poorer than when he came; he went home and fo 
himself out of business, his clients all gone, other lawyers hi 
taken them,and he found himself like [a] young man just star 
the world; and now was forced to commence anew, to go to w 
at his profession to support himself and family. Mr. C. follor 
the subject much further and concluded by remarking, th 
they allowed picayune salaries they must expect picayune 0 
—if dollar salaries dollar officers. sei), rh. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery replied, and in the course of 
remarks, reminded the committee that at the last session of the. 
islature there were a number of candidates hanging round tl 
Legislature for a vacant judgeship, and the salaries were then bt 


SATURDAY, JULY 10, 1847 381 


then to have the office at one thousand a year. He opposed any 
sum over that proposed by the committee, and would vote for 
that all through. 
_ Mr. LOGAN advocated an increase to fifteen hundred dollars, 
as nothing more than a fair and reasonable compensation. He 
‘thought the effect of reducing the salary to one thousand, would be 
to give the office entirely to men who were rich, and who could 
afford to live even without the salary. He found it difficult even 
for him to live here on one thousand a year. He said that when 
the salary was at one thousand, they had Gov. Duncan, one of 
the wealthiest men in the State; Gov. REynotps another, Gov. 
Epwarps and Gov. Co es, both rich men, and all of whom could 
afford to live as Governor of the State without reference at all to 
the salary. He alluded to the difficulties attending the adminis- 
tration of affairs, if the Governor resided elsewhere than at the 
seat of government, and thought the proposed saving, by allowing 
him to reside at home, would be of more expense to the people 
having business to transact with him, and which required his atten- 
dance, would be more than the proposed increase. He thought it 
Was poor economy; it was spoiling a knife worth twenty-five cents 
to skin a flint not worth a farthing. 

Mr. GREEN of Taz[elwell said, that when the section had 
been proposed he thought it perfectly proper; then came the 
amendments, and he had watched to see who were in favor of 
amending; then he had endeavored to satisfy himself as to the 
motives inducing them toproposetheamendments. And although 
it was not proper at all times to allude to motives of gentlemen, 
he hoped he would be pardoned in stating what had been his 
impressions. He had looked around at those who had proposed 
the increase, and had come to the conclusion that they all had a 
sly notion that at some time or another, they would becalled upon 
to occupy the office, the salary of which we were now about to fix. 
This was more evident to his mind, from the fact, that his friend 
from Sangamon and his friend from Clinton, whose chances were 
very desperate and the probability very slight, proposed only the 

moderate increase of two hundred and fifty dollars; but the gen- 
tleman from Jo Daviess, whose chances were fair, who was on the 
right side, and who had the start of his competitors, had stopped 


willing to “sblige these Beiecep but. fe felt 
the State, which was much embarrassed and 


the patriotism of ae gentlemen, ie i be ta 
get along without them, that they would gene ally 
services at one thousand per annum. — aie 
Mr. HOGUE moved the committee rise 
was carried, and the chairman reported and a: 
again. Granted. tee 
Mr. SCATES suepested Y to the members 


tion adjourn till ae at 9 A.M. 
Carried. 


7 _ -XXIX. MONDAY, JULY 12, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. Patmer of Marshall. 
Mr. LOCKWOOD presented certain propositions in relation 
to the redemption of land sold for taxes, which he said he would 
call up at some other time. 
-_ Mr. HURLBUT moved that it be laid on the table, and 200 
copies be ordered to be printed. Ordered. 
Mr. SCATES, from the committee on the Judiciary made a 
report. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved that 200 copies be printed. Ordered. 

Mr. SCATES, from the same committee, reported back sundry 
resolutions, and asked to be discharged from the further consider- 
ation thereof. Granted. 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac presented a report of the minority of 
the Judiciary committee. Two hundred copies ordered to be 
printed. 

Mr.CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved a call of the Convention, 
and 124 members answered to their names; and then further pro- 
ceedings were dispensed with. 

Leave of absence was granted to Messrs. KREIDER, SHARPE, 
Morris and MILter. 

Mr. HURLBUT, from the Judiciary committee, reported 
certain additional sections to be added to those reported by the 
committee on the Judiciary. ~ 

_ Mr. ROUNTREE offered a substitute. 

Mr. SCATES moved they be laid on the table, and 200 copies 
of each be printed. Carried. 

Mr. DAWSON offered a resolution that a majority of the Con- 
vention shall constitute a quorum to do business, till the 20th, and 
that hereafter that no member shall have leave of absence, unless 
on account of sickness. 

Mr. SCATES moved that the Convention resolve itself into 
committee of the whole. Carried, and Mr. Crain took the Chair. 

The committee resumed the consideration of the report of the 


383 


384 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC' TIONS. seh 


Executive committee. The question pending was on the su 
tute for Section 5, offered by Mr. CampsBeE t of Jo Daviess. b. 
Mr. LOCKWOOD made a few remarks in favor of the Gor 
nor being required to remain at the seat of Government during 
term of office. 


Legislature and that of the Governor. In the former case, the} 
were called here in the winter season, when farmers could lose ; 
crop, when lawyers could attend the supreme court at the sai 
time, and when, from the shortness of the session, no perso 
business would be injured or neglected; while the Governor 
obliged to sell out his furniture at home; give up all his busines 
if a farmer, rent his farm—if a lawyer, lose all his clients, and 
here four years, entirely cut off from any other business. — 
thought the reduction of the salary to $1,000 would have the effe 
of excluding all poor men from the office, and secure it to the ri 
that the State would be deprived of the talents which povert 
possesses, and have rich men for Governors howe they w 
stupid and incompetent. 
Mr. PINCKNEY thought that $2,000 was cxtrayaeanel 
would vote for $1,500 a year as the salary of the Governor. — 
Mr. McCALLEN thought the discussion upon the salary w 
premature. He would like to know what duties were to be 
quired of the officer, and whether he would be required to resi 
here, before he could vote upon the amount of his salary. If the 
office was to be a mere nominal one, one of empty title onl 
$500 would be sufficient, but if required to reside here, and gi 
up all his other business, and devote himself to the duties of 
office, $2,000 was nothing more than a fair remuneration. Hey 
of opinion that the effect of allowing but a small salary wou 
be to deprive every poor man in the State of the privilege of ho 
ing the office, and to raise up an aristocracy of wealth which 
was our policy to oppose. 
Mr. PALMER of Marshall advocated the amount proposé 
by the committee—$1,250. 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess modified his substitute 
leaving the amount of salary blank; and it was then adopted. — 


MONDAY, JULY 72, 1847 385 


_ Mr. WEST supported $1,500 as a proper sum. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, that at the suggestion 
of his friend from Madison he would move to fill the blank with 
$1,500. 

Mr. SCATES opposed the amendment as an unnecessary ex- 
travagance, in the present circumstances of the State; and was of 
opinion that the proper inquiry was, what sum was necessary to 
‘enable a man to live comfortably and well, and not what was re- 
quired to enable him to live extravagantly.—The State should 
allow her Governor a sum sufficient to support him while in office, 
‘and no more; he did not think he should be paid for his services. 
He had made inquiries, and was informed that his friend from 
Sangamon, (Mr. Epwarps) who, as everyone was aware, lived 
well, gave the most elegant and sumptuous entertainments, and 
whose house was always open to the members of the Legislature 
and strangers, had said that his expenses did not exceed $1,200 a 
year. Upon this sum, said Mr. S., I think the Governor may live 
comfortably and well, and I do not think that any one who may 
hold the office will desire to exceed in comfort and hospitality the 
gentleman from Sangamon. 

_ Mr. THOMAS moved to fill the blank with “two thousand 
dollars;” and, on a division, the motion was lost. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, that he would like to ask 
the gentleman from Jefferson, if he, when he was receiving fifteen 
hundred dollars a year as judge of the Supreme Court, succeeded 
in laying up a large sum of money? Did he complain that that 
pay was too large, too extravagant? If there were any such com- 
plaints made, he (Mr. C.) never heard of them; but he had, when 
the salary was at one thousand, heard them declare from their 
seats that it was impossible for them to live at that pay and sup- 
port their families. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery replied, that the judges were 
obliged to be absent from their families for nine months in the 
year; that they were obliged to pay tavern bills, when board was 
at one dollar to one dollar and fifty cents a day, and that their 
expenses were such that one thousand dollars was not sufficient. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon said, that he was sorry his name 
had been introduced, as the remark had been made by him with- 


case of a Governor who came hae from another pe: cidk ao 
As to the hospitality which the Governor would be obliged t t 


he did not think.this should have any weight upon the quest 
Past experience, and he made the remark in no spirit of unk 
or of personal application, had clearly satisfied him that it 
be dispensed with. Not one of the State officers who had resi 
here for years past, with the exception of Mr. Walters, ever 
shown any hospitality to strangers or members of the Legi 
or had kept an open house, such as spoken of by gentler 
Moreover, he was informed that the present Governor ren 
the house provided for him by the State, and has the am 
the rent deducted from his board. He thought the sum pr 
by the committee sufficient. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, that the reason 
no parties, nor kept an open house while he was a State offic 
that the State did not allow him enough to do so with. 

Mr. EDWARDS said, he did not refer to the gentleman; h 
well known spirit of hospitality and friendship satiefied a nat 
was not his fault, if he was not generous. i 

The question was taken on the motion to insert $1, 
result yeas 55, nays 62. Some misunderstanding having ex 
in relation to the vote, a recount was had, and resulted y 
nays 63, and the motion was lost. 

Mr. McCALLEN moved to amend by inserting, “the o offic 
Governor shall be let to the lowest responsible bidder.” — 

Mr. GEDDES moved to fill the blank with $1,250. 

Mr. NORTON proposed $1,400. 

Mr. KNOWLTON proposed $1,450, and the heart 
taken on the $1,400, it was decided in the negative—y 
nays 71. The question was taken on $1,450, and resulted 
28, nays 70; noquorum. A motion was made that the cor 
rise, and decided in the negative—and then the amendm« 
lost. The question was taken on inserting $1,250, and res 


MONDAY, JULY 12, 1847 387 


eas 83, nays 22; noquorum. And then, on motion, the commit- 
ee rose, and asked leave to sit again. Granted. 
On motion the Convention adjourned till 3 Pp. m. 


AFTERNOON 


~ Mr. SHUMWAY moved a call of the Convention, and the 
‘Convention was called, and 99 members answered to their names; 
after some delay a quorum appeared. 

~ Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to take up the resolution which had 
‘been laid on the table in the morning, providing that a majority 
‘shall constitute a quorum—yeas 41, nays 40, no quorum. A 
second vote was taken, yeas 56, nays 49; no quorum. The yeas 
and nays were ordered, and the question was decided in the nega- 
tive—yeas 41, nays 71. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of de Daviess moved the Convention ad- 

journ. Lost. 

Mr. AIKEN offered the following: 

Wuereas, Mr. HAtcs, in a sermon on the 11th day of July, in 
the 2d Presbyterian Church,denounced the existing war with Mexico, 
as being unjust; and whereas, such declarations ought not to be 
tolerated, more especially in a republican government; and 
whereas, it is unbecoming in a Minister of the Gospel, to use such 
language in [a] Gospel sermon, or before the young and rising genera- 
tion, therefore; 

Resolved, That said Mr. Hale be excused from holding prayers 
in this Convention for the future. 

Mr. CROSS of Winnebago moved to lay it on the table. 
Yeas 71, nays 23: no quorum. The yeas and nays were ordered 
and resulted—yeas 82, nays 36. 

Mr. LOCKWOOD offered a resolution that a majority of the 
Convention shall be a quorum to do business till the 20th inst. 
Yeas 45; nays not counted. Lost. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved that the Rev. Mr. Hale 
be excused from praying in this Convention for the future. Mr. 
C. said that so far as Mr. Hale was personally concerned he felt 
kindly toward him, but he objected to any man speaking of those 
who had gone forth to fight the battles of their country as a moral 
pest to society. 


Sean i Bae Seed aS 


388 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION 


C. replied he had not. Mr. T. on said that second-hat 
dence was inadmissable ee 


what had been said by the aanflene from Jo Daviess. 
particular in noticing the language used. 
Mr. WEST said, that he was present ind heard the se: 


there were many honorable exceptions. ; 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess. Honorable exceptions i 
body of men who had perilled their lives in a defence of 
country! Worse than the other. 
Mr. WEST. He said exceptions amongst the poleneeseaae ry 
Mr. CAMPBELL. Well, honorable exceptions amongst thos 
who had battled in the cause of their country! ) 
Mr. SINGLETON said, that in order to obtain infornigelal ¢ 
what Mr. Hate had really said, and to enable him to de 
himself, he would move to lay the subject on the table. Car 
Mr, KNAPP of Scott offered the following resolution: 
Resolved, That the Convention highly appreciate the ser 
of the volunteers, both officers and privates, of this State, who 
perilled their lives in the cause of our common country in the y 
with Mexico, that their fame is established upon an immova 
basis, far above the reach of calumny, having earned for t 
selves a character that needs no vindication, and which anne 
impaired by detraction. 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved to add to ‘the re 
tion the following: “‘And this Convention highly deprecai 
reflections upon the character of the volunteers, coming fror 
pulpit or any other source.” 
On this resolution and amendment a debate ensued, in whicl 
Messrs. Dertz, CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess, PincKNEyY, and B VI 
of Montgomery participated. 3 
Mr. LOGAN moved to insert after the hed “character, in 
the amendment, the words “for courage or patriotism.” 


a ie MONDAY, JULY 72, 1847 389 
he question being taken thereon, it was decided in the negative; 
and then the amendment of Mr. Campzett was adopted. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin offered a preamble and resolution, 
as a substitute. The preamble contained a recital of the general 
principles set forth in the constitution of the United States, and. 
the resolution disclaimed any power to control an expression of 
opinion by any person. 

The debate was resumed and continued by Messrs. ARCHER, 
~McCatien, Servant, Locan, Patmer, and CampsBett of Jo 
Daviess. 

Mr. Campse tt of Jo Daviess moved to lay the substitute on 

the table. 

Mr. Patmer of Macoupin moved to lay the whole subject on 
the table. The question was divided and taken first by yeas and 
nays on laying Mr. P.’s resolution on the table—yeas 60, nays 54. 

Then on laying the preamble on the table—yeas 9, nays 102. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to refer the preamble to the commit- 
tee on Bill of Rights. 

_ Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon raised a point of order—could 
the preamble be so referred? 

_ After argument in opposition to the order of the motion by 
Mr. Casey and Mr. Locan, the Cuair decided the motion to be 
in order. 

‘Mr. SERVANT moved to lay the motion of reference on the 
table—yeas 53, nays 44. No quorum. 

Mr. GEDDES moved the Convention adjourn till Thursday 
at 3 P. M.—yeas 41, nays 51. Lost. 

The motion to lay the reference on the table was then put 
again and carried. 

The question was then put on the substitute, (the preamble) 
and resulted yeas 44, nays 50. No quorum voting. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved the Convention adjourn 
till Thursday at 3 p. m. 

Mr. BOND moved the Convention adjourn sine die—ayes 
and noes demanded, and then the motion was withdrawn. 

Mr. WHITESIDE moved the Convention adjourn for two 
weeks. 


4 


Lien till the 1 Oy af Scenes 
Mr. BOND renewed his motion to ‘adjo n Sin 
and noes were demanded and ordered. Rainy th. 
Mr. Z. CASEY appealed to the gentleme | to 
‘motions, and to the Convention to proceed th t 
which they had been sent. He deprece ted t ie 


Messrs. WHITESIDE, BOND, CAMPE 
severally, withdrew their motions, and the ( 
to attend the funeral of Col. Hardin, at Jacks 71 
adjourned till T[hlursday at3P.M. 


XXX. THURSDAY, JULY 1s, 1847 


_ The Convention, pursuant to adjournment, met at 3 P. M. 

_ Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, there was apparently no 

“quorum present, and probably there was not in town. He, there- 
fore, moved the Convention adjourn till to-morrow at eight o’clock; 

and the question being taken on the motion, was decided in the 
negative. 
_ Mr. PETERS moved a call of the house; and it was ordered. 

_ The Convention was called, and after the absentees had been 

called again, a quorum appeared. 

Mr. Z. CASEY moved that all further proceedings under the 
call be dispensed with. Carried. 

_ Mr. Z. CASEY moved the Convention resolve itself into com- 
‘mittee of the whole, and the Convention did resolve itself into 
committee of the whole—Mr. Cratn in the chair, and resumed the 
consideration of the report of the committee on the Executive 
Department. 

The question pending, was on filling the blank, in the substi- 
tute proposed by Mr. Campse t of Jo Daviess for the fifth section, 
with the sum of $1,250, (annual salary of the Governor;) and the 
vote being taken thereon, it was decided in the affirmative. 

The section was then passed over informally for the present. 
Sections 6 and 7 were passed without amendment. 

Sec. 8. The Governor shall have power to grant reprieves, 
commutations, and pardons, after conviction, for all offences 
except treason and cases of impeachment, upon such conditions 
and with such restrictions and limitations as he may think proper, 
subject to such regulations as may be provided by law relative to 
the manner of applying for pardons. Upon conviction for treason, 
he shall have power to suspend the execution of the sentence until 
the case shall be reported to the General Assembly at its next 
meeting; when the General Assembly shall either pardon the 
convict or commute the sentence, direct the execution of the sen- 
tence, or grant a further reprieve. He shall, biennially, communi- 


3g! 


392 


cate to the General Assembly each case of reprieve, commu ati 
or pardon granted; stating the name of the convict, the crim 
which he was convicted, the sentence and its date, and the d 
of commutation, pardon, or reprieve. 

Mr. PETERS offered to amend. After “applying f 
dons,”’ at the end of first sentence, insert, Pa he shall als 


the indictment shall be pending, shall recommend to him to ¢ fi 
such pardon;” which amendment was adopted. 
Mr. KNAPP of Scott moved to insert after the word “q 
where it first occurs, the words, “‘and his reasons for granting 
pardons.” a 
Mr. HARDING offered as a substitute for the amendment 
“and at the time of such pardon he shall publish at large his rea 
for granting the same;” which substitute was rejected. — 
And the question beak taken on the amendment, it re 
yeas 37, nays 59—no quorum voting. And a second vote ‘bei 
taken, it stood, yeas 35, nays 70—no quorum voting. At ds 
committee rose and reported that fact to the Convention. 
Mr. THOMAS moved a call of the Convention. Ordere 
and a quorum responded to their names. The Convention 1 
resolved itself into committee of the whole again, and the 
being taken on the amendment, it was decided in the negatit 
Mr. HARDING renewed his substitute as an amendme t 
and the same was again rejected. “ 
Mr. TURNBULL moved to strike out the words “ bien fe 
the General Assembly” and insert “publish in the several f 
published at the seat of government.’ Messrs. ARCHE 
Davis of Montgomery opposed the amendment and Mr. Bs 
BLE advocated its adoption. a 
The question being taken, the amendment was rejected. | a 
Mr. McCALLEN moved toamend by inserting after “treason” 
the word “murder.” 
He said, that when the report of the Judiciary committe 
before the Convention, he intended, if none else did, to mo 
abolition of capital punishment, and the object’ of this amendr ne 
was to meet that proposition. He desired that when a man 


THURSDAY, JULY 15, 1847 393 


. convicted of Beier, that he should not be hung, and at the same 
‘time he wished to place him beyond the reach of the pardoning 
_ power, by the Governor. 

Mr. KINNEY of Bureau opposed the amendment briefly. 

’ The question being taken on the amendment it was decided in 
the negative. 

Sec. 9 was passed without amendment. 

Sec. 10. He may, on extraordinary occasions, convene the 
General Assembly by proclamation, and shall state to them, when 
assembled, the purpose for which they shall have been convened; 
and the General Assembly shall be limited in their action to such 
matters only as the Governor shall lay before them. 

Mr. PETERS moved to add at the end of the section: “Ex- 
‘cept at such special session trials of cases of impeachment may 
be had, and removals from office made in the manner provided in 

the constitution.” 

And the question being taken thereon, the same was rejected. 

Mr. SCATES moved to insert after “occasions” the following: 
“which would cause great and irremediable injury by delay;” and, 
on a division the amendment was lost. 

Mr. THORNTON moved to strike out all after the words, 
“the general assembly shall,” and insert “enter upon no legislative 
business except that for which they were specially called.” 

Mr. CHURCHILL offered the following as an amendment to 
the amendment: strike out all after the word “proclamation,” and 
insert, “the general assembly, when so convened, shall have the 
same power, and be liable to the same restrictions as in a regular 
session.” 

And the question being taken thereon, the same was rejected. 
The question recurring upon the amendment of Mr. THornTon, it 
resulted, yeas 43, nays 60; no quorum voting. A second vote 
was taken, and the amendment lost—yeas 42, nays 68. 

Mr. McCALLEN moved to strike out all after “proclama- 
tion.” 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved to strike out all after 
“convened;”” which was accepted by Mr. McC. as a modification 
of his amendment. 


394 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL CO1 


fa: Mr. CONSTABLE moved the commit 
and ask leave to sit again; which was carri 

The committee then rose, reported prog | 
sit again; which was granted. 

A motion was made that the Convention a 
at 9 A. M., but the motion was negatived; and t 
Convention adjourned until 8 A. M. to-morroy 


XXXII. FRIDAY, JULY 16, 1847 


‘Prayer by Rev. Mr. Green of Tazewell. 
Messrs. MOFFETT, JACKSON, KNOWLTON, BROCK- 
N, and FARWELL, presented petitions from their respective 
inties, praying the appointment of a superintendent of common 
“schools, all of which were referred to the comm ttee on Education. 
eg: _ Mr. WOODSON offered the following as two additional rules; 
which were adopted—yeas 71, nays So: 
Rute. No resolution or proposition which has been or which 
shall be hereafter introduced in the Convention shall be considered 
unless it relates to or is directly connected with the “alteration, 
‘revision or amendment of the constitution,” without the consent 
| “of at least two-thirds of the members of the Convention previously 
obtained, and if such consent be so given, the same whall be voted 
on without debate. 
_ Route. Hereafter, immediately after the reception of petitions 
and reports from the standing committees, the Convention shall 
resolve itself into a committee of the whole on the reports of 
standing committees, which shall be the standing order of the day 
— the same are concluded. 
Leave of absence was granted to Messrs. JAMES, KITCHELL, 
PALMER of Macoupin. 
_ Mr. WEAD, from the special committee on townships, and 
the organization thereof, made a report containing a proposed 
article to be incorporated in the constitution; which was read, laid 
on the table, and 200 copies ordered to be printed. 
The Convention then, on motion, resolved itself into committee 
a the whole, and resumed the consideration of the report made by 
the committee on [E]xecutive Department—Mr. Crain in the 
chair. 
_ The question pending was on the amendment proposed by 
Mr. McCALLEN. 
_ Messrs. MINSHALL and EDWARDS of Madison made a few 


395 


is 


396 ILLI NOI S HISTORICAL COLLECT! ONS 


remarks in opposition to the amendment and 1 in favor of the se 
tion as reported by the committee. a 

Mr. KINNEY of Bureau said, that he would be in favor of h 
report of the committee if he thought that it would hereafter | 
construed in the manner intended by the committee, but he < 
sidered that another interpretation than that intended woulc 
placed upon it, and he would, therefore, move to strike out 
last clause, and have the same idea inserted in language that ( 
not be misconstrued. 

Mr. LOGAN said, he desired to say a few words in explanat 
of the position he occupied on this question. He thought he sa 
when looking at this question through the dark vista of futu: 
scenes of tyranny, oppression and misrule; a violation of the great 
principles of republican government, and the constitutional es 
lishment of a legislative department, abandoned to the power a 
control of one man, styled Governor. This would be the ef 
of the last clause in the section now before us, if retained in 
constitution. 

He opposed the section in its present shape, because it confe 
upon the Governor legislative power, which was not contempla 
by any of the States, or the people of this State, when they pi 
posed to establish a republican form of government. Our gover 
ment was one of three co-ordinate branches, and it was nev 
designed that either one of those departments was to invade | 
the duties of the others, or in any way assume the peculiar fu 
tions not belonging to itself.. The clause in the section now bet 
us placed in the hands of one man the great and dangerous po 
to direct and control the Legislature in its actions—to say t 
“thus far shalt thou go and no farther;” to say to it what acts 
required them do, and to deny them the right of legislating upo 
those subjects which he had no desire should be touched. T 
section gave him this dangerous power over the action of 
Legislature at a called session, and if the principle was good 
special session, why would it not hold good at the regular sessio 
If it was safe and proper to give him the power at one session, 
not let him have it at all sessions? If the great evil to be drea 
at special sessions. was excessive legislation, and this section V 
intended as a remedy for that, why not apply it to general sessions; 


FRIDAY, JULY 16, 1847 397 


for the remedy if good in one case was good in the other. He 
thought that under the spirit of our system of government, the 
legislative power properly belonged to the Legislature as the im- 
mediate representatives of the people, and that it contained the 
views and sentiments of the people, and a better knowledge of 
what laws the people desired than under any circumstances could 
be possessed by a Governor. And he objected against the bestow- 
al of such an immense power upon the Governor. The constitu- 
tion never contemplated conferring any legislative power upon 
‘the Governor; it gave him the power to call the Legislature 
together when extraordinary circumstances required it, because 
that body had no power to call themselves together. He also 
opposed the vesting in the Governor the power to call a session of 
_ the Legislature, and propose to them, as long as they continued 
in session, new schemes and projects. He desired to see the object 
set forth in the proclamation calling them together, and none 
other allowed, as it would be found to be the case that the Governor 
would find himself beset by friends, political friends, who would 
beg him to recommend to the Legislature favorite measures 
desired by them, and they, in their turn, would support the schemes 
of the Governor, and thus, by a system of combination and log- 
rolling, the Governor would be enabled to wield an extensive 
legislative power. He would thus become a central power, and 
could control the others. He thought the Legislature the proper 
body to judge of what was its proper duties, and what ee 
was required for the people. 

Mr. KNOX moved, as an amendment, to add to the section 
“at the commencement of the session.” 
_ Mr. BROCKMAN followed in favor of the section as it stood. 
He thought the general sessions of the Legislature, to be held 
biennially, would be sufficient for the legislation required by the 
people, and for the stability in them so much desired; and that the 
extraordinary session should be devoted solely to the business 
which the Governor should lay before it. He had full confidence 
in the Legislatures that might come after us, and dreaded no 
such evil results as had been predicted by the gentleman from 
Sangamon. 

Mr. HAWLEY opposed the section as unprecedented, and as 


398 


one calculated to defeat the object of the format 
ent legislative department. 


and coanmeeeted the probability of the evils deg ts 
man to be consequent upon the adoption of this secti ’ 
Mr. DEMENT was in favor of the old constitution as 1 
in reference to this subject, and opposed to the section | 
by the committee. He did not believe that the effec 
restriction would be to restrict legislation at the extr: 
session, but would rather increase it. Every member 1 
any particular subject which he desired legislation upon, 1 On 
upon the governor and request him to call the attention 
legislature to it; and if he had not the influence with the Gor 
he would by the intervention of friends, obtain that pi 
The Governor would feel obliged, from feelings of courtesy, 
so, and thus every sort of matter would be before the 
and that too with the sanction of the governor’s recom 
that they were matters of importance. And, in this 
Governor himself would be placed in a very delicate p 
either to recommend trifling matters or to lay himself ope 
charge of denying one man’s request when he may have 
to that of another. He thought there was no danger in entr 
the legislature with all matters, and allowing them to be the f 
judges of what was required by the people. He again , 
would prefer the provision as it stood in the old consti 
the section as reported by the committee. 
Mr. DAVIS of Massac said, that he supposed +e obj 
committee, in reporting the section, or the last clause o: 
prevent any legislation upon matters other than those 
it had been called. He was in favor of the object whi 
had in view, but he did not believe that it would be effe: 
section as it now stood. The clause, which it was p 
to strike out, placed in the hands of the Governor the : 
recommend and lay before the legislature at this extrz 
session, any subject which he might think proper, whe 
subject had any reference to the specific object of the calle 
or not. Mr. D. was not willing to give the governor t is 
by Ay he would be enabled to regulate the action of th 


) tae Sosy bats oS oe ee sk 
eo aes Sie yt . Ws 


FRIDAY, JULY 176, 1847 399 


e by submitting to them whatsoever he thought proper, and 
i legislation upon subjects which he only, perhaps, had a : 
lesire or an interest in having legislative action upon. He was 
posed to it because he considered that when the legislature was 
ed together, which should be only when extraordinary business 
uired their immediate action, they should be confined in their 
ctions to the object for which they were called, and should enter . 
o no business but that stated in the proclamation. He would 
€ against the amendment offered by the gentleman from Knox, 
order that the amendment offered by the gentleman from 
elby (Mr. THornTon) on yesterday, and which had been voted 
wn, might be reconsidered, and adopted. That amendment 
defined, in proper terms, the action of the legislature at the extra- 
ordinary session, and prohibited any general legislation. It was | 
similar toa provision in the constitution of the State of Tennessee, 
and he was sure it had not been understood, or else it would have 
been adopted. 
if Mr. WEAD was in favor of the section as it had been reported, 
ad opposed to any amendment. He thought that it was under- 
stood that the people of the State felt there had been too much 
Tegislation in Illinois, and they had been informed upon that 
subject to-day, by men of experience and of age. That there 
had been too much legislation none could deny; and to remedy 
that evil and guard against it for the future, was one of the princi- 
pal reforms expected from this Convention. Laws had been 
‘passed at one session and changed at the next; and all this was to 
& prevented for the future. 

Tt. however, general legislation was desired more frequently 
pd once in two years, why not have the Legislature meet every 
‘year, and do away with the provision for biennial sessions? He : 
considered this matter settled and thought the only question now 
for them to dispose of was, what restrictions should be placed upon 
the action of the extraordinary sessions, which might be called by 
‘the Governor. It was, should we confine them to legislation upon 
the subjects contained in the proclamation by the Governor or 
to what i is laid before them, in his message to them, when they 

| have assembled or shall we allow them to act upon what he 

may lay before them from time to time, during the session or 


x , 


<n 


- sessions to be held biennially, thus prohibiting general legi: 


4oo ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE 


which they may think proper for them to legislate upon, 
ent of the object for which they may have been called? 
in his opinion, were the proper subjects of inquiry. The 
been settled by the former action of the Convention, in fixing 


more than once in two years. To the first there were 
objections; one of these was, that no man could forsee t 
number of events that might transpire between the time of is 
the proclamation and the time of the meeting of the Legis 
and the Governor may set forth in that proclamation a vas 
ber of subjects, which will embrace every sort of matter pro 
legislative action, some of which may not be popular wi 
people in one section, and some unpopular in another se 
The Convention has already said that the legislature shal 
but once in two years for general legislation, with unlimited po 
except so far as restrained by the general provisions of the 
stitution, and can we not provide the restrictions to be 
upon their action when assembled for a specific object, sc 
confine them to legislation upon that object, without prejud 
their action, or treating them with distrust? Much good y 
found to result from this resolution. Take away from the 
nor this privilege of laying before them the only subjects 
which they can act, and you throw open the doors again to all 
evils of special, and local, and excessive legislation, as we 
have if the sessions were annual. 
He was in favor of allowing the Governor this Aisi up 
action of the Legislature at this extraordinary session, 
feared none of those evils, of combination and log-rolling, 
had been spoken of by the gentlemen. The Gove 
was to be presumed, was to be a man of some charac 
honesty, and that very character, his pride, his self-resp 
his regard for his position as representative of the State 
whole people, and not any local interest or section, wou 
him above such contrivances and designing schemes, and 
all his actions with a desire to promote the general welfare of t 
State. He will take care that all things proper and desirable | 


FRIDAY, JULY 16, 1847 401 


action of the Legislature shall be brought before the people 
all others excluded. 


_ The question was then taken on the amendment of Mr. Knox, 
d it was rejected. 

A _ The question recurring on the amendment of Mr. McCatien 
‘to strike out, it was decided in the negative—yeas 60, nays 64. 
__ Mr. WOODSON moved to strike out the words, “lay before 
them,” and insert: “‘set forth in his proclamation.” 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved, as an amendment to the amend- 
“ment, to add to the same: “and such other subjects as may be 

introduced by the concurrence of two-thirds of the members of 
each house composing said general assembly, based upon the 
“important exigency demanding this action and connected with the 
public welfare.” 

' Mr. PRATT opposed the amendment of Mr. W. as without a 
precedent in any state constitution in the Union, where the 
_ instance or precedent of a case where the Governor was required 
to state, in his proclamation calling an extraordinary session, 
the object for which he convened them. He would refer the 
gentleman to the extraordinary session of the Congress in 1837, 
called by the President. In the proclamation the object was not 
expressed, although every one knew the cause—the financial 
‘difficulties of the land;—but at the meeting of Congress, the 
_ President sent to them his message upon the subject of the finances 
of the country, and submitted to them the Independent Treasury. 

‘Congress, however, at the extraordinary session, rejected the 

Independent Treasury, and adopted a loan by treasury notes, for 
the Independent Treasury bill was not passed for two years after- 
wards. No such thing was required in any state in the Union, and 
there were good reason|s] for not doing so. One great reason 

was, the great expense of so doing. If the arguments were set 
forth in detail in the proclamation, it would make it very long, 

and to have it published in all the papers over the state, would cost 

a great amount, which he thought it better to avoid. 

Mr. WOODSON said, that if he understood the objection 
urged by the gentleman, it was that the proposition contained in 


402 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC 


the amendment was one which had not been required b ¥ 0 1e 
states; this was one reason in his (Mr. W.’s) opinion, why it sh 
be adopted, and the legislature confined to the specific ob 
which they had been called upon to legislate. By havin 
object stated in the proclamatlilon it would be known to 
people in the state, and the representatives might be enabk 
obtain an expression of the people’s sentiments upon the subj 
We had already made provision, in the article of the constit 

reported by the committee on the Legislative Department 
the legislature should meet, for purposes of general lea 


demanded by the people; and if they were to be called toge 
on these extraordinary occasions, the people should knoy 
object of the call, and the representatives ought to have tf 
before the meeting of the session, to exchange their view: 
sentiments with their constituents upon matters which they 1 
to act upon; and when they did meet to carry out the wishe 
their constituents. upon that subject, act upon it, and that « 0: 
and then go home. i 

Mr. LOGAN said, he would say one word to the conden 
from Jo Daviess (Mr. Pratr) upon the question of expens ee 
the objects which the Governor desired to lay before the legis! 
at these extraordinary sessions were presented in detail t 
people, at the time of the proclamation calling the general a 
bly together, it would not cost any more than if he did so, 
would, in his message to them at the opening of the sessi 
They would have to be presented at one time or the other, and # 
expense would be no less at one time than at the other. _ 

Mr. PRATT replied, that the gentleman from Sangamon 
mistaken. To have the long proclamation advertised in 
various papers of the state, for a month or more previous to 
meeting of the legislature, would cost considerably more the 
having the message set up at one office, and then 20,000 e: 
copies, which would cost but the price of the paper and the pres 
work in addition, circulated over the state. If that gentlen 
would examine, he would find out that there would be considera 
difference in the cost. f 

The question was then taken on the amendment of Mr. C 


FRIDAY, JULY 16, 1847 403 


BLE, and the same was rejected. And thereupon the motion 
f Mr. W. to strike out and insert, and the same was rejected— 
eas 59, nays 63. 

OY Mr. HAYES moved the committee rise, &c.; and the com- 
mittee rose, reported progress, and asked leave to sit again. 
Granted. 

_ And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned till 3 Pp. . 


AFTERNOON 


The Convention met, and immediately resolved itself into 
committee of the whole—Mr. Crain in the chair. 

Mr. PETERS moved to reconsider the vote by which the 
amendment proposed by Mr. Tuornton had been rejected. 

And the vote being taken on reconsidering the same, it was 
decided in the affirmative—yeas 63, nays 57. And then the said 
amendment was adopted—yeas 75, nays 33. 

Mr. KENNER moved to strike out the words, “‘when assem- 
bled the purposes for which they were convened,” and the same 
was adopted—yeas 76, nays 40. 

Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to strike out the whole section; 
which motion was negatived—yeas 41, nays 72. 

_ Sec. 11. He shall be commander-in-chief of the army and 
navy of this state, and of the militia, except when they shall be 
called into the service of the United States. 

Mr. KENNER moved to strike it out. 

Mr. WHITESIDE offered, as a substitute: “He shall be 
commander-in-chief of the militia of the state, except when they 
shall be mustered into the service of the United States.” 

_ And the question being taken, both motions were decided in 
the negative. 

Sec. 12. No amendment. 

SEC. 13. Provipinc ror a LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR OF THE 
STATE. 

Mr. OLIVER moved the section be stricken out. Rejected. 

Sec. 14. The Lieutenant Governor shall, by virtue of his 
office, be Speaker of the Senate; have a right, when in committee 
of the whole, to debate and vote on all subjects, and, whenever 
the Senate are equally divided, to give the casting vote. 


_ it shall have originated; who shall enter the objections « 


404 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COL. 


Mr. CHURCHILL moved to strike out: yen 


in committee of the whole, to debate and vote « on : 
ee 


Lost. 
Sections 15 and 16 were passed without amendment aati 
Sec. 17. If the Lieutenant Governor shall be called 1 

administer the government, and shall, while in such ad 

tion, resign, die, or be absent from the state, during the 

the General Assembly, it shall be the duty of the S 

State for the time being to convene the Senate for the 

choosing a speaker. 

Mr. CHURCHILL moved to strike out al shiey 
and insert: ‘“‘the speaker of the house of representatives 
as Governor.”’ Lost. 

Sections 18 and 19 were passed without siudncanaies 

Sec. 20. Every bill which shall have passed the 
and House of Representatives shall, before it becon 
be presented to the Governor: if he approve, he shall sign’ 
if not, he shall return it, with his objections, to the house i et ; 


their journal, and proceed to reconsider it. If, after such r 
sideration, two-thirds of the members present shall agree f 
the bill, it shall be sent, together with the objections, to tl 
House; by which it shall likewise be reconsidered; and a 
by two-thirds of the members present, it shall bora 11 
withstanding the objections of the Governor. But ir 
cases the votes of both Houses shall be determined by ‘ 
nays; and the names of the members voting for or aga 
shall be entered on the journal of each House, respectively. 
bill shall not be returned by the Governor within ten day 
days excepted) after it shall have been presented to’ him, tl 
shall be a law, in like manner as if he had signed it, un 
Legislature shall, by their adjournment, prevent its re 
which case the said bill shall be returned on the first’ 
meeting of the General Assembly after the expire 
days, or be a law. 

Mr. WOODSON moved to strike out, “if he pee f 


BRIDAYs JULY 10; "7847 i 0, 405 


” 


but if not,” and insert: “who shall sign the same and return 


Y And the question thereon being faved was first taken on 
ing out, and decided in the negative. 

Mr. CROSS of Winnebago moved to strike out, “two-thirds 
f the members present,” and insert: “majority of all the members 
ect.” Rejected—yeas 60, nays 61. 

Mr. [SMITH of Macon]** moved to strike out the whole sec- 
tion. Lost. 

ES Mr. DAVIS of McLean moved to strike out, “two-thirds of the 
“members present,” and insert: ‘‘two-thirds of the members elect.” 
He said that he offered this amendment for the purpose of giving 
the veto power, if it was to be retained, some little force. We had 
adopted, in the article on the Legislative Department, a provision 
that no bill should be passed until it received a majority of the 
votes of the members elect; and if the section stood as it now did, 
‘- bill, after having been vetoed by the Governor, might be passed 
by a less vote than in the first instance, for two-thirds of the mem- 
bers present might, in many instances, be less than a majority 
of the whole house. He thought it would be inconsistent to leave 
this section in its present shape, after the action of the committee 
on the former article. 

_ Mr. PETERS enforced the same view. 

_ Mr. LOCKWOOD thought differently; a bill which had 
been passed by the legislature, and which was returned by the 
Governor, came again before that body, not as a bill which had 
_ been passed, but as a new proposition for their action, and which 

would require, at least, the same vote as other bills required. 

Mr. DAVIS replied, and repeated his remarks, and Mr. 

a withdrew the opinion he had just expressed, and con- 

curred in the view taken by Mr. D. 

_ Mr. LOGAN said, that the section as it now stood, reduced 
‘the effect of the Governor’s veto to a little less than nothing at all. 
The house consisted of seventy-five members, and it would require 
-avote of thirty-eight in its favor to pass the bill in the first instance; 

the legislature may say that one-third shall constitute a quorum 


- ®Name supplied from the J ournal of the Convention. 


406 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 
for the transaction of business, which would be thirty-four 
bers, and under this section, two-thirds of this quorum m 


the bill. This destroyed entirely the veto power. 
Mr. SINGLETON thought a majority of the member. 


to be attached to the objections interposed by any Gove 
which we may have in Illinois. He would vote for making 
majority of the members elect, a sufficient number to pass 
after a veto, and would oppose the two-thirds. ei 

Mr. MINSHALL advocated the amendment—two-thir a 
the members elect, as a most invaluable safeguard against th 
evils of hasty and unprovident legislation, which had been 
subject of such universal complaint for years past in our state, 
upon this floor where it had been denounced in such unme 
terms; and he was astonished now to hear these same gen 
hesitate to adopt this most salutary and wise provision agains 
recurrence. He had seen the time when, if such a clause as 
had been in our constitution, it might have saved the state 
the shame, ruin and disaster which had fallen upon them, by 
wild and speculating notions of the legislature. He con: 
the veto power, particularly in the western states, where suc 
desire existed to rush into hasty legislation, and wild specu. 
was the wisest and most saving clause to be inserted in any con 
tution to check the excess of over legislation. He was in favor 
adoption in this constitution, and he thought there was a grea 
feeling existing among the people, which looked to this Cony 
tion for its adoption. Though its expediency in the hands of — 
President of the United States might be doubted by some 
could see no objection to it in a state government, but thoug 
most salutary and proper. Bye 

Mr. PETERS was in favor of the amendment as proposed e 
the member from McLean, and when the time would come w 
the ayes and noes could be called for, he would not hesitate an 
stant in recording his aye in favor of it. He thought its operat 
had been most beneficial, and had been informed that if i 
been in our old constitution would have saved us from much fr 
He was not acquainted with the circumstances himself, (not t 


FRIDAY, JULY 16, 1847 407 


being i in the state) but he was informed that when the great cause 
‘of our misfortune—the internal improvement act, which had 
created our debt, and piled up millions upon millions, which we 
"were to pay—the Governor had vetoed it, and when it went back to 
the legislature, it was passed again by a majority of those present. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon said, he had never understood 

that that bill had been vetoed. 
_ Mr. THOMAS said, he was familiar with its history, when it 
was first passed; it came before the council of revision, the Gover- 
‘nor vetoed it, and gave his reasons, Judge Smith did the same, and 
gave his reasons, and other members of the council did the same; 
all the members who opposed it, gave their reasons for vetoing it, 
‘separately, and differently. 
_ Mr. PETERS said, that he was glad to have been informed 
upon the subject, for he knew nothing of it himself, and had 
referred to it as a matter of history. Any way, however, had the 
‘Governor not been clogged by the other members of the council of 
revision, and this two-third provision been in the constitution, the 
state might have been saved from all the devastating evils of that 
act. He again referred to the inconsistency of the section as it 
now stood, which allowed a bill to be passed after a veto, by-a less 
number than it did in the first place, and advocated the adoption 
of the amendment. 

The question was then taken on striking out “‘present”’ and 
inserting “elected;”’ and decided in the affirmative. 

Mr. LOGAN moved to strike out “two-thirds” and insert 
“majority.” 

Mr. SERVANT said, he would vote to strike out two-thirds, 
if he thought he could have three-fifths inserted, but he feared 
that he might not succeed, and would therefore vote against 
striking out. He alluded at some length, to the internal im- 
provement act, and argued that all its evils might have been 
prevented if a similar provision had been in the old constitution. 

Mr. KNOWLTON followed in opposition to the veto power, 
in any shape, which he denounced as opposed to the principles 
of republicanism—it giving to one man, the power to defeat the 
action of a majority of the immediate representatives of the 
people. 


408 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL on. 


Mr. SMITH of Macon said, he represented ‘two. coun 
and this question was the principal one which had been discu 
before the people by himself, and his opponents; and he was 
that he knew the sentiments of his constituents to be entire 
opposed to the veto power in any shape. He argued ae m 
length against it as a relic of the British constitution, an 
entirely opposed to the true basis of republican government 
the power and sentiments of the people, as manifested by ‘ 
‘representatives. . : 

Mr. McCALLEN was entirely opposed to the veto pi 
being engrafted on our constitution. It was anti-republican, 
it afforded means whereby the wishes and sentiments of the 
might be defeated by one man; and as anti-democratic— 
gave one man, styled Governor, an equal weight with forty- 
of the representatives of the people. He alluded to the re 
that had been made upon the internal improvement act, w. 
was said might have been defeated by such a power; and ar; 
that even admitting the truth of that remark, it was no caus 
they should depart from the true principles of republicanis 
democracy. He thought that the whole evil of that scht 
was the result of one exercise of the veto power by a Presid 
the United States. The bank of the U. States had b 
stroyed by the veto of General Jackson, and the th 
currency of the land was taken away; the people had resolve 
self defence, to have state banks, which had produced an infla 
of the currency, and a desire to speculate; out of that desire 
grown the internal improvement speculation—and then had ¢ 
the ruin. All of this he attributed to the veto of the ch 
the United States Bank. He denounced the veto power as 
giving the executive an authority to encroach on the legis 
department, which he said had been done gradually by 
President since the first exercise of it; and at length, it h 
so far that the President had involved, by his own act, the cou i 
in a war, without consulting the legislative department at ¢ 
Many evils might have been averted to this state, had this ] owel 
been exercised. Rome had been saved three times by clo hi 
its executive with dictatorial powers, but that was no arg 
that the true principles of our government should be abando 


Oe ES ees Te a ema eS er? ere 


FRIDAY, JULY 176, 1877 409 


. 
Jt 


Beaton was divided, and first taken on striking out 
is,” and decided in the afirmative—yeas 68, nays 47. 


NSHALL moved to insert “three-fifths” instead of ‘ 

” as proposed. a 

% 

- : 
MINSHALL addressed the committee:” 4 
le question at present stands, said Mr. M., (the committee "9 


in their report required a vote of two-thirds of the legisla- 
) pass a bill over the veto of the governor,) there appears to 


r the veto power on the governor or not, in the manner 
it is thus proposed in the report of the committee. Unless 
endment which has been proposed, to strike out the words 


a See 


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a 
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o 
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a 
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ines 


f a majority of the whole number of members elect may 
bill, or a bare majority, which is already provided for in 
section of the report of the legislative committee, requir- z 
ls before they can become a law, to be passed by yeas 
ys, be a majority of all the members elected. I cannot, 
Mr. M., see the necessity or use of the veto, as proposed 
committee, unless the amendment proposed by the gentle- 

m Mclean, requiring that the two-thirds should be two- 


m od ar eee i ‘ 
ray a Ree eg eee ee 


e that two-thirds is the right number. I do not know 
I would prefer a smaller number; but I must be permitted 


png Spud i 


en has been the subject of universal complaint for years 
n this State; and we hear the same complaints reiterated on 
por. Have we not been striving in every possible way to 
t its recurrence hereafter, by narrowing down the legislative 
, and heaping restrictions upon it in every shape and form? 
heard the legislation of the State denounced in un- 
d terms; and I must say, that I am not a little astonished 
gentlemen who have been so eager to check hasty legisla- 


ah 


ae iam Pat Ni at UU ee ae eS 


S speech by Minshall, together with those by oe a Smith? 
i Woodson, are taken from the Sangamo Journal, July 29 


Sie Z rit Sop te Ri ek lee ee eae 


410: ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


tion, now, when we have arrived at the proper point—v 
have in the progress of framing a -constitution—arrived © 
place were we may in the most appropriate manner interpo 
proper check to improvident legislation, I am astonished 
to see the same gentlemen hesitate to adopt this salutary and 
provision against its recurrence. I have seen the time, sir, w 
such a clause as this, in the constitution of this State, might I 
saved the State from the shame, ruin and disaster which | 
fallen upon it. In-the general government the Veto po 
my opinion, ought to be curtailed; but in our State gover 
it may be safely increased. 

[Some further discussion having taken place on the r 
to strike out ‘‘two-thirds’’ and insert three-fifths of the me 
elected.] 

Mr. MINSHALL said he desired to place himself in a c tre’ 
position, inasmuch as the language of the gentleman from 
(Mr. Woopson,) might subject his views to misconstructic 
am in favor, continued Mr. M., of this slight increase of t 
power in the State eheerrenents without regard to party ¢c 
ation. I do not think that party has anything to do wi 
matter, although some gentlemen seem to argue as if thi 
in reality some connection between this matter and par 
siderations. I regard it as a matter pertaining to the State | 
ernment alone; as a principle proper to be incorporated i 
State constitution; as a necessary, salutary provision for 
tection of the people against improvident and hasty legi 
I have referred to the executive of the United States an 
veto power in the United States Government,—not as a m 
party difference—although some gentlemen have treated 
that way; I have referred to it for the mere purpose of argi 
and illustration, and I presume it may be referred to for tl at 
pose without differing with gentlemen as to the effects of the px 
on the legislative interest of the government of the United 
and without impropriety. die 

Mr. MINSHALL proceeded to enlarge upon this pot 
insisted that there was no analogy between the exercise 
power under the United States government, and its exere 
State government; and no just comparison could be made be 


FRIDAY, JULY 16, 1847 4It 


its exercise by the President and its exercise by the Governor of 
State. It was not a fair argument to resort to on this occasion, 
here the simple deductions of reason alone were proper; because 
it furnished gentlemen with the opportunity of making improper 
appeals to the prejudices of our nature, without taking the dis- 
tinction, which in reality existed, between the reason for the 
power in one case, and against it in the other. They were not 
parallel cases. The powers of Congress were different entirely 
from those of the legislature of the State. The powers of Congress 
were limited and restricted to certain specified matters. In the 
States, on the contrary, all power resided in the legislature except 
what had been delegated to Congress. The powers of Congress 
were of a limited delegated character, while those of the State 
legislature were sovereign and supreme. The patronage of the 
executive of the United States was large and increasing, and 
possessed a controlling influence which was likely to operate im- 
properly, if it had not done so already on the legislative depart- 
ment of the government. The argument of the gentleman from 
Greene, and the quotation which he has made from Justice Story, 
proved that the veto power ought to be increased in the State 
government, and diminished in the government of the United 
States. It would be proper to restrict the power in the govern- 
ment of the United States, but the same reasons for its restriction, 
did not exist in a State government. 

Look, said Mr. Minsuat1, at the history of our State govern- 
ment, and let gentlemen tell me when and where the executive 
department of this State, ever encroached upon, or overrun the 
legislative department; when the power of patronage or influence 
of the governor ever overran the legislature? When was it? 
Never. On the contrary, the history of the past in our legislative 
progress shows that the legislative department has constantly 
encroached upon the province of the executive; and that is almost 
always the case with State legislatures, they being the active 
branch and concentrating the sovereignty of the people. 

_ Unless the executive and the other co-ordinate departments 
are strongly guarded, the inclination of the legislative department 
is, and ever will be, to encroach upon the others. Has not that 
been the case with our State government for the last fifteen or 


412 


twenty years? Did not the legislature take intge 
the appointment of prosecuting attorneys, and various othe 
ileges which had been originally conferred upon him? Wh 
has been nothing else since the beginning of this government, 
particularly for the last 10 or 15 years, but encroachme: 
encroachment by the legislative department upon the exe 
and judicial department of the government, until it has 
trated the one, and rendered the other contemptible. The 
power, then, is necessary to enable the executive by the exer 
this negative power, to protect itself and its co-ordinate ¢ | 
ment from the encroachments of the panera 


purpose of perserving the equilibrium and jndiepend nee 
co-ordinate branches of the government. Are we to have a 
ernment of co-ordinate and independent departments? 
not commenced with that as the basis of the constitution 
ment we are now framing? If so, this provision is necess 
the executive for its own protection. It would appear fro 
position of the gentleman from Greene, that he was for disp 
with the executive department altogether, from the holy | 
which he manifested at what he is pleased to call this monat 
feature of the government.—Yet the government of the 1 
States, and of all the States in this republic, all possess thai 
monarchical feature. 

But this power is necessary for another imbarealilee 
and that is, to carry out the position of the gentlemen wl 
oppose the power, but who have been strenuous advocat 
inserting in the constitution, the clause restricting legislat on 
special session, to the matters contained and specified in the } 


restraint. Suppose the case of a special call of the fe 
under our new constitution, for a specified object, and that 
the session the legislature should, notwithstanding the restr 
pass an act the subject of which was not comprised in 
fication of reasons for calling the legislature. How is 
lature to be restrained, if the governor has not the power 


FRIDAY, JULY 176, 1847 413 


“negative to a bill of this kind, or if a bare majority be 
cient to pass the law notwithstanding the veto? This new 
e in the legislative department alone, if gentlemen who are 
ror of it, seriously design to make it available, requires a 
increase of the veto power. The gentleman from Greene 
, that the internal improvement system is the only instance 
xcessive legislation which can be cited, and that would have 
sed in spite of the veto, if it had existed. But that is not the 
ly case. Has the gentleman forgotten the scenes of 1840? 
we not|stand]shoulder toshoulder in resisting the encroachments 
the legislature upon the judicial department? Was not that 
rmous breach of the constitution, and the prostration of the 
diciary, returned by the council of revision; and does not the 
gentleman from Greene, well remember the manner in which it 
$ passed, notwithstanding the council of revision, by a majority 


- 
. 


‘just one vote? The increase of the veto power now advocated, 
‘three-fifths instead of a bare majority, would have saved the 
e from that calamity, and the judiciary from that desecration. 
gentleman from Greene says, that I am inconsistent in hav- 
advocated a large representation in the Legislature, and in now 
ocating an increase in the veto power; I maintain that it is a 
ect position. I entertain a desire to see a full and fair represen- 
on of the people in the popular branch of the Legislature, 
sause this is the department which most closely and intimately 

ects the wishes and interests of the people; but for the very 
on that this branch also represents the passions and prejudices 


to be for the best; yet as they are occasionally carried away 
adden impulses, incident to all popular bodies, the executive 
uld therefore be invested with this negative, this counteracting 
rer. In this consists the beauty, harmony and science of our 


x If, continued Mr. M., our government is to consist of the 

* co-ordinate branches, distinct and independent of each 
er, and the executive is to stand upon an equality with the other 
hes; this increase of the veto power is indispensable to pro- 
the executive and other departments from the encroachments 


‘wy “of 4 
i - 


414 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO. 


of the veto power, will operate beneficially for the i intere S| 
State hereafter. I feel assured that it cannot be product 
injury under the present organization of the department, an 
little patronage that we are about to allow to the gov 
we were going to have in our constitution a provision gi é 
governor a large appointing power; if we were about 
extensive patronage upon him, so as greatly to increase his 
ence, the matter would than assume a different aspect, and 1 
event, I would be less inclined to confer upon him the veto 
but that is not the case. It is doubtful whether he will h 
appointment of a single officer. He is to have no patronag 
to be a mere shadow, an image, a sign of the sovereignty 
State; a representation of that sovereignty in name only, 
possessing any of the attributes which belong to it; and yet g 
men profess great fear and alarm at the proposition for inv 
the executive branch of the government, with the slight in 
which is now proposed: In my judgment in view of al 
considerations, the executive could never exert sufficient inf 
over the Legislature to check its progress from any ex 
causes; but if it exercise an influence at all, it must be fr 
mere intellectual and moral power which a great and gi 
only could possess; and that check, in all probability, wot 
for good and not for evil. I am therefore in favor of this in 
of the veto power. 

Mr. SINGLETON said, he was in favor yesterday of 
out that part of the section so as to leave the power with a 
of the legislature to pass a bill after the veto of the 
but as he was satisfied from the vote of the convention y: 
that a majority of the convention were not in favor of 
osition; he was now willing to vote for the proposition { 
gentleman from Schuyler. He was not one of those vies 
go for no proposition which did not originate with ther 
He was willing, if he could not get the proposition he want 
take the best that he could get. He believed that a maj 
the Legislature ought to have the power, but as it was imp 
to obtain a vote of the convention in favor of that prop 
he was for making the evil as small as possible, by taking 
proposition for a majority of three-fifths. It was clearly 


FRIDAY, JULY 16, 1847 Sears 


J estion, and he was willing to compromise, in order to obtain 
the best terms that he could get. It was the first time, however, 
that he had ever offered to compromise, but he felt it to be a duty, 
which he owed to his constituents, that he should do so on this 
occasion, and it was only necessary to see the path of his duty 
before him, and he was ready to follow it. He was ready then to 
meet gentlemen on half-way grounds. There were serious objec- 
tions against the proposition as contained in the report of the 
committee, requiring a majority of two-thirds to pass a bill after 
a veto of the governor.—That proposition would make the gover- 
nor equal to sixty-six members—fifteen more than a majority.— 
The proposition of the gentleman from Schuyler would make him 
equal to a majority and nine over—a considerable reduction. 
This proposition, then, was preferable to the first. 
_ Mr. SMITH of Mason said: 

Mr. Chairman,—I have not trespassed upon the time of the 
Convention heretofore to any extent, and will not now inflict a 
regular speech upon the committee. I would not utter a word 
upon this subject did I not see a disposition to adopt the report of 
the committee before us without sufficient investigation; and I 
feel it to be my duty to make known the wishes of my constituents 
upon this subject; and when this is done, I am certain it will have 
more influence with the committee, than any argument that I 
can present. It will at least have the influence, so far as it goes, 
in making up the public opinion of the whole State. Certainly 
no gentleman here is willing to insert any provision in the con- 
stitution that will not meet with the approbation of the people 
of the State. 

If I know the opinion of the people of the two counties which 
[ have the honor to represent on this floor, upon any one subject, 
itison this. I consider myself directly instructed on this subject. 
The question of giving to the governor the veto power, was one 
of the issues between my honorable competitor and myself, when 
canvassing for a seat in this Convention. I was opposed to giving 
the governor this high power then, and am more opposed to it 
now. Considering what we have already done in this Conven- 
tion, if there ever was a necessity for provision of this sort in the 
constitution, there certainly is not now. Gentlemen want the 


constitution, to prevent a repetition of similar exe 
future. Gentlemen refer to the great internal impro 
that has saddled upon the State the immense debt 


legislature. This all may be true enough; but gentle 
that we have already provided in the amendments that 
reported in the committee of the whole, against the e 
public debt. We have provided that the legislature | 
pledge the faith of the State for any sum exceeding fifty 
dollars, except in cases of war and insurrection, wii 
referring the matter to the people at a general election, ar 
it must meet with the approval of a majority. Th 
the veto power where it belongs. The people have to 
bills, and they should hold the veto. Does anyone, s 
that the people of Illinois would have ratified a debt of 
millions of dollars? They would have been as clear ¢ 
was Gov. Duncan. They would have vetoed the r 
sir, I cannot see the necessity of providing a veto pow: b 
first by the governor and then by the people. In this. 
governor thinks proper, the matter or bill may pass to th 
or if he choose otherwise he can veto the bill and the pe 
never get a chance at it, unless a majority of two-thirc 
branches of the legislature over-rule the veto. In 
comes before the people, and if they veto it the matt 
There are propositions also before this convention 
think will prevail, which will give the people a veto upor 
charters. Then, I ask, what necessity is there in giving a 


the government of Illinois has become the most unpo 
of the government, and I believe it is deservedly s se 


constitution upon that department. Had the executive I 
same power conferred upon it, it would now be as unpop’ 
the legislature. ‘ae 


FRIDAY, JULY 16, 1847 417 


The proper way, as I consider, to prevent the abuse of power 
in not conferring it. The legislature has given more dissatis- 


we have already provided against this abuse, by limiting the pay 
nd the time. This is all called for by the people; but I do not 
ink that the people want us to take power from the legislature 
d give it to the governor. If you give power to any one of 
al three departments of government, we must expect they will 
_ use it, and if you give the governor the power of becoming dan- 
_ gerous, you may expect that he will become so. The people 
‘want to hold in their own hands such power as we may take from 
legislature, and not give it to the governor. 
_Mr. Chairman, I am opposed to giving the veto power to the 
‘governor, both on the ground of expediency and principle. I 
agree with the gentleman from Peoria, that the doctrine is anti- 
republican, and that it is contrary to the genius and spirit of a 
presentative government. It is, sir, a kingly prerogative, and 
should be left in the hands of the sovereign people. There seems 
to be a disposition in this body to confer too much power upon 
1é governor and to render the legislature powerless. You have 
stricted the legislature by your action in a called session to 
ist such subjects as the governor may propose to them, and now 
ou propose to give to him the veto power. If you succeed in 
"one case, the legislature has the power of originating and pro- 
" posing such laws as they may pass,—but in the other, they are 
denied the right, and you give the governor a veto in all cases. 
Tt does seem to me that if this plan succeeds, that the legislature, 
who are the legitimate representatives of the people, will cut but 
a poor figure in Illinois. I ask, sir, what use is there in having 
legislature if you render it powerless, and place it under the 
mntrol of the executive of the State—a one-man power—the repre- 
ntative of monarchy? 
Mr. BOND said he was opposed to the proposition of the 
entleman from Schuyler, for the reason, first, that the veto power 
as not an executive power; and in the next place, that if there 
as any necessity for guards and restrictions to be thrown around 
e legislative department, that had been sufficiently done already. 


418 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIC 


We have provided, continued Mr. Bonn, as a securit 
improvident legislation, that no bill shall become a law 1 
shall have received the votes of a majority of the members o o! 
legislature. The sophistry of the arguments of gentleme 
sist in this: that they do not say that it is a legislative power 
If they would have the governor participate in legislation, 
not provide a place for him to come in and engage in di 
that his opinions may be duly weighed and properly apprecia te 
Again, the bill of rights provides that the people shall have 
right at all times to assemble together in a peaceable mann 
petition for a right of grievances. Why, we might as well p 
at once, that the people shall petition the governor and his | 
lature. hi 
Sir, I am utterly hostile to giving the governor a power 
to that possessed by the people’s representatives in the g 
assembly. I do not think it is such a power as he ought to e 
cise.—All that he should be called upon to do, is to sancti 
not to sanction the acts of the legislature; andif he do not san 
their acts, there will be a sufficient guard thrown around i 


be permitted to go into effect. 
The veto power is not suited to this meridian.—It se 
been a proper conservative power, in the earlier an 


man of learning; that he shall possess a nner of él u 
of government; above all, it pre-supposes him a man of cor 
sense, and common honesty; and a man who can take a su 


but the good of the entite community. I might perhaps j 
say, that I was opposed to this power because the people 


different departments of the government, the fictitious capi 
which they have been trading. I am not willing to ackn 


FRIDAY, JULY 16, 1847 419 


rilst the members of the legislature, indiscriminately, represent 
articular districts. Sir, can he know the wishes of the people 
ter than members of the legislature, who come fresh from the 
eople themselves? If he can, he is something superior to what I 
lave heretofore seen of the qualifications combined in a governor 
f Illinois; and I believe the responsibility is greater, in anindivid- 
al who comes immediately from the people. Believing this, and 
elieving also, that as a general rule, they are as capable of dis- 
riminating the wants of the people, and as honest and faithful 
n carrying them out, I never can consent to give my support to 
| proposition that will put it into the power of the executive to 
leprive the people of what they desire should be done. 

“Mr. WOODSON rose and asked the indulgence of the Con- 
rention, in order that he might, without consuming more than a 
ery few moments of their time, explain the position which he 
;ecupied in reference to this subject. It was not his intention, 
le said, to enter into a discussion of the veto power. It was 
innecessary to do so. He found that a majority of the Conven- 
ion was disposed to retain that power in the constitution, and as 
t was to be retained in the constitution, he hoped it would be 
etained in its least objectionable form. 

He was conscientious in saying that he believed it was a power 
vhich did not belong to a government such as ours. It was 
ontrary, he thought, to the genius of our institutions. If the 
jovernment was to be based upon the will of the people, then the 
reto, proceeding as it did, from one man, was to say the least of 
t, highly objectionable. 

In discussing this question, continued Mr. Woopson, I would 
jot have alluded to vetoes which have heretofore been given, 
yecause I am averse to enkindle anything like party feeling, or 
ntroduce anything like party considerations; but I may remark 
ere, that I do not think the veto power, as exercised by the 
resident of the United States, should be exercised by the Gover- 
jor of Illinois. There are reasons why the President should have 
he right to exercise the power in his capacity as President, which 
lo not apply to the Governor of a State. In the first place, the 
xecutive of the United States is clothed with vast executive 
atronage, growing out of our foreign relations as well as our 


ne 


legislature is restricted and tied down, so that no in 


assigned by those who have written commentaries pen | ‘te 
States government for giving this power.—Judge Sto: 


encroach upon the executive, and to absorb all the | 
government.’’ Now whatever tendency exists on th 
legislature of the United States government, to enc 
the executive, the same tendency does not exist in th 
ernment. It cannot exist, as I shall show presently. 


can possibly arise. The reason assigned for requiring 
of the veto power, is that it may be used as a check uj 
dent, unwise and rash legislation. This is the only 1 
in favor of the exercise of that power here. Well, I 
convince this convention that it will not apply to Illin 
the constitution which we are about to adopt. Befor 
this, however, I will allude to the remarks made by the 
from Fulton, regarding the veto power. He says it has ne 
exercised in any case in which it has not been universall 
by the people. Now I am not so sure that this is 
doubt that it has invariably received their approval. 
difference of opinion upon that subject; but it is not r 
discuss that question in connection with the questio 1 vy 
now before the convention. ; 

I differ most widely with the gentleman at any rate. 


tell me whether there has not been one universal voice 0 
nation in regard to that veto. Sir, have not men of ¢ 
recently met at Chicago and expressed their disapproba 
veto of that bill? Why unquestionably; there is scarcel 


and Van Buren. However I will not consume the time by 
upon this subject. It is not necessary on this occasion 


421 


@ expression without designing anything offensive) of the 
men from Schuyler and Fulton, on this subject. Sir, when 


re should be composed the gentleman from Schuyler was 
ent upon what he called an infringement of the rights of the 
le—endangering their liberties, and yet, when a proposition 
ide by which the powers of that very people are to be cur- 


to check the power of the representatives of the people. 

the representatives in the general assembly come directly 
ahs : ‘ 
hould they be accountable and not to the executive. But, sir, 
now to the question, and wish to call the attention of the 
ree to it. Is there not sufficient restriction at this time 


e single case, that of the internal improvement system, 
ch, if the governor had exerted the veto power, the State 
have been in a better condition at this day.—But that is a 
case; such a case cannot again occur under the restrictions 
we have placed around the legislation of the State. It is 
ible. But, will gentlemen suffer themselves to be frightened 
eir propriety by this single case? Are all principles to be 
Jered because one single case existed which would have 
n exception? No, sir, we should look at the consequences 
t in all future time; we should consider how the country is 


er existed in the old constitution. A majority of the quorum 
d pass a law without the yeas and nays. Now, it cannot be 
without the yeas and nays, and without a majority of the . 
number of members elected. Again, the members of the 


ad 


422 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIC 
legislature are to receive but two dollars per day for 

forty-two days, and one dollar a day thereafter. There is a 
important restriction on the action of the legislature; t 


striction is, that no bill for the payment of a claim a 
State can be passed, unless the claim shall have been | 
adjudicated before some judicial tribunal. Now I — 
danger there is to be apprehended from legislative acti 
these restrictions? There is no danger in future, regar 
passage of bills for internal improvement for which the 
to be saddled with taxation. State legislation is further r 
by the manner in which the legislature is constituted; 
acting as a check upon the House, and the House a c 
the Senate. This is what Franklin aptly compared t 
with one horse hitched before and another behind, each 
in different directions. Gentlemen here, are not only for 
horse before, and a horse behind, but for putting so grea’ 
upon the wagon, that it cannot be moved. If you invest 
ernor with the veto power, there will be such a weight 
as will perhaps entirely clog the wheels of legislation. 
the governor should at any time come in collision with 
lature, so that feelings of hostility will be aroused; (a 
not at all improbable,) under the veto power, the gov 
veto every law passed by the legislature. Suppose thi 
tion should have refused to require the governor to 
when he has constitutional objections against their p 
power will be illimitable, whether his objections are const 
or otherwise. Such a restriction upon legislation, I thit in 
in accordance with the genius and spirit of this govern 
government derived from the people. ik 

I merely throw out this, said Mr. Woopsov, as an 
assertion of the gentleman from Fulton, that the p 
always expressed their approval in every case in which a 
been given. It is a remarkable fact, and one which ste r 
in bold relief, in the history of this State, that the men wh 
for that law, have been sustained by the people, and m 


UY 


FRIDAY, JULY 16, 1847 423 


the people for their acts, and not to the executive. 

_ These are my views, and I cannot reconcile it to my mind, 
_ that the will of one man should be permitted to control the action 
of the legislature. If it is to be a representative government at 
a) all, I want the people to rule through their representatives, and I 
‘want these representatives to be amenable solely to the people. 
This is the safest course.—Sir, the veto power of the governor, even 
_ if abaremajority may set aside his veto, is of itself asufficient check. 
Let us examine how bills are passed. In the first place, a bill 
has to be read on three several days, unless three-fourths of the 
_ members agree to dispense with that rule, and the same formality 
_ takes place in both Houses. Here is sufficient time for reflection. 
The bill then goes to the executive and he vetoes it; and if they 
_ think proper upon reconsideration to pass the_bill again by a 
_ majority, that I think is a sufficient check, a sufficient safe-guard 
_ against hasty and inconsiderate legislation, and I cannot consent 
‘by my vote that the legislature should be controlled by any 
further restriction than this. Do the people require that there 
should be any more restriction? As far as I know the question 
‘has never been mooted or discussed before the people of the 
country; but I believe they will be satisfied with the Constitution 
if you leave it as it is at present, in regard to this matter. There 
_ can be no objection to leaving it as it is. But I perceive that this 
_ Convention is determined that the veto power shall be exercised, but 
_ why they should be so desirous of introducing it, I cannot conceive. 
_ Mr. WOODSON referred to the veto of Gov. Duncan and re- 
marked that Duncan was less popular after that veto than before. 
_ As iniquitous as the law was, which was vetoed by him, yet the 
_ people returned to the legislature time and again the very men 
_ who voted for the law. The men who held the very highest offices 

_ in the State afterwards, were those who voted for that law.] 


na Mr. WEAD addressed the Convention on this subject, (his 
remarks will appear in our next)*8 until the hour of adjournment. 


#8 Wead’s remarks do not appear in later issues of the Illinois State Reg- 
_ ister nor in the Sangamo Journal. 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Green of Tazewell. . 
Mr. DEITZ presented a petition in relation to heap 
of a superintendent of schools. Referred to the cor 
Educatl[ijon. 
Mr. TURNER paseeute! a petition praying the abo 
capital punishment. Referred to the committee on tht 
ciary. rei 


whole—Mr. Crain in the Chair. 
The question pending was on the two motions to inser 
ity’’ and “three-fifths.” 
Mr. HARVEY — advocated the amendment 


effect of a veto to too small an importance. a 
Mr. WOODSON said, that it was manifest that ce 

of the Convention were in favor of retaining the veto p 
if so, he was desirous that it should be adopted in its 
tionable form—by the amendment proposing a major 
members elect. He opposed the veto power under an 
stances, as opposed to the spirit and genius of our govet 
which recognize all power as vested in the people, and fror 
in their representatives; and which was defeated by giy ing t 
man authority to obstruct the passage of any daw 
representatives thought it proper, wise and expedien c 
There might be some propriety in vesting the President 
United States with some such power, but none that we 

confer it upon a Governor of a state. The President has 
extended patronage, and is the representative of the whol eg! 
and all its diversified interests, and it may be necessary 
for him to interpose this power, to prevent wrongs uj 
interests by encroachments by the Legislature. Judg: 
has said, that one reason for the veto was that there i is a 
tendency in the legislative department t to encroach upon thed 


424 


_ SATURDAY, JULY 17, 1847 425 


is a safe-guard against rash and hasty legislation. What 
safe-guard is required than those already provided by the 
tee in its action upon the report of the Legislative com- 


in no case, where the veto power had been exercised, did 
in receiving the universal approval of the people,” and he 
d say to that gentleman that he was not altogether satisfied 
t the late veto of President Polk was so universally approved. 
the western part of the country all parties were unanimous, and 


€ was not a single item in that bill which had not, at one time 
other, received the approbation of Presidents Jackson or 
Buren. 

Mir. W. then referred in detail to the reduction of the number 
‘Legislature, the many checks, re[s]trictions and prohibi- 
thrown around its action, the denial to it of the power it had 
eretofore of appropriating moneys upon private claims, and urged 
Il these were sufficient to prevent hasty or improvident 
lation. He thought that the case of the internal improvement 
7as one which might not occur again in a century, and was not 
cient argument to justify a departure from correct principles. 
even if he was sure that the veto power would not be exer- 
d, except on conservative grounds, still he would oppose it, 
se he believed it opposed to the spirit and genius of our 
rnment. He believed that if the Governor had the veto 
at the time of the passage of the internal improvement act, 
had exercised it, that the people would have still demanded 
succeeded in passing that act; for they had shown their 
oval of the men who had carried it through, by elevating 
-even to this day to the highest offices in the State; one, at ° 
f our U. S. Senators was in favor of that act. 


fr. NORTHCOTT followed in opposition to the veto on 


UA eMAME NMS UN ae bid Si hace Me 
i ) ia Halt is, WON Yet ade Y 


426 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLI 


grounds similar to those expressed by those precedi | 
same side. 


[Mr. NORTHCOTT said,” he did not believe that 
justice to his feelings, or his constituents, without 
time of the committee, while he submitted a few rema 
candid and deliberate consideration; and if an apolog: 
mine is found in the vast importance of the question | 
a question that involves great principles, the wise or 1 
ment of which, will tell for weal or woe, during the exist ste 
instrument we are now framing. 

We have provided for three separate and distine 
government—Legislative, Executive and Judicial. | 
ciple and good policy alike dictate, that each of th 
: magistracy, in the performance of their various duties, 
iS : independent of each other. The Legislative depart 
stituted for the purpose of framing laws for the gover! 
well being of society. The Judiciary, for the purpost 
cating upon, and expounding those laws: and the E: 
H ; the purpose of seeing them faithfully executed. Sir 
just as reasonable to declare that the judiciary shoul 
new constitution, exercise a controlling influence over e 
other departments, as that the governor should control - 
lature. Indeed, it would be equally correct in theo 
pedient in practice, to give the governor the right to 
judgments and decisions of the supreme court, as to vest ] 
power to veto the acts of the general assembly. = 


The object of the veto power, say its advocates, is t 
hasty legislation. Are there no hasty decisions of th 
court? Are not individuals frequently injured by those 
Most certainly they are. Then, gentlemen to be « 
should carry out the principle, and say to that body, 
can do in accordance with the will of the governor, t 
far shalt thou go, and no farther.’’ If a concurrence of 1 
of the legislature be made necessary to pass a bill th 
obtain the Governor’s sanction, it would give him con 
trol of the law-making power; it would become a plia: 


39 This speech by Northcott is taken from the Sangamo Jo 


SATURDAY, JULY 17, 1847 427 


sion here; but such are the circumstances by which I am 
inded, that I cannot do justice to the subject without glanc- 


ind National history for a few years past. I might have been 
red the painful task, had it not been for the very extraordinary 
h delivered here on yesterday, by the gentleman from Fulton. 
= has hurled defiance at us. Mark his singular language: ‘‘I 
y those on the other side to show a solitary instance where the 
© power has been wielded to the injury of the country.’’ 
, speaking of vetoes, he says:—‘“They have been invariably 
stained by the American people.’’ He has thrown down the 
auntlet. I take it up. Sir, the pecuniary embarrassments of 
State, past, present and future, are the legitimate results of 
exercise of that power; I mean the vetoes of the chief magis- 
e of this confederacy. When called upon to sign a bill for the 
iter of the United States Bank, he refused, and in his message 
O ‘Congress giving his reasons for that refusal, recommended to 
he States the creation of State banks, and to the banks liberal 
scounts. This coming from such a source, from a man the high- 
in power, first in the hearts of the American people, a hero, a 
triot and a statesman, carried with it immense weight. Accord- 
ly banks sprung up, like mushroons during the sable shades of 
ht, and scattered their promises to pay, thick as falling leaves 
| autumn. 

Side by side with this bank veto, I will place another, similar 
its character, and similar in its tendency, both of which worked 
jointly to produce that overwhelming ruin, that came very 
swallowing up our whole country in general, and Illinois in 
ticular; I mean that of the Maysville road bill, in which the 
resident recommended the States should construct their own 
ks of internal improvement. That recommendation worked 
magic, and the States, both old and new, weak and strong, 
discriminately, began these works with a vengeance. Magnifi- 
t schemes were planned and commenced; money was borrowed 
abroad without stint, and paid to agents, contractors and 


of business. This money, obtained by loans, and augn 
the issues of a thousand banks, all thrown into circ 
once,—all seeking profitable investment,—caused the s 
come visionary, the heretofore wise and prudent lost their 
and forethought, the nation became involved in debt,— 
corporations and individuals followed the example; a agri 


be able to feed the world, compelled to lave to Europe 
means of subsistence. The balance of trade turned ag 
Specie was demanded to make up the deficit. This caused | 
on the banks for cash, deprived them of the means of red 
their out-standing notes, which had been previously receiva 
all government dues, and the “‘specie circular’” was issuec 
the government from loss; and this caused a further run o 
banks, and they suspended specie payments. This created < 
all over the country, and spread consternation among our cl 
abroad; no more money could be borrowed; the energ 
State, and of many other States, were completely para 
the people who were in 1832 progressing most speedily. 
the most apparent certainty in the acquisition of weal 
and of happiness, in a short time were prostrated. Th 
was scarcely able to redeem its plighted faith. States fo 
at least, driven to repudiation. Banks broke; individual 
insolvent, and their property sold at public outcry; c 
destroyed; confidence between man and man had given 
spirit of distrust; ruin, like a stream of molten lava, had com 
over-run the fair face of our lovely country; from Maii 3 
isiana,—from our own blue lakes to the Gulf of Mexico,— 
a scene of desolation; scarcely was a green spot left on w 
eye of the soul-stricken patriot could rest. , 
These are the financial evils resulting frome these " 
poor Illinois stands forth as a conspicuous witness of t 
tions; the monument she has erected in memory of her 
the shape of a State debt of fifteen millions—the exis 
which, I fear, will be co-equal with that of the pyramids of | 
This veto was the commencement of an era in the exe 
history of this country.—Up to this period, moderation 


A i enh: a 


SATURDAY, JULY 17, 1847 429 


en preserved, and the co-ordinate departments had kept 
their legitimate spheres. In the midst of the delusive and 
eral prosperity that followed this assumption of executive 
sibility, and the accompanying recommendations, the people 
called upon to exercise the elective franchise, in the choice 
chief magistrate. The overwhelming majority he received, 
s taken by himself and friends as a direct approval of that act. 


ol all departments of the government, and from that day to this, 
th the exception of one short month, “‘I take the responsibility’’ 
as been the motto of every President. That day proscription 
amenced, wholesale and retail, from custom house officer to the 
fe post-master, all must make room for the favorites of the 
esident; from that time Congress had to commence carving its 
tk to suit the views of the executive, and when they have 
tted to do it, the executive has interposed his fiat, and said, 
‘shall not be so.’’ At one time, the President by repeated 
nportunities received from Congress the Nation’s purse; and while 
held it meekly in one hand, reached out the other, and implor- 
gly solicited the sword; the people’s representatives answered, 
No. And at the then ensuing presidential election, the people, 
ing in their majestic might, answered in tones of thunder, 
sver.” This was the death blow to executive usurpation. 
ut it slumbered only for a time, it was galvanized in 1844, by 

miracle working names of ‘“Texas and Oregon;’’ in its galvan- 
state it has brought us into a war with a neighboring republic; 
w it moves, not as if guided by nee it exhibits but the 


nh of Gen. Taylor, bury it so deen, that Gabriel’s ‘crutipel 
all not cause it to twitch a single muscle. 


430 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE 


right? And if productive of much evil, shall we engraft it in out 
new constitution? Shall we subject ourselves to the usurpatior 
by one man, of such unlimited power, and enable him to defea 
the popular will? I trust not, sir. Some gentlemen here, s: 
that it is but a negative power; that it enacts nothing. Ca 
may arise in which it will have the same effect. Suppose a 
to be unpopular and mischievous in its tendency—the people c 
loudly for its repeal—the majority of the legislature so determine 
but Mr. Governor says, no;—by his will he prolongs the existence 
of a bad law. This, to a man of my humble capacities, looks 
exercising legislative powers by indirection, and I think cannot 
otherwise. 

The gentleman from Schuyler says, “‘such powers should 
be given to a president, but that the governor should have + 
by all means.’’ Here is, I think, distinction without a differer 
if the principle is correct both should have such authorit 
wrong, as I think I have clearly shown both from fact and a: 
ment, neither. Ifa governor can prevent the enactment of go 
laws, and the repeal of evil ones, By that power, I say withho! 
from him. 

One other argument, Mr. Cheeta and I have done. 
people know the candidate for governor by his previous acts; 1 
candidates for the legislature they know personally—they 
verse with them familiarly face to face, about their wants; a 
it to be expected that the governor, shut up in the city of Spri 
field, or in New York city acting as fund commissioner, can kn 
the views, the feelings, the wants and the interests of the pec 
of whom he has never seen one in ten far better than their im 
ate representatives fresh from among them? Sir, the idea is 
posterous. I hope the amendment offered by the gentleman fr 
Sangamon will prevail.] 


Mr. DAVIS of Massac proposed to submit a few remarks { 
the consideration of the committee, in answer to the extraordt 
arguments advanced by a gentleman on the other side of the q 


SATURDAY, JULY 17, 1847 431 


»n.—The gentleman from Hardin, in his remarks the other day, 
t by saying that the veto power ought not to be exercised in 
ublic; that it was a concomitant of monarchy. And the 
eman from Greene, if I understood him, declared in his 
ce to-day, that the power should not be exercised under a 
nment such as ours; and I understood the gentleman who 
just resumed his seat to declare that much, nay, almost all, of 
evils of which we have had to complain for the last ten or 
teen years, have resulted from the exercise of the veto power. 
» 1 am at a loss to know to what part of our national history 
tlemen will go to support the assertions which they have made 
this occasion. Sir, if it be the exercise of a power closely allied 
nonarchy, if it be drawn from the mother country from which 
have drawn most of our notions of government, and if expe- 
ice has demonstrated, as I think it has, that its exercise has 
nded to promote the interests of the whole country, it seems to 
that gentlemen have stepped very far out of their proper 
ere when they have denounced the advocates of the power as 
orites and supporters of monarchy. Will they pretend to say 
Washington, the first man who exercised the power in our 
onal government, was an advocate of monarchy, or of any 
that savored of despotism? Will they say that the great and 
jod Madison was an advocate of monarchy? I trust that gentle- 
men do not mean to asperse the memories of those illustrious men 
uch a manner. In my opinion the exercise of the veto power, 
M proper occasions, is one of the most essential and important 
ects that can be secured. It is, it may well be said, indispen- 
le to check hasty and inconsiderate legislation; and if we go 
< over the whole history of legislation we will find that the 
ertion of this power has on no occasion been condemned, or even 
pproved of by the people. It has been said, however, 
if the power is invested in the Governor at all, it should be 
a majority power; that it should only require a majority to 
ass the law notwithstanding the veto. I ask what benefit 
id result to the legislation of the country from the exercise of 
veto power, if a bare majority can come in and pass a law 
tthe veto. What benefit could result to the legislation of the 
ntry when a majority, incensed perhaps by the exercise of the 


St ebiaG 
vie. f 


432 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL ‘com 


veto power, may enact the law notwithseanaiiael the 
bers of the Legislature, instead of being conciliated 
ments contained in the veto message, will naturally be. 
strongly set in their opinions than before; they will be t 
firmly fixed in their determination to pass the law, i in cons 
of the veto. Every man has a certain pride of opinion, 
likes very much to be driven from a position which he ha 
he will not be willing to renounce the opinions he has once exp: 
although the arguments contained in the veto message n 
sufficient to convince any unprejudiced mind. He is no 
to recede from the position he has assumed and admit that 
wrong. No, sir, that pride of opinion which every man hi 
greater or less extent, will induce him to adhere to that : 
and instead of conciliating, instead of gaining any th 
executive will lose everything. But the gentleman from 
tells us that there is no necessity for the exertion of this - 
this state, after the legislative power shall have been n 
down, as it will be, to almost nothing. And one argum 
use of by the honorable gentleman is, that two dollars p 
being the pay of members of the Legislature, it is, conse 
to be presumed that they will not do wrong. Sir, th 
my judgment, the strongest argument that can be made. 4 
dollars being the per diem of members, we are, consequen 
have good and enlightened legislation. I confess, Mr. P’ 
that I should be inclined to apprehend the contrary. _ 
will ensure entrance into your legislative halls hereafter ¢ 
who have not the capacity for legislation, and who cat 
controlled by any power whatever. This, then, instead 
an argument in favor of the gentleman’s position, is” 
potent argument for extending the exercise to the utm 
which its advocates desire. But, says the gentleman from. 

“it is contrary to the genius of our institutions to place the 
tive over the heads of the people, by giving him such a po 
this.” Let me tell the gentleman, that it is not the d 
of the advocates of the veto power, to place the Exe 
the heads of the people, but it is the disposition of those wh 
cate the exercise of the veto power, to enable the Governor, 
the representative of the whole people, to control the ac 


es Wea? ee Pe ZO Pn OE RS re 
ita Biase Og aa as i otk Ue i es. 


SATURDAY, JULY 17, 1847 en te 


; nest agents, for all experience has shown that, however honest 

| upright the representatives of the people for the most part 

bad men will sometimes find their way into legislative assem- 

It is not a restraint upon the people, but is a restraint upon 

ublic agents of the people. It is not intended to control the 

ple, for the people are not here, as in a pure democracy, in 

rson; they are here by their representatives, and it sometimes 

ns out that the representatives are not the true exponents of 

ir wishes. There are districts represented in this Convention 

y individuals who do not know the wishes of the people, or who, | 
‘they do know the public sentiment in their districts, do not 
“truly represent that public sentiment. This will ever be the case, 

and the exertion of the veto power is necessary for that very 

r eason. Then, in the mode of conducting the elections, it some- 

‘times turns out that we cannot secure the return of such men as 

" will carry out the real wishes of the people. 

_ But, sir, it is said, because the Legislature will be limited in 

the duration of its sessions, therefore there is no necessity for the 

‘exercise of this power. Sir, this very reason constitutes, to my 

‘ind, an argument for its exercise. For, if you limit the Legisla- 

ire to short sessions, the business will necessarily be hurried; the 

inevitable result will be the most hasty and inconsiderate legisla- 

. tion. Let this matter, then, rest with the Executive, who can 

" look calmly and deliberately upon the acts of the legislature, and 

view them in all their phases and aspects; and if he be the faithful 
‘representative of the people—if he be an upright public servant— 

e will bring his honest heart and intelligent understanding to the 

correction of the abuses which hasty and inconsiderate legislation 

would occasion. Have we not all witnessed the haste with which 

; bill after bill, and act after act, have been passed into laws about 
the period of the winding up of the business of the session of the 
Legislature? Very few members are able to know what pro- 
sions are contained in those acts; if they happened to be wise 
ones, it is merely a fortunate accident, and if they happened to 
unwise, it is nothing more than we had reason to expect. But, 
one gentleman has gone into the history of the currency of the 


spirit has returned to the God who gave it. He has brought this 


‘ 


434 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC’ 


matter into the arena. Sir, I shall not enter into a party di 
sion in this Convention, unless compelled to do so in self d 
and I trust there will be no compulsion. But, sir, it is said, t 
it is not necessary in a state government as in the federal gove: 
ment that this power should be exercised. I should be glad if 
gentleman would tell me why it is not necessary to be some 
exercised in a state government. Is it to be presumed that 
representatives of the people of this state are endowed with m 
wisdom and intelligence than the representatives of the peop 
the national legislature? Is it to be presumed that there wi 
less of hasty legislation in a state legislature, than in the nationa 
legislature. I think not, and I think very few will disagree with 
me when it is considered that the Senate of the United State 
composed of the wisest men in this confederacy, they cons 
a check upon the hasty legislation of the popular branch, just as th 
veto of the President constitutes a check upon both. The Sen 
is a check upon the House of Representatives, and e converso, 
all experience has shown that these checks, wholesome as they | 
great as they are, are not sufficient to restrain men in the en 
ment of injurious laws. All experience has shown that some 
more is needed, and that is the placing in the hands of the e 
tive, the power to arrest unwise and unwholesome exactm 
before they inflict upon the country, the irremediable evil of th the 
blighting influences. I have, perhaps, sir, detained the committ 
as long as I ought to do; I trust that if either of the proposi 
to amend should prevail, it will be that of the gentleman fr 
Schuyler. I would prefer two-thirds as being better than tht 
fifths, but if I can get no better proposition than that of the 
tleman from Schuyler, I shall, when the vote is taken, avail m 
of it, for I believe that the exercise of the veto power is essen 
in order that the state of Illinois, peculiarly blessed as she may 
if governed by wise councils, may not see her prospects blighted | 
unwise legislation, but may hereafter shine forth as the brighte 
star in the constellation states. ae 
Mr. ARCHER said, that although this question pe aire 
been discussed, and he had intended to have said nothing 
it, yet he felt constrained, after what had been said by those w. 


opposed the introduction into the constitution, to present his viev 
1a 


SATURDAY, JULY 17, 1847 435 


as it was one upon which the people of the part of the state he 
epresented felt great interest in, and he considered it a duty due 
to himself and them to lay those views before the committee. 
de was in favor of the section reported by the committee, as 
‘amended by the gentleman from McLean, which then, he believed, 
would be in the same words that were used in the constitution of 
he United States. He believed the veto to be the great and salu- 
ery conservative power of all governments, and that Illinois 
should be the last state, after the experience of the past, to give it 
p- Have we not had enough of unwise, hasty and improvident 
legislation to point out to us the necessity and importance of 
Beading against it for the future? Out of such legislation had 
own the internal improvement acts, which had blasted the 
prosperity and hopes of the young state, and raised up a debt 
which our grand children will never see the day of its payment. 
We should never abandon the only sure and constitutional mode 
of preventing a recurrence of such things, and this veto power was 
the most saving power to accomplish that end. It had well been 
said by the gentleman from Massac, that Illinois was a state 
which had been blessed by Heaven, but cursed by legislation, and 
our people should be jealous of any attempt to wrest from the 
constitution this mode of checking it for all time to come. Gentle- 
men have said that this is a legislative power conferred upon the 
Governor, enabling him to legislate for the state in opposition to 
the will of their representatives; it is not a positive power, it is 
only conferring upon him, who is the representative of the whole 
people, the power of checking such legislation as may be deemed 
unwise, hasty or unconstitutional. Is this legislative? Pevalsy 
as I said before, not a positive, but simply a negative power to 
check what may be considered wrong. And what other power 
hhave we left the Governor of this state? We have left him the 
power of granting pardons and reprieves, and the veto; this last 
it is now proposed to take away, and what I ask do gentlemen 
desire him to be? Do they want to see the man chosen by the 
people of the state to be their Governor made the tool of the Legis- 
lature, to do whatever they may desire, to carry out what they may 
choose to enact, no matter what his opinion may be? Do they 
want him to occupy the chair of state, and look on at their pro- 


ob Ge Aas 


ceedings and see the most unwise, corrupt ‘ad unconstitu 
legislation without the power to interpose an objection, or 
forth his hand to save? If this power be denied, then ag 
we have all the evils of over legislation, by combination and corru 
tion. A man comes to the Legislature, we will say from Pik 
Hardin, or Massac, who has some local measure which h 
anxious to have passed, one which may be of no sort of be 
to the state, but merely desired by that member an 
friends at home. He comes upon the floor of the House of | 
resentatives and there meets with other member[s] who 
similar designs to carry out, not one of which could be pa 
alone, but by a system of combination and log-rolling they su: 
in obtaining its passage—the passage of them all. In such | 
as this—no improbable one, if we judge by what has been s 
old members of the Legislature on this floor, to whom c 
people look for protection against all the evils of this local 
lation? They look, sir, to the Governor. They call upon 
avert the evil by the interposition of the power they have } 
in him. They say to him, our representatives have become 
rupt, they have betrayed the trusts we have reposed in ft 
they are about to bring upon us the accumulated evils o 
legislation, and we look to you, as the representative of the 
people of the state, and of all its great interests, to check it b: 
constitutional power. Much has been said about “one 
power.” ‘There is attached to the exercise of this power by 
man a responsibility which is not felt by legislatures? — 
Governor permits a bill to become a law which is wrong an 
constitutional, the whole responsibility of such an act rests 
his head, and there only. He is the person responsible 
people for such an act—upon him it falls entirely. Bu 
different when the Legislature may pass an act of this kin 
what is the responsibility when divided among one hundred 1 
No one of them feels, nor will take, nor can it be placed upon 
the responsibility for such a violation of the duty they owe 
the people. “One man power!” is the cry. They desire tha 
one man shall have this power. It is, say they, a “one man p¢ ey 
arrayed against the representatives of the people. Why h . 
Governor at all? Why have the executive power of the st 


ee CN epee ey PRN Sava Pee CON Pee MIT Ra Te ee Mee i re 


SATURDAY, JULY 17, 1847 437 


Why, if this power is so dangerous in the 
of “one man,” do you leave with him the right, by the 
rity of his office, after the judiciary department of the state 
tried and condemned a man for a violation of the laws, to 
pose, to pardon that man and arrest the judicial proceedings? 
‘same argument will apply in this case against the exercise of 
a “one man power,” as it will in the exercise of the veto upon 
the proceedings of the other department. It has been asked why 
ge the old constitution? I tell the gentlemen because the 
umerable evils of the past, which this power might have pre- 
ented, call loudly for the change. The people of the state look 
siously for it; the people of the county I represent demand 
adoption of the veto power in the hands of the Governor. Of 
I have no doubt, for Iam sure I reflect their sentiments when I 
say it should be adopted. 

_ The gentleman from Menard has deprecated the introduction 
of party feeling in this Convention. Though I am a party man, 
m and ardent in my feelings and opinions upon all party 
ects, I agree with him that they should not be introduced here; 
d I regretted very much, when the gentleman from Hardin 
Mir. McCatten) declared that he would review the history of the 
“country regardless of what feelings it might stir up here. I then 
ought, and I do now, that that was a most unfortunate remark. 

was one calculated to raise party feeling and excitement here, 
d to draw out replies in the same spirit; but I have said I was 
josed to it and I will not allude further to his remarks. I will 
ly say that the people have passed upon all the acts of the 
ise of the veto power, and that in the case where the Bank of 
the United States was put down by the veto upon its charter was 


3 


most signally and triumphantly sustained by the people in the 
election of Mr. Van Buren—thus showing that they regarded its 
xercise as one intended for the benefit ne prosperity of the whole 
eople. 

In conclusion, he said that he would vote, when they would be 
Ps bie upon in convention, for the retention of the whole veto 
power; that now if he could not get two-thirds he would vote for 
three-fifths, for, in his opinion, the simple majority of the members 
elect, was nothing more than no veto at all. 


0 
A 


438 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS = 


Mr. GRAHAM made some remarks in opposition to the 
power, which our limits will not permit us to give. : 

Mr. SINGLETON was in favor of the Legislature having 
power to pass what laws they should think proper, independe 
of the sanction of a Governor; but from the vote taken yester 
he thought that the Convention had decided that the veto po 
was to be retained. If this was to be the case, he would vote 
the three-fifths, because he believed that was the best he could 
and as a matter of compromise. This was a party question 
one which he had not discussed before his constituents, 
he was willing to compromise between two-thirds and a majo: 
by voting three-fifths. He had never compromised upon 
political or party question in his life, but upon this, as he did 
know exactly what the sentiments of his people were, he thoug 
something was due to them, and therefore he would vote for t 
three-fifths, as in that case the evil would be presented i in its le 
objectionable shape. He believed the majority rule the proj 
one, but he would not, for the reasons given, vote for it now. | 
thought the veto gave the Governor a power and an influence upon 
the representatives of the people which he should not possess. 1 
made him equal to forty-nine members of the House of Repre ent 
atives. 4 

“Mr. GREGG said, that he did not intend to have said anythi n 
upon this subject, but he desired, as the matter was to be d dis 
cussed, to express his views upon the subject. a 

He was one of those who believed that the veto power cann 
be abandoned without causing great danger to the liberties o 
the people, and producing a fatal tendency to the destruction 
our institutions and government. What was it. Is it the ble 
and hideous bug-bear that is held up to our view, as one conferr 
upon the Governor legislative power? No sir, it is not. ¥ 
veto confers no legislative power upon the party holding tte 
is not a positive power, it is but a negative one. It 
simply the power to negative for a time the action of the Legis 
ture when it is deemed rash, hasty or unconstitutional. T. 
was but a principle of our government. Our government is o 
of checks and balances, and this is one of those checks. If 
abandon them and let the government go without these checks a 


SATURDAY, JULY 17, 1847 439 


ces, it would fast run it to ruin and destruction for want 
the proper means to preserve its several departments, to pre- 
serve their independence and proper functions. He was in favor 
f keeping those checks and restrictions upon each depart- 
ment of the government by the other, which were first introduced 
by the framers of the constitution of the United States to pre- 
e the government, and this veto power was one which in their 
wisdom they had incorporated in that constitution. 
_ He had heard much said of the one man power, and of its power 
and influence over the representatives of the people. There was 
to his mind, nothing in a qualified veto power calculated to grind 
down the liberties of or to oppress the people, but he thought it one 
solely intended to check and drive back those destructive evils 
and dangers of misguided and uncontrolled legislation. The evils of 
oligarchy were, in his opinion, far more dangerous and destructive 
the liberties of the people than was the exercise of this one man 
ower. All history shows it, all history proclaims it in tones that 
not be misunderstood, that the evils of an oligarchy have been 
most dangerous and destructive. An abuse of power by one 
is not so bad as when it is the act of a body of men, in that 
se you have the man, you have something tangible which you 
n hold to the responsibility of the act, and he can be punished for 
at act; but how will you hold any to the responsibility where one 
dred individuals share and divide that responsibility? If one 
"man commit any act, it can be more easily traced, and he can be held 
_ to more strict accountability than where that responsibility is shared 
with ninety-nine others. He would ask the gentleman is not the 
overnor of the state the representative of the people, of the whole 
ople, and in whom all sovereignty resides? Is he not their agent 
who sits.in the executive chair to carry out the authority delegated 
to him? He was as much their representative as the members of 
the Legislature who assemble in this hall, and more so; for they 
are elected and were the representatives of local matters and local 
influence; they owe their election to county lines and sectional 
interests, but the Governor was elected by the whole people to rep- 
sent the general interests of the state, to represent the sovereignty 
her power, and to administer the government for the general 


late 


re 


beet te 
a 


440 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIOI 


¥ # NN 

Here were two representative powers, each drawing thei 
from the people, set up to check each other. It was a mi 
view of our system of government that the Legislature is 
representative of the people; the Governor was also their re 
ative. He could see no danger in giving the Governor the ] 
to watch over the actions of the Legislature, and to gua 
interests of the state from the corruption which might obtain ase 
ency in that department. Gentlemen have undertaken to 
that the veto power is a restriction upon the people and in its eff 
it is anti-tepublican. He had never considered it in that ligh 
nor had the people themselves, for we have all seen, as it ha 
truly said, that every exercise of it in the national gover 
has been prudent, wise and good for the common welfare. 
the time when Washington and Madison exercised this pov 
down to the present time, the people have sustained he 
although there may be difference of opinion on some of them, 
he himself might, upon one of them entertain different views 
those entertained by the President, still the exercise of the fo 
and the principle on which it was based had universally been 
tained. When the responsibility of the act rests upon a 
individual, so long will the people have no cause to complain 
exercise. Gall 

He would vote for the three-fifths, as proposed by the gentle 
from Schuyler, because he had now no opportunity of votin 
the two-thirds which had been stricken out. But when the s 
came before the Convention, he would vote for its adopti 
reported by the committee on the Executive Departmen 
would also vote to reconsider the vote by which that numb 
been stricken out. He hoped that vote would be reconsidere 
“two-thirds” replaced in the section. ei 

Mr. MINSHALL replied at some length to the argument o 
gentleman from Greene (Mr. Woopson) and urged that the rem 
of that gentleman and the authorities cited by him had 
that there was more necessity for the constitutional veto to be 
in the Governor of a state than in the President of the United S 
The great and iniquitous evils of unrestricted, wild and ruine 
local legislation, did not exist to such a dangerous extent in the 
tional legislature as inthe states. il 


Pies ‘7 er eee heart Deere ee re oe . 


SATURDAY, JULY 17, 1847 44t 


‘sued the subject for some considerable time. 
[r -SCATES addressed the committee in favor of the veto power, 
1 advocacy of the “two-thirds” proposal. 
r. HAYES said, that he had no desire to prolong the discussion 
efore the question was taken he wished to say.a few words 
on this subject. He was one who believed that the rights and inter 
of the people were as much represented in the person of the 
nor of this state, as in the Legislature, or in this body. This 
he ground he had ever taken on this question and upon all others, 
| he had seen no resaon to abandon it. He differed from the 
man who had denounced this veto power with so much warmth; * 
ld not see in it the horrid spectre of monarchial misrule, nor 
_ 

= the iron rule of despotism, nor one man ruling with an iron 
and over the rights, liberties and destinies of the people. He could 
‘nothing of this kind as the result of the veto power. It was true 
if you took away the right of government and gave it to one 
1 to the exclusion of all others—it would be tyranny; if you 
€ to one man all power, and allowed no appeal, he admitted 
lat that would be tyranny; or if you gave to him the sole power 
enacting laws, this would be tyranny. But he did not think that 
power of a constitutional qualified veto was any more than a 
rary restriction upon legislation; the Governor who exer- 
it neither enacts nor defeats a law, his veto merely postpones 
‘passage, and delays for a while the action of the Legislature. 
¢ Legislature meets here and passes an act which the Governor 
Joes not, looking at it in no sectional nor local point of view, think 


should become a law; he vetoes it, and the subject goes back to 


Legislature and from them, if it fails to be passed again, to the 
ple and they decide upon it at the next election. In such a 
= there is an issue between the executive and the legislative 
tments, but where is it tried? If the Governor had the sole 
of deciding that issue then that power might become tyranny; 
t is not so, he has not the decision of the question, it goes 
to the source whence both parties derive their power—the 
ple. He could see no danger in a power so conservative as this. 
He had heard since he had been here the greatest outcries against 
legislatures; he had heard them denounced as wanting in 
ity and regard for the people’s interests; they had been 


442 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


termed nuisances, and yet he was astonished, greatly surpt 
to hear the same men who had been loudest in their denunciati 
object to the most wholesome restriction upon the actions 
bodies. He wished not to introduce any party feeling or p 
spirit into this discussion, or upon any question which might com 
before the Convention, he had avoided it heretofore and ‘wo 
for the future; but the gentleman from Clinton we hea 


knew not the sense in which the gentleman inncnaedun to be un 
stood, when he made that remark, but for one, he, (Mr. H.) w 70 
say, that as far as the present Governor of Illinois was concerne¢ 
it would not be applicable, if intended as a sneer; nor did he, s 
far as his acquaintance extended, [know] of any other piisal 
had occupied that post, who was not fully competent to perf 
its duties. in 

Mr. BOND disclaimed any intention in what he had ; said 
reflecting upon the present Governor of the state, of whom he 
high opinion. 

Mr. HAYES said, that he would say no more upon ihe sub 
he had attained his object, which was to draw forth from the gen tle 
man the disclaimer he had just made. In conclus‘on he hoped t 
the “majority” would not be adopted as it rendered the vet 
little avail; but hoped that the amendment, “three-fifths,” a 
succeed. “y 

Mr. GREEN of Tazewell expressed himself in favor of ia 
fifths,”’ as a concession. a 

And the question being taken on inserting « three-fifths,” i it. 
decided in the affrmative—yeas, 85, nays, not cone 


Orr 


rose dad asked leave to sit again. Granted. 
And the Convention adjourned till 3 P. m. 


‘AFTERNOON 


The Convention resolved itself into committee of the whe 
Mr. Cratn in the chair—and took up section 21. 
Sec. 21. The Governor shall nominate and, by and with the 
advice of the Senate, appoint a Secretary of State, who shall 


SATURDAY, JULY 17, 1877 443 


fair register of the official acts of the Governor, and, when re- 
ired, shall lay the same and all papers, minutes, and vouchers 
ative thereto, before either branch of the General Assembly; 
hall perform such other duties as shall be assigned him by law. 
HOGUE moved to strike out “shall be appointed by the 
'Mr. JONES moved to strike out the whole section. 

' Messrs. Toomas, Vance, Lockwoop, KircHe.t, and Peters, 
idvocated the adoption of the section in the shape as reported; 
hey thought that the Secretary of State was the confidential and 
onstitutional adviser of the Governor, and that it was of the utmost 
mpo tance that he be a friend of and chosen by the Governor. 
fany cases were daily occurring where the necessity of this was 
y demonstrated. They also argued that the act of election 
lied representation, and asked what interest was represented by 
Secretary of State. They considered the office of no sort of 
Test to the people, and that it was only of importance to the 
yernor, who would often have occasion to consult and deliberate 
nh him upon points of constitutional law, which, perhaps, that 
sovernor might not be familiar with. 

_Messts. Grecc and Loupon advocated the motion to strike 
gt, and a provision to be inserted that the Secretary of State 
hould be elected by the people. They repelled the argument that 
his s officer was the constitutional and legal adviser of the Governor, 
oy urging that that function was properly belonging to the Attorney 
sene They contended that the people were as competent and 
ikely to select a proper and suitable person to fill that office as 
they were any other in the government. 

| The question was then taken on the motion of Mr. Hocus, and 
‘as lost. 

% ‘Mr. CONSTABLE moved to insert, after the words Secretary 
of State:” “whose term of office shall expire with the office of Gov- 
ernor, by whom he shall have been nominated, and to hold the office 
ll his successor is appointed and qualified.” 

_ And the vote thereon resulted—yeas 51, nays 50; no quorum 
_Mr. THOMAS opposed the amendment as insufficient and in- 
explicit and hoped it would be voted down, in order to have one, 


SER Ee ee) Oe ee ee ee a ee aL eer a Fe oe he ete 
PR ee ene Lee ee NE aR ee, he a Lm ER 


Ae ee 


’ drawn with great care by the chairman of the “mie 


. ” 
~ annum. 


444 


for their git 


was the one which had been drawn with great care by the ch; 
of the committee, who had requested him to offer it. He 
not press it, but would withdraw it. A gh 
Mr. DAWSON moved to strike out “the” at the beg 
of section, and insert “each.’’—Adopted. . 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved to add to the section: 
shall receive as his compensation $600 per annum.” Reje 
yeas 38. . ae 
Mr. BOSBYSHELL moved to insert: “whose salary s 
$1000 per annum;” which was rejected. rah 
Mr. MARSHALL of Mason moved to insert: “who shall 
his office for the same time as Governor, and receive $8 


Mr. LOGAN offered, as a substitute, the amendment withdr 
by Mr. ConstaB ie; which was adopted. 
Mr. KENNER moved to make the salary $700 per ant 
which was rejected. Several amendments of small i importance 
offered and almost unanimously rejected. The question wa: 
on striking out, and decided in the negative—yeas 48, nays 6 
Mr. SIBLEY moved, that the salary be $800 per annu 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery offered, as amendment, “ 
Governor shall have power to remove the Secretary, from o 
when, in his opinion, the public interests require it;” hie, 
adopted, and then the amendment of Mr. S. was carried. 
Sections 22 and 23, the last of the report, were adopt 
slight amendments. Ve 
Mr. MARKLEY ‘called up his motion to recmnagee the 
which the 4th section had been amended, so as to require a 
ship of fourteen years to be elected Governor, and the com 
refused to reconsider—yeas 48, nays not counted. — 
The 5th section, which had been passed over informall 
taken up, and the question pending was the substitute th 
amended. 


XXXII. MONDAY, JULY 19, 1847 
Prayer by Rev. Mr. Hate. 


cdanty, praying that some provision may be adopted’ exenai 
homestead from execution. Referred to the committee ont i 
Reform. 


this convention adjourn on Si bindae next, to meet again ie 
1st Monday of November next, and after some remarks, the sat 
was rejected. Yeas 13. q 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac, from the committee on Elections, z 
the right of suffrage, made a report, which was read, laid on the tal 
and 200 copies ordered to be printed. 4 

Mr. Z. CASEY moved to suspend the rules to take up a eal 
offered by him some days ago, providing that this Cony 
adjourn sine die on the 31st inst. After a short debate, the 1 
to suspend the rules was rejected. Yeas 62, nays 82. 

Mr. BROWN rose and moved that the rules be suspen 
enable him to present a preamble and some resolutions. He s 
that he had received a letter from Alton, which informed him t 
the remains of Lieutenants FLetcHer, Ropsins, and FER 
who had gallantly fought, and gloriously fallen in the service of 
country, had arrived at that place, and would be interred on ’ 
nesday. He had been requested to extend an invitation to 
Convention to attend the funeral ceremonies, but he was 
that some time had-already been lost by the visit for a 
purpose to Jacksonville, and that there were many in the Co 
tion who regretted the time thus lost, thinking that the Conven 
might have appointed a committee to represent them at that» 
bration, and as the time ee it would occupy to go to a K 


difference in the distance, he had therefore prepared the folle 
preamble and resolutions: 
The following letter was then read: 


446 


MONDAY, JULY 19, 1847 447 


7 Atton, July 16th, 1847. 

7 oe: €5q., 

2AR Str: - I am requested by my fellow citizens, to ask you, 
»M ayor of the city of Alton, to extend to the members of the con- 

itutional Convention of Illinois, an invitation to participate with 

mM on Wednesday next, (the 21st inst.,) at 2 P.M., in the cere- 

jonies attendant upon the burial of the remains of our brave 

sutenants, FLETCHER, FErRcuson and Rosstns, of the Alton 

tds, 2d Regiment Illinois Volunteers, who fell upon the battle 
Hof Buena Vista, nobly sustaining the honor of their state and 


I am with respect, 
Your obedient servant, 


E. Keatine, Chief Marshal. 


e rules were unanimously suspended and Mr. Brown pre- 
ted Ae following, which were unanimously adopted: 
esas, This Convention has just been informed that the 
bdies of Lieutenants Epwarp F. Fiercuer, Lauriston Rossins 
Ropney Fercuson, of the “Alton Guards,” second regiment 
ois volunteers, who fell upon the bloody field of Buena 
a, while nobly sustaining the honor of their country, have reached 
1, and that they will be interred in that city on Wednesday, the 
inst., with funeral honors; and whereas, this Convention, be- 
that it is right and proper for them to commemorate the 
and patriotic deeds and virtues of those who have so gloriously 
n in the service of their country; be it therefore 

solved, That this Convention deeply sympathize with the 
es and friends of the lamented FLeETcHER, Ropsins and Fer- 
» who have been so suddenly cut down in the vigor of youth, 
hose noble deeds on the bloody field of Buena Vista have en- 
ed their memories in the affections of the nation and placed their 
lames on the page of its history. 

Resolved, That this Convention, for the purpose of honoring 
lamented dead, will join in the celebration of their funeral 
monies. 

Resolved, That a committee of nine be appointed to represent 
Convention in the funeral ceremonies aforesaid. 


“448 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL CO 


eS0 
signed by the President and Secretary, be transmitted 
Secretary to the families of the deceased Be st, Ross 
FERGUSON. 
Messrs. Brown, SINGLETON, SMITH of Galak Coe 
Pratt, Woopson, McCa.ien, Cosy and Hocus, were app 
the committee under the above resolutions, to bigs sat th 
vention at the funeral ceremonies. 
Mr. WEAD moved that the Convention dened itself 
committee of the whole, to take up the report of the comm 
the Judiciary Department, and the Convention resolved it: 
committee of the whole. Mr. Scares in the chair. After 
discussion as to the proper mode of proceeding with the t 
reports, the committee took up the first section of aa mi 
report: i 
Sec. 1. The judicial power of this State, shall be ves 
one supreme court, in circuit courts, and such inferior 
as the legislature shall, from time to time ordain and es 
Mr. LOGAN moved to insert in ‘the section “county 
Mr. JENKINS moved to strike out all after “circuit 
and insert ‘ ‘and such other courts as may be established b 
constitution.’ 
Mr. LOGAN accepted this amendment to be alias to 
Mr. DAVIS of McLean was opposed to leaving with thi 
lature the power to establish innumerable municipal 
throughout the State, as would be the case if the section 
remain in its present shape, and advocated the adoption 
amendment of Mr. JENKINS, which, while it establatae the j : 


of the people demanded. ’ 
Mr. HARVEY did not agree with the gente in 
number of the courts in the constitution. It was impossi 


of the legislature from establishing such courts, with auch : 
and jurisdiction as may be required by those interests 
increase of population. 


MONDAY, JULY 19, 1847 449 


altering or changing or adopting that system to meet thegreat 
Wing interests and wants of the people. A supreme court was 
jecessary under all circumstances, and so were circuit courts, and 
‘was well to provide that they should be established, but he did 
not think that the number of circuit courts should be unalterably 
fixed. It was indispensable that these two courts should be 
‘ovided for in the constitution; but not so with the inferior or 
nor courts. He was opposed to any constitutional provision 
fining the number and character of all the courts that may be 
quired by the changes of society, and of the business and inter- 
of the people. The smaller and inferior tribunals of the state 
cted to the greatest extent the interests of society, and the 
= should be left full power to establish such courts, or 
change and alter their power and jurisdiction to meet the 
changes that were daily taking place in the business and feelings 
f the people. We might be able to adopt a system that would 
suit the interests and population of the state at the present time; 
but i it was impossible for us to adopt any system that would suit 
sn years hereafter. 
_ Mr. SINGLETON advocated the adoption of the amendment 
of the gentleman from Jackson. He was in favor of fixing in the 
Bpastitution a system of our judiciary department, and the char- 
acter and jurisdiction of the courts, but would leave with the 
Legislature a power to increase the number of the circuit courts to 
meet the exigencies of the increased population of the state. 
_ Mr. PETERS said, he approached this subject with some trem- 
Benes he had looked forward to the day when the report of 
ae Judiciary committee would come before them for discussion, 
fear and trembling. The judiciary was the most important 
- of the government. While it was the most important 
d powerful in its influence and effect upon the rights, property 
and liberties ‘of individuals, it was the least powerful in defending 
itself from” *the encroachments of the other branches of the govern- 


a4 
is 


450 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL a7 


least powerful of any branch of the government crs atta 
the Legislature or the popular clamor. And it was our d 
justice to its importance and the want of power, to defend 
to fix in the constitution a provision that will place the 
courts above the power and influence and control of the i 
ture. The history of the judiciary throughout the country 
that in no single state has it escaped from the effects of a : 
excitement against the higher judicial tribunals, which in m 
instances had forced them to submit to popular clamor and 
lative control. This fact was known to all, and he calle 
gentlemen to place at least the highest courts of the stat 
all these influences, and then the people, in case the infe 
bunals of the country do them injustice, will always hav i 
tribunal to protect their rights, property and liberties, a ; 
conservative power on which they can depend. If these 
tribunals be thus elevated above all influences, we migh 
with safety, to the Legislature, a power to regulate the in 
courts to conform to the interests, and, if you pleased, to th 
of the people. He was opposed to granting the Legisla 
power to increase the number of the circuit courts of the sta 
there was danger in allowing that department power to e 
inferior courts how much more was the danger i in giving t 
power to fritter away the power of the circuit courts byi incr 
their number to as many as there are counties in the s 
Mr. P. read a proposition which he had drawn up—which 
the Legislature power to create, establish and destroy the 
courts—at the will and desire of the people, and secured th 
and superior courts from any change by legislative action 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery was in favor of the amenc 
He thought we should establish in the constitution the syste 
jursidiction of our judiciary, and leave with the Legislatur 
power but to increase the number of circuit courts. 
Messrs. MINSHALL and KINNEY of Bureau were in f 
of the section as it was reported by the committee. 
Mr. GREGG said, that in the amendment he saw on 
tion to it which he desired to point out to the Conventio: f 
should be adopted it would prohibit the creation of any munici 


‘ee 


MONDAY, JULY 19, 1847 451 
rts in the cities; and in his opinion the time would come when 
courts would be absolutely necessary in our cities. In the 
‘of Chicago, which was increasing so rapidly, the time would 
1 come, if it had not already arrived, when such a court— 
spendently of the county courts—would be necessary to pre- 
mn ve order and obedience to the laws. He thought that the 
onvention should take this matter into consideration, and hoped 


a a Petlative action. Let the Legislature, when the time 
come, that the population will require it, establish such 
s in Chicago, Peoria, Alton and Galena. 


Legislature may establish in cities having a population over 
thousand, such tribunalls] as may be necessary, having police 
jurisdiction in cases less than felony.” 

Mr. SHERMAN expressed similar views to those of his col- 
ague, Mr. Grecc. 

_ Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess, was of opinion that, although 
amendment of the gentleman from Sangamon went further 
it did before the modification of it, still it did not go far 
ugh. ‘The section even as amended placed an absolute restric- 
upon the Legislature, from providing such tribunals as the 
pple may hereafter require, when the interests and population 
the state shall be increased. He agreed with the member who 
d said that we are restricting too much, carrying our restrictions 
far, and should be careful that we did not earn for our con- 
tution the soubriquet of a constitution of restrictions. This 
not proper. We should not follow this course. We should 
something for future legislation. If we pursued the course 
Testriction that seemed such a favorite course with gentlemen, 
re will it lead us? It will, if carried out, lead us to forge 
of iron to be placed upon the members of the General As- 
y whenever they meet, to prevent them rushing, the moment 
y attive here, into the treasury and robbing it. There had 
en something said respecting a court which had been established 
Alton and then abolished, of that he knew nothing; but he 


42 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


would refer them to the tribunals that had been establis E 
Chicago and Galena, which the actual necessity of their crea 
compelled the Legislature to establish. Before they were est 
lished it was often eighteen months before the people could obt, 
a judgment on a suit, and we had to resort to the United 
district court, our dockets were crowded, our jails were full, ju 
was delayed and men were denied a speedy trial, a right s 
to them by the constitution of the United States. The p 
unable to remain thus, came to the Legislature, and had the 
bunals created to meet the exigencies, under that provision 
constitution which it is proposed by these amendments to 
stricken out. This was the same case in Galena; necessity 
pelled her to have these courts established there, which if no 
had been given to the Legislature to create, we would have. 
wait till the constitution had been changed. And now, are 
to be taken away from us. Look at St. Louis. There they 
their circuit and city courts, a court of common pleas, 
recorder’s and a criminal court, all springing up as the city gr 
interest and population, and established as the exigencies o 
people required them. No complaint was ever heard ag 
them; no complaint that they had abused their powers. | 
at Chicago and see what she will be some years hence; look a 
fast increasing population, commerce and business intere 
every kind: here too is Galena stretching her Biarean arms 6 
her hills, and reaching far up her vallies [sic], fast rising int 
portance, and interest, and will you tell them these courts, sp 
in this section, are sufficient for the administration of yourp 
judicial affairs, and the constitution shall deny you for all t 
come, any change or increase, no matter how large in po 
or influential in trade and commerce you may hereafter be 
He would desire to say more upon this subject, but his healt 
not at this moment permit him, as it was with difficulty 
spoken at all. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean replied to the gentleman from 
and Jo Daviess. He said the necessity of the courts the 
spoken of was the result of a want of the provision now pro 
in the old constitution. In 1840 the Legislature abolishe 
circuit court system and compelled the supreme court to do ¢ 


MONDAY, JULY 19, 1847 453 


These judges were unable to perform the laborious tasks 
ned them and the business was undisposed of. Then arose 
necessity of these smaller courts. But under the present 
on the number of circuit courts may be increased and Chicago 
‘Galena can have each a circuit court to itself. This in his 
nion obviated the difficulty urged by the gentleman. 
‘The question was divided and first taken on the provision 
fered by Mr. Locan, and it was rejected—then on striking out, 
decided in the affirmative; then on inserting “‘county courts,” 
h was carried; and then adding the amendment of Mr. 
ENKINS, which was also carried. 
_ Mr. CHURCH moved to insert after “‘county courts,’—“‘and 
srobate courts.” 
On motion, the committee rose and the Convention adjourned 
1 3 P. M. 
ae AFTERNOON 
_ The Convention resolved itself into committee of the whole 
resumed the consideration of the report of the Judiciary com- 
ittee. The question pending was on the motion to insert 
obate courts;” and being taken, resulted—yeas 29, nays 42— 


Mr. HENDERSON suggested that the committee had ex- 

pressed their intention to give the circuit courts probate juris- 

ction, and therefore, it was unnecessary to insert this amendment. 

_ And the question being taken again resulted—yeas 31, nays 

4—no quorum voting. 

_ The committee rose and reported that fact to the Convention, 

ad a call was ordered; after some time spent in the call a quorum 

appeared, and the committee resumed its sitting. 

And the question being taken on the amendment, it was 

jected. 

_ Mr. DAVIS, of Massac, moved to strike out. the section and 
sert ““The judicial power of this state shall be vested in one 

supreme court, in circuit courts, in justices of the peace, and in 

val other courts as the Legislature may, from time to time, 

tablish.” 

_ And the question being taken thereon, it was rejected—yeas 49, 


formations, in the nature of writs of guo warranto and ce 
and to hear and to determine the same, and in such cases ¢ 
peachment as may be required to be tried before it. 
Mr. ARCHER moved to strike out all after the word ‘ 
He said that in the last report which we had acted upon 
provided for trial of impeachments by the Senate which 
more appropriate tribunal. Cases of impeachment were ge 
for political offenses, and it might occur that after impea 
it would be found proper to have the individual tried before a cx 
and it would not be proper to have him tried by judges who 
when impeaching him, made up an opinion of his guilt. 
The question was taken and decided in the negative. 
Mr. HURLBUT moved to strike out “except in cases re 
to the revenue.” Lost. 
Mr. THOMAS moved to strike out“ prokilaten ge wa 


and insert “‘and all other writs necessary to the ait exe 
of appellate jurisdiction.” ye. 

Mr. HARVEY moved to strike out Ae the amendm« 
word “appellate.” Carried, and then the amendme 
adopted—yeas 64, nays 47. ; i, 

Sec. 3. The supreme court shall consist of one chie: 
and two associate justices, who shall be not less than thirty ry 
years of age, and shall receive a salary of twelve hundred ¢ 
per annum each, and no more, payable quarterly. 

Mr. DALE moved to strike out “two associate titi 
insert “three” &c. Mr. D. said that as to the numbe: 
should compose this court, he had not given much conside 
the number “three” did not appear to him a proper numbe 
the main duty of the supreme court was the determination of 

‘ of appeals, and this determination to be final, the neces 
peared of fixing the number of judges with a view to this end, 
sure proper determinations and which would be satisfactory 
people. Would determinations made by this court, compe 
three judges only, be always satisfactory? If, in a case of 


ioe 


13 


MONDAY, JULY 279, 7847 455 


se supreme judges favored the reversal of a judgment 
1 itd the affirmance of it, the judgment would be reversed; 
| yet it would be but the opinion of two judges opposed to two. w 
e two | supreme judges, overruling not a smaller number of j 
nor of less capacity, but an equal number, a supreme judge 3 
circuit judge, and the latter two probably the more compe- 4 
men. The opinion of the circuit judge was entitled to con- : 
on. This judge would oftentimes be a more able one than i 
st e judge. For the latter would be nominated by con- r 
ior s, which, desirous of presenting familiar names to the 
, would select from among men well known, but known, it 
be, chiefly as politicians; whilst the circuit judge would be 
<d by a small district, by those personally acquainted with 
, and would be chosen on account of his legal acquirements, 
to every one in the district, and acquired, it might be, 
st the nominees for the supreme court were employed in 
glitics and legislation. Would the people be satisfied with the 
mination of their cases made by two associate Justices over- 


same & e™ 


. ich: so that there might be a concurrence of 
of at least three judges in all final decisions and this being 
rity of all giving opinions in the case, supreme judges and 
judge, would it not be more satisfactory? 

rs. Harvey, Lockwoop and Perers supported the 
dment; Messrs. Davis, of Montgomery, Davis, of McLean, 
L, and Weap opposed it, and the question being taken 
On, it was decided in the negative. 

I KITCHELL moved to strike out “$1200” and insert : 
” Yeas 49, nays 65. 


KITCHELL moved to amend by adding “ Provided, that j 
eral assembly may, whenever it shall become necessary, : 
>for additional associate justices, not exceeding two others, 2 
appointed as provided for in this constitution;” which was 2 


voters of the state on the first Monday in March after the adopt 


456 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


Mr. WITT uted to insert after “age,” “and who shall 
been a citizen of the United States for five years;” which ° 
adopted. 7 

Mr. WEAD moved to strike out the section and insert 
supreme court shall consist of three judges, any two of whom 
form a quorum; and the concurrence of two of said judges shal. 
all cases, be necessary to a decision,” and the same was reject 

Sec. 4. The justices of the supreme court shall be elec: 
by the qualified voters of the state, on the first Monday of Ma 
after the adoption of this article; returns whereof shall be mad 
the Secretary of state, who shall count the same in the presen 
the Governor and Auditor, or either of them; the three pe 
having the highest number of votes shall be elected. 7 

Mr. SERVANT moved to strike out “elected by the qual 


of this article,” and insert “appointed by the Governor, by 
with the advice and consent of the senate.” He said t 
knew his amendment would not be adopted, but he desired the 
his constituents should know that he had acted according to h 
sentiments. If he thought he could carry the amendment I 
would speak for a month and log roll with every member o 
Convention; but he knew differently and would do no more t 
propose the amendment. : 
Mr. PETERS addressed the Convention till a late hou 
support of the amendment, and without concluding, gave way 
motion that the committee rise. 
The committee rose, and then the Convention adjourned w 
8 A. M. " 


XXXIV. TUESDAY, JULY 20, 1847 


¥ Prayer by Rev. Mr. Green of Tazewell. 

_ Messrs. Kinney, of St. Clair, Weap, and Cross, of Winnebago, 
P resented petitions praying the appointment of a superintendent 
of schools; referred to committee on Education. 

_ Mr. ROBBINS presented the following resolution, which was 
: . : lopted: 

_ Resolved, That the committee on Finance inquire into the 
expediency of inserting in the constitution an article, requiring 
‘the Legislature to ascertain from time to time the amount of the 
State debt—to apportion the state debt, according to the taxable 
" property assessed in the state. To ptovide by law that any indi- 
dual may pay his share of the said debt proportioned to his 
able property, and that such real estate as shall have paid its 
‘share of state indebtedness, and the value of so much personal 
estate as shall have been paid its share of state indebtedness, shall 
be ever thereafter exonerated from any liability in consequence 
the state debt, and to provide from moneys raised by such 
oluntary payments, a sinking fund, with which to purchase the 
‘state indebtedness. 

Mr. KNAPP, of Jersey, by leave, presented the following 
“solution, which was adopted: 

_ WHEREAS »A respectable minister of the Gospel, whilst attending 
the Convention to open its sessions by prayer, under a resolution 
fof this Convention has been grossly insulted and menaced with 
bodily injury by a member of the Convention; and whereas, it is 
ike due to the Convention and to the ministers, that we should 
ot invite them to perform that duty unless we could secure them 
ainst such indignities; therefore 

Resolved, That the resolution inviting the clergymen of Spring- 
eld to open the sessions of the Convention with prayer be re- 
scinded, and that the secretary inform the said clergymen of the 
same, with the assurance of the Convention, that this step is not 
adopted from any dissatisfaction with the manner in which they 


457 


OO ge, ae ee 


pad 


Sa ie 
SEBO OS Sy we 


S's 


have discharged Le sacred duty, but solely hon an Sunil 
ness to subject them to a repetition of such indignities. 


The Convention then resolved itself into committee | 
whole—Mr. Scates in chair. 

Mr. PETERS said, that the question now Hane pian was 
of greater interest to him than any other which would come 
them; and it was this reason that had induced him to detain 
Chavcniin much longer than under other circumstances 
would have done. He had prepared a proposition to ame 
section, and would have offered it had he not been anticipated 
the motion of the gentleman from Randolph. He would ha 
read: (the secretary read the proposition.) Mr. P. said, tha 
proposition just read was not the one which he preferred most, b 
it was one which would secure the independence of the judicia 
and with the independence of the judiciary, the rights and li 
of the people. He had argued yesterday, and would to-day, 
on the independence of the judiciary of the government, S 
the liberties of the people. When that department was placed 
such circumstances—exposed to all the dangers of a. change 
legislative action or the popular clamor—it was easily induce 
swerve from the path of rectitude, and its purity endangered 
becoming dependent upon them for support. The great 
guard of all liberty was gone when the judiciary became d 
ent. He alluded to the history of the judiciary in England, 
said, the time was when it was the prerogative of the cro 
make and unmake judges—to command them—to rule by th 
terror of power their decisions, and make them the instrume 
of tyranny; but the time came when the monarch was for 
abandon this part of his prerogative, and give up the right « 
removal of judges from office, except on the address of his gentle 
men in the commons. Prior to that time they were the creatt 
of the crown, and bound to its behests; since then, and ever al 
the revolution of 1680, we find them independent, and as firr 
as adamant in opposition to the tyrannical encroachments of th 
kingly power. In the Swiss cantons the independence of dl 
judiciary was most safely guarded; the people there fear so 
that their judges will be influenced by the party appo! at 
them that they, when they have to appoint a judge, send to ot 


TUESDAY, JULY 20, 1847 459 


for a suitable person to fill the office, in order that he may 
among them free from all influence upon his actions by a 
for the persons selecting him. In Spain, too, he found an 


x 


nion over the administration of the laws. The people were 
er safe under such a rule. A change came, the judges were 
de independent of all parties, and removed from the influence 
e lords, and public safety was secure. He could not illustrate 
beauty of an independent judiciary and of the great confidence 
eated in the minds of the people, better than by relating an 
dote told of the great monarch Frederick. He was once 
g outside Berlin, when he met a boy carrying fruit; he asked 
boy to give him some of the fruit. The boy replied, “I cannot, 
I am carrying it to my mother.” “TI will buy it of you.” “No, 
IT cannot sell it, I must carry it to my mother.” “I will tell the 
ing that you refused it to me for money.” “I cannot help it, 
will not sell it.” “Then,” said the monarch, “I am the king, 
will make you give up the fruit.” “I don’t care if you are 
ie king,” said the boy; “‘if you take it from me, there are judges 
Berlin!” This, sir, was the greatest boast of that monarch, 
t his people could exclaim, “‘we have judges in Berlin.” He 
ag the experience of the past had shown that the old 
node no selecting the judiciary was safe, and had worked well, 
and he deprecated any departure from it, to enter into the un- 
own paths of this untrodden system, with no lights of experience 
to guide our footsteps. The greatest man who had ever distin- 
guished the tribunals of the country, had said, when an attempt 
made to overturn the judiciary system of Virginia, that on 
independence of the judiciary, and its removal from all in- 
mces, depended the liberties of the people. Mr. P. here read 
an extract from the remarks of judge Marshall in the Virginia 
pnvention. He would refer also to another Virginian, Mr. 
ferson, who had said repeatedly that we should have our judi- 
y independent and far removed above all influences and biases; 
| that, if this were so, no matter how corrupt the legislative or 
executive departments might become, the people would always 


ta 
Pe OD CAL Oe 


‘dangerous action. Mr. P. thought that an flees em 


460 


have one safeguard, and an invulnerable protection from tt 


could not secure to us an independent judiciary. Judge Mar 
has said: ‘would you place on the jury a man who was interes S 
in or to be opposed by the result of the verdict?” And Mr. 
asked, would you trust a man on your bench whose very offi 
whose salary, whose means of living, and the very bread for 
wife and family, may depend on the decisions he will mz 
when he, if he offend that power or that party which put hi 
office, knows and feels he will be by them put out again? — 
any man, can any man, say that such a system will secur 
independent judiciary? He had as high an opinion of the ge 
intelligence of the people as any man, but he would not fl 
the people by attributing to them qualifications which they 
not as a body possess, nor which they would claim. He 
not disposed to say that the masses of the people were all co m 
tent judges of a man’s capacity as an expounder of one of the m 
abstruse sciences. He was not ready to admit that they ¥ 
all competent to judge whether a man whom they never saw 
read a sufficient number of books upon law—whether he had - 
mind to understand what he had read—or was qualified with 
knowledge sufficient to discharge the duties of a judge. And 
a capacity to decide this question was an important requisite to 
possessed by one who was called upon to choose a judge. A mé 
presented himself to the people as a candidate for the pro 
of chemistry, would any one say that the masses of the pec 
were competent to decide whether that man understood the sc 
of chemistry, or qualified to teach it? 

Mr. P. said, that although he might draw upon a 
censure of the people and the press, he thought his position a 
rect one, and would follow it, even if he stood alone. He did 
think the people desired an elective judiciary—they wanted 
to take from the Legislature the power to elect them. Foreign 
were coming into our state, many who did not understand. 
language; they, in six months, were permitted to-vote, were 
qualified to judge of the abilities and learning of a man to fill 
office of a judge? They were good men, but not compete: 


TUESDAY, JULY 20, 1847 461 


i’ to select Hlanest men to represent them in the Legislature, when 
“you open to them, the greater privilege, and recognize in them, the 
‘capacity of judging of the qualifications of judges of law? He 
_ reviewed, at great length, the history of the State of N. York; 
My alluded to the elective provision in the constitutions of Niiscour! 
| and Wisconsin which had been rejected. He alluded to many 
vis abuses under the operation of the system in Mississippi. He 
sis ‘referred to the dangers of an elective judiciary in times of excite- 
_ ment, asked where would be the independence of a judge elected 
in Hancock county, during the Mormon excitement, and in the 
‘same manner to the Massac difficulties. 
He felt he had discharged his duty, and called upon the mem- 
bers of the bar to stand up for the independence of the judiciary. 
4 He thought he saw many evils in this system: the rich oppressing 
me the poor, the strong bearing down the weak, and the weak appeal- 
if ing to the judiciary in vain. He thought he saw the judge ranging 
- around the state, making friends by his official decisions of those 
who would be powerful i in re-electing him. 
We have given but a skeleton of the remarks of Mr. P., who, 
on both days, addressed the committee for four hours, eliciting the 
_ closest attention. 
_ Mr. DAVIS of McLean followed in a speech of one hour’s 
Mi length in reply to the various positions assumed by the gentleman 
_ from Peoria. He reviewed the whole argument, and contended 
_ that the election of the judiciary was republican, and the most 
_ effective in establishing it independent. He thought the expe- 
“ rience of those states, in which it had been adopted, sufficiently 
demonstrated its utility, and beneficial consequences. He advo- 
: cated its adoption as the only mode of ridding Illinois of her present 
" inefficient system which had none of the confidence of the people, 
and’ ‘of establishing a system that would be entirely independent 
_ of the other branches of the government, and would always receive 


aay KT PA SH eh ee 
Tax. fe Af 7 


462 


reminded the members that any system might be abused, 
that an abuse was not a fair argument. The right of suff 
might and was often abused, but that was no argument against th 
right of suffrage. Some men had wealth, and abused the por 
it gave them, but that was no argument that it should be tal 
from them. He would rather see judges the weather-cocks 
public sentiment, in preference to seeing them the instrume 
of power, to see them registering the mandates of the Legislat a 
a and the edicts of the Governor. 

a He thought that even if the national judiciary were elected 
: the people, they would have made better selections than had bee 
ee made by the President for years past. They would have ch 


4 judges, instead of broken down politicians. Y 
s Mr. GREEN of Tazewell replied to the gration . 
; McLean, and advocated briefly the same views expressed b: 


3 gentleman from Peoria. 
ie Mr. PALMER of Macoupin argued at much jeneth on 
same grounds presented by Mr. PETERS, against an ele 
judiciary. 
On motion, the committee rose and reported progress. he i 
And the Convention adjourned till 3 P. M. 


AFTERNOON 


The Convention was called and, as soon as a quorum appeal al 
resolved itself into committee of the whole, and resumed the 
sideration of the report of the Judiciary committee. ‘ 

Mr. ARCHER said, that he had listened to the remarks of 
gentleman from Peoria with great attention, but had not be 
convinced by what he had heard, that the election of the j judici 
was not demanded by the people, or that it was fraught ¥ 
danger to the liberties of the state. After alluding to the bene 
resulting from its adoption—by placing it above the contro 
the legislative or executive departments, and making 
entirely upon the people—the source of all power—for suppi 
and confidence, he scouted any danger to be apprehende 
the change in the system. 


TUESDAY, JULY 20, 1847 463 


New York they had made a change from the old system to 
ctive principle, and it was done to meet the growing and 
ving opinions of the people in regard to their judiciary. In 
state they had no cause to complain of their judiciary, it 
high and elevated in the estimation of the people, its deci- 
were authority all over the Union, and the people felt satisfied 
‘it, or at least they had no complaint to make. But a change 
e system was thought desirable by the Convention that met 
ame the constitution, and it was made and the people sus- 
it by a triumphant majority. If a change was desirable 
e, where there was no complaint, how much more so here, 
ere there was great complaint of the mode in which judges were 


ed they would become the mere tools of the politicians to 
m they owed their elevation. Such would be the case when 
an felt that he owed the office he held to the Governor by whom 
as appointed, but not so with the man chosen by the whole 
le. In the latter case he stood the choice of the people, to 
nme man was he compelled to acknowledge his election, but 
ed to them all as men whose interests he had been selected to 
h over, guard and protect. 

He alluded at great length to the capacity of the people to 
t competent judges to fill the bench of the supreme court, and 
lled the arguments of Messrs. PETERs and Patmer, that they 
not as well qualified to elect the judges, as to elect a man to 


q 
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4 
= 
j 
fs 
% 
* 
: 
24 
2 


464 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS | 


_ why should any two of the departments of the government ass 
the right of creating the other, and of exercising over it a con 
After an allusion to the late change by the state of New Yor 
her judicial system, and an explanation of the anti-rent difficulti 
he referred the Convention to the period when the offices of con: 
stable and justices of the peace were made elective. Then th 
were the same cries made against the danger of political prejudi 
and influences being brought to bear upon the administratic 
justice. No where throughout the land could be found 
honest, upright, and impartial justices of the peace or in 
magistracy, than in those states where they were elected by 
people. In time the superior courts would be found to be as pure— 
as far removed from petty and political influences—as was 
inferior. Moreover, he thought it a possible case, that the t 
would come when.the people would discover that it was not nec 
sary to have lawyers on the bench. It had been supposed th 
none but lawyers should have been elected to this Convention 
frame a constitution, but in the election, the people had shor 
that they thought differently. Farmers, merchants, and mech 
ics, had been sent here, and they were not the least comp 
For one, he was not willing to give up every thing to la 
There had been eulogies passed upon the profession, and it ha 


the amendment.” 

Mr. KITCHELL was in favor of appointing the ‘ioe of h 
supreme court by the Governor and senate; and of the electio o! 
the circuit judges by the people. His views would be differen 
from those expressed by both sides. He thought the great ob 
tion on the part of the people to our present system was, that 
judges were elected by the Legislature; and then, another 
they held their office for life. The first prejudice against 
judiciary had arisen from a decision made by the supreme 
upon the question of the tenure by which the Secretary of S 
held his office. The only manner in which the evil decisio: 


Se oT eines of this speech by Knapp may be found in the Sang 
Journal, July 29 a 


TUESDAY, JULY 20, 1847 465 


rt would be got over, was the increase of the bench, and 
‘there were made nine judges for /ife. At last, to remedy this 
_ the present Convention was called, and the principal object 
to abolish the life system. The people were dissatisfied with 
mode of appointing the judges, in consequence of the great 
s of time by the Legislature in choosing the men, and in election- 
e for favorite candidates. He could see no necessity in 
ng the judges of the supreme court elective; that the 
le had a right to elect them as well as any other officer, he did 
t deny, but that such a thing was necessary he did deny. With 
@ circuit court it was different: the people knew all about the 
ididates, as they were men continually on the circuit, and the 
-eyed observation of the people would select the best men. 
people of Jo Daviess county knew nothing of a man who lived 
Wabash county. He alluded to this subject for some time, and 
mcluded by remarking that the object of the people in desiring 
ange, was to strike at the circuit judges, and not to have the 
ipreme judges made elective. 

~Mr. WILLIAMS considered the question an important one, 
and desired to state the grounds on which he would vote. He had 
d the arguments of the gentlemen from Peoria and Macoupin 
inst an elective judiciary, but had not been convinced. He 
uld appreciate the sincerity of their sentiments, because at one 
he was as prejudiced, by early associations and opinions, in 
of the old system as they were. He had thrown off the 
kles which had bound his mind, and had come to a different 
usion on the subject. We had seen the working of the old 
m, and admired it—we had lived under it and saw no abuses— 
ad witnessed and felt all of its operations, and had heard nocom- 
t. We were attached to it because it had worked well. But 
was ten years ago. At that time a man who was in favor of 
ective judiciary would be a curiosity. At that time, as had 
said, they made a decision, and that it was complained 
But who made the complaint? If it had come from the 
ople, and they had stricken down the whole power of the court, 
‘there might be an argument against the elective principle. 
the complaint came from the Legislature, and the court was 
sndent on the Legislature. Since then the system had not 


Much had been said of an independent paper tla 
whom? He agreed with all that had been said about the i 
pendence of the judiciary; but one object of the judiciary 
protect the people from the other branches of the gover 
and how was this proposed to be carried out? The old 
was to place the judiciary independent of the people, and de 
ent on the Governor and Legislature; the elective plan 1 
make them independent of the Governor and Legislature 
dependent on the people for support against the other brane! 
the government. The object of the distribution of the pow 
government was that the one department may check another. 
pose you give a few men the power to make laws and carry 1 the e 
execution, itis simple and plain. Why not try that gov 
Because those few men may become corrupt. Gentle 
Let the Legislature and the Governor pass the laws, a 
those laws can go into effect, the judiciary must give th 
approval; therefore the judiciary has a control over the ot 
But they say to the Governor and Legislature you may 
that judiciary yourself! Mr. W. was in favor of a limite 
of office by judges. He here viewed the English judici 
replied to Mr. PETERS on.that subject. He opposed the 

of judges by general ticket as most objectionable, but an 
was better than appointment by the Governor, as good 
always appointed good judges, and bad governors al 


that the people thought second or third rate plitiians m : 
enough to fill that office. 


insert wilt had been Bea died by the ameneaeae 
vote for the election of judges by general ticket, but woul 


friends of both propositions of the elective system, to 

striking out; the question could then be taken on the v 
ositions. He urged upon all who were in favor of an elec 
the people to vote to strike out. 


TUESDAY, JULY 20, 1847 467 


DAVIS of Massac hoped the motion to strike out would 
, he thought the general ticket system was the most objec- 
ble feature that could be proposed. Sooner than vote for 


: n by the Senate. 
ir. DAVIS of Montgomery expressed a similar view. 
HENDERSON moved the committee rise; which was 


, CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess warned the friends of an 
tive system to stand by the report of the committee as it stood, 
if this provision be stricken out, we cannot replace it. And 
h: would they then do? If stricken out they were precluded from 
el Hi g it again. 
Mr. LOGAN said, that when they got the measure into the 
vention and out of the committee it might be again inserted. 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess: Why not report the section 


moved that the committee rise, sahick was 


Mr. Z. CASEY appealed to the friends of an elective judiciary 
0 vote against striking out. He warned them not to part with 
; |, alte as it stood now. If the motion to strike out prevailed, 
“then they might give up all hopes of that system. He warned 


_ Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess warned the friends of the 
elective judiciary to maintain their ground. He assured them 
‘that if it were stricken out, they would get no provision to elect 
; bg judiciary inserted again. 
__ A motion that the committee rise was made, and decided in 
wes negative. 
__ Mr. HENDERSON said, that he had expected the movement 
_ that had been made by the enemies of an elective judiciary. He 
had been watching all day for the gentleman from Sangamon to 
blow his trumpet, and gather his forces. He was not astonished 
Dog that gentleman, after a careful glance at the vacant seats, 
sounded the note for action; it was in keeping with that 
iieepletnan’ s superior tactics. He (Mr. H.) again warned the 
members who were in favor of an elective judiciary to vote against 


wk 


Zz 
w* 


all propositions to strike out, for if the m 
carried, the election of the judges by the pe 


in the affirmative. Yeas 81, nays 31. 
Mr. PETERS moved the committee rise; 
and the Convention adjourned till to-morrow 


XXXV. WEDNESDAY, JULY 21, 1847 


Prayer by Mr. Green, of Tazewell. 

Leave of absence for ten days was granted to Messrs. MARKLEY, 

BY -Lovupon, Akin, and Dummer. 
Ye _ Mr. JENKINS, from the committee on Counties, reported 
__ back sundry resolutions, and asked to be discharged from the 

_ further consideration thereof. 
On motion, the report and resolutions were laid on the table. 
The Convention then resolved itself into committee of the 

_ whole on the report of the Judiciary committee. 

The motion pending was on inserting the amendment of Mr. 

_ Servant—“be appointed by the Governor by and with the advice 
and consent of the Senate.” 

Mr. DAVIS, of Massac, moved as a substitute for the amend- 
ment—*‘the State shall be divided into three grand divisions as 
‘nearly equal as may be, and the qualified voters of each division 

_ Shall elect one of said supreme judges for the term of six years.’ 

Mr. BROCKMAN addressed the committee in opposition to 
the amendment and in support of the election of the three judges 
by general ticket. 

_ Mr. FARWELL opposed the district system. It was, in his 
opinion, worse than having the judges elected by the representa- 

_ tives of the people. Under the district system a majority of the 

’ court might be composed of two judges who were the choice of a 
minority of the people. A man might be chosen by the people 
of the southern or the northern districts who was obnoxious to the 
whole people, and whose sentiments and opinions might be differ- 
ent from those entertained by the majority of the people. Wasthis 
an election by the people? It was not, but onthe contrary placed 
within the power of a minority to defeat the choice of the majority. 
He warned gentlemen that in the north part of this State there 
was a large party that was fast increasing in numbers and political 
strength, they would soon be able to command an election in 
that section. Did gentlemen desire to see those men—whose 
Principles were to do away with the law of the land, and adopt 


, 469 


470 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC’ 


what they called the law of God—filling, or select 
to their views to fill the office of a judge of the su] 


"Mr. DAVIS, of Massac, said that he hoped the am: 2 
proposed by hie would pass. If it does not, he thought he c 
see a dark and impenetrable gloom overhanging the future des 
of this state. He thought if the general ticket system 
we would see in the future men elected to the supreme 
no other reason than that of party influence and poli 
When such would be the case, then would the sheet anc 
liberty be forever gone. He thought there was no pla 
fraught with danger to the liberties of the people, than t 
ticket system. Gentlemen have said that we should hay 
judges elected by the whole people, heretofore they | 
elected by the representatives of the people, and is there a 3} 
more universally condemned than the present judicial syste 
Illinois? Who are the judges of this court? They are 
with all the frailties and weaknesses of human nature—n 
more than mere human beings—and will be influenced and 
by considerations of gratitude and feeling towards the 
electing them; they would feel coerced into a support of the 
ciples of that party to which they owe their election. By cho 
the judges from these three grand divisions the conflicting i 
of the several parts of the state are represented on th 
bench of the state, and no one political sentiment or 
exclusively followed by that tribunal. If the judges 
elected by general ticket, the whole south would be sw 
by the vortex of the north, and he called upon them 
judges by districts, and thus secure a judge from the s 
deprecated the general ticket system, as it would lea 
conventions and caucuses, and the eliciting by them 
from their nominees to decide upon certain questions 
ticular way, for he concluded that the candidates of th 
ventions would inevitably be chosen. He had seen the 1 
of such systems. He had known the pledge made by, and 
from candidates for judgeships. He had known men [to] re 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 21, 1847 4qt 


intment of a judgeship upon a pledge to appoint a particular 
dividual clerk of his court. It was to break up and avoid all 
this, that he advocated the election by districts. He feared 
nothing from the growth of the abolition party, or that one from 
that party might be appointed a judge. On the subject of the 
je ea, he knew no party feeling—recognized no party lines. 
e knew no party when called upon to act upon a principle which 
‘was for the benefit or prejudice of the state. He knew no party 
when called upon to act upon the judiciary—upon the selection of 
. a to expound the law. He opposed the general ticket system 
because he feared a court made up on party grounds, and of men 
1 Seiosc judgments would be swayed by party considerations. 
. such came to be the character of our judiciary, republican 
7 institutions would crumble into dust, and freedom would shriek 
_ her last. 
__ Mr. GREGG said, that he could not see those great and alarm- 
- ing evils which had been predicted as involved in the general ticket 
im 3 tem. He did not think the supreme court as constituted for 
- the benefit or as the representative of the interest of any part of 
_ the state, but as the supreme judicial tribunal of the whole state, 
_ with jurisdiction over the whole territory and people of the state. 
_ Why then consign to onesection of the state the choice of a man to 
administer j justice in other parts of the state, and over people who 
_ had no voice in his election? Why not let the whole people, whose 
P - rights, liberties, and property, are placed under his jurisdiction, 
hhave a voice in his election? It is said that party interest and 
feeling will be introduced, and party excitement will enter into the 
choiceof the judges, if we elect them by general ticket. Will not 
the Same argument apply if elected by districts? Will not party 
feeling be as rife? Will not party rancor and contention exist, or 
: be felt in those districts upon the subject? Will they have con- 
ventions and caucuses, and all the modes of nominating party 
candidates, as well as if they were elected by general ticket? 
He could see no difference in that particular between the two sys- 
tems. He deprecated party spirit as much as any one in judicial 
matters; he agreed the ermine of justice should never be permitted 
‘to be polluted or touched by the baleful influence of party spirit, 
_ and sooner than see such take place, he would vote for the appoint- 


4 
es 
oe 


472 ‘ ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT. é 


ment of judges by the Governor and senate. It had ete 
that the district system would produce a conflict of opinion 
a diversity of sentiment and interest upon the bench—and 
can this be produced? In no way except by the. introduction | 
party spirit into the election of the judges in the districts, and 
the election in one district of a candidate from one party, a 
the other districts of men of different political sentiments. An 
does it thus avoid party spirit? Certainly not. We will t 
have a diversity of opinion on the bench upon some political qu 
tion, which has by this means been drawn before them for adju 
cation. His opinion was that the majority should rule in all 
and that the principle was as applicable to the election of th 
diciary as any other department of the government. 

Mr. PINCKNEY advocated an elective judiciary, to be cho: 
by the people in districts, who were to hold office for the term | 
ten years, and after that time the judges to be ineligible to a - 
election. He also desired the elective system to be submitte 
every ten years to the people for their approval, and to be chang 
if they so desired it. 

Mr. HARVEY was in favor of an election of the supren 
judges by the whole people, and opposed entirely to their electic 
by districts. He considered that the duties of a judge of 
court were something different from those performed by a senato 
The one expounded and administered the law to the whole peop! 
and the other represented a section of the people. He thought 
difference in their relation to the people required a difference ‘ 
the mode of electing them, and applied the same argument to t 
election of judges by districts, when the duties they would have 
perform were to govern and control the actions and interests 
the people at large. He considered the post of a judge not on 
a representative nature. He was to decide questions arising 
his court according to law, and not to suit the wishes and noti 1s 
of any particular section of the state, and hence the impropriety 
of electing him by a portion of the people. He would be sorry to 
see judges, elected from the north or south, deciding quest 
according to the feelings and sentiments of the portion of the st 
they came from. Much had been said about no party—that : 
party feeling upon this question, and in the election of judg 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 22, 1847 473 


_ should exist—that all demagogueism should be put down; but 

_ from what had appeared to him, those who denounced party, 
were the very ones who were most under the influence of party, and 

- showed most of its spirit. 

. Messrs. Pinckney and Davis of Massac explained their views 

_ upon party, and a rather personal colloquy took place between the 

latter gentleman and Mr. H. 

Mr. HARVEY said he cared little about political life or death; 
it was a matter of no importance to him. He would be sorry to 
see local feelings and sentiments represented on the supreme bench. 
He felt yesterday, when the gentleman. from Sangamon had 
_ sprung his mine, that a trap had been set for the friends of an 
_ elective judiciary, and he regretted much that many had not seen 
“it before it was too late. That gentleman, by his profound and 
skilful tactics, had succeeded in drawing into the snare a sufficient 
number to defeat the general ticket system, and would, he scarcely 
doubted, succeed in defeating an elective judiciary entirely. He 
did not think the plan pursued by that gentleman, although suc- 
cessful, was a fairone. And he had strong suspicions that beneath 


ae, ini ate wt a oe 


wet NS, 


ie 


_ the present proposed system there was hidden another mine, 
__ which would be sprung at the proper time,and when it [would] be too 
late for those friends of an elective judiciary, whom he had suc- 
- ceeded in drawing into his trap, to retrace their steps. He thought 
that if the district system was adopted, they would find that there 
was to be but one session of the supreme court in a year, and that 
& at Springfield, for the benefit of those lawyers who resided here. 
5 He was opposed to all monopolies, and particularly to a monopoly 
__ of the supreme court. 


Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery asked if the gentleman considered 
_ that he was a party to that scheme. 
_ Mr. HARVEY. No, sir; I believe you are too honest a man, 
but I think that, like others, you have been led into it without 
. seeing the object. Mr. H. then reviewed the argument that the 
people would not know the candidates or their abilities, and 
thought that the same argument would apply to the large divi- 
$ sions proposed. 
Mr. ALLEN said, that he was one of-those who had voted for 
_ striking out, andif he had fallen into the trap mentioned by the 


474 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC 


member from Knox, he certainly was not aware of it. 1 a 
ber says he saw the trap; but there he, perhaps, 
many things that others cannot. He is somewhat strang 
he happens to differ from other men upon any subject, 
diately declares all wrong and he alone right. This was Pp 


was opposed to the district system and to compelling the p 
select from districts; perhaps he thinks that in Knox cc 
there may be found three men competent to fill the post. - Hi 
think so, but the people may differ from him, and they d 
like to have these judges selected, as it might occur, from 
or any other county. Mr. A. came here with no nort 
southern feelings; he came here divested of such sectional | 
as far as it was possible. He was in favor of the election 
justices of that court from the three grand divisions of the s 
so as that the people of all parts of the state might have the 
- tion of one judge at least. He did not think the gentleman 
Knox should have said, that, because he entertained this opin 
because he was in favor of the district system, and had foll 
that course which alone could have allowed them to prese 
the Convention, they had fallen into a trap set for them; t 
had been deluded into an act the consequences of which th 
not know the importance. That this trap was sprung, and the 
wary caught, by a combination of factions. 

Mr. HARVEY said, he had used no such terms. 

Mr. ALLEN. I then misunderstood the ie s 
guage, though I did not his meaning. OY 

Mr. A. then alluded to the difficulties syaeesta Nae 
people in the districts would not know the candidate for th 
and told the house that if a line were laid any where, sou th of 
Springfield, that no man could be presented in the distri r 
south of that line, with whom the people were not sufficien 
quainted to decide upon his qualifications. If they wer ; 
acquainted with the candidate personally, they could, by i ing 
receive all necessary information upon the subject. And ho 
the Governor select his judges? When a vacancy occu 
candidate for the vacancy, or his friends, get up a petition, se 
forth his abilities &c., and it is sent post haste to the Gove 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 21, 1847 475 


hers. He would vote for the election by districts, and if he 
ON not get that he would vote for the election by general 


iva LOGAN (a thunder storm raging without at the time) 
_ teplied to the remarks of [the] gentleman from Knox, and dis- 


Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, he desired to speak, but 


being weak and the hour late, he moved the committee rise. 


Mr. SERVANT rose to defend the system of appointment by 
a the Governor and Senate, though he felt that his health required 
should avoid any excitement. Mr. S. spoke a few sentences 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess presented the following as an 
amendment to the proposed amendment of the gentleman from 
Massac: 
Strike out of that amendment, ‘“‘and the qualified electors of 
each division shall elect one of said supreme judges for the term of 
six years,” and insert in lieu thereof, ‘‘one of said judges shall 
reside in each of said districts, and all of the said judges shall be 
_ elected by the qualified voters throughout the state.” 

¥ - In presenting the above amendment Mr. C. said, that he 
_ fegretted most exceedingly that he and the gentleman from Massac 
differed so widely upon this subject, and it pained him much that 
he occupied a position in opposition to the election of the judges 
by the whole people. 

_ The great argument used on this question by the friends of the 
" district system, is that, by making selections from the three great 
"divisions of the state, we will get better men to fill the bench. 
_ Well, sir, if we must select men from districts to get the best judges, 
_ does not my proposition—to divide the state into three divisions 
and that one shall be chosen from each of those districts, in the 
same manner as they desire, obviate the whole difficulty and dan- 


er el AA oe an fie 


.they, for their district, present to the southern part of the 


476 ‘ILLINOI S HISTORICAL COLLEC: INS sat 
ger which [it] is said is attached to the general ticket catch 
it not establish an independent judiciary selected from t 
tricts, and does it not disarm them of their great argumen 


from the districts, and the whole people would have the priv 
of electing them. Would not the judges in such a case be sel 
with greater care, with a greater regard for their ability 
qualification for the office than if voted for separately by dist 
The party at the north would go into Convention (for he presun 
that party nominations would be followed in either case,) 
a man every way qualified, by experience and legal acquireme nts, 
for the office and ask its support; the south would do the s 
and so with the other district. Both parties in these district c 
ventions would select their best men, those whose reputation 
standing would ensure the confidence of the people, even beyot 
the limits of the district; there would be a sectional pri: 
present candidates who would be the least obnoxious to 
charge of incompetency, or want of the necessary ability | 
attainments, which might be brought by the opposing p 
We thus would secure men for that bench who were chosen 
a confidence possessed by the whole people in their competeno 
How different under the district ayepeny There a man ee ) 


the whole state have one to preside over their interests incomps te 
to the task, and whose principles they abhorred. When a ma 
of such a character received the nomination and under the gener: 
ticket system his name was presented to the convention of 
whole state, there would be a close, scrutinizing examinat 
made into his character, his capacity and his standing, an 
convention would take care that none but competent men, sut 
as would receive the support of the whole people, would be 
sented to the state. Gentlemen say that the people in one sec \ 
of the state will not know these candidates, will know nothir 
their abilities or their standing as professional men. Was this s 
How did the people know the man for whom they vote for Go 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 21, 1847 477 


_the conventions; there for the first time was his name heard by 
them, and they inquired, they examined, they read, and long 
before the election became familiar with his reputation and prin- 
ciples. So would it be in regard to a candidate for the supreme 
- court—his character and legal acquirements would be examined 
closely, his ability to perform the high office of a judge would be 
 inguired into, and the people would inform themselves upon the 
- ‘subject, before they elevated any one to the supreme bench and 
conferred upon him the great prerogative of passing upon their 
_ lives, liberty and property. This fact alone would be a sufficient 
- inducement to the different parties to bring forward their best 
" men, and vie with each other in presenting candidates most 
_ worthy of the confidence and support of the people. 
_ He would refer gentlemen to the great state of N. York, 
_ where a similar provision had been adopted, and to the result of 
an election then for judges of the supreme court. Both parties 
oe eae forward the ablest and wisest of their party. Were they 


ie present the ablest and most experienced men. From the argu- 
? i ‘ment of the gentleman from Sangamon, it would appear that he 


Pee pt blackguards and ragmuffins, and that such characters 
~~ _ always had the best chance in conventions. He differed from the 
_ gentleman: experience had shown them that, generally, the 
_ best men of the state were brought forward by the conventions. 
_ Bad men the result of party conventions! He would ask the 
_ gentleman, or any other, to point out to him any man that had 
__ been elevated to the bench in this state, by the democratic party, 
_ whose judicial acts were complained of, or whose career had been 
_ oppressive upon the people. Show him one. And he challenged 
_ them to deny that such men, whose acts had drawn from the 
i people complaints long and loud against wrongs and oppressions 


seals appointment from the democratic partyhatoe ae ir 
of. If he knew anything of the history of this state for | t 
last few years, he felt that he was right in his statement. T 
great objection, and cause of complaint on the part of the 
had been against the manner in which these judges hav 
made for the last few years. Heretofore the election of the: 
judges has been confided to the representatives of the peopl 
General Assembly; and when a vacancy has occurred, it has’ 
the custom for the party in power to say to the Lenina 
from that portion of the state in which it has taken place: “ 
gentlemen, is a vacancy—it is in your circuit—go, nom 
man, and report him to us, and we will elect him.” He was t 
selected by the few representatives from the circuit, and 
elected by the Legislature; but really by those few men of 
circuit, elected to the supreme court. The people saw this 
disapproved of it. They said: here is a man elected to the sup: 
court with power and jurisdiction all over the state, and over 
and he has been elected to that high office and prerogativ 
few men of a single party, who represent, in the Legislat 
small circuit down south, or up at the north, and we, who 
be affected in our lives, liberty and property by his decisio 
have nothing to say in the matter. They have seen this t 
done, and have said, we will suffer it no longer. So of th’: 
trict system. The people will not approve of it. They wi 
we desire that our voice may be heard in the choice of th 
supreme judges, to whose hands are entrusted, and under w wt 
jurisdiction are to be secured, our rights, liberties and possess 
This is the answer they will give to your district system 
three grand divisions. The gentleman from Massac says, t 
by this system we will have a conflict of opinion on th 
What kind of a conflict of opinion? Political, sectional, 
or does he mean that conflict of legal opinion—that confli 
will, from its operation, bring forward from their Nate thi 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 21, 1847 479 


on the questions before them? ‘Can he mean that he desires 
‘a conflict of opinion upon political questions on the bench? 
b Mr. DAVIS of Massac explained, that he thought that if the 
court were elected by the whole people, there would be danger 
tl t it might become biased in its action by party feeling and 
spirit; but if elected from the three divisions, there would be a 
nflict of the different opinions of those districts, and of their 
ersified interests. 
_ Mr. CAMPBELL. A conflict of the opinion of the different 
_ sections of the state, and of their interests, is then what the gentle- 
"man means. And to obtain this, the judges must be elected in 
three grand divisions—nothing else would accomplish the end. 
e would ask the gentleman if there was any difference to the 
representation of those interests upon the bench, if the judges 
_ were chosen by the grand divisions, and then elected by the whole 
yeople. He could see none except that the latter mode made the 
judges more independent. There was a great difference between 
_ judicial independence and judicial irresponsibility; much between 
' an independent judge, and an irresponsible one.—Take a judge 
_ at home, in his own district, or in his own circuit—the people 
- of which elected him; a great and important question arises, in 
which the whole interests of the state are concerned, and he makes 
Ra decision upon it—what does he do? He decides to suit the 
- feelings and interests of the people of his district, and thus secures 
his re-election, and that is all he cares for. He has no responsibil- 
_ ity beyond his district. How different if he were responsible to 
_ the whole people! Then his decision would have been one becom- 
a ‘ing a judge of the supreme court of the state, and not that of a 
_ judge of a district. What responsibility will a judge elected in 
_ the southern district of this state feel he owes to the people of the 
_ other two-thirds of the state? What cares he if they be satisfied 
_ with his decisions on the bench? They have no voice in his re- 
‘election, and all he has to do is to please the people of that district. 
Will not his responsibility cease when he crosses the line of his own 
vd istrict? 
a The want of room precludes our following the remarks of Mr. 
C further. He pursued the subject for some time in his usual 
_ style. He asked if those, who said the question of a judiciary was 


ih cla VPM mK 5 T: ted 


to touch it, considered that there would be no party conv 
and party nominations, and party voting, under the dis 
system, as well as under the general ticket system? He thou 
the only way to avoid it was to have one whig district, but 
had been refused by the gentleman from Sangamon. He allt 
to the many professions of the whigs, that they wanted no | 
of their party, &c., and to their cry of “no party” durin 
_canvass for members of this Convention, and to their 
success, by that means, in obtaining what they wantec 
defeat of the democratic party. He scorned such tricks, p 
ring the bold, manly course of a whig like Harry of the Wes 
who never cried “no party.” He saw no great privilege conferr 
upon the people by this district system. A man came to f# 
court and his case was tried by judges, a majority of whom | 
had no choice in electing, and so far as the privilege of beit 
tried by judges of his own choice, we might as well be tried 
a court in Missouri. The people had less to say in the c 
of their judges than when they were elected by their represen 
in the Legislature. In replying to the remarks of Mr. L 
made during the storm, and to which that gentleman had allu 
he remarked that it was true that there was a storm; that wi 
the lightning did play, the thunder did roar, and the rain did 
but it was in this hall that the wind blew. He replied to # 
argument that the party would always vote for and elect 
nominees of the convention, by asking if they would not do t 
same thing in the grand divisions. He thought that if the j 
were elected by the whole people, that there would be an emulation 
among them to deserve the good will and approval of the who 
people, and a re-election based on their meritorious set 
He said that he would put a question to be submitted to the peop. D. 
here is one plan which divides the state, for the purpose of electi 
a supreme court, into three grand divisions; you elect one of th 
—with the other two you shall have nothing to do, nor in 
election a voice—they are given to your neighbors to elect. T 
other plan is: here are three judges taken from different par: 
the state, but you, and your neighbors, and all the people of the 
state, shall have the power of electing them. And he asked if any 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 27, 2847 481 


‘member would say that the people would reply that it is better 
_ for us not to have any thing to do with the electing of two of these 
_ judges, and our neighbors may elect them for us? He repelled 
the charges made by members against the bar; and replied to the 


member from Ogle, that he was perhaps in as great danger of losing, 


in his absence from home, some of the choicest lambs of his flock, 
_ as were the lawyers of losing their clients. He called upon his 
friends to vote for the proposition he had presented. He alluded 
to the appeal made by Mr. Locan on yesterday, by which he had 
succeeded in striking out the general ticket system. He had called 
‘upon the advocates of the district system to come to his aid, 
while his own friends stood waiting for him, like Roderick Dhu, 
to blow his shrill whistle, to spring into arms, and then at the 
wave of his hand, to disappear. He asked gentlemen would they 
follow that gentleman, who was calculating upon our going back 
to the old system, in case we failed in the general ticket, and then 
by uniting his votes with ours, defeat the elective judiciary entire- 
ly. Were they prepared to be thus led? 

Mr. KNOWLTON was opposed to an elective judiciary; but 
if we were to have it, he would vote for the district system in 
preference to any other. 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac returned his thanks to the gentleman 
from Jo Daviess for his expressions of kindness, and assured him 
that the difference of opinion was as painful to him as to that 
gentleman. The gentleman from Jo Daviess had said, that he 
(Mr. C.) [D.?] had called upon the whig party to come to the rescue. 
_ He had not called upon the whig party, nor any party, to come to 
the rescue. He had said, that upon this question there was to be 
_ no party, that there ought to be none; and if, for concluding that 
the judiciary of the state should be separated from party spirit, 
feeling and influence, he was to be anathamatized [sic] and sepa- 
rated from his party, he would say be itso. As Pitt and Fox said to 
each other, if he was to be separated for this cause, “‘we separate, 
and we separate forever.”—He had made no such appeal, but he 
had called upon all to abandon party lines on this question; and if 
there was to be anathema and separation, he was ready to be 
separated, on this question at least. He thought he¥saw in the 
general ticket system a dark and impending gloom hanging over 


Py Wa HES oa Ee cet MAC ea I Vin Al 


possible for the mind of man to fathom. He thous 
proposed by the member from Jo Daviess one most a 
to deceive and draw to its support those who did 1 ‘not 
examine it. It retained one feature which he stood there 
and before God determined to resist. That feature was 
tion by general ticket. We are told that the districts ma 
in convention and nominate a man, and that when the s 
vention met, they would ratify it. But we know the 
such conventions. He referred the gentleman to a ¢ 
which met a few years ago in a city in this Union, for t] 
of nominating no less a candidate than for the chief 
office if the country. A large majority of the delegate: 
convention, before they left their homes, were instruct 
states to vote for a particular individual, but when they 
they disobeyed their instructions, and nominated ano 
He opposed the general ticket system because of its dange 
had always been opposed to the election of the supre 
but had yielded to what had been the expressed opin 
people, and to theirdemand. Mr. D. continued for so: 
stating his principles, and in repelling the charge of c 
combination, for the purpose of carrying his plan. 

The question was then taken on substituting Mr, 
amendment for Mr. SeRvant’s, in the motion to insert, 
same was decided in the i Aicniuthye eas 78, nays vi : 

The question was then taken on the proposed < 
of Mr. Campsett and decided in the negative-—yeas 4 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved to strike out | 
(the term of office) and insert “nine.” 12 and 15 ye 
also proposed; and the question being taken, the 
refused to strike out. keh 

Mr. PETERS presented the following as a substitu 

“The Governor shall nominate, and by and wit 
and consent of the senate, (two-thirds of the senat 
concurring therein) shall appoint the judges of the supt 
who shall hold their office for the term of nine years, < 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 212, 1847 483 


le to any other office than a judicial one for the time for 


1 favor of the amendment now offered, inasmuch as he had given 
hi views at length when the proposition of his friend from Ran- 
dolph (Mr. Servant) was under consideration. The Convention 
m had then listened to him for a long time, for which he felt under 
the greatest obligation. He had now only to say that he earnestly 
desired every member to look at the pictures which the friends of 

| the elective principle had been drawing on yesterday and to-day. 
$ _ The friends of that system had divided into two parties; one 
_ party was in favor of electing the judges by general ticket, by 

_ the electors throughout the state; the other party was for divid- 
ing the state into three grand divisions or districts, and each dis- 
“trict to elect one judge of the supreme court. The friends of the 
general ticket system declare to us, and they have repeated it 
"again and again, that the district system is fraught with the most 
“enormous evils—that each judge will represent a locality and not 

’ the people of the whole state, though he is to be judge of the state; 

that there will be no feeling of responsibility resting upon him; 
that they will be elected in reference to local questions; that they 
_will be subject to corrupt influences. Various other evils are im- 
puted to this mode of election, all going to show that it will degrade 
and prostrate the judiciary. Those in favor of the district 
system tell us that the other plan will produce only “evil and 
evil continually;”’ that the election of the judges will at once 
be subjected to the control and machinery of political par- 

- ties; that nominations will be made by political caucuses; 
that the people will have but little to do in fact with the 
election, but all will be subjected to party drill; that we shall 
have party judges; inefficient and unqualified men will fill those 

_ Stations, and all sorts of enormities and iniquities will be intro- 
duced into the judiciary. Whether, owing to the different 
degree of talent of the speakers or not, he did not know, but 
so it was that the advocates of the district system had made 
the general ticket system appear much worse, more hideous, if 
possible, than the general ticket men had made the district system 
appear. Taking the pictures drawn by the advocates of the - 


Ce Soy Ye Rigen oy Mame =k 


TIAA le a Fecha VES NG RTH EA 


‘to him to terrify us, and induce us to resort to the good 


Cn 


484 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE 
two systems or modes of election proposed, and i 


ciple of appointment. But he should not argue the poi 
He felt as if the arguments used by him when dis 
subject the other day, were greatly strengthened b 
coloring these gentlemen had given to their respective 
He would, therefore, end as he [had] begun, by asking g 
look at the pictures which the friends of the elective pri 
drawn; to look at them in all the deformity which 
friends had given them, (and no one would doubt the 
the picture,) and then let gentlemen vote as their judgmen 
consciences would dictate. He was s willing to leave the ee 
here. ° 

And the question being taken on the substitute, i it was re 
—yeas 40, nays not counted. ‘3 

Mr KENNER moved to amend by inserting —“ 
elected by both branches of the Legislature, on joint b 
the first Monday of March;” and the same Was alesse 


era citie good behavior.” Rejected. : 
Mr. WEAD moved to add to the section, “ ‘the L 
may change or alter said divisions to meet the on es 
people.” 
Messrs. WeAD and CaLpDwWELt advocated the amendmen 
Messrs. Locan and Epwarps of Sangamon opposed it. - 
Without taking the question, the committee rose, 
motion, the Convention adjourned till tomorrow at 8 A. M. 


‘ ‘ XXXVI. THURSDAY, JULY 22, 1847 


Mr. CROSS, of Winnebago, presented a petition praying that 
no distinction be made in the constitution on account of color. 
Referred to the committee on Bill of Rights. 

Mr. STADDEN presented a petition, praying the appoint- 
ment of a superintendent of schools. Referred to the com- 
mittee on Education. 

Mr. GEDDES asked a suspension of the rules, to enable 
him to offer a resolution, that we proceed forthwith to the election 
of a chaplain, and the Convention refused to suspend the rules. 


[Mr. GEDDES said,*! he had been exceedingly pained by the 
course which this convention had taken in relation to the clergy- 
men of Springfield. The conduct of the convention, he said, had 
been disgraceful in the extreme. They had first invited clergy- 
men into the hall to invoke the blessings of heaven upon the 
deliberations of this body, to ask for that wisdom which alone 
could guide their deliberations to beneficial and happy results; 
and now by their action they had declared to those clergymen, 
“‘we can do without your services; we had rather dispense with 
them than to defend and protect you from insult and injury.’’ 
Is this, continued, Mr. Geppes, the proper conduct of this con- 
vention? Are we become so graceless that a minister of the gospel 
is not safe among us? When the convention for framing the 
constitution of the United States was in session, it is well known, 
that after much time had been spent to no purpose, and it had 
become apparent to all that they would not be able to effect any- 
thing;—in this hour of darkness and doubt and almost of despair, 
the sage, Franklin rose and offered a resolution for the appoint- 
ment of a chaplain, to invoke the blessing of Heaven upon their 


Jat 2 as debate on Geddes’ resolution is taken from the Sangamo Journal, 
uly 29, 


485 


486 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIC ci) 


deliberations. The resolution was adopted, and w 
result? Concentration of strength, unanimity of a 
mutual concession of opinion, which eventuated in the 


was formed. Then, sir, glad angels on shining pinio 
their way up through the boundless fields of ether to the 
Heaven, and there proclaimed the joyful news that ma 
new world had asked a boon of Heaven,—had asked the 
and direction which Heaven alone can give,—and Heavy 
arches rung with sounds of joy, and Heaven’s guidance w. 
safed to their deliberations. Thus has it been from t 
with all deliberative bodies who have acted in a simi 
But this convention is deserting the good old path; ist 
from the counsels of the wise and prudent, and like one oj 
we have read in scripture history, is carried away with v: 
ceits, and will finally, I apprehend, meet with a similar d 
But what heinous crime has been committed by the 
gentleman? Has he insulted officers, abused our 
spoken disrespectfully of our doings? Nothing of the ki 
he has dared to do his duty, even when that duty compell 
speak of the faults and follies of the men whom Illinois delig 
to honor. This is the awful offence which he has m 
He spoke of the demoralizing effects of war, and statec 
said, that the returned volunteers were not free from i 
inating influence. He was solicitous that the wreath of 3 
glory which crowned their brows should not be sullied by 
conduct; that the bright laurels so dearly earned shor 
torn from their brows by their own intemperate hands; 
the monument, bright as gold, and more durable than m 
which they had reared for themselves, should not be 
and trampled in the dust by their own rash feet haste: 
evil. And for this he was to be rebuked by this 
He could see no impropriety on the part of the clergym 
ring to these things, but he thought that the conduct o 
here admitted of no excuse. 
Mr. Green of Tazewell, opposed the suspension 0 
on the ground that we had by resolution invited ~ 
to attend here—and that we had subsequently desired t 


THURSDAY, JULY 22, 1847 487 


end, because we could not protect them from insult; and it 
yould be inconsistent now, and unjust to them, to go into the 
lection of a chaplain. 

_ Mr. Wivutams said, he hoped the resolution would be with- 
rawn, for another reason in addition to the one stated by the 
entleman from Tazewell. He had at the commencement of the 


ured, and they had rescinded that resolution, on the ostensible 
ground that it was wrong to invite them here to be subjected to 
_ gross insult. 
The election of another chaplain would appear invidious. It 
_ would look as if the real object of rescinding the resolution, was 
_ to get rid of our chaplains and to procure others. He was, for 
_ this reason alone, in hopes the resolution would be withdrawn. 
If neither the sense of decorum and propriety of the individual 
members of the Convention, nor its rules, could secure our former 
chaplains from the rude and indecent insult offered by one of its 
members, what guaranty could we offer to a new chaplain that he 
would not be subject to similar insults? Until the Convention 
_ asserted the power of compelling its members to behave them- 
selves with propriety and decency, he was opposed to the appoint- 
ment of a chaplain.] - 
Mr WEST asked a suspension of the rules, to enable him to 
offer a resolution in relation to the apportionment of counties, and 
_ the Convention refused to suspend. 
Mr. Z. CASEY moved to suspend the rules, that he might 
offer the following resolution, and the rules were suspended: 
Resolved, That fifteen hundred copies of the journal of the 
Convention be printed for distribution among the counties. 
Messrs. THomas and Davis of Montgomery opposed the 
printing of more than a single copy.—Messrs. Casry, Hares, 
Arcuer, Locxwoop, CampseE Lt of Jo Daviess, CHuRCH, SHERMAN 
and others advocated the adoption of the printing, and after 
debate, the resolution was adopted. 
Mr. THOMAS moved to suspend the rules, to enable him to 
offer a resolution, that a committee be appointed to divide the 
state into three grand judicial divisions. 


488 


Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess thought the gentle 
Morgan rather hasty with his resolution. The Conv 
not decided yet, whether there would be any “three g 


Messrs. Lockwoop and MarsHatt of Mason, 
amendments, which were adopted; and Messrs. 


ments, which were peed. After which, me section : asa 
read as follows: 

“The state shall be divided into thine! grand. div 
nearly equal as may be, and the qualified electors of each. 
shall elect one of said supreme judges, for the term of 
The Legislature may, from time to time, alter said | 
previous to any general election for judges of the supre 
so that each of said divisions may contain, as nearly as m 
an equal number of inhabitants; and also, each divisic 
contain territory, as nearly as [may] be, in a compact for 
vided, that such changes or alterations shall not be ma 
other time, than is provided for the apportionment of 1 m 
the General Assembly.” 

And the question being taken thereon, it was adopted 
80, nays not counted. re 

Sec. 5. The Secretary of State shall, in the presenct 
same person or persons, draw the names of the said 
lot; the justice, whose name is ee drawn, shall be c 


office four years; the other, two eee and each until hiss 
is commissioned and qualified. Thereafter, an election sh 
held every two years, on the first Monday of March, for on 
of the supreme court, who shall hold his office six years 
his successor is qualified. After the term of the first ck 
expires, the justice oldest in commission, shall be chie: 


THURSDAY, JULY 22, 1847 489 


Mr. WEAD moved to strike out the section, and insert the 
following; which was carried: 

Sec. 4. [5?] The office of one of said judges shall be vacated in 
two years, of one in four years, and of one in six years; to be 
decided by lot, so that one of said judges shall be elected once in 
every two years. The judge having six years to serve shall be the 
first chief justice, after which, the judge having the oldest com- 
mission, shall be chief justice. 

Sec. 6. One term of the supreme court shall be held annually 
in each judicial circuit, at such time and place as may be provided 
by law. 

Mr. WEAD moved to strike out the section, and insert—“ the 
supreme court shall sit at least once in each year, in each of the 
three grand divisions in this state, and in such other places as 
may be prescribed by law.” 

Mr. WEAD advocated the amendment, which while it made 
it imperative for the court to sit at three different parts of the 
state during the year, also, left it in the power of the Legislature 
to increase the number of those sittings, as the convenience and 
interest of the people required. 

Mr. KNOX would like to know from the gentleman, if his 
amendment did accomplish his end, or if it did not do too much. 
What “other places” did he intend the court should sit in, that 
were not comprised in the three divisions? Did he mean to send 
the supreme court to Iowa or Oregon? 

Mr. HENDERSON advocated the section as it stood, and 
was in favor of twelve circuits and the supreme court to visit each, 
during the year. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery would be in favor of the larger 
number of circuits if the salary allowed the judges had been suffi- 
cient to support and remunerate them for the expenses of travel- 
ling and of board while from home. 

Mr. HARVEY advocated the larger number of circuits, and 
the supreme court to visit each, during the year. 

Mr. KINNEY of Bureau was opposed to the larger number of 
circuits, and in favor of the amendment. 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac hoped the amendment would pass. 

Mr. WEAD modified his amendment to avoid the difficulty 


490 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT! 


suggested by Mr. Kee and replied at lenges t t 
gentlemen who had opposed its adoption. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess opposed tee ‘ae 
districts as not sufficient for the convenience of the | t 
people, whose interests they represented. He was in 
least five districts and five judges. He admitted — 
allowed them was not sufficient to allow them to eave 
whole state. He thought the Convention ought to fix 
constitution the number of judges and the number of d 
and were it not for the palpable injustice of the act—to 
men who received only such a salary as we had allowe 
travel the whole state, he would be in favor of the Sap ( 
sitting in each district in the state. oh 

Mr. HAYES advocated the smaller number Hed dis 
replied to the other gentlemen. 


to the supreme court travelling over the whole state. H ' 
once a year in each of the three divisions quite sufficient. — 

And, without taking the vote, the committee rose, : 
on motion, the Convention adjourned till 3 P. . 


AFTERNOON 


ue Convention resolved itself into committee of the v 
Mr. LOGAN addressed the Convention in an ar 
support of one central supreme court, to meet at the capi 
state, and presented its advantages and benefits at le: 
conclusion, he said that he would vote as for a oe 
three sittings—once in each division. y 
Mr. ATHERTON (during the speech of Mr. L) 7 
manded the enforcement of the half hour rule. ah 
The rules were suspended and Mr. L. proceeded. 
Mr. ATHERTON explained his reason for his demand 
that Mr. L. had occupied three times as much of the time 
already cost the state $10,000. Miateovee, he had comple 
Mr. L. a few days before, of the great loss of time by long s 
and that gentleman told him in reply, “why don’t you e 


4 Cre Ose et Oe ee ee oe oe) oe ee ee BL i pene | ete. 
sf Haag ali dy Rides: oes tie ‘wy any os ah aa 


THURSDAY, JULY 22, 1847 491 


“tule and cut them off.”” He therefore had followed the advice in 

the present case. 
’ Mr. DEMENT addressed the committee for Agede two hours 

_ in opposition to the amendment. He thought that the debate had 
wandered from the question, and would endeavor to give it a new 
turn. He did not think it a question in which lawyers alone were 
concerned, but one of vast importance to the people, at least one 
___in which the people he represented felt a great interest in. From 
the debate between the several members of the bar it had been 
hinted that the less the number of circuits for the supreme court, 
the more advantageous it would be for the older and more expe- 
rienced members of the bar, because those from a distance could 
not attend, for so small a fee, to the case of their client at Springfield, 
as could a lawyer who resided here, and consequently the people 
had to intrust all their appeal cases to those who practice in that 
court. This was unjust to the younger lawyers, and unjust to 
the people. The people desired to have the courts, wherein the 
cases in which their rights and interests were involved, brought as 
near them as possible, and that they could attend it and give their 
personal aid and attention in assisting their counsel. This 
could only be done by having a large number of districts, and 
the supreme court to visit them all in each year. Many gen- 
tlemen seemed disposed to favor the amendment because of the 
low salary allowed to the judges. He admitted that $1,200 was 
not sufficient for them, when we compelled them to traverse 
the state, but thought it was no argument against our devising 
the best plan for the convenience and interests of the people, 
and the system which would be most satisfactory to them. If 
we adopted the plan which would enable the people in all parts 
of the state to have the facility of justice, by bringing this supreme 
court near their door, he appealed to the whole committee whether 
any man should hesitate a moment in raising the salary of each 
of the three judges to $1,500—increasing the annual expense but 
$900. Must we deny the people the great benefits of the system 
of a large number of districts, because of the miserable sum of 
$900 additional tax? He thought not; nor did the people expect 
such economy. On this subject the people felt a great interest, 
and he warned gentlemen that it behooved them to engraft some- 


492 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO: 


thing into the constitution that would be satisfactory enou 
the people to induce them to overlook other provisions not 
acceptable, and which, unless such popular systems as thi 
adopted, would probably defeat the constitution. The argu: 
that appeal cases would increase if the number of distri 

enlarged, was, in his opinion, rather in favor of the plan th 
against it. If cases were worthy of an appeal, justice requir 
that the means of prosecuting that appeal should be plac 
near the reach of the party desiring it as possible. The r 
from Sangamon had said, that lawyers who practised in 
supreme court do not charge more than those in the circuit. 

might be easily accounted for. That member resides here. 
he can afford to attend a case before the court here for muc 
than can a man who has to come two hundred miles, to leave | 
home and business, and remain here probably six weeks, wai 
for the case to come on. The consequence of this was, that 
clients in the country were unable to pay the attorney the : 
required for such a duty, and often abandoned the appeal, s 
than bear the expense or entrust a lawyer with it, to whom he 
a stranger. He was in favor of throwing open to the who 
fession a competition for the fees of attending to cases in 1 
preme court, and that there should be no monopoly. Heo 
to the amendment, because there would be certain lo 
selected in each of the divisions, at which it would be as ine 
ient for the people and their lawyers to attend as if the co 
held here alone. In the northern district, Chicago wou 
selected, as perhaps it ought to be; and he would ask, wo 


attend there, than it would to come to Springfield? 
where would be the place in the southern district at which : 
would sit? Would you have it on the Mississippi? What wo 
the people of the Wabash counties think of its conve: 
Would you put it at Shawneetown; would not the peor 
Alton prefer Springfield as the place, sooner than go there. 
only way to meet the difficulty was to hold a session of the 
in each circuit, and let that number of circuits be large. ; 
them be held at Chicago, Peoria, Galena, Quincy, Springfiel 
Alton, Shawneetown, Danville, and such other places as w 


THURSDAY, JULY 22, 1847 493 


_ meet the convenience of the people. They would be satisfied 


with this, and it was our duty to have the constitution as satis- 
factory as possible. The member from Gallatin had said, the 
court, if the state was cut up into small districts, would often have 
but a single case to try in a circuit, which would be a contemptible 
business for the supreme court. He could not see how it would be 
derogatory to a court, elected by the people, and paid by the 
people, to go any where the convenience of the people required 
them to go, for the purpose of trying even one case. The court 
would be physically competent to the task, and if we paid them 
sufficient we could obtain men to do it. He did not think that 
we could get the best lawyers at any salary, nor did he believe that, 
if we said the court shall meet but once a year, and that here for 
six weeks, we could get the pick of the bar. But we still might get 
good judges, and men mentally competent to the duty. 

The gentleman from Sangamon said that you could not elevate 
the court above the character and standing of the bar that prac- 
tised before it, and the conclusion he (Mr. D.) drew from this, 
and from that gentleman’s opposition to the large number of 
districts, was that he considered it would be lessening the dignity 
of the bar to be brought down to the level of the lawyers in the 
counties, and that then the court would be brought down in its 
dignity to the same level with the bar. What other conclusion 
could one come to from the remark, except that the supreme court 
lawyers would be degraded by associating with a class of lawyers 
who had never practised in such a high court, and consequently the 
court being brought to the level of the bar would become less 
dignified. He did not think this would be the case but that both 
lawyers and court would be elevated by the association. He 
associated the gentleman from Gallatin (Mr. CaLtpweE Lt) so far 
as his remark that the court would become contemptible, if it 
descended to sit and try one case, with the member from Sanga- 
mon, and he sincerely hoped that they were not associated any 
further. 

Mr. D. then entered at large upon the subject of the election 
of the supreme judges by the whole people, as compared with the 
election by districts. He thought the only argument in favor of 
the district system was a want of confidence in the people, a 


494 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO 


doctrine to which he never subscribed, and would ney 
Should this district system be finally adopted and they wen 
to the people, what answer could they make, when the peopl 
—you allowed me by this constitution you have adopted, 1 keh 
and privilege of voting for the judge of the circuit court, 
you withhold from me the right to vote for the two supreme 
who decide my case? The only answer the friends of this 
could give, would be “I could not give you that right, 
not trust you with such a power.” This was a variation 
part of some gentlemen from their long known and well 
lished opinion of full confidence in the people on all si 
He examined at length the subject of the election by dis 
its probable political bearing and results, and concluded by ! 
ing that he would vote for the three judicial districts in 
could get no better. 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac said, that the committee would 
the justice to say that he never detained them for any 
time in expressing his views, and that he addressed them 
dom, and he now assured the committee that nothing but 
regarded [as] a systematic attack upon him, and that atta 
from a quarter where he little looked for it, would indu 
address the committee again on this question. He therefore 
the attention of the committee for a few moments while he w 
repel the systematic attack that had just been made upor 
and upon those of his friends who had acted with him 
question, tor some cause or another which did not appear. Y 
day he had done what he considered his duty. He had op 
plan which he thought full of danger and ruin, and for 
drawn down upon his head the anathema of these gentle 
insinuate that my course would indicate that there was 
thing rotten in the state of Denmark,” which their pe: 
faculties will not allow them to penetrate. Sir, there is 
and important question before the committee, of the 
interest to the liberties and rights of the people of the state, : 
affect them for all time to come, and upon it I did not 
to be denounced for taking a position I thought best cale 
advance the people’s interests, nor to be abandoned 
exclusive advocates of the rights of the people. He had 


THURSDAY, JULY 22, 1847 495 


esterday that upon this subject his own opinions were opposed to 
an elective judiciary, but that he had given up his own opinions 
to that of the people, and to their demand, and in doing so had 
followed the example of the apostle of democracy, Thomas Jeffer- 
he. son, who has said that in all doubtful questions give way to the 
Se “majority. And yet, sir, they say that he (Mr. D.) had aban- 
_ doned democracy and the people. He would say to them that, 
__upon this great question, one which was to secure a free, independ- 
ent judiciary, so vitally important to the people, they had 
abandoned the true interests of the people, and were found fighting 
in the ranks of the enemy. He would say to those who charged 
him with deserting democracy, to go back into history and search 
there, let them read more, study more, and try to understand what 
they do read, and then they will be better able to come here and 
tell us what is democracy. He would ask them to go back to the 
'« days of Washington. No such doctrine as the election of judges 
was taught then, go to the days of Jefferson—the first man who 
_ lisped the name of democracy in our country—and he asked them, 
was this election of judges by general ticket taught then? No, 
sir, no. It was the doctrine taught by men anxiously looking for 
the spoils. Let them read more and then tell us if spoils be democ- 
racy! He was opposed to the general ticket system because it 
afforded such inducements to men. If it be democracy to look 
out for the spoils of office, then he was no spoilsman, and belonged 

_ not to such a democracy. He would not have alluded to this 
subject had it not been for what was so evidently a systematic 
attack upon him for some unknown cause. He did not think that 
so humble a man as himself could have been the sole object of 
this studied attack, but there must be some causes which did not 
appear, and unless he was much mistaken, it authorized him in 
saying that there was “something rotten in the state of Denmark.” 
He battled for principle and upon these other matters he cared not 

to break a lance with the gentleman from Lee, although there were 
some in the other party, who might not be so well able to defend 
themselves from the charge of a change in political principles. He 
had opposed the general ticket system because he saw in its results 

a judiciary swayed by political influences and corrupt motives, 
which he thought would be prejudicial to the interests and rights 


tan 


496 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIOI 


of the people, and when the gentleman from Lee said 
opposed the district system he it was that attacked the 
liberties of the people in the most vital point—a pure ji 

Mr. DEMENT explained. 

Mr. DAVIS said, well, sir, the gentleman voted 
motion to strike out the general ticket system, he voted 
tem that did affect injuriously the people. oa 

Mr. DEMENT said, that he did vote against s 
the general ticket system, and would vote for the 
of the judges by the Governor and Senate in 
to the district system. While up he would ask the n 
Massac, if he alluded to him when he spoke of pe 
changed their principles? R: 

Mr. DAVIS. No, sir, no; but there are those in the Com 
tion who may, peradventure, have an opportunity of mal cin 
explanation upon that subject before the adjournment. 

Mr. DEMENT would ask the gentleman another 
Did he allude to him as one of those who had made a 
attack upon him? If he did he was mistaken. 

Mr. DAVIS said, that he was not a man to back out of w 
had said, or to avoid its consequences, he would inform th eg ge 
man that he did allude tohim: But his disclaimer was suffi 

Mr. DEMENT said, the gentleman was mistaken, t 
been friends and had always acted together and he woul 
last man that would attack that member, or throw a fii 
into the Convention. 

Mr. DAVIS said, that he was glad to hear the gentlem: 
that he had no desire to throw fire-brands into this Convent 
but it is strange, sir, what events will occur inashort time. Be 
this Convention met he understood that the opinion of 
majority of the people of this state was in favor of a tota 
tion of banks; but when we come here we find out that 
have an opinion on this subject, and that there are 
think that the people have a right to be heard on the su 
then sometimes we hear certain gentlemen declare 
Thompson has the right to control them. There was 
thing said which was almost beneath notice. He had I 
the stump, by wild political demagogues, but it was 


THURSDAY, JULY 22, 1847 497 


not to be expected from a gentleman, or in a constitutional con- 
' yention—it was the miserable cant about lawyers. He would tell 
them to go to English history if they knew nothing of, or did not 
place confidence in American history, and read what was written 
there about the men who first nursed this republic into existence. 
Let them go to John Adams, to Jefferson, and see what they— 
lawyers—did for the country, and even what English history says 
of their eftorts for the country. Let them read of Madison, of 
Monroe, of John Quincy Adams and of General Jackson, who, 
though endeared to the people by his achievements as a military 
chieftain, was a lawyer, let them see what these men, all lawyers, 
did for their country; let them, before they make attacks upon 
_that profession, first read a little history. 

He would say a few words upon the question now before them. 
What was proposed by the system of twelve circuits for the su- 
preme court to travel. The judges were to be taken away from 
their homes to travel this whole state, the year round; no time 
allowed them for reading, for study, for examination, or for prep- 
aration for one of the highest and most important duties that 
can be conferred upon man—the passing upon the lives and liber- 
ties and property of his fellow man. It was acknowledged that 
the pay we had allowed them was insufficient, but pay was no 
argument with him. All history told them that aman todischarge 
that duty well, must have time for preparation. All experience 
had shown that no man, even with a genius as bright and effulgent 
as the noon-day sun, could perform the duties of that station, 
which requires years of constant reading and study to become 
qualified, without time for preparation for its offices. It is the 
supreme court of our state; it should be a dignified, enlightened, 
upright, and an honest supreme court, or the judiciary sinks into 
insignificance. He was not in favor of spreading the supreme cir- 
cuits all over the state and into every county, to enable small 
petti-fogging lawyers to bring cases into the supreme court, not 
knowing or caring whether the law was with them or not; but 
merely for the purpose of having a case in that court. 

Mr. D. gave way, without concluding, for a motion that the 
committee rise; which was carried. And then, on motion, the 

_ Convention adjourned. 


Fy BANE. MORE MRS ARICTIM RSs. Pe RUT ee RR 


XXXVIL. FRIDAY, JULY 23, 184" 


county for the appointment of a state superinte 

mon schools. Referred to the Education committee. Bay 
Mr. SERVANT, from the committee to which was 1 

the petition of citizens of Kaskaskia, in reference to their ' 


power to lease or sell the same by a vote of the inh 
ested. Laid on the table and two hundred copies 
printed. 

The Convention went into committee of the ° 
amendments to the sixth section of the report of 
committee, pending at the adjournment yesterday. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean addressed the Convention 
holding the supreme court at the seat of government. 

Mr. HARVEY replied, and advocated the holdi 
supreme court in every judicial circuit. ? 

Mr. WILLIAMS replied to Mr. Harvey, and ad 
central supreme court. A 

Mr. KNOX followed and advocated the bile. 
sixth section of the report. 

A vote was then taken on striking out. Lost 
61. Rs 
Mr. ECCLES moved to amend the section so as t 
that if the people desire it, the courts may be chan 
circuits to the seat of government or to one point 
_of the grand divisions. Change to be made not o 
once in six years. 

Mr. HARVEY moved a substitute; which was n 
Question recurred on Mr. Eccies’ amendment. i 
Mr. CALDWELL offered a substitute, so as to pr 

one term of the supreme court should be held at such » 
places as may be provided by law. 


498 


FRIDAY, JULY 23, 1847 499 


_ Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess made a speech in opposition 
to imposing restrictions upon the Legislature in reference to the 
matters under consideration. 

_ Mr. GREGG spoke against the re(st]rictions which the 
_ amendments were calculated to impose on the Legislature. He 
was willing to leave a little discretion to the Legislature to change 
‘the system to suit such a change of times and circumstances as 
might take place. He had confidence in the people and believed 
that they understood and would promote their own interest. 

The vote being taken the substitute was not agreed to. 

An amendment to Mr. E’s amendment was moved and lost. 

Mr. SHUMWAY moved to strike out “‘the seat of govern- 
ment.” Lost. 

Mr. KINNEY of St. Clair moved a substitute so as to prevent 
the Legislature from authorizing the court to be holden in less 
than five different places in the state. Lost. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess offered as a substitute, “‘so 
as to provide that the Legislature should change the places of 
holding the courts as the interests of the people might require.” 
Lost. 

Various amendments were then offered and voted down. 

The question recurring on Mr. Eccies’ amendment it was 
agreed to—yeas 72, nays 51. 

Section 7 was then taken up. 

Sec. 7. There shall be twelve judicial circuits, which may be 
increased from time to time as the Legislature may provide. 

Mr. SHUMWAY moved to strike out “twelve,” and insert 
“nine.” 

Mr. CALDWELL moved to strike out “section seven” and 
insert the following: 

Sec. 7. The state shall be divided into twenty judicial Gree) 
in each of which one circuit judge shall be elected by the qualified 
electors thereof, who shall hold his office for the term of four years, 
and until his successor shall be commissioned and qualified.” 

A discussion arose upon this proposition; pending which the 
committee rose, reported back the report with amendments, and 
asked the concurrence of the Convention. 


TE Oe aie hen 


500 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE C 


opposed to its being held in circuits; at all events, he 
number of places at which it should be held ought not to 
three. The experience of other States in regard to th 
was strictly conclusive to his mind against the practicabi 
multiplying the number of places where that Court s 
held. He referred to the States of Missouri and Tenness 
the experiment had been tried, and where it was ascerta 
correct decisions could not be obtained in that way. The 
ments of gentlemen who had adverted to the practice in 
achusetts, as an example to be followed in this State, were 0 
force, inasmuch as the condition of things there was 
different. There they had good libraries in all parts of the 
and every requisite facility for holding the court at di 
places, which was not the case in this state, but he en 
approved of the system as pursued in Massachusetts; 
sidered it highly objectionable under any circumstance 
decisions of the supreme court were the law of the land, ar 
care should be taken to make them as perfect as possib 
having the best judges that could be obtained, toge 
every aid to be derived from books and arguments of able 
and this could never be accomplished if the supreme | 
made a travelling court and required to give its decision 
various districts of the state. The increase of litigati Qn 
such a system would also tend to embarrass the counts 
render their decisions hasty and imperfect. Gentlerr 
impute to him motives of personal interest in this matter, 
could with truth assert that personal considerations had n 
with him whatever. He preferred the practice in the cit 
and could not be induced to relinquish it in favor of t 
court. * 
Another consideration, which was énited to tine 
was, that if a number of circuits were established for 
court, competent judges could not be obtained; for 
that was proposed. Even two thousand dollars a yea 


“This debate by Davis, Williams, Knox, and others, is tak 
Sangamo Journal, July 29. 


FRIDAY, JULY 23, 1847 501 


justify a man who was well qualified for the office in accepting it, 
if he were obliged to travel all over the state. He hoped at all 
events, that the committee would see the propriety of providing 
that the number of places at which the supreme court should be 
held, should not exceed three. 

_ Mr. WILLIAMS said he felt some solicitude in this matter, 
and it was a question in which all the people of the State were 
deeply interested. He did not concur in the objections which 
some gentlemen seemed to entertain, that by fixing one, or even 
two or three places only, for the sitting of the Supreme Court, 
they would be depriving any portion of the people of the benefit 
of the supervision and control of that court over the inferior tri- 
bunals of the country. It was not proposed that in doing this 
its jurisdiction should be limited to one district or to one county. 
The only question was, where that court could best hold its ses- 
sions for the supervision and control of the decisions of the inferior 
courts. Gentlemen had argued the question as if they appre- 
hended that by fixing it at one, two, or three places only, the 
benefits to be derived from it would be but partial, and would not 
extend equally to the whole State. 

The gentleman from Knox (Mr. Harvey), had told the com- 
mittee that it was to him immaterial whether the court should 
be held here or at Quincy. The gentleman then, did not require 
that it should be carried throughout each circuit; carried, accord- 
ing to the popular phrase, to each man’s door. It was only nec- 
essary then according to the gentleman’s showing, in order to 
secure every portion of the State the benefits intended to be 
secured by the establishment of a supreme court that its jurisdic- 
tion should extend all over the State, and that any person, when 
injustice was done him by the decision of an inferior court, should 
have a reasonable opportunity to have that decision reversed by 
the supreme court. It had been well remarked by the gentleman 
from White, that parties litigant would have no occasion to bring 
their witnesses to attend the supreme court; the court acting only 
upon the record, determining the points reserved for its decision 

_ which were thought to be erroneously determined by the inferior 
court.—Where was the necessity, then, for carrying that court 
into different counties or circuits? Did gentlemen expect that all 


attorney did not require to be advised by his whe esate n 
points observed for the decision of the supreme court. He 
attend the case just as well without the presence of his c 
It was important that there should be a supreme co 
purpose of correcting the errors committed by the inferi 
It was important that that court should be upright, i int 
and independent; and it was also important that it shoul 
an opportunity of investigating every case that might be pre 
it was important that the judges should be men whose le 
intelligence and wisdom, would afford all the facilities for 
them to arrive at just conclusions. How was this to be f 
By sending the judges hurriedly around the State and req 


a correct judgment was not in favor of having the cou 
lished at one or two places, instead of sending persons a 
missionaries without affording them time for investiga 
_ out affording them the aid of precedents and autnen 


course to be taken, he thought the result would he 

decisions, and a consequent insecurity of the rights of th 
litigant. But if the court were allowed to hold its si 
one or two places only, there would be an opportunity fo 
gation, and a correct line of decision might be relied up 
gentleman from Knox had argued unfairly. The prec 

which he had referred in support of his plan for a peramb y 
court, were in fact of a different character from the court 
he was speaking. The gentleman had remarked that the. 
in England had their circuits in which they held courts at 
places; but the gentleman did not draw the distinction 
the trials of cases at isi prius in which the justices were si 
engaged, and the determination of cases in banco regis, Ww 
analagous to our supreme court. Justices of the inetall 


FRIDAY, JULY 23, 1847 503 


; hee as true, had circuits for the purpose of holding the trial of cases 


t nist prius, but they afterwards met at Westminster Hall in 


_ banco regis, and there determined cases arising in all parts of the 
y kingdom. The gentleman had also stated that the judges of the 


q _ supreme court of the United States traveled round in their respec- 
tive circuits. So they did; but not for the trial of appeals, they 


/ 


traveled as circuit judges; appeals were carried to them at Wash- 


‘ington. The sitting of the supreme court was always held at 


” 


Washington. The examples adduced by the gentleman were 


_ against his position, they proved exactly the reverse of that which 


the gentleman desired; and unless the gentleman was prepared to 
‘take the ground that the supreme court of the United States 
‘ought to be required to hold court in each State, then he must 
abandon the position as to any analogy between the cases. The 


_ gentleman told them also, that the judges of this State had here- 
_ tofore gone round; so they had, for the purpose of holding circuit 


courts, and complaints innumerable had come up from the people 
of improper decisions; everybody was tired of the system, and 
thought that it ought to be abandoned. ‘The people almost with 
one acclaim, had said we want supreme judges. He believed 
there was no instance, with the exception perhaps of the New 


_ England States, with whose history in this respect, he was not 


very familiar, of a supreme court holding its sittings in every cir- 
cuit. In Missouri it was once tried, not holding them in every 
circuit, but in four different places; but after some little experience 
in this practice, they changed it and fixed the court permanently 
at one place. Some regard he thought was due to the experience 
of Missouri in this matter, and the practice which had prevailed 
in all the States west of New England, was entitled to considera- 
tion, rather than that of New England herself; for it would be 
remembered that New England was densely populated, and that 
the place at which the court was to be held might be reached in 
one day’s travel; and good libraries were to be found in every 
county in the State. There was not the same reason then for 
holding the court at one particular point, while every requisite 
facility was afforded them at various places and where less travel 
was required. Again, in relation to the convenience of the law- 
yers, for he apprehended after all, that the object was to draw the 


HUA ANRC li beac Oh ph a a 


504 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE 


practice from the supreme court into different he 
with the gentleman from White, that there ought to b 
in this matter as in other things, and however it might s 
savor of a disposition to please the popular taste, to whi 
would never pander, he must be permitted to say, that 


to have able lawyers on the circuit. It was not equally : por : 
he admitted, to have able lawyers, as to have able and 
judges; but it was highly necessary to have able lawyer 
the single result of keeping pettyfogging lawyers out of t 
tice and could be attained, it would redound to the credit ¢ 
people of the State. But it was said that a lawyer comi 
a remote part of the State, had to remain a long time w v2 
before they could get the ear of the court. It might be sc 
those little lawyers who came with little cases, but it was 
with those who came with a reputation, and whose briefs n 
worth while for the court to attend to them. Ifa lawyer 
his case as he should do, though there might be some delay, 
would not be sufficient to justify complaint. 

He was prepared to meet gentlemen on middle ground i 
to this matter. He was prepared to agree that the eat 


hereafter, when experience showed that there was ne 
change. How many circuits were there to be? One report 
mended twenty, and another twelve. Gentlemen might: 
they pleased, it was well known that carrying the court into ¢ 
circuit would greatly increase litigation. He did not. say | 
would increase the number of original cases; but it wo 
the number of appeals. Every case that was susceptible of 2 
would be carried into the supreme court, and its business 
be greatly and unnecessarily increased. ‘Three places, 
thought, would afford ample opportunity for conductin; 
advantage the business of the supreme court. 

He had been the more solicitous in regard to this m 
cause he knew that there was something pleasing in the - 
having justice carried to every man’s door, and the advantag 
ing the court permanently fixed in one place, were apt to 
looked. There was another reason why he felt apprel 


% FRIDAY, JULY 23, 1847 505 


ie about this amendment. They were divided concerning this 

| system of establishing the supreme court into three parties. One 

| set of gentlemen were desirous of having three divisions of the 

State; another set desired to have the judges elected by general 
ticket; and another, wishing to have the judges elected by districts, 

and not appointed by the Governor, and each were unwilling to 
perfect the other system; consequently they had to fight first 
against the enemies of the system, and then against those who 
were allured with the idea of carrying home justice to every man’s 
door. It was for this reason that he felt a solicitude for the fate 
of the amendment, involving, as it did, all that was valuable in the 
supreme court. 

Mr. KNOX said he rose to make a single suggestion in regard 
to a matter which he believed had not been adverted to. This 
committee had decided that the supreme court should consist of 
but three judges. The proposition contained in the report of the 
majority of the judiciary committee which it was proposed to 
strike out was, that ‘‘one term of the supreme court shall be held 
annually in each judicial circuit,’’ and the report went on to pro- 
vide “‘that there shall be twelve judicial circuits, which may be 
increased from time to time,’ &c., and the minority ‘report pro- 
vided that there shall be twenty judicial districts. It would 
therefore be necessary for the three justices of the supreme court, 
if this section should be retained, to hold their courts in all these 
different circuits, and it was admitted on both sides of the house, 
that if the terms of the court were held in these different judicial 
circuits, the business of the court would be materially increased. 
The gentleman from St. Clair in his argument yesterday, took the 
ground that it was necessary that the court should be holden in 
the several districts to give the lawyers of those districts an oppor- 
tunity to conduct their cases, which they would not be able to do 
if the court was held at one place for the whole State. The whole 
tenor of the arguments on that side went to convince him that, 
under the circuit system there would be great increase of litiga- 
tion. The great and moving cause for calling the convention of 
the State of New York was, that the courts that existed in that 
State were entirely incompetent to dispose of all the business 
before them. Twelve years ago the supreme court of the State 


eee 1 i ea Bis cobes tetg yi gh se 


= 

he 
{ Mya 
: 


506 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COL 


that the crowded state of the business at that time gave 
for voluminous and interesting reports, to which, if gent 
would refer, they would find a rich vein of judicial decisior 
which they might look in vain to the records of subsequent 
If they would look back then to the reason for calling th 
Convention of New York, which was to change their ju 
system, it might give them some reason to fear that with 
judges, and no power to increase their number, whose dt 
should be to perambulate the State and hold courts in 
districts, they would be unable to discharge the duties thai 
be assigned them, and to investigate and decide upon all 
portant matters that would be brought before them. It 
this additional reason, with others which had been already a 
by gentlemen in this discussion, that he was in favor of st 
out the sixth section of the majority report. If it were nece 
to provide for holding courts in all these circuits, then it w 
the duty of the convention to provide for increasing the n 
of judges of the court; otherwise it would not be many y 
before it would be necessary for a convention again to be 
for the purpose of remedying the evil which would neces 
attend such an arrangement. _ ; 
The question being taken on striking out the 6th sec 
was upon a division, decided in the negative.—Ayes 58, nay 
Mr. ECCLES offered a proviso to the 6th section, givir 
legislature power to change the place of holding said cour 
the circuits to the seat of government, or to one point | 
grand division as heretofore provided for, and said change 
be oftener than once in six years. 2 
Mr. ECCLES said, that the object of his amend 
that if upon a trial of the operation of holding the supreme Cot 
in each judicial circuit, it was found not to work well; there s 101 
be vested in the legislature the power either to bring it bat 


FRIDAY, JULY 23, 1847 507 | 


to the seat of government, or if it were thought more advisable, 

more advantageous to the interests of the people, to establish one 

- in each of the grand divisions of the State. Upon the face of the 
proposition it seemed to promise that it would work well to estab- 

lish a supreme court in each judicial circuit; but it must be remem- 
bered that the system was as yet, an untried one in this State; 
and it must also be remembered that our judicial system had 
hitherto worked badly in every phase in which it had been tried. 
This would be an entirely new experiment, we were not only going 
' to elect our judges, although a large portion of the convention 

did not think it would work well; (he for one did) and they were 
establishing a rotary court also. He was in favor then of provid- 
ing in the constitution that the supreme court should be held in 

each judicial circuit; and for providing also, that if it were found 
not to work well, they might retrace their steps so far as to locate 
the court at one point, in each grand division of the State at least. 
He thought this would accomplish the purpose which the gentle- 
man from Gallatin desired. 

_ Mr. KITCHELL said, he agreed with the gentlemen from 
Fayette in the opinion, that it was not desirable to fix this matter 
unchangeably in the constitution. 

He was in favor of holding the supreme court in each judicial 
circuit, because he thought it would tend to the greater accom- 
modation of the people. He thought it would be well, however, 
to provide that the legislature might hereafter, if it were found 

necessary, re-arrange this matter. He offered an amendment for 
that purpose. 

Mr. CALDWELL offered a substitute for the amendment, 
providing that the terms of the supreme court should be held as 
directed by law. 

Mr. CALDWELL briefly addressed the committee. He was 
desirous he said, that justice should be brought as near as possible 
to every man’s door, and that could only be done by having a 
greater number of judicial circuits than we had heretofore had. 
Anyone who was familiar with our judicial system up to the pres- 

ent time, must be aware that the circuits were too large. For 
the purpose of bringing the courts nearer to the people, and of 
increasing their consequence and usefulness, he was in favor of 


508 _ ILLINOI S HIS TORI CAL cOLLBenK : 


the number of judicial circuits proposed in ee minority repo 
Tt was circuit courts that were required for the convenience of the 
people. The supreme court was of less importance to them. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess was in favor of having four 
judicial circuits in the State, and five judges; and he trusted t 
the effort to accomplish this object hereafter might not be ut 
successful. With regard to the present amendment, he was i 
favor of it with one exception. He believed it would give to th 
legislature power of creating one supreme court to be held at the 
seat of government. He was against reposing this power upon 
legislature at any time, and he was equally opposed to restrict 
the legislature unqualifiedly to the circuit system. He did 
wish to tie up the hands of succeeding legislatures. If the circ 
system should prove itself inadequate for the purpose for which it © 
was intended; if, instead of facilitating the administration of justice, 
it proved oppressive to the people, he desired that the legislatu 
should have power to change the system as time and experie 
might dictate. ae 

Mr. GREGG said, it seemed to him that it would be wrong in 
this convention to undertake to judge as to what would be the 
proper system for all future time. They could not possibly know © 
whether the particular system which they might be disposed to 
adopt, would work well or not. He was willing to trust somewha 
to the legislature in the management of this matter. He though 
they might safely confide in the discretion of the representative 
of the people to make such alterations hereafter as the pu 
good might require. : 

Mr. HARVEY moved a substitute for Mr. Ecctes’ provisi 
which was rejected. 

Mr. KINNEY of St. Clair moved the following amendme 

But the legislature may change the time and place of hol 
the supreme court, provided that it is not held in less than fi 
places in the State; such change, however, not to be made ofte 
than once in six years. 

Mr. KINNEY observed, that if the system should not be fou 
to work well, the proper time for alteration to be made by tk 
legislature would be at the time of the election of judges; 
he thought that the substitute which he offered would meet 1 


FRIDAY, JULY 23, 1847 509 


approbation of those who had expressed themselves in favor of a 
smaller number of circuits for the supreme court. He believed 
that almost every gentleman who had addressed the committee 
was in favor of having the supreme court held in every district in 
the State, but they were opposed to having this matter fixed so 
that it could not be changed in case the system was found to work 
badly. The amendment which he had proposed would obviate 
this objection; and if at any future period after the experiment 
had been made, it should be found that this system did not satisfy 
with the wants of the people, it might be changed by the legis- 
lature. He thought that five places for holding the supreme court 
would be few enough; it would bring that court nearer to the peo- 
ple than if it were confined to three judicial circuits, and would 
be infinitely preferable to confining the court to a central posi- 
tion at the seat of government. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said he had sat patiently waiting 
in expectation that the committee would take some action upon 
this part of the report, but he could see but little prospect of 
coming to a decision, for if one amendment had been offered, he 
believed there had been fifty, and he had come to the conclusion 
which some gentlemen in the convention who were older than 
himself had arrived at some days ago, that the deliberations of 


‘this convention would never lead to any good result. They 
_ had sat for two months, and had now before them the most im- 


portant report that had been, or would be made by a committee, 
and after being engaged upon it for several days, they were as 
far from being through with it as when they commenced. There 
seemed a manifest disposition to evade by a multitude of amend- 
ments and long speeches the adoption of any part of the report as 
it stood. The report did not seem to meet the concurrence of 
any two members of the convention; indeed, he believed that it 
had not been concurred in by more than two members of the 
committee from which it was reported. I believe, continued Mr. 
Davis, that I understood you, sir, [Mr. ScaTEs being in the chair,! 
as saying that you did not endorse the report itself. Sir, I am 
in favor of the report of the minority, because, that has at least 
the concurrence of two members of committee. I believe that a 
proposition ought yet to be made to refer the whole matter to some 


lawyers or farmers, that they may bring in such a sports 
be a basis for our action, and en we shall be able to Aston 


sit here and see the convention Fie ondean neue to pak ' 
present report into such a shape that they may all agree upon 
The people do not expect that in connection with making t 
judges elective, we shall set about tearing up all the fundame 
principles of the judiciary department. For one, I heartily pre 
test against the proceedings. I shall not make the motion : 
reference myself; but I do hope that we shall now pause and re 
the matter to a competent committee, who may report somet 
for our action, without wasting any more time. 

Mr. BALLINGALL observed that as a member of she 
mittee on the judiciary, it was within his own knowledge that 
report did receive the concurrence of a majority of that ¢ 


mittee. 
Mr. DAVIS remarked, that he had not understood the: cl] 


such reasons for the provisions embraced in the report as w 
satisfy the committee of the whole. 

The question being about to be put, 

Mr. WEAD said he hoped the Convention was not goi 
decide upon the number of circuits without a more full dis 
and interchange of opinion. Mr. Wead proceeded to cor 
upon the propositions contained 1 in the reports of pea 


number of circuits. No subject, he said, which ae come 
the judiciary committee had been discussed more at length the 
the question of dividing the State into judicial circuits for 

purpose of holding the supreme court. He had no desire to a 
cate one particular system to the exclusion of another, but fr 
the discussion which had taken place before the judiciary co 
mittee, he had come to the conclusion that the way in which 
could best meet the wishes of the people of the State, was 
divide it into twenty judicial circuits at least. He had beet 


FRIDAY, JULY 23, 71847 Sir 


establishing a county court for the transaction of probate business; 
‘but reflection, the discussion which was elicited in committee, and 
_ the long array of facts which was presented had satisfied him of 
the impracticability of that system; and he believed that if gentle- 
men would give their attention to the subject, they would arrive 
at the same conclusion. 
__ Mr. WEAD proceeded at considerable length to advocate the 
aap proposition contained in the report of the minority of the com- 
mittee. 
___ On motion of Mr. Epwarps, of Madison, the committee rose 
“and reported back the reports, with sundry amendments and 
_ asked the concurrence of the convention therein. 
Mr. EDWARDS moved that the whole subject be referred to 
a select committee of one from each judicial circuit. 
7 Mr. MINSHALL moved to amend by making it two from 
each judicial circuit. 
_ Mr. ROUNTREE moved to amend by making it three from 
each judicial circuit. 
Mr. Z. CASEY said he should vote in favor of the motion of 
the gentleman from Madison, and trusted that it would prevail. 
Mr. BALLINGALL opposed the motion. There was nothing 
remarkable, he thought, in the action of the committee. Nothing 
Was more common than that a variety of amendments should 
be .proposed. There was a majority of the committee on the 
judiciary in favor of the adoption of the amendment of the gentle- 
man from Fayette to the report of that committee. Because the 
committee of the whole had thought proper to differ in some 
points from the majority of the committee on the judicary, was 
this a sufficient reason for appointing a special committee? The 
business would not be accelerated by it. If, as had been said, the 
gentleman from Fulton, had spoken to empty benches, that was 
no reason why the order of business should be changed. He hoped 
the committee would not arise; he thought it would be of no use 
whatever to obtain another report, and to commence over again 
the discussion upon it; it would be only jumping out of the frying 
pan into the fire. 
Mr. EDWARDS. of Madison said he thought that every 
member of the convention must be satisfied that no good purpose 


Cie spite 


512 ~‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS ~ 


could be accomplished by pursuing the discussion of this subj 
in the embarrassed situation in which the committee were no 
placed. Every gentleman must perceive that they were cons: 
ing time without the prospect of arriving at any definite conclusi 
He would move that the committee rise and report for the pu 
of referring the subject back to the judiciary committee or t 
select committee, so that a proposition might be reported upo 
which they could act free from the confusion and embarrassme 
in which they were now involved. Whilst the gentleman fro 
Fulton had been presenting to the committee views of the ut mc 
magnitude, gentlemen would observe that nearly every seat 
vacant, and little or no attention was bestowed upon one of tf 
most important questions that could be presented to them. — 
moved that the committee rise and report. 
Mr. SCATES opposed the reference. a 
Mr. KNAPP of Jersey was in favor of the reef toa si ( 
committee, and moved that the committee consist of nine inste 
of twenty-seven. ; 
Mr. EDWARDS of Madison said he was indifferent as to th 
anes He would have proposed a smaller number himself, 
he thought they would be more apt to concur readily. He wo 
accept the amendment of the gentleman from Jersey as a mi 
fication of his motion. 
Mr. WEAD said that in his opinion nothing was to. be gait 
by a reference of this matter to a special committee; but if it 
referred, it ought to be to a committee consisting of a gr 
number, because nine members would not give a fair repres 
tion of the State. The number proposed was entirely too 
to consider a subject of so much importance; a subject invol 
so many conflicting interests. His impression was, that no gi 
would arise from its reference; the proper place for deciding 
matter was in committee of the whole. fi 
Mr. MINSHALL was in favor of its reference to a select com- 
mittee, but preferred that the committee should consist of a larget 
number than nine, and less than twenty-seven. He SuEBeSE 
eighteen as the proper number. 
Mr. SERVANT was in favor of the reference to a select co: 
mittee to be composed of two members from each judicial circu 


FRIDAY, JULY 23, 1847 513 


and he trusted that those who were appointed on the committee 
would frame their report in accordance with the views that had 
_ been expressed by the committee of the whole. 

- Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery, was in favor of a reference to a 
- select committee of twenty-seven, and he had no doubt from the 
_ discussion that had taken place, that the committee would be 
_ enabled to make such a report as would meet with the approba- 
tion of the committee of the whole. 

Mr. Z. CASEY desired to suggest to the gentleman from Mont- 
gomery, whether his views would not be as well carried out by the 
appointment of a committee of nine members, as one of twenty- 
seven? He believed the present proposition was, that the commit- 
tee should consist of nine; one from each judicial circuit. If this 
proposition were adopted each circuit would be represented, and 

all differences in the views of the members of the committee would 

be more readily reconciled, than if the committee consisted of a 

larger number. 

Mr. KNOWLTON was in favor of the reference. The com- 
mittee if appointed, he said, would, from the discussion that had 
taken place, understand pretty nearly the prevailing sentiment of 
the convention; and if they were willing to yield somewhat of 
each man’s peculiar ideas; to abandon somewhat of pride of opinion 
in order to meet the wishes of the greater number; and to do that 
which would best promote the interest of the State; he thought 
they might easily agree upon a plan which would meet the con- 

_ currence of the convention. He thought that a select committee 
would best accomplish the desired object, and he was in favor of 
making the committee a large one; because the report of a large 
body would have so much more weight, that the convention would 
the more readily harmonize upon it.] 


Mr. EDWARDS moved that the whole subject be referred 
to a select committee of one from each judicial district; which 
amendment, after being amended so as to refer the subject to a 
committee of three from each judicial district, was agreed to. 

The following gentlemen were appointed the committee, under 
the above motion. 

Messrs. Epwarps of Madison, Locxwoop, Davis of Massac, 


514. ILLINOIS HISTORICAL CO 


of Scott, BosBYSHELL, Deen Hurisur vor 
Bureau. 
And the Convention adjourned till 3 Pp. mM. | 
Be 


é 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. EDWARDS of Madison offered certain artic 
to be inserted in the constitution, in relation to the 
which were referred to the committee on Finance. 

Mr. ARCHER moved the Convention resolve itself 
mittee of the whole on the report of the committee on the 
zation of Departments; which motion was carried, al 
Casey took the chair. The report was taken up by sec 

Src. 1. There shall be chosen, by the qualifi 
throughout the state, an Auditor of Public Accounts,. 
hold his office for the term of four years, and 
shall be regulated by law, and who shall receive a 
thousand dollars per annum for his services. 

Mr. BUTLER moved to strike out $1,000, and i ir 
which was rejected. . 

Mr. DAVIS of Meee moved to add ta) the : sectic 


jected. 

Mr. JONES moved to add to the section: © 
Carried. Oe. 
Sec. 2. There shall be elected, by the soe ie 


decided § in the affirmative. f 
Mr. LOGAN moved to strike out $800, and i insert 

yeas 44, nays 64. Rejected. 
Mr. KENNER moved to strike out two years, 

“four years.” Rejected. Mb, 


FRIDAY, JULY 23, 1847 515 


Daas. PETERS moved to insert after years: ‘‘and until his 
‘successor is qualified.” Carried. 

_ Mr. CHURCH moved to add to the section: ‘exclusive of 
iss hire.” Rejected. 

Sections three and four, having been provided for in a former 

“report, were, on motion, stricken out. 
- On motion, the committee rose and reported back the article, 
with the amendments, to the Convention. _ 

_ The question being on concurring in the amendments, they 
‘were concurred in. ‘ 
; Mr. PETERS moved to insert after ‘years’ in the first sec- 
tion: “and until his successor is qualified.’”’ Carried. 
The question was put on the adoption of the two sections as 
article of the constitution, and decided in the affirmative. 

Mr. SCATES moved it be referred to the committee of Revi- 
sion. Carried. 

Mr. ROMAN moved the ne of the committee on Elections 

_ and Right of Suffrage be referred to the committee of the whole, 
and that the Convention go into committee on that report; which 
was decided in the affirmative, and Mr. Harvey was called to the 
chair. 

Sec. 1. In all elections every white male citizen, above the 
age of twenty-one years, having resided in the state one year next 
preceding any election, shall be entitled to vote at such election; 
and every white male inhabitant of the age aforesaid, who may be 
a resident of this state at the time of the adoption of this constitu- 
tion, shall have the right of voting as aforesaid; but no such 
citizen or inhabitant shall be entitled to vote except in the district 
or county in which he shall actually reside at the time of such 

election. 

Mr. SCATES moved to strike out “‘citizen”’ in [the] first line 
and insert “inhabitant.” 

Mr. S. said, that he made the motion because he was in favor 
of admitting foreigners to the right of voting, provided they had, 
like other voters, resided twelve months in the state, and made a 
declaration of their intention to become citizens. He thought 
that men who came to this country as an asylum from oppression, 
and on account of a love for our institutions, should not be con- 


$16 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COL 


sidered in the light of spies, or as mischievous person ; 
come here to operate dangerously with the privilege 
We had had an experience of a similar law, and found no. 
ing from it—We placed all foreigners under the same 
citizens—we taxed them, we made them subservient to 
and compelled them to work on the road and perform 
duties of citizenship, and he saw no reason why we sho 
them the right of voting, or refuse them the privileges of 
They made good citizens, and in the present war wer 
even the unnaturalized, to be ready and willing to battle 
land of their choice. He thought the time proposed lon 
for the probationary term. ; 
Mr. GEDDES replied, and thought the law of the 
States, requiring five years residence, a period not too k 
that we ought to follow it. i 
The question was then taken on striking out, and de 
the negative. . rm 
Mr. ROMAN moved to insert after “constitution: ei 
has filed his declaration of his intention to become a citiz 
United States, according to the laws thereof.” ‘ 
Mr. GEDDES moved to strike out “or,” in the amen 
and insert ‘“‘and.” 4 
Mr. HAYES opposed the amendment to the amend 
because it not only affected those who were to come int 
state, but also those who were here at present. He was 
of the amendment, and had voted for the amendmen 
gentleman from Jefferson, Mr. ScaTEs. 
Mr. BROCKMAN was in favor of the amenuareee but: 
to the amendment to it. He was willing that every 
came to the state should enjoy the rights of freemen. 
opposed to any distinctions among the people, and was 
admit all to equal rights. 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, that he nonede 
tion would not be taken at this time. The Conventic 


to run away with the denote without giving time for c 
ation. The question now before them was one of great imp 
to a large portion of the community, and particularly to the 


FRIDAY, JULY 23, 1847 517 


‘ing classes. He asked those who desired this feature in the con- 
stitution changed, to point out the abuses of which they com- 
plained. He would ask them if it had retarded the progress of the 
state? If it has thrown any obstacle in the way of a full develop- 
ment of our resources? If any one would point out to him when 
it had done this, then he would go with them in the change. Will 
gentlemen tell him the ground of their complaints? He believed 
them nothing but imaginary chimeras of the brain, or the result 
of some party design. If he had time, and this question had not 
been sprung upon them this afternoon, he would have been pre- 
pared to enter more largely upon the subject, and would have 
drawn a clause to be inserted in the constitution, which, he was 
sure, would meet the views of a majority of the people of the state. 
Mr. C. read what he said was the substance of his plan: To 
require of every foreigner coming into the state, and desiring the 
rights of citizenship, to take an oath of allegiance, and of his intention 
to become a citizen, to be filed in a court of record; and, provided 
he shall have been twelve months in the state, to be admitted to 
all the privileges of citizens. He asked gentlemen to tell him if 
men had the hardihood to leave the land of their fathers, the 
scenes of their youth, their friends and acquaintances, to come to 
a country of whose government and institutions they were ignorant 
of? Could any man say that these foreigners tore themselves 
from their native land and came to this country without some 
previous knowledge and acquaintance with the form of govern- 
ment under which they were about to place themselves? Was it 
possible? He thought not. He would ask them to place them- 
selves in the same position. If they were about to emigrate to a 
foreign land and to leave the institutions under which they were 
reared, would not their first thought be directed, and their most 
“anxious enquiries made, to obtain knowledge and information of 
the system of government in the country they were about to select. 
So withthe foreigners. Those gentlemen who declare that foreign- 
ers, after a two years’ residence, are not qualified to be entitled 
to exercise the right of voting say that which has no foundation 
in fact, and they can base no such conclusion upon any thing con- 
tained in the history of the last thirty years. One other thing: 
we had an enormous debt, fast accumulating in interest, and which 


TAMA Ri csi Say! a 


518 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL oo ( fslges 

we were unable to pay. But it was to be pelts ho Ne 
answer is, by the natural resources of the state. And how a are tl 
be developed? Only by the hard hand of labor. How are our 
untenanted prairies to be covered, and their fertility made 
ductive? By increaseofpopulation. Wealladmit that the nz 
resources of Illinois are amply sufficient to pay all our debt; 
then that is wanted is a development of them by labor, and 
requires hands. Should we not then hold out to the world 
greatest inducement for men, particularly of the laboring c 
to come amongst us, to till our prairies, to work in our mines, 2 
develop the vast and inexhaustible resources of our state. 
cannot obtain this class of population age Sst out: 


where. Fier the same reason, he was sede toa pals tax: 
opposed to any restriction upon the right of suffrage, the | 
which would fall most heavily upon the working classes. T. 
desired, and it was our policy, to see [them] free and unrest; 
the exercise of that privilege so dear to them. He would vot 
amendment of Mr. Roman, unless gentlemen who complait 
the system as it stood, would point [out] to him, in the history 
past thirty years, any evils resulting from it. He called upon the 
to make some argument, to give some reason for the chanted 
if they did not, he would never vote for it. vin a 
Messrs. Davis of Montgomery, Parmer of Macouy 
Green of Tazewell, all opposed the amendment. 
Mr. GEDDES withdrew his anh to the aged 
Mr. HARDING renewed it. iN 
Mr. KINNEY of St. Clair obtained the floor, but gave 
to a motion that the committee rise. The committee 
the chairman reported progress. Aan 
Mr. GREGG offered a resolution that, in ottes toh 
hall cleaned, the carpets taken up, etc., and to enable the 
mittee to finish the business before ‘hem when the Con 
adjourned, it would adjourn till Monday. Carried. 
And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned. ; 


XXXVIII. MONDAY, JULY 26, 1847 


The Convention met at 8 P. M. 
Mr. HAYES moved that so much of the resolution presented 


| 


on the 16th inst., by Mr. Knapp, of Jersey, and passed on that day 
__ by the Convention, which states that this Convention is unable to 
_ protect itself or its officers from insult or indignity, be rescinded. 
And, also, that the President be requested and authorized to make 


arrangements for having the Convention opened each morning 
with prayer. Which resolutions were passed. 
Mr. SHERMAN presented a plan of restricted corporations 


to be chartered by the Legislature, for various purposes, banking, 


manufacturing, &c. Which he moved to be laid on the table and 
printed. 
Mr. BALLINGALL opposed the printing of any such plans. 


_ Several members had their favorite schemes, and if one were pub- 


% 


lished why not extend the same courtesy to all. He would oppose 
it as a bad precedent. The gentleman from Fayette, the gentle- 
man from Grundy, and from Jo Daviess would also have an equal 


‘right to have their propositions printed. If all were printed the 
_ expense would be considerable and if one only was printed it would 


be showing a want of equal courtesy, therefore, he would vote 
against publishing any. 

Mr. SHERMAN replied, that it would be impossible for the 
members to fully understand the various propositions upon this 
important subject unless they were laid before them. As to the 
economy advocated by his colleague (Mr. BAattincatt) he thought 
that it would be no saving of expense to refuse the printing, 
because the time lost in reading them, when the question of banks 
came before the Convention and the difficulty in amending, or 
understanding them, would be a greater cost to the state than if 


_ they were printed. He had no objections to the printing of the 


other propositions. : 
Mr. DEMENT said a few words in favor of the printing. 


519 


520 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI 0. 


Mr. WEST thought the printing of the proposition wov 
the best course to follow. Be 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess opposed the printing asi 1- 
necessary, and as of no sort of benefit. } 
Mr. EDMONSON presented (in order to have printed will the 
proposition of Mr. SHERMAN) a long system of banking restri 
and provisos, and offered it as a substitute for the propositio 
Mr. SHERMAN. D: 
Mr. ARMSTRONG presented a substitute for the substitute 3 
proposition, (total prohibition of banks in the state,) which, - 
any were to be published, he desired to be printed with the oth 
Mr. McCALLEN said, that he had a substitute for the 
of the propositions, which he desired to have published if an 
were to be printed. He did not, however, desire to have any 
them printed. No person ever thought that a plan of a b; 
coming from representatives of Cook county would be adop 
He was a bank man, and desired to have established a bank wh 
would be of some benefit and advantage to the people of the st 
—He desired to have nothing to do with the bantlings that v¥ 
presented by the representatives from Cook county, who 
in favor of prohibition.—If they were to have a bank, he d 
to have such a one as would be proposed by the friends of 
institution. It appeared to him very strange that these prob 
tion men could not wait till the bank was proposed by its friend 
he thought it looked as if they feared they would have nothi 
the “odious banking system” to annihilate—or to adopt! — 
Mr. SHERMAN said, that he would say to the member 
Hardin, that, as one of the representatives from Cook, hi 
no prohibitionist, that he never was in favor of the prohi 
clause. 
Mr. McCALLEN said, that his remarks were grounded 
the course of one of the members from that county, (Mr. Gree 
who made a speech some time ago in favor of prohibition 
wound up by presenting a system of banking. After that 
ple, he thought that he was not wrong in supposing the gent 
(Mr. S.) to be in favor of a prohibitory clause, although he r 
present a plan for granting incorporations. He moved that. 
whole subject be laid on the table till the 1st of January, 184) 


MONDAY, JULY 26, 1847 521 


Mr. BALLINGALL said, that as one of the representatives 
- from Cook he would say that he was in favor of a total prohi- 
‘bition of banks. He was opposed to them for many reasons, but 
particularly for the very good and all-sufficient reason that the 
democratic convention that nominated him and the other dele- 
gates, passed a resolution instructing them to vote for a prohibitory 
clause! This instruction he would obey. 

The question was taken on the motion to lay on the table till 
January, 1848, and decided in the affirmative. 

Mr. ALLEN, from the committee on the Bill of Rights, to 
whom had been referred the petition of sundry citizens of Winne- 
bago county, praying the abolishment of all distinctions of color, 
reported the same back, and asked to be discharged from the 
further consideration of the subject. Granted. _ 


THE CARPET 


{In pursuance to the order of the Convention made on Friday 
last, the carpet on the floor of the hall was taken up by the door- 
keepers on Saturday, but unfortunately would not hold together 
after the dust was shaken out. Consequently the door-keepers 
reported that the same could not be replaced on the floor, so 
shockingly torn was its condition. The noise made by the one 
hundred and seventy persons in the hall, by moving upon the 
uncovered floor, was so great that it was impossible to proceed 
with the business.] 

Mr. THOMAS stated that he desired to call the attention of 
the house to the difficulty of proceeding with the business, while 
the floor was uncovered and such noise prevailing. [Cries of 
“louder” from all parts of the house.] Mr. T. repeated what he 
had said, and urged, as the reporter understood him, that a new 
carpet should be procured, as the old one was not fit to be replaced 
—so torn and worn that it could not be put upon the floor again. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess suggested that the carpet 
could not be obtained in Springfield. On a former occasion he 
had tried here and in St. Louis but could not get sufficient of any 
one kind to cover this hall. 

Mr. THOMAS moved that the Convention adjourn till to- 


_ new carpet, and chek withdrew it. mors. 


522 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL co 
morrow at 8 A. M., to enable the Sedetnaee of State to 


Mr EDWARDS of Madison inquired haw ace it Sale 
to put down the carpet? Our adjournment should be regula 
meet that contingency. 

Mr. ROBBINS moved that when the Convention ad 
adjourn to meet in the Senate chamber; he ne a 
sufficient might be found there. 

Mr. VANCE moved that the old carpet be replaced, no me 
what was its condition. 


carpet shontd now turn to and put it down. © 
Mr. THOMAS renewed his motion to adjourn. He saic 
it had been suggested to him that a committee be appoint 
examine and enquire into the condition of the old carpet, (lau 
but he had no desire to make such a motion. ee 
Mr. SINGLETON moved Mr. Tuomas be appointed a 
mittee to examine the old carpet and report its condition al 
probable utility for future service. f 
A Memser proposed that the floor be covered with saw du 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, that it would take s 
days to have a new carpet put down, and he hoped that 
carpet would be replaced, it would prevent the noise to ane 
that would enable them to go on with the business. 
A Memper said, that this Convention has no authe : 
purchase or order a new carpet. ei 
Mr. THOMAS said, the Secretary of State was directed 
the law to furnish us what was necessary for our comfort and | 
venience, in the despatch of business. a 
Mr. PETERS said, that we should regulate our adjou 
according to the probabilities of having the carpet pu 
And (at the suggestion of Mr. SHarpe) he moved the door. 
address the Convention upon the condition of the old ca 
After innumerable suggestions, motions, ideas, pro 
and recommendations, the following resolution was propo: 
Mr. Kinney of St. Clair, and adopted by the Convention: ae P 


to examine ‘ike igi) ey at if He same i not ina an 


ion to be replaced on the floor of this hall, then to pur- | 
ew one for the same. And the door-keepers are author- 
poly saan hands to aid them in putting the same 


, on | motion, the Convention adjourned. | 


XXXIX. TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 


Mr. DUMMER presented a petition of sundry citizens of C 
county, praying the appointment of a superintendent of cor 
mon schools. Referred to the committee of Ede 


committee on Elections and Right of Suffrage. 

The question pending was on the amendment to the 
section proposed by Mr. Roman. Mr. Roman modified his amenc 
ment as follows: ; 

Insert, after “constitution,” the follayeines “And all - 
white male inhabitants of the age aforesaid, not being citizens | 
the United States, who shall have resided in this state one ye 
and shall have declared their intention to become citizens of 
United States by a declaration of that intention in conformi 
with the laws of the United States: Provided, whenever Congre 
shall dispense with a declaration of intention as a requisite 1 
naturalization, the declaration of intention required above shall 
be made and filed 1 in the office of the clerk of any court of record 
in this state.” 

Mr. KINNEY of St. Clair rose and said, that it was not h 
intention to take up much of the time of this committee in di 
cussing this question, but it was one on which he desired to expt 
his views, and would do so briefly. The question was the rig 
of suffrage—and whether we should restrict it in our state, « 
depart from the rule laid down by the wise framers of our pr 
constitution, or adhere to that rule and secure that right in a 
unrestricted form. The member from Macoupin (Mr. PALME! 
has told us that, if we extended the right of suffrage to the uw 
naturalized foreigners, we violate the constitution of the U: te 
States, because that instrument secures to Congress the rig 
establishing a uniform naturalization law. That gentleman 
tainly has never examined the constitution upon this point 
does not understand it or construe it correctly. The framers of 


524 


TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 525 


constitution of the United States gave Congress the power to 
pass uniform naturalization laws, not any power to control the 
action of the states with regard to the exercise of the elective 
franchise within its limits. Let that gentleman read on a little 
further in the constitution and he will find that it says, “the 
house of representatives shall be composed of members chosen,” 
&c.; “and the electors in each state shall have the qualifications 
requisite for electors of the most numerous branch of the legis- 
lature.” Here the power to regulate the qualification of voters 
is left to the states, and is not attempted to be defined by the con- 
stitution. If the rules which should govern the right of suffrage 
were stated in the constitution, as claimed by the interpretation. 
of the gentleman, then state sovereignty would sink into nothing. 
Congress has the power to pass laws of naturalization, and the 
states have it not; but Congress has no power to control the right 
of suffrage in any state, or to define the prerequisite qualifica- 
tions of its exercise. This the states alone possess. 

Again: Is it our policy, as a state burdened with debt and 
sparsely settled, to restrict the right of suffrage, and thus prevent 
immigration to our soil? It has always been our policy to encour- 
age it; the policy of the general government has been the same. 
One of the great subjects of complaint urged against Great Britain 
in the declaration of independence, was, that she restricted 
emigration, that she denied the men of other climes the right to 
expatriate themselves from their native lands, and from their 
homes, to seek a shelter here, and to find in our then thinly settled 
land a home. All of our state constitutions encourage immigra- 
tion to their states, and the same spirit runs throughout the whole 
land. The right to expatriate oneself, and to seek a home, has 
always been contended for by the United States, and it was finally 
tested in relation to our own people in the case of the settlement 
of Texas by American citizens, who left their country and went 
there and became citizens, and whom our government recognised 
as citizens of that government. They could not deny the right of 
men to go wherever they please, even to expatriate themselves. 
We have the power to receive these men. We have the power to 
prescribe what shall be the qualifications of voters for the members 
of our General Assembly, and the men whom we entitle to vote 


526 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE 


for members of our General Assembly are orisha ‘expr 
the United States constitution, to vote for members | 
We may have no power to make them citizens, but we 
allow them the exercise of the elective franchise. It 
thought, our policy to encourage immigration by exten 
the immigrants the right of suffrage. They came to ou 
settled down upon our land, and we taxed them as much as 
citizens; we compelled them to bear the burdens of our gov 
ment, we made them do work on our roads, and perform all 
duties required of citizens. Why not, then, give them the 

of suffrage? Why deny them a voice in the election of the: -: 
for the period of six years? This policy had been laid dow 
the framers of the present constitution. They, too, rile 
immigration should be encouraged, that foreigners woul 
into our large state, if we allow them this right; they gave it t 
them, and why should we now change that policy? They prod 
the wealth of our state; they are principally the laboring 
It was the policy of our fathers to encourage immigration 
the east, and from foreign lands, in order to have our land 1 
ited, and they extended inducements such as no other state 
He thought that we should rather encourage them to com 
us, by throwing open to them all the privileges of civil libert 
above all the right of suffrage. We are here, a Conventio 
devise the best means of raising revenue to pay off our debt. 
do this, to relieve us from this evil, it is proposed to levy a po 
showing that at present we have not in our state asi 
quantity of taxable property’ to raise revenue upon to 
expenses, or to pay the interest on our debt. Why den 
foreigners this great inducement to come and settle among 
and increase the value of our waste lands, increase the po 
and lessen the burdens by which we are oppressed. Mu 
been said about the character and ignorance of the fore 
lation that come to our shores. He would refer the ge tl 
to the two great states of New York and Pennsylvaniz 
settled by Germans, the latter nearly populated by them, 
there anything in the character of their people dangero 
liberties of the people? They had alwaysencouraged im 
to their soil. Those states have grown, they have wi 


i TUESDAY, JULY 27, 17847 527 


wield an immense influence, and are the most prudent in all their 
1M acts. Yet neither of those states have, with few exceptions, the 
i "vast and unexhaustible resources of Illinois. A gentleman had 
_ complained that the paupers and criminals of Europe come to this 
country, and therefore this restrictive policy should be followed. 
Will they not come, no matter what the restrictions? Throw 
_ around the right of suffrage all the restrictions they think proper, 
and such people will come any how, you cannot prevent them from 
coming here; but you will exclude those who will be of benefit and 
advantage to the state, those who bring wealth, and who settle 
_ down among us without any desire save to live here and enjoy 
our institutions. Something had been said about the opinions of 
celebrated men of the country in relation to foreigners. He 
desired not to allude to it here, it would introduce party spirit, the 
spirit of a party styled “Native American.” He did not believe 
there was any man in the Convention who would stand up and say 
the doctrines of that party were right. If, however, the gentle- 
man who had alluded to Washington, would look into the writings 
of that great man, he would find that, instead of being a “‘ Native 
American,” they will discover that his feelings, his sentiments, and 
actions were very different from the doctrines taught by that 
party. 
Mr. TURNBULL said, that after a common sense view of 
‘the matter by him, he had come to the conclusion that we had 
no power to do anything in conflict with a law of Congress, passed 
under a power vested in them by the constitution. 


[Mr. TURNBULL said: Theimportant question before the 
committee has not, in my opinion, been fairly met by gentlemen 
opposed to the view contained in the report, and in favor of this 
amendment. It is a principle founded on common sense, that, in 
any society whatever, members alone have a right to a voice in 
the management of the affairs of that society. This is true of 
civil society, as well as of all others. 

Gentlemen on the opposite side have taken the ground that 

_ residence should entitle the alien to the right of suffrage. Sir, 
in my opinion, citizen-ship, alone, can entitle a person to a vote. 

48 This speech by Turnbull is taken from the Sangamo Journal, August 5. 


By the Constitution of the United States, Concedes 
power to make a uniform rule of naturalization. The S 
having delegated that power to Congress, and that body h 
passed a naturalization law, we have no right to make a 
that subject. The State has a right to fix the qualifica 
voters on all other points; that is, to declare how long a pe 
who is a citizen of the United States, coming from another S 
shall reside in this State before he can vote. This State has 
required a property qualification, and I hope never will. 
question cannot turn on the length of residence; for, in a 
after living among us, and becoming acquainted with our in 
tions; if he has lived, even in one county, five, ten, or ev: 
years, and at the end of that time is so opposed to our gove 
that he will not become naturalized, he can have no right to a y 
To permit an alien to vote for Electors of President and | 
President, and Congressman, is injustice to the other State 
this Union. Surely, gentlemen can discern between natura, 
acquired rights. The State protects the alien in the enjoy: 
his natural rights; then, when he acquires citizenship, let 
placed on the same footing with our native-born citizens. 

The right to exercise the elective franchise is an ines’ 
right. What boon, Mr. Chairman, would induce you to 
this privilege? Sir, you can fix no price:—that right cann 
valued. And shall we give away our dearest rights, to th 
No! Let him first qualify himself for this distinguished 
for, by any other name I cannot, in the present instance, 
Let him renounce his allegiance to the potentate from whose 
ernment he hails, and become a citizen. Then, and not till t 
let him enjoy the privileges of the native-born citizen.]} 


‘ \, 


Mr. GREGG said, that it had been well remarked, t 
elective franchise, to be beneficial, must be exercised wisely, 
that when not exercised wisely, it becomes a curse, insteac 
blessing. From this he could not see the good sense or logic i 
argument which will bring us to the conclusion, that an ¢ 
should reside in the country five years before he can exer¢ 
right of voting. We now say that six months shall be the 
this is what the framers of our present constitution requi 


TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 529 


' enable aliens to exercise the right of suffrage. This same principle 
_ of a short probationary term was recognized by the ordinance of 
| 1787, established for the government of the north-western territory. 
_ They were allowed to be represented and to vote for representatives 
to the territorial legislature. The same provision was incorporated 
| into the territorial government of Ohio, Indiana, and Illinois; and 
_ this provision was made for the purpose of encouraging immigra 
tion to the country. It gave them the right to choose their rulers. 
In 1812 the act establishing the territorial government of Illinois 
_ was passed by Congress. Mr. G. read an extract from its provi- 
sions. It was then not thought by the Congress who passed the 
act, that it would be dangerous to the liberties of the country, to 
give foreigners, after a residence of less than five years, the right 
of exercising the elective franchise; and now when we propose the 
same provision to be inserted in our constitution, we enter into 
an argument upon the wisdom of the Congress who passed that 
law, and who, in all their actions, were distinguished by their just 
regard for the rights of man. 

It has been said, that we have no power to confer this franchise 
upon aliens; that the constitution -has conferred upon Congress 
the exclusive power of establishing naturalization laws, and the 
gentleman from Macoupin bases upon this an argument that, 
because the states have no power to pass naturalization laws, 
therefore, she cannot confer the right of suffrage upon any but 
citizens. The gentleman made an argument of some ability but of 
more sophistry. It was a fallacy from beginning to the end. 
It was based upon the ground that the elective franchise was an 
incident of citizenship. Citizenship has other rights than this. 
It is not one intended to be conferred by citizenship. In framing 
the constitution, the exclusive power was left to the states to make 
such, and whatever rules and regulations should govern the exer- 
cise of the elective franchise. It is in the first section of the second 
article of the constitution of the United States. (Mr. G. read the 
section.) Does not this language show clearly that the states 
have been left the power to control this franchise? What are 
electors of members of Congress? The same electors as the states 
may admit to be electors for the most numerous branch of the 
Legislature. Congress has attempted to fix no rule upon the 


at 


Bes Auiiae sh bil iy shy ahd gia set Ay 


In one state a property qualification i is reqniene ina 
ship, in another residence, in other states other rules; 
man say that Congress has, or can, by any power given 
the constitution, enter into legislation for the intern: 
state and limit by metes and bounds the rights and 
her people, and say who shall vote for members of the 
No, sir, the states have ever been left with this power c 
the qualifications of the voters within her limits. 
Mr. G. here read an extract from a paper 1 in the F 
by Mr. Maptson. i 
Here, sir, is the language of Mr. Mapison, she’ fa ! 
constitution, who says that the whole subject of the 
qualification of voters has been left with the states, tha 
the whole power to prescribe the rules to govern the fr 
that their fiat settles the question. He says that | 
no right to interfere, and that the power has been wisel: 
the states. He therefore concluded that we have the : 
make whatever rules upon the subject of the right of suf 
that we should not exercise that power to operate : 
rights of men, nor so that we should become illiberal ar 
We have now free suffrage, let us retain it. Do not let u 
examples of other states who have bound up this inesti 


they have lessened the liberty of their people, have , 
rights. The argument of the gentleman from Ma 
therefore a fallacy, if he (Mr. G.) was right in his 
which was supported by the words of Mr. Mapison 
of the constitution. He would refer the gentleman t 
Rhode Island, and the restrictions placed upon the rig 
there. She was the most illiberal and unjust, in Biot: d 
rights, of all the states in the Union. Te the negro 


leaned, or talented the latter might be. We ae 
example of this state, in placing restrictions upon 


TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 531 


anchise, but for one, he was not desirous of so doing. He was in 
| "favor of encouraging immigration by having the exercise of the 
‘right i in the reach of all. Such had been our policy, and he asked, 
_ would we now leave it to follow the examples, and to adopt the 
maxims of illiberality, bigotry and prejudice, more becoming a 
government of tyrants than of freemen. We want the population. 
_ We want the labor. We want the men to till our soil, those who 
will bring to our aid, the hard hand of labor to develop our 
_ resources in their full beauty and proportion. And unless we do 
so, these men from the adjoining states, and foreign lands, would 
find elsewhere a home, where these privileges would be granted 
them. Mr. G. pursued this subject at length. He alluded to our 
mines, and the vast hidden and undeveloped riches of our state,and 
asked how [we] would restrict immigration of labor to bring them 
forth from their hiding places, and render them of service to our em- 
barrassed state? He thought all such attempts should be frowned 
down. When all our means of wealth could be developed, he 
claimed for Illinois no second place in the Union, but first 
in influence in the affairs of the nation. He could see no evils in 
the past that called for this change. He could not see how our 
liberties had been put in jeopardy during the past, nor how they 
could be for the future. He challenged an instance of any foreign- 
er by birth, who had been less patriotic than the natives, in the 
cause of the state. He claimed the feeling of “love of their native 
land” attributed to foreigners as a sacred, a holy, and an honorable 
feeling, alike a pledge of their patriotism and their human feeling. 
The man who had no such love was a traitor to the feelings of 
humanity, and on his head should be branded the curse of Cain, 
the unmitigated curse of humanity; all fellowship should be denied 
him, and he compelled to associate with the brutes of creation. 
He said the immigrants all made this country and her institutions 
the subject of their thought and study in the domestic circle and 
the family fireside, long before they left their native land. He 
Was not to be told that they tore themselves from their native 
land, the graves of their fathers and the homes of their childhood, 
to come among strangers to dwell, without first having obtained 
knowledge of the character of the government under which they 
were about ta place themselves; nor that, after enjoying our 


ea oi a ake ASN PS eee sei ini 


532 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


freedom, they would be found faithless to the land of 
tion. All experience gave the lie to such a charge. 
never falter in support of our country when they cont 
that they left behind them. Mr. G. then alluded to their 
in the army on the battle field; to their deeds as seamen 
navy, who have aided in bearing the stars and stripes in 
-over every sea. He denied that the founders of our 
tion entertained any such opinion of distrust of foreigne: 
had tried them; they knew their worth in the conflict — 
revolution; they made no distinction between men on act 
a difference of birth; their minds was [sic] as extensive as 
itself, it included every country, clime, and creed. It hac 
shown that their policy was, that this country should bec 
asylum of the brave and the refuge of the oppressed. He 
glowingly to the many signers of the declaration of indep 
who were men of foreign birth. The quotation from Washing 
farewell address in relation to foreign influence was ma 
allusion to the attachment felt by our people towards Fran 
it was'against this he warned them. The name of Wash 
was known and revered everywhere; it was the wat 
liberty in the lips of freemen; the word that tyrants trembl 
hear. He had, during his administration, issued a procle n 
setting a day for general thanksgiving to heaven for 
blessings, and in it he said this country should forever be 
for the oppressed of all nations, and the unfortunate of 
A sentiment worthy of a patriot. This was a sufficient 
those who declare that he considered there was no virt 
what was American. They were asked to place the te 
years, because foreigners could not become, inaless time, a 
with our institutions; this he had answered alre 
intelligence of our immigrants is greatly underrated. H 
some acquaintance with them, and knew many of them 
ally, and had generally found them more learned and 1 
quainted with our institutions than they are represente 
and he ventured to say that if an equal number of th 
placed along side of a number of our natives, chosen in 
nately, that they would not be found to be less acquainted 
spirit of our government than the latter. The gentleman 


oe 


TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 533 


‘azewell supposes them as always ignorant. That member, 
accustomed to all the bigotry of his native state, is as ignorant 
_ of the character of the immigrants to our state, as he supposes 
_ they are of our laws and institutions. Let him but study their 
character a little more, and like an honorable man he will change 
| his opinions. Throw around the elective franchise all sorts of 
' restrictions—criminals and paupers will come to the country, shut 
the doors upon every privilege, say that those who were born here 
shall be the exclusive worshipers at the shrine of liberty—still 
they will come and you cannot prevent them. He alluded to 
the term of probation proposed by “‘Native Americans,” twenty- 
_ one years, and thought that those who contended for five years 
should with consistency advocate the same doctrine; he spurned 
the principles of such a party as unworthy of Americans, and said 
they were advocated by men, who, in five times five years, could 
not have as good a knowledge of our institutions as those immi- 
grants, who come here to dwell, generally acquired in one year. 
He advocated at length the policy which we have heretofore fol- 
lowed—the encouragement, by offering them the greatest induce- 
ments, to settle in this state. He saw no reason to depart from 
it now and turn the tide of immigration to the neighboring states 
who opened to them their lands, their privileges, and admitted 
them on grounds of equality. He wanted not to let those states 
say to the emigrant—“ Avoid Illinois, there the bigotry and preju- 
dice of the “Native American’ spirit burns, it shuts y ou out of all 
the privileges and immunities that belong to freemen, and render|s] 
you as men unworthy of trust or confidence, and deprive[s] you of 
what every man should have—the right of suffrage. Come to us, 
we will give you all these privileges.”’ Will we permit this to be 
said of us? The interests and future prospects of this state 
depend on our answer. He would have the state increase upon 
liberal principles. He would have the world say, as it does now, 
to the immigrant in search of a home—“‘Go to IIlinois—go to the 
prairie state, where you will be taken by the hand of American 
friendship, and welcomed to a full participation in the rights of 
freemen, to which hospitality and liberality she already owes her 
fast increasing wealth and prosperity.” This is what Mr. G. 
desired to have said of the state of Illinois. 


oy" 


Mr. GREENE of Tazewell replied to Va Sues att 
upon the state of Rhode Island.—He had lived there, was ra 
there, and he wanted no information from any New Yorker of 
principles and condition of the people of that state —That s' 
had never known trouble or difficulty until some of these 
Yorkers—one Mr. Slamm, and a ruffian from ‘the penitent 
called Mike Walsh, came there to make laws for her people. - 
would ask them to go there and look at the peace and pro 
of her people, at the well cultured farms and the spirit of indu 
pervading the whole community, and then let them come ai 
tell us something of her condition. Mr. G. was opposed, as | 
had expressed himself before, to extending the right of suffrage to 
foreigners till they had become citizens. He repeated his vie 
of the majority of foreigners who came here to be ignorant 
that none but such, and criminals and paupers, came here at 
Those who were intelligent and industrious remained at 
able to get along there without coming here, 

Mr. BALLINGALL said, that he desired to say a few wor 
upon the question now before them, for he felt much intere 
in its decision. He was not an American by birth, and hops 
that he would be pardoned if he detained the committee wi 
remarks. He would have proposed an amendment similar t 
now pending, had he not been anticipated by the gentleman 
St. Clair. In setting out, he would ask gentlemen, how w ; 
that they denied the constitutionality of allowing foreigners ) 
vote before they became citizens, yet they all were. willing tha: 
those unnaturalized and who were in the state, should be al 
that privilege? Had we not sworn to observe the constitut 
the United States, and if this were a violation of it in one cas 
was also in the other. They might say that those who were. 
had a vested interest; but let them not allow this to weigh d 
their oath; let them not take their oath in one hand and the vested 
interest in the other, and balance them. ‘That same oath is 
by every man who makes an oath of allegiance. = 


ignorant of our laws. Is this the fact generally? No. Th 
be a few, and perhaps some may be found in Chicago, who d , 


PA Aig ce RY Oe eee Pa ee ee Peete ae Some 


“TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 535 


ught that this oath of allegiance is not necessary, but it may be 
per to require it. It was also argued, that they should be here 
years, because they could not understand our institutions ina 
time. Another argument, and used in support of the charge 
c ignorance, was that many came here who did notunderstand our 
language. He was sorry to hear these objections. In the days 
of the revolution, no such objections were urged against foreigners 
y their forefathers, as he had heard to-day by their sons. In 
the it day, they extended to the Canadians, exclusively French, and 
a exclusively Roman Catholic, their arms for aid, and sought from 
the people their assistance—On the other hand, the British 
Ac al applied to the Bishop of Quebec for men and arms, and 
th at prelate replied that the incitement of the people to strife and 
tfare was not the business of the ministers of religion—an 
nple of christian feeling the gentleman from Tazewell might 
y bell follow. In that day the forefathers of the country addressed 
"the people of Ireland— whom that gentleman is so particularly 
_ opposed to—and asked them for support. (Mr. B. read an ex- 
” tract from the address.) Is this the same spirit which has been 
shown here to-day, on this floor by Americans?—Those were the 
_ “times that tried men’s souls.” In the winter of 1775—remark- 
a able for its severity and the privations of the army—there 
was aman from that country, who braved all its perils in the cause 
. of our country and fell before the walls of Quebec. Congress 
sent t to France for a monument to perpetuate his fame and mem- 


i 
* 

ae os 
> 


He said he quoted these instances of foreigners rendering 
ervice to our country, because he wished to show that the fathers 

of the country asked no questions of those who come among them 
as to their birthplace. He alluded to the several signers of the 
‘. de aration of independence who were foreigners, and particularly 
to John Witherspoon, who, like himself, was from the land of 
ot mountains and of flood. There was then no craven tongue come 
forward and bid them stand back, that they could not sign that 
_ instrument, because they drew their first breath in a foreign land. 
a f there were any such here, well might they hang their heads in 


Aix 


PURE FR eT Loe des Sede 


536 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEEN " 


shame. He would call the attention of senelemenet al p 
larly those from Macoupin and Tazewell, to the seventh r 
given in the declaration of independence, why we took up a 
against Great Britain and George the Third: ““He has endeavo 
to prevent the population of these states; for that purpose 
structing the laws of naturalization of foreigners; refusing to p 
others to encourage their migration hither,” &c. These ge 
men know that we have a state larger in territory than Engl 
and Scotland together, and they seek to close the door a 
immigration, by requiring that they shall become citizens bef 
they have a right to exercise the right of suffrage. They are dot 
as did George the Third—when addressed—you are refusing to p 
laws to encourage immigration to our state. He would refe: 
another instance, where a foreigner who was in the ranks o 
army in the days of the revolution seized a tory (an Ameri ic. 
who had been an enemy of his country, and hung him ot 
leafless limb of a tree in the forest, the descendant of that 
(the foreigner) is a delegate upon this floor, [Mr. CAMPBELL 
McDonough] and when the time comes will no doubt vote 
this amendment and say as he does so—‘“‘and this to your 
ory!” ' 

Mr. B. then reviewed the same statutes referred to by 
Greco, and pointed out the several instances where Congress : 
admitted, in the territories, unnaturalized foreigners to the 
of suffrage; and begged such of the legal gentlemen who d 
from him to examine the colonial statutes and they would 
that foreigners were then naturalized on very easy terms. | 
Mapison, in commenting upon this subject says, that th 
sections of the Union which had most encouraged immig 
have increased most rapidly in agriculture, wealth &c. 
then read an extract from one of the letters of Mr. Van Buren 
which that gentleman advocates the introduction of immigr 
as a wholesome restriction upon the rising ae of | 
people. 

In 1812 Congress passed a law entitled “An act to e 
the right of suffrage in the territory of Illinois,” which | 
vided that every free white male person who paid a tax 
had resided here one year should be entitled to vote, &c. 


- 

fi 

: 
% 


TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 537 


men who passed that act took the same oath that we have, and 


i” they did not think they violated the constitution of the United 


States by giving to every one the right to vote, whether citizens 
or not. In 1818 Congress authorized the people of Illinois to 
hold a convention to form a constitution, and prescribed the same 
qualifications of voters for the members of that convention. In 
18i9, that convention met, and they adopted the clause in our 
present constitution, and which was adopted in conformity with 
the spirit and policy of the times, and of the act of Congress of 
1812. That constitution was presented to Congress, and they, 
by the act of 1819, declared that const[i]tution to be “repub- 
lican.” How, then, can gentlemen say that this amendment, 
which is the same in principle with that constitution, is in violation 
of the naturalization law of the United States? He regretted 
that the gentleman from Macoupin, who has heretofore supported 
some of the fundamental principles of democracy, has left us on 
this subject, and he urged that gentleman to reflect, and perhaps 
he might return. He regretted to hear that gentleman ask the 
question, whether the Irish people, now starving and whose eyes 
were turned to the world for bread, took time in their suffering to 
study our institutions before they fled to us for life. The question 
sounded harshly. He would answer the gentleman—that the 
Irish people, when dying for food, when laboring under all the 
privations and suffering of famine, when death was stalking 
through the land and knocking at every door, this country was 
ever uppermost in their thoughts, and cherished as first in their 
heart of hearts! He thought the question a cruel one. As to the 
charge of ignorance of our government because they could not 
understand our language, he would merely say to the member from 
Macoupin that he held in his hand a history of our country, written 
by a learned and talented Italian, which had been approved and 
endorsed by Mr. Jefferson; yet, if that author came here and 
addressed this Convention in the most eloquent terms in his 
native tongue, the member from Macoupin, because he could not 
understand him, would say he was ignorant, and could know 
nothing of our government. (Mr. B. read an extract from a letter 
from the army detailing the death of a learned and most talented 
man who had joined our army, and who was killed in a late battle, 


from Tazewell. He was aged and had a holy calling, but w. 


- were intelligent. But the member from Tazewell ein 


538 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIC 


and who spoke no English.) Tell him not that ‘because a 
cannot speak our language, that therefore he is ignorant! Suc 
doctrine was the very essence of “Native Americanism.” M 
read a letter published in a whig paper in Chicago, givi 
description of the wealth, prosperity, and increase of a Swe: 
settlement in Henry county; and made some remarks upon tl 
exclusion of such immigrants from the state by those arbitrary 
restrictions. He desired no conflict with the reverend membx 


he so far went out of the path of his duty as to connect unnecessa 
a large and most respectable portion of community with crimina 
and paupers, his age would be no protection. He says that. 
foreigners who come here are raised in ignorance of the i institut 
of their own country and of this. He would mention to th 
member the fact that an American, born in Massachusetts, nam 
John Copely, left his native land and by pandering to the p 
of Great Britain had risen to the office of Lord Chancellor of 
kingdom. When the question of Ireland and her Ble ee ee, 


“aliens in blood, and aliens in religion,” he dared not say they we 
ignorant—the thunders of catholic emancipation taught him 


English lord. He pronounces them aliens in blood and alien 
understanding. He never thought, when he saw that memb 
kneeling at morning hour, praying for peace and harmony thr 
out the state and in this Convention, that before the sun wo 
have gone down at eve he would rise here and pour out his venc 
upon a class of our population, many of whom are vastly 
superior. Mr. B. read numerous extracts from Native Ame 
constitutions and petitions, and applied their doctrines t 
language of the reverend gentleman. He thought it wa: 
same doctrine of the alien and sedition laws. It might be 
that he—a foreigner by birth—should not have addressed 
committee on this subject; he would answer them as did anotl 
on a similar question. Mr. B. read the conclusion of a gj 
made by Hon. R. D. Owen, when attacked, for opening the 
on the tariff, as a foreigner. And concluded by stating that 


_ TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 539 


his fellow men, perhaps he would to those of his God. He then 
_read from the Bible the following: 

F “And if a stranger sojourn with thee in the land, ye shall not 
vex him. 

; “But the stranger that dwel/leth with you, shall be unto you 
a ‘as one born among you; and you shall love him as thyself; for ye 
"were strangers in the land of Egypt; I am the Lord your God.” 
_ Mr. HURLBUT pleaded guilty to the charge of being an 
% American, but not to that of entertaining the narrow principles 
_ of “Native Americans.” He thought the cause of Native Ameri- 
"can associations was to be traced to such remarks as had fallen 
_ from the lips of the gentleman, who had just sat down. He 
_ reviewed the constitutional arguments of the gentleman, and 
_ denied a precedent out of Illinois, where a man not a citizen was 
entitled to vote. In the state of South Carolina the constitution 
_ said “every free white man”—words more comprehensive than 
even those in our constitution, and yet no one ever presumed that 
_ any person could exercise the privilege but a citizen. He thought 
the argument was used only by those to whom it was necessary 
ia that the amendment should be adopted. He scorned the address- 
ing of foreign voters as “Irishmen,” &c., and had told his people 
4 he knew them not as such. But in other places it was different. 


“3 He would inquire of gentlemen if there were no frauds upon the 
ah elective franchise on the line of the canal? If men had not been 
a run by wagon loads from Joliet to Chicago, and voting at every 
poll on the road? 

a Mr. GREGG said, he never heard any such thing. 


~ w, 


_ Mr. HURLBUT replied that he himself knew nothing of it; 
he only had heard the representative in Congress from that dis- 


= 
“+ 


4 trict (WENTWORTH) say so, and there were many others here who 
__ had heard him say the same thing. He claimed that if foreigners 
_ fought for us in the revolution, that there was a balance of account, 
Gs because it was they who fought against us. If the numbers 
__were weighed it would be found that the latter were largely in 
‘f the majority. He had never heard before of the sentiment 
_ attributed to Mr. Van Buren, that had been mentioned by the 
‘ member from Cook. If that gentleman ever used the sentiment, 
Pas and it was known throughout the land, then he was not surprised 
Ms, 

a - 

as 


He considered it jmahidarble for any furcveaeml to bene eke. 
ed with our institutions and government, without a long resid 


in high stations in Europe in relation to our aL! 
denied that the common people knew any thing of our system o 
government. Mr. H. occupied much time in answering sever 
arguments made by those who had preceded him in sup 
of the amendment, and closed by stating he vote vote for 
section as reported by the committee. a 
Mr. BOSBYSHELL moved the committee rise, and that com- 
mittee rose. 
The Convention then adjourned till 3 Pp. m. 


AFTERNOON 


The Convention resolved itself into committee of the w 
and resumed the subject under consideration in the forenoon. 

Mr. COLBY said, he, too, was an American, but if he 
that would be no reason why he would deny to men not s 
birth, the same rights and privileges he enjoyed. He wo 
not take Rhode Island as his polar star. That state had a prop er 
qualification, which was to him sufficiently odious without goin; 
farther. Shall we take that state as a polar star where th 
imprison a man for expressing his opinion? He thought 1 
He had travelled in that state, but he had seen farms as well 
vated here as there. He denied the allegation that our ft 
population was the sweepings of the poor houses and prisons. | 
had found among them men as intelligent as anywhere else. J 
C. replied to the remarks of Mr. Hurizur and denied any kno 
edge of frauds at elections on the canal line. He would vote | 
the amendment. co 

Mr. THORNTON argued against the power of this 
to pass any law allowing foreigners the right of suffrage. — 
thought such was unconstitutional and challenged a le 


44A longer account of Hurlbut’s speech may be found in the San 
Journal, August 5. %; 


TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 541 


ours, yet they have never interpreted it as we have. He would 
vote against the amendment. 

Mr. ARCHER had been induced from the continued com- 
plaints of danger to be apprehended in case we allowed foreigners 
this privilege, to look into the subject, and after giving it the 


closest scrutiny could discover none. The history of the past 


taught us no such thing. He agreed with those who had said no 
danger was to be apprehended from men who sought a home and 
refuge from oppression, or from those who loved the land of their 
birth. He, too, argued that foreigners before they came here 
made our institutions the object of their study, and were not so 
ignorant as represented. He advocated the extension of this priv- 
ilege as an inducement for them to bring to us their wealth and 
their labor, and thought it was our best policy to encourage them 


_ to come there, to develop the resources of the state. He took 


up the constitutional question and argued for some time in favor 
of the power of the state to control the exercise and regulate 
the qualifications necessary to the exercise of the right of suffrage. 
He attributed the Native American associations not tosuchremarks 
as had been made there, but to the spoils of office. Such was the 
case in New York, where they held power but for one year. He 
alluded to the many illustrious foreigners who had rendered 
acknowledged services to the country, and closed by urging the 
most extensive liberality to the people of the whole world. Mr. A. 
spoke for nearly an hour, and we regret that we are precluded 
from giving his remarks at length. 

Mr. McCALLEN addressed the committee, in a speech of 
more than an hour and a quarter, upon the subject, and touched 
upon every imaginable point involved in the question. He dis- 
cussed it constitutionally and politically; as a question of right 
and wrong to the native citizen, and on grounds of expediency, 
and finally as a party question. He replied to all who had pre- 
ceded him, and anticipated those to follow. He read from several 
documents, in his possession, opinions of the fore-fathers of the 
country in opposition to foreigners, and finally took the ground 
that they were not the most desirable population as citizens, and 
not to be tolerated at all as voters, when unnaturalized. In the 
course of his remarks, when alluding to the member from Cook, 


542 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL CO 
he denounced the right of any man of foreign t 


of his country, to teach Americans what was pice 

Mr. BALLINGALL. Do you intend to say, ae 
here from any such cause? 

Mr. McCALLEN. I said perhaps. Ana 

Mr. BALLINGALL. I then say to you, bi that 
gentleman. 

Mr. McCALLEN. I can take that. I can ere 
you, who have shown so much bravery as to attack a 
headed man who cannot defend himself. 

Mr. SCATES addressed the Convention in an 
upon the constitutionality of the amendment, and was 
that the states had a clear and unquestionable power to 
the elective franchise—a right expressly conferred by 
section of the second article of the constitution. We : 
limits will not allow its insertion. ey 

Mr. WILLIAMS made a few remarks against the ¢ ex] 
of the amendment. 

And the committee rose, and the Convention adjour 


[Mr. THORNTON said* he ar not as yet participate 
debate, and he did not now propose to do more than ve 
to present a few of the reasons which would induce him to 
the report of the committee, and to oppose the aie 3.) 
gentleman from St. Clair. 

Notwithstanding the trivial manner in which ie constit 

ng 
question had been treated, it did seem to him that t 
constitutional question involved in the proposition. A 
specific powers granted to Congress was this; that Congr 
have power to pass a uniform law of naturalization. Some 
men had contended that the second section of the first ar 
the Constitution of the United States, which provides ti 
electors in each State, for members of Congress, “ ‘shall 
qualifications requisite for electors of the most numer br 
of the ‘State legislature,’’ deprives the National Legisl aes 


This account of the afternoon’s debate is taken from t 
Journal, August 5. 


OE ONE ee ee Fea ON CET IT gn eg on tae 


y 


TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 543 


all power, in fixing the qualifications of electors. According 
" tosuch a construction, it seemed to him that the power granted to 
Congress, to pass an uniform law of naturalization, is a mere nul- 
Bt lity. What is the meaning of the term, Naturalization? It is the 
"investing an alien with the privileges of a native citizen. The 
"right of suffrage is one of the most inestimable privileges of the 
- free citizens of this country. It may be said to be his birth-right. 
But, sir, it is mot the birth-right of the alien. The power, then, 
to pass a law of naturalization has been conferred upon, and exer- 
_ cised by, Congress. There is no other authority in the country 
_ to pass a similar law. If there was, there would be no uniformity 
_ in this matter; there would be no safety to the country or its 
institutions. Michigan or Maine might require only a residence 
_ of one day, to entitle a man to vote; and thus, an influx of aliens 
_ from Canada might determine the election of President of the 
y United States. The States, in their sovereign capacity, may 
' impose additional restrictions, upon the alien, to those imposed 
_ by Congress; but they have not, and ought not to possess, the 
¢ _ power to prescribe any rule that would counteract and destroy 
_ the effect and operation of a law of Congress passed under an 
% express grant of power. 
_ But, sir, the alien, until he is naturalized, cannot be made 
amenable to our laws. He cannot be tried for treason;—he cannot 
' be compelled to take up arms in defence of the country. Are 
gentlemen willing to confer upon foreigners rights and privileges 
_ superior to those enjoyed by native citizens? Do they wish the 
- foreigner to share in all the d/essings of our government, when he 
etait be made to bear some of the urdens? Gentlemen may 
__ say that the alien is prompted by as high and noble motives, and 
__ by the same patriotism, to rally under the banner of the country 
as the native citizen. Well, sir, admit that he enters into the 
_ service with zeal; still, the fact is unquestionable that he cannot 
be forced to take up arms in defense of the country, until he is 
naturalized. Instances occurred during the last war with Great 
y . Britain, of persons who had been resident in this country for 
x twenty or thirty years, and who were drafted to serve a short 
a eePsien in defense of the country during the war, who refused 
_to serve—upon the ground that they were not citizens of the 


544 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC 


country—and they were onda by the courts, Yaa ‘sl 
no penalty for their refusal. Is i it right or just, twats our | 


franchise when you cannot make them amenable to the awe 
There is a question of policy involved in this ea wh 


zation laws of the Pannery even if there were no constitut 
barrier. What are the statistics of immigration? I notic 
recent accounts, that there have landed, at New York alo 
between January and June of this year, eighty odd thousand 1 imn 
grants; and this number will, probably, be doubled before th 
close of the year! And how many are there that land at all th 
other ports of the United States? The whole number who I 
upon our shores, during a single year, cannot be less than four or 
five hundred thousand. Are all these people to be turned loose 
upon us, and permitted to enjoy the right of suffrage—as they 
be, if this amendment prevails? Would not a residence of fi 
years—by enabling them to become somewhat. acquainted wi 
our§institutions—fit them a little more to exercise the nig 
suffrage properly? 


noblest feelings of our nature, possesses. This allusion 1 is enti 
against the proposition which the gentleman advocated. 
the very reason that such a feeling does exist, I am in f. 


ed with, and attached to, our peculiar form of government. — 
sir, I would ask, if all of those 4 or 500,000 immigrants, wh« 
annually brought to this country, are imbued with feelings 
for the country of their adoption—are they actuated by tl 
noble and exalted motives, in coming here, which gentlemen hi 
attributed to them? No man feels a higher pleasure, a gr 
veneration, for the names of Lafayette and those other ga 
spirits who participated in the Revolutionary struggle. Ai 


Per eee le eh) eee tere 


TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 545 


there are foreigners now in this country who came here for the 
_ purpose of making it their home—their asylum from oppression; 
but these feelings do not operate on all who are cast upon us. I 
recollect a remark that was made by a distinguished Peer in the 
- British Parliament, a few years ago. He recommended to turn 
. loose upon us, from the prisons of Europe, a swarm of felons, for 
"the purpose of undermining our free institutions; as he regarded 
it as utterly hopeless to attempt to subvert them in any other way. 
‘Sir, aliens are not influenced, in coming here, by those pure feel- 
” ings of love for the institutions of this country which have been 
4 attributed to them. I do not, I cannot, believe that the foreign- 
ers who come here—many of them, at least —are induced to come 
from the exercise of a deliberate choice, or from motives of attach- 
6 ment to this country. The native American, it is stated by gentle- 
men, is here merely “dy accident!’’ There is, to my mind, a double 
_ meaning in this expression. The foreigner, has patriotism to 
animate him, while the American is merely here by accident. 
_ The American, then, is not influenced by that pure and exalted 
_ love of country which the foreigner feels! I really cannot harbor 
such a sentiment as this; a sentiment, abhorrent to every native 
citizen. 
{[Mr. GREGG. If the gentleman imputes to me such a senti- 
ment, he is entirely mistaken. I do not deny that the native 
_ American is influenced by patriotism. I attribute patriotism to 
all alike.] 
. Mr. THORNTON: I do not refer to the gentleman. The 
remark was made, I believe, by another gentleman from Cook, 
_ that the American was here by accident. It was to this senti- 
_ ment to which I was adverting. I cannot believe for a moment, 
_ that all this large influx of foreign immigration is governed by such 
feelings. I have seen too much of them in the large cities of the 
ii to believe this. I have as much respect for foreigners as 
-anyman. I am as willing to welcome them here—as willing that 
they should find a home and an asylum here, as any man; but I 
am unwilling to pandertothem. All that the foreigner can we all 
_ that anyone can reasonably ask for him, is, that he shall be re- 
_ quired to live a few years in this country, in order to lose some of 
_ his attachment to the home of his birth, and take some slight 


¥ 


‘ 


must permit negroes to vote. But I protest against a yo 


546 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION: 


interest in our institutions, before he shall have a voice in t 
ment of laws, in the election of officers of government; | 
shall have the power to upturn, if you please, that repul 
government under which we have lived for nearly a centu: 

Some gentlemen have alluded to the fact that foreigner 
taxed, and have contended that they should therefore be al 
the right of suffrage. Now, I would ask the gentleman if fen 
and minors who have property, are not taxed, and whether 
are prepared, in carrying out their doctrine, to permit 
and minors to vote? I ask is this doctrine correct, that e 
that is taxed should be allowed the right of suffrage? If s 50, 


doctrine. I donot believe that it has any bearing on this q stic 
We do not determine the principle of the right of suffrage in a 
way. The gentleman again says that if we adopt the rep 
the committee, and require aliens to be naturalized before z 
shall be allowed to exercise the elective franchise, we requi: 
than is required by some of the adjoining States, and will | 
immigration into this State. The constitution of Ohio h 
guage somewhat similar to that of our own, yet foreign 
required to be naturalized before they are permitted to e 
right of suffrage in that State. I do not, and cannot conce! 
that we shall prevent an influx of population at all by rest 
the rights of suffrage in this way. Every State in the 
except Illinois and Ohio, has this restriction, and requires 
before a man is allowed to vote, he shall be a citizen of the L 
States. If the restriction will have the effect of preventing in 
gration now, why would it not have had that influence b 
Why are we to suppose that the action of this convent 
reference to this question, will go across the ocean ‘anc & 


amongst us, when the same restriction has existed in ere 
and has not had the effect of preventing immigration in 
States? Such assertions ought to have no weight in the 
of this question. It is a question of vital importance; one w 
we should determine without regard to party. And I do 
to see the indication of so much party feeling in relation 
I represent on this floor a very strongly democratic county, 


TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847 547 


say here, that I do not know the solitary man in my county, either 
native or of foreign birth, who is not willing to have this clause 
bs in the constitution as reported by the committee. It is no party 
' question in my county. The people are unanimous in requiring 
that those who come to this State after the adoption of this con- 
' stitution, shall be naturalized according to the laws of Congress, 
before they shall enjoy the elective franchise. But gentlemen 
ask, why not carry the restriction to those already in the States? 
It should not be done for a very good reason, to my mind; because, 
to restrict those who have been invited here under the existing 
laws, would be a violation of an implied pledge to them that they 
should be allowed to enjoy the privileges, which the laws as they 
_ existed, at the time when they came into the State, afforded them. 
I for one, however, have always believed that the enactment of 
those laws was wrong, and that the construction given to the 
constitution was wrong; but that construction having been given 
to it, and those laws having been passed, it would be a violation 
of a pledge to deprive them of a right which we have already 
extended to them. For that reason I should be unwilling to 
impose any restrictions upon those who are already in the State. 
But I do hope that the report as it came from the committee will 
_be adopted, and that all aliens who come into the State hereafter, 
will be required to comply with the naturalization laws of the 
United States, before they are permitted to enjoy the right of 
suffrage. 

Mr. WOODSON gave notice that he would henceforth insist 
upon the enforcement of the rule which had been adopted for 
limiting the speeches to thirty minutes. 

Mr. McCALLEN next addressed the committee, in opposition 
to the amendment. He contended that the power had _ been 

_ conferred upon Congress by the constitution of the United States, 
to pass laws for the naturalization of foreigners, and that the several 
States had no right to contravene those laws. He reviewed the 
arguments of the gentleman who advocated the propriety of con- 
ferring the privilege of exercising the elective franchise, without 
a compliance with the requisitions of the laws of Congress, and 
replied to them, contending for the necessity of adhering to the 
terms of naturalization prescribed in that law. It had been 


country in a few months. It was too ee the case 
votes were thrown into the market, and purchased by th 
bidder. It had been asserted by the gentleman from Browr 
one of the gentlemen from Cook, that seine . ae privi 


_ ductive of no bad results, and that the extension of thes 
leges could not be productive of injury. He would refer t 
the scenes that had taken nts at Pi What 


as had been Ee here to-day? Did it not pioeeudt 
encroachments which were being made by foreigners 1 
rights of American citizens? 
Mr. GREGG. I ask the gentleman if religious bias 
not something to do with it? 
Mr. McCALLEN. I ask you, sir, if fanaticism, suc 
been preached here to-day, had no more to do with it? 
Mr. GREGG. I say no, in reply. “ 
Mr. McCALLEN. And I say no, in reply to the gen e 
enquiry. . 
It has been reserved, continaad Mr. McCatten, ‘Ge s 
with such towering minds and magnanimous feelings as 
the gentleman from Brown, and the gentleman from 
make this discovery. 
Mr. McCALLEN proceeded to state instances of th ich 
use made of the influence of party men over the votes of f 
employed on the public works. He himself had been tt 
with the destruction of his prospects in case he refused to pe 
the unholy appetite of political gamblers. He was no 
to foreigners. He was as friendly to their welfare as wer 
who prated so much about their privileges. Every drop: ( 
which flowed in his veins had its origin in the land ‘ah the 


TUESDAY, JULY 27, 1847. 549 


the land of the shamrock. But, (unfortunately for him 
ording to the gentleman’s showing) those from whom he 
lescended emigrated to this country previous to the Revolution- 
y war. Some of the blood of his ancestors had watered the tree 
liberty. The gentleman from Cook was more fortunate in not 
eing born in America; he was fresh and verdant from the soil of 
urope. » 

Mr. GREGG. Does the gentleman allude to me? 

Mr. McCALLEN. I allude to one of the gentlemen from 
‘ook. 

_ Mr.GREGG. Does the gentleman mean me, when he speaks 
of the gentleman from Cook? 

_ Mr. McCALLEN. I mean Mr. Batiinca.t. 

_ Mr.BALLINGALL. 1 ask the gentleman if he does not think 
that thirteen years residence is not sufficient to give a man some 
claim to citizenship? 

Mr. McCALLEN. The gentleman may think for himself as 
“he pleases; but he must not think that because he was born in 
Treland or Scotland, he can come here and teach me what the 
_ institutions of my country are!—that he can teach those who have 
_ been born and nurtured upon the soil—those who have been 
_ dandled on the lap of American mothers! Such men are not to 
be taught patriotism, by those who are recently from a country 
_ governed by despotism. I know not what the motives are that 
_ brought them here—perhaps it was love for the institutions of the 
_ country—perhaps they came here for bread—and perhaps the 
_ gentleman himself may have come here as a refugee from the 
_ insulted dignity of the laws of his country. 

_ Mr. BALLINGALL. Does the gentleman mean to assert 
that? 

: Mr. McCALLEN. I say, perhaps, sir. 

_ Mr. BALLINGALL. I say to you, sir, that you are no gentle- 
man! 

_ Mr. McCALLEN. Well, sir, I can take that from a man who 
ay has no feelings in common with Americans, and a man who has 
_ no more bravery than to attack an old, venerable, gray-headed 
_ gentleman, who, from his peculiar position in society cannot 


by defend himself. 


55° 


The CHAIRMAN [rapping the desk with his : 
thirty minutes have expired. 
Cries of ‘‘go on’’—‘‘go on’’—“‘go on’’—from all Sitee 
Mr. BALLINGALL. This is a question of great magnit 
Other gentlemen have spoken their hour, and I hope th 
gentleman will be so ungracious as to call for the enforcem 
the half hour rule. I hope the gentleman will be permit te 
proceed with his remarks. : 
Renewed cries of ‘ ‘proceed’ ’— “proceed” : 
Mr. McCALLEN. I was remarking, sir, that it came 
very bad grace from a mere stripling, a foreigner, to ma 
attack upon, and ascribe motive to a venerable gentleman - 
this floor; to charge him with being actuated by motives 
blackest and deepest corruption, when he knew that fre 
position in society, he could not defend himself. I ask him 
there is anything gentlemanly in conduct like that? When : 
aspersions were thrown out, I felt in duty bound to defend the 
aged gentleman. I have now done. a 
It has been asserted here, by the gentleman from Coal 
large portion of the army, now battling in Mexico, are f 
Does the gentleman know anything of the organization 
regular army in time of peace? Is it motives of patriotis 
which actuate men to enter the army? No man of en 
character, or who is a very valuable citizen, will enlist. 
chiefly those who desire to get a living without work. An 
have these foreigners conducted themselves? Why, sir, it is 
that they have deserted to the enemy by fifties and hundre 
Mr. McCALLEN proceeded at considerable length 
madvert upon the arguments of gentlemen on the opposite 
On motion of Mr. Geppes the committee rose, has 
gress, and had leave to sit again. 
Convention adjourned.] 


‘ a ae 


XL. WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 


_ Prayer by Rev. Mr. Fintey. 

~ Leave of absence for eight days was granted to Messrs Bonn, 
RDING, Moore and Huston, and for fourteen days to Mr. 
cHaTron. 
The Meee bon solved inclf into committee of the whole; 
[tlhe report of the committee on Elections and Right of 
frage—Mr. Harvey in the chair. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG said, that he was in favor of the amend- 
t proposed by the gentleman from St. Clair. This was a 


4 Iwanted the provision as in the old Eeasrtetcens and the whigs 
"wanted citizenship. The report of the committee was no com- 
ae it carried it up to the 5 years. The amendment was the 
_ compromise. He was the representative of no party or faction, 
he came from his county without opposition. But there were no 
_ whigs there, who required the time to be extended to five 
years. The people were big with vengeance at our protracted 
| "session, and unless we were careful in what provisions we made, 
_ our new constitution will never see day-light. The member from 
_ Boone said that our representative in Congress told him that 
_ wagon loads of foreigners were carried from poll to poll, and voted, 
‘ over and over,.at one election. This is strange; no one who lives 
in that region, ever heard of it. It either shows our member of 
¥ Congress has said in a joke what was not so, or, that he was a 
_ fool in selecting a confident [sic] from the whig party, and the 
# gentleman from Boone in particular. 
_ Mtr. A. alluded warmly to the high character of the foreigners 
who had settled in our state, and mentioned an incident that 
ae on the canal. A gentleman from this city came ae 


554 


552 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLL 1 
—who was none other than Cou. BAKER. ‘He: 


(Mr. McCa..en,) and wondered that the people, aha 2 
elevated virtue, had permitted them to remain in obscu 
He asked if the mobs in Philadelphia, and in Massachusetts, 
the result of a six months’ qualification? He thought we s 
remember the Massac and Hancock affairs, before we spo 
riots and bloodshed. 

Mr. BOSBYSHELL then addpenced the Convention at 
length. We are reluctantly compelled to condense his intere 
remarks. He advocated a liberal policy towards foreign 
approved of the present system. He defended foreigne 
aspersions cast upon them and insisted that they were 
industrious and useful citizens. He said that he was in fa 
coming as near as possible to universal suffrage. He f 
allow native or naturalized citizens to vote within three mo: 
after coming into the State, and he would allow foreigners t 
within a year or two after declaring their intention to b 
citizens. 

Mr. PRATT said, he felt it incumbent upon him to 
himself in a position before the Convention, where the 
which would govern his vote might not be misunderstood. 
understood the report of the committee to require a resi 
of five years, and citizenship of the United States; he und 
the amendment to require a residence of one year, and ar 
of allegiance, and of intention to become a citizen. Both pi 
tions recognize the necessity of restrictions. The question, 
was merely one of time. He was unwilling that his democ 
friends should force him into a position of being acting wi 
“Native Americans”—who desire to exclude foreigners et 
The principles of “Native Americans” exclude foreigners en 
and draw an invidious distinction between men, on account of 
accident of birth. He was unwilling to be forced into such a 
of persons, who hold this narrow-minded doctrine. The que 
was then, one of time, for he admitted the power of the sta 
regulate the exercise of the elective franchise. Time was essen 
to a knowledge of our institutions, and the working of our go 
ment. The longer that time, the greater the knowledge wo 


ee ee eR yg, OM oe Gee RR mere era ek /eat ay 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 553 


: therefore, it was incumbent upon those who advocated 
"one year, to establish that that time is sufficient. It would appear, 
from the view of the case, that the longer time would be the better, 
yet no man had come forward before this Convention, to establish, 
_ by facts and figures, or by a comparison of man with man, that one 
_ year is as sufficient to acquire the necessary knowledge of our in- 
_ stitutions, as five years would be. Now who are these foreigners? 
_ They who come here, may be divided into three classes:—The 
_ first, those who come here with a hatred for a monarchy—and 
such a form of government—a hatred for the despotisms of the old 
world, and who left there in consequence of persecution. The 
gentlemen from Cook and St. Clair are of this class; but they- 
are very few in number. The second class, are those who leave 
their country to better their condition in a pecuniary manner, 
and not for any love of liberty, or our government; men who would 
as soon go to Asia as to come here, if the same facilities to wealth 
were open to them. Scotch and Irish merchants, who, after 

they have made a fortune, return to their native land. The third, 

and most numerous class, are those who have at home, known 

nothing but want and privations, and who have not the means of 

subsistence. They come here to gain that subsistence, and they 
__ are generally men of a lower social position, and of less education 
than those of the other classes. Their purpose in coming 
here is to gain a subsistence, and for the first two or three years 
they have neither time nor inclination to learn American manners, 
_ American principles, American laws and American institutions. 
_ Yet it has been gravely argued that in one year they can and do 
_ become acquainted with our constitution; and he asked if such 
was not an absurdity onits face.—This admitting them to the 
right of voting after one year’s residence, gave them the power 
to neutralize the votes of American citizens. Did it not degrade 
’ an American citizen to give to an alien the power to neutralize his 
_ vote? and that too, by men who exercise the privilege by guess 
work. It had been asked where was the evil result in the past 
history of the state, owing from this provision—He would answer 
_ them in one case. We are in debt, the result of a ruinous and 
extravagant speculation in internal improvements. That debt 
__ has been increased by an obstinate continuance in them after the 


their votes have been and are now always given for men Ge e 
to vote for a continuance of the canal, which is of no possi 
benefit, except to these foreigners—The Philadelphia riots. 
been spoken of, and the destruction of property and of chur 
Who does not know that foreigners provoked these riots? a pa 
of men—American citizens—had assembled together to petit 
Congress for a repeal of the naturalization laws—a wrong policy 
but they had the right so to assemble. They were set upon, broke 
in upon and interrupted by foreigners who were opposed to tl 
object of the meeting; and the first bloodshed was the result o 
this execrable and detestable interference by the foreigners. T 
Americans had a right to assemble, and on these foreigners w 
attacked them rests the consequence of the bloodshed and violen: 
that ensued in that city. 
The question now before them was one of mere ‘expedioneys — 
one of time. Ohio had three foreigners to one that we ha 
and yet she has the same provision in her constitution th 
proposed by the committee. So with Indiana. In Wisconsin a 
provision similar to this amendment had been inserted in the « 
stitution, and the people rejected it. He would ask gentlemen toe 
go to Europe, and into some country where the language spok ef 
was different from ours, and what means have the people th 
acquiring a knowledge of our institutions? And yet the majority 
of the English, Irish, and German emigrants, without the natura 
advantages of intuitively understanding our institutions, we 
brought here and placed upon the same broad platform of ¢ eqi 
rights and privileges, and they were given the exercise of the 
of suffrage in common with American citizens. Was this ri 
He had no confidence in this doctrine of intuitive knowledge. 
desired, by voting for five years, to benefit the foreigner and 
to injure him. He desired to make them become citizens, or 
would have the scenes again that we had witnessed two years 
in Jo Daviess. He had seen men there who had been residents 
this state for years, and who had gone over to lowa and a 
to exercise the right of suffrage, but they were refused beca’ 
they were not citizens. They enjoyed the right of voting here 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 555 


and had not thought of becoming citizens. It was said that the 
tree of liberty had been planted here, and that its branches were 
me to extend over the world; this he did not oppose, but he wanted 
guardians to be placed near it to protect it from abuses. 
a Mr. SHERMAN said, he was born in Connecticut where they 
_ had a property qualification, and not being blessed with the 
qualification, had felt the oppression of any restriction upon the 
right of suffrage. He opposed any restriction; but if we were to 
place any, he thought the term proposed by the amendment— 
one year—fully sufficient. He would refer to the north part of the 
state. It was their pride that it was fast filling up by immigrants, 
the majority of whom were foreigners, and he asked, why not 
encourage them to come on, to bring their money here and buy 
our land? There was scarcely an immigrant coming into the 
state who did not purchase a farm of from 40 to 200 acres, and 
then commenced paying taxes upon it. The immigration this 
year, he had been informed, was of the best kind. He alluded to 
the patriotism of the foreigners, and stated the fact that four-fifths 
of the two Chicago companies was composed of foreigners. He 
denied the charges of fraud in the elective franchise by foreigners, 
stated by the member from Boone, and informed the member from 
Jo Daviess that they had uniformly voted against the “canal 
ticket” on the line of that work. 

Mr. BROCKMAN advocated, in a speech of considerable 
length, the adoption of the amendment.—He repelled the various 
charges of incompetency from ignorance, and want of patriotism 
on the part of the foreign population. We have a full report of 
Mr. B.’s remarks, but cannot insert them today. 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac said, this question had been fully 
discussed, and he desired not to detain the committee. But as 
he was chairman of the committee which had reported this section 
he desired to express the reasons which had governed him in so 
doing. There was a difference in opinion in the committee on 

this subject. He was opposed to that portion of the report now 
under discussion. There were six in favor of it and five opposed 
to it. It was argued in committee, and they could not agree. 


\ 


46 A longer account of this speech by Pratt may be found in the Sangamo 
Journal, August 12. 


He did not think it necessary for him to argue ‘that he stat 
the power to control and regulate the exercise of the e 
franchise, that was too plain a proposition to require 
argument. He read from Story’s Commentaries, and s d 
the matter was settled. Mr. D. followed the question, 
usual warmth, through all its points, and argued that it w: 
just and politic for the state of Illinois to adopt the ame 
Mr. BUTLER discussed the question to a considerable 
but our space will not permit us to report his speech. He 
the matter home to the whigs, and showed that from that qr 
alone came the opposition to the right of foreigners having a 
in our elections. He contended that the best interests « 
state should prompt us to give them the right of suffrage 
shortest possible time, after filing their declaration to 
citizens, and that while we impose upon them the burd ns 
government, we should not so far forget the dictates of justi 
the rights of man, as to refuse to extend to them its immuni 
privileges. That he considered this a party question. T 
had made it, and [he] was free to acknowledge that while. 
upon principle, he acted as a party man in this respect. — Tha 
belonged to a party which he took pride in saying was foun 
upon principle, and it was impossible for him, or any other | = 


than as a party man to this extent, gentlemen’s declarati ) 
contrary notwithstanding. 

Messrs. TurnBuLt and Davis of Montgomery foll 
opposition. i 

Mr. WHITESIDE offered, as an cmichaea to be! 
the amendment, the following; which was accepted . 
Roman: 

“And provided further, that if such inhabitant “gh Ne 
perfect citizenship according to the laws of the United 
at the earliest practicable period after declaration of in 
then the elective franchise shall cease until citizenship sha 
been perfected.” 


ai 
_ for this change, and will not be satisfied with a silent vote. We 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 557 


Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess opposed the modification and 
hoped that it would be withdrawn, because he did not see how 
our constitution could be made so as to compel foreigners to perfect 
their naturalization. The question properly before us is, shall we 


admit them to the right of suffrage, or deny it. If we give them 


the privilege, it is not competent for us, at the expiration of five 
years, to say to them—you shall have this right nolonger. He did 
not intend, after his opening address a few days ago, to detain the 
committee by making a speech. He regretted that those who 
opposed the extension of this privilege had not come forward with 
the reasons for this change in our policy, and for their silent vote 
upon this question. The people desired argument and reasons 


want in our state an increase in our laboring population, and when 
gentlemen refuse to give their reasons for their silent vote, by 


_ which they cut off an inducement for that class to migrate here, 


we must conclude that behind that silent vote is hid some secret 
party intention. We want the men among us to do hard labor. 
It is said that we have in ourselves the means of developing our 


resources, and that to protect our own citizens we must exclude 


the foreigners. There is no competition in labor. There is no 
competition here for the privilege of laboring in our state. 

It was unpleasant to him to be obliged to refer to the remarks 
made by his colleague this morning.—He would merely state a 


fact in relation to the opinions of that gentleman, before the 


meeting of this Convention, which would not be denied, if it were, 


it would be a denial of truth. Before the election we rode out 


from Galena to a place called Vinegar Hill, where there were some 
60 or 70 foreigners at work. After entering into conversation 
with them upon the subjects that would come before the Conven- 
tion, this subject of the right of suffrage came before us, and that 
gentleman told them that he was in favor of foreigners, after aresi- 


_ denceof one year, and a declaration of intention to become acitizen, 


a 


pra! 


Wy 


; 


- 


to be admitted to the exercise of the elective franchise. And the 


good faith with which he carried out that pledge has been shown 
here this morning. 

Mr. C. said that he had challenged gentlemen to maint out 
the dangers to be apprehended from foreigners coming amongst 


558 


us. The member from Montgomery read to us some fra 
of a letter of Washington, found by him in the torn oe 
Bian “Native American” newspaper. 


devil always quoted scripture, and if he could do “9 w. 
that party quote isolated remarks of Washington and Jef 
and sustain the most contemptible doctrines? He hated 
very name of “Native American.” Native American! He 
horred and despised the very name. Go to yon city in the 
look at the lofty spires and towering domes erected to the h 
and glory of God, torn down, desecrated, and reduced to a: 
and my colleague justifies this! God and his religion torn down 
trampled to the earth—and it meets with justification, 
from such a source! Mr. C. addressed the committee at m 
length in support of the amendment, and upon the good ch 
of our foreign residents. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery replied, and passed an 
upon the Illinois volunteers. : 


[Mr. DAVIS, of Massac said,“” it was necessary that he sh 
explain the position which he occupied in regard to the repo 
The committee were divided, and although every effort was r 
to produce a reconcilement of opinion, it was found utterly 
possible for them to agree. The division on the report w 
to four, and he was finally instructed by the majority of th 
mittee to make the report in the form in which it had been p 
sented to the convention. It may be thought strange, put 
Mr. Davis, that I have come in here with this report whil 
entertain opinions adverse to it. There is but one single pr 
osition, however, involved in it, which does not meet my 
and cordial approbation, and that is the proposition which 
elicited so much discussion, and which is now under considera 


b 
47This account of the speeches of Davis, Butler, Campbell, and oth 
taken 22 the Sangamo Journal, August 12. 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 559 


It has been contended that a State of this confederacy has no 


_ the general government to establish rules on the subject of natural- 
_ ization,) to fix the qualification of electors. This is a proposition 
Be < which is so palably wrong as not in my opinion to need discussion; 
but although it is clearly wrong, and has ever been so held, yet 
I will enter very briefly into its discussion, and will produce 
authority to sustain my position. It never has been pretended, I 
believe, sir, that in consequence of conferring by the several States, 
in the constitution of the United States, upon the Federal Govern- 
ment the power to establish an uniform rule of naturalization, 
that therefore a State has no right to fix the qualification of electors. 
I will here read an authority in point. I read from Story’s Com- 
___ mentaries: 
%, **There is no pretence to say, that the power in the national 
~ ‘‘government can be used, so as to exclude any State from its 
“share in the representation in Congress. Nor can it be said, 
. ‘with correctness, that Congress can, in any way, so alter the 
_ ‘‘rights and qualifications of voters.’’ 
If this authority be correct, then, sir, there can be no doubt 
___as to the power of this convention to fix the qualification of 
electors. There can be no doubt as to the power of this body to 
__ say that an individual born in a foreign land, may come here and 
__ exercise this important privilege; and to show that the position 


“7 


nf occupied by the gentleman from Macoupin, and others on the 
same side with him, is untenable, it is only necessary to advert to 
be the fact, that they are perfectly willing that all persons who may 
3 _ be in Illinois at the time of the adoption of this constitution, may 


_ exercise this important franchise. Now if it be a violation of the 
constitution of the United States, to provide by constitutional 
_ provision that foreigners coming to the country hereafter, may 
"exercise the elective franchise, notwithstanding they may not 
pe have been naturalized, I say, if it be true that it would be a viola- 
__ tion of the constitution, as has been contended by somegentlemen, 
__toallow such persons to vote, unless they have been natural- 
ized under the law of congress; would it not be equally a violation 
of the constitution of the United States to allow individuals to 
q = vote who may be here at the time of the adoption of this constitu- 


me that they will at once renounce the arguments hel 
in regard to the power of the convention to fix the qu 


that it was useless, in my opinion, to enter into the aise si 
this constitutional question, upon which gentlemen ha 
into a palpable error. The only question, in my judgment, 1 
should engage the attention of the committee, is whether or 
will be proper for the convention to fix the qualification of 1 
according to the mode proposed by the gentleman from 
and in order to come to a conclusion upon this propo 
seems to me that it will be only necessary to ask the ques 
these persons be faithful in their allegiance to this gove 
and capable of exercising intelligently the elective franchi 
my opinion nothing more should be required as an ev 
their attachment to our constitution and laws, than the 
declaration made in the presence of a court of record, 
intention to become citizens of the United States, and a re 
tion of all allegiance to the kingdom from which the emig 
come. Can there be a stronger evidence than the oath 
open court, in the presence of the people and of his God 
intention of the party to become a citizen? Could the 
stronger evidence, IT say, of his sincerity The mere 


it, sustain it, to do everything that a good citizen should do. 
mere lapse of time, I repeat, can constitute no argument in 
of the supposition that the party would be attached to the 
stitution. The question then is, could he exercise the 
voting intelligently? Is he in a condition to do so? 

understand the constitution and the laws of the countr 
probable, sir, that an individual would take an oath to s 
the constitution without understanding it? Is it a 


he land of his nativity—everything endeared to him by the 
‘recollections of his youth, and declare his intention to support the 
constitution and laws of the country of his adoption, unless he 
had some idea of that constitution and of those laws under which 
he was about to live? I know, sir, that it is important that every 
man who may be called on to exercise the important privilege of 
voting, should know something about the institutions of the 
country, and should be capable of making a good selection when 
“he comes to vote for those who are to administer the government; 
but we have no means in this republic of ours, of ascertaining 
whether an individual is acquainted with the institutions of the 
ountry, but such as are presented to us in the ordinary way. 
Ape cannot know whether a man is qualified to do this or to do 
_ that except by ordinary means. Now I apprehend, though I am 
‘ “not very well acquainted with many foreigners, I apprehend that 

most of them when bidding adieu to their homes, and launching 
upon the broad bosom of the Atlantic to come to this country and 
_ swell the current of freedom, are actuated by the best possible 

“motives; that they are anxiously bent on doing all they can to 
( make themselves freemen, and to assist in the promotion of the 
"great principles of human liberty. And is it to be assumed that 
_ they are the most ignorant classes of Europe? I think not. It 
"is the intelligent; it is those who are capable of entering into the 
_ most noble of enterprises, who leave their homes for the purpose 

‘of finding a new home in the western world. The idle, the slothful, 
and the ignorant will remain at home and bear the fetters and 
_ shackles of the government under which they have been born; he 
has no ambition to seek a home in another country, where he may 
enjoy in a most eminent manner the benefits of a civil government, 
_ that is built upon the true basis of human freedom. Hence it is 
‘we find in the United States foreigners who have accumulated 
‘ immense fortunes; hence it is that we find foreigners who have 
_ contributed to the great cause of human liberty; hence it is that 
_ we find in the United States foreigners who have on all occasions 
Peedwn themselves ready and willing to bear arms and expose their 
lives in the defence of the country. They are attached, ardently 
oe to the institutions of the country. They appreciate 


} 
NRK 


+ 


562 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL . COLLEC 


feeling has been well expressed by one who understood t 
of the human heart: 

““Breathes there a man with soul so dead, 

Who never to himself has said, 

This is my own, my native land?’ } 

It is impossible to eradicate from the mind this - 

attachment to the place of one’s birth. But, although 

deared to us by many fond recollections and pleasin 


we can divest ourselves of all attachment to that which is 
error. What was it that produced the original settlemen 
country? It was the oppression which prevailed in the o 
The genius and intrepidity of the old world discovered an 
this continent, and is it to be presumed that men wh 
to this country with them an ardent love for liberty 
unconquerable hatred of tyranny; is it.to be Pe 


Why, it is a notorious fact, and that fact has been spr ea 
the world, by one of the most able writers of the present 
that there is an unusual tendency throughout the whole 
world, to throw off the shackles of oppression, and to 
liberal governments. ame | 

The gentleman from Macoupin thinks that something 
necessary than a mere declaration of intention to became 


eae he in an n equal degree intelligence to exercise in an € 
manner the elective franchise, and to refuse its exercise 
who fall short of this standard, I fear, sir, that many, 
must be excluded. 


with the constitution of the country, so as to be able to 
commentary upon it; but it is to be expected that every m 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 563 
able to judge between a good and a bad government. It is 


tyranny and universal freedom. The idea that was expressed the 
other day by the gentleman from Jo Daviess, and in which I con- 
curred, that it was the interest of the State of Illinois to do all 

‘ss ‘that it can do, to invite immigration. The same policy that 

governed the actions and deliberations of the Convention of this 

State in 1818, should, in my judgment, govern thé deliberations 

of and action of this body. It was then thought desirable that 

_ persons should be invited into the State, to settle its verdant prai- 
‘ries and cultivate its acres. It is now no less desirable than then, 
that they should be invited into this country, or at least that there 

should be no obstacles thrown in the way of immigration. That 
all who may desire to come into the State should have every proper 
inducement held out to them to come here and take up their abode 

‘among us. We have a soil capable of supporting a dense popula- 
tion; we have a State peculiarly blessed by Heaven, and one 
which in the progress of time is destined, in my humble opinion, 
‘to stand unrivalled in this confederacy. We are at present under 

the embarrassment arising from the existence of a large public 
debt, and we all acknowledge it to be our bounden duty to adopt 
every practicable means for the payment of that debt. We all 
regard repudiation as a thing never to be tolerated by the citizens 
of this State. We all agree that every energy should be exerted 
for the speedy liquidation of that debt. If then by constitutional 
provision, we place competition between the State of Illinois and 
other adjacent States, is it not probable that our population will 
not increase so rapidly as it would increase if we were to leave this 
provision open; or at least to adopt the amendment of the gentle- 
man from St. Clair? I think so, sir. 

__ And again, sir, it is in my judgment a violation, and I express 
it with great deference to the opinions of gentlemen who entertain 
a different view of the question—it is a violation of the natural 
right of every man to be represented when he is subject to be called 
on to perform duty, let that duty be of what character it may. 

Sir, all men derive immediately from their Creator the right to 
govern themselves, and when a government is instituted by 
yielding up a portion of the natural rights which belong to each 


t4 


564 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COI 


have transferred the power of acting for us. It is wrong 
sir, for the reason that these persons are to be opera ed 
all the branches of the government, that they should, | 
siderable period of time be excluded from the enjoyment o 
privileges which belong to citizens. Is it apprehended 

admitting these people to the enjoyment of this import 
the institutions of the State will be endangered? Its 
sir, that we should not abandon the principle that all 
have some participancy in the affairs of government, p 
when they may be called upon to contribute to the supp 
government. These people, as I before said, are subjeci 


Baker, when the tocsin of war has sounded, rally to 
battle. Shall we say that such men shall not exercise 
franchise? Shall we say, by the formation of a cons 
the State of Illinois, a State which has heretofore been 
ized by a peculiar degree of liberality; shall we say that 
men of the same family of freemen as ourselves, men ente 
the same principles, the same political views, the sa 
attachment to freedom, are we to say that they shall 
simple reason that they have not been naturalized ac 
the laws of the United States, be entitled to enjoy those 

privileges? I trust that such a conclusion will not be arr 
by this committee. There is no man who would m 
go for their exclusion than myself, if I could be con 
there could be any just apprehension of danger to the ins 
of the State, by permitting the exercise of the elective 
by foreigners. If I thought this, I would deny them 
but believing, as I do, from the little experience that I ha 
that there is probably little danger to be apprehended fr 
source; I cannot believe that in view of the solemn oath 
nounce all allegiance to the government of the country ff 
they came, and to support the constitution of the U 
and the constitution of Illinois, it is right to deny ibe 
cise of this important privilege. 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 565 
ere has been in the course of the discussion a great deal of 


become excited in debate, (and I am not myself exempt from 
error,) they unconsciously say that which they afterwards 
t. Some allusion has been made to certain gentlemen who 
seats on the floor of this convention who have come from 
sn lands, and taken up their residence among us. Those 
tlemen, I have no doubt, are as ardently attached to our in- 
tutions as those of us who have had a hand in laying their 
dations, broad and ample. I regretted, sir, to see such a state 
feeling as this. I do not know what may have been the evils 
€ county of Jo Daviess may have experienced. I confessed in 
‘outset that I was not sufficiently acquainted with the foreign- 
who are in the State to be able to judge of them; but the few 
yeigners who are resident in the portion of the State in which 
live are, in my opinion, as ardently attached to the interests of 
2 country as any citizen in the State. They are as peaceful and 
_ as industrious citizens as we have; they add as much to the active 
by in dustry of the State as any other citizens of equal number to 
mselves. Shall we then prohibit these persons from enjoying 
‘a ae and thus induce them to go to a neighbor- 


“aah are not capable of understanding our institutions be- 
they are unacquainted with our language, is certainly 
eed, I think, tovery little weight. There are few of them who 
‘do not speak our language, those few are chiefly Germans and it 
must be recollected that in Germany the whole people enjoy the 
idvantages of education to a greater extent than the people of 
any other country on the habitable globe. Being educated and 
intelligent, they have no great difficulty in making themselves 
acquainted with the nature of our institutions, and they are in- 
uenced in a great degree by the same political notions, and by 
€ same ardent desire for liberty which characterize the American 
eople. Is it to be presumed, sir, that they will not after one 
_ year’s residence be capable of exercising the elective franchise? 
iy think not, sir. My own mind has been conducted to the con- 
clusion, that they can after one year’s residence exercise the privi- 


proposition of the gentleman from St. Clair. 
Mr. BUTLER next addressed the committee. 


who hae preresed me in favor of the pioncemon b 
Convention, that there is little left for me to say, except t 
my cordial approbation of the amendment which has be 
posed by the gentleman from St. Clair. I conceive, sir, t 
report of the committee, which it is proposed to amend, 
adopted, deprive a large and respectable class of the ci 
this State of their natural rights, and upon this point I ft 
cur with the gentleman from Massac. I conceive it to bea 
right, a right to participate in the government by which th 
governed, of which this report would deprive them. Thi 
proposes to make a very great change in our present constitu 
a change which I believe to be uncalled for, a change 

believe the people of this State do not ask for, and as 
knowledge is concerned, I can truly say, a change to w 
never will consent, a change to which they most strenuousl; 
and that objection will be made manifest when the vote 
taken on the constitution. This class of people, sir, w 
provision will affect is in the section of the State in whic 


munity. Now, sir, they will look upon a proposition of t 
as unjust, unequal, and oppressive. They conceive that 
as they are good citizens; so fone = as they obey the laws of 


the government are imposed upon them, they should ave 
to enjoy the privileges and immunities of that governme 
especially the privilege which the report of the committee 
to deprive them, which is so dear to us and will be to 
think, sir, we are purposing too many changes 4 in this con 


we proceed as we have commenced;—such an oppositic 
think, will ensure its rejection by the people. Sir, I do not p 
to enter into a long discussion of this matter. It has been a 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 — 567 


bject had not the gentleman from Adams made the remarks 
' which he made last evening. That gentleman, as is usual with 
the party to which he belongs, raised the cry of no party, and 
alleged in his place that he knew of no party question having been 
_ made in this State on this subject. Now I believe that it is per- 
F -fectly notorious that such is not the case, and that the reverse is 
true. It is well known that it has been and now is a party ques- 
tion, and I freely and openly and willingly avow that I act upon 
Re: this subject as a party question, and as a party man I conceive 
_ that each and every party ought to be composed and constituted 
with reference to principles, and if a man acts upon principle, he 
_ must necessarily, to a certain degree, act as a party man; and 
- 1 am free to confess that this is one of the principles of the party 
_ to which I belong, which I am proud to say has its foundation on 
principle. I therefore act in regard to this question as a party 
_ man; and I believe that the gentleman from Adams himself, acts 
from the same motives, although he is unwilling to avow it. If it 
be not a party question, why do we see gentlemen of the opposite 
party so strictly arrayed on the other side? There is the strongest 
evidence that can be given in this Convention, that it is a party 
‘question, the gentleman’s declaration to the contrary notwith- 
standing. I have observed that whenever certain gentlemen in 
the opposite ranks get into a difficulty, certain allusions are thrown 
out in relation to John Thompson and his team. Now, sir, I under- 
_stand the intention of these expressions;—I understand the mean- 
ing intended to be conveyed, and the effect which gentlemen 
intend to create by the use of these expressions, and I despise the 
Natrow-minded spirit which prompts their use. I hold such a 
miserable low pettifogging mode of attack in the utmost contempt. 
I shall, however, pass that by. I leave such things for what they 
are worth, and I will leave those gentlemen who make use of them, 
as the remnants of an ill-spent political life. Whatever course I 
have taken, or may take, is founded upon principles, upon those 
principles which I hold dear, and I acknowledge the right of no 
individual to question my right to entertain them. 
One word more, sir, upon the question before the committee, 
and I have done. It has been alleged that the immigration of 
foreigners into this State, and permitting them to exercise the 


- continued, to procure the votes of the laborers; and what was 


568 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT: 


right of suffrage is deleterious to the i interests of oe Stee; 
has a bad effect; and will always have a bad effect. Has 
been any evidence of this? Has there been a single ins 
pointed out? The gentleman from Jo Daviess is the only in 
ual who has attempted it. He has said that foreigners 
were employed upon the public works gave their votes in favor 
those persons who were favorable to the continuance of tho 
works, for the purpose of obtaining employment for themsely: 
The answer of the gentleman from Cook upon this point is 
clusive. It is true that upon the line of the canal individ 
endeavored, by representing themselves as being in favor o 
progress of the work, which was then on the point of being ¢ 


result? Those laborers, sir, opposed them on the day of election: 
Those men are in that region very numerous; they have nev 
in the exercise of the right of suffrage personal consider 
above those of the public interest. They are very numerou: 
yet in all the delegation from that region of the country, there 
but one member on this floor of foreign birth from that section 
the State: and though numerous, sir, they have not presumed 
ask, that which gentlemen have said they would ask, if the; 
of suffrage should be extended to them. 

But, said Mr. B., there is another view of this question whi 
induces me to cukanid the right of suffrage to foreign immig 
after one year’s residence. The right of suffrage, the righ 
voice in the selection and election of the various officers in 
government, has had, and will have the effect of inducing ther 
inform themselves as to the nature of our institutions a 
qualify themselves to discharge this and other duties unders 
ingly and in a proper manner. But, sir, if you deprive th 
this privilege; if you refuse to give them a voice in the admi 
tion of the government, you take away this incentive, this ind 
ment to thus qualify themselves, and you create in them a 
of attention, a carelessness, which in a great measure would rend 
them unfit for a proper exercise of this privilege. Such will, 
the course of things, be the effect on the minds of men, and 
has been the effect in all despotic governments, and govern 
which deprive their people of this invaluable right,—a 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 569 


on which the liberties of every nation in a great measure depends. 
_ Mr. DAVIS, of Montgomery, said that he had not intended to 
say anything on this subject. He had no apology to offer, how- 
ever, for detaining the committee a few moments. He would not 


"Shelby, said Mr. Davss, stated clearly and distinctly that the 


_ government ought not to extend the right of suffrage to aliens 
- until they become citizens; because, until they become citizens 
a) according to the gentleman's views, would have no power to com- 
a pel these persons to defend the country in time of war; and that in 
a case they were admitted into the army, and should desert and go 
th over to the enemy, this government would have no power to punish 
\) them. The gentleman (continued Mr. Davis), stated these things 
as clear and indisputable facts, and so I maintain they are. No 
- gentleman here has, as yet, satisfactorily answered them. Is there 
_ any gentleman who pretends to say that if we adopt a provision 
giving the right of suffrage to foreigners, without naturali- 
zation, they will be amenable to the laws of the general govern- 
ment? Is there any gentleman here who will pretend to say that 
_ the state of things, as stated by the gentleman from Shelby, does 
not actually exist? If there be such an one, I would like to hear 
_ him maintain that position. Is it not right then that a foreigner 
_ should be required before being allowed to vote, to place himself 
in a situation in which the government would have jurisdiction 
and control over him, at least so far as it has over those who are 
born here? Now, I call the attention of gentlemen on the other 

_ side to this point, and if they are able to explain it to my satisfac- 

_ tion, I hope they will do so. The gentleman from Jo Daviess, 

this morning, placed the matter on its true ground; he argued it 
fairly; and I would like to hear his arguments replied to and 
_ tefuted, if gentlemen are able to refute them. He said it was a 
_ question of time; that it was a question as to whether it would not 
___ be best for us and best for the foreigners themselves to make the 
term of residence, previous to naturalization, equal to that re- 

_ quired by the laws of the United States, as they are at present— 


rv: 


aac be 


570 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC 


which would make them qualified citizens ae = 
them not only citizens of this State, but entitle them to the p 
leges of citizenship in every other State in the Union, and k 
them completely under the jurisdiction of the government. 
would be placing the matter upon its true and proper four 
But the amendment proposes to place the foreigner as soon ¢ 
lands on the shores of Illinois, upon precisely the same foot tin 
a man from the State of New York or Kentucky. Now, I 

this right? I understood the gentleman from Massac, (an 
is no gentleman on this floor in whose intelligence and 
have more confidence, but it does seem to me that he was 
in regard to this matter), I understood him to say that fore 
had a natural right to vote. I maintain, sir, that they have 1 
a natural right. I say that the organization of governme 
arbitrary, and that we, having organized a government of our 
and conferred certain privileges upon our citizens, may. 
persons coming from another country, that they are not ent 
to claim anything asa natural right. Why, I should like to k 
if such doctrine as this is to be advocated here by lawyer 
those who have made the science of government their study. 
in the broad open field of nature, before any government ¥ 
organized at all, men had natural rights; but the moment 
ments were organized, each man gave up a portion of his na 
rights. Is it to be contended here that people from every 
of the earth, people of all kindred and all colors, may co 
and claim national rights-under our government Woes ais K 


i 
TT 


all parts of the habitable globe have a right to come hese ar 
all the rights that we enjoy. The gentleman has placed h 
in this position, and he cannot escape from it. 
Mr. BUTLER (interposing) said that the position ‘ 


vidual had a natural right to have a voice in the sales Ge th 
ernment under which he lived. 


to the same thing. The gentlemen had better consult their b 
and ascertain how governments are organized. I lay it down 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 Eat 


_a principle, from which no intelligent man will attempt to escape, 
that the organization of governments is arbitrary, and that every 
individual yields up a portion of his natural rights, in order that 
he may enjoy the protection of the government in those rights 
which remain to him. The difference between the gentlemen and 
myself is this: They contend that all persons are entitled to a 
__ voice in the affairs of the government under which they live, with- 
_ out submitting to those restrictions which the government sees 
_ fittoimpose. ThisI deny. I maintain that the government has 
a right to prescribe restrictions. J maintain that an individual 
has no natural rights under a government. He has only such 
rights as he may acquire; and I lay it down as a broad principle, 
from which no gentleman will attempt to escape, that this con- 
__vention has a right to prescribe in what manner aliens may be- 
: come citizens, and in regard to the particular manner, it is alto- 
gether a question of expediency. But, the gentlemen say that 
requiring a residence of one year before a foreigner shall be allowed 
to vote, is depriving him of a natural right. Such a doctrine as 
this would destroy the very foundation upon which all govern- 
ments rest. If gentlemen think, that to carry out such a doctrine 
as this would best promote the interests of the State, and have 
strength to carry it out, let them doit. It is not my intention to 
detain the committee very long. I said at the outset, that I 
should neither praise foreigners nor abuse them; I hope at least 
to have the privilege of claiming to understand the principles upon 
which our government rests as well as they do. 

The gentleman from Harding yesterday read a portion of 
Washington’s farewell address. Everyone must know that Wash- 
ington’s intention was to guard us against foreign influence. 
Sir, when we abandon our naturalization laws and admit foreign- 
ers to the privileges of citizenship without restrictions, do we not 
subject ourselves to foreign influence to an alarming extent; to 
such an extent, as upon the occurrence of a great political contest, 
might put it in their power to subvert the liberties of the country? 
It has been said, that it was a view entertained by a British states- - 
man, that the only way to subvert this government was to throw 
amongst us a foreign population, and if we say that as soon as they 
touch our shores they shall be ova fide citizens, might not such a 


572 «ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE 


result be effected? Might it not be done? I am onl 
a case, it is the duty of the government to guard 
most remote possibility of evil. One word regarding the i 
which has been made by the gentleman from Lake: I und rs 
him to say that it was a party question. Now, I have | sai 
little about my constituency as any man. I represent in rt 
counties which have a democratic majority of four hund 
fifty. I took ground in my addresses to the people in favor of 
naturalization laws of the United States, and at no time di } 
it objected to by anyone. 4 
I am going to close, sir, with a single ‘aun in aan 
this John Thompson affair. The allusions of gentlemen t 
matter have been pronounced to be low and contemptible. Th 
expressions cannot apply to me, sir, because I have never said 
word about it; but suffer me now to say, that when I want to 
of John Thompson and his oxen, I will do it; and no man 
breathes, no man that lives and moves, and has his being, 
deter me from doing it. I hold myself responsible to no 
any figure of speech that I may use. I care nothing abou 
Thompson and his oxen; let it all go for what itis worth. = 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess next addressed the commi t 
He desired to hear some good and sufficient reasons assij } 
gentlemen who were so desirous of depriving foreigners 
privilege of exercising the elective franchise, for the position t 
took. Were gentlemen afraid to express their opinions? 
they any good and substantial reasons to sustain the pr 
which they were inclined to advocate by their silent votes? 
had as yet given no reasons; they had carefully refrained 
expressing an opinion; but he for one would not be satisfied 
silent vote. The country would not be satisfied with it; the r 
ple would expect to hear arguments and reasons from those 
voted against extending to foreigners the privilege of exet 
the elective franchise, to show that conferring ek them 


State. 

My views on this subject, said Mr. Canteeeee are pract 
and we want the resources of this State developed, we want will 
hearts and strong hands to come here for the purpose of deve 


VECRE PE VSS Siw, tS a Pers a ay ey Ee oo 7 —" Se Se ey Fe a 
¥ : 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 3 573 


_ ing those resources. And when gentlemen give silent votes 
_ against their admission, I must suppose that there are political 
"reasons why they are unwilling to reveal to the convention and 
‘ to the country, the motives by which they are actuated. Why 
do they not come forward and state them boldly? Some gentle- 
‘men say we have the means of accomplishing all that we desire, 
j and it is not our policy to hold out inducements to foreigners to 
_ come amongst us. Sir, I for one am in favor of allowing the 
' people of Europe to whom we are indebted, to come here, and by 
their labor, provide the means of paying the debts that we owe 
' them. Gentlemen say that it will create a competition which 
_ will operate against our citizens. Sir, there is no competition 
about it; it is not a subject about which our citizens fear com- 
_ petition. It is hard labor that we require; and without which 
we have not the means of relieving ourselves from the indebted- 
ness which rests upon us. 
‘$ It is unpleasant for me, Mr. Chairman, to refer to my colleague 
_ from Jo Daviess; but I will state one fact, which I apprehend the 
_ gentleman will not be willing to deny; if he does it will be a denial 
_ of the truth. Before the election in the county of Jo Daviess, 
the gentleman and myself rode out to a place called Vinegar Hill, 
where about sixty foreigners were at work. In conversation with 
them about this question of naturalization, the gentleman stated, 
he was in favor of foreigners residing here one year, filing a declar- 
ation of their intention to become citizens, and then exercising the 
privilege of the elective franchise. The good faith with which 
that gentleman has carried out this pledge, has been revealed to 
_ the convention this morning. This is the truth, sir; it is undeni- 
_ able. Sir, when I make a pledge, I carry it out in good faith. 
_ My opinions before the election, are the same as after it; and 
~ gentlemen who take a contrary course may reconcile it to their 
' own consciences, but they cannot reconcile it with the great prin- 
ciples of truth and justice. 
-Much has been said, sir, with regard to foreigners coming to 
this country, and the great danger in which the institutions of the 
_ country would be placed. Sir, I called upon gentlemen on Friday, 
when I first rose to address the committee upon this subject, to 
point out to me the great evils that have arisen, as they allege, 


Se WY GON A 
at . < 


CAE ET Moan PoE EE en a 
| 7 + r \ 7 " 4 Y? y 


574 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT! 


nation, would it not well become us to pay some ees fe 
the declaration of him, whose portrait hangs above your | 
sir, that this country is the asylum of the oppressed of every 
although my friend from Montgomery, who read fron 
fragment of a native American paper, a different a at’ 
of the views of that great man? 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery, —I call on the cane 
whether I did not read it correctly? 

Mr. CAMPBELL.—It was, I admit, a fragment of an o spi 
of Washington, carefully culled out to suit native American vie 
And what great man is there who has ever lived in this cour 
whose opinions may not be quoted to his disadvantage? 
the devil himself can quote scripture to suit his purpo 
gentleman can also quote isolated portions of the writings 
Washington, Jefferson and Madison, to suit his purpose. Lool 
at the proceedings of these native Americans! Native America 
Native Americans! I abhor, I detest, I hate them. — 

Look at the magnificent domes and spires pointing to He: 
which they reduced to ashes in Philadelphia; yet my colle 
justifies their acts! Religion and human rights were both dis 
regarded and trampled under foot by those ruthless men; 
sunk before their violence; and yet gentlemen will stand. up 
assert, that the cause of all this was the presence of foreig 
this country! Such an argument, and coming from such a sot 

Who was it that achieved the liberties of this country? 
for a moment, at the proceedings of the Continental Congr 
they addressed a memorial to the people of Ireland, askin; 
their assistance; and I ask you, sir, if there ever was an instar 
in which the flag of liberty was unfurled anywhere, in any pa 
the world, and Irishmen were not seen to rally around it, ar 
bathe the ground over which it waved with their blood, vie 
it was assailed? Look, sir, at our standing army at this 
two-thirds of that army is composed of foreigners—men Ba 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 575 


ays ready to brave danger and peril; to stand in the front rank 
in the day of conflict; the foremost whenever a difficult charge is 
to be made, marching over the dead bodies of their comrades to 
‘victory or to death. It is foreigners who are called upon to do it, 


e the fire of the enemy the places of the fallen are filled by 
‘their surviving comrades; these are the men on whom to rely. 
Ido not say this in disparagement of our peg ie I know 


hear foreigners depreciated in this hall, from reminding gentlemen 
a of their devotedness and self-sacrificing spirit. The foreigner 
- comes here as a matter of choice; it is the act of his own free will 
_ and enlightened judgment; he comes here to enjoy the freedom 
| that we enjoy; to escape from the oppressions which he has been 
“made to suffer; and how have we acted towards him? We have 
borne him down with heavy and strong irons. Was it, Sir, for 
himself that LaFayette come here and shed his blood? Did he 
” expect to enjoy the liberty for which he was fighting? No, sir; 
Bs) it was for those who should come after him. Look at Montgom- 
. ery, whose rich, red, republican blood melted the Canadian snow. 
__ Was he fighting for himself when he yielded up the divine essence 
i 5 with which the Creator had endowed him? No, sir, he was fight- 
E Bi ing for the cause of liberty. Did he suppose that any American 
3 z who should come after him would ever raise his voice to deny to 
F, others the rights and privileges for which he fought, and bled, 
_ and died? Oh! sir, it is a horrible thought! The great, glorious, 
__ and immortal Washington declared that this country was the 
__asylum of the oppressed. We had the prayers of the Irish people 
im the Revolutionary war; their supplications were addressed to 
high Heaven for our success; they sent their sons to our aid; they 
_ sent them to assist in maintaining the cause of liberty; and yet 
_ there are gentlemen now in this Hall who maintain that those 
__ men—the descendants of the very men, it may be, or at all events 
_ descendants of the same stock as those who rocked the cradle of 
Ditisty, should not be admitted to a participation in those privi- 

: leges which we enjoy! 


4 
ew 
7 7 
— 


“‘Can these things be? ‘ 
And overcome us like a summer dowd: 
Without our special wonder?’ 

Sir, I feel an abiding interest in this matter. I fee 
we were departing from the principles established i th 
founded the government. Why should not foreigners 
and participate in the benefits of the free and independent 
ment which we are enjoying? Look at our broad dc 


cea till at last its golden beams will rest upon | ' 
the broad Pacific? Shall we resist the tide sir ee 


oh 


us in achieving. Would this be right? isa it an ne Athy 
ple? Is it the doctrine which we ought to avow in the fac 
world? Is it the result of such a doctrine which i is c 
army victoriously to the city of Mexico? I deny it. 

its broadest sense is emphatically the doctrine of the 
people. Despotism is to be broken down and destroyed thi 
out the world. Look at our Missionaries now in Rom 
Rome! once the seat of learning, science and the a1 
America was a wilderness—a terra incognita. We are 
ing missionaries to impart to them the lights of kno 
yet we say to the people of Europe, you shall not co ne 
participate with us in the blessings we enjoy. 


I know I speak the voice of every liberal hearene Those ¢ 
who see fit to differ with me in opinion, I care not where th 
from, whether they have lived under the charter of Cha 
Second or not, they cannot advance their illiberal prin 
the State of Illinois. Prapes: | 

-One word more, Sir, and I have done. We haves 
aliens after a short residence here, the privilege of exerc 


Sh 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 577 


_ elective franchise. It is impossible, that in the formation of a 
oa new constitution, they should be deprived, in any degree, of the 
% privileges which they are enjoying. I apprehend that it is 

_ admitted on all hands that it is not in the power of this Conven- 

4 ‘tion to take away from them the rights which are guaranteed to 
_ them by the constitution under which we live at present; and are 
' we to make a difference between those now here, and those who 

_ come afterwards? Suppose that Congress should listen to Native 

_ Americanism (which God forbid); and require foreigners to remain 

twenty-one years before being entitled to the privilege of exercis- 
ing the elective franchise. Then if a foreigner comes here, he 
must remain twenty-one years, before he will have a right to vote 
under our constitution. Would this be just? Would it be right? 

_ Shall we make this invidious distinction? Itseems to me it cannot 
be our policy. It seems to me it would be manifestly wrong. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery rose and addressed the chair. 
I understand the gentleman to say, said Mr. Davis, that two- 
thirds of our standing army are foreigners, and that when in the 
heat of battle men are called upon to make a desperate charge, 
these are the men. Sir, to this I enter my unqualified dissent. 
Sir, the idea that an army, two-thirds of which is composed of 
foreigners, will stand up and bear the brunt of battle, in a difficult 
and desperate charge, more patriotically than an army compared 
[sic] entirely of our own citizens, is a doctrine that I never will 
subscribe to, while a drop of American blood runs in my veins. 

Mr. CAMPBELL. Their superior discipline enables them to 
do it. 

Mr. DAVIS. I care nothing about their discipline, and I 
wish to say nothing disparagingly of foreigners, but, sir, I refer 
you to the heroic acts of our volunteers in Mexico. I refer you to 
the field of Buena Vista. Who was it that bared their bosoms to 
the shafts of the enemy? Who was it that drenched the soil 
with their gore? Was it a standing army composed of foreigners? 
No, sir, no; it was the sons of Kentucky; it was the sons of Illinois, 
who drenched the soil to profusion with their blood. Sir, who was 
it that gave up their lives in the battle of Cerro Gordo? Who 
was it that marched fearlessly up to the cannon’s mouth? Was 
it this well drilled and well disciplined standing army composed 


578 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL Ct 


citizen soldier;—the soldier who had drunk the spirit 0 
liberty from his mother’s breast;—who had been dandled 
said yesterday) upon the lap of an American mother. It y 
citizens of Illinois and Kentucky that rushed to the m 
unequal conflict, determined to conquer or die. It wa 
boldened by patriotic feelings, by a love of country, 
implanted in every American bosom. It was no standi 
composed of foreigners. Sir, it is an honor now to be a 
She stands side by side with Mississippi and Tennessee; 
stands there at great cost. She stands there at the cost 
lives of her most valued citizens;—at the cost of the li 
the sons of Illinois, who have poured out their life-blood w 
battlefields of Buena Vista and Cerro Gordo. They have 
an imperishable monument to the fame of Illinois;—one- 
every American will be proud of, as long as the “‘star 
banner’ floats upon the breeze. Sir, they have done m 
they have established beyond the possibility of a doubt, 
that a standing army, SO far from having any advantage 
army of volunteers, is infinitely beneath them i in efficiency} 


ing officers against them. It was supposed that no 
could be placed in them undisciplined as hey ee 


patriotism,—because he is ready on all occasions to sel 
defence of liberty,—because he is always ready to 
country with his blood.] 


Mr. PRATT said, he hoped the Convention wou 1 
sider him as saying more than was due to himself after w 
fallen from his colleague in relation to his allusion to 
delphia riots, and his pledges to his constituents 
not understand the object of that gentleman in 
attack. It would, however, if not replied to, have 


WEDNESDAY, JULY 28, 1847 579 


of lessening my influence here, if I have any, and place me before 
_ my constituents as a man derelict and wavering in my pledges 
to them. He charged me with having, a short time before the 
election, gone with him to a certain place in Jo Daviess county, 
where there were some sixty or seventy foreigners, and that I there 


iia “pledged myself to go for a proposition the same as the one I have 


this day spoken against. That by this means I had deceived my 
constituents, and had stolen votes, which otherwise would have 
been thrown against me. This is a serious charge, and ‘it is but 
proper that I should state what did take place on that occasion. 
If the charge be true, honorable men should know it; and as the 
charge, if true, will degrade me, it is but proper that all should 
understand it if it be untrue. The facts are these: A few days 
before the election, my colleague and myself got into a buggy and 
rode out into the country; on our way, and at a place called 
Vinegar Hill, we accidentally came across a body of Irishmen, 
sixty or seventy in number, making what is called a bee-fence. 
They were all known to me, and more acquainted with me than 
Mr. CampsELt, because he had been absent from there for nearly 
four years. They were most of them personal friends of mine, 
who had heard me speak often, and I suppose six-sevenths of them 
were my clients. While sitting in the buggy andconversing with 
them, we very naturally questioned them about this subject 
of foreigners. Mr. Camppett made a remark, the substance of . 
which was “I am opposed to any alteration in the present constitu- 
tion. I am for allowing all who come here the right to vote 
after six months residence.”’ I said to them, and put the question 
only as a feeler, in order to obtain an expression of their views, 
and never considered it as pledging myself in any manner upon 
the subject, “what would you think of a proposition to enlarge 
the term to one year, and require a declaration of intention to 
become citizens?” That I made any pledge to vote for such a 
proposition, or expressed myself in favor of it, never occurred to 
my mind. Those foreigners, however, replied “we are not in 
favor of any such proposition, we want no provision other than 
that of becoming citizens; you have degraded us by your mistaken 
confidence and friendship, as we, in consequence of being allowed 
to vote, have not become citizens.’ This is what took place. I 


aaa ee es 


an excitement which impairs their recollection upon ae 7 
actually take place on such occasions. Nothing has ever 
said by that gentleman since upon this subject. We have eve 
been on the most intimate terms. He is a man whom 
always treated as a friend; in sickness and in health i 
tended him, when attacked, as I would have done myself, an 
attribute his attack upon me to-day as prompted only [by] c 
and feelings of envy, caused by what he may feel has been 
effect and impression created by the remarks made by me to-c 

Mr. CAMPBELL said, it was unpleasant to be compe. 
refer to the personal remarks of his colleague. I can on 
that the statement which he has made of what took place at 
interview with the foreigners, of which he insinuates my mel 
is not clear, is most unqualifiedly false, and I hold myself resp 
ble for the remark, and if he is a man of courage he will noti 
Why, sir, he admits that he put the question to them, but he 
he did it as a feeler. He gave them to understand that he was 
favor of such a proposition. He says they were his friends, 
that six-sevenths of them were his clients. Szx-sevenths of sixt 
in Jo Daviess county, the gentleman’s clients! He say. 
they all answered that they were opposed to any such thi 
Why; sir, we were not in conversation with one-twentieth 
people there at any one time, and how could they have all a 
his proposition, when he, sitting in the buggy, put the ‘ 
to a few? Sir, if he had made there, or in Jo Daviess, st 
speech as he made here to-day, he would never have held z a 
on this floor—and as it was, he got here by only nine v 
hope the Convention will not be troubled with this matte 
but that it will be left to ourselves to settle, personally, and 
the Convention. | 

The committee then rose and reported progress. Ai 
on motion, and to give the Districting committee time 
the Convention adjourned till to-morrow. 


XLI. THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Crist. 
_ Leave of absence for ten days was granted Messrs. Trower, 
L AUGHLIN and Powers. 
A call of the Convention was ordered and taken. 
_ According to order, the Convention resolved into a committee 
i of the whole—Mr. Harvey in the chair, and resumed the con- 
ation of the report of the committee on Elections and the 
Right of Suffrage. 
‘ Mr. HENDERSON said, that he lived in Joliet, and never 
_ heard of the frauds upon the elections, or the running of wagon 
pp, Ic loads of foreigners from there to Chicago, on election days. He 
a was in favor of the amendment. He thought it our policy to hold 
out to the foreign i immigrants, the greatest inducements, to settle 
in our state, in order that by an increase of our population, the 
sregate amount of tax may be greater, and we have more means 
pay our debt with. The capital of all states was their popula- 
| tion; their wealth—the industry of their inhabitants. These 
; foreigners coming into our state, added both to the wealth and 
capital of our state. 
a _ Mr. KNOWLTON said, that he was a member of the committee 
who had reported this section, and he would express his views 
4“ upon the subject. He had no fears in expressing his opinion to be 
in fayor of the report, although there were some three or four 
_ hundred foreign voters in his county, and a large democratic 
_ majority. He had taken the ground there, that citizenship should 
bs a be required, and the mass of the intelligent foreigners asked for 
_ such a Provision. He had seen the ignorance of foreigners in 
a relation to our institutions, and from experience, he would not 
- entrust them with the elective franchise, until they had first 
§ become citizens. He had seen them led like cattle to the polls 
= demagogues. He extended his remarks upon this 
ti “point for some time, and argued that five years was but a short 
period i in which to acquire a knowledge of our government, suffi- 
581 


} 


\ 
| 


He Dhikeed out the immense hordes of imines Hoda 
shores, and the probable numbers that were yet to foll 
possibility of their out-numbering the natives at the ] po : 
_asked would this Convention set the example of permittin 
fresh from their native land, to decide and control our « 
He commented at length upon the downfall of the Roma 
the Athenian and Adriatic governments, by the admi 
foreigners, and thought the warning thus set, should be w 
sidered, before we adopted the principle contained in the 
ment. He alluded to the love of country, ane nevis 


lands more than any other. He also opposed the amendm 
constitutional grounds. It interfered with the powers 
Congress, to establish uniform naturalization laws. 


[Mr. KNOWLTON said: 
Mr. CuatrMan, Already has the debate upon thia’ 
question been protracted to such an extent that I am ec 


convention; and I would not now do so, were it not that 
member of the committee from which the report emanated 
under consideration, I feel it incumbent upon me to express 
views in relation to this report. My duty to my con 
demands that I should explain to this convention, my o 
relation to this subject. Sir, I am not one of those wh 
silent through fear upon any question where it is neces 
views should be heard. I intend always to be prepared 
to the requirements of duty, and whenever the path of 
clearly and in straight lines before me, I hesitate not for an 
to enter upon it. A sense of duty should be with us everywh 
most especially with us, who are acting, as we are perha 
acting, for unborn millions. In such a situation I know ne 
and there is no opinion that I hold, no feeling of my bo m 
I wish to screen from the eye of a prying world. It was int 
by the gentleman from Jo Daviess yesterday, that the 
48 This speech by Knowlton is taken fromthe Sangamo Journal, Aug 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 583 


bers of this convention, who would not come forward and 
their opinions upon this subject, for fear of offending the 
eign population that reside within the limits of this State. Sir, 
6 am not one of those that entertain any such fear. Although in 
ey e, county which I have the honor in part to represent, there are 
4 some two or three hundred men not born upon our soil, that vote 
at our polls. Nor, were a majority of those men opposed to my 
election? Among them I acknowledge some of my warmest and 
best friends, and I am proud to believe that it is their desire, that 

_ the elective franchise of their adopted country, should be faith- 
fully and carefully guarded. 

_ And, sir, I will suggest another reason, and a stronger one too, 
pea it becomes my imperious duty to advocate the proposition 
_ that foreigners should become naturalized before they are entitled 


> 


_ to the privileges of the elective franchise. Sir, in a circular that 
4 -Lissued to my constituents, previous to the election, I freely and 
~ fully stated my opinions upon this subject. I took the same 
A ground then that I take now, and yet, I believe, I had a majority 
of all the alien voters in my county in my favor. I often con- 
_ versed with them upon this subject, and I am happy to say, that 
' r) they mostly agreed with me in opinion, and were desirous that an 
_ organic law should be passed and incorporated into the consti- 
4 tution, requiring those aliens that shall settle in our State, after 
_ the adoption of the new constitution, to become naturalized 
: before they are entitled to the privileges of the elective franchise. 
__ I know not what may be the wishes and the feelings of the alien 
f population in other counties; but in mine, I believe it to be a 
‘S settled conviction in the minds of the foreigners, those of them 
who understand the nature and character of our institutions, that 

_ such a law should be passed. They ask that it may be passed. 

_ They ask it for their own protection and for the protection, of what 
to them, is now their common country. If they are good citizens, 
could it be otherwise than that they should desire it? Is the 

_ right of franchise to be cheaply purchased? Is it not one of the 

_ dearest privileges that we possess? Can we hold it too sacred? 

_ Can we guard it too strongly? I think not, Sir. It was a privi- 
lege secured with blood, and it should be more esteemed than the 
_ diamonds of Golconda. It has been said and reiterated in this 


584 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT. 


convention, that there can be no reason brought forwa 
alien should not be entitled to vote as soon, and upon thé 
terms as a citizen from a sister State. Sir, all men do not 


my fortune to have some acquaintance with aliens—as m 
haps as any member who has addressed the committe 


balloting with the same discrimination and practical know! 
after a short residence among us, as those who have been | DO 
and reared, and educated in our country. My experie 
me that this is the case with the majority of our foreign E 


how much superior they were in the knowledge of the lav 
constitution of our country, to those who have been born o 
soil, it would not have been necessary for me to have stated 
my experience has been. I believe that the conclusion which I 
have guido at, and which I have here stated, ee 


Swede, the Sais aye even the Prussian, (and it is ie 
Prussia exists the best system of common schools in the 
cannot properly be prepared to give his vote in the sho 
of one year from the time he shall make his home upon our | 
soil. Why, sir, when they first come among us they cannot v 
a word in, nor read a line of our language. aa 

Then whence their knowledge of our institutions? It ha 
said that they study their nature and their character by 
firesides, in the old world from whence they have emigrat 
How many of them to whom the art of printing is but as « 
letter? How many can obtain from prejudiced books, w 
takes years of practical experience to acquire? Until ae 


" 
ae 


a eye > a TI hea Y Cee ee 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 585 


_ be those men whigs or democrats. On this question, I trust I 
am above all party spirit, any party feeling. They may go, thus 


circumstanced, unwittingly to the polls, without reflection, with- 


out knowledge. Is it so with those who have been born in this 


country, those who have been nursed upon our soil—those over 
whom the eagle of liberty, that proud bird, whom we have chosen 
as our national emblem, has ever stretched her protecting wings— 
those whose first breath was drawn, whose first accents were lisped 


in an atmosphere of freedom? Sir, we have heard from the pulpit, 


from the forum, from the stump, from the corner of the streets, 
everywhere, wherever men do congregate, the principles of our 
government discussed, until those principles have become ‘‘as 
familiar to us as household words.’’ Is there no advantage in this? 
Is there no advantage in beginning early in life to make a subject 


so important our study? Is there no advantage in hearing it 


talked over and canvassed? Is there no advantage in listening 
_to the opinions of those who have made it the study of their 


lives? Why is it, sir, that as soon as the child begins to articulate, 
to lisp in broken accents the idiom of his mother tongue, the fond 
parent commences to teach him his alphabet? Is it not that the 
young mind may early be put in training for several studies; that 
it may gently and quietly unfold itself, and thus proceeding 
onward from step to step, at last, after the long lapse of years, 
be able to master the most abstruse and difficult of the sciences? 
Can a child do all this in a year? Can the full grown man, with 
all his feelings chastened and all his intellectual faculties devel- 
oped? This is not experience. And shall we promulgate to the 
world that a man who knows not a word of our language, who 
never uttered, in our pure Anglo Saxon, the term republican, 
can come here and forthwith understand our institutions better 
than we do? Mr. Chairman, there are such ¢hings as demagogues 
in this country, creatures with a name, but without form or sub- 
stance. O! that I could portray them in all their horrid deform- 
ity;—that I could paint them upon the retina of every man’s 
mind in this convention, in their true colors, in all their utter 
loathsomeness. What reck they of country, of State, of State 
pride, of national prosperity, if they can but carry out their own 
vile schemes of personal aggrandizement? Sir, the practised 


586 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


demagogue has no heart. If he could but gain a vote 
would utter a stump speech upon his mother’s grave, ere 
earth that had been piled upon her bosom has been warmed | 
the rays of the first rising sun. He would mount his fath 
coffin, and hold forth to the wondering multitude, ere all 
pertained to him of mortality had in its dark, narrow, si. 
ous cabin been laid. Sir, it is time that the spirit of demag 
should be looked upon with that contempt, that utter con 
that its low and bastard lineage would seem to require. 
a strong passion. It is confined to no age, no nation, no 
Scotland, old, ancient Scotland, the land of Wallace and of 
has, in these our days of modern degeneracy, become taintec 
tinctured with it. It may be a counterfeit presentment. 
chance the blood of the children of Green Erin may have kb 
mingled with and thrilled through the veins of some of Sc 0 
pretended sons. ay 
But, sir, let me not be misunderstood. I am not opp 
foreigners emigrating to this State. I wish not to prevent 
from settling here. I have always loved and respected the 
and the good of other climes. No matter where they were 
where they lived, or what sun had burned upon their co 
Who of us does not feel a pride in, aye, a love for, our 
country’s mighty dead, as well as her mighty living? If ther 
any-such in our land, they are not truly American in spirit. 
are not such Americans as we would wish all those to be, who cl 
a birthright upon our own free soil. Can we forget, and \ 
we, if we could, forget, how, prior to the Revolution, tl 
Chatham, and Fox, and Burke, and Barre, in England’s 
parliament, lifted up their voices, and poured forth their 
eloquence in favor of the then American colonies? How 
sisted to the last, with argument, with persuasion, aye, eve: 
denunciation, that taxation of the colonies that was prop 
their tyrant king?—how Pitt forewarned him that he was ¢ 
to lose the brightest jewel of his crown? Have we not | 
read and ponder over the glowing pages of Chaucer, and 
and Milton, and Dryden, and him 
‘Who played with the thunder as with a familiar f 
And wove his garland of the lightning’s twist?”’ 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 587 


Shakespeare, too, the child of fancy and of song,—he who 

ed amid the abstruse mysteries of the human mind, and etched 

- the lineaments of the human passions with a pencil of living 

Tight,—he who wrote in our own language, in whose veins coursed 

and thrilled our Anglo Saxon blood,—he who played upon “a 

" arp of a thousand strings, and tuned them all to sweet accord.’ 

x ce. These, all these, are a part and a portion of our own fame. 

They lived in another age, in-another clime. But we claim a 

common origin with them; we love them, and regard them in a 

easure, as a part and a portion of ourselves. Is it notso? And 

Bike hen the gifted and the philanthropic of England’s sons are 

_ spoken of, do we not feel almost as if they were our own country- 

Ri men; and is this not one of the noblest, and proudest traits of 

American character, that we can look across the broad ocean, and 

__ believe, and feel, that the fame of the distinguished scholars, 

" and statesmen, of the mother country but adds luster to our own 

republic? Nor is it to the mother country alone, we offer up a 

grateful remembrance. Sternly we strove with her for the high 

privilege of ruling ourselves, and of becoming, the greatest and 
purest, of the nations of the earth. To have become so, we owe’ 

4 -much to those whose birth was not on our land. Our memories 

_ dwell with a fond delight, upon the noble Pulaski; the generous 

the valourous DeKalb, whose life blood eres the battle- 

oe field of Camden; and above all of Poland’s gallant sons; upon 

' the great and good Kosciusko. Him, of whom the poet has elo- 

quently written: 

““Hope for a season bade the world farewell: 
And.freedom shrieked as Kosciusko fell.’’ _ 
_ Nor is the youthful and generous Montgomery forgotten. He 

_ who despised toil, and laughed hunger and hardships to scorn; 

as he led his valorous continentals, through an unbroken wilder- 

'« hess, to the very mouths of the cannon, that burst on the walls 

_ of Quebec; and there sealed with his blood, his untiring devotion 

_ to freedom. 

Have we not gloried in the bards, heroes, and statesmen of 
Ireland? Have we not mourned the early fate, of her gifted pat- 
riot Emmet? Does not her Fitzgerald, and her Theabold Wolfe 
- Tone live, in unchanging freshness in our memories? Have we 


* 


y 


- elective franchise. 


588 


not named her, the greenest isle of the ocean? H 

our sympathies been aroused at the story of her suffe 
oppressions? How often have our heart-strings thrill 
have heard trilled forth, from manly lips, as well as th 
beauty, the sweet, yet mournful song of ‘“Erin go bragh.’” 
has Germany been unremembered? Kant, Kotzebue, G 
Schiller; they too live, in the hearts of the American peop 
portion of their wide-world fame, is ours, we have wept o1 
untimely fate, while we have read the soul stirring m 
him, of the “‘sword and the lyre.’’ Their countrymen 
us. Connected as we are with them, our memories, 0 
with them to the ‘‘Fatherland;’’ our reading, or our ass 
the feelings that link us to the German emigrant, make u 
with, and lead u& to admire, the great names, that adorn the 


a lingering fondness, often revisits the shrine of their 
greatness; at the same time could the departed worthies, 
have mentioned, be permitted to come among us now, 
lift up their voices, upon the floor of this convention; they 
entreat us, by that holy regard which we should have | 
country; by that love of freedom that knows no pi 
those inestimable rights, of which the present generation 
inheritors, and which our fathers most dearly purchased; 
more securely than we have hitherto done, the pe 


Could such aliens as the illustrious names that I ee re 
to be permitted to go to the polls, there would be no dai 
they would misuse or misapply the privileges granted to 
But there are thousands of their countrymen swarmi 
shores who have not their knowledge, their pride of ch 
their consistency, their judgment, and who possibly mi 


them to exercise this sacred right. Sir, we are asked to reme 
the services of LaFayette. What patriot can forget them? VY 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 589 


above your head, and next, the patriotic, the gallant, the chiv- 
alrous Marquis de Lafayette. And wherever it may be my fortune 


to roam, whether it should be in the sunny clime of his own loved 


France, or upon the inhospitable soil of frozen Russia; whether 
to where the Oregon pours its world of waters “‘in one continuous 
sound,” or where the simoon sweeps over the arid desert, his 
memory and the fame of his deeds will still be with me there. 
And let me tell you, sir, that when, in the days of my boyhood, 
I read the history of our Revolution, I hardly knew which I loved 
the best, and which I honored most, the soldier of my natal land, 
or the foreign soldier that battled by his side. The ardent feel- 
ings of my youth twined around the gallant Frenchman with a 
gratitude but little inferior to that which I felt for my own country- 
men. Nor have the rougher scenes of maturer life obliterated my 
young affections and remembrances. The fire of gratitude still 


_ burns in my bosom, if not with so fierce a glow, yet with a steadier 


flame. And shall it be told to us who have experienced these 
feelings, that we are opposed to foreigners; that we have no phi- 
Janthropy, no kindly feelings for such of them as come to our 
shores with the intention of becoming a part and a portion of our 
government? If they tell us so, they cannot read our hearts;— 
they cannot read what has been inscribed upon the tablets there, 
with a pen so enduring that the black ink of demagoguism cannot 
obliterate a single line. I repeat it again, sir, I am not opposed 
to foreigners coming among us. But I do oppose their voting, 
till they are qualified to give their votes in a judicious, under- 
standing manner, according to their own knowledge and opinions, 
and not by the dictation of partisans and demagogues. Sir, the 
associations of our youth are a part of our being. They are inter- 
woven with the best and finest feelings of our nature. We would 
not part with them if we could; we could not if we would. We 
alllove ourcommon country. We love, particularly love the place 
where our first infant breath was drawn. It is in vain, sir, for 
anyone to tell me that in one year he can forget all the associa- 
tions and remembrances of his youth. Sir, can you forget (and 
you have been in this State some ten years) the brook by which 
in boyhood days you played—the old gray rock by which that 
streamlet flowed—the venerable oak, beneath whose rich, luxuri- 


590. -~—-—« ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE 


these? Do they not live in your memory, as in i 
go back to your own green hills? Time may have di 
love for all these, but still that love lies broad and dee} 
bosoms, ready to gush up whenever the chords of - 
touched. So with the foreigner, when he first arrives 
shores. Are not his thoughts away, in the home he | 
his own loved cabin, in the land of his nativity? — 
otherwise. And if, when an alien comes here he begi 
matize his country, and to speak of it in derogatory 
to have nothing to do with such a man. He is eithe 
who has fled from justice, he is either a felon, or his h 
been attuned to the strongest and most imperishabl 
our nature. There was one of Scotland’s poets, sir, that 
this sentiment more forcibly, more touchingly, than I< 


““Breathes there a man with soul so dead, 
Who never to himself hath said, 

This is my own, my native land; 
Whose heart within him ne’er hath burn 
As home his footsteps he hath turned; 

From wandering on a foreign strand: 
If such there breathe, go mark him well, — 
For him no minstrel raptures swell.’?” 


“The wretch concentered all in self, 
Living shall forfeit fair renown, 
And doubly dying, shall godown 

To the vile earth from whence he sprung, ; 

Unwept, unhonored, and unsung.’ ME 


This is the language of one of Scotia’s noblest 
sentiment more just and true ‘‘was never married to 
verse.’ It is true in the abstract; it is true in fact. Th 
ings are linked with our very being, and the alien ca 
worthy to become an American citizen, in a mome 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 


_ He who will, without a struggle, forget his native country, 
_ forget all his early a:sociations, fling them aside as he would a 
"worn-out garment, will never be of any advantage to his adopted 
- ‘country. In all ages, the traitor has been despised; yet if, while 
living he shall curse his natal land, he but causes himself to be 
- scoffed at and scorned by the worthy and the good. And when he 


"ure, “‘none so vile to do him reverence.’” Who would shed a tear 
over such a man’s grave? Sir, the man who does not love his 
- country, no matter what country may have given him birth, is 
_ not the man that should enlist either our feelings of philanthropy 
_ or generosity. Such a man is a stranger to those emotions and 
_ passions which we desire should be possessed by all whom we 
admit into our great common family. He would prove a traitor, 
_at any time, for a small reward, to his adopted country. Such a 
' man would be regardless of the fame or happiness of the wife of 
_ his bosom, of the children of his affection;—affection! he would 
not know the meaning of the word. Show me the man who can 
_ fling from him the associations of his early life, the endearing 
recollections of his childhood’s home, and I will show you in return 
_ a man adequate to any villainous deed—a man on all occasions 
- _ fipe “‘for treason, strategems, and spoils.’’ Sir, it has been argued 
08 upon this floor, that every man that pays taxes should have a 
-\ voice in making the laws by which he is governed; that when we 
_ tax the foreigner, and do not permit him to vote, as a necessary 
_ consequence, he becomes exceedingly dissatisfied. What do 
_ gentlemen require? Do they not ask for the alien what he would 
_ not ask for himself, especially if his own free will was not biased 
by petty demagogues and corrupt partisans. In our progress up 
to the present period of the existence of our government, we have 
so conducted it as to challenge the admiration, perhaps the envy 
of the world. We have acquired great fame abroad. Have 
foreigners helped to exalt that fame? Do they give us a prouder 
and brighter name? I must say that I was somewhat surprised 
to hear the gentleman from Massac assert, that the alien popula- 
tion who come among us, almost without exception, were men of 
character, wealth, knowledge, and respectability. Is the gentle- 
man well informed upon the subject of which he has spoken? I 


ae GN an Ih aS a cae | 


592 «ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC1 


am inclined to think he is not, when he permits hi 
such statements as I have referred to. JI am sorry that 
man is not better informed; that he does not better un 


spoken. These aliens emigrate to our shores; we recei 
with open arms; we extend over them the aegis of our 
protect them against the tyranny of the dynasties of Eur 
make them equal upon their arrival, almost, with our citiz 
and yet it is asked of us, what do you do for them? — 
taxes, perform road labor, and you do nothing for them 
Sir, is it not something to feed the starving millions th 
hastened, and are now hastening to our shores? Do we no: 
them to become owners of our soil? Do we not put th 
way of procuring a comfortable subsistence, for themselves 
their families? Do we not exempt them from militia traini 
and from sitting on juries until they become naturalized? 
is it not right that they should render something in re 
all this? Is it not right that they should help to make th 
on which they travel? Why, the arguments of the gentle 
who have addressed the committee, in opposition to this 
seems to be, that those aliens who come to us to better th 
dition, should be placed a head and shoulders above tho: 


cause to comaphaie: Should they not be requitddle to pay 2 
tax, as a partial equivalent for these advantages? It is 


tax they would have to pay, so far from being a burthen or 
is absolutely nothing, in comparison to the advantages 
they derive from the privilege of settling among se and of 
governed and protected by our laws. 

It has been said, that we want our State filled up, an 
therefore we should hold out every inducement in our po 
increase immigration. Will the right class of aliens, such 
should be happy and proud to call citizens, after an appre 
ship of five years, be at all affected by the alteration we p 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 593 


_ make? It they have determined to settle upon our rich soil, and 


to cultivate it, will the altering our constitution alter their deter- 
mination? Not at all. But I honestly believe the well informed 
foreigner would like us all the better for it. An alien cannot sit 
upon a jury until he is naturalized. And yet there are members 
of this convention so inconsistent as to desire them to be per- 
mitted to help elect the judges of our courts. Sir, the alien can 


vote for all offices, from a president down to a constable. He 


cannot sit upon a jury, to try a case of a few dollars between his 
neighbors, till he is naturalized. Yet he can help to elect the 
judge that, in one sense, has our fortunes, our liberty, our lives 
at his disposal! What a splendid inconsistency. 

But, sir, I will say a few words in relation to the increase of 
our foreign population. In 1812, there was but one alien in this 
country to every forty persons native born. How was it in 1846? 
There was one alien to every six persons born upon our soil. In 
1846 there came to our ports, and by way of Canada, to this 
country, 500,000 emigrants. In the present year, the number 
will amount to at least 1,000,000! And if immigration continues 
to increase at this ratio, how long will it be before the alien popu- 
lation will exceed our own? Should we not be fearful of the 
consequences? Does not history furnish us with some useful exam- 
ples? Letuslook back to the once famous republic of Switzerland; 
let us reflect upon her fate when she threw open her gates for the 
admission of the people of other nations. From that moment 
may the story of her decline be dated. Soon the star of her 
greatness, which had so long culminated in northern Europe, 
begins to decline, until finally it disappeared beneath the horizon. 
Aye—the once proud mistress of the Adriatic—she whose ships 
went forth to every port—whose citizens were called the bankers 
of the world; whose merchants were princes; whose winged lion 
of St. Marks had flaunted to the breeze of every clime, fell, in 
consequence of the admission of a foreign population. Had Rome 
in the days of her imperial greatness been content with her own 
citizens, Attila would never have thundered at the gates of the 
“Eternal City.’’ 

We should ponder over these things, and if we are not too self- 
willed to derive instruction from the experience of past nations, I 


504 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEt 


think we cannot fail to be convinced that we I 
thing to fear, should this immense amount of fore 
permitted to vote without first swearing allegiane 
government, ig 

It has been said by the gentleman from Massac that. 
the emigrants that come here, are well prepared to imm 
become good citizens; that they are well informed as to t 
of our government, and to the duties and privileges of its citi: 
that they are wealthy, and that they are a desirable class 0 
lation. Sir, I will point him to a single State—to the Sta 
Massachusetts. And I refer to that State because 1 am more 
iar with the condition of her affairs than any other State exc 
our own. What does the gentleman suppose that that St 
yearly for the support of her foreign pauper popula 
pays about seventy thousand dollars—being not more tha 
ten thousand dollars less than the expense of her iS g 
ment. Is this a population of such a character as we would ¢ 
have come here? 1 believe not. I do not mean to be under 
as asserting that they are all of this description. om am 1 


multitudes who are fleeing from the « oppression wick the 
ence in the nations of Europe—who are fleeing from starvati 
tyranny, and fastening themselves upon us. Well, sir, 
little State of Massachusetts, not more than one-tenth i 
large in territorial extent as the State we live i in, has to p 
sum of seventy thousand dollars for the support of foreign p 
what must the State of New York pay ?—and what must t 


the Atlantic States will not always retain these masses | 
paupers. The time will come, when tired of support 
they will pay the expense of their transportation to. our Vv 
prairies. They will fasten themselves upon as a afte 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 595 


whole present population of the United States. By that time 
ere will, in all probability, be within this State a number of 
S foreign voters equal to the native voters; and these men in one 
year are to be permitted (all uninformed and unprepared as they 
are to give their votes knowingly and discreetly), to go to the 
‘polls with citizens, and exercise the privilege of the elective fran- 
chise. Is this right? I ask you again, sir, are we not making this 
| privilege too cheap? Are we not making it so cheap, that soon 
it will not be worth possessing? If you make no distinction as to 
_ yoting, between him who was born upon a foreign soil, and him 
_ who was born upon American soil, will it any longer be considered 
_ a privilege to have been born an American? Sir, I was early 
taught to believe that he who was born an American had some 
_ privileges above the rest of mankind. I have been taught that 
ours was a free government, a government of equal rights; but it 
hi seems, sir, from what we have heard on the floor of this conven- 
ai tion, that the right of the citizen is to be disregarded, trampled 
‘upon—that aliens are to be put over our heads, and that those of 
us who have been so unfortunate as to draw our first breath in 
_ this country, are to surrender up every right that we have fondly 
__ fancied we possessed, and quietly submit to the intrusions of a 
set of men imbued with foreign prejudices and foreign feelings. 
_ + Mr. Chairman: the gentleman from Massac asks the ques- 
tion, how it is possible that those who have taken a solemn oath 
_ to support the constitution of the United States, can vote in favor 
_ of the proposition that those aliens who shall be entitled to a vote 
at the time that the constitution, we are now framing, shall be 
__ adopted, shall be permitted to continue the exercise of the elective 
franchise, without being subjected to the same conditions that 
are imposed upon those foreigners who shall come to our State 
after the adoption of the new constitution? I will endeavor to 
_ answer that question. Sir, I had no part in framing the old con- 
__ stitution of this State; no man.who is a member of this convention 
is was a member of that body that framed our first constitution. 
_ The constitution went forth to the people; it was sanctioned by 
_ them; it thus became the organic law of the land; but rights were 
acquired under it; and I sincerely believe that those rights are in- 
_alienable and immutable, and I should be doing that which I 


596 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


never mean to do, and which in my heart I believe to be w 
if I should lend my aid to suppress rights now existing in framii 
a new organic law. For one, I shall never give my consent, 
my sanction, to an ex post factolaw. The ruined credit and blig 
ed prosperity of our State, speaks in thunder tones to those m 
bers of a past legislature who attempted such an innova 
It is no part of our duty to encroach upon rights acquired, o1 
affect the privileges of foreigners who have come into this S 
with the expectation of enjoying such privileges as they shou 
acquire under the law of the land. It would be morally as 
as politically wrong to deprive them of rights obtained, and y whi 
they were entitled to enjoy under the organic law that exis 
when they came into the State. I have another objection to of 
to the amendment now under discussion,—permitting foreigners 
vote after a residence in this State of two years; but I appro 
this. part of the subject with fear and trembling; and how car 
be otherwise. The gentleman from Jefferson, a few days sin 
in the plentitude of his legal knowledge, said that there was | 
man in this convention could bring forward a single constitutic 
argument against any State permitting foreigners to vote w. 
ever they pleased. This is high ground; but the alien cham Dic 
has taken it, and how well he has maintained it, is not for m 
this time to say. If he can measure men’s minds, and comp 
hend their thoughts, even before they are uttered, ae he 
possessed of most wonderful gifts. } 
It is, if we believe at all in the constitution ig He Unit 
States, in my opinion, in direct collision with one of its articles | 
a State to permit an alien to vote until that alien should hz 
become naturalized. The framers of our time-honored % 
revered constitution, were men of learning, patriotism, integt 
They had no sinister views to accomplish. Their deliberat 
were the deliberations of sturdy and inflexible patriots. 
deliberations of men framing an organic law for a mighty na‘ 
True, that nation was then, comparatively, but upon the thre: 
hold of being. It was in one sense, but an infant in its swaddli 
clothes—and most dearly did that noble land love that i 
There were no mock caresses there. They acted, not only for 
generation that then lived, but for the coming peitetanants th 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 597 


should float adown the tide of time. The spirit of demagogism 
was hushed in that body—or rather, it was not permitted to in- 
trude itself among them. A high, a holy, a generous desire to 
make us a great and a good people—to dispense equal rights and 
equal justice, as well to him who should dwell by the frozen streams 
“of the Kennebec and Penobscot, as to him who should dwell on 
the sunny banks of the St. Mary’s, was uppermost in their patriot 


4 Among other articles incorporated in the constitution of the 
¥ United States, we find one requiring an uniform system of natural- 
ization in all the States of the Union. Why was this? Had it no 
_ import? Has it no meaning? If it was the intention of the 
_ framers of the constitution of the United States, to permit the 
' various States to regulate the time when aliens should be per- 
_ mitted to vote, why should the provisions I have referred to been 
incorporated into the constitution? Did they intend an alien 
should vote before he became a citizen? Did they intend that 
soon’ after they had freed themselves from a foreign bondage, that 
an alien should come to our shores, and before he became a citizen 
exercise one of the dearest privileges of an American freeman? 
If that was their intention, why did they couch that provision in 
such ambiguous language? For it does appear to me, that if they 
intended to leave it to the States to regulate the qualifications, as 
to time, of their alien voters, that their language is exceedingly 
dark and very ambiguous; very different from the clear and lucid 
language, and evident intention, that is found in every other part 
_of that sacred instrument. I can.have but one opinion respecting 
the intention and the meaning of that clause of the constitution; 
and that is, that no alien in any of the States should be permitted 
_to vote until he has become naturalized. If it were otherwise, 
would not a right so fraught with consequences, either for good 
_ or evil, as the elective franchise is, been further explained. Would 
there not a following clause have been inserted giving to the States 
the power to regulate the qualifications of their foreign voters? 
At the time of the formation of the constitution of the United 
States, the tide of emigration was setting with a strong and rapid 
_ current towards this our Western continent. The dynasties, the 
‘corruptions of the old world, were falling into disrepute. Many 


598 


portion of our new experiment. Our Fathers did not 
desire that these soldiers of fortune should partake of, and i imm 
ately become connected with our government, —not at least 
they have been put upon trial; and then when their term of ap 
ticeship should have expired; phe they had demeaned themsely 
as good citizens; when they had sworn to renounce all allegi 
to foreign potentates, princes and powers; to support the or 
tution of the United States—they were to be received into 
Brotherhood of American freemen—enjoying all their rights 
partaking of all their privileges and immunities. Can : 
seriously suppose, when he looks back to the period of the for 
tion of our constitution, when he makes himself familiar witl 
history of those times, that it is not a violation both of the 
and the meaning of the constitution of the United States to p 
aliens to vote until they have become naturalized? Ours 1 
only State in the Union, I believe, that permits it. 
If this is so, are we not committing a wrong upon other Sta 
We have the illustrious example of older States before us. Doe 
it not become us, then, as one of the younger branches fe 
great confederacy, to pay at least a decent respect to long ¢ est 
lished precedents? < 
Mr. Chairman, the time may come when the vote of the § 
of Illinois will determine the election of President and Vice 
dent of the United States, and the unnaturalized alien may 
mine the majority of this State. If such an event should | 
happen, would not our sister States have great and good 
to complain to us? Would they not say, and with j justi 
that the votes of the Union had been disregarded, and men 
no allegiance to our government had been permitted to elect 
of the highest dignitaries of our land? If such a circu 
should ever transpire, would it not redound to the disadvai 
of the alien? We all know that during a Presidential contest 1 
are high hopes and wild excitement in every bosom. Men 
sions are aroused, their energies awakened. The spirit f 
quest is with them. If then the alien votes of Illinois shoul 
defeat any party in such a contest, I ask again, would it r 
worse for the alien? Would not those who by their means 


THURSDAY, JULY 20, 1847 599 


been defeated in their wishes strive to put aliens upon a longer 
‘a period of probation? And would not the chances be that the law 
- would be altered; that ten, fifteen, or twenty years would be sub- 
tuted in place of five? 

Sir, ours is an elective government; and being an elective gov- 
‘ernment, in whom resides, and to whom is given the elective 
franchise? Is it not vested in the people? Did it not originate in 
them? If this be true, the elective franchise is a sovereign power, 
_ and should not be trusted with, aye, it cannot be conferred upon 


“A republican government like ours, ae from the govern- 
_ ments of the old world. There, in many of their governments 
the king frames their constitution and enacts their laws,—or at 
least they are the offspring of his recommendation. Ours is a 
_self-constituted government—a political corporation, whose con- 
_ stitution was the work of the people, and their posterity the 
- members of the corporation. After this corporation has gone 
- into existence, can an alien become a member of it at his will? 
‘Must there not be two contracting parties? Have not the mem- 
bers of that corporation a voice in the matter? Can an alien join 
_ them, or force himself into their midst without some express agree- 

ment on their part to receive him? Is there any way by which an 
alien can engage his allegiance to this country, and be favorably 
received by it, except by naturalization? Then, should he be 
allowed to vote before he becomes a citizen? Never! sir; never! 
Reason, common sense, sound policy, the express will of the 
general government, all forbid it, imperatively forbid it. And I 
_ do say, sir, from the love I have for that class of our population— 
__ for I have many friends among them—that it is for their interest, 
_ for our interest, for the interest of us all, that they should be 
_ naturalized before they are permitted to enjoy the privileges of 
the elective franchise. 

As I am aware, Mr. Chairman, that the committee is some- 
_what exhausted, I shall not pursue this argument as far as I origi- 
nally intended. I shall, however briefly notice some of the remarks 
__ that fell from the lips of gentlemen upon this floor, and then leave 
__ the subject to be disposed of by the committee. There was a 
_ remark made by the gentleman from Cook, sir, that I cannot 


600 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIC 


pass over in silence. The gentleman asserted that those of u 
were in favor of requiring the alien to become naturalized, be! 
he should be entitled to exercise the privilege of the electiy 
franchise, were acting more harshly towards the emigrant 
George III did towards the American colonies. Sir, there 1 
part of my being that allows of no contradiction. I love 1 
country; I love her laws; I love her institutions; and I am re 
at all times, and upon all occasions, to peril the last drop of n 
heart’s blood in defense of them. Sir, the heritage of freed 
was mine; upon her holy altars my infancy was consecrated; 
I shall cling to those altars so long as this heart continues to 
as long as the purple current shall circulate through my veins. 
My eyes were first opened upon this free soil; and I trust in € 
that when they shall be closed forever they shall be closed upo 
the same broad domain. Sir, the remark of the gentleman fr 
Cook was unkind. I am no tenant by sufferance. I need 1 
teachings in the school of republicanism. If I ever should, I wi 
to exercise a freeman’s privilege, and select a master for myse 
And when I do make the selection, it shall be one whose ea 
devotions were offered up at the shrine of freedom; not one 
whose bosom more strongly glides the spirit of demagogis: 
than that of American patriotism. Sir, in passing, I will allu 
to another remark of the gentleman from Cook. It was thi 
‘‘ought you not to hang your heads for very shame, to advoc 
such doctrines as you do?’ And this addressed to Ame! 
citizens, and one of them my venerable friend from Tazewell, 
has stood up here in his place, with his head sprinkled o’er with 
frosts of many winters, and frankly and freely declared his sen 
ments; sentiments emanating from a heart purely Ameri 
from a heart responding to no tones but the tones of patriot 
and he is asked to hang his head in shame! And by whom 
By a boy—a very stripling—who, according to his own acknow 
edgment, is but ¢hirteen!—but thirteen, as far as his knowle 
of the institutions of this country is concerned. He dictating 
an honorable—respectable—venerable—AmeERIcAN citizen! | 

Shall I, too, hang my head for very shame, for daring here 
the hall of this Convention, to utter my opinions regarding | 
countrymen of the gentleman from Cook, or even my own count 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 6c1 


men? No, sir. I fear him not. I fear neither his hordes or his 
_ clans;—nor did I ever fear; and, I trust in God, I never shall, 
_ that fiery spirit of demagogism that breathes in every sentiment 
He he has uttered. American citizens to hang their heads for shame, 
_ for daring here, in an assembly of the people’s representatives, to 
_ advocate what they honestly believe to be just and right! O, 
how exceedingly modest it was in the young man!!! Sir, had I 
been placed in his situation, I would sooner have burned my right 
arm off to the very shoulder, than to have uttered such a senti- 
ment in the presence of a free people. Nor did my worthy friend 
from Tazewell escape scot-free from other gentlemen, in this 
debate. The little state of Rhode Island seems to have been the 
target set up to be shot at, by the petty marksmen of the opposi- 
tion. And my venerable friend from Tazewell appears to have been 
the bull’s-eye at which they have aimed their shafts of vitupera- 
tion. But they have all fallen harmless at his feet. Sir, allow 
me to allude, for a moment, to the attack made upon that little 
state, and her own “‘bald eagle,’’ in the halls of Congress. There 
was a time when the bird-hawks of that body made a simultaneous 
dash, at the old ‘‘bald eagle’? of Rhode Island. The marks of 
that eagle’s talons, and the impression made by the stroke of his 
wings, they will carry with them to their graves. Cambreleng, 
and Wickliffe, and Daniel, will remember, to the latest period of 
their lives, the withering satire with which their ungenerous 
attack was repulsed. Mr. Chairman, there are miniature Cam- 
brelengs, and Wickliffes and Daniels in this Convention. And 
when, on the other day, an attack was made upon Rhode Island, 
and upon my venerable friend from Tazewell, I could not help 
wishing that Tristram Burgess could have been here, to defend 
his little state. I know my worthy friend from Tazewell has all 
the spirit, and at least a portion of the power of his ancient friend, 
to do it;—but his hands are tied; he is bound by the ligaments of 
our holy religion. He will not 
—stoop, from his pride of place, 
To hawk at mousing owls. 

There is another remark of the gentleman from Cook, that 
deserves a passing notice. It is this: ‘“The natural tendency of 
the Americans is towards aristocracy, and they need an infusion 


602 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC 
of foreign blood in their veins to preserve its purity.” 
strange and a bold doctrine; and yet he has asserted it upo 
thority of the sage of Lindenwold! I will not undertak: 
that Mr. Van Buren has uttered such a sentiment; I can 
that I never heard of it before. And if Mr. Van Buren hz 
such language, he has certainly departed from that usual 
ness which he has always had the credit of possessing. 

We, the descendants of those men who passed thr 
storms of the Revolution;—who have, ourselves, expe! 
darkness and shadows, as well as somewhat of sunshi 
unable to maintain the purity of our institutions? We ob 
procure assistance from the broken systems of Europe, a 
imbibe a portion of the spirit of those who cringe, and fawn, 
the thrones of the Old Continent, to bolster up the tott 
fabric of our Government! What man, who has always be 
republican, can submit, quietly and tamely, to be told, tha 
order to perpetuate our institutions, it is necessary an infusic 
foreign blood should be thrown into our veins?—that oun 


corrupt nobility, or their-born and willing serfs, in oui 
. free government may be sustained? What, is there not 


untarnished, our own free constitution ?—to piotenee it fa 1 
encroachments of American aristocracy? Sir, I do not say 
the expression the gentleman from Cook attributes to 
Buren is a forgery; I only say that I never heard of it before. 
it pass for its true value. There are many other remark 
gentleman from Cook that I should be glad to correct, but 
no time to do so now. I will pass to the gentleman from 
A day or two since, he gave us a long historical disserta’ 
was somewhat amused, and instructed also, with the | 
lore which he so profusely scattered among us. Certainly 
entitled to great credit for his historical researches, and h 
rate information. All must admit that he has made dis 
that no one else ever dreamed of. When I heard the ge 
declare that the feudal system originated among the Rom 
confess I was somewhat startled at the profundity of h 
edge, and his penetrating shrewdness., I would like, hows 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 603 


it was that the feudal system was instituted; or, if it might not 
have been instituted by him who was called ‘‘the noblest Roman 
of them all?’’ There is another observation of the gentleman 
from Brown, that claims a momentary notice. He said, in com- 
menting upon the acute and astute remarks of the gentleman 
from Cook, that he (the gentleman from Cook) had enjoyed higher 
privileges than those that belong to a native American citizen, for 
the reason that he had been born in another clime, and upon 


another soil. If the gentleman from Brown considered this a 


higher privilege, he is welcome to enjoy it. 

A plain republican soil, and the sun that shines and the stars 
that glisten upon that soil, are good enough for me, sir. It was 
upon a republican soil that I was born. I ask no purer earth to 
cover my bosom, when the spirit shall have departed from my 
body. A higher birth! Is there a higher heritage that God’s 
sun ever shone upon, than that of an American freeman? Would 
we barter it for the privilege of being born under the dominion of 
principalities and thrones? No, sir; the American whose bosom 
is imbued with the spirit of patriotism—who loves his country as 
he should love it—asks no prouder heritage, requires no nobler 
privilege, than to live and die in the land of his birth. If the fancy 
and imagination of the gentleman from Brown still lingers around 
the crumbling dynasties of the old world, let him go there—God 
speed him! We can spare him. 

Sir, I have a word of reply to the argument of the other gentle- 
man from Cook;—I mean the gentleman from Cook. He asserted 
that two-thirds of our standing army was composed of foreigners. 
In time of peace, it may be so; and I think this fact, sir, a high 
compliment to American freemen. My countrymen are unwilling 
to enter the regular army in time of peace; they have higher and 
nobler avocations to perform;—those, more consonant with the 
spirit and genius of an enlightened patriotism. They are engaged 
in developing the resources of our common country; in agricultural, 


___ mercantile, and manufacturing transactions. They are better 


employed than they would be in shouldering a musket and march- 


ing through our towns and cities, to the music of the fife and drum. 
In time of peace, to the enterprising citizen, the regular army has 


604 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO 


tf 


no charms, or inducements; an active, striving, eh 
part of his being. Not so with many of the aliens. They 
among us without any particular fixed principles; they have n 
chart to guide or to govern them. In the land of their pita a 


accustomed to its idleness, they soon seek, after ‘hae arivel 
privilege of again partaking of their favorite indulgence; and 
the trumpet of war should call them to the field, they fight, 
they fight mechanically, unsupported by those feelings that 1 
fluence the citizens that battle for home and for freedom. Thx 
may fight, but they fight as the men of Hesse Cassel did, du 
our revolution, for pay, simply for their eight dollars per mo 
It is not so with our volunteer aliens, they stand in our ra 
shoulder to shoulder, with our citizens, and they seek the - 
not for war’s sake, but for the love they bear their adopted coun 
Sir, were they all foreigners that fought the battles of Palo 
and Resaca de la Palma? Those battles were won by our r 
army, and the most of those men who battled there were our 
countrymen. 


and our navy, is borne to every clime, by ships manned by foie g 
ers. Sir, has it come to this, are we so weak, so pitiful, so con- 
temptible, that we have to Boece aliens to bear the stars and 
stripes, aye, and sustain their honor too, in foreign ports? 
him turn his vision to the Pacific ocean, methinks, he would st 
if he should so do, some few scattering ships, riding upon 


stormy billows. Who mans those ships? Are their crews | 


ever ready to fight as long as a single plank of the ship that 
them remains above water? Sir, did aliens carry our flag abroa 
during the last \ war with England; or was it done by the ma 


men who, when the tocsin of war sounded in our ee y 
selected to sustain the honor, and the glory of our navy. 
were the men who manned the decks of the glorious old Constit 
tion, and with their colors nailed to the mast-head, roamed ovet 
every ocean. With the stars and the stripes floating over 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 7847. 605 


MS: they everywhere sought the British Cruisers; and in the smoke of 


battle, while the dead were around them, while the shrieks of the 
wounded were ringing in their ears, they thought but of their 
country, their noble ship, and the proud flag that was flying over 
them. It was to men like these, the destinies of that gallant ship 
was entrusted. Before they would have surrendered to their foe, 
they would have gone down, frigate, crew, flag and all; to those 
depths that know no sounding. Such are the men, sir, that have 
given character, and tone, and immortality to our navy. And, sir, 
it will be to men such as these, born upon our own soil; from the 
cradle familiar with the ocean, to whom her honor, and fame, will 
be entrusted, if again Britannia should strive to rule the ocean. 
The gentleman from Jo Daviess told us yesterday, that when 
a charge was to be made upon an enemy, foreigners were the men 
selected by our officers to make it? Ah! it pains me much to hear 
an enlightened gentleman, in a deliberative assembly of a country 
claiming to be the birth-place of freedom, promulgating to the 
world, that our success in arms, depends, not upon our own brav- 
ery, but upon the skill and courage of men of other lands. 
Perhaps the sentiment announced by the gentleman from Jo 
Daviess, may go abroad. It may be copied into the London and 
Paris Journals, that the late Secretary of the State of Illinois, did 
admit in his place, upon the floor of this convention, that when a 
daring charge was to be made upon an enemy, we did not depend 
upon ourselves, but depended upon foreigners to accomplish it. 
A pretty commentary this would be upon our native courage. I 
will ask the gentleman, if his conscience will permit him, thus to 
desecrate the memory of those of our countrymen, who have 
achieved a victory, whenever an enemy has been met, upon the 
plains [of] Mexico? Ifhe would desecrate the memories of those 
gallant spirits, who have poured out their life blood in fighting the 
battles of their country? If he would desecrate the memory of 
the gallant Hardin, whose obsequies a few short days ago we 
witnessed? I think I could name some, sir, who at Buena Vista, 
charged the enemy tolerably well, although they were not foreign- 
ers. Sir, did foreigners fight the battle of Bunker’s Hill? Was 
it not fought by men who left their ploughs standing in their own 
native fields, and rushed with true American courage to the 


bth. Pe 


606 


desperate battle? 
Boston, with the best blood of English irr 
men, high-minded men, natives of the land for whom 
“‘who knew their rights, and knowing dared maint 
Who charged the Hessians ‘at Bennington? Were they - 
or were they the sturdy mountaineers of Vermont and N 
shire, who with their own stalwart arms, dealt death at ey 
Sir, it is in vain for gentlemen to talk to us, of the supe! 
foreign courage, over that of our own. So to talk, is uny 
the character of a high-minded and intelligent statesman. 
Sir, it has been told to us, during this debate, that V 
spoone, Morris, Braxton, and others foreigners, suppo 
Declaration of our Independence; that great charter of o 
ties. True, they did so, and I ask you, sir, if they did n 
they signed that instrument, pledge their lives, their fortun 
their sacred honor, to its support; could there be a highe 
of naturalization than this? Sir, was it not one 
kinds of naturalization that immediately emanates from tl 
of Deity itself? The highest that is given to sublunary 


this country their own by adoption; and there will al 
great and good men of other nations, settling among us 
us remember that we are now framing an organic law, 
last for centuries. And that while there may be m 
some bad men will come to our country. Let us require of 
to linger a while upon our shores before they are permitte 
partake of the privileges of the elective franchise. 

One word more in conclusion, Mr. Chairman, and I 
to trouble the committee. It was said by the gentleman 
Brown, that it was by chance we were born here. That th 


Africa. It is evident to me that I could not very well hav 
born a negro, or if I had been, I think I could have ee 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 607 


_ ship their God according to the dictates of their own consciences, 
in the morasses, and amid the pestilential fogs of Holland? Was 
‘it by chance they embarked at Delfthousen; the forlorn hope of a 
_ mighty world, cabined and confined in two vessels? Was it by 
a chance they wended their cheerless way through the storms and 
winds of the ocean, to a wild and unbroken wilderness? In that 
_ wilderness to encounter the snow wreaths, and unpitying blasts 
of winter, and the scorching sun and remorseless pestilence of 
summer; the tomahawk, and the scalping knife of the red savage; 
continued hardship, and grim and unrelenting famine? Was it 
by chance that from a little band of about one hundred Puritans 
a sprung up a population of three millions of souls; ready to declare 
themselves free and independent? Was it by chance that when 
_ they found oppression and kingly tyranny following them to 
their new home, that they were ready to resist it even to the death? 
_ Was it by chance they endured the horrors of war through a period 
_ of deep and dark distress; and eventually came out from the 
struggle, bearing aloft the magnificent charter of our freedom, 
wet with the blood of our sires; that charter won by stern courage 
at the cannon’s mouth, by the bayonet’s point? Was it by chance 
that from three millions, we now number twenty millions? No, 
no, no. It was by the fiat of the eternal God. By that fiat 
of Him who unrolled yonder blue scroll, and wrote upon its high 
frontispiece, the legible gleamings of immortality. By that fiat 
of Him who paints the bow of promise amid banners of storms; 
and unchains the lightnings, that linger, and lurk, and play, and 
flash, amid the gloom. It was the fiat of Him who gave to the 
Leviathan his home, deep in the unsounded bosom of the ocean; 
__and hangs out the stars that deck the dewy brow of night. It 
_ was the fiat of Him who gave to the Eagle his eyrie, high up amid 
the mountain storm; and to the dove, her tranquil home, in the 
woods, that echo to the minstrelsy of her moans.] 


Mr. WHITESIDE rose, not to detain the committee by a 
speech, but as he had heard insinuations thrown out during the 
_ debate against the intelligence of the framers of our present 
constitution he desired to repel those insinuations. They were 

men of good, sense and intelligence. Our state was settled by 


608 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


That was chet time when every man depended for his life on he 
neighbor; and they asked not where he was born. In that hour 7 i 
danger the foreign settler was found to turn out as ‘teadily a as” 
any other. A warm feeling for them grew up from that time, 
and the same feeling towards them was felt by the framers of the 
constitution, and the insinuation that those fathers of the 7 
knew not the difference between “citizen” and “inhabitant”’ 
false. I had a conversation with a gentleman from Kentucky 
who was the one who drew mp that constitution, and when it was" 
first reported it contained “citizen” in it, but the old men of 
Illinois struck it out. They did understand the meaning of the 
word “inhabitant.” He believed the people of his county were 
in favor of allowing aliens to vote, provided they at the earliest — 
moment become citizens. With that view he had drawn up the 
amendment that had been accepted by the member from St. Clair, — 
as a modification of his own. If any one after being here val 


citizen. The great majority of them desire to become citize: \. 
and do so, and are worthy of the privilege. That a bad man 
could be occasionally found was not strange, and if the same rule © 
were applied and no Americans allowed to vote except those 
who were worthy of the privilege, many would be excluded. He 
run against such a one the other day, who said he hoped our — 
armies in Mexico might be defeated, and that a curse would fall — 
upon our nation. He hoped the amendment would be adopted. © 
And the committee divided on the amendment and it w 
rejected—yeas 61, nays 76. 
Mr. MASON rowed to amend so as to require an oath of alle ; 
giance &c., from those here now; which was rejected. , 
Messrs. Knox, Dawson and Mason offered amendments — 
proposing additional restrictions, and they were all rejected. 
Sec. 2. All elections shall be by ballot. ; 
Mr. BALLINGALL moved to add to the section— ‘provided 
that the Legislature may change at any time the mode of voting 
to viva voce.’ 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 609 


_ Mr. KITCHELL opposed the amendment. 
And the amendment was rejected. 
_ Mr. WHITESIDE moved to strike out the section. And 
the motion was rejected. 
Sections 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 and 8 were passed without amendment. 
; Mr. Z. CASEY moved the committee rise and report the 
" article to the Convention without amendment. It is as follows: 
. Sec. 1. In all elections every white male citizen, above the 
age of twenty-one years, having resided in the state one year 
v3 next preceding any election, shall be entitled to vote at such 
election; and every white male inhabitant of the age aforesaid, 
i 
who may be a resident of the state at the time of the adoption 
of this constitution, shall have the right of voting as aforesaid; 
_ but no such citizen or inhabitant shall be entitled to vote except 
im the district or county in which he shall actually reside at the 
time of such election. 

Mr. SCATES moved to lay the article on the table, to be 
taken up at a future time; which motion was decided in the 
negative. ; 

The question recurring on the adoption of the article— 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved it be voted on section by section; 

which was agreed to. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to amend the first section by 
inserting, &c. (The same amendment as proposed by Mr. Roman, 
in committee, with the term changed to two years instead of 
one.) 

“Mr. KITCHELL moved that the section and amendment be 
passed over informally for the present. Rejected. 

Mr. BOSBYSHELL moved the Convention adjourn. Decided 
in the negative. 

Mr. SCATES moved a call of the Convention. 

Messrs. ServANT, GEDDES, TURNBULL and others objected. 
Upon a division, a call was ordered—yeas 70, nays 40. 

The call was made, and all present except 15 members. 

The question being on the amendment of Mr. ARMSTRONG, 
the yeas and nays were demanded and taken—yeas 66, nays 77. 

The yeas and nays were as follows: 
YEAS—Allen, Anderson, Archer, Armstrong, Atherton, Blair, 


. 


Sister Sarto lsh ot alist Sn Aid 
\ - mak ry 


610° ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COL} 


Aeah Ballingall, Ch Boshysely 


Woodford, Cloud: Churchill, Davis of Massac, Dawent: D 
Farwell, Green of Clay, Gregg, Hatch, Hayes, Heacock, He 
son, Hill, Hoes, Hogue, Hunsaker, James, Jenkins, Jones, K 
Kinney of St. Clair, Kitchell, Lasater, Lenley, McClure, 
Markley, Moffett, Morris, Nichols, Oliver, Pace, Robbins, R. 
Rountree, Scates, Stadden, Sherman, Smith of Gallatin, ‘Tho 
son, Tutt, Vernor, Witt, Whiteside.—66. 
NAYS—Adams, Canady, Choate, Constable, Cross of V 
bago, Church, Dale, Davis of Montgomery, Davis of Mc 
Dawson, Deitz, Dummer, Dunn, Dunsmore, Edwards of Ma 
Edwards of Sangamon, Eccles, Evey, Frick, Graham, Ge 
Green of Jo Daviess, Green of Tazewell, Grimshaw, Ha 
Harper, Harvey, Hay, Holmes, Hurlbut, Jackson, Judd, Kn 
Jersey, Knapp of Scott, Kenner, Kinney of Bureau, Kno 
Knox, Lander, Lemon, Lockwood, Logan, McCallen, Marsha 
Coles, Marshall of Mason, Mason, Matheny, Mieure, Mi e 
Minshall, Northcott, Palmer of Marshall, Pratt, Peters, Pinck ne 
Rives, Robinson, Sharpe, Swan, Spencer, Servant, Sibley, S$ 
Simpson, Singleton, Smith of Macon, Thomas, Thornton, 
bull, Turner, Tuttle, Vance, Webber, West, Williams, Wh 
Woodson, Worcester.—78. , 
Absent—Akin, Bond, Edmonson, Harlan, Hawley, Mh 
Laughlin, Loudon, McCully, McHatton, Moore, Norton, P. 
of Macoupin, Powers, Shields, Shumway, Trower and Weac 
Mr. DALE, when called upon to vote, said that his own 
and sentiments were in favor of the amendment, but the 
of his county thought differently, and he regretted that he 
compelled to vote in the negative. “ 
Mr. BOSBYSHELL offered the same amendment, wit 
term changed to three years. And the vote being taken b 
and nays, resulted—yeas 67, nays 76, as follows: 
YEAS—Allen, Anderson, Archer, Armstrong, Atherton, 
Blakely, Ballingall, Brockman, Bosbyshell, Brown, Bi 
Butler, Crain, Caldwell, Campbell of Jo Daviess, Campbell « 
McDonough, Carter, F. S. Casey, Zadoc Casey, Colby, Cross | 


ee fee Le eo es Ree aM. eee 
+ he Wie asa ‘: ¥ 


. THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 x 
Woodford, Cloud, Churchill, Dale, Davis of Massac, Dement, 
nlap, Farwell, Green of Clay, Gregg, Hatch, Hayes, Heacock, 
a Jenderson, Hill, Hoes, Hogue, Hunsaker, James, Jenkins, Jones, 

et. Kinney of St. Clair, Kitchell, Lasater, Lenley, McClure, 


Roman, Rountree, Sadie Stadden, Sherman, Smith of Gallatin, 

_ Thompson, Tutt, Vernor, Witt, Whiteside —67. 

2 NAYS—Adams, Canady, Choate, Constable, Cross of Winne- 

. bago, Church, Davis of Bond, Davis of McLean, Dawson, Deitz, 

¥ Dummer, Dunn, Dunsmore, Edwards of Madison, Edwards of 

" Sangamon, Eccles, Evey, Frick, Graham, Geddes, Green of Jo 

_ Daviess, Green of Tazewell, Grimshaw, Harding, Harper, Harvey, 

&: Hay, Holmes, Hurlbut, Jackson, Judd, Knapp of Jersey, Knapp of 

. Scott, Kenner, Kinney of Bureau, Knowlton, Knox, Lander, 
_ Lemon, Lockwood, Logan, McCallen, Marshall of Coles, Marshall 
* of Mason, Mason, Matheny, Mieure, Miller, Minshall, North- 

cott, Palmer of Marshall, Pratt, Pinckney, Rives, Robinson, 

‘i! ‘Sharpe, Swan, Spencer, Servant, Sibley, Sim, Simpson, Singleton, 

_ Smith of Macon, Thomas, Thornton, Turnbull, Turner, Tuttle, 

_ Vance, Webber, West, Williams, Whitney, Woodson, Worcester— 

P76. 
Mr. CONSTABLE moved the previous question; which was 

_ seconded. 

. The question being taken on the adoption of the section, it was 

decided i in the affirmative by yeas 82, nays 60. 

___ The second section was then taken up, and 

_ Mr. CONSTABLE moved the previous question. 

____ Mr. ROBBINS opposed the previous question, as it cut off all 
_ amendments, and excluded members from presenting the views 
~ of their constituents, and having an expression of opinion upon 

_ them. 

4 Messrs. BALLINGALL and KircHELL opposed the previous 

- question on similar grounds. 

: And the Convention refused to second the demand. 

Mr. ROBBINS offered an amendment—strike out all after 

_ “elections,” and insert, “until the legislature shall otherwise 

_ provide, shall be viva voce.” 

___ Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess opposed the amendment. The 


ev 


might vote his sentiments, uncontrolled by any moneyed 4 
employer’s interest, as was the case at the east. 
The question being taken, the amendment was lost. 


Bravided by law.” Rejected—yeas 63, nays 72. ¥ a 

The question on the adoption of the section was taken b ny 
yeas and nays, and resulted yeas 96, nays 40. The 3d, 4th, 5th, 
6th, and 7th sections were adopted. The 8th section was read. 

Mr. ADAMS moved to insert before “Monday,” the words 
“the first Tuesday after the first,’ in order that our electio 
might all be held on one day—the day fixed for the president 
elections. 


judiciary, to meet during the session of the Convention. . 
And without taking a vote on the amendment, the Conventi n 
adjourned till 3 Pp. M. ao: 
AFTERNOON , 
The question pending was on Mr. Apams’ amendment, and t 
was carried. 
Mr. HARVEY moved to strike out “biennally;” which moti n 
was rejected. 4 
Mr. THOMAS moved to add to the section, “until otherwis se 
provided for by law.’ And the vote being taken resulted— 
yeas 67, nays 15. No quorum voting. 
A call of the Convention was ordered and made, and a ( 
members answered to their names. The question was aga 
taken and no quorum voted. A third vote was taken and 
quorum voted. 
Mr. Z. CASEY called for the yeas and nays! and they w 
ordered and taken. And the amendment was adopted—yeas 
nays 50. 
And the section, as amended, was adopted. 


THURSDAY, JULY 29, 1847 613 


Mr. WOODSON moved the article be referred to the committee 
i. of Revision, &c. Carried. 
. Mr. THOMAS moved the Convention resolve itself into 


committee of the whole and take up the report of the committee 


on the Militia; which was agreed to, and Mr. Tuomas was called 
to the chair. 

The report of the majority of the committee (the sth article 
_ of the present constitution, without any amendment) was taken 
up. 

Sections one, two and three were agreed to, without amend- 
ment. 

Sec. 4. Brigadier and major generals shall be elected by the 
officers of the brigades and divisions, respectively. 

Mr. McCALLEN moved to strike out “officers of” and insert 
“persons composing.” 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough moved to insert—to meet the 
views of his friend from Hardin—after the proposed amendment, 
the words “except foreigners;”’ and the motion was rejected. 

The question being taken on the first amendment, it was also 
rejected. 

Sec. 5. All militia officers shall be commissioned by the Gov- 
ernor, and may hold their commissions for such time as the Legis- 
lature may provide. 

Mr. KNAPP of Jersey moved to strike out the [proposed] sec- 
tion, and insert: “all militia officers shall be commissioned by the 
Governor, and may hold their commissions for such time as the 
Legislature may provide.” 

And the same was adopted. 

Mr. McCALLEN offered, as an additional section, the follow- 
ing: “All persons who shall enroll themselves into volunteer 
companies, uniform, equip, and hold themselves in readiness for 
service, shall be exempt from serving on juries, and paying a 
capitation tax for road purposes.” 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough moved to insert after “‘all 
persons,” “except foreigners.”’ Lost. 

Mr. KITCHELL moved to strike out the exemption from 
jury service. Carried. : 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough moved to strike out the 


614 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLI 


exemption from the capitation tax for road ea 
same was rejected. 

The question was taken on the proposed st 
rejected. ; 

_ The committee rose and reported the article; i 
ment, to the Convention. And the question being 
curring with the amendment, it was decided 


tributed according to law.” 
Messrs. ARMSTRONG, BROCKMAN and SINGLET 


and the Ruesiicn being Ge thereon, the ame 
jected. 
The article was then adopted as a a part of cheng 
and it was referred to the committee on Revision, &c. 
And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned. 


eS re eS sap SB a AN ae pal ats ah hina Satta, Mes bl ‘<Fr 


XLII. FRIDAY, JULY 30, 1847 


_ Mr. MARSHALL of Mason presented a petition, praying 

© appointment of a state superintendent of schools; which was 

tred to the committee on Education. 

‘Mr. Z. CASEY moved the Convention resolve itself into com- 
ee of the whole on the report of the committee on Revenue; 
motion was concurred in, and Mr. Epwarps of Sangamon 


Sec. 1. The Legislature shall cause to be collected from all 
e white male inhabitants of this state, over the age of twenty-one 
ars and under the age of sixty years, a capitation tax of not less 
han fifty cents nor more than one dollar each, to be applied yearly 
r0 the payment of the interest due and to become due from this 
to the school, college, and seminary funds; and if in any 
ear there shall remain any balance of said tax, after the payment 
of interest due for that year, such balance shall be paid into the 
_ state treasury. 

_ Mr. ARCHER moved to strike out “shall,” in the first line, 
; and insert “may.” Such was, said Mr. A., the instructions to 
the committee. 

+ Mr. GREGG said, he sincerely hoped the amendment would 
prevail, as he believed it would be both impolitic and unjust to 
provide for a permanent poll tax in the constitution. There 
no objection, in his opinion, to leaving the matter in the 
ds of the General Assembly, for the people would then have 
ibe control over it. Their representatives might provide in a 
“single i instance for such a tax, but public opinion would thereafter 
check all such legislation. 

ae A capitation tax was unjust to two classes in the community— 
‘o the laborers of the State—those who earned their daily bread 
_by the sweat of their brows—and to the farmers of small means, 
who were just commencing their improvements, and needed every 
thing they could earn to pay taxes upon their little property, and 
upport their families. 


615 


616 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Property was the only fit and appropriate basis of taxation— 
those who had the wealth of the country ought to pay its pecuniary 
burdens. It was not true that the poorer classes paid no ee. pe 


juries, work upon roads, and do service in the militia? Did the 
not, upon every occasion of danger, rally in defence of the country, 
fight our battles, and freely shed their blood in sustaining the 
national honor? Was not the property of the country, in times 
of war or domestic disturbance, protected by the strong arms of 
the poorer classes of [the] community? 
A provision for a permanent poll tax would create an clemenia 
of opposition to the new constitution which could not well be 
overcome. The people would readily appreciate its gross ns ‘ 
tice, and spurn the instrument that gave it sanction. s 
Entertaining these views, he felt it his duty to oppose stren- 
uously every effort to provide for the imposition of a poll tax. In 
these times of boasted “progression”’ there was little propriety in 
taking up the discarded maxims of aristocracy and engrafting 
them upon our system. There was no occasion for attempting to 
fasten upon the people an unjust, oppressive, anti-republican bur— 
den. In this light would a poll tax be regarded, and justly 
regarded. Public interest, public policy, and public justice were 
alike opposed to it. Immigration to our state should be encour- 
aged, and not repelled.—The effect of a poll tax would be to drive © 
away all those who were able to appreciate unnecessary and unwise 
exactions. After further remarks sustaining the same view, Mr. 
G. concluded by asking the Convention to pause before they 
adopted a policy which the people would repudiate, and which 
they ought to repudiate. 
Mr. WHITNEY concurred with the views expressed by tid , 
gentleman from Cook. He would vote for the amendment. 
Mr. PETERS was opposed to the amendment. He was in 
favor of a poll tax upon grounds of justice and equal taxation. — 
Persons were as proper a subject of taxation as property, and 
should be made to contribute towards the expenses of the govern-_ 
ment. We were all protected—the landholder and thé non land- 
holder—with equal care by the laws and the government, and 
should pay our share towards its support. if 


FRIDAY, JULY 30, 1847 eo Ong 


Mr. TURNBULL said, this matter had been discussed so 


&. long and so thoroughly when last before the Convention, that he 


did not think we should enter again on the subject. He suggested 


_ that the amendment be withdrawn for the present, and offered 
_ when the subject was reported back to the Convention. 


Mr. CALDWELL differed from the gentleman last up. He 
hoped discussion would be had and had now upon the subject. 
When the resolution of instructions to the committee passed this 
Convention, he understood it as containing a different principle 
from that contained in this section reported by the committee. 
The resolution left with the Legislature a discretionary power to 
pass such a law; this report makes it obligatory upon them, and it 
also directs that the money shall be applied to a special and partic- 
ular object. He hoped discussion would open, that debate would 
be allowed, and that members would now proceed with a considera- 
tion of the subject. For one, he had voted for the resolution ot 
instruction, but he would vote against the section as reported, for 
the latter makes it obligatory upon the Legislature to pass this 
law, and applies the tax to be raised to a specific purpose, which 
the people of this state will never allow. 

Mr. SHERMAN said, he was in favor of the amendment, 
because it would leave the question of a poll tax with the people, 
to be adopted by their representatives. He feared that we were 
inserting too many “‘shalls” in the constitution. The people 
might at some time be willing to have a poll tax, but not at present. 
He was for leaving with the Legislature the power to pass the law 
or to repeal it, to meet the wishes of the people. 

Mr. THOMAS was in favor of the poll tax, and opposed to the 
amendment. He desired the section to remain as it was. By it 
the money raised was to be applied to the payment of our school 
debt, which was as much a public debt as any other. It was also 
intended as a substitute for the road labor, which, in many parts 
of the state, was not as necessary now as heretofore. Every state 
in the Union had a poll tax except one, and that was Illinois, and 
its justice was admitted by all. Persons, he considered, should be 
taxed as well as property, for they were equally protected by the 
laws and government. 

Mr. ADAMS was in favor of a poll tax, but opposed to any 


oY » aes hy hg es ML Lal UP ORY ROS BD A RRs | CS VEN 
is ones ROM LR as 


618 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


permanent provision in the constitution. He would vote for t { 
amendment. x 
Mr. CHURCHILL was opposed to a capfeseen tax. Tty was 
unjust. We, by it, professedly propose to make taxation equal 
By it we did not arrive at that effect. We oppressed. the lowe 
classes and relieved the upper ranks—if we struck a line at $5, e 
we oppress the lower classes, but relieve the higher. Most of our 
taxes was collected from the laboring community, and he boo 
any additional burden upon them. ; 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, that he was in cen fo 
poll tax, but would vote for the amendment. He said the sectio: 
would, when amended, read as the committee had been instruc 
to report, by the following resolution passed on the 17th of Jun 
“ Resolved, That the committee on Revenue be, and they ar 
hereby, instructed to report an amendment to the constitutior 
so as to authorize the Legislature to levy a capitation tax, not t 
exceed one dollar, on all free white male inhabitants over the ag 
of twenty-one years, when they shall deem it necessary.” 
Mr. MINSHALL was in favor of giving the Legislature power 
to levy a poll tax, but opposed to any imperative provision. 
had voted for the resolution of instruction on this ground. Ne 
state had an imperative provision that it shall be levied. Som 
states said that the legislature may levy such a tax; others con 
nected it with the right of suffrage, and in three states it w 
repudiated as unjust. He would vote for the amendment. 
Mr. BUTLER said, that at a first view of the question he we 
in favor of the proposition, but upon reflection, had come to t 
conclusion that a poll tax was unjust, and oppressive w 
‘laboring classes. Therefore, he should oppose the section, and ~ 
oppose giving the Legislature any such power. He would vote | 
to strike the section out. a 
Mr. PALMER of Marshall advocated the poll tax, as a proper 
and just tax. There were many in the state who had no property, — 
lived as well as all others, and were protected in their persons 
our government, yet paid nothing towards paying the expens 
Suppose the state had no property, would not there be a manif 
necessity in taxing persons? This is the ground he took before 
his people, and they elected him over his competitor, who took ; fir 


FRIDAY, JULY 30, 1847 619 


' different view of the question. He would like the tax to be fixed 
_ at one dollar, and that the section authorizing it should be sub- 
“mitted to the people for a vote separately from the constitution 
itself. 
. Mr. JONES said, the word “shall” was in both the majority 
: and minority reports. He did not know whether the resolution 
was before them or not when the section was written; he was 
satisfied that the committee intended to obey the instruction. 
_ He had voted against the resolution, because he was opposed to 
~ apoll tax at all. He would vote for the motion to strike out. 

Mr. KITCHELL was in favor of the poll tax as just, liberal 
and equitable towards the poorer part of the community. The 
report intended to exempt from taxation the wearing apparel and 

_ the household and kitchen furniture of every one in the state, and 
certainly there could be no one who would object to paying the 

small sum of fifty cents in a year towards defraying the expenses 
of the state. He hoped the amendment would not pass, for the 
Legislature would be changing it every year. First a poll tax and 
then its repeal, and in this way the revenue of the state would 
always be uncertain and the people could not make provision to 
meet the taxes with any degree of certainty. 

Mr. ALLEN thought a poll tax unjust and improper. The 

_ gentleman last up did not desire to give the Legislature power to 
fix the tax; but he is willing to give them the power to dispose of 
the funds raised by it. Where is the difference? Why not leave 
the question then with the representatives of the people whom 

_ they can instruct upon this subject. He lived in a county where 
this subject was discussed, and the people of that section are 
opposed to it. He agreed with the remark that there were too 
many “shalls’’ in the constitution. Yesterday, gentlemen when 
they had a small majority refused to give to the Legislature power, 

in case the ballot system did not suit the people to change it to the 
old mode of voting, to which we have been so long accustomed. 
We all come here to present our views and represent our constitu- 
ents, and at the same time we must of necessity compromise those 
views in order to obtain the support of the minority. There 
would be scarcely any proposition that would be passed here, 
that would not be opposed by a respectable minority, and we 


620 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


should pass nothing that would excite in the breasts of mer 
an opposition to our constitution. He was opposed to a poll 
on principle, and if it should be fixed as a permanent thing in 
constitution he would have to oppose the constitution. 
mentioned this not as a threat, but as a plain undeniable fa 
which it would be well to consider on this subject and. upor 
others. z 
Mr. WEST said, this subject formed no pe of the canvass . 
in his county, but since he had been here, he had received | ne 
expression of the sentiment of his constituents, and that was 
favor of the poll tax as an experiment. But only to be levied : sc 
long as the people desired it. He was opposed to the insertior 
in the constitution of any imperative provision. He would vote 
against any clause that would endanger the adoption of the con- 
stitution. He believed the people of the state of Ilinofis] to be. 
in favor of the poll tax, yet he was candidly of opinion that in. ten 
years they would be opposed to it. He would vote to strike ou it 
“shall,” and insert “may.’’ He was also opposed to the sectio: 
providing for the appropriation of the money. He wished t 
to be left to the Legislature. RY 

Mr. McCALLEN was opposed to the section, and in. favor « 
the amendment. He would also vote for striking out all afte 
the word “each!” He was in favor of a poll tax. He thoug 


the poor men, did not fairly represent the feelings af that parti ‘ 
of the community. He was one of that class, and knew that they s 
were willing to contribute in that way to the expenses of the State. 
—It was argued that persons would not come to this state if w 

levied this tax. He would answer that, if any one was unwillin 
to pay fifty cents in a year to defray the exPeUSEs, of the govern 
ment, it should be our policy to say to all such: “remain whe 
you are; do not come to Illinois.” A poll tax was levied in almos 
every state in the Union, and no one had ever repealed it. He wa As 
raised in an adjoining state, and had seen its practical operatiot 
and no man ever refused to pay it. Any man who permitted his 
name to be posted, for delinquency in paying his capitation tax Ky 
might as well declare himself a member of the second * ‘Indian 
Regiment.”’ Mr. McC. said that he could not understand tho 


FRIDAY, JULY 30, 1847 621 


_ who opposed the poll-tax, it was his opinion that they had some 
_ other motives, which had not been disclosed. 

‘ Mr. ALLEN said, he hoped the member would explain what 
he means. 

Mr. McCALLEN said, he did not wish to offend that gentleman, 
for he esteemed him highly; he had only said it was his opinion, 
and when he had an opinion, he generally belched it out. 

Mr. ALLEN said, that if he meant that he (Mr. A.) had any 
other motive than that expressed by him, he was perfectly willing 
that it should be stated. 

a: The CHAIRMAN said, that he was determined there should 
be no personalities. —The member from Hardin was in order, so far, 
and could proceed. 

Mr. McCALLEN, after a short pause, said, that his friend 
had cut the thread of his discourse, and he felt he had no wax to 
mend it, and therefore, he would sit down. 

Mr. ARCHER had heretofore expressed his views in opposi- 
tion to the poll tax, but had voted for the instruction as a com- 
promise. At that time, he did not know the sentiment of his 
people; but, when at home, he made some enquiries, and found 
the sentiment of his people was sensitive on the subject. Many 
were in favor of a poll tax, and many were bitterly opposed to it, 
or to any compromise, for this reason, he would go for the com- 
promise: the giving to the Legislature power to levy the tax or not. 
And, to carry out that compromise, he had made the motion to 
amend, now before the committee. 

Mr. THOMAS advocated the adoption of the provisions that 
the money should be appropriated to the payment of our school 
debt. As, unless we did so, and left the matter before the Legis- 
lature, we should have the same ill-advised legislation that we 
have hitherto had. 

Mr. WEAD had expressed his views upon this subject before. 
He would detain the committee, with but a few remarks. He 
said this tax is equal to one and a half mills or fifteen cents on the 
hundred dollars of property in the state; the same amount as we 
have now provided for the payment of the state debt, making a 
tax of three mills or thirty cents on the one hundred dollars, 
independent of the tax of two mills for ordinary purposes. Will 


people, far more desirable than a poll tax. That object was 


622 " LLIN Ors HI STORICAL COLL 


the people submit to this? The Auditor had in: 
at the end of this year the amount of taxable property 
would amount to $100,000,000.—The tax of one and a hal 
upon this would be $150,000. He was in favor of a tax « 


adoption of the constitution. It was well known that in r 
sections of the state, the people were opposed to it, and if it shor 
be fixed as the permanent policy they would vote against 
constitution. But, if the power be given to the Legislature. 
people, when they may desire it, will themselves force that 
to passsuchalaw. There could be no question more appropri 


much the expediency of levying a poll tax in the state of Uli 


levy it. Gentlemen admitted the difficulty of eollcede this ta 
from those who had no property, but they put the matter on th 
ground that the pride and patriotism of the people would pron 
the payment. He had as high an opinion of the pride and patric 
ism of the people as any one, and that they would rush forward an 
make any sacrifice to pay the debt or to sustain the honor 
character of the state, and he believed that if a poll tax was k 
to-day to pay the state debt, the people would willingly emb 
the opportunity, but if, after paying it from year to year and s 
no diminution of the debt, they would become lukewarm and 
with its burden. He lived in a state where a poll tax had ex 
from the foundation of their government, but the land 1 
belonged almost entirely to residents. Here it was differen 
Our debt was acquired in improving the land of the non-residen 
as well as of the resident. It was, therefore, unjust to tax 
landholders who reside here with a double tax to clear th 
of non-residents from an incumbrance which is upon it. This yé 
unequal, and therefore, he opposed it. The resident now pa id 
poll tax—in the shape of road tax, which was as much fot 
benefit of the non-resident as for himself, and he asked w 
they now adopt a poll tax, which would only place an addit 


" 
. 


FIRDAY, JULY 30, 1847 © 623 


burden on the resident and relieve the non-residents of an incum- 
brance upon their land? The people had not demanded this poll 
tax at our hands, and he asked would this Convention fix perma- 


__nently in the constitution such a provision. 


Mr. EDWARDS of Madison said, that he knew the member 
from Fulton was as anxious as any one to clear the state of 
the heavy debt upon her, and to provide for the payment of the 
interest on that debt, but he was wrong in his present views, and 
his remarks should be replied to or they might produce a wrong 
effect. He had presented the whole amount of taxes that we 
have proposed to levy and those now levied to amount nearly to 
seventy-five cents on the hundred dollars. This as an argument 
against a poll tax is of no weight, for if we make a provision for 
this poll tax, the Legislature will have power to reduce the other 
taxes now levied, and the only object of this tax is that the system 
may become one more equal. 

The member from Greene says, that out of fifteen hundred votes 
in his county, there was but one hundred found in opposition to a 
poll tax. The member from Marshall says a large majority of 
the people in his county are in favor of this tax; his colleague 
[Mr. West] has said that the opinion of our county is in favor of it, 
and there was no doubt the same opinion was held all over the 
state, and there could be no danger of its defeating the consti- 
tution. : 

Mr. KINNEY of Bureau could see no objection to the section. 
A poll tax was in his opinion just and equitable. 

Mr. CALDWELL moved to amend the proposed amendment 
by further striking out all after the word “each;”’ which was 
accepted by Mr. ArcueEr as a modification of his amendment. 

Mr. HOGUE was in favor of the amendment, and in favor 
of the poll tax. He had been in favor of a poll tax always, and 
had expressed that opinion to the people of his county before the 
election. He would prefer the section as it was reported by the 
committee, but when the matter was before the Convention 
before, there were several resolutions under discussion, and that 
which was adopted, was offered as a compromise, and was adopted 
as such, by a vote of 110 to 49. He desired to adhere to the com- 
promise. 


624 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT 


y aA 

Mr. FARWELL said, this was not a question that hax 
discussed before his constituents. He and his colleagues 
then left to exercise their own judgment upon the subject. 
would vote for the amendment, and then vote against the wh 
section. He was opposed to the poll tax as unjust, unequal, | 
as resulting injuriously upon the finances of the state. Prope 
was the basis of taxation, none other could be found certain. 
man that had property, could be forced to pay his taxes, but t 
could you collect the tax from a man who had nothing? 17 
attempt to force one dollar from a man who had nothing, w 
idle, for you would obtain nothing for your trouble. But t 
sweeten the section, and to make it more palatable to 
poor man, they exempted personal chattels to the value of | 
hundred dollars, from taxation. Now the poor man would hay 
to pay a tax of about twenty-five cents on that hundred dollars; 
but, for his benefit, you exempt him from this taxation, in consider- 
ation of his paying fifty cents or one dollar in shape of a poll 
It was unjust and unequal, because it increased the burdens u 
the residents, for the purpose of improving the property of 
state, and of the non-resident, while the latter, by whom the grea 
part of the land in our state was owned, paid none of it. Gent 
men said that the requiring of this tax was beneficial, because th 
who paid it, would feel a greater interest in the state. He did ne 
believe that the people who were most oppressed by the gove 
ment loved that government best. Such was an attribogs 
spaniels, but not of men. a 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery repeated his views in favor of t 
justice of a poll tax. He considered that every man in the stat 
who was protected by the state, in his person, character and pre 
erty, was bound, in justice and honor, to contribute to the s 
port of the state. Every principle of justice dictated this. Th 
landholder had a greater interest than one who had no land, and 
he paid a greater tax; he too, had a greater interest than that 
his land, his life and his person were protected, and for this he y 
bound to contribute. “f 

Mr. MASON addressed the committee in favor of a poll 
And{then the committee rose and reported progress. And 
motion, the Convention adjourned till 3 P. m. ae 


FRIDAY, JULY 30, 1847 625 


: AFTERNOON 
_ The Convention resolved itself into committee of the whole, 


The question pending was on striking out “shall,”’ in the first line, 
and inserting ‘‘may,” and striking out all after the word “each,” 
being taken was decided in the afirmative—yeas 78. 
| Mr. WOODSON moved to strike out the section, as amended, 
and insert the following sections: 
“Sec. 1. The Legislature shall cause to be collected from all 
' free white inhabitants of this state, over the age of twenty-one 
_ years, and under the age of fifty years, a capitation tax of not less 
_ than fifty cents, nor more than one dollar each, until the payment 
of the state debt, to be paid into the state treasury, and applied 
as the Legislature may direct: Provided, when the poll tax herein 
provided for shall be fixed at one dollar, no person paying said tax 
‘shall be required to perform more than one day’s labor on the 
public road during the year; but when said tax shall be fixed at’ 
less than one dollar, two days’ labor may be required. 
_ “Sec. 2. The foregoing section shall be submitted separately 
to the people, at the same time that the constitution shall be 
submitted to them for their ratification or rejection; and if a 
majority of the votes polled at such election shall be in favor of 
such tax, then the same shall be a part of the constitution of the 
state, but if a majority of the votes shall be cast against the said 
section, the same shall not be a part of the constitution; but the 
Legislature may, notwithstanding, when they shall deem it advisa- 
ble, levy such tax as provided in said first section.” 
Mr. SCATES moved to insert in said amendment the follow- 
ing: “Provided, that whenever a capitation tax is assessed, as 
_ provided in this section, there shall also be assessed and collected 
an additional capitation tax,of____ amount on every $100, on the 
following property, viz: On the excess, in value, above $1000, of all 
_ dwelling, commercial, manufacturing houses and appurtenances; 
on the excess, in value, above $100, of all household and kitchen 
furniture, and on all jewels, trinkets, ornaments, time-pieces and 
pleasure carriages.” 
Messrs. Woopson and Scares explained their respective 
amendments. 


ed q bi * 
626 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC! 


Mr. GEDDES moved to provide that no Be Ge, ‘hol 
unless said tax was paid; and the same was iat 


law, providing for a poll tax, to the people for their appro I; 
and it was rejected. a 

Mr. DAWSON moved to strike out “so years’ "in amendn 
and it was carried. 

Mr. THOMPSON moved to fill the peri with ne yee 
Agreed to. 

Mr. FARWELL said, in order to test his eee who were 4 
tenacious for the rights of the blacks, he moved to wa 
“white.” Rejected. 

Mr. STADDEN moved to strike out “inhabitant,” and ir 
“voter.” Carried—yeas 50, nays 59. [sic] " ‘. 

And the question being taken on striking out the section E 
inserting the amended sections, offered by Mr. bile 2 it \ 
decided in the negative. 

Mr. THOMAS offered a substitute for the section which 1 
before the committee for one hour and a half, and to amen 
which innumerable propositions were made and rejected, and the 
Mr. T. withdrew it. n 


“able badica® before the words “free white.” Carried. . 
Mr. ROMAN moved to amend by inserting “who are entitle 
to the right of suffrage.”’ Carried—yeas 69. We 
Messrs. Vance, KENNER and Hur sur offered amendmet 
which were rejected, and the section was adopted as follows: 
“Src. 1. The Legislature may cause to be collected from 
able bodied, free, white male inhabitants of this state, over | 
age of twenty-one years, and under the age of sixty years, - who 
are entitled to the right of suffrage, a capitation tax of not 1 
than fifty cents, nor more than one dollar, when the Legislat 
may deem it necessary.” 
“Src. 2. The Legislature shall provide for levying a tax 
valuation, so that every person shall pay a tax in proportion 
the value of his or her property; such value to be ascertained 


FRIDAY, JULY 30, 1847 627 


some person to be elected or appointed in each county in the state, 
in such manner as the Legislature shall direct, and not otherwise: 
but the Legislature shall have power to tax peddlers, auctioneers, 
brokers, hawkers, commission merchants, showmen, jugglers, 
‘inn-keepers, grocery-keepers, and ferries, and persons using and 
exercising franchises and privileges, in such manner as they shall 
_ from time to time direct.” 

This section was taken up. Several trivial amendments were 
offered by Messrs. Campspett of McDonough, Weap, Brockman, 
West and Markey and rejected. 

Mr. SCATES moved to amend by inserting after the word 
“person,” in the first line, the words “corporation and govern- 
ment.” 

_ This amendment brings up Mr. ScaTes’ proposition to tax 
the United States lands, 

Pending which, the committee rose, and the Convention 
adjourned till to-morrow at 8 A. M. 


XLII. SATURDAY, JULY 31, 1847 


Leave of absence for eight days was granted . Hi 


county courts.—Read, laid on the table, and 250 copies 
to be printed. 
Mr. Z. CASEY moved to suspend the rules for the 
of taking up a resolution offered by him some days since, pt 
for the adjournment of this Convention on the goth inst. 
And the question being taken by yeas and nays, was ¢ 
in the affirmative—yeas 77, nays 30. etek: 
The resolution was then taken up. weg 
Mr. WITT moved to strike out “30th inst.”—Carrie 
Mr. WITT moved to insert ‘20th August.” Laon 
Mr. ADAMS moved to insert “September the first.” 
Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to insert ‘‘ August yi , 
Mr. DAWSON moved to add to the resolution the 
“‘ Provided, no member hereafter shall, on any questi 
in committee of the whole or in Convention, be allowed t 
more than once on any one question, nor for a longer perio 
teen minutes; and the president of the Convention or ch 
the committee of the whole is hereby required to a 
the same.’ ; 
Mr. EDWARDS of Madison moved to lay the resolv 
the table; on which motion the yeas and nays were orde 
taken, and the motion was rejected—yeas 26, nays 94. 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon rose to a point of ord 
stated it to be, that the rules required that no resolution co 
offered or discussed in the Convention; that they also requi 
suspend them or any of them, an affirmative vote of “two 
of the members;” this two-thirds of the members, in his 
two-thirds of the members elected. Therefore, two-th 
members elect not having voted to suspend the rules, 1 
tion could not be considered by the Convention. 
628 


SATURDAY, JULY 31, 1847 629 


_ The PRESIDENT decided that the words “two-thirds of the 
members” meant two-thirds of those present, and that, therefore, 
im the resolution was properly before the Convention. 
4 _ Mr. BOSBYSHELL appealed from the decision of the chair. 
a And the question being put—shall the decision of the president 
stand as the decision of the Convention? It was decided by yeas 
ied nays in the affirmative—yeas 94, nays 26. 
_ Mr. Z. CASEY moved the previous question; which was 
_ seconded. 
_ And the vote being taken on inserting “‘September the first,”’ 
it was rejected—yeas 48, nays not counted. 
__ The question on inserting “August 25” was decided in the 
_ affirmative—yeas 62, nays 53. 
Mr. DAWSON’S amendment was then adopted, and the 
resolution, as amended, was passed. 
_ The Convention then resolved itself into committee of the 
“whole—Mr. Epwaros of Sangamon in the chair, and resumed the 
consideration of the report of the committee on Revenue. 

The question pending was on the amendment proposed by 

_ Mr. Scares to the second section of the report, to-wit: to give the 
legislature power to tax “‘corporations and governments”—the 
objects being to tax the United States lands. 

Mr. SCATES addressed the committee for fifteen minutes, 
during which time he had but laid the foundation of his argument, 
when he was called to order by the chairman, under the rule 
adopted in the morning, restricting debate to that “period.” 

. Messrs. Casey, McCa.ten, SHERMAN, Davis of Montgomery, 
_Apams, Peters, and Dawson insisted on the enforcement of the 
tule. Messrs. Davis of McLean, Brockman, and JENKINS advo- 
cated a suspension of the rule in this case, because Mr. S. held the 
floor yesterday, and yielded it for an adjournment, under an 
implied belief that he would be allowed to proceed to-day. 

Mr. SCATES said, he desired no one to vote from courtesy to 

_ him, if the importance of the subject did not demand investigation, 
he wanted the rule to be enforced. 

And the question being taken on a suspension of the rules, it 
was decided in the negative. 

_ The committee divided on the amendment of Mr. S., first on 


630 


inserting “corporation,” and it carried; and then on inser 
“government,” and it was rejected. : 
Mr. LOGAN moved to amend by striking out the words “ 


each county in the state.” He thought this giving to the several 


heretofore, to be inefficient in its results. He was of op 
that the power should be given to the Legislature to appoint: 
assessors, or else we might have similar cases to what had occurre 
in the state some years ago. One county has refused to assess hi 
property, and has paid no taxes for four years. They elect 
assessors men pledged to resign before the time for discharg 
their duty, and the state loses so much of her revenue. 

Mr. Z. CASEY thought no such case would ever occur a) 
he would suggest to the member from Sangamon the propriet 
inserting a provision that in case any county acted in the 1 
spoken of, that the Legislature might then appoint assessors. 

Mr. CALDWELL opposed the motion to strike out. “ 
section, as it now stood, presented a principle which shoul 
observed throughout our whole organic law—that all power 
the people, that all the officers to carry out that power shou | 
chosen by them, and made responsible directly to them. Once 
assume the principle that the people would be so lost to hones 
and virtue as to refuse to assess their own property or to c 
officers to perform that duty, then away with all elections of of 
by the people, for the principle will apply to the choice of all 
cers as well as that of assessors. We must always assume that 
people are honest, virtuous and patriotic, and upon that all 
proceedings must be based. Otherwise, how can we give them fl 
choice of any officer?—All power is derived from the people; | 
all officers exercising that power, particularly assessors, who ¢ 
use it more oppressively upon the people than almost any ot! 
should be directly responsible to the people, for the manner 
which they perform their duties. ‘ 

Mr. ROUNTREE made a few remarks to the same effect. a 

Mr. Tuomas and Mr. Weap advocated the striking out. 

The committee divided on the motion, and it was carrie J 
yeas 59, nays 50. ¥ ah: 
C4 


Mr. MARKLEY moved to insert, after “valuation,” the fc 


SATURDAY, JULY 31, 1847 631 


owing: “but (the Legislature) may fix a minimum valuation 
pon real estate.” 

Mr. KNAPP of Jersey offered as a substitute for the amend- 

“ment the following: “But no lands subject to taxation shall be 
sessed at less than one dollar and twenty-five cents per acre.” 
e Mr. THOMAS advocated the fixing of a minimum valuation 
upon land, below which no assessment should be made. He 
cited the amount of revenue received in 1841, when such a policy 
"was in force—the minimum at $3 per acre. 

Mr. CALDWELL was surprised to hear the principle that all 
“taxation should be based on the value of property, controverted 
by any one, or that it was just to fix any arbitrary rate of taxation 

on property, independent of its value, advocated. He held that 
' the true and only just basis of taxation was the value of the thing 
“taxed. He was asked what was the value of property—how it 
could be ascertained? The value of all property is the profit it 
~ yields—what it is intrinsically worth, what it will command. 
‘This was evident. All the relations and business of society 
establish the principle that the true valuation of property is by the 
amount of capital invested and the profits it yields. Erect any 
system of valuation upon any other basis, and society will break 
it down and trample upon any such arbitrary rule as taxing 
property independent of its real value. Such arbitrary rules are 
calculated to violate the laws of nature, the very instincts of man, 
for the principle of valuation of property by the profit it yields, 
pervades all the relations of society.. He replied to the calcula- 
tions submitted by Mr. Tuomas, based upon the increase of reve- 
nue in "41, by reminding the Convention that in that year there was” 
a greater amount of real estate subject to taxation than at any pre- 
ceding time, and that the rafe of taxation was higher than at the 
different periods mentioned. He attributed the difference in the 
amount of revenue at the different periods not to any minimum 
provision, but to the changes by Legislature in the rate of taxa- 
tion. : 

Mr. LOGAN was in favor of a minimum valuation, not to be 

fixed in the constitution, but to be left with the Legislature. 

Mr. WILLIAMS was opposed to a minimum valuation, as 

unjust. He was willing to compromise on the proposition of Mr. 


632. ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT 


Knapp, but if that were rejected he would vote against it en 
He thought valuation was the only true basis of tz 
value was what it is worth, what it will bring in the 
The question was taken on the substitute of Mr. Kwapp,a 
rejected. The question recurred on ae amendment rs 


Sime: 
The committee rose and reported the fact to the Cony 
and the Convention adjourned till 3 Pp. mM. Hi 


AFTERNOON Se 


yeas 48, nays 53. No quorum voting. A stan ve was Y 
and the same result was had. 


A call was ordered and, after considerable. time, 117 m 
appeared, and the committee resumed its sitting. 

And the question being again put on the amendment, 
rejected—yeas 52, nays 59. 3 

Mr. DAWSON moved to strike out the words “ 
otherwise.” 

Mr. SCATES said, this was the minimum propo: tic 
another shape, and he hoped it would again be voted down. 
the motion was rejected. 
a Mies SCALES moved to reconsider the vote a whic 
amendment, to insert “government,” was rejected. 
vote was reconsidered. said 

Mr. SCATES then withdrew his amendment. 


liquors; which was rejected. 


SATURDAY, JULY 31, 1847 633 


Sec. 3. The following property shall be forever exempt from 


yy 


Ist. The wearing apparel of every person in the state. 

. 2d. The household and kitchen furniture of every housekeeper 

in this state, not to exceed in value the sum of one hundred dollars. 

‘3d. +The real and personal property of this state. 

_ 4th. +All lands belonging to the school fund of any township 
_ in the state, and every school-house, court-house, and jail, and all 

county lands and buildings set apart for county purposes, not to 

exceed five acres. 

e sth. Every building erected for religious worship, the pews 

__ and furniture within the same, and lands whereon such building is 
_ erected, not exceeding ten acres. 

6th. Every building erected for the use of any literary, reli- 

_ gious, benevolent, charitable, or scientific institution, and the tract 

- of land on which the same is situated, not exceeding ten acres; 
_ also, the personal property belonging to any such institution and 
" connected with and set apart for the use thereof. 

Mr. WEST moved to insert after ‘“‘ten acres: and such 
lands as may be set apart for burial grounds;’ which was 
adopted. 

Mr. WEST moved to strike out the words, “the following 
property shall be forever exempt from taxation,” and insert: 
“the Legislature may exempt from taxation the following proper- 
ty’’—yeas 62, nays 41. No quorum voting. 

A second vote was taken and resulted yeas 69, nays 50. 
Carried. 

Mr. THOMAS moved to strike out the section, and insert the 

_ 7th section of his report. 

Mr. KITCHELL offered as a substitute for the amendment: 
“the Legislature may exempt such property from taxation as 
they may deem necessary”—yeas 69, nays 31. No quorum 

_ voting. A second vote was had and resulted—yeas 74, nays 35. 

* And the vote being taken on inserting the substitute in lieu 

_ of the section, it was decided in the negative. 

. Mr. LOCKWOOD offered, as an additional section, the fol- 

_ lowing; which with a slight amendment, was adopted—yeas 61, 
nays 39. 


” ce 


634 


Sec. 4. Hereafter, no purchaser of any land or town - 
any sale of lands or town lots for taxes due either to this s 
or any county, or incorporated town or city, within the same; or 
any sale for taxes or levies authorized by the laws of this stat 
shall be entitled to a deed for the land or town lot so purchas 
until he or she shall have complied with the following conditions, 
to-wit: Such purchaser shall serve, or cause to be served, a writte: 
notice of such purchase on every person in possession of su 
land or town lot, three months before the expiration of the tim 
of redemption on such sale; in which notice he shall state wl 
he purchased the land or town lot, the description of the land 
lot he has purchased, and when the time of redemption will expir 
In like manner he shall serve on the person or persons in whos 
name or names such land or lot is taxed, a similar written notice 
if such person or persons shall reside in the county where such 
land or lot shall be situated; and in the event that the person or 
persons in whose name or names the land or lot is taxed, do not 
reside in the county, such purchaser shall publish such notice in 
some newspaper printed in such county; and if no newspaper 
printed in the county, then in the nearest newspaper that is pub- 
lished in this state to the county in which such land or lot is sit- 
uated; which notice shall be inserted three times, the last time not. 
less than three months before the time of redemption shall expire. 
Every such purchaser, by himself or agent, shall, before he shall 
be entitled to a deed, make an affidavit of his having comply 
with the conditions of this section; which affidavit shall be deliver. 
ed to the person authorized by law to execute such tax deed; and 
which shall, by him, be filed with the clerk of the circuit court of 
the county where such land or lot shall lie, to be by such clerk ~ 
carefully preserved among the files of his office. Any person. 
swearing falsely in any such affidavit shall be deemed guilty ol a 
perjury, and punished accordingly. In case any person shall be 
compelled, under this section, to publish a notice in a newspaper, 

then, before any person, who may have a right to redeem such land 
or lot from such tax sale, shall be permitted to redeem, he or she 
shall pay the officer or person who by law is authorized to receive ~ 
such redemption money, the printer’s fee for publishing such notice, ~ 


shall be collected in gold and silver coin, or auditor’s war- 
a the county revenue shall be collected in gold or silver 


; 
i. 
+ 


from execution. 
Subj ects. 


esi from the further consideration thereok . 
A few members only being present, the Convention was cal 
and after some time occupied in the call, a quorum appests 


house divided thereon, and no quorum voted. 
Mr. THOMAS then withdrew his resolution. 
Leave of absence was granted for two weeks to Messrs. No 
and HunsakeEr; for one week to Mr. Green of Tazewell, an 
three days to Mr. KnowtTon. 
Mr. ECCLES moved to suspend the rules to enable 
offer the following resolution: + 
Resolved, That whenever a call of the Convention i is 
the secretary shall note on the journal the names of the abse 
And the rules were suspended. a 


the affirmative, 39 in the negative. No quorum voting. 
Mr. WOODSON withdrew his Seen 


to hen a resolution ae the “‘fifteen minute period” ber resci 
and the Convention refused to suspend the rules. 


636 


MONDAY, AUGUST 2, 1847 637 


The Convention resolved itself into committee of the whole, 

_ and resumed the consideration of the subject of Revenue. 

The question pending was on the proposed additional section, 

_ offered by Mr. Farwe tt on Saturday, and the motion to strike 

out thereof the words “‘auditor’s warrants.” 

; ts _ Mr. THOMAS made a few remarks in favor of his amendment. 

_ Messrs. Hocus, TutrLe and Dement opposed the amendment. 

_ They considered it unjust in the state to refuse to receive for taxes 

_ the issues of the state. 

p And the question being taken on Mr. Tuomas’ motion, it was 

_ rejected—yeas 29. 

‘ Mr. McCALLEN moved to insert after “‘auditor’s warrants” 

_ the words: “or other state indebtedness;” which was rejected. 
The question recurred on the proposed section, and that, too, 

Was rejected. 

* _ Mr. SHERMAN offered, to be added to the 3d section, the 

: following: | “Provided that if any part of the aforesaid ten acres 

_ is used for any other purposes than a burial ground, or a building 
for religious worship, then the same shall be taxed as other proper- 


Mr. WOODSON offered the following, as a substitute for the 
amendment, and it was accepted as a modifiction. 
“Provided that property owned and used for purposes of 
_ education, or religious worship, or to the burial of the dead, shall 
__ be exempt from taxation, but the General Assembly shall have 
_ power to limit the quantity of land to be exempt as aforesaid.” 
And the question was taken on the amendment, as modified, 
and adopted. 
Mr. HOGUE moved as a substitute for ide third section, as 
amended, the following: 
_ “The property of the state and of the counties, both real and 
_ personal, and such other property as the Legislature may deem 
_ necessary for school purposes, shall be exempt from taxation.” 
___ And the substitute for the section was adopted. 
Mr. LOGAN moved to add to the section: “and necessary 
__ Wearing apparel, not including watches, trinkets and jewelry.”’ 


Mr. ECCLES moved to add to the amendment: “also, the 


y 


638 


household and kitchen furniture, not exceletdaaian in athe’ one 
dred dollars; which amendment was accepted. 
Mr. LOGAN then withdrew the modified amendment. 
Mr. THOMAS moved to add the following additional sectio 
n Secy 15. 0 Phe corporate authorities of counties, townshi 
school districts, cities, towns and villages may be vested w 
power to assess and collect taxes for corporate purposes; st 
taxes to be uniform in respect to persons and property, within | 
jurisdiction of the body imposing the same. 
“Sec. 6. The specification of the objects and subjects of ta 
tion shall not deprive the General Assembly of the power to requ 
other objects or subjects to be taxed in such manner as may 
consistent with the principles of taxation fixed in this consti - 
tion.’ ‘ 
Mr. CHURCHILL offered, as an additional section, the foll w 
ing: a 
“The Legislature may, at any regular session, change, alter o1 
repeal the foregoing sections by a vote of two-thirds of the memb 
thereof;” which was disagreed to. 
Mr. DAWSON offered a long additional section; which w sy 
rejected. 
Mr. TUTTLE offered the following proviso to be 2dea 
section 4: 
“ Provided, that every tract or parcel of land! ying in this sta 
subject to taxation, shall be liable for all taxes accruing on 
same, and all such lands may be proceeded against and sold 
taxes without regard to ownership, or otherwise, in such man: 
as the Legislature shall prescribe by law; and provided, in all cases, 
a judgment shall be obtained against such lands before the sami 1e 
shall be sold.” Es 
Mr. TUTTLE expressed himself in opposition to section 4 
it stood. 
Mr. CHURCHILL opposed both the section and the ame 
ment. q 
Mr. LOCKWOOD defended section 4 as necessary and just 
to the protection of the people, and opposed the amendment. by: 
And the question being taken on the amendment, it 7 
rejected. . 


MONDAY, AUGUST 2, 1847 639 


_ Mr. Z. CASEY moved the committee rise and report. Car- 
tied. 
And the committee rose and reported back to the Convention 
the report of the committee, and asked the concurrence of the Con- 
_ vention in the amendments. 
_ Mr. THOMAS moved that the article be laid on the table, 
and that 250 copies be printed with the amendments; which 
_ motion was adopted. 
— Mr. CALDWELL moved the Convention adjourn till 3 p. m. 
ae Lost. 
~ Mr. ADAMS moved to take up the report of the committee 
on the Executive Department, as amended in committee of the 
whole—yeas 47, nays 58, no quorum voting. A second vote was 
taken and resulted—yeas 49, nays 53, no quorum voting. The 
_ yeas and nays were demanded and ordered. 
Mr. LOCKWOOD moved a suspension of the rules to enable 
him to offer the following resolution: 
Resolved, That hereafter a majority of the members shall con- 
stitute a quorum to transact business. 
And the Convention refused to suspend the rules. 
Mr. ADAMS withdrew his motion. 
Mr. DALE moved to take up the report of the committee on 
_ Counties and their Organization. 
Mr. WEAD moved a call of the Convention. Objected to. 
Mr. LOGAN moved the Convention adjourn till to-morrow 
-at8a.m. And the Convention adjourned till to-morrow. 


XLV. TUESDAY, AUGUST 3, 1847 _ 


Mr. CRAIN, from the committee on Miscellaneous Sub 
and Questions, to which was referred sundry petitions on 
subjects, reported the same back to the Convention and ° 
charged from the further consideration thereof. aainae® 
Mr. THOMAS moved the Convention resolve itself i int 
mittee of the whole and take up the reports from. ‘the com 
on Incorporations, and the motion was concurred in. 
The Convention then resolved itself into committee 
whole—Mr. Weap in the chair. 
The report was read as follows: Bak 
BS Section 1. Corporations, not possessing banking powe 
ac privileges, may be formed under general laws, but shall 
2s created by special acts, except for municipal purposes, and it 
a where, in the judgment of the Legislature, the objects of tl 
4 poration cannot be attained under general laws. 
Sec. 2. Dues from corporations not possessing — 
powers or privileges shall be secured by such individual i 
of the corporators, or other means, as may be prescribed by 
Sec. 3. No State bank shall hereafter be created, no 
the state own, or be liable for, any stock in any corpora’ 
joint stock association for banking purposes. 
' Sec. 4. No banking powers or privileges shall be 
either by general or special acts of incorporation, unless 
by the people of the state as hereinafter provided. Barina: 
Sec. 5. The Legislature may at any session, but not | 
than once in four years, direct the vote of the people to 
on the day of the general election, for or against the ; 


Legislature may authorize the forming of corporations or 
tions for banking purposes by general acts of 1 ince 

$ the following conditions: 
as 640 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 3, 1847 641 


tst. No law shall be passed sanctioning in any manner, 
directly or indirectly, the suspension of specie payments. 2d. 
Ample security shall be required for the redemption in specie of 
all bills and notes put in circulation as money, and a registry of all 
such bills and notes shall be required. jd. The stockholders in 
every corporation and joint stock association for banking purposes, 
issuing bank notes, or any kind of paper credit to circulate as 
“money, shall be individually responsible to the amount of their 
respective share or shares of stock in any such corporation or 
association, for all its debts and liabilities of every kind. 4th. 
In case of insolvency of any bank or banking associations, the bill 
holders shall be entitled to preference in payment over all other 
creditors of such bank or association. 5th. Non-payment of 
specie shall be a forfeiture of all banking rights and privileges, and 
the Legislature shall not have power to remit the forfeiture, or 
relieve from any of its consequences; and provision shall be made 
by law for the trial, in a summary way, by the judicial tribunals, 
of all contested questions of forfeiture of banking privileges. 

Sec. 6. Acts of incorporation for municipal purposes, whether 
general or special, may at any time be altered, amended, or re- 
pealed, and all general acts granting corporate powers of any kind 
other than for municipal purposes, may at any time be altered, 
amended or repealed, but such alteration, amendment or repeal 
shall, unless the right to make the same be reserved, operate 
prospectively. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved to strike out the first 
section and insert the following: 

“No corporate body shall be hereafter created, renewed, or 
extended within this state, with banking or discounting privi- 
leges.”” 

Mr. D. said he was totally opposed to banks and in favor of a 
prohibitory clause. This was his position now and at all times. 
He addressed a few words to the party with whom he generally 
acted (whig) and told them that they were not, asa party, pledged 
to state banks or local banks; that was the policy introduced by 
their opponents, when they crushed the national bank. The whig 
party is only pledged to a national bank; a bank that will give us 
a currency that when a man sellls] his horse or his products at St. 


= 


i ee 


s 


642 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION: 


Louis, he can take its notes and they will be as good as silt 
New York. This is what they were pledged to, and therefor 
feared not to be read out of the party for opposing banks in Ili- 
nois. But party would govern no longer, we would all soon be one 
universal party—a “Rough and Ready party.” The people of 
this state wanted no banks—wanted no state banks; Cook county 
wanted no banks; the people here have declared their hostil 
to banks in the form of instructions to their representatives. How 
was it that the democratic party, or a portion of them, distrust th 
judgment of the people, so far as to openly violate their instruc- 
tions? How can they now reject the opinion and sentiments of 
the people on this point, when opposition to banks has been t 
cardinal principle of the whole party? Why, sir, by voting f 
state and local banks they admit that the people are in favor 
them, and is this so? They come here with instructions in the 


tion will be voted down, if prohibition becomes the order of tl 
day. Sir, it is all gammon. The people will sustain it. TI 
democracy will sustain it, and one half the whig party will susta 
it. Everywhere it was known as the principle of the democrat 
party. Your newspapers, your county and town meetings, | 
held the same principle, and it was proclaimed by the convention 
that nominated your governor, who was elected by 23,000 major 
ity. a 
Mr. DEMENT said, that from the haste which had be 
shown to test the question of prohibition, it was evident the dem 
racy had cause to congratulate themselves. We have, from 
hot haste, an evidence that perhaps a few of the “tender footec 
are coming to our aid; and it might be that a number of the w 
party would also come to the side of prohibition. Although 
was a favorite hobby with the democratic party, he would | say | 
those whigs—“‘Come, come along gentlemen, you are welcome 
to ride with us. We don’t care even if you mount in fron ‘ 
we will be willing to ride behind provided we can carry our © 
principle. On the question of striking out, he said, that the oa 
tion now before them was one in relation to incorporations without 
banking powers, and confined exclusively to that. Such a sec 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 3, 1877 643 


necessary and he hoped that it would be suffered to pass by, 
more proper opportunity to test the question of prohibition 
d occur afterwards. This was his view, and he did not think 
air test could now be had; but if the whig friends of prohibition 
a goodly host he hoped—desired to test it at once, why, he 
his democratic friends would go with them and carry the 
n to strike out. Let us do the work while they are in 
he humor, while the wind was favorable and in the right quarter. 
_ Mr. MARKLEY was in favor of striking out, and hoped the 
tion of prohibition would be tested at once. 
po KINNEY of St. Clair said, that he hoped the friends of 
rohibition would vote for striking out. 
The question was taken on striking out and resulted—yeas 40, 
‘ays 63; no quorum voting. 
Mr. WILLIAMS said, he was opposed to prohibition on 
‘eneral principles, but the great success of the democratic party 
a Illinois had been the result of the continued out-cry and preach- 
ag by them against banks, and because the whig party were 
enerally identified with banks. He would vote, therefore, for 
rohibition; would unite himself with John Thompson’s cattle 
td help to draw the democratic cart out of the mud hole. He 
yould do this, not because the principle was a true one, but for the 
urpose of forever putting an end to this cry against banks and 
7higs, on which the democratic party always kept in power. 
' Mr. HARVEY was in favor of the section as it was, it related 
nly to incorporations without banking privileges, and would vote 
t striking out till they were provided for. When the ques- 
of prohibition came properly before them he would define 
position on that subject. 
Mr. BUTLER expressed views similar to those of Mr. Harvey, 
3 to striking out. On the question of banks his opinions had not 
fanged. He thought he understood what was democracy as well 
's any one else, and desired not the teachings of others. He was 
‘pposed to a prohibitory clause as part of the constitution; but 
jo vote for it as a separate article, to be submitted to the 
ple separately from the constitution. 
Mr. THOMAS was opposed to striking out the section. He 
Ks not say whether he would vote for prohibition or not, but 


644 


when that question came before them propel 
he might not. ; 

Mr. COLBY was Spe to stein out. 

And the question being taken on striking out, wt 
yeas 44, nays 71. ; 

Mr. WHITESIDE moved to strike out the word | 
the word “‘purposes”’ in the Ist section; gk, tite ay 
yeas 50, nays 61. 

Mr. CALDWELL moved to add to de section: ‘ 
whether general or special, may, at any time, be alt : 
or repealed,” and the same was rejected. 

Mr. SCATES moved to add to the section: 
all corporations or associations, other than munici 
scientific, and charitable, shall be individually liable 
liabilities and acts of such corpo os associations 
consequences resulting from such acts.’ ave 


yeas 58, nays 55. 
Section 2 was then taken up and— 
Mr. THOMAS moved that it be wee out. I 

that the amendment just adopted carried out its object 
Mr. SCATES moved to strike out the ‘wor 

liabilities of the corporators, or,’ in order that | 

might have power to require greater security than I 

as amended conferred upon them. 
Mr. DEMENT advocated the amendment : 


And the question being taken, the motion was 

Mr. BROCKMAN moved to strike out the wor 
sessing banking powers or miei. and ‘a 
rejected. 

Mr. CHURCHILL moved to add to the secti 
liability shall be levied on their individual property, 1 
to their several interests in said corporation,” and it v 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 3, 1847 645 


: question then recurred on the motion to strike out the 
and it was decided in the negative. 

EDWARDS of Sangamon offered as an additional section, 
lowing: 

Il the Property belonging to the inhabitants of any munici- 
poration shall be liable to the payment of debts contracted 
the authority of law;” which was adopted. 

Section 3 was taken up and— 

Mr. McCALLEN moved to add to it: “unless the people 
on the establishment of a state bank, by a vote at a general 
tion, to be submitted to them according to law.” 

. SCATES inquired whether the section as it now read 
affect the interest of the state in any institution at present 


_ Mr. HOGUE thought the section was intended to effect pro- 
ively, not retrospectively. 

fr. McCALLEN was in favor of a state bank for two reasons. 
to give the people a good and reliable currency; the other, 
el the base slander that the people of Illinois have not suffi- 
it virtue and honesty to be allowed to create a currency for 
emselves, a right enjoyed by the people in every state in the 
Jnion except our own. He bitterly attacked the fifteen minute 
, which prevented discussion upon the question, while the 


he question was then taken on the amendment, and it was 
ted. 

Mr. KENNER moved to strike out “for banking purposes”’ 
d insert “to be created by general or special laws;’’ rejected. 
Ir. HARVEY moved to add to the section the words “‘to be 
ifter created.” 


ie were to take it in payment of debt. 

Mr. HARVEY thought it would, and for that reason would 
3 for | it. 

_ And the question: being taken on the amendment, it was 


646 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL Coen 7 


Mr. WILLIAMS said, that he was in the \eekleea 
time when the state bank was established and was acc 
with its history. At the opening of the legislature our den mo 
Governor informed us that he was about to propose a sta it 
which was to give a good and uniform currency, and enab 
state to carry on her intended system of internal improve 


the democratic party commenced a war upon banks; at 
meetings and assemblages their theme was opposition | 
The whigs differed; they came forward to sustain the banks) 
relieve them, and were held up before the state, by the dem« 
as rag barons, friends of swindling monopolies, and the ad 
of banks. That tirade has been kept up till the present 
all who are in favor of conservative measures, have fallen un 
effects. He would now vote for prohibition ofall banks. 
would say to his democratic allies, he acted thus for the 
the whig party and not because he believed the princip 

one. He acted also for the good of those democrats wl 
sincerely in favor of prohibition. He considered that no 
bank could exist in this state, so long as cause for this cle 
suffered to remain. He would, therefore, vote for prohil 


that the question would forever be put at rest. He look 
the resolutions of instruction from Cook county, as got 
mere effect, and they were understood to be open to 
The whigs and a portion of the democratic party may succ 


to it, but that the people may become sick of it, and then w 
have a good bank and one on which all parties will unite. 

Mr. SHERMAN said the county of Cook was becom ing a 
familiar word in the Convention, and the instructions of the 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 3, 1847 647 


' democratic convention was becoming the theme of every speech. 
Those instructions, as he understood them, were not, as had been 
ingeniously insinuated, passed with an understanding that they 
if ‘might be violated, or were not binding. He understood that 
e they were passed in reference to the banks such as had heretofore 
existed in this state, and not in reference to any system that might be 
adopted in this Convention. They were passed in good faith, and 
__ not to go before the country for Buncombe purposes. He was 
_ opposed to prohibition, and in favor of giving Illinois the same 
_ privileges that other states possessed. He was opposed to a 
- national bank; but was willing to have, in this state, a restricted 
banking law. 

Mr. HARVEY called for a division of the question so as 
to vote first on striking out. He was opposed to striking out. 
He believed the people of the state are opposed to a state bank. 
He was prepared to sustain a prohibition of a state bank, for he 

_ believed the people were united on that subject. He was surprised 
to hear in the Convention, where we had met to discuss great 
_ constitutional questions, gentlemen descend to personalities; that 
lectures should be read to the gentlemen from Cook and from 
other places, about the course they thought proper to follow. 
Much difficulty was experienced in ascertaining who was John 
Thompson. That story had been told but the true version was 
this: John went to market and got drunk: on his return he fell 
asleep in his cart, which was drawn into a mud hole; the cattle 
struggled and broke from the cart and cleared off. John woke up 
and rubbed his eyes and exclaimed, am I John Thompson or am I 
not? IflamI have lost my team; if lam not I have found a cart. 
Thus it was with the leaders of the party upon this prohibition. 
If the gentleman from Jefferson was John Thompson he has lost 
his team; if not, he has found a cart. But he had yet to learn 
that hostility to banks—total prohibition of them, was a principle 
of democracy. No democratic leader ever advocated such doc- 
trine. He was opposed to banks, but desired to give the people 
the right to say whether they will have them or not. 
Mr. GEDDES was in favor of some well regulated system of 
banking, which by increasing the capital of the state, would enable 
the vast resources of the state to be developed. 


648 


Mr. THOMPSON, like Hannibal of old, who had bees 0 
in his infancy to eternal enmity to Rome, had sworn eter he 
hostility to banks. He had been taught the value of labor, by his 
earliest occupation—teaching school in the eastern states. 
received his pay there in eastern bank money and when he sta 
for Illinois, he found that the price of his toils was almost worthle: 
When he reached Albany, he found that his money would not pur es) 
chase a dinner. There he made his first acquaintance wii 
brokers and shavers. After that he travelled on New York cur: 
rency. Thus in his early days he acquired an enmity to bai 
and it had continued ever since and would not be eradicated fro 
his mind. He remembered the time when all his democr 
friends spoke of banks in very hard terms, called them mons 
and all sorts of opprobious names; but now they changed t 
tone. He would say to them as did the minister to his peop 
when speaking of the devil—my friends, the time was when 
spoke of him bitterly, when you called him “the devil,” but 
forsooth, you rub him down the back and call him “poor fail 
angel.” 

Mr. T. spoke some time in opposition to banks in any aha 
and thought that the resources of the state could all be develo) 
as well by gold and silver, as by a paper currency. 

Mr. ARCHER expressed himself as opposed to all see 
banks and banking systems, and would vote against them 
matter what shape they were presented in. He was in favo 
total prohibition and would vote for that and that only. 

The question was taken on striking out, and lost. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved to strike ¢ out the 

“state” before the word “‘bank;” lost. 

The 4th section was read, and 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to strike out and insert the a 
ment proposed by Mr. WILt1ams. ; 

Mr. ROBBINS moved to strike out all after the word “on 
and insert, “‘the act granting the said powers or privileges be 
mitted to the people for their approbation or rejection, at the 
general election after the passage of the said act, and if the said 
shall be approved by a majority of the votes given at the sal 
election, the same shall thereafter become a law.” *g 


word 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 3, 1847 649 


| Mr. FARWELL moved to add to the amendment: “Provided, 
hat all persons voting for the adoption of this section shall be 
ponsible to the full extent of all their property, both personal 
real, for all the failures, miscarriages or defalcations of any 
nd of all banks hereafter to be created or established by virtue 
this section.” 
' Mr. FARWELL called upon all those who recommended those 
titutions to the people as safe, trustworthy, &c., to show their 
sincerity, by voting for his proposition. He aticideted it but fair 
hat they should be compelled to endorse their recommendation. 
Il the laws of trade, and of every day life, recognized a 
similar principle; and those who recommended these institutions 
should be required to endorse that recommendation, by becoming 
responsible for any loss that might be sustained. 
_ Mr. ROBBINS thought the people should have the right to 
govern themselves in all things. They were in favor of a bank of 
‘some kind, and would take the best they could get. The report 
of the committee put the time when they could have a bank too 
far off; it might be eight years before they could have one. His 
amendment put it in their power to have one at a shorter period. 
| hi Mr. PALMER of Marshall sincerely hoped that Mr. FarwELt’s 
Proviso would not carry; it would be the greatest injustice to the 
members of the Convention who would vote for a bank. He 
advocated the amendment of Mr. Rossins. 
fi _ The question was taken on Mr. F’s. proviso, and after two 
| votings was rejected—yeas 35, nays 76. 
_ Mr. CRAIN moved to add to the amendment of Mr. Rossins 
‘the following: 
And should there ever at any time exist a bank charter of any 

‘ind j in this state by authority of law, and if said institution shall 
‘at any time reject or refuse to redeem any and all of her issues, 
when presented for redemption, 1 in gold and silver—without delay 
at par value, then and in that case said charter or privilege shall 
be forfeited forever; and all the property of her stockholders, both 
personal and real, shall be bound for the redemption of all their 
circulation. 

_ Mr. DEMENT said that he was sorry to see amendments to 
bank propositions coming from the friends of prohibition. We 


6s0 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT 


have now arrived at that point when we might test our str: 
Let us do it. If we fail then it will be time for us to turn 
attention to the propositions and attempt to mend them; a 
finally to take the second best to prohibition. It was true, h di 
not feel as confident of success now as he did in the morning; 
had been led to expect too much from the other side of the hou 
The gentleman from Adams, (Mr. WiL.tAMs) who had led 
that side for prohibition, has said that his object in so doing is 
accomplish the ultimate success of the whig party; he has vie 
it as a party question. Now it is well known the whigs for t 
reason could not follow him. They had made the “no pa 
principle the basis of their action, and have declared thems¢ 
for “‘no party” policy, and cannot, consistently, vote for a party 
movement. However, the gentleman’s vote will be with 
though his heart is against us, and though he gives us, every 
he speaks, two blows back for the one forward, we will not re: 
his aid. He was not so much disappointed as might be conceiy 
in the result, though he had hoped that the member from Adai 
might bring a corporal’s guard, or a sergeant’s guard, or per 
a captain’s command, with him; he still remembered that 
could not recruit many in the county where he was. His count 
men were all peace men, were opposed to war, and as this mi 
be considered an “unholy war’’ against banks, the whigs c 
not enlist. He hoped the friends of prohibition would not try 
to sweeten the dose, but first try prohibition. If they fai ed 
then let us sweeten and spice up every system they offer, anc 
perhaps it may not be so palatable to its friends after con ni 
from our hands. 


voting ae prohibition at once. 

Mr. WILLIAMS said, he had some . difficulty in tae ing 
himself to his allies, and had been uncertain how to vote; hi 
would place himself under the gentleman from Lee, and would 
as he did. 

Mr. W. then solicited the whigs to vote for prohibition, 
the ground that it would result to their benefit in the end. 

The committee rose and reported progress, and the Conventio 
adjourned till 3 P. m. 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 3, 2847 651 


AFTERNOON 


The Convention resolved itself into committee of the whole 
and resumed the bank report. 

Mr. BOSBYSHELL addressed the committee in opposition to 
banks. 

An act of special incorporation may frequently afford the 
persons associated under it facilities of accomplishing much 
public good. But, sir, if those facilities can only be given at the 
expense of rights of paramount importance, they ought to be 
denied by all whose political morality rejects the odious maxim 
that the end justifies the means. Sir, I am particularly hostile to 
special legislation, that is, special incorporations. I am opposed 
to the objects to be effected, viz: the right of forming partnerships 
to be granted to the few, and wholly denied to the many. I am, 
in short, opposed to unequal legislation, whatever form it may 
assume, or whatever object it may ostensibly seek to accomplish. 
It has been truly said, sir, by one of our illustrious Presidents, 
that there are no necessary evils in government. Its evils exist 
only in its abuses. If it would confine itself to equal protection, 
as Heaven does its rains; shower its favors alike on the highand the 
low, the rich and the poor, it would be an unqualified blessing. 
But, sir, when it departs from its legitimate office, it widely 
departs from the cardinal principle of government, in this country; 
the equal political rights of all, when it confers privileges on one set 
of men, no matter for what purpose, which are withheld from the 
rest. It is in this light, sir, I look upon all special acts of incor- 
poration. They convey privileges not previously enjoyed, and 
limit the use of them to those on whom they are bestowed. That 
acts of incorporation, sir, have been given for objects of intrinsic 
excellence and importance, I freely admit, nor do I intend to deny, 
that they have been of incalculable benefit to the community at 
large. Let it be understood that I do not war against the good 
achieved, but seek only to explain the evil of the means. A 
special act of incorporation, sir, is a powerful weapon; but is one 
that should have no place in the armory of the democracy. It is 
an instrument that may hew down forests, and open fountains of 
wealth in barren places, but these advantages are purchased at 
too dear a rate, if we give for them our freedom. As a general rule, 


652 


too, corporations act for themselves, not for the community 
they cultivate the barrens, it is to monopolize its fruits, if 
delve the mine, it is to enrich themselves with its treasures. 
they dig new channels for the streams of industry, it is that they __ 
may gather the golden sands for themselves. Even if the bene tsi) " 

which I, sir, am willing to admit, have been effected by companies, 

acting under special privileges and immunities, could not have 
been achieved without the assistance of such powers, better would © 
it have been, in my opinion, far better, sir, that the community 
should have foregone the good, than purchase it by the surrender, a 
in any instance or particular, of a principle which lies at the founda- 
tion of human liberty. No one, sir, can foretell the evil conse- 
quences from one such error of legislation. Next day the fatal — 
precedent will plead. The door once open, ambition, selfishness, 
cupidity, rush in, each widening the breach, and rendering access 
easier to its successor. But fortunately, sir, we are not driven to — Bh 
the alternative of either foregoing for the future such magnificent _ 

projects as [have] heretofore been effected by special legislation, or 

for the sake of accomplishing them, continuing to grant unequal — 
privileges. It is a propitious omen of success in the great struggle, 
in which the real democracy of this country are engaged, that __ 
monopolies are as hostile to the principles of sound economy, as on 

they are to the fundamental maxims of our political creed. The PS. 
good, sir, which they effect, might more simply and more certainly 
be achieved without their aid. They are fetters which restrain 
the action of the body politic, not motories which increase its speed. 
They are jesses that hold it to earth, not wings that help i it to soar. 
Our country has prospered, not because of them, but in spite of 
them. This young and vigorous republic has bounded rapidly _ 
forward in despite of the burdens which partial legislation has hung — 
upon its neck, and the clogs it fastened to its heel. But swifter, 
sir, would have been its progress, sounder its health, more pros- 
perous its general condition, had our law makers kept constantly — 
in view that their imperative duty requires them to exercise their — 
functions for the good of the whole community, not for a handful 
of obtrusive and grasping individuals, who, under the pretext of — 
promoting the public welfare, were only eager to advance their 
private interests, at the expense of the equal rights of their fellow 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 3, 1847 653 


men. Sir, we have been sorrowfully taught the miserable impo- 
tence of legislature; it was the fountain from which the waters 
‘of bitterness have flowed; let us not then again unseal it, that it 
may infuse another desolating flood. What, sir, can legislation do? 
Insult the community by confirming the special privileges of 
money changers, after their own acts have declared their utter 
worthlessness? Enable a band of paper money depredators to 
prey the more voraciously than before on the vitals of the people? 

Authorize them to pour out a ftesh torrent of their promises, 
now really of no more value than the paper on which they are 
written? Will the community tolerate, sir, such an enormous 
fraud? We are now rid of banks, let us remain so. Let all 
monopolies be swept from the board! Let the whole gang of priv- 
ileged money-changers give place to the hardy offspring of 
commercial and agricultural freedom, who ask for no protection 
but equal laws, and no exemption from the shocks of boundless 
competition. Now, sir, is the time for the complete emancipation 
of banking from legislative thraldom. If this propitious moment 
is suffered to pass by unimproved, the fetter now riven asunder 
will be riveted anew and hold us in slavery forever. The choice 
is presented to us of freedom or perpetual bondage. Let us, by 
the adoption of the prohibitory clause, alone, prevent the restora- 
tion of that cumbrous fabric of legislative fraud and folly, which 
has destroyed itself, and if raised again, will again topple before 
the first commercial revulsion, to bury other myriads in its ruins. 
Sir, if I knew any form of speech that would arrest the attention 
of this Convention or any mode of argument that would satisfy 
their reason, that I have not heretofore used, I would employ it 
now, with all the earnestness of a sincere conviction of the impor- 
tance of the subject, to persuade them that the only true ground 
of hope for the enduring prosperity of our agricultural, mechanical, 
and commercial relations consists in the freedom of trade and the 
total annihilation of paper money. Sir, the great object that 
I desire to see accomplished and to the accomplishment of which I 
think the course of things is obviously tending, is the utter and 
complete divorcement of politics from the business of banking. 
I desire, sir, to see banking divorced not only from federal, but 
from state legislation. Nothing but evil, either in this country 


654 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


or others, has arisen from their union. The regulation of the 
currency and the regulation of credit are both affairs of trade. 
Men want no laws on the subject, except for the punishment of 
frauds. They want no laws except such as are necessary for the 
protection of their equal rights. 

The question was taken on Mr. Crarin’s amendment and lost. 

Mr. HARVEY explained the nature of his report to be in fact 
a prohibition of banks. It differed from an unqualified prohibi- 
tion to this extent only. Under his plan—the people at intervals 
of four years—if they desired banks, and so expressed themselves 
at the polls, could have them without changing the constitution. 
Under the other, they would have to go to the expense of a con- 
vention to change the constitution, in order to have banks. 

Mr. ROBBINS withdrew his amendment. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to strike out all the section except 
the following words—‘‘no banking powers or privileges shall be 
granted either by general or special acts of incorporation.” 

And the question being taken thereon, resulted yeas 52, nays 
pea : 
Mr. SHERMAN moved to strike out all the section after the 
words “no banking powers or privileges shall be granted,” and 
insert the following: 

“Except by general laws, which shall be in accordance with the 
following provisions: 

tst. No law shall be passed, sanctioning, in any manner, 
directly or indirectly, the suspension of specie payments. 

ad. Ample security in interest paying stocks of the United 
States or of the states, shall be deposited with the Treasurer of 
State, for the redemption in specie of all the bills and notes put in — 
circulation, and no stock shall be received in deposit, as aforesaid, 
but such as shall be at par value at the time of said deposit, and 
of such states as shall have regularly and promptly paid their 
interest for the three years immediately preceding the deposit; 
and no bills or notes shall be put in circulation by any association 
but such as are registered and countersigned by the Treasurer of 
State, to any banking association, and the notes or bills so regis- 
tered for any banking association; shall not exceed in amount the 
stocks or bonds deposited by such association: Provided, That the 


- TUESDAY, AUGUST 3, 1847 655 


Legislature may also authorize a deposit of the bonds of this state 
‘to be made in like manner, for a like redemption of such bills or 
notes; the amount and value of such bonds being determined by 
the rate of interest which the state may at the time of such deposit 
pay on the same; and the amount of such deposit shall be pro- 
‘portionate to the rate per centum interest paid thereon. 
3d. The Stockholders in every corporation and joint stock 
“association for banking purposes, issuing bank notes or any kind 
‘of paper credits to circulate as money, shall be individually re- 
‘sponsible to the amount of their respective share or shares of 
“stock in any such corporation or association, for all its debts and 
liabilities of every kind. 
' 4th. In case of insolvency of any banking association, the 
‘bill-holders shall be entitled to preference in payment over all 
‘other creditors of such bank or association. 
_ $th. Non-payment of specie shall be a forfeiture of all 
banking rights and privileges; and the Legislature shall provide 
for the sale of said stocks deposited, and apply the proceeds there- 
‘of, to the redemption of the notes or bills in circulation; and the 
Legislature shall not have power to remit the forfeiture, or to 
‘relieve from any of its consequences; and provision shall be made 
by law for the trial in a summary way, by judicial tribunals, of all 
“contested questions of forfeiture of banking privileges. 
' Sec. 4. No corporation or association for banking purposes 
‘shall have a capital less than fifty thousand dollars, nor greater 
than five hundred thousand dollars. 
Sec. 5. The embezzlement of the funds or property of any 
‘corporation or joint stock association for banking purposes, by any 
officer or agent thereof, shall be deemed a felony, and it shall be 
the duty of the General Assembly to provide for the punishment 
of such felony in the penitentiary. 
_ Sec. 6. This article shall be separately submitted to a vote 
‘of the people, and if voted for by a majority of all voting on the 
question, shall become a part of the constitution.” 

And the question being first taken on the striking out, it was 
‘decided in the affirmative. 
Mr. BUTLER offered a substitute (of which we have no copy) 
for the amendment of Mr. SHERMAN. 


Fi) Seka b' el thy FAL PACU NN WRT AN oe Tee ast Pep hos iy) 


AYT at bine 


656 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE TIONS 


Mr. WILLIAMS inquired of the member from ial if th 
the time to vote for prohibition? 

Mr. DEMENT: Yessir; nowis the time to put your shou 
to the wheel and call on Hercules. 

The question was taken on the substitute, and it was reje 

Mr. ROBBINS offered his amendment (heirs withdr 
as a substitute; and it was rejected. 

The question recurred on Mr. SHERMAN’S amendment. 

Mr. BROCKMAN opposed it. 

Mr. THOMAS despaired of any good banking. system, 
would not vote for prohibition, because that would, in his opinia on 
defeat the constitution. i, et 

Mr. DEMENT opposed the plan now bees chm as wil 
ambiguous and dangerous. am 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery opposed it also, and after a cr t 
examination of its provisions, pronounced it the most consumn 
system for swindling purposes that the ingenuity of the Conv 
tion could devise. a 

The question was taken on the Ma and it was pe 
—yeas 46, nays 68. 

The section now read as follows: “no banking powe 
privileges shall be granted.” 

Mr. McCALLEN offered as a substitute for what remaine; 
of the 4th section, the following: 

There shall be a poll opened every four years at nee 
election in this state, for or against the absolute prohibiti 
banks; and if a majority voting shall decide against absolute p 
hibition, the Legislature may authorize the incorporation 
bank, with branches—as hereinafter provided. 

Mr. DEMENT moved the committee rise and report the 
tion. Lost—yeas 50, nays 62. 

Mr. CALDWELL moved the committee rise and ma 
gress. Lost. 

Mr. HOGUE moved to strike out “four years” in the a am 
ment and insert “‘ten years.” Lost. 

Mr. MARKLEY offered as a substitute for the amend: 2 
pending, to be added to the present section: “And no bran 


agency of any bank in any state in the Union shall be established 
‘s a the state of Illinois.” Yeas 40, nays 73. Lost. 

_ And the amendment was then rejected. 

Mr. HARVEY moved to add to 4th section—“ by the legisla- 
3 it e unless directed by the people of the state as herein directed” 
—yeas $4, nays 65. Lost. 

_ Mr. LOGAN moved to strike out the 5th and 6th sections of 
the report. Carried. 

-_ Mr. LOGAN moved the committee rise and report the article. 
‘Carried. 

_. And the committee rose and reported back to the Convention 
the report of the committee on Incorporations, and asked a con- 
¥ currence in the amendments. 

_ Mr. HOGUE moved to lay the report on the table, and that 
250 copies thereof with the amendments be printed. 

_ The question was taken thereon—yeas 56, nays 59, and motion 
_ was rejected. 

__ And then on motion, the Convention adjourned. 


XLVI. WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 4, 1847 


‘The question pending at the adjournment yesterday was on 
concurring with the amendments of the committee of the whole. 


Mr. LOGAN moved, as an amendment to the report, and as 
a substitute for the amendments of the committee of the whole, 
the adoption of Mr. SHERMAN’s system, with some eu modifi-- 
cations. 7 
Mr. LOGAN moved the postponement of the whole subject 
till Monday next. : 


Mr. SCATES was opposed to the postponement. The com- 
mittee understood the question before them, and why not vote 
now? A few days ago, a report came from the committee of the 
whole on an important subject—the right of suffrage—and 
there was not time given to breathe, before they demanded a 
vote. hy 
Mr. SHERMAN was in favor of the postponement. Hig 
plan had been misrepresented by the gentleman from Monisomm 
ery, and he desired time to answer him, and to explain his plan. ig 

Mr. DEMENT was opposed to any postponement. The 
question was fully discussed yesterday, and now was the time tod 
vote. The proposition submitted this morning had been éxamiail 
ed, and was fresh in the minds of the members; and he could see no” 
reason why we should not vote upon it at once. The member | 
from Cook and his friend from Sangamon, between whom there 
appeared to be so much good feeling, also desired to postpone. — 
This was a joint production of the gentlemen, and what did they 
want a postponement for? Because the member from Cook — 
a week to prepare a defence of his plan? Yesterday, he said, it 
would speak for itself—to-day, he desires a week to prepa 
himself to speak in its favor. The gentleman from Sangamon : 
desires a postponement, no doubt, to rally his friends; to cS 


‘4 


and devise some system of banking, on which he and the tender- 

footed might unite. He hoped this would not be postponed. 

We had passed a resolution to adjourn on the 25th of this month 
658 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 4, 1847 659 


and if we postponed this matter and took it up again next 
week, as a new question, much time would be lost in its discussion, 
and we would never be able to adjourn by that time. 
_ Mr. LOGAN said, that the report of the committee was not 
a choice of a majority of the Convention; nor did he think any- 
Being that could now be presented would meet with approbation. 
Prohibition could not be carried. He desired to postpone to 
"give time to prepare something on which a majority could unite. 
Mr. WEAD said, the reasons given were the best in the world 
for his voting for an immediate vote on the question. One reason 
s, that he wants to rally his friends." He has offered us the amend- 
“ment of the gentleman from Cook, and none other. That has 
been printed, and read by members, examined and considered, and 
“if the Convention is not ready to vote now, when will they? We 
are now asked to postpone for further consideration, and for time 
‘torally. Sir, if important arrangements were to have been made, 
they ought to have been made long ago. These gentlemen ought 
“not—and it was they who did it—to have rushed in such haste to 
‘consider the matter yesterday. The gentleman from Cook says 
“his speech was cut off yesterday; well, if he was ready then to 
speak, why not now? Now is the time for him to give it to us in 
all its freshness, before it becomes rusty and stale. He would 
“vote against postponement. 
h Mr. CALDWELL was opposed to postponement. He could 
‘see no object in it. He did not know how many were in favor of 
postponement, but it was evident that if we postponed till Monday 
‘next it will come up as a new question, and will have to be discussed 
‘Over and over again. Are we to have a subject discussed here for 
‘days in committee of the whole, and then postpone the voting 
and the debate for a week? If this was the case, we would not be 
able to adjourn on the 25th, but may be here till the first of Octo- 
ber. He called upon those in favor of finishing the business, and 
of an early adjournment, to vote against any postponement. 
_ Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, the section as it stood was 
‘prohibition, and he was ready now to vote to sustain it. He was 
‘satisfied with it, and wanted no further consideration. 
Mr. FARWELL opposed the postponement. 
Mr. ARMSTRONG was opposed to the postponement. He 


AY 


660 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE 0 en 


called upon ines in favor of sdiausemee on he asth oF ia 
to go against postponement. We had sent forth to the wor 
that the Convention would adjourn on that day, and let tho 
who were so clamorous for that measure now come forward a 
show their hands. ‘ 

Mr. PINCKNEY was in favor of postponement, in dey 
give a fair opportunity to the friends of a good system of ban 
to introduce a system that would be acceptable to the majorit 

Mr. WOODSON moved the previous question. - 

The PRESIDENT said, the effect of the previous ques 
would be to cut off the motion to postpone. 

The motion was then withdrawn. 

Mr. KITCHELL said, he would not be infhicheen ee p2 
calls. He was opposed to prohibition but would vote age 
postponement, because he thought the Convention : as ready no 
as at any time, to vote on the subject. 

Mr. BROCKMAN addressed the committee in ‘opposition 
postponement. 

Mr. HAYES moved to lay the motion to postpone on 
table. ee 

The yeas and nays were demanded and ordered. Th 
resulted as follows: yeas 70, nays 62. Carried. : 

The question recurred on the concurrence with the report of the 
committee, and 

Mr. LOGAN withdrew his amendment. x 

Mr. WILLIAMS moved to add to the 4th section, as it 3 
stood, the following: “‘The Legislature shall prohibit, u unde 
adequate penalties, the circulation of all bank notes in this stz 
and all contracts founded upon, and payment made in, suche 
shall be void.” 

Mr. WILLIAMS said, that in order to make the experi 

_complete, he desired to have nothing in circulation but 
money. 

Mr. WHITNEY despaired of a good bank, and Bais th 
fore, go for the exclusion of all paper money, because the pea 
mostly desired a bank in the state for the purpose of exclud 
from circulation the bank notes of other states. For this rez 
he enlisted himself under the captain’s command of his friend 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 4, 1847 661 


A dams, and would, therefore, vote for prohibition of paper money 
in any sae 


_ Mr. DAVIS of McLean said, he was in favor of the proposition 
” of the gentleman from Cook, but. from the vote just taken on the 
_ motion to postpone, it was evident that banks would be prohibited, 
- and for the purpose of making the prohibition effectual he would 
 yote for the amendment of his friend from Adams. He would 
e prefer i it, if it made the circulation of bank notes a penitentiary 
_ offence. 
: Mr. LOUDON said, that he felt in good spirits as well as other 
_ gentlemen. He would ask the member from Lee if he had any 
_ more room on his pony! He felt like taking a ride this morning. 
’ He was in favor of a well regulated system of banking, and if he 
_ could not get that he would go for a total prohibition of banks, and 
_ of paper money, in the state. He announced himself as a mem- 
_ ber of the guard of the gentleman from Adams. 

‘ Mr. GEDDES announced himself as intending to follow the 
_ same course. 

Mr. SCATES advocated the amendment. 

Mr. KNAPP of Jersey was satisfied, from the misrepresenta- 
tions by the gentleman from Montgomery of the proposition of 
_ the gentleman from Cook, and the avidity with which they were 
_ swallowed, that no good banking system could be carried in the 
Convention. He would, therefore, vote for the amendment of the 
~ gentleman from Adams. His constituents were in favor of a 
" system of safe banking, but as that could not be obtained he 
~ would vote for the exclusion of all paper money in the state. The 


_ justice, hold it up to the ridicule of the Convention, and state its 

_ provisions so erroneously. He did not desire to speak disrespect- 
fully of the gentleman, but he had not acted fairly. 

_ Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery. Well, sir, if you do not speak 
_ respectfully, I will make you do so. 


662 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


Mr. KNAPP repeated his remarks upon ies course of | 
member from Montgomery. 


y 


[Mr. KNAPP: But, sir, I must be permitted to say, that to 
me it appears impossible that the gentleman, holding in his hand, 
as he did, the proposition of the gentleman from Cook, should 
so entirely misunderstand that proposition. The gentleman knew 
that the use of repudiated bonds could not, under any circum- 
stances, have been contemplated. Sir, the gentleman knew, c 
should have known, that the proposition contemplated the use of 
bonds of any kind, only as a collateral security to the creditors in 
general, and the bill holders in particular, and not as a basis or. 
capital for banking operations. It did contemplate the use of 
bonds; but their credit, their character and their value, were all 
distinctly set forth in the proposition itself; and none were to be 
used but such as had regularly paid their interest, fully and punctu- 
ally, for the three years preceding the time of making a deposit 
of the same with such officer of the government as may be desig- 
nated by law. This proposition, fair and safe as it appears to me, 25 
seems not to have found favor with the convention—and I am 
now convinced, that there is a disposition to dispense with bank - 
ing altogether. a 

Sir, I am the more convinced of this when I observe the proce 
avidity with which these strange misrepresentations are caught 
up, and if this be the determination, then, sir, I go for the et 
tion of the gentleman from Adams. If we are to have no b 
of our own, ought we to have and use the paper of the banks c f 
other States, with whose value and solvency, it is tie fo rr 
us to have any accurate acquaintance? 4 

Is it not in consequence of using the bank paper of ot 
States that the people will be liable to suffer loss? It certai 
can not be in the mere existence of banks, irrespective of th 
issues, that danger is to be apprehended. 

Now, sir, if we are to have no banks of our own, let us p: 
hibit the use of bank paper altogether; this is our only consistent 
course; let us prohibit its use, and that too by penalties entirel y 
adequate to secure its observance; then, if banks and bank issues: 
be indeed an evil, let us rid ourselves of that evil at once and 


ae 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 4, 1847 663 


effectually; and this, sir, is the position I take. I assume it as 
my alternative position, believing at the same time, that the 
people of my county, and as I believe the majority of the people 
of the entire State are in favor of a system of safe and restricted 
banking, such an one as we might secure by adopting the prop- 
osition which is now before the convention, proposed by the 
gentleman from Cook, (Mr. SHerman.) But if the convention 
think differently, I for one’will bow submissively to their decision, 
stipulating only, firmly but respectfully, that prohibition shall 
extend to bank paper as well as banks. 

The gentleman from Lee [Mr. DEmENT,] when he opened the 
debate, declared it was no longer a question of principle. I was. 


_ sorry to hear the gentleman say so. I had supposed it a question 
_ of principle. 


Mr. DEMENT. I said it was a question of democratic princi- 
ple. 

Mr. KNAPP. Sir, I supposed it a democratic principle of 
course, if indeed it were a question of principle at all. I supposed 
that the democratic principle was entire opposition to— 

Mr. DEMENT. I do not admit that. My position does not 


lead to that conclusion. I say there is no fundamental principle 


of democracy involved in the settlement of this question. 

Mr. WILLIAMS. As I have been regularly installed leader, 
I decide that the gentleman from Lee is right. 

Mr. DEMENT. So let it be— 

Mr. KNAPP. I know not who is foremost—who is leader; 
but I am sorry to see the principle abandoned by the gentleman 
from Lee,—especially as I had been led to suppose from the re- 


_ peated declarations of gentlemen, that it was a principle of democ- 


racy to do away with banking and bank issues altogether. 
The gentleman from Brown (Mr. Brockman) on yesterday 


_ characterized every system of banking as being anti-democratic; 


and in his printed speech, has attempted to fortify this position, 
by extracts from ‘‘Mansfield’s Political Grammar,’’ ‘‘Conven- 
tional Debates,’’ &c. &c. Sir, the value of this testimony is very 


_ small indeed, when compared with other testimony which the 


gentleman seems to have strangely overlooked. I mean, the 


664 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION: 
: ) a 


history of our own government, and our own most aac 
men, for the last thirty years. 

Does the gentleman know who it was that drew up a s 
ported most ably and successfully the charter of the late Natio 
Bank in 1817? And does the gentleman know who it was t 
drew up, and supported in the Senate of the United States in 
1832, the bill or charter providing for its continuance? Does th 
gentleman know who were its most able and devoted advocat 
If the gentleman does not know, he would do well to examine, a and 
he would soon find how much easier it is to assert a position than. 
to prove it true. The first Vice President under General Jackson, 
then and now, one of the great leaders of democracy, was 
author and advocate of the first, and the present Vice Preside t 
of the United States was the author and advocate of the second 
and both were supported by the great leaders of democracy in 
United States. Is not this true? Does any gentleman deny 
What, then, becomes of the assertion that every system of bank- 
ing is anti-democratic? Now, I ask every candid man if it is 
indeed true that banking is an exclusive whig measure? On t 
contrary, is it not true that the democratic party have had mot 
power, all over the Union, to control this matter, than the whig 
have ever had? And what has been the result? Since the yi 
1832, when Gen. Jackson vetoed the United States Bank chart 
about three-fourths of all the bank charters in all the States of th 
Union, have been established, whether for good or evil, by St 
legislatures having large democratic majorities.—There is no deny— 
ing the truth of this. Facts justify the assertion—and I appeal 
with perfect confidence to the history of the times. Hence it 
be seen that the gentleman from Lee was indeed right when h 
said that no fundamental principle of democracy was involved 
the settlement of this question. 

Now, sir, I am willing, as one of the whig party, to Ayétaes 
reasonable proportion of the odium arising from being favora 
inclined towards a safe and well guarded system of banking, 
indeed, any odium can fairly arise from being so inclined; but, s 
I am not willing, and will not bear any more than my just ¢ 
equitable proportion; and this proportion shall not be fixed b 
every empty headed declaimer; but by an appeal to fac 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 4, 1847 665 


to abide. 

Sir, I am in favor of a safe and well founded system of bank- 
4 ing;—a system which shall, under every possible state of circum- 
_ stances, keep the bill-holder entirely safe in the use of its notes; 


: —and by the results of this appeal, I am entirely willing 


; and such a system I am quite sure could be established; but, sir, 
4 J will never consent to the establishment of any bank in this State, 
: without first submitting the act of its incorporation to the peo- 
p ple for their vote. If they adopt it, ’tis well;—if not, I have not 
; 
1 


= 


a word to say; but will bow, as every good citizen should bow, to 

__ the supremacy of public sentiment. 
; But if this Convention shall insist upon a prohibitory clause, | 
positive and absolute,—then, sir, I fall back upon my alternate 
position. I will insist upon prohibiting all bank issues as well as 
_ banks themselves, as contemplated in the proposition of the gen- 
tleman from Adams. Any other course would be a reflection upon 
either the capacity or integrity of the people of this State. 

Who dares say that we possess not the capacity to create, or 
the integrity to control, as well at least as our neighbors, banking 
institutions, for our convenience? And inserting a prohibitory 
clause in our amended constitution would, in my judgment, be as 
insulting to their intelligence, as it would be distrustful of their 
integrity. 

: I confess that I had supposed we might be able to offer for the 
‘g acceptance of the people, some system that might meet the gen- 
_ eral wish, and as I believe, the general expectation. I still hope 
_ we may yet be able to do so, but from the proceedings of this day 
_ and yesterday, I am compelled to admit, that my hopes are 
mingled with many apprehensions. And if a prohibitory clause, 
' operating alike on banks and bank issues, in any and every form, 
shall be made a part of this constitution, we shall present to the 

people of this State an issue, that will most assuredly lead to its 
inevitable rejection. I hope gentlemen will pause before they 

insist,—will ponder well the consequences before they place the 


_ matter beyond their own control.—It may, or may not be best, 
' ultimately to establish banks in this State; there can be no harm, 


however, in submitting the question to the people themselves, 
and in whatever way they may decide, I pledge my own acqui- 


666 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


escence in that decision, without a question, and without a mur- 
mur.]* ‘ ay 


Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery replied. The gentleman from 
Jersey had expressed his astonishment of his misrepresentations — 
of the system of banking proposed by a member from Cook. He ~ 
did not know, nor did he care, in what light that member viewed — 
his remarks upon that stock-broker’s scheme for swindling. — 
That member also said this Convention gulped all he had said 
down with great avidity. Now, it was strange that this Conven- : 
tion had not the great wisdom, and power of perception, possesed _ 
by the member from Jersey, or as that member thought he had. y 
Mr. D. was no phrenologist, but from what that gentleman had f 
said, he should judge, and it was evident to all, that the bump of. } 
self-esteem was strongly developed. Instead of showing up the © 
benefits of this system, he has amused us with a lecture upon his . 
better powers of perception. But it was not strange. He told us, ~ } 
some weeks ago, that he looked for the time when farmers and ~ 
doctors, &c., not lawyers, would be on the bench of the supreme ~ 
court, and that they would make good judges. Now, he was a 
good, scientific, physician: wonder if he will, when he gets there, 
allow a steam doctor to sit along side of him? Mr. D. then said, » 
that he and his friend from Adams had acted together yesterday, 
but he was sorry he would have to leave him to-day. That gen- 
tleman represents a whig county and a democratic one. The 
democrats of his county had instructed him to go for prohibition, ~ 


all banknotes, under penalties, from circulation. They were 
opposed to the present law, in that respect. But if the democrats 3 . 
here thought the people would sustain them, let them go for it. — 
The whigs could vote for it with safety, as their constituents 
would understand the vote; but the democrats could not do the ~ 
same. The whigs risk nothing in this, but the democrats much. — 

Mr. NORTHCOTT said, he was a whig, but as the gentleman — q 
from Montgomery had dropped off the pony, he asked for his seat. 
He was sent here as a whig. He was objected to by his opponent, ~ 
because he would have no influence with tender footed democrats, ¥ 


This speech by Knapp is taken from.the Sangamo Journal, September 3. 4 


i 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 4, 1847 667 


but he was now in the same place as that opponent would be 
were he here; and desired his place on the pony. He was once a 
bank man but would now go for prohibition, as a good banking 
system could not be carried. 

Mr. PINCKNEY would vote for prohibition, but it should go 
in on the largest scale. The total exclusion of all paper money 
from circulation should be a part of it. The result would be 
undoubted—the rejection of the constitution. 

Mr. SHERMAN said, he would vote for the amendment, not 
because he believed it could be carried into effect, but because it 
could do no harm.—There was no power in any state to prevent 
a man receiving what he thought proper—even a white piece of 
paper—for his goods or property. The gentleman from Mont- 
gomery read the proposition he (Mr. S.) presented to the Conven- 


_tion, and made a great splutter over it. I was surprised that he, 


a professional man, would make such a statement of its provisions 
as he did. If he was a mechanic, like him (Mr. S.), the matter 
would be different; but a lawyer to criticize it as he did, was strange. 
He read a few words, commented upon them, and then skipped, 
as a lawyer always does, in order not to meet the question fairly. 
He would refer him to the fourth section: it provides that, before 
one dollar is issued, $50,000 must be paid in. When he says there 
is no specie clause, he says what is not the true interpretation. 
The clause [provides] that fifty thousand dollars must be paid in in 
specie-paying bonds, as collateral security. Thisis the true reading 
of it. The gentleman from Lee had insinuated that he and the gentle- 
man from Sangamon had made a party arrangement to carry this 
proposition; but when the gentleman from Adams came to the 


___ aid of the member from Lee, he was willing that he should mount 


Conse 


the pony, and the member from Lee was willing to mount behind, 
or even to hold on to the tail. Mr. S. said he cared nothing for 
banks himself; he could make more money if there were none, 
and so could men who had means. 

Mr. LOGAN said he went most heartily in favor of the amend- 
ment of the member from Adams. He favored it in good faith, 
as an adjunct proposition to prohibition, not as a weight to break 
it down and defeat the constitution, but as a proper requirement 
upon prohibition. Mr. L. then made a long statement of the 


s 


uy Hh pa r 


668 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI 


evils to the state of bank notes from other states being in c 

tion here. a Ve 
Mr. ADAMS moved one previous question, and it 

seconded. - 


yeas and nays being ordered and taken, it was Wein aie 
nays 41. 
The question being then on concurring with ae committee 0 
the whole in their amendments to the report, as just amended b by 
Mr. WIL.IAms, ae 
Mr. CALDWELL asked for a division on the SON ¢ to 
the first section, (proposed in committee by Mr. ScaTEs,) and th 
Convention refused to concur therein—yeas 53, hays 73. baveaen: 
There was no amendment to the 2d section. ‘ 
The addition of the words, “‘to be hereafter created,” 1 
3d section, was concurred in. ae 
The additional section offered by Mr. Epwarps of Sia 
and adopted in committee, was rejected—yeas 47, nays 83. 
The 4th section was then taken up. The question was 
concurring with the committee in striking out all after “ grante 
and inserting Mr. Wituiams’ amendment. The yeas and na 
were demanded and taken, and the Convention refused to concut 
yeas 47, nays 86. "| 
The question then was on concurring Tite the committee 
striking out the two last sections of the report—pending whi hy 
the Convention adjourned till 3 o’clock, Pp. m. 


AFTERNOON SSP i iN 


Mr. WOODSON moved a call of the Convention—ordered ind. 
made. if 
The question was taken on concurring with the connie 
striking out the two last sections of the report, and decided in th 
negative—yeas 56, nays 69, and the report of the committee « ‘ 
Incorporations stood as when first reported. 
Mr. DUNLAP moved to strike out all after the clit sectio : 
and insert the following: ! 
“No act of the legislature granting any special charter ; 
incorporation for banking purposes, nor any general act of i inco 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 4, 1847 669 


poration for such purposes, shall be in force or of any effect unless 
the same shall, at the next general election after its passage be 
submitted to a vote of the people, nor unless a majority of those 
voting (for and against it) be cast in favor of the act at such elec- 
tion shall vote.” 

The question was first taken on striking out—and decided in 
the afirmative—yeas 84. 

Mr. DEMENT said, that he sincerely hoped the proposition 
just offered would be adopted. He had been satisfied for some 
time, that it would be impossible to engraft in the constitution any 
prohibitory clause. This proposition was the next best thing 
to prohibition, and the best we can get. For one, he was willing to 
east his vote for it, and not fear the responsibility of the act. 
Everything that could be done for prohibition had been tried, and 
he hoped its friends would fall back on this as the next best. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG offered a proviso: that said bank should 
provide for the redemption of its notes in specie at Alton, Quincy 
and Chicago. ; 

Mr. McCALLEN moved to lay the proviso on the table; and 
it was laid on the table—yeas go, nays 40. 

Mr. ARCHER said: He would inquire of the gentleman from 
Morgan, if he designed this amendment as a substitute for the 
remainder of the report after section third? If so, he hoped the 
amendment would prevail, after the ride we had taken this morn- 
ing. The prohibition pony had broken down with us, and when 
he consented to take the ride on the pony with the gentleman from 
Adams he thought that gentleman was a skillful reinsman. He 
had been mistaken. From the unskillful driving of the gentleman 
from Adams or some other cause, he could hardly tell what, the 
pony, starting with a fair prospect of success, had broken down 
and thrown us in the mud. He had intended, if the pony had 
held out to the end of the race, to move to present the labors of 
the pony to the people as a separate article. 

Mr. HAYES offered the following as an amendment to the 
proposition: is 

“Provided, that after a bank charter or banking law shall 
have been submitted to the people, no other bank charter or 


670 ILLINOIS — STORICAL COLLECTI ons oe 


banking law shall be passed by the general assembly, until es i 
the expiration of five years.’ he 
Messrs. HARVEY and KITCHELL expressed themselves i in 
favor of the amendment of Mr. Duntap. ne 
Mr. WEAD regretted that the question was presented in its — 
present aspect. He never had much confidence in the gentleman 
from Adams as a leader, but expected more from the foresight and — 
experience of the gentleman from Lee. He never expected to see Bh 
the gentleman from Lee voting with the whig party on the bank 
question. But circumstances make strange bed fellows, and it i 
a matter he could not understand. If any agreement has been 
made, it is strange the member from Lee would vote for the presen 
plan. What is it? It gives the legislature power to gratify all 
the applications for private and special acts of incorporation that 
may be made. The same old system of special legislation. Every 
year applications will be made, bribes offered, &c., by gentlemen 
with wealth, who may desire a private bank charter. Was it not — 
sufficient for him, in giving up prohibition, to require them to — 
submit to general laws? Was he obliged to go over body and ~ 
-soul to the other party? Does he give them up all restrictions — 
over private incorporations? If the legislature is to have this — 
power, every feeling of patriotism should dictate that the statute — 
books should not be overcharged with acts of private bank charters. 
This is a greater power than has been granted by any state in the — 
union that has changed her constitution for years. If the power 
was to grant general acts, then the friends of prohibition would — 
have some chance. But if passed in its present shape they will © 
be unable to watch all the twistings and turnings of the friends 
of those private acts. If the gentleman from Lee and his co- 
adjutor from Adams have made this arrangement, he hoped this 
house would crush it, and that some regard would be paid to the 
public interests, and the rights and sentiments of the Beem 
would be protected. a 
Mr. DEMENT was opposed to the amendment of the acne a 
man from White. He was sorry to have fallen so far from the mi 
high place in the opinion of the gentleman from Fulton, as ita 
seemed he had. This proposition does not prevent the member 
from Fulton to get in what he wants. This, sir, is the best thing, 


a oe 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 4, 1847 671 


after prohibition, that can be attained from this Convention, for 
the interests of the people. Here the law will have to be submitted 
to the people. Again, at the election for the legislature, the 
question can be made of bank or no bank, and it will be submitted 
to the candidates, and they will be elected to carry out the instruc- 
tions of the people; and again, the charter must be submitted to 
them for an approval. The people are thus doubly protected. 
This does not prevent the member from Fulton from getting in 
anything of which he has the slightest chance. He says that he 
has lost confidence in me as a leader; well I can’t help it. As to 
voting with the whig party, I will be only glad that they will vote 
with me, but I am afraid they will not. I will, anyhow, vote for it 
as the best can get. The gentleman from Adams did not do us so 
much harm by mounting our pony. The gentleman from Fulton 
and myself had run him down and wind-galled him, and I was 
willing that the gentleman from Adams should mount him. If he 
got on his neck and was thrown over, we all fell together, and I 
was not sure, and for all I heard I did not doubt but what the 
gentleman from Fulton was killed in the fall. I do not understand 
the purpose as denying general banking, and I am not prepared to 
say that I am in favor of general banking laws. 

Well, allow them to have this bank charter passed—and then 
at the election we can take a town meeting view of the question, 
and the gentleman can take hold of their charter, and show up 


- its deformity to the people. 


Mr. LOGAN advocated the proposition as a true democratic 
plan, one based upon true republican doctrine. 

Mr. SERVANT would vote for the proposition as acompromise, 
and styled the gentleman who offered it as the great “‘ Pacificator,” 
and sterling “democrat” of the Convention. 

Mr. BROCKMAN opposed it as infinitely worse than the old 
constitution, as under this five hundred banks might be created. 

Mr. FARWELL said, that this plan was the most plausible 
and fair upon its face, but the basest in its effects that could be 
devised. It throws the door open to unrestricted banking by 
the legislature, and all its devastating evils. It was said that 
the question was left to the people to decide upon having a_bank. 

He had as much confidence in the intelligence of the people 


672 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL ee NS 


by the glowing pictures ar gentlemen beret abe thae was in | 
great internal improvement system. 


‘He had said before, and said now, that he had no 0 confide 


enced by banking i institutions. Pas 
The gentleman from Sangamon says that the ‘ddctrine® 
banking i is not confined to the whig party. If there be a differ- 
ence in the two parties it is on this question of banks. The 
gentleman from Knox has said on two different occasions that 
hostility to banks is no principle of the democratic party! Has 
he read anything? Has it not been inscribed high and brilliantly 
upon every democratic banner that has floated to the breeze fe 
the last ten years? Has he read the proceedings of the democrat 
meetings and conventions, for general and county officers? 
it not been published at the head of every democratic paper i 
the state? Has it not been published in all the democratic tes 
books? He must be ignorant of the history of this state, or h 
would not venture such assertions. ys 
Mr. McCALLEN advocated the proposition. oe 
Mr. SCATES opposed the amendment and declared Tenis if n 
favor of prohibition to the last—He would follow the lead of 
gentleman from Lee no longer. his 
Mr. HAYES withdrew his amendment and moved to ied 
the words “‘for or against be cast,” and insert “at such elections. 
He did this in order that the whole people might have a decis 
of the question. If this was adopted he would vote for the pr 
osition. He denied that the people of the state required 
expected banks at our hands. He defended prohibition 
just principle, as much so as any other restriction upon legislati 


various vhactles prohibition had gone through under the lewd 
the gentlemen from Jefferson, Lee and Adams; and commented 


to receive. He would vote for this, he would vote for any till 
in preference to the Wall street stock jobber’s scheme of a 
gentleman from Cook, which he hated worse than sin itself. i 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 4, 1847 673 


Mr. WILLIAMS replied to Mr. Hayes, and then gave an 
account of his progress as commander of the prohibition forces. 
Mr. PALMER of Marshall moved the previous question, 
“which was seconded. The question was upon the amendment of 
Mr. Hayes, and the vote was first taken on striking out. The 
_ yeas and nays were ordered, and resulted—yeas 72, nays 60; and 
then on inserting—yeas 92, nays 40. 

Mr. WEAD moved the Convention adjourn.—Lost. 

The question then was taken by yeas and nays on inserting the 
_ Proposition of Mr. Duntap as amended, and it was rejected— 
‘4 yeas 66, nays 66. 

So the report of the committee on Incorporations remained 
as first reported—minus the three last sections. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison (by leave) presented the report 
of the majority of the select committee of twenty-seven on the 
Judiciary. 

__ Mr. DEMENT presented the minority report of same commit- 
me tee. 
; Mr. DAWSON (for Mr. MrnsHatt) presented a minority 
_ report from same committee. 

_ And the reports were laid on the table and 250 copies ordered 
to be printed. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery entered a motion to reconsider the 
vote rejecting Mr. Duntap’s proposition. 

} Mr. LOGAN entered a motion to reconsider the vote adopting 
_ Mr. Haves’ amendment thereto. 

And then the Convention adjourned. 


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Fert Solae were Her ote MEAS ane 
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XLVII. THURSDAY, AUGUST 5, 1847 


Mr. CASEY asked a suspension of the rules to move 
rescinding of the latter past of the 17th rule, which require 
motion to reconsider to be laid over; and the rules were suspen 
and the part of the rule was rescinded a 

The question pending was on the motion to reconsider the vo ote 
by which Mr. Dun ap’s proposition, as amended, was rejec 
and being taken by yeas andnays, was decided in the icici) 
yeas 61, nays 69. 

Mr. LOGAN offered as an amendment to be inserted af on 
section three, the following: 

Sec. 4. No corporation for banking purposes shall be 
mitted to issue bank notes, to an amount exceeding three-four 
the amount of the capital stock actually paid in. 

Sec. 5. No such corporation shall be permitted to issue 
bank notes unless the same shall have been first countersigned 
registered by the Treasurer of this state. 

Sec. 6. No such notes shall be issued until such corporat’ 
shall deposit with the Treasurer the amount of such notes in st 
of the United States, or such of the states as shall, for three yea 
next preceding, have paid the interest on their bonds, provz 
that the bonds of this state may be received as such deposit, < 
such proportion of their nominal value as the interest paid by t 
state on such bonds for the three years ae preci 
such deposite, may bear to six per cent. 

Sec. 7. No bank shall be permitted to issue any paper uni 
one-third of the capital stock of said bank shall be paid in in spect 

Sec. 8. In case of insolvency of any bank, the bill-holders 
shall be entitled to priority in payment. 

Sec. 9. Non-payment of specie shall, in all cases, be a forf 
ture of the charter, and the Legislature shall have no power 
remit said forfeiture. : 

Sec. 10. No bank shall be established with a less capital t 


674 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 5, 1847 675 


one hundred and fifty thousand dollars, nor with a greater capital 

than six hundred thousand dollars. 

; __ Mr. GREGG moved to add to the amendment, as an additional 
"section, the following: 

“No act of the General Assembly authorizing corporations or 
associations with banking powers, in pursuance of the foregoing 
provisions, shall go into effect, or in any manner be in force, unless 

the same shall be submitted to the people at the general election 

“next succeeding the passage of the same, and be approved by a - 

majority of all the votes cast at such election.” 

Mr. THOMAS moved to lay the amendment on the table. On 
which motion the yeas and nays were ordered, and resulted—yeas 
46, nays 86. 

Mr. LOGAN then withdrew his amendment. 

Mr. DEMENT renewed the same with Mr. Grecc’s proposed 

amendment embodied therewith. 

Mr. WOODSON moved to add thereto after the words ‘“‘such 
election,’ the words “for or against such act.” 

Mr. GREGG said: I desire to inquire why it is that gentlemen 
who, but a day or two since, were loud in their professions of confi- 
dence in the people are now unwilling to trust them? What new 

light has beamed upon their understandings? What new visions 

have been displayed to their wondering gaze? Not long since 
certain gentlemen were soundly lectured on account of the restric- 
tions they proposed upon future legislative action. They were 

_ told that the people knew how to take care of their own interests— 
that there was no danger of the adoption of destructive measures 
as long as the principle of popular supervision was preserved. 

Then, the people were fit to be trusted with everything—there 

was no limit to their virtue, their intelligence, or their capacity! 
It was almost treason to place any thing like restrictions in the 

“constitution. The gentleman from Sangamon (Mr. Locan) went 
so far as to challenge members of the Convention to go against 

the amendment of the gentleman from Morgan, (Mr Dunzap), 

and triumphantly asked them if they were willing to deny to the 
people the privilege of determining for themselves what was cal- 
culated to promote their interests. He was fierce in support of 
‘that amendment and labored hard to procure its adoption. But 


| 
f 
“| 
e\, WEN 


Op i 
It provided that simply a majority of ee voting for an 
any banking act passed by the legislature, should be suffi 
give it effect. No majority of the people was Nesacia K 


number would impose upon the state a system uF frariia tas 
scheme of popular sanction was all proper and just. 
exceedingly democratic to enable a minority to make laws fe 
majority! Now, sir, I ask you to look at the other side of 
picture. The amendment of the gentleman from White 
Hayes) was adopted. It required any banking law, prop 
the legislature, to be sanction[ed] by a majority of the peopleb 

could go into effect. This did not suit the gentleman from $ Sangz 
mon, and those who acted with him. O no! Their | co ic 
in the popular capacity was great, but it did not go quit far 
Anything but a majority for'them! The people were wise ai 
honest, but the wisdom was all on the side of the minority 
admirable consistency! Now these gentlemen oppose any thin 
that contains the full and unqualified majority principle. Th 
are ready to go for projects falling short of this—for a 
popular sanction, which may embrace only a small min 
entirely subvert the popular will. Now I desire some expla 
of this change of position. I call upon gentlemen to de 
new position. I inquire why it is that their confidence 
people has so suddenly vanished? Can they tell me what | 
principle of evil exists in a provision requiring the sanctio 
majority of the whole people to a ease, having the 
possible bearing upon their interests? For one, I am 
support almost any proposition which allows the people of. 
to approve or reject such banking projects as the legislat 
submit to their consideration. Any thing for me, is 
entire legislative discretion upon this subject. But I 
to this complexion it will come at last. Some gentlem 
so strenuous in supporting entiré prohibition when they 
cannot be obtained, that I am much apprehensive they wil 
tribute largely to aid those who wish to leave banking a 
question, entirely free to legislative action. Are they 
perceive the result to which their action tends? 


are inflicted upon the people of the state, they stand in a position 
‘to be in some degree responsible for the existence of those evils? 
The amendment of the gentleman from Greene (Mr. Woopson) 
proposes merely a limited popular sanction for such banking acts 
as may pass the legislature. It falls short of a submission to the 
: _ whole people, and I am therefore opposed to it. It of course suits 
the views of the gentleman from Sangamon, (Mr. Locan,) and 
_ those who act with him. It comes up to their notions of popular 
: capacity and right, and they will not go beyond it. It will enable 
a minority of the voters of the state to give law to the majority. 
For my own part I am opposed to all such projects, and I like to 
‘see gentlemen who profess to respect, love, and venerate the 
" people, have consistency enought to be willing to trust them. 
_ Mr. WOODSON advocated his amendment as the only just 
» mode of taking a vote upon the question. Those who did not 
vote either for or against the proposition of a bank should not be 
_ counted as against a bank. 
"Mr. DAVIS of McLean argued on the same side. He thought 
"it an unjust principle that those who had not a sufficient interest 
in the question to induce them to vote either way, should be 
- counted against the bill. 
Mr. SCATES opposed the amendment as it did not require 
_ a majority of the whole people in its favor. It was the old system 
of ‘unrestricted banking, disguise it as they would. Like the ass 
in the lion’s skin, it perhaps might have passed by undiscovered, 
_ when the gentleman from Morgan (Mr, Duntap) offered it 
wae but we heard him (Mr. McCatten) attempt to roar 
" here yesterday, and he was discovered. The member from White, 
' tore off his covering and showed the full length of his auricular 
' organs. To-day the gentleman from Greene is endeavoring to 
"put on his covering again by his amendment, which is but a 
_ pretended popular vote. 
: Mr. HURLBUT was in favor of the amendment as presenting 
_ the only just mode of ascertaining the choice of the people. 
Mr. KITCHELL said, on yesterday, when the question now 
4 under consideration was presented by the gentleman from White, 
(Mr. eaten he found himself voting in the minority, and differ- 


iy 


678 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI On. “ne 


ently from most of his political friends, and from many hed are 
striving for the same result as himself. The vote was taken in a 
silence, without discussion; and, at first, seeing the large majority : 
against me, I thought possibly I might have voted wrong, but I 
have since reflected upon it, and I cannot bring myself to believe 
that my vote was wrong. As the question now comes up again, 
it is but proper that I should, briefly, give the reasons of my vo re. 
Sir, I have endeavored in all the proceedings on the bank question 
to act consistently. I have opposed absolute prohibition, because — 
I am satisfied that such is the wish of my constituents; and in 
doing so I do not compromise any principle, nor my personal 
opposition to banks. I seek to represent truly the wishes of my 
constituents when I know them, and not my own—for I am not a 
bank man. Some general restrictions I deem absolutely necessary 
and the first and all-important one is the one, offered by the 
gentleman from Morgan, Mr. Dunxap, requiring the submission 
of the law creating banks to a direct vote of the people. I have 
been for this all the time, and I believe my votes will all be found” 
perfectly consistent on the subject. Nor have I been found with 
the extremes of either party—neither with those for unqualified 
prohibition, who are mostly of my own party, nor with those who 
are for leaving the question open and unsettled, so that the Legis- 
lature may create and establish, without restraint, any kind of 
banks, for which I believe most of the whigs are striving. And is it 
not a little remarkable to observe, on, yesterday and to-day, how 
these extremes have come together; how the most ultra prohibi- ~ 
tionists and those who are for no restraint, and no prohibition, 
are now voting and acting side by side? But, sir, I will recur to” 
the question I rose to speak of, and what is it? The amendment 
of the gentleman from Cook (Mr. Grece) embraces a provision 
(the same offered yesterday by the gentleman from White) 
requiring a majority of all the votes given at a general election | 
to be in favor of the bank law, or else it should fail—in a word, 
that those who are careless, who have no opinion, who will not 
examine the matter, and who will not vote at all, shall be put down 
as voting against it. a 
Sir, this is an important principle, and before it is to find a 
place in our new constitution should be examined. The amend-— 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 5, 1847 679 


ment of the gentleman from Greene (Mr. Woopson) proposes to 
let the law stand or fall by the majority voting for or against it. 
and why not leave it so? By what right do we say that all who 
do not vote at all are against it? It is true that in changing our 
 constitution—our organic law—a majority of all the votes polled 
for representatives, &c., is required. But the people have been 
_very cautious about changing the constitution, and have required 
such modes as will secure great deliberation and prudence. A 
_ bank law is a far different thing from a constitution. There are 
some of the eastern states that require an individual to obtain a 
majority of all the votes given for the office, in order to be elected— 
_ that is to say, if there be six candidates for Congress, or Governor, 
‘one shall receive more votes than all the other five, to be elected. 
This is an inconvenient rule, and one not adopted in our state 
government. We act upon the principle, that in the exercise 
_ of the right of suffrage no man is absolutely bound to vote; that 
‘it is a duty he may omit, but that if he will not vote, will not par- 
ticipate in the election of officers, and in the powers of government, 
he must submit, and does submit, to the majority of those that 
‘do. This principle is recognized and practiced, I believe, every 
where else. Why is it proposed on this question alone to set 
down every man who does not vote at all, as opposed to the law? 
Are there no other questions of equal importance? Why not say 
‘that no judge, no congressman, no Governor, shall be elected 
without a majority of all the votes in the district or state? That 
the application of this principle, on this question, will be very 
acceptable to those who are for entire prohibition, is very likely, 
for it would certainly go very far towards utter prohibition. But 
‘it is unnecessary to engraft this new principle upon our constitu- 
‘tion, on this single question. 
Let me ask, further, whether this proposition is practicable? 
It provides that the act of the Legislature creating banks shall be 
‘submitted to the people at the next general election, and unless a 
majority of all the votes given at that election be in favor of the 
act it shall fail. Pray what votes are to be counted? Those for 
justices of the peace, for sheriffs, for judges, for what officers? It 
is not certain that we shall have any state officers to elect at such 
elections. And how, then, are you to find out how many votes it 


PPD eee 


680 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


will take to bea majority of all the votes at such acetone 
as you may, and there will be no better criterion to judge of tl 
expression of public opinion, than will be afforded by the 
upon the bank question alone. Mr. President, I was in 
yesterday, that the proposition of the gentleman from Mor, 
would be accepted by the Convention, untrammelled, as a 
promise measure upon whichalarge majority mightagree. Bu 
when the amendment of the gentleman from White (and 
again proposed) was offered, I did regard it as a death blow tot 
proposition. I am still more satisfied to-day that that princip 
will prove fatal to the proposition of leaving the law to the pec 
at all. Sir, from the position of the whole subject now, I 
form any opinion as to what will be the result of the matter 
Mr. CALDWELL said that upon this question he desir 
make a few remarks. He had not occupied much of the tims 
the Convention since its meeting, nor participated to any ext 
in the discussions that have taken place. There were m 
reasons why he had not done so, why he had not particip 
the discussions. Sometimes the previous question was called 
to cut off discussion, and also others have been more fortun: 
catching the eye and the ear of the speaker, than he had, 
possibly to the better position of their seats. This question 
prohibition had not been so fairly before the Convention, uj 
its real merits, till now; and it was due to himself and his ¢ 
stituents that he should say something upon it, and this, it) 
evident from what has been said, will be the last opportuni 
expressing his views upon the subject. The question of 
was one of the greatest importance to the people, and to 
interests. His convictions were entirely against them in 
shape or form, and were in favor of a prohibition of them 
engrafted in the constitution, and that was also the com 
and sentiments of his constituents. The gentleman from 
land (Mr. KircHE Lt) opposes prohibition, on the ground th 
the democratic doctrine that the people have the right to 
any time whether they will have this or that law, or whether 
shall exist here or shall not. Why, sir, when prohibition 
proposed here in the Convention, it was offered in a form, w. 
an alternate proposition of prohibition or not, might be su 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 5, 1847 681 


to the people for their choice and approval. Why did he not 
then vote to sustain that proposition? Why was that suffered to 
drop by these gentlemen for the plan now before us? Much has 
been said here about submitting banks to the people in bills to be 
passed by future legislatures, and by those who declare themselves 
in favor of prohibition and opposed to banks: why did they refuse 


to submit to the people a question of bank or no bank, and the 


decision thereon to be engrafted in the constitution? Why have 
they, who talk so much about submitting the question to the 
people, uniformly voted against a proposition presenting an 
alternate prohibition to the people, thus showing a manifest want 
of sincerity in their professions of submitting to the decision of the 
people. The gentlemen now have declared themselves in favor of 
this proposition as a compromise. Sir, when this convention first 
assembled, long before this compromise which has been effected 
between the gentleman from Lee and the gentleman from Adams— 
got up in a way | cannot understand, the friends of prohibition were 
in favor of a compromise, upon the grounds and in the manner he 
had just stated. When his (Mr. C.’s) convictions pointed him 
to a certain principle he would consent to no compromise of that 
principle. The friends of prohibition held it as a correct principle 
and they could not compromise upon the subject, by voting for 
a banking system. He was willing to submit it to the people as a 
proposition to be voted for by them separately, but never to 
sustain a compromise like the one before us, and which at the time 
excited his suspicions as to the mode in which it was brought about. 
When, on the day before yesterday, the gentleman from Lee and 
the gentleman from Adams commenced the exchange of compli- 
ments, and installed each other as leaders of the prohibition party, 
he could not understand it; but to-day a compromise has been 
effected by them, which the gentleman from Lee supports, and 
how that was brought about, or what means were resorted to, he 
confessed he did not know. Sir, we had prohibition in the com- 
mittee of the whole, and we carried it through like a flash, but as 
soon as we get back into the house, it is defeated. How this result 
was brought about, he could not see; whether it was the result of 
any concert for that purpose by gentlemen, or by accident, he knew 
not, but such was the fact. Again, as soon as we get out of com- 


682 I ae NOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


mittee, prohibition is defeated, and then comes the proposition of 
the gentleman from Morgan, offered as a compromise, and the 
gentleman from Lee votes for it, and speaks in its favor. He kne 
not if any arrangement or concert had been made between gentl 
men, but, sir, from what the member from McLean has said, 
would appear that there was something rotten in Denmark. Sir, © 
this is strange. That proposition had some ear marks about i 
that spoke the source whence it came. It had the stamp of the é: 
gentleman from Sangamon upon it; it had his seal and signet upon 
its features. And this is the proposition which the friends of pro- 
hibition accept as a compromise! al 
There had been much said against proliiaee as an unjust — 
principle, and doctrines had been advocated and preached her 
which appeared strange to him. It was denied that there is ; any 
principle of right to sustain prohibition. Look, sir, around your 
wide spread state, look at all the varied and distinct interests — 
of the country, at its manufacturing, commercial, agricultural an 
other important interests, and he asked what was government — 
established for? Is it not for the purpose of regulating the righ’ 
of those interests, and to protect one from the other, to secure each 
from the power and encroachments of the other? and how was this 
to be done? By placing proper limits and bounds to the powers 
and privileges of these respective interests, in relation to the others. — 
What is your bill of rights? which secures men in their lives and 
liberties, but a restraint upon the government in the exercise of its — 
power over men. What are the exemptions we have placed in the 
_ constitution, whereby the property of our people to the amount of 
one hundred dollars is released from taxation, but a restraint { 
upon the power of wealth and money from destroying the liberties — 
of the poor? and when we propose a prohibition of banks, what Y 
is it? We propose nothing but a restraint upon the monie 
power and influence of the country from establishing insta ; 
here to swallow up the rest. There is a manifest tendency on the 4 
part of the money power of the land to become the sole rulers and x 
governors of the different interests of the country, and it was our 4 
duty to restrain it. In no way could this be better done than by a — 
prohibition of banks. Mr. C.’s time expired at this moment and fi 
he could pursue the subject no longer. Be 


, 
’ 

4 
: 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 5, 1847 683 


Mr. LOGAN said, it was exceedingly unfortunate that the 
proposition of the gentleman from Morgan had been in his (Mr. 
L.’s) hand writing as, after it had been offered and the general 
feeling was in its favor, and the discussion going on, it was whis- 
pered about the room that it was in his hand writing, and 
that no doubt contributed to its defeat. But it happened not to 
be his proposition. It was the same as was offered on yesterday 
by the gentleman from Randolph, (?—see proposition of Mr. 
Roppins, in Wednesdays proceedings) and had been copied 
from that. Its paternity therefore was entirely democratic. 
Mr. L. then argued at length in favor of Mr. Woopson’s amend- 
ment. 

Mr. DEMENT said, he desired to say a few words in reply 
to what had been said by the gentleman from Gallatin, this 
morning, in relation to his course on the question of prohibition. 
Mr. D. came there a friend of prohibition, fought for it long, 
battled for it in its first, its second, third, fourth and fifth defeat, 
had presented himself under its banner at every fight, had thrown 
himself into every breach, and would never desert it until 
driven from it, and then he only retired with his face to the foe, 
and took up the next best position. Where, during all these con- 
tests, has been the gentleman from Gallatin? He has lain low, 
secreted in his ambuscade, and has not been heard of till the battle 
is over. The breast of the enemy has never been bruised by the 
force of his blows, it has never been pierced by his spear, or 
an arrow from his bow. He has laid hid in his ambuscade, while 
the fight was going on, when every arm was needed, and now when 


_ we are defeated, he has come out—sneaked out of his hiding place, 


and has risen a tall warrior in the cause, and his first bow is bent 
at the bosoms of his friends! His first blow, after his long inaction, 
is directed against the friends of prohibition. In his disordered 


_ imagination, he thinks the friends of that cause have abandoned 


_ their principle, when in fact, they have only, after a signal defeat, 


fallen back upon the next best position. In his disordered imagina- 


_ tion—which Mr. D. did not envy—he thinks, and says there is 


something very suspicious in manoeuvering with the gentleman 


_ from Adams. He mistakes a few jocular remarks which passed 


between us yesterday, made more for the amusement of the 


684 


Convention, than any thing else, and he) sets it down that 
is something wrong between us. 
Mr. CALDWELL said, he did not say so. oil, 
Mr. DEMENT. Well, he said it was very suspicious. — 
was our condition? We had fallen from fifty-four or fifty-eigl 
down to fifty, to forty-nine, then to forty-seven; every day y 
were becoming less in numbers; at that time, and after as 
contest, in which we were again defeated, the gentleman fr 
Adams came to our aid, and offered us his vote. Reduced 
numbers, and though not expecting success, we took him and h 
vote, and looked for more. That gentleman, however, came 
the support of prohibition alone, and we have again been defe 
And this the gentleman says, appears suspicious. Mr. D. lik 
not the man who is always suspicious of his friends, one who v 
turn upon them instead of the enemy, and draw his bow. 


of the cause which he says has been deserted for a susp 
compromise. Mr. D. never gave up, he never abandoned 
principles, had never gone over to their opponents. He had 
disastrously beaten and had been forced to retire. When h 
unable to hold his castle or his fortress, he would take up a medi 
position: if pressed by the enemy, and driven from there, | 
would take to the log cabin, and occupy that, if he could hav 
better. Such is not, however, the policy of the gentleman 
Gallatin ——He wars upon his friends for sodoing; hehas risen het 
when we are struggling for the next best thing after prohibit 

and in amean pettifogging manner, has alluded to the joc 
remarks which have passed between the gentleman from A 
and myself, and has endeavored, by insinuations, to hold me up 
to the Convention, and to the country, as one deserting my p 
ciples and my party, and as making some corrupt bargain 
the gentleman from Adams.—Mr. D. said that he would ever 
firm and true to the democratic and republican doctrine. If tl 
member from Adams, or the member from Sangamon, or any | 
their party come to our aid and vote with us, he would never 
his own party, and turn around and fight them, because 
members were on the right side. He had always been in fa’ 
prohibition, from the first to the last. When it was first rej 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 5, 1847 el 6 8e 


B. by a large majority, he had, in his remarks to the Convention, said 
_ that probably a compromise might be made with those of the 


democratic party who would not vote for it, that might be satis- 


_ factory; and an union effected that would answer in case 


prohibition could not be obtained. He never had heard the gen- 


_  tleman’s views before, he had never received any intimation of 


what they were, and he knew nothing till now of the gentleman’s 
opinions, other than that he was in favor of prohibition. 

Mr. D. was in favor of the plan which he had submitted, with- 
out the amendment of Mr. Woopson.—It was true, that it con- 
tained a system of banking, but in a most restricted form, and as 
it required, before any bank charter could become a law, that it 
should be submitted to the people, and to be approved by a major- 
ity of the whole people, it was, in his opinion, very near an effectual 
prohibition, or was, at least, the nearest thing to prohibition that 
we had any chance of obtaining. 

Mr. HAYES advocated the adoption of the proposition 
submitted by the gentleman from Lee. He was now, and had been 
throughout, in favor of prohibition. He was opposed to banks in 
any shape or form; he looked upon them as an evil of the worst 
character, and one which we should avoid above all others. But 
prohibition could not be carried, as the votes of the last few days 


have clearly shown. What, then, was the best course to follow? 


Abandon the subject, or leave to the friends of banking a Legisla- 
ture free to act, to create as many and of what kind of banks it 
pleased? Or to adopt in the constitution such restrictions as 
would check the evils of banking, and then depend on the addition- 
al clause, that the charter shall be submitted to the whole people 
for their approval, as a complete check. This was the best we 
could now expect to obtain. Should we leave the subject open 
to the Legislature? No one seemed to think this desirable. 
Then, how could the member from Gallatin reconcile it with his 
views of the subject to oppose this plan of restrictions upon the 


_ Legislature? He could understand the course of the friends of 


banks, they were consistent. But that policy pursued by some 
of those who were in favor of prohibition appeared to him very 
strange. Unless we adopt this amendment of the gentleman 
from Lee, the whole subject will be left open to the Legislature. 


686 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI ONS 


Was the member from Gallatin prepared for that? Mr. H. 4 
opposed at much length the amendment offered by the member 


ciple requiring a majority of the whole people to approve of a bank | 


charter before it can go into operation. 


Mr. McCALLEN addressed the Convention in opposition to _ 
the whole scheme, but if the same was to be adopted he would _ 


vote for the amendment of the gentleman from Greene. 


Mr. DAVIS of Massac said, it was not his intention to detain 


the Convention long; he had but a few remarks to make. He was 


in favor of the proposition to have the act creating a bank sub- a 
mitted for the approval of the whole people. Prior to his coming — 
here, he thought the whole democratic party was in favor of a 
total prohibition of banks, that in the party there were none, 
whatever, to raise their voice against it. When he reached here 


he found that the party was represented differently upon this floor. 
He found upon this important question, this question affecting — 
the whole people, that gentlemen entertained views different from 
those he had anticipated. 

Previous to the sitting of this Convention the whole dence 
cratic press of the state declared the sentiments of the party to be 
in favor of prohibition—the democratic meetings at all times, and 
on all occasions, fulminated their thunder against banks in any 


Lied 
ch, 


and all shapes, the proceedings of their meetings and conventions — B 


breathed the same spirit. The great state convention that met 
here, in this very hall, to nominate a candidate for the highest 


office in the state, declared they would not support any man for 


that office unless he declared his hostility to banks. Such, sir, 


had been the sentiments of the democratic party for years upon — 


this subject. This Convention met, and we find that the friends 


of prohibition stand here fifty-eight in number—an almost equal - 
number of the same party are found in favor of banks. What 
was to be done? We have been defeated, must we go over to the - 


other party, yield up our principles and vote for a banking system? 
Is that the only course left for the friends of prohibition? No, 
sir. There are those here in favor of prohibition who, when the 
democratic party is shipwrecked and about to be engulfed in the 
sea of whiggery, come forward and submit an alternate proposition 


. 


- eS —— - se —oaws se ee ee ee le 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 5, 1847 687 


to the people, in order that we may present to the people the 


di question of bank or no bank. In order that the whole people may 


choose in the matter, and decide whether we shall have banks or not. 
But, sir, this course has not been followed; gentlemen, with 


_ exceedingly good management, have directed the question of 


prohibition differently; they have avoided this alternate plan of 
submitting the question. The gentleman from Adams has been 


installed as leader by the gentleman from Lee, and the gentleman 


from Lee by the member from Adams. They have brought the 
question before the Convention in a different shape, and in all 
other ways, save that which the friends of the principle could sup- 
port. But, sir, their reign has been short. They have been 
defeated in their management of the cause, and the gentleman 
from Lee presents us now the amendment before us, as a compro- 
mise. A compromise with whom? A compromise with the 
gentleman from Adams and the gentleman from Sangamon. He 
complains that the gentleman from Gallatin alluded to this matter. 
Sir, the other day, when he (Mr. Davis) submitted a proposition 
of his own origin, in relation to the important question of a free 
and independent judiciary, and the gentlemen from Adams and 
Sangamon acted with me in its support, it was found very strange— 
by the gentleman from Lee—that I should be found acting with 
those gentlemen! Sir, there was no concert, no arrangement, no 


-compromise ¢here! Yet the gentleman from Lee found it very 


strange that the whigs were in favor of that proposition. 

Mr. DEMENT rose to explain. He said, that as he had no 
chance to reply to the gentleman, he would say to him and his 
friend from Gallatin that he had never insinuated there was any 


compromise. It was evident that the members from Massac 


and Gallatin were ove, and that their attack upon him was a 
joint one. He interrupted the gentleman now, because he would 
have no chance to reply. 

Mr. WILLIAMS said, he would defend him. 

Mr. DAVIS resumed. Yes, sir, we are one, the gentleman 
from Gallatin and myself are acting together upon this question, 
as we did upon the question of a judiciary. The gentleman says 
he cannot reply, he need not fear, for Hercules, whoissitting behind 
me, says he will defend him. The member from Lee says the 


nals, and they will show that he has acted hiod tele the who 
session of this Convention, with a strict regard to principle; ‘the ; 
he has never abandoned his principles upon a single question, ‘b 
has adhered to them with a pertinacity which Mr. D. was sorry 
say had not been so characteristic of the course of some other 
honorable gentlemen. Mr. D. argued till the expiration of his 
time, in opposition to the amendment proposed by Mr. Woopson 
and contended that there would never be an expression of the sen- 
timents of the peop/e in favor of banks, unless we required a majo 
ity of all those voting at the election. This was the only fa 
proper and satisfactory mode of ascertaining the popular will. 
Mr. SHERMAN suggested to the member from Greene 
modify his amendment so as to require a special election upon t 
subject of approving a bank charter—he would, however, sas 
it as it stood. 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery opposed the whole gr before the 
Convention. 
A motion was made to adjourn, pending which— ay 
Mr. ALLEN (by leave) submitted a report from the commit 
on the Bill of Rights, which was laid on the table and ale: zx 
ordered to be printed. es 
And then the Convention adjourned till 3 Pp. m. May i 


rh oy! 
AFTERNOON ‘A Ty 


Mr. DEMENT modified his proposition by ae thereto th 
following: ' 

“The stockholders in every corporation and joint Sack. ass 
ciations for banking purposes, issuing bank notes or any kind t 
paper credits to circulate as money, shall be individually respon: 
ble to the amount of their respective share or shares of stoc! 
any such corporation or aeopeeon for all its debts and etry 
of every kind.” 

Mr. KNOX iota the Convention in favor of a poodl 
sound specie paying bank, which would facilitate business and lead 
to develop the resources of the state, and, also, against Re 
tion, 


a THURSDAY, AUGUST 5, 1847 689 


a Mr. Tuomas and Epwarps of Sangamon both opposed the 
: individual liability clause. 

And the question being taken on the amendment of Mr. Woop- 
son, by yeas and nays, it resulted—yeas 80, nays 57. 

' Mr. THOMAS moved to strike out the individual liability 
- clause. 

_ Mr. CALDWELL said, that he had been unexpectedly inter- 
' rupted this morning by the expiration of his time. He felt the 
"remarks he should make and those he had already made, were due 
_ both to himself and his convictions. He was sorry that his time 
_ was short, for if he had been allowed to continue, the gentleman 


i 


_ from Lee would have seen that there was no ground for his com- 
' plaint against him (Mr.C.) The gentleman’s feelings seem to have 
E been wounded by what had been said, but if he (Mr. C.) had been 
allowed to continue his remarks this morning that gentleman 
would have seen that his remarks were not intended to apply 
specially or personally to that member. 

_ Mr. DEMENT asked the gentleman if his remark that the 
compromise with the gentleman from Adams was suspicious—was 
a general remark. 

_ Mr. CALDWELL replied, that it was, but if others applied it 
"specially to their case, he could not help it. | 

Mr. DEMENT again rose, but the cries of order prevented his 
being heard. 

Mr. CALDWELL said, that his time was short and for that 
‘reason he had not interrupted the member from Lee when he spoke 
é! ‘this morning. The gentleman from Lee said that he (Mr. C.) had 
_ ‘not participated in the discussions heretofore in the convention. 
‘This was true, and he felt proud to say that he had not participated 
as others had in discussions, the most of which were frivolous 
and trifling, and which were continued to purposes and ends to be 
accomplished without this house. He was an honest man, and 
what he did and said here was for some legitimate project. He 
did not arrogate to himself this principle, but such was one reason 
why he did not participate in the trifling discussions which we have 
had. Again, there were many who had greater celerity in obtain- 
ing the floor than others, and that was perhaps a reason why many 
had not heretofore spoken. The gentleman regretted that he 


690 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — : 
te us 
(Mr. C.) iA not spoken much in the convention, well, sir, the 
very first effort he made—and it was on a most important subject, _ 
the judiciary, the gentleman from Lee rose and attacked him, 
attacked him in his position and in his argument. Yes, sir, said 
Mr. C., he regrets that I have not spoken, but he forgets that 7 
very first effort drew upon me an attack from him. 4 
Mr. DEMENT disclaimed, in what he had said on that occa: ‘ 
sion or reply to Mr. C., any intention to attack him. 
Mr. CALDWELL Bee and said, intention or not thell 
gentleman had attacked him on the very first occasion he had 
addressed the convention, and yet he now says he regrets I have © 
not spoken oftener. Sir, the member from Lee was a leader here 
of the democratic party, at the commencement of the session, 
and on all party questions, it was unnecessary for him (Mr. C.) 
to address the convention, because the leader was always ready to 
do so, and had an extraordinary facility in getting the floor, 
and none of the humble members of the party were called upon to 
speak. The member from Lee complains that my opinions upon 
this question have never been heard by him, when, sir, has this — 
question been before us, in a shape to be properly discussed? i 
Never, sir, till now. Since it has been, I have endeavored to 
obtain the floor; on yesterday I tried several times and failed. 
But, sir, when we had a general discussion upon banking, where | 
was the gentleman from Lee, did he then oppose banking upon» 4 
principle? Did he show how wrong and unjust were its operations, — 
viewed as a matter of principle? No, sir, he argued it on the : 
grounds of expediency—he considered the question not one of 
principle, but mere expediency. We act differently. We inquire — 
- not into the expediency of any thing which we consider wrong in 
principle. We look upon the question of prohibition as a matter 
of principle, but the gentleman differs from us. He says we fight — 
against our friends, that we turn upon our own friends instead of — 
our enemies. Is thisso? Weare fighting for prohibition yet, and — 
cannot compromise the principle. He is acting with those whom ~ 
he calls enemies, and is defeating prohibition. We stand firm to 
our principle, he has gone over to a bank project, and now at the 
last hour, when deserted by our leader, I have come out ancora 
the last of the party to sound the;tocsin of alarm. Mr. C. said he 


7] 
4 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 5, 1847 691 


were in its favor would rally around it, it could be presented in a 
shape that could be adopted. Of all the various propositions that 
ad been presented during the convention on the subject of banks, 
this, contained in the amendment of the gentleman from Lee, was 
‘the most objectionable, and the last he could ever vote for. It 
" was really and truly what it had been termed by the member from 
Montgomery—a Wall street proposition drawn up by stock-jobbers 
nd schemers. It allowed an issue to an amount of three-fourths 
ts capital, while only one-third of the capital was to be in specie. 
" This itself was wrong—was a feature he could never adopt. More- 
‘over the charter granted under it was to be a constitutional charter, 
which could never be repealed or altered. It was worse than the 
ordinary bank charters, for they could be changed, altered or re- 
_ pealed, but a charter granted under this provision would be above 
them all. It creates in our state a perpetual banking charter. It 
‘creates a powerful and continual money power, which by its 
influence will control all the interests of the state, and possibly 
_ the freedom of our electors. Its effect would be the centralization 
of the monied influence of the country, and work injuriously 
: upon allitsinterests. Itis based upon nothing real or substantial, 
_ its capital is not specie or its equivalent; it is based upon stocks. 
_ Let it once become known in the country that a bank may be 
established i in Illinois, based upon a capital consisting of stocks, 
and, sir, you will have numerous runners and agents from every 
tock-jobbers’ board in the land—scouring our state, dealing 
_ out money and using every possible means to secure its adoption 
‘by the people. And [is] #75 to be fastened upon us forever, by a con- 
‘Stitutional charter? Mr. C.’s time here expired. 

_ Mr. DEMENT said, he felt himself obliged to trespass upon 


Mr. D. had not deserted prohibition, he was in favor of it 
till, and had, as he had stated in the morning, been its consistent 
advocate. He only abandoned /ofa/ prohibition after a series of 
defeats, and then took the next best position—restriction. The 


692 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT! 


gentleman from Gallatin has taken a different course. 
never fought the battle, he has never felt the charge, or r 
the thrust. But after the battle has been fought and we def 
after we have been driven from eee to the next ge 


place, and rising like a tall and valiant Waren ashe is, and di > 
his fire at his friends who are battling for the best they can ob: 
Which course is the true one? The gentleman from Gallati 
that on the occasion of his first speech he was attacked. 
was not so; no attack was made upon him. When he said 
supreme court, when it held court where there would be but 
case to be tried, would become contemptible, he, Mr. D., diffe 
from him, and thought otherwise. He thought the gentlem 
the gentleman from Sangamon agreed then in pronouncir 
effort to make the supreme court hold a term in each circuit 
calculated to bring the court into contempt, and he differed fr 
them in opinion. This was all: and no attack was made upon th 
gentleman. But it is evident, said Mr. D., from the allusion 
by the gentleman to that matter, that he has been treasuri: 
in his heart, wrath against the day of wrath. Hehascarried th 
his heart, until that day should arrive when he could get me 
opposition, where he could vent his spleen upon me. It has com 
and we have seen its workings. Not content, sir, with p 
upon my head the venom he has treasured, you, sir, have co me 
forashare. He has complained of you, also, because he says. th 
from his seat he cannot succeed in catching your eye, and your : 
and has, therefore, been denied the opportunity of speaking. — 
Mr. CALDWELL said, he had never complained of 
Speaker. 
Mr. DEMENT said, well, sir, he says he could not pape 
eye, nor your ear; if his complaint is not against you, it is age ns 
his seat. The gentleman has said that he thinks prohibition, 
this moment, stands upon firmer and ‘surer grounds than at 
time during the Convention. How he had come to that co 
sion is rather difficult for others to perceive. If he thinks fe 


ee a em See ge eee, Pere SOL, ea eS 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 5, 1847 693 


‘hibition could be carried after its rejection yesterday by an over- 
whelming vote; if he thought there was the least chance, he would 
vote for it. Mr. D. explained the provisions of his amendment 
_ not to be a banking system, but a plan of restrictions upon any 
sy stem that might be adopted. He pointed out the vast difference 

between it and the plan of Mr. SHERMAN, and advocated its 
4 adoption, as the best thing the opponents of banks had any chance 
of obtaining. 
_. Mr. THOMAS withdrew his motion to strike out the individual 
_ liability clause. 

_ Mr. CALDWELL said, the gentleman from Lee had repre- 
_ sented him as saying he had offered an alternate prohibition clause. 
: _ This was not so, he had not offered any such thing. When he 
' _ spoke of this, he was referring to a proposition that had been intro- 
_ duced by the gentleman from Fulton, (Mr. Marktey) and by a 
g member whom he did not now remember. 
_ Mr. ARCHER said he had offered such a proposition. 
“ Mr. CALDWELL said, that it was to the fact that these had 
_ been offered, and he had asked the member from Lee why he 
_had not taken up one of those, as a compromise, instead of his 
present amendment, or the proposition of the gentleman from 
_ Morgan. 
| Mr. DEMENT had no knowledge of the propositions. 
Mr. HAYES offered an amendment. 

_ Mr. CALDWELL offered an alternate prohibition section, to 
_ be submitted to the people separately, which was accepted as a 

_ substitute therefor. 
7 _ Mr. ADAMS moved the previous question, which was 
seconded. 
The question was then taken, by yeas and nays, on the amend- 
_ ment offered by Mr. Haves, as modified;_ and the same was reject- 
ed. Yeas 61, nays 76. 

____ The question was then taken on the amendment first pean 


toonsow- and the same was sloped: Yeas 127, nays 9. 

_._.. The question was then taken on the 11th section, (individual 
_ liability of stockholders); and the same was adopted. Yeas 109, 
_ nays 30. 


69, ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


99: | 
And the report of the committee on Incorporations as amended 
and adopted, stood as follows: a 

SECTION I. Corporations, not possessing banking powers or 
‘privileges, may be formed under general laws, but shall not be 
created by special acts, except for municipal purposes, and in 
cases where, in the judgment of the Legislature, the objects of the 
corporation cannot be attained under general laws. 

Sec. 2. Dues from corporations not possessing banki 
powers or privileges shall be secured by such individual liabilit 
of the corporators, or other means, as may be prescribed by la 

Src. 3. No State bank shall hereafter be created, nor sh 
the state own, or be liable for, any stock in any corporation or 
joint stock association for banking purposes, to be hereaftey 
created. : 

Sec. 4. The stockholders in every corporation and joint stod 
association for banking pruposes, issuing bank notes or any ki 
of paper credits to circulate as money, shall be individua 
responsible to the amount of their respective share or shares of 
stock in any such corporation or association, for all its sag and 
liabilities of every kind. ge 

Sec. 5. No act of the General Assembly authorizing corpora- 
tions or associations with banking powers in pursuance of the 
foregoing provision, shall go into effect or in any manner be 
enforced, unless the same shall be submitted to the peo 
at the next general election next succeeding the passage of | 


ray 
sy 


- 


election for or against such law. 
Mr. SMITH of Macon moved the Convention prey A 
the Convention adjourned. 


XLVIII. FRIDAY, AUGUST 6, 1847 


The question pending at the adjournment yesterday was on 
the adoption of the report as amended. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved the previous question 
__ which was adopted—yeas 65, nays 56. 

; -“Mr. SCATES moved a division so as to vote first on the adop- 
_ tion of the last section thereof, and the Convention refused a 
_ division of the question. 

The question was then taken on the adoption of the article, 

and it was decided in the afirmative—yeas 96, nays 45. 

7 Mr. HAYES offered an additional section. 

The PRESIDENT ruled it out of order. 

Mr. HAYES appealed from the decision of the Chair and asked 
_ for the reading of his amendment. 

Mr. THOMAS objected to its reading. 

__. The question was taken on allowing the amendment to be 
_ read and decided in the affrmative—yeas 65, nays 56. 

- Mr. CASEY begged the gentleman to withdraw his appeal; 
_ the chair was certainly correct. 

Mr. HAYES withdrew his appeal. 

Mr. SERVANT moved the article be referred to the committee 
on Revision. Carried. 

Mr. Z. CASEY moved to take up the report of the committee 
on the Executive [Legislative?] Department as amended in com- 
‘mittee of the whole; and the motion was agreed to. 
és The first and second sections and the amendments thereto 
_ were adopted. 

? The third section was read, and 

i Mr. MARKLEY moved to strike out “25” and insert “21” 
__ and the same was lost—yeas 41, nays 86. 

‘ Mr. SINGLETON offered an amendment; which was adopted. 
And then the section was adopted as amended. 


; Sec. 3. No person shall be a representative who shall not 
_ have attained the age of twenty-five years; who shall not be a 
695 


eee AY 
Y i 


696 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE ( 


citizen of the United States, and an inhabieane ee ih stat 
shall not: have resided three years in the state, and within the 
of the county or district in which he shall be chosen twelve mont 
next preceding his election, if such county or district shall h 
been so long erected; but if not, then within the limits of the coun 
or counties, district or districts, out of which the same shall ha 
been taken, unless he shall have been absent on the public busi: 
of the United States, or of this state; and who, moreover, s 
not have paid a state or county tax. v 

The three following sections were adopted: 

Sec. 4. No person shall be a senator who shall not have : 
tained the age of thirty years; who shall not be a citizen of the 
United States, and an inhabitant of this state; and who shall 0 
have resided five years in the state and one year in the county 
district in which he shall be chosen immediately preceding ok 
election, if such county or district shall have been so long cre : 
but if not, then within the limits of the county or count 
district or districts, out of which the same shall have been take 
unless he shall have been absent on the public business of the Uni 
States, or of this state; and shall not, moreover, have paid a 
or county tax. 

Sec. 5. The senators, at their first session herein neaeiiad 
shall be divided by lot from their respective counties or districts, 
as near as can be, into two classes. The seats of the first 
shall be vacated at the expiration of the second year, and 
of the second class at the expiration of the fourth year; so 
one-half thereof, as near as ae may be ern cho 
forever thereafter. 


souls, when five members may be added to the House, an 
additional members for every five hundred thousand inhab 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 6, 1847 697 


to which said counties may be entitled, shall be elected by the 
entire district; and until there shall be a new apportionment of 
senators and representatives, the state shall be divided into 
senatorial and representative districts; and the senators and rep- 
resentatives shall be apportioned among the several districts as 
follows, viz: 

The following sections, after various amendments, were 
adopted, as follows: | 

Sec. 7. The first session of the General Assembly shall com- 
mence on the first Monday of January, one thousand eight hun- 
dred and forty-nine; and forever after, the General Assembly 
shall meet on the first Monday in January next ensuing the elec- 
tion of the members thereof, and at no other period, unless as 
provided by this constitution. 

Sec. 8. The Senate and House of Representatives, when 
assembled, shall each choose a speaker and other officers. Each 
House shall judge of the qualifications and elections of its members, 
and sit upon its own adjournments. Two-thirds of each House 
shall constitute a quorum; but a smaller number may adjourn 
from day to day, and compel the attendance of absent members. 

Sec. 9. Each House shall keep a journal of its proceedings, 
and publish them. The yeas and nays of the members on any 
question shall, at the desire of any two of them, be entered on the 
journals. 

Sec. Io. Any two members of either House shall have liberty 
to dissent and protest against any act or resolution which they 
may think injurious to the public or to any individual, and have 
_ the reasons of their dissent entered on the journals. 

Sec. 11. Each House may determine the rules of its proceed- 


_ ings; punish its members for disorderly behavior; and, with the 


concurrence of two-thirds of all the members elected, expel a 
member, but not a second time for the same cause; and the reason 
for such expulsion shall be entered upon the journal, with the 
names of the members voting for the same. 

Sec. 12. When vacancies shall happen in either House, the 
_ Governor, or the person exercising the power of Governor, shall 
_ issue writs of election to fill such vacancies. 
Sec. 13. Senators and representatives- shall, in all cases, 


698 | ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


except treason, felony or breach of the peace, be privileged { 
arrest, during the session of the General Assembly, and in go’ 
to and returning from the same; and for any speech or debate in 
either House, they shall not be questioned in any other place. a 
Sec. 14. Each House may punish, by imprisonment during 
its session, any person, not a member, who shall be guilty ‘ 


at any one time exceed pilin dae hours. 
Sec. 15. The doors of each House and of committees of the 
whole shall be kept open, except in such cases as, in the opinio 
of the House, require secrecy. Neither House shall, without th 
consent of the other, adjourn for more than two days, nor t 
any other place than that in which the two Houses shall be sitting. - 
Sec. 16. Bills may originate in either House, but may be 
altered, amended, or rejected by the other; and on the final passage | 
of all bills, the vote shall be by ayes and noes, and shall be entere 1 
on the journal, and no bill shall become a law without the con- 
currence of a majority of all the members elect in each house. 
Section 17 as reported was stricken out and the following wa 
substituted therefor: i 
“‘Bills making appropriations for the pay of the members an 
officers of the General Assembly, and for the salaries of the officer 
of the government as fixed by the constitution, shall not contai 
any provisions on any other subject.” ‘ 
Leave of absence was granted to Messrs. ARCHER, PINCKNEY 
and Kinney of Bureau, for eight days. 
And the Convention adjourned till 3 p. m. 


AFTERNOON 


Leave of absence for eight days was granted to Mr. Dummer. — 
The Convention resumed the consideration of the busines: “ 
before it in the morning. i, 
Section 18 was read, and after various amendments by Messrs 
Suumway, Perers and others, was adopted as follows: 
Sec. 18. Every bill shall be read on three different daved i 


ya 


each house, unless, in case of urgency, three-fourths of the hous 


where such bill is so depending shall deem it expedient to dispenst 


were; 


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Lee 


43 


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» 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 6, 1847 699 


with this rule; and every bill, having passed both Houses, shall be 
signed by the speakers of their respective Houses; and no private 
or local law which may be passed by the Legislature shall embrace 
more than one subject, and that shall be expressed in the title. 
And no public act of the General Assembly, shall take effect or be 


in force until after the expiration of sixty days from the end of the 


session at which the same may be passed, unless, in case of emer- 
gency, the Legislature shall otherwise direct. 

Messrs. Sim and KENNER offered additional amendments, 
which were rejected. 

Section nineteen was adopted as follows: 

Sec. 19. The style of the laws of this state shall be:—“Be it 
enacted by the People of the State of Illinois, represented in the 
General Assembly.” 

To section twenty eighteen motions to amend were made, 
and the yeas and nays were taken seven times; and the section 
was adopted as reported—yeas 93, nays 35. 

Mr. VANCE moved to insert the following, as an additional 
section: 

“After the year 1860, the Legislature may raise the per diem 
pay of members to any sum not over $3 per day;” and the same 
was rejected. 

The twenty-first section was adopted, as follows: 

Sec. 21. The per diem and mileage allowed to each member 
of the Legislature shall be certified by the speakers of their respec- 
tive houses, and entered on the journals and published at the close 
of the session. 

The twenty-second section was adopted, as follows: 

Sec. 22. No money shall be drawn from the treasury but in 
consequence of appropriations made by law; and an accurate 
statement of the receipts and expenditures of the public money 
shall be attached to, and published with the laws at the rising 
of each session of the General Assembly. And no person, who 
has been or may be a collector or holder of public moneys shall 
be eligible to a seat in either house of the General Assembly, nor 
be elected to any office of profit or trust in this state, until such 
person shall have accounted for, and paid into the treasury, all 
sums, for which he may be accountable. 


place of trust, cas this state, which shall have beat we yr 
emoluments of which shall have been increased, during such 
Mr. AKIN moved to add to it: “Nor shall any mer 
this Convention be eligible to any office created by this: 
tion at the first election after its ratification.” om 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon offered the fllowing, 
substitute thereof: His a 
““No person elected to the Legislature shall receive 


+ 


Yite 


and all such appointments and all votes given for any y such m 
ber, for any such office or appointments shall be void.” 
Mr. EDWARDS supported the amendment with ‘some 
marks, and was replied to by PPh 
Mr. SCATES who doubted its constitutionality. ‘s fee 
The Convention, without taking the question, adjor rr 
to-morrow at 8 o’clock. 


XLIX. SATURDAY, AUGUST 7, 1847 


Mr. WEST moved to suspend the rules to enable him to offer 


the following preamble and resolutions. And the rules were 


unanimously suspended. 


Wuereas, we have just learned with deep and poignant regret 
of the death of Captain Franxiin Nites, of the 5th 
regiment of Illinois volunteers, which occurred on the 
24th day of July last, whilst on his way to Mexico, in 
command of a company of volunteers from Madison 
county; therefore, 

Resolved, That we sincerely mourn and deeply regret the death 
of our fellow-citizen, Capt. Franxiin NILEs, of the 5th regiment 
Illinois volunteers. 

Resolved, That in the death of Capt. NiLEs, the volunteer army 


of the United States has sustained the loss of a brave and accom- 


plished officer; our state one of its noblest and deserving sons; 
and the community one of its brightest ornaments, and his family 
and friends one who was endeared to them by every feeling and 
sentiment of love and esteem. 

Resolved, That we cordially sympathize with the 5th regiment 
of Illinois volunteers, and the company under his command, and 
with the friends and family of the deceased, who, by this afflicting 
dispensation of Almighty God, have sustained a loss which neither 
the honors of the world, or the sympathies of friends, can deprive 
of its bitterness. 

Resolved, That the Secretary furnish a copy of the above 
' resolutions to the sth regiment Illinois volunteers, and the family 


of the deceased. 


Mr. WEST accompanied the presentation of the above with 


_ some exceedingly chaste and appropriate remarks, in relation to 


the virtue and manly patriotism of the deceased.” 
And the preamble and resolutions were unanimously adopted. 


°° Tais eulogy by West may be found in the Sangamo Journal, August 12. 
701 


702 ~~: ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


The question pending was on the adoption of the substitute — 4 
proposed by Mr. Epwarps of Sangamon for the amendment of _ 
Mr. Axtn to the twenty-third section of the report of the Legisla- _ 
tive committee. re 

Messrs. Epwarps of Sangamon, Harvey, WILLIAMs, WHITE- — 
sipE, Hurigut and Peters advocated the adoption of the sub- 
stitute, and Messrs FARWELL and Pratt opposed it. ie 

The question was taken thereon and it was adopted—yeas 90, 
nays 29. a 
Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to add to the section the following: 4 

“Nor shall any member of the General Assembly be interested, 
either directly or indirectly, in any contract with the state, or any _ 
county thereof, authorized by any law passed during the time for 
which he shall have been elected, or during one year after the 
expiration thereof.”’ ke 

Mr. AKIN offered the amendment presented, yesterday, asa 
substitute therefor. Ml 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved to lay the substitute on the table. — 

The yeas and nays were ordered thereon, and the substitute 
was laid on the table—yeas 81, nays 41. ‘a 

The question recurred on the amendment of Mr. Locxwoop, “fl 
and it was adopted. qi 

Mr. PRATT moved to add to the section: “All persons — 
elected by the people of this state to any office whatever, shall, — 
if the same be accepted, be ineligible to any other office in the 
state during the period for which they shall have been elected.” 

Mr. FARWELL advocated the adoption of the amendment, 
as carrying out the principles contained 1 in the amendment of Mr. | 
Epwarps, adopted this morning. a 

Mr. KNOWLTON moved to lay the amendmenton the table. _ 

And the section was then adopted. - 

Sec. 24. The House of Representatives shall have the sole — 
power of impeaching; but a majority of all the members elected ~ 
must concur in animpeachment. All impeachments shall be tried 
by the Senate; and when sitting for that purpose, the senators 
shall be upon oath, or affirmation, to do justice according to law 
and evidence. No person shall be convicted without the concur- 
rence of two-thirds of all the senators elected. : 


‘wy on a 


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ae 


ERY Seay aR aNts F 


SRE ED Me 0! 


io 


+ a eae ark, ee pide! att oe % ET 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 7, 1847 703 


Mr. CALDWELL moved to add to tHe section the following: 
“the General Assembly shall be forever prohibited from passing 
any private, special or general acts, renewing, extending or 
in any wise creating or authorizing the exercise of banking powers 
and privileges: ‘Provided, that the foregoing section shall be 
submitted as a separate question to the people, and if the same 
be adopted by a majority of the votes cast for and against the 
constitution, then the same shall become a part of this constitu- 
tion, and supersede all other provisions to the contrary. 

Mr. SMITH of Macon moved to lay the same on the table. 

Mr. CALDWELL demanded the yeas and nays, and they 
were ordered. 

Mr. CALDWELL moved a call of the Convention; which was 
ordered and made. 

The question was taken by yeas and nays, and decided in the 
negative—yeas 65, nays 66. 

Mr. GEDDES moved to add to the amendment, before the 
proviso: ‘‘The Legislature shall pass laws imposing adequate 
penalties on the circulation of the paper of banks located out of 
this state, and making void all contracts, the consideration 
of which is the paper of such banks, and all payments made in 
the notes of such bank.” 

Mr. SCATES thought the amendment of the gentleman from 
Hancock (Mr. GeppEs) just and correct in principle, but under 
the circumstances he would vote against it. A few days ago the 
question of prohibition was before the Convention, but their new 
leader brought in this feature, as an amendment to it. He and 
others had been caught by it, and voted for it, and then prohibi- 
tion was defeated. He hoped the friends of prohibition would 
vote down this measure, and have a full and direct vote upon the 
question of prohibition, upon its real merits. 

Mr. CALDWELL said, he, too, had voted for the amendment 
now proposed when offered a day or two ago by the gentleman 


_from Adams, but now he would vote against it. It contained 


principles that he thought just in themselves, but there were 
many friends of prohibition who could not vote for it with this 
amendment hanging upon it. He had voted for it in good faith 


704 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI 


then, but now would oppose it, as there was a sentiment in 
Convention against it. 

Mr. TURNBULL was opposed to prohibition, but oie anendal 
ment was a proper accompaniment to that principle; therefore, 
he would vote for it, and then vote against the whole. __ 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved to lay the whole subj 
on the table. 

The PRESIDENT said the motion was out of cde a 
Convention had just refused to lay the proposition on the tabl 
a motion to lay the amendment to the amendment on h 
table, would be in order. my 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin said, the friends of rohibicel n 
were desirous to present to the people the naked question of bank 
or no bank, and he hoped it would be allowed to be done. 
bank party had expressed their willingness to do this; but th 
desire now to clog the proposition with this amendment. Wh 
are all their professions in favor of submitting the question to | 
people? Did they ever feel willing to do so? If so, let them com 
forward now, and show the sincerity of their professions, and v 
for submitting this question unencumbered with other pr 
sitions. Let them present us with the naked question of ba 
or no bank. 2 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved to refer the whole subj 
to the committee on Incorporations. 

Mr. ADAMS advocated the reference of the subsiee ets 
committee, and then branching out into the merits of the an 
ment, was called to order. | 

Mr. KINNEY of St. Clair moved the previous question. 

Mr. DEMENT opposed the previous question. He wante 
test vote upon the subject. He would vote against the am 
ment. 

Mr. CHURCH pointed out that, in its present shape, t 
section providing for the trial of impeachments must be ia 
with the prohibitory clause. oe. 

The question being taken, the previous question was 1 
ordered—yeas 53, nays 65. at 

The question then recurred on referring the subject to t 

committee. 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 7, 1847 705 


Mr. WOODSON hoped the reference would be made. By 


; “referring i it we could economize time. 


___[Mr. WOODSON remarked,*! that the question was now upon 
_ the reference of this proposition to the committee on incorpora- 
tions. The gentleman from Macoupin was, perhaps, not aware 
‘that the question had been settled, that any act which might be 
passed by the legislature, should be referred to the people for 
sanction or rejection; and, such being the case, he had supposed 
that the gentleman would have been content to let it remain as it 
_was. If the question of prohibition was still pending, he would 
have no objection that it should be referred; but inasmuch as 
"so much time had been consumed upon it, and a decision had been 
| atrived at by the convention, he thought it could serve no good 
_ purpose to continue to agitate the question. If there had been 
an expression of the sense of the convention in regard to the sub- 
‘ject at all, it was unmistakably in favor of the proposition which 
ped already been adopted, to the exclusion of all others. He was 
a festrictionist, though not a prohibitionist, and as restriction— 
'j Mr. Woodson was reminded by the President that it was not 
in order to debate the merits of the proposition, pending a question 
1 of reference. 
_ Mr. WOODSON said he was speaking to the question of 
‘reference; he was remarking that restriction had been adopted, 
and in the most proper and respectful mode in which it could be 
adopted. When an act was passed by the legislature, it was to 
be submitted to the people for sanction or rejection by them; 
could there be a more respectful course than this taken by the con- 
-vention? It was more respectful towards the people than it would 
be to refer to them the question of prohibition or no prohibition; 
_and in case the people should be against prohibition, then to leave 
‘ it open to the legislature— 
___ (Mr. Woodson was again called to order.] 
» Why should this proposition be referred at this late stage of 
| the proceeding? It could answer no good purpose; it could only 
serve to consume the time of the convention, which they ought 
-y every practicable means to economize.] 


: 51 This speech by Woodson is taken from the Sangamo Journal, August 24, 


et 


question to the people can expect nothing ie dane commit e 
who have determined that the people shall have nothing to say 
the subject. If referred to them, it will never be heard of | agai 
Here, Mr. F. was called to order by the President. 
Mr. F. proceeded again for a few gee and was calle 
order for irrelevancy. Nu 
Mr. F. commenced four additional times to proceed, ae a 
a few words each time, was called to order on the same daha - 


wee i‘ 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon insisted that a member 1 wh 
called to order should take his seat. 
Mr. F. said he would sit down. ya 
_The PRESIDENT said, the gentleman had been out of c ord 
that nothing could be discussed but the question of references) a 
that only. : 
Mr. FARWELL was about to proceed, when a 
Mr. KENNER raised a point of order, that ae gentlem 
had spoken 4efore—that is, had taken his seat. 
The PRESIDENT overruled the point of order. 
Mr. FARWELL again proceeded, for about one minute, 
opposition to the reference, because the amendment was onlt 
tended to break down the question of prohibition. Crie 
“‘order”’ from all parts of the hall. m 
Mr. GREGG moved that the Convention adjourn till Mon a 
to enable the districting committee of twenty-seven to close 
labors. And the motion was agreed to. i 


L. MONDAY, AUGUST 9, 1847 


The President being absent, Mr. Z. Casry took the chair. 
Prayer by Rev. Mr Patmer of Marshall. 

_ The question pending at the adjournment on Saturday, was 
_ on the motion to refer the amendment of Mr. CALDWELL, 
_ together with the amendment thereto, to the committee on Incor- 
_ porations. 

_ Mr. ECCLES moved a call of the convention, and the same 
__ was ordered. 

After the list had been gone through with, and no quorum 
appeared, the doors were closed. 

Mr. ROMAN moved that leave of absence be given to Mr. 
_ Koiwney of St. Clair, tor eight days, and leave of absence for eight 
days was granted to Messrs. Woopson, Cuoate, Evey, JENKINS 


~ and StncLeTon were excused on account of sickness. The follow- 
ing gentlemen absent were not excused: Batiincatt, Bonn, 
_ Constas_e, Epwarps of Madison, Locan, Nortucort, PETERS 
- and the PresIpENT. 
A quorum having appeared, the convention resumed its busi- 
ness. 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon urged the reference to the com- 
_ mittee on Incorporations. 
Mr. CALDWELL opposed the reference to the committee on 
_ Incorporations; he preferred a direct vote upon the question. 
; Mr. CONSTABLE was in favor of the proposition offered by 
_ the member from Gallatin, but he thought it out of place in the 
section to which it was proposed to attach it. He suggested its 
_ reference to a select committee of its friends. Indeed, it was an 
_ established rule, that a proposition should not be referred to a 
_ committee known to be opposed to it. 

Mr. SCATES raised a point of order, whether the motion to 
refer an amendment did not carry with it the whole subject. 


797 


7088 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


The CHAIR said such was his opinion and he would so decid 
were it not the president had uniformly decided otherwise, an 
would follow his decision. y 

Mr. CALDWELL moved that the amendment and the amend- 
ment thereto, be referred to a select committee. *g 

Mr. SCATES appealed from the decision of the chair. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean raised a point of order, whether th e 
amendment was in order at the time it was offered on Saturday. 

The CHAIR decided that he knew nothing of that matter. 
It had been received by the president, and had been decided by 
him to be in order. Therefore, the present occupant of the chat r 
would decide the amendment to have been in order. “@ 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean appealed from the decision of the ch 

Mr. SCATES withdrew his appeal, and Mr. Davis did the 
same. a 

The question recurring on the motion to refer, ie 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin asked a division of the questic n 
so as to first vote on referring the amendment of Mr. GeppE 
Objected to; and the vote being taken the convention refuse 
divide the question. b 

Mr. SINGLETON opposed the motion to refer the question to ‘ 
the committee. This question had been discussed; we were all 
fully prepared to vote upon it, and he hoped it would be settled at 
once. He desired a direct vote, and did not approve of the mov 
ments to evade it. f 

The question was taken on referring the subject to the coma 
mittee on Incorporations, by yeas and nays, and decided in the 
negative—yeas 63, nays 77. ; a 

The question was then taken, by yeas and nays, on referri 
the amendments to a select committee of nine, and decided in 
affirmative—yeas 71, nays 67. , 

The section then stood as reported. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to add to it an amendment, provid 
a power to repeal all charters, &c. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon raised a point of order, “ag 
the amendment relevant to the section.’ 

The CHAIR decided its irrelevancy was a question for the 


¥ y 


MONDAY, AUGUST 9, 1847 709 


convention, good ground for the body to reject it, but not a ques- 
tion for him to decide. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean appealed. 

_ After a short debate the amendment was withdrawn. 

. Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved to reconsider the vote 
referring the subject to a select committee. 

A Mr. DEMENT advocated the reconsideration; the present 
was as good as any other time to decide the question. He hoped 
the convention would take a direct vote on the subject. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said the friends of prohibition seem desir- 
ous to force this question upon us at this moment, and he would 
vote for the reconsideration. He was in favor of the proposition 

_ and had voted for its reference as the best mode of advancing it. 
_ But as some were not disposed to be satisfied with well enough, 
_he would vote to reconsider and then vote against the whole. 
Mr. CALDWELL hoped the vote to reconsider would not 
prevail. There were many who were not satisfied with its present 
_ phraseology, and in committee this difficulty might be obviated. 
Mr. PALMER opposed the reconsideration on the same 
grounds. 
Mr. SHERMAN hoped it would be reconsidered, and the 
question met fairly now. 
The question on reconsideration was taken and decided in the 
_ affirmative—yeas 69, nays 56. 
Mr. CALDWELL withdrew his original proposition and offered 
_ the following: 
Sec. —. The general assembly shall be forever prohibited 
from passing any private, special, or general law, renewing, ex- 
_ tending or in anywise creating or authorizing the exercise of bank- 
_ ing powers or privileges within this state. Provided, that this 
clause be submitted as a separate section to the people at the 
election held for the adoption of this constitution; and if such 
_ clause as a separate section be adopted by a majority of the votes 
_ cast for and against it, then the same shall become a part of this 
constitution, and supersede all provisions in this constitution 
_ to the contrary, otherwise to be void. 
_ Mr. CALDWELL moved the previous question. 


ia. 


710 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI ons. 


Messrs. WILLIAMS and DEMENT opposed the odie 
question. 

Mr. CALDWELL advocated it. 

Mr. McCALLEN opposed it. 

And the convention refused to order the main question— 
65, nays 74. 

Mr. GEDDES renewed his amendment. me 

Mr. ADAMS moved the previous question; which was adele dis 
when, g 

Mr. CALDWELL withdrew his amendment. 

The question was then taken on the adoption of id mak sec . 
tion, and it was adopted. 

Mr. WILLIAMS offered an amendment, containing the 
stance of Mr. Catpwe .t’s and Mr. GeppeEs’ pst ah hig e 
bodied in one. 

Mr. HAYES offered the following as a substitute ckeboe : 

“The question of banking shall be submitted to the people 
when they shall vote on the adoption of this constitution, and if a 
majority of those voting on the question shall vote for bank 
then the general assembly may pass banking laws under 
restrictions contained in this constitution, but if the majo 
voting on the question, shall not vote for banking, then no per: 
corporation or association of persons shall be allowed to manu. 
facture or emit any paper intended to circulate as paper money.” 

And the vote being taken thereon, by yeas any nays, it was 
rejected—yeas 60, nays 8o. 

A motion was made to adjourn, and it was ecjoctealee 

Mr. CALDWELL moved as a substitute for the amendm 
of Mr. WIiL.1aMs, his own proposition (before withdrawn) and 
amendment thereto, offered by Mr.Geppgs, with a proviso. 
the latter, that 7# should be submitted as a section separate 
from the constitution, and from his prohibitory section. . 

Mr. SHIELDS moved the Convention adjourn Ne 3 P. 
Lost. 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved the previous quceaees which 
ordered. 

And the question recurring on the substitute it was reieee 
yeas 56, nays 85. ; ; 


. 


MONDAY, AUGUST 9, 7847 7II 


_ The question recurring on the amendment of Mr. Wit.iaMs, 
_ Mr. CALDWELL called for a division of the question, so as 
' to vote first on the prohibitory part. And the Convention 
_ refused to divide the question. 

The amendment was then rejected—yeas 68, nays 72. 
And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned. 


_ [Mr. CALDWELL alluded® to the various objections which 
had been urged against this amendment, and against the pro- 
_ priety of referring it to the committee; first, that it occupied the 
_ wrong place; next, that it had no application to the subject which 
it proposed to amend, and that it ought therefore to be discon- 
“nected with it. Now, said Mr. Caldwell, what is the subject 
“under investigation at this time as embodied in this report? Why, 
‘it is but one single subject, and that is the subject of legislative 
_ power; that is the subject embraced in this section. It is a limit- 
_ ation on legislative power, in a particular mode; conferring power 
upon the legislature under certain limitations. I am not so 
_ familiar with the forms of legislation as the gentleman from San- 
_ gamon, but I am satisfied that it is in the right place; however, as 
_ to the place it shall occupy, I am not at all tenacious. Now, 
_ suppose the section should be adopted, why it will all be referred 
_ to the committee on revision, and they can detach it if they please 
from the body of this article and give it the form of a distinct 
"article. The very object of the constitution of that committee 
‘is for the purpose of revising and arranging the sections. The 
_ proposition is of itself separate and distinct. But the gentleman 
d ‘Says, it is not in order to submit an additional section. I do not 
_ know how that is, but I think it is proper to submit a distinct 
_ proposition; so far as that objection is concerned, it amounts to 
_ nothing at all. The committee on revision can set it right; and 
in addition to that, we hold a similar proposition before the com- 
mittee on the legislative department; they did not think proper 
_ to act on it, and if it be now referred to the committee, I shall 

consider it a defeat of the proposition. This, I take it, will be the 
effect of reference. It is well known what the sentiments of that 
committee are. It will never be reported back. 


This fuller account of the remarks by Caldwell, Constable, Pratt, 
a Singleton, and others is taken fromthe Sangamo Journal, August 24. 


712 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


Mr. CONSTABLE said, although perfectly silting to vote folk 
a proposition of this kind separately and distinctly, and although 
in so voting, he should vote the sentiments which he sincerely 
entertained; yet, he could not consent to place this subject 
connection with the subject contained in the legislative report as” 
it now stood. It was a subject which would have to be explained; 
it was a subject which would not be understood by the casual 
observer. Had the gentleman from Gallatin presented, in a sep- 
arate report, the reasons for the introduction of this section, or 
had he introduced it as a distinct section of this report, there might 
have been some propriety in thus submitting it; and in the re- 
marks which he had made concerning the propriety of providing, 
for the impeachment of derelict officers, but he could not exacth 
see the propriety of introducing it in this place. But in voting 
for the reference, he did not do so for the purpose of defeating the 
proposition, although the gentleman might suppose that that was 
the design of those who voted for its reference. The gentleman 
might select some other committee if he pleased. He was in favor 
of the reference for the purpose of having the subject presented it 
a proper shape and in a proper place, in order that the sense of 
the convention might be taken upon it, in such a manner as not 
to involve it in any doubt. He thought that it was proper to- 
refer the proposition, unless the gentleman would consent to with-— 
draw it, and submit it at some other time. He would add, that 
he did not think that the committee on Incorporations was the 
committee to which it should be sent, as that committee had 
already considered the subject, and reported unfavorably upon its 
and he believed it was a parliamentary rule, that a measure wa 
entitled to a reference to its friends. 

Mr. SINGLETON said, he should vote against refer 1g 
the proposition to the committee, not because he was in favor of th 
proposition, but because he was anxious to dispose of it. If 1 t 
were referred to the committee, it would be their duty to make a 
report. He was opposed to this method of evading the question. 
He desired to see it fairly met and disposed of. 

The question was taken on referring the subject to the cor 
mittee on Incorporations, by yeas and nays, and decided in the 
negative—yeas 63, nays 77. 


MONDAY, AUGUST 9, 7847 733 


The question was then taken, by yeas and nays, on referring 


_ amendments to a select committee of — and decided in the 


affrmative—yeas 71, nays 67. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, that as a friend of the proposition 
which had been adopted, he would vote for the reconsideration; 
and then, against every proposition to amend it. Mr. CALDWELL 
was opposed to the reconsideration of this vote. The proposition 
had been offered by him in a spirit of compromise, with a view of 
placing it in such form and place as would render it free from 
objection. 

Mr. SHERMAN was in favor of reconsideration. He was 
anxious to have a direct vote upon the proposition, so that the 
question might be definitely settled. 

The question being taken on motion to reconsider the vote, it - 
was, upon a division, decided in the affirmative. 

Mr. GEDDES moved to amend the amendment by inserting 
the following immediately after the proviso: 

“The legislature shall pass laws imposing adequate penalties 
on the circulation of paper of banks, located out of the State; and 
making void all contracts, the consideration of which is the paper 
of such banks, and all payments made in the notes of such banks.’’ 

Mr. CONSTABLE observed that from the situation in which 
the matter now stood, the Convention would perceive that the 
submission was not a submission of the simple question of banking, 
but also of the mode of impeachment. The people would not have 
an opportunity of voting upon the question of banking as a distinct 
question; they would have to vote also on the question as to the 
manner in which impeachments shall be conducted. If one of 
these questions should be rejected, the other must be rejected also. 

Mr. PRATT asked for the reading of the amendments, to- 
gether with the original proposition. [They were read.] He 
would prefer having these propositions, he said, separate and dis- 
tinct; it seemed, however, not to have been their fortune to have 
them so presented. The gentleman from Wabash, though in 
favor of the proposition of the gentleman from Gallatin, yet he 
would not sustain the proposition in the connection in which it 
stood. The proposition contemplated submitting the clause and 
not the section. 


The proposition, at the suggestion of Mr. ConsTABLE, Nv 
again read; and it was modified by the mover. 7 

It seems to me, said Mr. Pratt, that by the proposition as now — 
modified, the objections of the gentleman from Wabash will b 
obviated. I do not propose to detain the convention with am 
discussion in relation to the subject of banking. I only desire to — 
say this;—when the resolution was offered by me in the early Dy 
stage of the proceedings contemplating prohibition, a great many my 
gentlemen who professed to be against banks, were unwilling toll 
have prohibition placed in the constitution for the reason as they - 
then assigned that it would endanger the constitution itself 
though they were entirely willing to support a proposition to be 
submitted as a separate section and thus permit the popular voice 
to be expressed upon the subject, and believing as they did, that ~ 
we were not sufficiently instructed on the subject previous tov 
coming here. I thought, sir, there was plausibility in this, but i a 
seems the gentlemen were not sincere in making the proposition; H 
it seems that there was some hidden reason for taking this course. _ 
The question is now presented in such a shape. Gentlemen sti 
dodge the question. I here undertake to say that I believe, an 
I have no doubt the friends of prohibition will concur in that be 4 
lief, that a large share of those who voted with us were unwilling — 
to appeal to the popular judgment; they were fearful that if the — 
question were to go before the people, they might speak in tones of — 
rebuke, condemning their action. If I am not mistaken in this. ” 
gentlemen will come out, and show by their votes that their pro- 4 


fessions at that time were sincere. As to the motion of the gentle- 


State a constitutional currency—a currency which will conform — 
to the currency of the world, gold and silver. I would like to see 
the proposition of the gentleman from Hancock left to legislative 
action hereafter; yet I shall go for the amendment for the purpos 

of testing the votes of those who throw in the proposition for the 
purpose of embarrassing the action of the Convention, and let them 
show what they will do with the bantling, as they have shaped its 


MONDAY, AUGUST 9, 1847 715 


and I will undertake to say that they will vote for the proposition 
as amended. 

One thing more, sir. It looked rather strange this morning 
when we had come to the conclusion that itshould go to a commit- 


_ tee of nine, who should be required to determine the naked ques- 


i r 


=e 


aS 


tions thus presented; and when gentlemen succeeded in the motion 
for reconsideration, professing by their votes that they wished 
the previous question to be put to the convention, that they 
should then wheel right about in five minutes, and vote against 
the previous question. Does not this look like insincerity? Does 
it not look as if they are unwilling to vote on the question nakedly 
and separately? When the question of prohibition was before 
us, they voted against prohibition. They were then willing to 
make it an alternative proposition,—to submit the alternative 
proposition of restricted banking or prohibition to the people and 
let them decide between the two. From this position they seem 
to have retreated. They seem now to be unwilling to leave the 
matter to be decided by the popular voice. They seem to have 
gathered strength, and to have determined that the people shall 
have nothing to do with it whatever. 

I believe it will be conceded on all hands, that the bane of hig 
country has been in an agitated condition of its pecuniary affairs, 
an unsettled state of the currency: Within the last five years, 
however, since this matter has been somewhat quieted, we have 
begun to prosper—prosperity has begun to exhibit itself—and yet 
gentlemen by their actions seem willing to protract their agitation 
of this question. They are unwilling to adopt a permanent and 
settled system, and they are unwilling to trust the people on this 
question of currency—and they are indisposed, as they say, to tie 
up the hands of the legislature, because a banking system in 
some form may become indispensable. Is there any thing con- 
sistent in this? There is not the same hesitancy to trust the people 
on other important subjects. 

Mr. SINGLETON said he felt somewhat awkwardly situated 
in regard to this question. He was not exactly in favor of either 
proposition. He was opposed to the one that had been adopted 
by the convention, and he would briefly state the reasons why he 
disliked it, and why he had voted against it. . 


We are sent here, continued Mr. S., to form a new organic law, 
and we very gravely proceed to ae three distinct departments 
priate duties, Sa to confer upon each the powers necossacin 
belonging to it. We have created a legislative department—the q 
law-making power. Here is a proposition for banking proceeding 4 
from the law making power to the people. I think, sir, it is a 
novel mode of adopting laws; I think it is a departure from the 4 
true principles of good government to submit questions of this — 
kind, or any other, from the law-making power to the people. — 
The people have determined to confide the law-making power to 
the appropriate department of the government, and when that — 
department undertakes to exercise the power, they ought to exer-_ 4 
cise it independently and definitely. This is my opinion, and it — 
is based upon principle, and not because I do not think the people — ée 
capable of deciding all questions. WW 

I am in favor of banks. I voted against the proposition which | 
was adopted by this convention, and I am now in favor of the ~ 
amendment which is pending. I am in favor of it, because, ifa 
proposition like that on the table, is to go to the people, 1 want — 
it as perfect as possible,—not as the gentleman from Jo Daviess — 
has said, that it shall be a naked question. What does he mean? ~ 
Does he mean to divest the question of its alternative form, and — 
thus make it naked? Does he mean that it shall be directed ex- 
clusively to one single point —the question of carrying on banking 
in this State, without embracing the question of the circulation 
of bank paper? It is admitted that the evils of which we have to ~ 
complain of, arise from the circulation of bank paper. If then ~ 
the gentleman desires to divest the question of its evils, it is not 
the question of banking alone which he should desire to submit; 
but he says that he wants a constitutional currency. Have we 
not bank paper in the State now? Suppose we prohibit the 
creation of banks, does the gentleman accomplish his object? I 
want to see the question fairly presented, that all the evils may be 
obviated. Let us make a fair test of the principles of those who 
are opposed to banking. If they say that the circulation of bank - 
paper in the State is an evil, then I submit, though I do not agree” 
with them that it is. 


MONDAY, AUGUST 9, 7847 717 


I shall vote for this amendment; but I am not prepared to say 
that I shall vote for the proposition if amended, because the 
question would not then go before the people in the shape in which 
it would be most conformable to my notions. I hope that all 
those who are opposed to banks, will also oppose the circulation 
of bank paper. I hope that the friends of prohibition will make 
this issue, and if we can get that out of the way, then I will go for 
this proposition when offered; I am unwilling that the two should 
be adopted, but I am willing to go for this if the other can be got 
out of the way; and I am willing to do this for the purpose of 
making a fair issue before the people. Now, I ask the gentleman 
from Jo Daviess, who seemed unwilling to let the convention 
know exactly what his opinion was—I ask him if it is right to 
submit to the people the question of the creation of banks alone, 
without touching the question of the circulation of bank paper? 
It must be admitted that there are some good effects attending 
banking, and if there are evils also, we have to suffer the evils 
without enjoying the benefit. If we prohibit banking in this 
State, without doing more than this, does it not seem to favor the 
proposition that we will use the paper of banks of other States, 
and exclude our own citizens from the advantages to be derived 
from banking? It appears to me so. 

I am willing, sir, to go for anything that will present the 
question to the people in the proper shape, and when it is adopted, 
and we get rid of the provision already adopted, then I am pre- 
pared to vote for the amendment as amended. I do not see the 
objection to it that the gentleman from Knox does. If adopted it 
will stand as a separate section, and be submitted to the people 
as a separate and distinct section, and it appears to me that there 
is nothing improper in so submitting it. The whole constitution 
is to be referred to the people, and we only propose that this shall 
be referred as a separate section and there is a great difference in 
my judgment between referring the question as just proposed, and 
referring a law from the law-making power, to the people. The 
principle, it appears to me, is essentially wrong, and it is this which 
makes me opposed to the provision which has been adopted. 

Mr. WILLIAMS hoped the amendment would be adopted. 
He concurred with the gentleman from Jo Daviess, in the most 


had intimated, in his opinion veny gratuitously, against he ‘ 
cerity of members of the convention. He was not one of those 
persons, however, who were embraced in the insinuation whic hl 
the gentleman had thrown out, for he had voted with the pro- 
hibitionists in almost every particular. He thought the 1 insinus y 
tions of the gentleman entirely uncalled for. 
The gentleman from Jefferson had said on a former occasion, % 
that he had been cheated once and did not intend to be again. 
He could only say that the gentleman could not have been cheated 
as to the purpose for which the amendment was intended, for it 
had been frankly stated at every stage of its progress. 
If there must be a paper circulation in this State, for it wi i 
that and that alone which was complained of as being objection — 
able, there ought to be a decided preference given to our own 
paper. Now gentlemen who were in favor of prohibition, were in 
favor of it for other reasons than those which influenced him. He 
did not believe that the evils connected with the circulation of 
paper money were greater, or as great, as the benefits to be derive 1 
from it. He did not think that a paper circulation would be 
dispensed with; he wished to have the proposition adopted, how- 
ever, in order that they might have an actual experiment, a nd 
ascertain by experience whether the entire suppression of th 
circulation of bank paper would be wise or unwise. He beliey: 
that a hard money currency, if the principle should be fully carried 
out, would result in the destruction of the commercial interests « 
the State. He hoped that those who agreed with him in rega 
to the propriety of having banks, would permit the question 
be submitted to the people and decided by them. 
Mr. SCATES explained the position he occupied in regard to 
this amendment. a) 
Mr. SERVANT asked the indulgence of the convention for 
less than three minutes of their time, he said, to enable him | 
define his position. It is well known to you, sir, (continued M 
S.), and to every gentleman i in the convent that I was Pepe 


neither of the extremes should be adopted a the prohibit 
should not be adopted, and wishing that the matter should I 


MONDAY, AUGUST 9, 1847 719 


a8 brought to a close, I voted in good faith for the proposition of the 
gentleman from Wabash, and against the amendment. I voted 
_ against it then, and shall now, and shall vote against every prop- 
 osition that is in the least degree calculated to disturb the com- 
‘promise that was agreed upon some days ago. Though I was 
originally opposed to a compromise, yet believing that the session 
might be almost indefinitely protracted, without coming to any 
conclusion on the subject, without a compromise, and believing 
- that a compromise was intended in good faith, I voted for it, and 
shall vote against every proposition that is calculated to disturb 
that compromise. | 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. MARKLEY moved a call of the Convention, which was 
made, a quorum appearing, 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to reconsider the vote whereby Mr. 
WiLL1aMs’ amendment was rejected. 

And the question being taken by yeas and nays, the Conven- 
tion refused to reconsider—yeas 55, nays 71. 

So the bank question was settled for the present, and stands 
as it did on Friday morning last. 

Sections 25, 26 and 27 were read and adopted, as follows: 

Sec. 25. The Governor and all other civil officers under this 
state shall be liable to impeachment for any misdemeanor in 
office; but judgment in such cases shall not extend further than- 
to removal from office, and disqualification to hold any office of 
honor, profit, or trust, under this state. The party, whether 
convicted or acquitted, shall nevertheless be liable to indictment, 
trial, judgment, and punishment according to law. 

Sec. 26. No judge of any court of law or equity, Secretary 
of State, Attorney General, Attorney for the State, recorder, 
clerk of any court of record, sheriff or collector, member of either 
house of Congress, or person holding any lucrative office under 
the United States or this state,—provided that appointments in 
the militia, justices of the peace, shall not be considered lucrative 
offices,—shall have a seat in the General Assembly; nor shall any 
person, holding any office of honor or profit under the government 


720 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


of the United States, hold any office under the authority of this 1 
state. ; 
Sec. 27. Every person who shall be chosen or appointee t 


thereof, take an oath to bhi the constitution OF ie Ueied d 
States and of this state, and also an oath of office. . 
Section 28 was read, as follows: 
Sec. 28. The General Assembly shall have fall power to. : 
exclude from the privilege of electing or being elected any person — 
convicted of bribery, perjury, or any other infamous crime. W 
Mr. SCATES offered a long series of amendments to be added — 
to the section, defining the powers of the Legislature and enumer- 4 y 
ating the same. 

To which were offered various amendments by Messrs.GEDDEs, ~ 
McCatten, Hay, Kenner, Harvey and ARMSTRONG. iq 

Mr. MOFFETT moved the previous question; pital was — 
ordered, and the amendments were rejected—yeas 31, nays 103 

And then, the section was adopted. 

Section 29 was read and adopted. 

SEc. 29. The General Assembly shall have no power to grant 
divorces, but may authorize the courts of justice to grant them fo! 
such causes as may be specified by law: Provided, That such law: 
be general and uniform in their operation throughout the state. 

Section 30 was then taken up. q 

Sec. 30. The Legislature shall never grant or authorize 
extra compensation to any public officer, agent, servant o 
contractor, after the service shall have been rendered or the con Ke 
tract entered into. 

Mr. CRAIN moved to add thereto, “But may at any tim 
repeal, alter or amend, when in their opinion the public good 
requires it, any charter, or general law, granting exclusive privi- 
leges to any incorporation, individual or individuals whatever.” 

And the same by yeas and nays was rejected—yeas 48, nays Sa i, 5 

And the section was adopted. 

Section 31, after an amendment, was adopted, as follows: i 

Sec. 31. The General Assembly shall direct by law in what 
manner suits may be brought against the state. - ; 

Section'32 was taken up. 


tht. oe te ae! be ee kee St, ee Pe i, 


MONDAY, AUGUST 9, 1847 721 


orize Eaicetics for any Purpose, and shall pass lave to prohibit 
e sale of lottery tickets in this state. 

Mr. DEMENT moved to insert after “purpose” in first line 
‘nor to revive or extend the charter of the State bank or the 


j _ And the same was adopted. 

The section was then adopted. 

Section 33 was read and adopted. 

_ Sec. 33. The General Assembly shall have no power to 
authorize, by private or special law, the sale of any lands or other 
real estate belonging in whole or in part to any individual or in- 


The 34th section was taken up, but before any vote thereon, 
Mr.— moved the Convention adjourn. 
Mr. CONSTABLE, by leave, introduced a resolution grant- 


LI. TUESDAY, AUGUST 10, 1847 


Prayer by the Rev. Mr. Patmer of Macoupin [Marshall?]. 
Mr. ROBBINS presented a petition from sundry citizens 
Randolph county, praying a constitutional provision, for 
exemption of a freehold from execution. 
He moved its reference to a select committee—to be com- 
posed of the committees on Law Reform and Miscellaneous Sub- 
jects, with the following instructions: 
“‘That they report an article providing that, from and afte Y 
the first day of January in the year, 1849, a homestead to each 
and every family in this state of a farm, not exceeding eighty ac: 
of land, and not exceeding in value eight hundred dollars, o 
town or city lot with its appurtenances not exceeding in va 
eight hundred dollars, shall be exempt from execution, and from 
all liability whatever for all debts thereafter contracted.” a 
Mr. CRAIN said that the committee on Miscellaneous Sul ; 
jects had unanimously agreed upon a report upon as subjec 
and would report to-day or to-morrow. ; 
Mr. GREGG suggested that as the report would be cam 
to the views of the member from Randolph, he had better with 
hold his motion till it was made. F. 
Mr. BOND expressed himself in favor of the instructions, bu 
would, at the suggestion of gentlemen around him, defer his 
marks till another time, when the subject would be more pron 
before them. 
Mr. ROBBINS, under the circumstances, agreed that the wal 
ject should be ree on the table till the report of the commi 
was made. 
Mr. BOND asked a suspension of the rules to ene him 
offer the following resolution: . 
Resolved, That the select committee of twenty-seven appoint 
to district the state into senatorial and representative distri 
be, and they are hereby instructed, that in their efforts to dist: 
the state into senatorial and representative districts, they shi 
722 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 10, 1847 723 


first fix upon a starting point either on the north or southextreme of 
he state, and whensuch point isagreed upon by said committee, they 
shall proceed to form districts, forming the same out of contigu- 
_ ous territory and keeping in view the principles of apportionment 
agreed upon by this convention, until they shall have districted 
"the whole state, without reference to judicial circuits or congres- 
" sional districts, as now constituted in this state. 

Mr. GREGG opposed the resolution. The committee had 

been engaged for some time in their labors and would be ready to 
report in a day or two. Moreover they had acted on the very 

principle contained in the resolution of the gentleman from Clin- 
ton. 

Mr. BOND was desirous to have the resolution passed. He 
looked in upon the operations of the districting committee last 
night, and he thought there was a principle followed, which he 
_ thought very disadvantageous to the section of the state in which 
his county was situated. He thought that unless this resolution 

was adopted it was probable that the interest of the smaller 
counties would be disregarded. 

Mr. CHURCHILL said, if the resolution was received, he 

would offer the following as a substitute therefor: 

Resolved, That this convention will not alter the number of 
senators and representatives as arranged at the last session of the 
general assembly for the next election of members of general 

assembly, and the districts shall remain as then fixed for the next 
general assembly. 
_ Mr. PETERS was in favor of the resolution. 
Mr. ARMSTRONG said the committee was going on rapidly 
_ with the districting of the state, and he hoped the rules would not 
be suspended. He could see no propriety in finding fault with 
the action of the committee, before it made its report or had con- 
cluded its labors; he could not see the utility in gentlemen throw- 
ing barriers in the way of the action of the committee. He hoped 
_ the rules would not be suspended. 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac was opposed to the suspension of the 
rules. He hoped the committee would be let alone in its opera- 
tions and not embarrassed in its labors. The committee had 
commenced according to rules contained in the resolution of the 


724 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


gentleman from Clinton. They districted the state into. sena 
districts under that rule; and they had undertaken the repr: 
ative districts twice ma had failed. They first commenced _ 
the north and went through the state till they reached the sot 
and found they had seventy-six districts. They then comme 
at the extreme south and went over the state till they reached t 
north, and they came out with seventy-eight districts. Fin 
how difficult it was to arrive at the number of seventy-five, - 
had referred to the committee-men of each circuit the distric: 
of their own circuits, and if the committee were left to perform 
their work, the districting would be done, and as satisfactorily as 
possible. 

Mr. BOND replied and urged the neceeey of his resolut 
in justice to the small counties. 

The question was taken on the suspension of the rules and 
convention refused to suspend—yeas 55, nays 56. i: 

Mr. HAYES moved to suspend the rules to enable him to offer 
the following resolution: 

WHEREAS, it is almost time that the labors of this conventt 
were brought to a close, and any plan of apportionment w 
may be adopted will occasion much delay and embarrass mel 
and may endanger the adoption of the new constitution, by c 
necting it with local questions and issues; therefore, aN 

Resolved, That this convention will not attempt to district t 
state for members of the general assembly—and that the sele 
committee of twenty-seven be discharged from any further ac 
on that subject. 

Mr. HARVEY agreed with the views ig in the res 
tion, and hoped it would be received. 

Mr. CALDWELL opposed the resolution. — EP would, if 
ceived, lead to discussion, which would consume as much > 
as the report of the Districting committee. Unless we distr 
this state the next Legislature will contain the large number 
representatives which we have heretofore had, and he thot 
that the Convention was spending money enough now, witl 
having that large body meet again. He was of opinion that 
Convention intended to have the constitution carried into ¢€ 
without the aid of the Legislature. 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 10, 1847 725 


f f "Messrs. Greco and ARMSTRONG expressed similar views. 

The question was taken on the suspension of the rules, and the 
Co onvention refused to suspend. 

_ The Convention then resumed the consideration of the article 
i | relation to the Legislative Department. 

ce Sec. 34. The General Cen shall have no power to sus- 


allowed under the general laws of the land, nor to pass any law for 
the benefit of individuals inconsistent with the general laws of the 
_ land; nor to pass any law granting to any individual or individuals 
“tights, privileges, immunities, or exemptions, other than such as 
may be, by the same law, extended to any member of the com- 
‘munity who may be able to bring himself within the provisions 
of such law; nor shall the Legislature pass any law whereby any 
person shall be deprived of his life, liberty, property, or franchises, 
without trial and judgment, in some usual and regular judicial 
tribunal: Provided, nothing herein contained shall prevent the 
_ passage of any law for seizing and holding persons or property by 
“mesne process, or otherwise, until such trial can be had, or for 
collecting taxes by distress and sale of personal property without 
judgment. 
_ Amendments thereto were offered by Messrs. WiLL1AMs and 
Scates, and adopted. 

And the question being taken by yeas and nays on the adop- 
tion of the section as amended, it was decided in the negative— 
yeas 56, nays 80. 

Sec. 35. In the year one thousand eight hundred and fifty- 
_ five, and every tenth year thereafter, an enumeration of all the 
_ white inhabitants of this state shall be made in such manner as 
shall be directed by law; and in the year eighteen hundred and 
fifty, and every tenth year thereafter, the census taken by au- 
thority of the government of the United States shall be adopted 
by the General Assembly as the enumeration of this state; and 
the number of senators and representatives shall, at the first 
regular session holden after the returns herein provided for are 
made, be apportioned among the several counties or districts to 


726 


be established by law, according to the number of white 
itants. 
Mr. THOMAS moved to strike out ‘‘regular,” and 
““biennial;”’ and it was rejected. , 
Messrs. Locxwoop and Prrers offered amendments to 
section and they were rejected. 
And the section was adopted. : 
Sec. 36. Senatorial and representative districts shall bee col 
posed of contiguous territory bounded by county lines; and 
one senator allowed to each senatorial, and not more than tl 
representatives to any representative district: provided th 
cities and towns containing the requisite population shall be « 
vided i into separate districts; but the ratioof repre ae 


allowed to each of such districts. ee 
Mr. KNOWLTON moved to amend the section so as t 
as follows: 
‘‘Senatorial and representative districts shall be composed 
contiguous territory, bounded by county lines; and only on 
ator allowed to each senatorial, and not more than three 
sentatives to any representative district: Provided, that c 
and towns containing the requisite population may, ie law, 
erected into separate districts.” 
Upon this motion, a debate ensued 1 in which Messrs. | 


and Pratt ad vandted the amendment, and Messrs. Titoue a 
Kwapp of Jersey opposed it. 
Mr. KNAPP moved the previous question, and 
Mr. KNOWLTON’S amendment was adopted. 
And the section, as amended, was adopted. a ; 
Mr. McCALLEN moved to reconsider the vote just te 


small counties. 
Mr. SINGLETON advocated the reconside eines of the 
He did so because he thought the section unjust. 


the rovdsiderarions! 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 10, 1847 q27 


And the motion to reconsider was rejected. 
Sec. 37. In forming senatorial and representative districts, 


counties containing a population of not more than one-fourth over 


F 


37 


the existing ratio shall form separate districts, and the excess 
shall not be computed, but shall be added together, and given to 
the nearest county or counties not having a senator or represent- 
ative, as the case may be, which has the largest white population. 
Mr. SMITH of Macon moved to strike out the words ‘‘“sena- 
torial and,’ and insert “‘senator or.’’ 
Pending which, the Convention adjourned till 3 Pp. m. 


AFTERNOON 


The question pending was on the motion of Mr. Smith to 
amend. 

Messrs. CALDWELL, Hayes, McCatien and Harvey opposed 
the adoption of the section, and Messrs. Bonp and Harp1nc sup- 
ported it. 

When this section was before the committee of the whole it 
was fully discussed, and the debate thereon was fully reported; 
the debate to-day turned upon the same points then argued. 

The question was taken on the amendment, and it was re- 
jected. 

Mr. THOMAS moved to amend the section, by striking out 
the words ‘‘not be computed, but shall be added together, and,” 
and the same was adopted. 

Mr. WHITESIDE moved to amend the section by adding 
thereto: “‘ Provided, that each senatorial district shall have not 
less than three representatives, which district may be sub-divided 
for representative districts.” 

And the same was rejected. 

Mr. DEITZ moved to amend the section by striking out 
the words “‘which has the largest white population,” and insert 


in lieu thereof, “‘including such excess would be entitled to a 


yn Se ee 


member.’ Rejected. 

The section was adopted as follows—yeas 85, nays 52. 

Sec. 37. In forming senatorial and representative districts, 
counties containing a population of not more than one-fourth over 
the existing ratio shall form separate districts, and the excess 


ator or representative, as the case may be, van ra the lar 
white population. 

Section thirty-eight was read. 7 

Mr. Epwarps of Sangamon and Mr. Harvey offered amend- 
ments thereto; which were adopted, and the section read thus: — 

Sec. 38. Each General Assembly shall provide for all 
appropriations necessary for the ordinary contingent expense: 
the government, until the adjournment of the next regular sessi 
the aggregate amount of which shall not be increased withou 
vote of two-thirds of each house, nor exceed the amount of reve: 
authorized by law to be raised in such time: Provided, the state 
may, to meet casual deficits or failures in revenues, contract 
debts, never to exceed in the aggregate fifty thousand dollars; 
and the moneys thus borrowed shall be applied to the purpose 
which they were obtained, or to repay the debt thus made, a 
tono other purpose; and no debt for any other purpose, excep 
repel invasion, suppress insurrection, or defend the state in we 
for payment of which the faith of the state shall be pledged, s 


shall be made, at the time, for the payment of the interest an 
ally, as it shall accrue, by a tax to be levied for the purpose. 


ment of such interest by such law shall be irrepealable until s 
debts be paid: Provided, further, that the law levying the tz 
shall be submitted to the people with the law sail the ca 
tracting of the debt. 

Mr. WITT moved to strike out the words ‘ which he ro: 
viding for the payment of such interests, by such tax, shall be irr 
pealable, until such debt shall be paid;’’ and the same, A yeas 
nays, was rejected—yeas 25, nays 106. Ut 

Mr. SMITH of Macon moved to add to the section: “* p 
vided that no act of the Legislature shall be referred to the Gov- 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 10, 1847 729 


_ ernor for his approval which, under the provisions of this section, 
" is to be submitted to the people;” which was rejected. 
The thirty-eighth section was then adopted, as above. 
) Sec. 39. The credit of the state shall not, in any manner, be 
_ given to or in aid of any individual association, or corporation. 
Mr. MARKLEY moved to add thereto, the following: 
_ “‘Nor shall the Legislature have power, in any manner, directly 
or indirectly, to pass any law or‘ laws conferring a monopoly or 
_ monopolies on any person or persons within this state.’’ 
Mr. CALDWELL moved to substitute therefor, the following: 
, “The General Assembly shall be forever prohibited from pass- 
_ing any private, special or general law renewing, extending, or in 
_ any wise creating or authorizing the exercise of banking powers 
_ or privileges within this state: Provided, that the foregoing clause 
_ be submitted, as a separate section, to the people at the election, 
held for the adoption of this constitution, and so on for every ten 
_ years thereafter, and when the same shall be adopted by a majority 
_ of the votes cast for and against it, then such clause, as a separate 
: section, shall become a part of this constitution and supersede all - 


_ other provisions herein to the contrary, subject to be submitted 
and voted on, as above prescribed.’’ 
. Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon raised a point of order. Could 
_ this proposition be again offered to the Convention, it having 
_ been voted down yesterday? 

The PRESIDENT said, the proposition as it now Eo ne has 
never been offered, and was in order. 
Mr. CROSS of Winnebago moved to lay the amendment and 
_ the substitute on the table. 
me Mr. CALDWELL demanded the yeas and nays, and they 
_ were ordered. The subject was laid on table—yeas 81, nays 53. 
_ Mr. WHITESIDE moved to amend the section. 
Pending which the Convention adjourned. 


LI]. WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 11, 1847 


Mr. CRAIN from the committee on Miscellaneous Subject ts 
and Questions, to which had been referred petitions praying 
constitutional provision exempting from sale by judgment a1 
execution the homestead of each family, made a report on t 
subject; which was read, laid on the table and ordered to be 
printed. a 

Mr. HAYES from the committee on Law Reform, reported 
the convention an article on the subject; which was read, laid ot 
the table and two hundred and fifty copies ordered to be printe 

Mr. CALDWELL moved to suspend the rules to enable cer. 
tain reasons, in writing, in the shape of argument in support o 
the report just made, to be presented and printed. He thoug 
this would be found to be the most economical mode of presenti: 
the question. In case this was denied the friends of law refor 
would be obliged to support it in speeches here, which would | 
found more expensive than the printing would be. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon objected. It would beg 
lation of the rules, and one which he would not consent to in any 
case. 


the aNoteaee of the subject of Law Reform should a cufficie 
cause for a suspension of the rules. 

The question was taken and the convention refused t to suspe 
the rules. 

Mr. MOFFETT moved the rules be suspended to ‘ehable 
to introduce a resolution that the afternoon sessions of the co 
vention shall commence at 2 p. m., and the convention i a 
to suspend. i, 

The convention resumed the consideration of the subject 
before it yesterday. fg 

The question pending was the amendment of Mr. WarrestpE_ 
to the 39th section. : 

Mr. WHITESIDE modified his amendment to read as follow: 


73° 


~ 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 11, 1847 731 


““And each county in the state, which has not a representative 
by apportionment, shall be entitled to one in the most numerous 
branch of the legislature: Provided, that such county will elect 
and pay such representative: And provided, further, that if any 
county shall elect a representative according to the foregoing pro- 
vision, then such county shall not be entitled to vote for a repre- 
sentative, with any other county, under the apportionment made 
by law, at the same election.’’ 

The question was taken on the amendment, by yeas and nays, 
and was rejected—yeas 22, nays IIS. 

Sec. 40. The legislature shall provide by law that the fuel 
and stationery furnished for the use of the state; the copying, 
printing, binding and distributing the laws and journals, and all 
other printing ordered by the general assembly shall be let, by 
contract, to the lowest responsible bidder, and that no member of 
the general assembly, or other officer of the state, shall be inter- 
ested either directly or indirectly in any such contract: Pro- 
vided, that the general assembly may fix a maximum price. 

Mr. BROCKMAN moved to strike out all in relation to print- 
ing, and insert: 

“There shall be elected by the qualified voters of this state, a 
public printer, who shall hold his office for the term of two years, 
and whose compensation shall be fees to be fixed by law.”’ 

Mr. B. said he was in favor of having all the officers elective, 
and chosen from the citizens of Illinois. The office of a 
public printer was an important one, he is the publisher of our 
laws, and should be a citizen and resident of thestate, where he could 
be held responsible by the people for a breach of his duty. If 
the printing were to be given out to the lowest bidder, any person— 
whether a citizen of Indiana, or St. Louis, may become the printer 
of the state, and would lead not only to much inconvenience, but 
that officer might be where he would be beyond any responsibility 
to the people. His fees could be fixed by law, as were those of a 
sheriff, and the people then could understand the whole subject, 
and know what the officer received. He opposed the system of 
letting the printing out by contract, because it always led to col- 


_ lusion and combination on the part of the bidders. Such was 


the result in all such cases. He considered the duties to be per- 


732 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


formed by the printer required that he should be a state offi er 
and as such ought to be elected by the people. 

The question was taken on the amendment and 1 it was rejecte 

The section was then adopted. ee 

Mr. WILLIAMS offered the following as an additional section: 

“The general assembly shall have no power to pass any la 
whereby any person shall be deprived of life, liberty, property 
franchises, without trial, judgment, or decree in some usual ai 
regular judicial tribunal: Provided, that revenue, taxes, and 
assessments, may be collected, and private property may be take n 
_and applied to public use, and persons and property shall be su 
ject to arrest and seizure, for purposes of trial, judgment, 
decrees, and persons may be punished for contempts by such trib 
nals and such manner as the general assembly, by general ai 
uniform laws, may provide: And provided further, that purchase 
of land sold without judgment for taxes, asserting title by virtue of 
such purchase as against the title of the original owner or pers 1 
claiming title or possession under such owner, shall be requir 
to prove, in order to sustain the title asserted as aforesaid, th 
the land when sold was liable for taxes, that the same was 7 
and sold conformably to law.’’ 

Mr. SCATES opposed the section for several reasons. He 
thought that the bill of rights was the proper place in which the 
life, liberty and property should be secured. Such had been th 
course adopted by the constitutions of every state in the Unio 
such had been the case in our former constitution, and he cou 
see no reason to depart from it. He wanted the trial by jury 
be secured permanently in another part of the constitution. | 
looked upon the amendment proposed by the member fr 
Adams as interfering with the right to arrest fugitive slaves. Mq 
moved to strike out the words ‘“‘life and liberty’’ and then 
could be tested upon its taxable features. 

Mr. WILLIAMS said the section had nothing to do wwithid 
titles; nor did it interfere in any way with the right to arr 
fugitive slaves. The latter was secured by the constitution 
the United States, and no provision in our laws could change the 
question. 4 y 

Mr. HARVEY opposed the section. He wanted no change 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 11, 1847 733 


the language of the bill of rights. The present constitution se- 
"cured every man life, liberty and property, and the provision was 
_a translation of the great magna charta. It was well understood, 
_ had been interpreted, its meaning frequently expounded and its 
construction firmly established. Why change it? The same 
_ language was in the constitution of the United States, and of all 
the states; why should we change it to meet the desires of the 
gentleman from Adams. It appeared to him that it did strike 
- at tax titles. It requires a fria/ and judgment before execution 
and sale. How can we have a trial in the case of a non-resident 
. p landowner, who owes taxes? Trial requires that the party should 
_ be summoned, and how can we summon them? He looked upon 
the section as releasing non-residents entirely from the payment 
of taxes. 

- Mr. THOMAS was in favor of the section. He had some- 
thing to do with its preparation and considered it as not inter- 
fering with tax titles other than the additional requirements of 
notice, &c. 

_ Mr. ANDERSON moved the previous question; which was 

not ordered. 

_ Mr. SINGLETON was in favor of the section in its present 
_ shape. He was, when the question was before them in committee 
i. ; of the whole, of the same opinion as the gentleman from Knox, 
but his objections had been obviated by the present language of 
_ the amendment. 
cj Mr. LOCKWOOD thought the Bill of Rights, with the old 
_ provision in it, would be found sufficient protection to the citizen 
 inhis life, property and liberty. He would vote against the whole 
"section, and at the proper time would move to strike out that por- 
tion in relation to tax titles. We had already made ample pro- 
visions to protect the landholder from surprise and fraud, and if 


Mr. SCATES withdrew his amendment. 
Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to strike out all in relation to 


The question was then taken on the adoption of the section, 
and it was rejected—yeas 65, nays 66. 
Mr. ROBBINS offered, as an additional section, the following: 


734 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


‘‘The General Assembly shall have no power to alter or amend 
any bank charter while the same may be in force in this sta 
nor shall any act passed by the General Assembly for the purpose 
of creating a bank, be submitted to the people for their ratificatior 
or rejection, until the same shall have been published, for 
least six consecutive weeks, in the public newspaper printed 
the seat of government of this state. 4 

Mr. SINGLETON moved to strike out all after the val 

““rejection.’ a . 

The yeas and nays were ordered and taken, and resulted- = 
yeas 6, nays 108. . % 

Mr. HURLBUT moved to lay the section on the bates on 
which the yeas and nays were ordered, and resulted yeas 90, n 
40. . iY 
Mr. PETERS offered an additional section; which was lost. — 
Mr. THOMAS moved to lay the article on the table for 
present; which motion was carried. . 

And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned till 3 p. Ma 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. TURNBULL moved to take up the report of ee co! 
mittee on the Executive Department, as amended in commit : 
of the whole. . 

Mr. DEMENT moved to take up the reports from ay Judi 
clary committee. 

And the Convention decided to take up the senor on | 
Executive Department, section by section. 

Section one was read and adopted. 

Sec. 1. The executive power shall be vested in a Governor. 

Sec. 2. The first election of Governor shall be held on the 
Tuesday next after the first Monday of November, A. D. 18 
and the next election shall be held on the Tuesday next after the 
first Monday of November, A. D. 1852; and,thereafter, elect 
for Governor shall be held once in four years, on the Tuesd: 
next after the first Monday of November. The Governor sl 
be chosen by the electors of the members of the General Assembl 
at the same places and in the same manner that they shall resp 
tively vote for members thereof. . The returns for every election f 


- WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 11, 1847 735 


‘Governor shall be sealed up, and transmitted to the seat of govern- 
ment by the returning officers, directed to the Speaker of the 
douse of Representatives, who shall open and publish them in the 
ce of a majority of the members of each house of the Gen- 
eral Assembly. The person having the highest number of votes 
- shall be Governor; but if two or more be equal and highest in 
_ yotes, then one of them shall be chosen Governor by joint ballot 
of both houses of the General Assembly. Contested elections 
_ shall be determined by both houses of the General Assembly in 
4 such manner as shall be prescribed by law. 
“Mr. GREGG moved to strike out ‘‘1848,” and insert ‘‘1850;’’ 
_ to strike out ‘‘1852,’’ and insert ‘‘1854.’” 
__ Mr. G. made this motion because the adoption of the section 
in its present shape, put the present Governor out of office before 
the expiration of his term. He thought there was a manifest pro- 
" priety in his amendment. No one had ever complained of Gov. 
i French, and there was no justice in saying that he, of all the gov- 
is ernors of this state, should be cut down in his term. 
fs Mr. DAVIS of McLean replied that there was no force in the 
_ argument. Our judges, who were appointed for life, are to be 
_ put out of office as soon as this constitution is adopted. He could 
_ see no implied or expressed censure of Governor French in this 
_ act. We were laying the foundation of government anew, and all 
our officers should commence with it. 
a The question was taken by yeas and nays on the amendment, 
and it was rejected—yeas 39, nays 94. 
ny And the section was then adopted. 
4 Sec. 3. The first Governor shall enter upon the duties of his 
‘ office on the second Monday of January, A. D. 1849, and shall 
hold his office until the second Monday of January, A. D. 1853, and 
: until another Governor shall be elected and qualified to office; 
“4 and forever after, the Governor shall hold his office for the term 
_ of four years, and until another Governor shall be elected and 
- qualified; but he shall not be eligible for more than four years in 
_ any term of eight years, nor to any other office until after the ex- 
_ piration of his term for which he was elected. 
ei Sec. 4. No person except a citizen of the United States shall 
_ be eligible to the office of Governor; neither shall any person be 


736 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age 
thirty-five years, and been ten years a resident within this st 
[and have been a citizen of the United States fourteen years]. 
The question was first taken, by yeas and nays, on agreeing 
with the words in brackets, and resulted—yeas 70, nays 68... jam 
And then the section was adopted. . 
Sec. 5. The Governor shall reside at the seat of, government = 
and receive for his salary the sum of twelve hundred and fifty 
dollars per annum, which shall not be increased nor diminish 
and he shall not, during the time for which he shall have bee 
elected such Governor, receive any other emolument from tk 
United States, or any of them. - By 
Mr. POWERS moved to strike out “$1250,” and insert 
““$1500.”’ P. 
Mr. SHUMWAY moved to strike out, and insert “$1000. 7 
The question was first taken on striking out, and carried 
yeas 70, nays 60. Ay 
And then on inserting $1500, and decided in the affirmative— 
yeas 73, nays 66. a : 
Mr. DEITZ moved to insert, after ‘“‘governor:’’ 
shall also be ex officio fund commissioner;”’ and it was rejecte 
yeas 24, nays 114. 
The section was then adopted. 
The one: sections were adopted: 


the duties appertaining to the office of Governor of the State 
Illinois; and will, to the best of my ability, preserve, protect, an 
defend the constitution of this state; and will, also, support t 
constitution of the United States.”’ i‘ 

Sec. 7. He shall, from time to time, give the General Ascoul 
information of the state of the government, and recommend 
their consideration such measures as he shall deem expedient. - 

Sec. 8. The Governor shall have power to grant reprievi 
commutations, and pardons, after conviction, for all offenc 
except treason and cases of impeachment, upon such conditic 
and with such restrictions and limitations as he may think prop 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 11, 1847 737 


subject to such regulations as may be provided by law relative 
_ to the manner of applying for pardons. Upon conviction for 
treason, he shall have power to suspend the execution of the sen- 
“tence until the case shall be reported to the General Assembly at 
its next meeting; when the General Assembly shall either pardon 
_ the convict or commute the sentence, direct the execution of the 
_ sentence, or grant a further reprieve. He shall, biennially, com- 
 municate to the General Assembly each case of reprieve, commu- 
tation or pardon granted; stating the name of the convict, the 
crime for which he was convicted, the sentence and its date, and 
the date of commutation, pardon, or reprieve. 
Sec. 9. He may require information in writing from the offi- 
‘cers in the Executive Department, upon any subject relating to 
the duties of their respective offices, and shall take care that the 
laws be faithfully executed. 
4 Sec. 10. He may, on extraordinary occasions, convene the 
_ General Assembly by proclamation, and shall state to them, in 
said proclamation, the purpose for which they are to convene; 
_ and the General Assembly shall enter on no legislative business 
_ except that for which they were especially called together. 
. Sec. 11. He shall be commander-in-chief of the army and 
navy of this state, and of the militia, except when they shall be 
eallcd into the service of the United States. 
- Sec. 12. In case of disagreement between the two houses 
with respect to the time of adjournment, the Governor shall have 
ever to adjourn the General Assembly to such time as he thinks 
_ Proper; provided it be not to a period beyond the next constitu- 
® ‘tional meeting of the same. 

Sec. 13. A Lieutenant Governor shall be chosen at every 

election of Governor, in the same manner, continue in office for 
the same time, and possess the same qualifications. In voting 
r Governor and Lieutenant Governor, the electors shall dis- 
_ tinguish whom they vote for as Governor and whom as Lieuten- 
_ ant Governor. 
Sec. 14. The Lieutenant Governor shall, by virtue of his 
office, be speaker of the Senate; have a right, when in committee 
f the whole, to debate and vote on all subjects, and, whenever 
... Senate are equally divided, to give the casting vote. 


of the Senate, the senators shall elect one of ane own snember 
speaker for that occasion; and if, during the vacancy of the of 
of Governor, the Lieutenant Governor shall “be eapeeaal 
moved from office, refuse to qualify, or resign, or die, or be ab 
from the state, the speaker of the Be shall in vite ma 
administer the government. 

Sec. 16. The Lieutenant Governor, wie he acts as spe 
of the Senate, shall receive for his service the same comp 
tion which shall, for the same period, be allowed to the ae 
the House of Representatives, and no more. 

Sec. 17. If the Lieutenant Governor shall be called upon | 
administer the government, and shall, while in such administ 
tion, resign, die, or be absent from the state, during the recess 
the General Assembly, it shall be the duty of the Secretary of St 
for the time being to convene the Senate for the purpose of cho 
ing a speaker. 

Sec. 18. In case of the ‘ipeacheteee of the Governor 
absence from the State, or inability to discharge the duties of 
office, the powers, duties and emoluments of the office shall deve va 
upon the Lieutenant Governor; and in case of his dea 
nation, or removal, then upon ‘the speaker of the Senate for 
time being, until the Governor, absent or impeached, shall ret 
or be acquitted; or until the disqualification or inab 
cease; or until a new Governor shall be elected and qualif 

Sec. 19. In case of a vacancy in the office of Governor, 
other cause than those herein enumerated; or in case of t 
of the Governor elect before he is qualified into office, the 
duties, and emoluments of the office shall devolve upon 
tenant Governor, or speaker of the Senate, as above pro 
until a new Governor be elected and qualified. ‘ 

Section twenty was then taken up. as: 

Sec. 20. Every bill which shall have passed the Sen: 
House of Representatives shall, before it becomes a law, be 
sented to the Governor: if he approve, he shall sign it; but if 


shall have originated; who shall enter the objections at_ 


oh 


_ WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 11, 1847 739 


ration, three-fifths of the members elected shall agree to pass 
bill, it shall be sent, together with the objections, to the other 
; by which it shall likewise be reconsidered; and if approved 
ee-fifths of the members elected, it shall become a law, not- 
hstanding the objections of the Governor. But in all such 
, the votes of both houses shall be determined by yeas and 
ays, and the names of the members voting for and against the 
i shall be entered on the journal of each house, respectively. 
iny bill shall not be returned by the Governor within ten days— 
indays excepted—after it shall have been presented _ to him, 


the Legislature shall, by their adjournment, prevent its 


of the meeting of the General Assembly after the expiration of 
| ten days, or be a law. 


The yeas and nays were demanded on the motion, and re- 
lted—yeas 71, nays 67. 

The question was then taken, by yeas and nays, on the adoption 
of the section, and it resulted yeas 74, nays 65. 

_ Sec. 21. Each Governor shall nominate and, by and with the 
idvice of the Senate, appoint a Secretary of State, whose term of 
office shall expire with the office of the Governor, by whom he 


| have been nominated, and who shall hold his office until his 


he official acts of the Governor, and, when required, shall lay 
same and all papers, minutes, and vouchers relative thereto, 
fore either branch of the General Assembly; and shall perform 
| other duties as shall be assigned him by law, and who shall 
‘ive a salary of eight hundred dollars per annum, and no more, 
ept fees; Provided, the Governor shall have power to remove 
@ secretary, when in his judgment the public good shall require 
and to appoint another. 


PSI TT ONT Sees ee REE ORT LEE me te ee 


“ “e . : 
journal, and proceed to reconsider it. If, after such recon- 


rn; in which case, the said bill shall be returned on the first 


essor is appointed and qualified; who shall keep a fair register 


ap AT 5. 


, 


740 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL 

Mr. VANCE moved to add to the. 
elected, &c., all the clerks required in 
is auditor, and secretary of State.’ 
2, Pending which, the Convention a 


LIII. THURSDAY, AUGUST 12, 1847 


_ The question pending at the adjournment yesterday, was on 
he amendment of Mr. Vance. 
. Mr. SMITH of Macon moved to lay it on the table; which 
s decided in the affirmative. 
“Mr. PRATT moved to strike out the section and insert the 


my 
J 
=. 


a “There shall be elected by the qualified electors of the state, at 
the same time of the election for governor, a secretary of state, 
e term of office shall be the same as that of the governor, who 
a Il keep a fair register of the official acts of the governor, 
d when required, shall lay the same and all papers, minutes and 
achers relative thereto, before either branch of the General 
sembly, and shall perform such other duties as shall be assigned 
uim by law, and shall receive a salary of $800 per annum, and no 
ore, except fees; provided, that if the office of secretary of state 
ald be vacated by death, resignation or otherwise, it shall be 
duty of the governor to appoint another, who shall hold his 
office until another secretary shall be elected and qualified.’’ 
The substitute was adopted, and the section as amended was 
Iso adopted. 
Sections 22 and 23 were read and adopted. 
- Sec. 22. All grants and commissions shall be sealed with the 
reat seal [of state,] signed by the governor or person administer- 
‘the government, and countersigned by the secretary of state. 
_ Sec. 23. The governor and all other civil officers under this 
ate shall be liable to impeachment for misdemeanor in office, 
ing their continuance in office, and for two years thereafter. 
Mr. SHUMWAY moved to reconsider the vote by which 
ection 20 was adopted, with a view to restore the veto power 
ts former force, which was not agreed to—yeas 68, nays 73. 
_ Mr. SCATES moved to reconsider the vote adopting section 
2, with a view of fixing the time of the election of the next gover- 


741 


wing: 


742 


nor ata beriod that would enable the needs governo 
his term of office. i 

Messrs. Lockwoop, Davis of Montgomery, Caxp 
Wuitney, Sincteton and Hayes opposed the motion, Messt 
ScaTEs and Pratr advocated it, and the Convention refuse 
reconsider the vote—yeas 42, nays IOI. 

Mr. WITT moved to reconsider the vote on vention 5, i 
tion to the salary of the governor, and the diy refu 
reconsider—yeas 64, nays 76. 


Scans offered a substitute; and both of whittle Mr. Z. 
moved to lay on the table, and the Convention so decided: 
66, nays 53. 

Mr. SERVANT moved the article be referred to the comr it 
on Revision, &c. 


to anaes a rule that members shall not be idicieedl toc 
round the secretary’s desk during the taking of the yeas ane 
The Convention refused to suspend the a 


THE JUDICIARY 


Messrs. ConsTaBLE, DEMENT, SINGLETON, Epwarps of \ 
Rountree, Z. Casey and the PRESIDENT ae 
resulted in Oe ea 


v3 rehbtted by himself, for the report of the nolan 
Mr. CALDWELL hoped the motion would not i si9 


courts. Se 
Mr. SCATES Eee a to the gentleman from ies to 

his motion so as to substitute his report for the first twelve 
and the last four sections. 


Mr. DEMENT did so modify his motion. 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 12, 1847 743 


_Mr. SCATES addressed the Convention in favor of the motion, 
2 din support of the election of the supreme court by general 
ti ket, in opposition to their choice by three grand divisions. 
_ Mr. WILLIAMS said, that the judiciary was the most im- 
portant department of the government. It had a jurisdiction 
; the life, liberty and property of individuals, and therefore its 
importance. It becomes us then to particularly inquire into the 
best mode of selecting the judges. He was in favor of the dis- 
trict system. A judge was elected in each district; and the people 
“of each district had the choice of one judge, and were therefore 
fully represented on the bench. The same argument against the 
di listrict system would apply to the Legislature. A member of 
| that body assisted in passing laws for the whole state and for the 
wh hole people, and would any one contend that because he did so, 
that he should be chosen by the whole people? Because he acted 
os i part in making laws to govern people in the other parts of the 
state, should he be elected by the whole people? He thought 
di ifferently. He considered, that as the people by the choice of 
“representatives by districts were represented in the legislature, 
so would the interests and the people of the respective districts be 
as fairly represented by having the judges elected in such districts. 
4 Paeain, he had come to the conclusion that under the present state 
q of affairs in Illinois, the best mode of selecting judges was by leav- 
' ing them to be chosen by the people; and as a great auxiliary 
i to the people in choosing them, he thought the district 
ystem should be adopted; because that they would be more likely 
‘and more certainly have a better knowledge and acquaintance 
" with the candidates for the office. This alone was a sufficient 
reason why he should vote for the district system. It had been 
said here that men could be chosen for the office in the district who 
‘could not be elected by the whole people. This was, to him, an 
“argument in favor of the district system. It showed that the 
p: people, when they knew the man, were acquainted with his quali- 
fications, &c., would rise above party considerations and elect 
- im. He ee asial the time when the election of our judiciary 
should be based upon party principles. He would regret the day 
. ‘when a man’s recommendation for the office ofa supreme judge was 
: based upon his party feelings and sentiments. A man nominated 


vag 
i 


on noother ground than that of his politics, and thus a man might 
be rejected by the whole people who did not know him, on accoul 


and who knew his abilities and qualifications, would elect hie 
they alone had the choice. He considered the district system t 
best in securing a pure, able and competent bench. 


pe eeleiiee from Jefferson, ke the effect, that one of the eaciver of 
the committee of 27 on the Judiciary had said, that the report 
of the majority proposed one of the must unfit and inefficie 
systems that could be devised. No such remark had been mai 

in committee by any one of the majority. It was the gentlem 
from Fulton who was not now present (Mr. Wead,) who ma 
the remark alluded to by the gentleman from Jefferson, or remar 

in their nature and tendency very similar. The remarks whi 
he had made concerning the report, and his objections to it were 
very different. It is true, continued Mr. Minshall, that about 
the time the vote was taken in committee, as most of the members 
voting for the majority report had committed themselves to the 
support of the report in the convention, on the ground that they 
regarded it as a compromise, by their votes and remarks; and 
I differed entirely with the committee in regard to the comp: 
mise, and entertained objections to two of the sections in tl 
majority report, viz: the third and sixth sections; and third sv 
rendering the power to the legislature of changing at any tit 
they might choose the organization of the court by changing the 
mode of election to general ticket, or from general ticket to di 
tricting, as the different parties might prevail in the legislatu 
the sixth section giving the legislature power over the sittings 
the supreme court, to require them to hold their terms at thr 
places, with power to alter and change them, either to the extent 


88 This speech by Minshall is taken from the Sagamo Journal, August 2: 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 12, 1847 745 


of requiring a term to be held in each judicial circuit or to reduce 
it to one single place, that being the seat of government. This 
power I thought, and still think, puts the supreme court completely 
“under the control of the legislature; a position, in my mind of all 
others, which we should most avoid in forming the judiciary 
department. The judiciary, particularly the supreme court, being 
_ a co-ordinate branch and one, which from the nature of our insti- 
_ tutions, would be most like to come in contact with the legislature 
_ when called upon to give construction to their legislative action, 
_ in view of all constitutional questions, was of all others, most 
necessary to be removed far from legislative control or influence, 
_ and should in no manner be accountable to, or under the influence 
“of the legislature other than by the general provisions holding 
them accountable to the people through their representative, for 
a faithful discharge of their duties, and for misdemeanor or mis- 
conduct in office. Entertaining these views, I conceived that I 
could under no circumstance surrender them, and could not re- 
gard it in the nature of acompromise. But rather than be looked 
upon as an impracticable, voted for the report of the majority to 
enable them to make their report as a basis for action in the con- 
vention, but at the same time distinctly stating that in so doing, 
I should not be considered as committed to the whole report, 
and reserving to myself the right, that if the minority or any one 
else produced a report that better accorded with my judgment 
and views, I should certainly give it my support in preference. 
If, then, I am the person alluded to by the gentleman from 
Jefferson, he is mistaken. It was the gentleman from Fulton, who 
_ was one of the majority, and appeared to be generally dissatisfied 
_ with the report, and more particularly with the county court 
“system in which he had figured conspicuously,—which, no doubt, 
_ will be remembered by other gentlemen of the committee. The 
most that I said at the time was, that I would not commit myself 
_ to the support of the whole of the report. My objection, however, 
will be seen not to be against the districting system;—for that has 
_been my favorite plan from the commencement,—but because it 
_ did not give that system in full and perfectly free from legislative 
"interference hereafter. In regard to the rest of the report, except 
_ these two sections, I concurred with the committee, and do now. 


at 


iY 


746 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLL. 


While up for the purpose of this explaaeeenn in regard z 
reason why I prefer the district to any other system of 
times, I can state them in a very few words (although I 
under great terror, and perhaps unnecessary fear of the ab: 
nable fifteen minute rule, and norepiy.) I have differed for son 
time with most of my political friends in regard to the election 
judges. In the first place I look upon the office of judge as a 
gether different from most offices. The nature of the ide 
such that the judge who is desirous even for re-election, can « 
secure that result by a faithful performance of his duty. He 
to perform his high trust openly before the public in the preset 
of all that choose to assemble in the courts. The matters in ha 
concerning all the public, and particularly the parties immedia 
interested on trial, within the keen sight of the parties, 
the still more sharpened vision of lawyers of the parties, and t 
general interest of the bar—how can the judge dare to show 
favoritism for the one party or the other for the sake of pop 
ity? Would not all he gained from the favored party, be mo 
than counterbalanced by the loss of the other, and still mor 
the general indignation that would be excited in the whole co 
munity, of all parties, at such conduct? Could the judge possi 
escape detection? Certainly not. Why should the judges 
supreme court be elected in districts? Because, in adoptin sf 
elective system, we are departing from an old established syster 
that of appointment during good behavior. We cannot rely 
appointment for a term of years unless we render the incumb : 
ineligible to re-appointment; because if liable to re-appointm 
it inclines the judge to look too much to the governor as t 
source and fountain of power, and therefore is likely to creat 
much dependence on that quarter. We cannot agree on a 
long enough to render the judges ineligible after one term. 


mendation altogether foreign to the old times, and beim 
little regard to the general welfare. I have been inclinec 
depart from this system for some years back, and I hold it 

Oi 


system, which may have been antiquated or is subject to con. 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 72, 1847 747 


districts, because it gives the people a better opportunity of 
‘exercising a correct judgment in their choice. If you will give 
them a fair chance to know something of the man they are to vote 
_ for, something of his qualities, his legal attainments, his integrity, 
iS his independence, and of all that makes up the fitness for the 
~ station, I feel confident the district plan affords to the voter most 
opportunity for this. It brings the voter and the voted for nearer 
_ together; affords men means of acquaintance, and if trusting to 
the integrity and good intention of the people this means of 
at "selecting their judges is adopted, it is reasonable to suppose they 
will select the very best from one party or the other to perform 
i. the high functions of this office. 
A As to the position taken by the gentleman from Jefferson, 
: ' that the court is to be regarded in the light of a representative 
_ body—if it is meant to assume that the court is to be so regarded, 
I do not agree with him. It is insisted by those who take that 
position that the judge will not represent all the State, or in other 
_ words that one-third of the State will make a judge for the other 
_ two, and that the judge will have the power to decide for persons 
_ that have no voice in electing him; and that therefore as the 
* supreme court are the judges for the whole State, the whole State 
_ should vote for them. This argument is more specious than sound. 
_ Tf gentlemen will have the court a representative body, which 
_ may be conceded for the sake of argument merely, the argument 
_ proves nothing, for by reference to the manner of constituting 
_ the truly representative branch in the government, the House of 


aor 


E The Representatives and Senators, it must be admitted, in 
th all matters of general concern, and in the enactment of general 
_ laws for the whole community, are the representatives and sena- 
tors for the whole State, yet they are elected from counties and 
_ Single districts. But really the objection that the judges _ will 
have to decide for voters of a district who may not have voted for 


748 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL ie 


recommendations. 
These are some of the reasons why I have adhered with tenac 
-ity to the districting system in the election of supreme judges 
and another may be named in departing from eld and settled — 
usages and systems in matters of such moment when the mind is 
satisfied with reasons for the change owing to the mutability — 
and uncertainty of all things pertaining to society, governments, and _ 
their transition from one form to another. We feel more safety 
in having a precedent before us. In adhering to the district plan 
we will have followed the example that has been set us by the 
State of Mississippi, and which we have followed in adopting the 
elective judiciary, and we have abundant evidence before us tha a 
in that State the system has worked well. If the precedent is 
good in part, the reasons for it would also seem to assure us that — 
it is good throughout. Let us then try it in its true spirit and see ~ 
if the system if followed out will not work as well in this State as 
in that.] 


Ae 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac begged the attention of the Convention 
for a few moments, while he expressed a few words in relation t 
the reports before the Convention. The argument advance 
now, and when the subject was before them on a previous occasion, ~ 
in favor of the election of the judges of the supreme court, was, 4 
that they should be elected by the whole people, if they were 
to be elected at all. For this view, for this system of an election — 
of the judiciary by general ticket, there was no precedent to ~ 
be found in the Union. Not a single precedent could be foun 
to support it. The only two states that we can look to as pre 
edents for an elective judiciary are the states of Mississippi and 
New York under her new constitution. But, sir, in the state 
Mississippi they had wisely provided against the election of th 
supreme court by general ticket; they had carefully avoided that 
evil. They had divided the state into three districts, and one of 
the judges was elected from each district. The experience of tht 
people of that state under this provision has been shown to us in © 
the debate on this question at a former day. Mr. D. read the © 
provision in the Mississippi constitution upon the subject. Nor 


*h 


ig 


y 


<3 
¥. 


athsleaal 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 12, 1847 749 


said he, is the state of New York any precedent in favor of this 


“general ticket system. What does it provide? It does not pro- 


_ vide for the election of the whole court of appeals—the court of 


final resort—by general ticket.. They have provided that that 


- court shall be composed of four judges to be elected by general 


ticket, and four to be chosen by the qualified electors in separate 
districts. Then, sir, the gentlemen have no grounds to sustain 
this principle upon; they having nothing here or elsewhere to 
support them. There is no ground in the state of feeling on the 
subject in Illinois to sustain them. But on the contrary, there is 
reason to believe that no such system as they propose should be 
adopted. There is good ground for us to believe that the people 
of the state of Mississippi, when they adopted this district plan, 
were actuated by an apprehension that if the court were elected 
by the whole people, it would become an engine of tyranny and 
an instrument of despotism. Mr. D. read an extract from the 
constitution of the state of New York, to show that the court of 
appeals—the court of final resort, was to be composed of the four 
judges to be elected by general ticket, and of others to be chosen 
in districts. These judges, sir, who make up this court are to be 
chosen by the voters of the state in their respective districts, not 
by general ticket. Where, then, is the precedent for this system? 
Where the precedent for the election of a tribunal of last resort by 
the general ticket system? Nowhere. Not ina single state of the 
Union can it be found. Nota single precedent for this proposition 
can be found in the whole United States. It is therefore an experi- 
ment. The whole plan of an elective judiciary is an experiment, 
but are we to be launched upon the sea of experiment with no 
light of experience to guide us? He hoped not. If the Convention 
substituted the report of the gentleman from Lee for that of 
the majority of the committee, then, sir, all responsibility 
on the part of the judges to the people was gone, forever 
gone. The judges would look not to the people for support, not 
to them for confidence, but to the party leaders of the day. They 
would not feel the responsibility which would attach were he 


_ obliged to look to the people of his own district to sustain him, and 


were they alone to judge of his conduct. What is the difference 
between the two reports? The majority report says the state 


460 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC 


shall be divided into three grand divisions, as nearly: equal. ir 
be, and the qualified electors of each division shall elect one of 
said judges for the term of nine years; provided, that after 
first election of said judges, the legislature may have the power 
provide by law for their election by the whole state or by divisiot 
as it may deem most expedient. The minority report says, 
state shall be divided into three districts, as nearly equal in pop- 
ulation as may be, and the qualified electors of the state shall elec 
the three judges, one of whom shall reside in each district. _ 
would be perceived that under the majority report, the legislatu 
had the power after the first election, in case it was found ‘ 
operate badly, to change the system to the general ticket plai 
But inthe minority report no such power was given. It was fixe 
permanently and positively; if found to act badly, there was no 
power given to change or alter it. Under the former, if such aca 
should ever arise, that the legal talent of the state should — 
gathered at one section, then the legislature may have the pow 
to provide for a change from the district system; but under 
minority report, they must come one from each district, and 
cannot be changed or altered, and the only object which can 
secured is, that they shall be elected by the whole people—t 
general ticket. Their whole argument is swept away. Weh 
no precedent any where for what they propose, and are we 
pared to adopt it? There are, however, precedents for the . 
trict plan. We have the experience of the two states, Mississi 
and New York, both of whom have adopted it. Shall we di 
regard them? Are we not to look at the lamp of experience bi 
ing at our feet, and venture upon an untried experiment, whic 
before his God, he considered the most mischievous and mo 
fraught with evil, ruin, and disaster to the rights and liberties 
the people that could be presented. He hoped the amendr 
would not be adopted. Much time had already been cons 
in the discussion of this subject, and he did not desire to deta 
the Convention. But he sincerely hoped that the Conve 
would retain the district provision to establish a supreme 
a court of final resort, that will give general satisfaction, 
which may be looked up to with pride. * 
Mr. DEMENT was sorry to take up the time of the Co 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 12, 1847 751 


“two gentlemen, from Adams and from Massac. Nor had 
‘come to the conclusions embodied in that report without full 
beration, and consideration of the subject, as is assumed by 
e gentleman from Massac. Sir, is there nothing in which the 
_ two reports differ, but that of the mode of electing the judges? 

> thought there were several points in which the reports differed, 
id those differences were sufficient to induce him to vote for 
le minority report, in preference to that of the majority. He 
d, on a former occasion, expressed his sentiments on all the 
_ points involved in the question of the judiciary, and would now 
confine himself entirely to the question of those two reports, and 
touch upon some of the points alluded to by the gentleman from 
Massac. He speaks of an apparent inconsistency in the minority 
eport, which confines the selection of the judges of the supreme 
ourt to the districts, and his argument was based upon the danger 
‘the possibility that all the legal talent of the state might be 
ound to be in one section of the state. Such an argument needs 
“no reply, and Mr. D. would not detain the Convention by SHOWane 
s fallacy. 

Mr. DAVIS said, that he had never said there was any danger 
“of such a thing as the whole legal talent being concentrated in one 
section of the state. He had alluded to it merely to show the 
in possibility, under the minority report, of changing the mode of 
election to meet the changes that may take place in the condition 
and circumstances of the people. 

Mr. DEMENT said, he had given way for an Leplanedon =! 
rt a speech—and he had not attributed to the gentleman any 
ch remark [as] that he complained of, when he did, it was time for 
_ the gentleman to complain. But it was urged by the member 
_ from Massac so tenaciously, it was nothing more than a fair con- 
sion, that he look upon the probability of such a thing as an 
gument. If not, why did he urge it? The gentleman objects 
the provision, and cites the majority report as a better system 


also, their election to the three districts. This is his nae 
to be a fixed rule until after the first election. The charact 
integrity and ability of the court are to be decided by the vo 
of one district—by a majority of one-third of the state—by 
little more than one-sixth of the people, and this is the place p 
posed to give the people the election of the judiciary. Again, t 
proposition of the gentleman divides the state not into thi 
divisions as regards population, but in respect to territory, whe 
by one division, with a small fraction of population, may have 
decision of the character, &c., of the court. The minority rep 
is different, it proposes these divisions to be laid off with resp 
to population. Another difference in the report; the minority 
propose a different term of office—six years. When the matte 
was before us before, the Convention, by a large majority, fi: 
the term of office at six years, and the minority have followed th 
decision. The majority, however, have set this aside, have 
the expressed will of the majority of the Convention shall not 
law, and have fixed in their report the term at nine years. - 
was also opposed to leaving this great power of panies 
judiciary, with the Legislature. He wanted to have it fixed, p 
manently and firmly fixed in the constitution, and the departm 
left wholly independent of the Legislature. Another reason w 
he opposed the majority report, was that a majority of this C 


the committee have come into the Convention, with the term fix 
at one place in each of the three divisions, and then the Legislat 
is entrusted with the power to change it. This is a great pov 
to give the Legislature, and he had not expected it to come fr 
the quarter whence it did, who have all during the session preache 
to us continually—distrust to the legislature. There was 3 
another difference between the two reports: in the majority-1 
port, they fixed the circuits at twelve in number; we think tha 
nine are ample for the present exigencies of the time, and the cor 
dition and business of the people. The majority also provide for 


the election of an attorney general and prosecuting attorneys, a 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 72, 1847 753 


ve with the Legislature the fixing of their pay and duties; 
the giving to the Legislature this power, he was also opposed. 
in the minority report, the salary of those officers was fixed; if 
the sum was too high or too low, it could be changed, but let us 
not leave it open to the Legislature. We want permanence and 
stability in our judicial system, and we should fix it so in the con- 
stitution, and all our officers should be above the influence and 
control of the Legislature. 
_ Mr. DAVIS of McLean said he admired the tactics of the 
gentleman from Lee, so well displayed in the address he had just 
ade. He had appealed to all those who held views different 
from the majority report in all the details, to vote for striking out 
and inserting his own report, while he had rather avoided the true 
‘question involved in the point.—The gentleman from Jefferson, 
"who entertains the same views with the member from Lee, with 
his characteristic candor, had stated the true question before 
; Saheim to be whether the judges of the supreme court shall be elected 
by districts or by general ticket. The gentleman from Lee, how- 
_ ever, to catch the votes of others, has alluded to the other differ- 
“ences between the reports. He has alluded to the fact, that the 
Convention decided that the term of office should be six years, 
instead of nine, as reported; but, sir, did not the Convention de- 
‘cide, by a much stronger and decided vote, that the judges should 
_ be elected from districts? If so, why, according to his own reason- 
‘ing, has he come in here with his general ticket system? Can he 
‘not, when the question comes up, move to strike out nine and in- 
“sertsix? The majority of the committee, however, with a decided 
“majority in their favor, have come in with a report in which the 
views of all these gentlemen are compromised.—They pro- 
s€ a provision as a compromise, which makes the judiciary 
elective by districts for the present, but leaves with the Legislature 
power to change it, in case it is found to work badly. Mr. D. 


ment, but as a compromise, he was willing to give up his own 


opinion and leave with the Legislature power to fix the time 


grand division, or more places than one in each division, or after 
1850, to have it fixed permanently at the seat of government. 


754 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


As to the complaints of the gentleman from Lee, that the maj 


favor of twelve circuits, yet the minority report had fixed the 
ber at nine only.—The majority has followed the expressed op 
ions of the Convention as nearly as may be, yet they have 
endeavored to meet the various opinions of the gentleme 
presenting a compromise. The gentleman from Lee has not 
the arguments in favor of the district system. He has no 
tempted to answer the argument of the gentlemen who hai 
taken the position that the district system is the better, because 
it brings the election of the judges nearer to the people, w. 
thereby, can make a better selection for the office, than if 
judge was chosen from the state at large, when they would not k 
acquainted with his character and abilities. | 

Mr. AKIN said, that it was apparent that they were to lav 
long speeches on this subject; therefore, to enable gentleme 
gain some wind, he moved the Convention adjourn. And i 
adjourn till 3, p. m. 

AFTERNOON 

The Convention was called, and as soon as a quorum appeared 
the report of the Judiciary committee was again taken up. 
question pending was on the motion of Mr. DEMENT. P 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin said, that neither proposition: — 
neither the general ticket nor the district system, was a fav: 
of his. He was in favor of the old mode of electing the judg 
by the GovernorandtheSenate. Ithad been, however, settled tl 
the judiciary was to be elective and he would be obliged to v 
for the form least objectionable. The people either were or 
not competent to the election of the judiciary, if they were, a 
such was the opinion of the majority of the Convention, why c 
them with this mockery of an elective judiciary, the dist 
system. Why say to the people, you shall have the power 
elect the supreme court, yet your voice shall not be he 
in the choice of two-thirds of that court. The gentlemen 
Massac and McLean have told us that there are no preceder 
be found for this general ticket system. The demand for pr 
edents comes with a bad grace from those gentlemen. + 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 12, 1847 W535 


lave advocated here an elective judiciary, which is opposed to all 
the precedents and experience of ages. They have argued against 
a system of appointment of the judiciary, which has stood the 
- test of centuries, and has never been found mischievous, but 
"which has been sanctioned and approved by all the lights of wis- 
dom and experience of the past and the well approved usage of 
ages. They tell us that this plan of an elective judiciary has 
_ worked well in Mississippi; that there it is found to be an excellent 
substitute for the old plan; this may be, sir, but it is just in its 
"beginning; and it may be found that, like the man who went up 
‘in the tree to fly, he started admirably, but came to the ground 
‘very hard. Such may be the case with this Mississippi plan. 
They have argued before us that the people have the capacity to 
elect judges of the supreme court; that it is a right properly be- 
longing to them, and one which they can and ought to exercise. 
Tf this be the case, why cheat them with this pretended election— 
this power to elect one of the judges, and denying them the right 
to be heard in the choice of the other two?—Suppose the state be 
divided into three districts—a northern, southern and a middle 
district. Suppose we, at the south, elect a man who is utterly 
incompetent to discharge the duties of the office, whom can the 
“people of the north and in the middle districts hold responsible 
for the act? On whom can they visit their punishment? On 
no one, sir. There is no responsibility anywhere; yet the decis- 
ions of that court may be governed by that man. In such a point 
of view, the district system is more objectionable than the present 
mode of electing them by the Legislature; for now, if a man be 
elected who is incompetent and unworthy of the office, the con- 
‘stituents of those who elect him may hold them to strict account 
for the violation of their duty and trust. The argument that it 
would be as proper to elect the Legislature by general ticket as 
the judges of this supreme court, is not a true one, and totally in- 
applicable to the point. There is no representative principle upon 
_ the bench as there is in the Legislature; in that body the different 
county and local interests are represented—for the purpose of 
‘preventing one from encroaching upon the others. But the 
‘supreme court is different—It is not a representative of any one 


interest or section; it is, emphatically, a state tribunal—Gentle- 
‘ud 


AN 
wie: 
aa 
Ps. 
ys 
ye 
af 


appointment by the Governor and Senate, but if the electi 


chosen from—if they were all chosen from one county- 


Be, 


756 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC’ 


men deprecate party spirit in the election of judges; the 
denounced the general ticket as calculated to produce part 
ventions, and party caucuses. Admit it. And will you, 
the district system, avoid this? Will you not. have distri 
ventions to nominate party candidates?—Most certainly yo 
and will they not be followed just as well? Do not the lir 
down by Congressional conventions, county convention 
district conventions, be [sc] as closely followed and observed as 
state nominations? Mr. P. said he was in favor of the p 


to be given to the people, he was in favor of giving it to the wh 
people. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery saw no difference in the q 
as it stood now, and as it did when before us on a 
occasion. The question then was, shall the judges be elected 
an unqualified general ticket, or by districts. The same q 
is now presented, with this difference: that then, the advoc 
the general ticket system declared that locality had nothing 
with the question, and now they come in with a report, th 
judges shall reside in one of the three grand divisions. B 
they have abandoned their ground; have given up their posit: 
that the judges should be chosen, irrespective of locality, | 
so doing, have admitted the correctness of the district sy: ste 
They are willing, now, to give the whole people the power to 
all the judges, but they require that they shall elect one o 
from each of the three grand divisions, which appeared 
more of a solemn mockery than anything he had seen y 

Mr. FARWELL did not consider that in presenting t 
nority report, the friends of the general ticket system had a 
doned any principle. It made no difference where the men 


whole people had a voice in their election. It had been arg 
that the nearer the judges were brought to the people, the bet 
it would be—the better the selection would prove. If such 
true, and that was the best mode of obtaining upright and a 
judges, then why not carry out the principle to the greatest 
fection by providing that the judges shall be chosen and 
by,the voters of the three counties in which they are to sit? — 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 12, 1847 757 


yould be bringing the doctrine to perfection, and he asked those 
no advocated it, why they did not carry it out? The division of 
2 state into three grand divisions, and having them vote sepa- 
tely and for different general officers, would have the effect of 
nating the different sections of the state, and cause sectional 
selings to spring up, which would be felt in the decisions of the 
ourt, as the judges would naturally be governed by the same , 
feelings as those entertained by the people who elected them. 
would not be the case if they were elected by general ticket, 
then they would be above all local feelings, and not influenced 
y sectional interests, but would seek to act as a court for the 
hole state and the whole people. He would prefer the election 
the judges by the whole people, but rather than vote for the 
trict system, he would vote for their appointment by the Gov- 
ernor and Senate. 

Mr. KITCHELL was opposed to the elective system, both 
eral ticket and district, and in favor of the old and long tried 
an of appointment by the Governor and Senate; and this, if 
from no other reason than because of the objections eed against 
the two elective plans, by the respective opponents of each. 

We have a full report of Mr. K.’s remarks, but they are 
_ctowded out by the press of matter. 

Mr. CALDWELL said, that at length he had succeeded in 
catching the eye of the speaker. He desired to say a few words 
upon the question, upon which he was sorry to say he was sepa- 
‘rated from many of the friends with whom he generally acted; 
and he was separated from them only because his most solemn 


favor of a free, pure, upright and independent judiciary. With- 
put independence the judiciary became an engine of tyranny, it 
ame a central consolidated despotism. A pure and independ- 
nt judiciary had always been sought; it was a theme on which all 
he light of the common law had shone. It is now proposed to 
establish an impure, a political judiciary—the plan 1 is before us. 


clary by general ticket, Pe iliac that is the mode, in his opinion, 
‘to make it independent. That gentleman is too new a convert to 
we elective judiciary for me to follow. Mr. C. remembered 


lately become an advocate of it. I have studied it long, 
always been in favor of it, and it is to be presumed know so 
thing about it. Sir, when you make the judiciary elective 
general ticket you concentrate its powers, it becomes a cen 
power, and as such it is highly dangerous, and should be avoi 
There is but one basis upon which all elections are founded, 
that is upon representation. The elective judiciary is a re 
sentative body; all our elections are upon the principle of represen 
tation. Our Congress, our Legislature, and all deliberative bodie 
are representative assemblages, and they are all elected by 
tricts. We have now a better court than any that can be ch 
by general ticket, and it is chosen by districts. Our senat 
tribunal appointed to try impeachments. It is one which is 
worthy of the highest respect, and upon which the utmost con- 
fidence is reposed, and it is chosen by districts. i 

New York and Mississippi have set us precedents for “hoa 
the judges of this court by districts. In New York the highe 
court—the court of final resort—is composed of four judges chosen 
by general ticket, and the balance from districts. When the co 
ventions to frame the constitutions of the states of Mississip 
and New York were in session, they approached this subject with 
much caution and deliberation, and they, with great care and pru- 
dence, threw around the elective judiciary the safeguard of a 
trict system. Appeals have been made, of a party characte 
save the state from an abolition bench. An appeal was m 
here the other day, by certain Aorthern gentlemen, to us, fi 
the south, to come to their aid. They have called upon us 
money democrats of the south to come to their aid, and save tf 
from the control of the abolition whigs of the north. This p 
spirit should not be followed, should not be permitted to en 
into the choice of judges of the supreme court. But under 
general ticket system party will rule, will control and govern t 
election of the court. No matter what party may be in power 


gomery has said, that the Rough and Ready party will then 
dominant; but be that as it may whatever party is in pow 
that party will have the whole bench under their rule. Then will 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 12, 71847 759 


got up. We know chats no man will ever be nominated by 
; , except men long known as keen and wily politicians—party 
leaders. Then, sir, look at the supreme court that you will have. 
ot only a party bench, but one composed of politicians, elevated 
ere because they are such politicians, and whose decisions will 
in conformity with the views of the party elevating them. We 
_ will then have, sir, a central power created in the state. We will 
ve a consolidated judicial despotism, in the shape of a supreme 
ee Such will not be the case with the district system; its 
pk and its responsibility are divided; it looks to different inter- 
"ests for its support, and cannot become so dangerous. For this 
district system, which is denounced as not orthodox, we have not 
only the precedents of New York and Mississippi, but also of two 
great leaders, Thomas H. Benton and Silas Wright, who have 
advocated it, and fought for it, in the halls of Congress. They 
have shown its benefits and advantages, when battling for it, as 
atule to govern congressional elections. This report of the major- 
‘ity of the committee is a compromise report. They went out of 
‘this Convention with a decided majority in favor of their plan, 
“but, to obviate all objections, they have made a compromise 
‘report. They have yielded so far on this district system, as to 
‘consent that the Legislature, after the first election, in case the 
mode does not work well, may change the manner of Agena In 
this they have yielded much; as much as gentlemen should ask, 
and he hoped the Convention tid sustain the report throughout 
valli its provisions. 
__ Mr. BOND addressed the convention in support of the major- 
ity report, and 
_ Mr. BROCKMAN in favor of the minority report and the 
general ticket system. 
_ The question was then taken, by yeas and nays, on the motion 
of Mr. Dement to substitute the minority report, No. 1, for the 
first twelve sections, of the majority report and resulted—yeas 
64, nays 84. 
__ The report of the majority was then adopted as a substitute 
for all the propositions that had been heretofore before the con- 


360 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC ; 


vention and which had been referred to the weg committee 
it was then taken up section after section. 

Sec. 1. The judicial power of this state shall be and is her 
vested in one supreme court, in circuit courts, in “yaaa ce 
and in justices of the peace. 

Mr. GREGG moved to add to the section: 

““Provided, that inferior local courts of civil and criminal ju 
diction may be established by the general assembly, in the 
of this state, but such courts shall have a uniform organiza 
and jurisdiction in such cities.’ Be 

Messrs. Grece, WILLIAMS and PETERS sdvueele the amei 
ment; and it was adopted. ‘ 

Mr. FARWELL moved to strike out all after ‘ ‘circuit cour 
and insert: ‘‘and such other courts of inferior jurisdiction as 
legislature, from time to time may create; which was reject 

And the section as amended [was] adopted. — ne 

Sec. 2. The supreme court shall consist of three judges, ¢ 
two of whom shall form a quorum; and the concurrence of tw 
said judges shall in all cases be necessary to a decision. 

Mr. SINGLETON moved to add thereto: : 

““And no person who has once been elected or appointed j 
of any court of record created or authorized by this constitu 
or by any act of the general assembly of this state after the 
tion thereof; or who shall have entered upon.his or their offi 
duties or otherwise signified his or their acceptance of the office, shi 
be eligible to an election or an appointment to any like offi 
created or authorized as aforesaid, nor shall any such person 
eligible to any other office in the gift of the people or of e 
ofthe departments of the government of thisstate for the peri 
two years after the expiration of the term for. which he or the 
elected or appointed judge.”’ 

Mr. BOSBYSHELL moved the Convene adjourn; w 
motion was negatived. 

The question was then taken on Mr. SINGLETON’S ae 
and it was rejected—yeas 62, nays 109. 

Adjourned. I 


LIV. FRIDAY, AUGUST 13, 1847 


_ Prayer by Rev. Mr. Sutetps. 

ss . of absence for eight days was granted to Mr. Bunsen, 
in consequence of sickness; and of ten days to Mr. Knapp of Scott; 
and eight days to Mr. Dunn and Mr. KitcHELt. 

Mr. SIM presented a petition praying an exemption of a 
; mestead, &c. from execution, &c ; which petition was laid on 
_ the table. 

- Acall of the convention was ordered, and after some time a 
- quorum appeared. 

__ Mr. SPENCER asked a suspension of the rules to enable him 
_ to offer a resolution that hereafter the afternoon sessions shall 
_ commence at 2 p. m., and the convention refused to suspend the 
ae 81, nays eA hinds not voting therefor. 

q _ The question pending at the adjournment on yesterday was 
+ s the adoption of the 2d section of the majority report of the 
ecial judiciary committee—and being taken was decided in the 
ative. 

' Mr. BUTLER moved to postpone for the present the con- 
"sideration of the intervening sections, and take up the 13th sec- 
n; which motion was lost. 

_ Sec. 3. The state shall be divided into three grand divisions, 
as nearly equal as may be, and the qualified electors of each 
ad vision shall elect one of the said judges for the term of nine 
‘years; provided, that after the first election of such judges the 


egislature may have the power to provide by law for their elec- 


ti Pron by the whole state, or by divisions, as it may deem most ex- 
ape dient. 

a _ Mr. SERVANT moved as a substitute for the section the 
<3 following: 

_. “‘The governor shall nominate, and by and with the advice 
a consent of the senate, appoint the judges of the supreme court, 


| (two-thirds of the senators elected concurring therein.) Said 


761 


762 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


judges shall hold their office for the term of fifteen years, and un | 
their successors shall be commissioned and sworn.’’ 
Mr. PETERS submitted a modification to the se 


lot, so that one would be sEDe ie by the governor and senate 
every three years. 

This, he said, was a compromise with those who desired’ 
break up the old system of appointment during good behaviou iE 
This was a compromise between the two systems, for it reduced d 
the term of offiice—which was one feature in the old system much 
complained of by the people. a 

Mr. SERVANT accepted the modification. J 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin said, that the proposition now 
before them was his favorite, and he addressed the friends of a 
general ticket to vote for this as far preferable to the district. 
system; and he also thought the friends of the district system would 
find it much better than the general ticket system. He called 
upon the opponents of an elective judiciary to stand by - and 
they could carry it. 

Mr. GEDDES said, he knew but little of matters relative to 
judiciary, but he agreed with the gentleman from Macoupin, an 
thought the old system of appointment the best. His secon 
choice however was not the general ticket system: he preferre d 
the district plan. He saw many evils in the general ticket system r 


the district system. He would vote for the amendment. 4 

Mr. PRATT said, this subject was a most important one. It 
was one of the great reforms which this convention was called to 
adopt, and where there was such a large majority in favor of the 
elective judiciary, he regretted to see such difference of opinion, 
and so much feeling shown on the question of the proper mode 0 0 : 
carrying this great reform into operation. He had long given the 
subject much consideration and study, and he confessed his o 
opinions were not yet satisfactorily settled. His views upon the 
subject were expressed in a published article, wa he read in| 
lieu of his own remarks. By e 

This was his view of the subject, and much bone expressed 
than he could do so. He was in favor of the election of the judges © 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 13, 1847 763 


_ by the whole people; but if that was voted down he would vote 
for the district system in preference to the appointment by the 
governor and two-thirds of the senate. 
Mr. BUTLER said, he was in favor of the general ticket sys- 
_ tem, but inasmuch as that had been voted down by the conven- 
tion, he would now vote for the district system, as reported by 
the majority of the committee, because it authorized the legislature 
to change the mode of election to whatever plan the people may 
desire. It was in his opinion a fair and honorable compromise, 
and the friends of the general ticket ought to support it. 
Mr. HARVEY asked for a division, so as to vote first on strik- 
ing out. 
Mr. DAVIS of McLean opposed the division of the question. 
Mr. LOCKWOOD said that, from his peculiar position, it 
would be but proper that he should define it. He did so as follows: 
I believe that long terms and competent salaries are the only 
sure basis of an independent, upright and able judicial system— 
and I am yet to learn that the tenure of good behaviour with a 
competent salary is not best calculated to secure these desirable 
results. I am however satisfied that the tenure of good behav- 
iour hasreceived the condemnation of the people. I am, therefore, 
for the next best plan that can be obtained to secure these objects; 
I am of opinion that the amendment of the gentleman from 
Randolph is the best that there is any probability of getting. I 
shall therefore go for it if it can be amended so as to render the 
judge ineligible —I cannot vote for the proposition of the gentle- 
man from Peoria, fearing as I do, that the short terms contained 
in it and the reeligibility of the judges will produce the evils of a 
_ dependent and time-serving judiciary. 
Mr. ARMSTRONG offered the following as a substitute for 
the amendment: 
___ The justices of the supreme court shall be elected by the 
- qualified voters of the state, on the first Monday of March, after 
_ the adoption of this article; returns whereof shall be made to the 
_ secretary of state, who shall count the same in the presence of the 
“governor and auditor, or either of them; the three persons having 
the highest number of votes shall be elected.”’ 
Mr. PALMER of Macoupin, said that he hoped the 


ws? ANS, PIN aA Re 


764 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTK 


amendment would be withdrawn and that a fair oppor 
might be given to the friends of the appointment by the go 
system, to record their votes upon the journal in favor of t 
plan. He thought it a want of courtesy to deny them this 
privilege. 

Messrs. KNOWLTON and WEST expressed the same vi 
and hoped that a fair vote might be had. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG replied, that his object was to * 
fair direct vote upon the general ticket system, and if that w 
voted down, then he would vote with the friends of the old sys 

Mr. PALMER of Marshall thought the district system was he 
choice of the majority and would vote for that. ‘ 

Mr. ARMSTRONG withdrew his amendment. 

Mr. LOCKWOOD offered the following as a dubstivate 
the amendment: 

““The judges of the supreme court shall be subi Kod 
governor, by and with the advice and consent of two-thirds of 
the senators elected; and shall hold their offices for the peri 
fifteen years, and until their successors are appointed and que 
fied, and the said judges shall not be re-eligible to said ic .. 


The question recurred upon the amendment sys prne z 
it was rejected—yeas 38, nays 103. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG renewed his amendment as a substit 
for the section. 3 

Mr. SINGLETON moved to amend the substitute by a 
thereto—‘‘and be forever ineligible to re-election;’’ which 
rejected. A. eae 

Mr. PRATT moved as a substitute for the Beir 
following: 

‘The state shall be divided into three districts, as. ne 
equal in population as may be. The justices of the supreme cx 
shall be elected by the qualified electors of the state, on 
whom shall be selected from, and reside in, each district;’” w! 
was rejected—yeas 42, nays 80. : 

The question was taken, by yeas and nays, on the substitu 
proposed by Mr. ArmsTRONG, and it was reject ae 60, 1 ; 


78. oat 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 13, 1847 765 


oa GEDDES offered an amendment, providing for the 


The question recurring on the adoption of the section: 
| Mr. KENNER asked for a division so as to vote first on the 


wie CONSTABLE moved a reconsideration of the vote just 
_ taken; and it was refused. 

Sec. 4. The office of one of said judges shall be vacated after 

_ the first election held under this article, in three years, of one in 
six years, of one in nine years, to be decided by lot, so that one of 

said judges shall be elected once in every three years; the judge 

having the longest term to serve shall be the first chief justice, 

ter which the judge having the oldest commission shall be chief 

fstice, 

Mr. HOGUE moved to athilte out the words “‘three,”’ ‘‘six 
and “‘nine’’ where they occurred and to insert in lieu thereof the 

words “‘two,”’ “‘four,” and “‘six.’’ 

_ Mr. KNOWLTON offered as a substitute for two, four and 
x, the words, “‘four,” “‘eight’’ and ‘‘twelve.”’ 

_ The question was first taken on striking out, and was decided 

in the negative.. . 

_ The section was then adopted, as was also, 

Sec. 5. The supreme court may have original jurisdiction in 

_ cases relative to the revenue, in cases of mandamus, habeas corpus, 

und in such cases of impeachment as may be by law directed to be 

tried before it; and shall have appellate jurisdiction in all other 

cases. 

Sec. 6. The supreme court shall hold at least one term annu- 

ally in each of the aforesaid grand divisions, at such times and 

places as the general assembly shall by law direct; provided, how- 


>? 


> ce 


466 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION. 


ever, that the general assembly may, after the year 
hundred and fifty, direct by law that the said court sha 
at one place only. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to strike out ‘‘at one place 
and insert “‘in each judicial circuit.’ 

. Mr. MINSHALL offered as a substitute for the an 
ment the following: 

“‘And provided that the legislature, after the year 185 
increase the number of judges to four, but after that addition 
number of justices of the supreme court shall not be increas 
diminished.” 

Mr. WITT moved to lay both on the table; which moti 
carried. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to insert before the words “‘pla 
the words “‘place or;’’ which motion was agreed to. . 

Mr. HARDING moved to add to the section the wore 
each grand division.” | 

Mr. HURLBUT offered as a substitute therefor, to be : 
to the section, “‘in the state.’ 

Pending which, the convention adjourned, till 3 p. m. 


AFTERNOON ri: 


No quorum appearing, a call of the Convention was oi 
and, after some time, 128 members appeared. 

Mr. HARDING withdrew his amendment. eng 

Mr. HURLBUT renewed his motion to add to the sectic 
words ‘‘in thestate;’’ and the motion was carried—yeass9, 1 

Mr. HARDING moved to strike out all of the sectio 
the word “‘divisions.’’ < 

The question being taken thereon, by yeas and nay. 
decided in the negative —yeas 64, nays 69. . 

Mr. GEDDES moved to strike out ‘‘or places.’’ Reje 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved to strike out the section, an 
stitute therefor the following: 

“‘The supreme court shall hold one term annually i ine 
the aforesaid grand divisions, at such time and place in each 
division as shall be directed in this constitution, and the t 
grand divisions shall be as follows: The counties of- 


ie 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 13, 1847 767 


shall form the first division, and the supreme court shall be held 
in the county of —_____,” &c. 

Mr. MARSHALL of Coles offered as a substitute therefor the 
following: ‘‘One term of the supreme court shall be held annu- 
ally in each judicial circuit, at such time and place as shall be 
_provided;’’ and the same, by yeas and nays, was rejected—yeas 
| 47, Nays go. 

_ Mr. HARVEY asked for a division, so as to vote first on strik- 

’ ing out, and it was refused. The question was then taken on the 

substitute of Mr. ConsTaBLe, and it was rejected—yeas 63, nays 
7 

‘ Mr. ECCLES moved the previous question; which was re- 

fused. 

Mr. HOGUE moved to strike out the section; and insert: 
“The supreme court shall be held at the seat of government once 
or more in each year, at such time as the General Assembly may 
direct.” 

Mr. HARDING offered as a substitute therefor: ‘“The 

supreme court shall hold one or more terms, annually, in but one 
place in each grand division.”’ 

Mr. POWERS moved the previous question; which was 
_ordered. 

The question was then taken on the substitute of Mr. Harpinec, 

and it was rejected—yeas 68, nays 69. 

The question being taken on Mr. Hocue’s amendment, it 
was rejected—yeas 40, nays 97. 

: The question recurring on the adoption of the section, it was 
adopted—yeas 85, nays 52. 

Mr. ROUNTREE moved to postpone the consideration of the 
intervening sections, (relating to the circuit court) and take up 
the 13th section; which motion was carried. 

Sec. 13. There shall be in each county a court, to be called 
a county court. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to substitute therefor the follow- 

ing: ‘““There shall be in each county in this state a county court, 
to consist of one judge and two associates, who shall be elected by 
_ the qualified voters of the county, on the same day fixed for the 


768 - 


election of other judicial officers, who shall hold their off 
four years, and until their successors are elected and saan 

Mr. SINGLETON moved to substitute therefor: ‘“ 
shall be in each county in this state a county court, to be ce 
posed of the justices of the peace of the several counties, and 
other tribunal shall hereafter be created for the management < 
direction of such matters as may pertain to the internal regulati 
of the counties. S'aid justices shall not be allowed any ot 
compensation for their services as members of said court, t 
exemptions from military duty and labor upon the public hi 
way. Said court shall have original and exclusive jurisdiction 
all cases to which the county is or may be a party, and shall e 
cise all the powers and duties of probate court, not conferred 
law upon the circuit court, and such other jurisdiction as the L 
islature may confer.” 

Mr. ROUNTREE advocated the original section. Bi 
Mr. CRAIN said, the amendment proposed by Mr. 
sTRONG was the first section of the report of the committee 
Miscellaneous Questions, and it had been reported in obedie 
to instructions passed by the Convention. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, there could be no sort of disneal C 
to the committee on Miscellaneous Questions, if the Conventi 
preferred the report of the Judiciary committee, which he ho 
would be done. 


his aeaene and in opposition to the section as poke . 
Pending the question thereon— : 
Mr. LOGAN (by leave) offered the following resolution, w 

was adopted: 

Resolved. That a committee of nine—one from each jud 
circuit—be appointed to divide the state into three grand divisi 
for the election of judges of the supreme court. ih 

2. That said committee be instructed to make said divisions 
as nearly equal in population as practicable; are to make 3 s 
divisions by lines running, as nearly as may be, east and y 
across the state with county lines. x 

3. That said committee be instructed to fix one place ir in € 


oGAN, Grecc, Pratt, PETERS, Ppa bk Har- 
own, and Tuomas were appointed the com- 


{ER of Meee. from the committee on Educa- 
+t; which was read, laid on the table and 250 
Sead adjourned. 


a 
= 


in, and Lis ie 
Mr. Z. CASEY took the chair. oa 
The question pending at the ee po 


the majority of the select committee on the Judiciary. 

Mr. SINGLETON withdrew his amendment. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG modified his proposed substi 

as follows: 

“*There shall be in each county in this state a cout 
consist of one judge and two associates, who shall be el 
the qualified voters of the county, as shall be provided b 
General Assembly, who shall hold their offices four years a 
their successors are elected and qualified.”’ 

Mr. ARCHER moved to amend the amendment, 
after the word ‘‘associates’” the words: “‘the latter be 
of the peace, to be drawn alternately from each precinct 
county.’ ; 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved the previous question’ 
seconded. vi 

The question was then taken on the amendm 
ArcuEr, and decided in the negative. : 

The question was then taken on the amendment of 
STRONG, by yeas and nays, and it was rejected—yeas 4 


until his successor is elected and qualified. 
77° 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 174, 1847 771 


WEST moved to strike out the section, and insert in lieu 
of the following: 

_ “There shall be established in each county in this state a 
t of probate, which shall be a court of record, to consist of one 
, who shall be elected by the qualified voters of the counties, 
tively, and be styled the judge of probate; whose compen- 
mn shall be regulated by law. The courts of probate shall 
jurisdiction in matters relating to the settlement of the 
ates of deceased persons, executors, administrators and guard- 


ans, and such other jurisdiction as may be assigned to them by 


_ Mr. PALMER of Macoupin moved to amend the amendment 
y adding to it the following: 

_ *‘And the justices of the peace of the counties in this state shall 
divided into four classes, by lot; and one of said classes 


action of county business; Provided, all the justices of the 

ace of the counties shall be entitled to seats in said court, but 

ly the class required to sit in said court shall receive compen- 
tion for their services.”’ 

a And the question being taken thereon, it was rejected. 

_ The question recurring on the amendment of Mr. Wesz, it, 

), Was rejected, by yeas and nays—yeas 25, nays I00. 

_ The question was then taken on the adoption of the section, 

ind it was adopted. 

_ Mr. SCATES moved to pass over, informally, the next three 

ections, and to take up the 18th section. 

é The question being taken thereon, it was rejected. 

Sec. 15. The jurisdiction of said court shall extend to all 

matters of probate, with such other jurisdiction as the Legislature 

y confer in civil cases, and such criminal cases as may be pre- 

scribed by law where the punishment is by fine only, not exceeding 
e hundred dollars. 

_ Mr. ROBBINS moved to amend the section by adding: “‘all 

leadings in said court shall be oral.’’ 

Mr. ROBBINS modified his amendment to read as follows: 

pecial pleadings in the county court in relation to matters of 

obate, and in relation to county business, shall not be required.’’ 


_ jected. 


772 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Messrs. Davis of Montgomery, PETERS, ConsTABLe, | 
and CuurcH opposed the amendment, and Messers. Scat 
PatmeR of Macoupin and Roseins advocated it. 

And the question was taken thereon, and rejected. 

Mr. SHIELDS moved to amend the section by striking o out 
after the word ‘“‘probate,” and insert instead: ‘‘and all coun 
business, with such other business as the Legislature may mea 
which was rejected. . 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to strike out all after the wo 
“‘where,’’ and insert: ““the offence is not capital or punishable | 
imprisonment in the penitentiary;’ and the amendment wa S 


Mr. CALDWELL moved to strike out the words “matt € 
and * ‘with,’ "in the first line, and insert instead of “‘with’’ the v 
“‘and;’” and the same was carried. 


law: * al the motion was rejected. is 
Mr. F ARWELL moved to add to the section; “Provided i 


Mr. CONSTABLE moved to lay the amendment on shes 

On which motion the yeas and nays were ordered, an 
sulted—yeas 117, nays I5. 

Mr. ADAMS moved the previous question. 

Pending which, the Convention adjourned till 3 P. mM. 


AFTERNOON 


On motion, a call of the Convention was ordered, and, aft 
some time, 116 members answered to their names. a 

The demand for the previous question being pending at 
adjournment, it was put and ordered. ” 

The question was then put on the adopniae of the isth sek 
and it was adopted—yeas 79, nays 45. as 
ji Sec. 16. The county judge, with two or more justices of 
peace, to be designated by law, shall hold terms for the transa 
of county business, and shall perform such other duties as € 
General Assembly shall prescribe; Provided, the Legislature 1 r 
require that the two justices, to be chosen as may be provid 
law, shall sit with the county judge in all cases. ‘a 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 14, 1847 773 


£ 


The question being taken thereon by yeas and nays, it was 

decided in the affirmative—yeas 68, nays 61. 

Mr. JONES moved to strike out the words ‘‘or more,’’ in 

first line. 

_ Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery opposed the motion. 

_ Mr. NORTHCOTT expressed himself in favor of the amend- 

nent. 

a The question being taken thereon, it was carried—yeas 71, 

“mays 50. 

__ Mr. SINGLETON moved to amend the section so as to read 

as follows: ‘““The county judges, consisting of the justices of the 

“peace, shall hold terms,’’ &c. 

_ Mr. SINGLETON expressed himself at considerable length in 
opposition to the report of the committee, and the course that had 
been pursued in relation toit. He thought that other members of the 

“Convention had interests at heart, had. the views of their constitu- 

‘ents to be expressed, as well as the immaculate committee of 

"twenty-seven, who had uniformly voted against every proposition, 

and opposed even the consideration of any amendment that had 

been offered to their report. For one he had offered the amend- 

“ments which he considered as carrying out the views of his con- 

‘stituents, though he knew that it was useless to attempt to carry 

them. He and many others who were anxious to present the 

‘sentiments of their constituents had been voted down and cut off 

by the majority, who seemed determined to carry the report 

‘through without time for consideration, or an opportunity to 

a end. He felt certain that so far as he was concerned, his con- 

‘Ss ituents would not adopt the report in this particular, and that 

he would not vote for the constitution with these provisions in 


__ The question was taken on the adoption of Mr. SINGLETON’s 
‘amendment, and it was rejected. 
__ Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved to insert after ‘‘busi- 
aess,”” in the 2d line, the words ‘‘and as many more justices of the 
eace as may be designated by law.’’ 


_viding for the time and manner of submitting the cons 


774 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE "i 
And the question being taken, the amehdetanll was sje 
Mr. BROWN moved to strike out the proviso at the 

the section. The question being taken, resulted yeas ae na 

no quorum voting. 


sbecnded 
The section now stood as follows: 
Sec. 16. The county judge, with two justices. to fie c 
in the same manner as the county judge, shall hold terms fe 
transaction of county business, and shall perform such — 
duties as the General Assembly shall prescribe. ‘ 
The question was taken by yeas and nays on the adopt 
thereof, and it was decided in the affirmative—yeas 80, nays 4 
Mr. WEAD moved to reconsider the vote just taken. 
Mr. MANLY opposed the motion to reconsider, beca se 
gentleman from Fulton had a scheme of uniting the - PIE 
circuit and district courts. ; 
Mr. LOGAN hoped the motion to reconsider ANN pre 
Mr. TURNBULL moved the Convention ba ake 
motion was rejected. 
The question being taken on reconsidering, it was dea 
the negative—yeas 45, nays 63. 
Mr. SCATES (by leave) offered the following reso 
which was adopted: 
Resolved, That a select, committee of one from each 


to be voted upon by the people, and also such Bien: 


the government under its provisions. 
Messrs. ScaTes, SERVANT, Maniy, DuMMeER, Ta 
HENDERSON, STADDEN, ARCHER, and HARPER were appoin 
committee. , 
And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned. 


POCA ed TR ee RE eS ge fw Se here cers 


q 
2 
4 


That—————- thousand copies of the constitution 
as revised and amended, be printed and distributed 


so et 


Sree ee er eee 


d Cross of Woodford. 
SHI » (by leave) from the committee on Finance, 
| report, which was read, laid on the table, and 250 copies 
to be printed. 
. CONSTABLE moved to suspend the rules to enable him 
the following resolution: : 
sol d, That a committee of one from each judicial circuit 
: state be appointed to prepare an address, to be submitted & 
ople of this state in connection with the proposed con- 


sales were suspended, and the resolution was adopted— 

s 80, nays 55. 

Messrs. ConsTAsBLe, Davis of Massac, DALE, MARSHALL 

n, WEAD, CamMpBELL of Jo Daviess, Dawson, KNowLTon, 
|ALLINGALL were appointed the committee. 

-WEAD presented a petition from sundry citizens of 

n county, praying a prohibitory clause in the new consti- : 
1 against banks and banking; which was read. 

-WEAD moved that it be referred to a select committee 


775 | 


776 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Mr. ARMSTRONG asked if there were any such comm 
The PRESIDENT said there was not. , 
Mr. McCALLEN moved its reference to the commit ree | 
Incorporations. 
Mr. WEAD said, that he desired that this petition shou dr 
ceive a respectful hearing, and as the committee on Incorpor: 
had expired, he hoped the subject would be referred to 
mittee favorable to its object, and that a report on the s 
might be had. 
Mr. HARVEY informed the gentleman from Fulton th 
committee on Incorporations had not expired, nor had any n 
ber of it expired.—The committee, however, were as little an3 
to have the subject referred to them as was the gentleman 
Fulton to refer to it. y 
Mr. PALMER of Macoupin hoped the subject would 
referred to the committee on Incorporations. They had re 
their views on the subject, and the Convention had sho 
opinion of that report by rejecting it. The subject now 
up on a petition from certain citizens of Fulton county, and 
should be respectfully heard, and it ought to be referred to : 
committee favorable to its object. ; 
Mr. McCALLEN hoped this question would be refe 
the committee on Incorporations, because that was the 
committee to examine into the matter. He hoped that 
vention would not again be occupied with this exciting 
Already days had been wasted in fruitless endeavors, by its 
to carry it through, and the Convention had over and over 
it down by decisive majorities. He earnestly hoped the b 
of the session would not be disturbed by the subject. 
Mr. CALDWELL said, that he hoped the petition w 
be referred to the committee on Incorporations. That co 
had already reported to the Convention its opinion on the 
and that opinion was adverse to the objects of the petiti 
He said this subject had been before them on former occas 
Pa 

but never fairly. The opponents of a prohibitory clause 
not allow it to be presented in a proper shape; and it would be 
sisted in by its friends till it did have a proper hearing. 
said so before, and said so now, that he would present the : 


MONDAY, AUGUST 16, 71847 TEL 


to the Convention every time an opportunity was afforded.— 
Moreover, he informed gentlemen of all parties that the whole 
_ people of the south and thousands at the north would vote against 
__any constitution which did not allow them in some way to express 
their sentiments of condemnation and opposition against banks. 


_ He hoped the petition would be referred to a select committee, 


_ from whom we can have a report that will present the question in 
a proper shape. 

Mr. NORTHCOTT said, that he was in favor of referring the 
_ subject to a select committee. The gentleman from Fulton had 
a greatdesire to be chairman of a committee, and had been at home, 
among his constituents, for a week or more. During which time 
he had, no doubt, gone to considerable trouble to get up this 
petition, and it would certainly be mortifying to the gentleman, 
after all this, to be denied the satisfaction of a select committee. 

Mr. WEAD rose to address the Convention, when he was 
called to order. 

Mr. W. said, that no member with any proper regard for him- 
_ self, as a member of the Convention, would attribute to him any 

impure or dishonest motives, and then attempt to choke him off 
in his reply. 

Mr. McCALLEN inquired if the gentleman had not spoken 
‘once? If so, why was he allowed. to proceed? He had been 
choked off under the rules several times. 

The PRESIDENT said the gentleman could explain. 

Mr. WEAD said, he only desired to explain. He merely 
wished to say to the member from Menard, that any man who 
attributed to him any motive or conduct in presenting this petition 
other than honorable and patriotic, he was sadly mistaken; and 
_ before any person made any such accusation as had been made by 
_ the member from Menard, he ought to be, at least, prepared to 
prove it. So far as this petition was concerned, he had nothing to 
do with getting it up, and knew nothing of it till it was handed 
to him to present. 

The petition was then referred to the select committee of nine. 

And Messrs. Weap, BosspysHELL, Z. CASEY, WILLIAMS, SMITH 
of Gallatin, Srappen, CampsBe.u of Jo Daviess, Davis of Mont- 
gomery, and Cross of Winnebago were appointed the committee. 


398” ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLL 


‘ may be specified.’’ 


ay, 


The Convention then took up the report of the : 


THE JUDICIARY 


Mr. ROUNTREE offered as an additional section to be 
serted after the 16th section, the following: 

“‘The General Assembly may provide by law, that a 
number of the other justices of the peace of the respective coun 


shall receive no pecuniary compensation for such service, bu 
be exempted from road labor, and such other duties as ‘Bb 


Mr. WITT offered a substitute therefor. — : ahs 

Mr. DAWSON enquired if a motion to reconsider we 
action of the Convention upon the subject of a county co 
would be in order? ‘ 

The PRESIDENT said it could not be done By one vote 
each vote would have to be reconsidered separately. _ 

Mr. MARKLEY reminded the Chair that a vote ‘hiad 
taken on a motion to reconsider the adoption of the sixteen tits ec 
tion, and it was refused. He tae 

The PRESIDENT said, the motion to reconsider was, then e- 
fore out of order. 

Mr. ROUNTREE then withdrew his proposed section. 

Section 17 was read— ae 

“Sec. 17. There shall be elected biennially, in each count? 
clerk of the county court, who shall be ex officio a 
compensation shall be fees.’’ 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved to amend the same by pref 
thereto the following: 

‘“‘The county judge, with such justices of the peace, in 
county, as may be designated by law, shall hold terms fi 
transaction of county business, and shall perform such 
duties as the General Assembly shall prescribe; Pr 
the Legislature may require that two Justices, to be chosen 
the qualified electors of each county, shall sit with the co int 
judge in all cases;’’ and to strike out ‘‘biennially,’’ and in 
‘“quadrennially’’ in lieu thereof. He 


ate wt % 
i pers 


MONDAY, AUGUST 16, 7847 779 


Mr . CONSTABLE advocated his amendment. It contained 


ae DAVIS of Montgomery was in hopes the amendment 
would be adopted. 
Mr. ARMSTRONG opposed the amendment. The Conven- 
on, on Saturday afternoon, by a vote of 80 to 45, had settled the 
bject, and he hoped the little time now left before the adjourn- 
ent would not be consumed in reconsidering questions which had 
en decided by the Convention. 
Mr. EDWARDS of Madison explained his course in relation 
to the subject of the judiciary. He said, that his object and 
m otive in moving the subject of the judiciary be referred to the 
select committee, was owing to the peculiar circumstances of 
ie time, and the great dissatisfaction shown at the action upon the 
bject in the committee of the whole; and in the hope of bringing 
out a compromise that would be acceptable toa majority of the 
Convention. His own views were in favor of the appointment 
of the judiciary by the Governor and Senate. He had compro- 
“mised his own viewsin order to bring about concession and harmony, 
he regretted the statement that the reference of the subject 
. select committee had been the cause of the delay, and the con- 
_ sumption of more than two weeks of the time of the Convention. 
Mr. WHITNEY expressed himself in favor of the amendment, 
i disclaimed any intention to practice demagogueism in sup- 
"porting an amendment that supposed all classes of the people 
“competent to perform the duties of judges. 
_ Mr. SCATES explained, that he had no intention to impute 
unkind motives to the gentleman from Madison when he stated 
that much time had been lost by the reference to the com- 
ttee. Such was, in his opinion, the fact, but he had no intention 


_ Mr. WITT offered a substitute for the amendment; which 
was laid on the table—yeas 73, nays 42. 
__ Mr. AKIN moved the previous question; which was ordered. 
The question was then taken on the adoption of the amend- 


780 | ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC’ 


The question recurring on the adoption of ‘the sec 
amended, 

Mr. HAYES asked for a division, so as to vote upon the 
part of the section separately. 

Mr. CONSTABLE objected, and the call for a oe 
withdrawn. 

The question then recurred on the adoption of ae 17th 
tion, as amended; was taken by yeas and nays, and it was dec 
in the afirmative—yeas 79, nays 55. 

Mr. ARMSTRONG offered as an additional section: 


in one or more tribunals, to consist of such officer or officer 
shall be provided by law.’’ it 

Mr. HARVEY hoped it would be adopted. Under the p 
state of the report, there could be no possible tribunal for bus 
in the county except by this one county court. This court wi 
have civil and criminal jurisdiction, probate and county bu 
No such court was ever heard of before. On one side wor 


tribunal and to be tried by one judge and two justices of ‘het 
This was an experiment and before gentlemen went so far 
reform it would be wise to pause and consider the extent of 
reform. He hoped the amendment would be adopted and 
the Legislature could change the organization of the court if « 
able. 
Mr. CALDWELL replied that the gentleman from Kno 
mistaken in his view of the case. The justices of the peace » 
only to be associated with the county judge in county bu: 
and it gave the Legislature the power to provide that ther 
be two justices elected to sit with him in all cases. f 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, that in respect to the m 
complained of by the gentleman from Knox, the report stooc 
as it did before, when that member was in favor of it. 
Mr. FARWELL thought that there could be no objec 
the plan proposed by the gentleman from LaSalle. The e 
so much difference of opinion here upon the subject of a + 


MONDAY, AUGUST 76, 1847 781 


that it was impossible for us to frame any system that would be 
f satisfactory to the people.—He thought it best to leave the sub- 
" ject to the Legislature to provide such courts, as the people de- 
sired. 
__ Mr. CONSTABLE opposed the proposition of the gentleman 
a. LaSalle, it was nothing more than throwing open the doors 
of the Legislature to change and increase the number of tribunals 
_ in the counties. This was one evil which the constitutional pro- 
_ vision was intended to prevent; and one which the people de- 
manded of us. The present system was a very bad one, and why 
_ did not the Legislature change it—they have the power? 
¥ Mr. DAVIS of McLean opposed the section of the gentleman 
from LaSalle, and explained the county court as it now stood 
_ organized by this report. 
_ Mr. WEST offered the following as a substitute for the pro- 
_ posed section: 
_ “That in all cases, where the population in a county according 
to the census of the county as last taken, shall exceed 10,000 in- 
_ habitants, the office of recorder shall be a separate and distinct 
-_office.”’ 
Mr. HARVEY was in favor of the substitute as a separate 
section, because it would defeat the amendment of the gentleman 
_ from LaSalle. He had never misstated the county court as it 
_ presented itself at present under the report. The system pro- 
_ posed was a transcript of the New York constitution, and he 
feared we were getting more of that constitution in our own than 
- would be acceptable to the people of Illinois. The county court 
_ now was this: that, as had been said, the best lawyer in the county 
_ was to be county judge. That he was to have jurisdiction over 
all probate matters, all county matters, all criminal matters, and 
_ some civil matters. Was any such court ever heard of before? It 
_ was true that in county matters he was to have the assistance of 
4 two justices of the peace, and also, in probate matters, he was to 
_ be aided by two justices of the peace, to be chosen—no one knows 
how. But the grand feature was, that he might, upon general 
subjects, have the aid and assistance of fifty justices of the peace. 


if the “‘best lawyer in the county’’ was to be enlightened by the 


782 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO 


a gee Ue 
aid and consultation of fifty justices of the peace, he « 
see how it was to be done. This last feature was not, h 
taken from the constitution of the state of New York, but 
apparently the intention to make a constitution for the fia 
Illinois, made up by patches and shreds taken from other con 
tutions. There seemed to be a sort of hydrophobia fe ong 


superior in intellect or virtue to any body ae wrod hie 
assembled in this state, and those who were in favor of this. co 
court system, as proposed by the committee, ought to be Se 
with having it fixed in the constitution, and in case it was | 
to work badly, let them leave with the Legislature the po 
change it to another. They ought to be satisfied with | 
the honor to be styled the fathers of this system, in case it 
well; but if it was found to be unsatisfactory, they eeu 
the Lesigtacire power to change it. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean replied to the gentleman from 1 
by reminding him that in the circuit court, to which an 
could be taken from the county commissioners’ court, th 
often tried a case of probate, of a road, a criminal case, a cij 
and a bill in chancery, all in one day, and all his ridicule 
tainly not more applicable to the county court than to the pre : 
circuit court. The gentleman need not have gone farth r th 
the circuit court, in Knox county, to have known this. Gi 

r. WEAD opposed, at much length, the whole report of th 
majority of the select committee, and particularly the cot 
court system. ; ay 
Mr. LOGAN replied and defended the committee. __ 
Mr. HURLBUT rose, but gave way to a motion to adjo 
And the convention adjourned till 2 p. m. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. HURLBUT replied to the member from Fulton, a 
fended the majority of the select committee. 


WEsT, aaa would vote for it as a separate section, but ith 
offered as a substitute for his own amendment, which he 


ote Me Seer te ee eee ee Ae eee | OY Al Oe 
agen j eae k ‘ 4 J 


MONDAY, AUGUST 16, 1847 783 


importance. He considered that the matter should be 


an insult to the intelligence of the people, to pretend that 
e would be no men ever chosen to the Legislature hereafter, 


or - of their midnight proceedings. He would merely say 
2 was not a member of the committee, and he was glad he 
as not, for he would be very unwilling to have this report, so far 
it relates to the county court system, go forth as a production 
Mr. A. then pointed out the defects in the system which 
thought would not be acceptable to the people. 

ee WILLIAMS replied to the several gentlemen who had 


. POWERS offered the suneaets proposed by Mr. West 
tc so as to read 12,000 inhabitants) as an additional sec- 


t ‘“8,000.”” 
And the question was taken on striking out, and resulted— 
60, nays 46. No quorum voting. 


: a ‘MARSHALL of Coles moved to jeer ae 
_ Mr. SMITH ‘of Macon proposed 1,000. 
| Mr. JENKINS proposed 3,000. 


ti 


“~ 


43, nays 89. a 
Mr. WITT proposed 5,000. ' 
The question was taken on filling the blank ih 1 dotll 

jected. 

On filling the blank with 10,o0o—48 yeas. Lost. fie 
Mr. THORNTON proposed 14,000—54 yeas, 68 nays. tm 
Mr. McCALLEN proposed 999932 yeas. Lost.’: an 
Mr. MARSHALL moved the previous question—which h we 
seconded. Ra 
The question was put on inserting 9,000, and rejected. 
On inserting 8,000—yeas 64, nays 70. Lost. 
On inserting 5,000, the yeas and nays were ordered and d 

cided in the negative—yeas 61, nays 79. 

The question was | put on 3,000 ae rejected. 


a 
SS 
RY 


sulted—yeas 45, nays on a, 
So the convention refused to insert any number in the b ble 
The question was taken on the adoption of the sectiol ar 

was rejected—yeas 32. BC a 
Mr. LOGAN offered as an additional section» 
“‘The Legislature may by law make the clerk of the « 

court, ex-officio, recorder, in lieu of the county clerk.’’ 
Mr. ARMSTRONG offered the following to be added the 
‘‘Provided, that in any county, where the inhabitants : 

exceed 4,000, the office of recorder shall be elective by ite quz 
voters of said county.”’ 
Mr. HARVEY supported the proviso, and peeked wit 
severity to the remarks of the gentleman from Adams—de 
earlier in the afternoon. 
Mr. WOODSON moved the previous question, wh 
seconded. 
The question was taken by yeas and nays on the! provi 

it was rejected—yeas 50, nays. 85. 

And then the question was taken on the section as P 
by Mr. Locan, by yeas and nays, and the same was carrie ‘ 


77> nays 55. 


MONDAY, AUGUST 16, 1847 86 


__ Mr. DAWSON offered an additional section. 
__ Mr. SCATES offered as a substitute therefor, the following: 
_ “The legislature shall fix a fee bill for the several officers of this 
‘state, whose compensation shall consist of fees for services ren- 
dered, and the several county courts shall have power to reduce 
the rates of fees accruing to any officer in the county, by a certain 
per cent., when, in their opinion, such fees yield more than ade- 
quate pay for the services rendered;’’ upon which the yeas and 
mays were ordered; and the same was rejected—yeas 45, nays 80. 
_ The question recurred upon Mr. Dawson’s proposed additional 
section, and it was rejected—yeas 14, nays 104. 
Mr. HURLBUT offered the following as an additional section: 
: “The legislature may pass a general law authorizing township 
organization, in all counties in which a majority of the legal 
voters may at any general election vote for such township organ- 
ization; and when such township organization shall be established 
‘in any county, then the county court hereinbefore provided shall 
cease to transact county business in such county.’ 

And the question being taken thereon, it was adopted—yeas 
92, nays not counted. 

_ Sec. 18. The general assembly shall provide for the com- 
pensation of the county judge. 

Mr. MARKLEY offered a substitute for the section, which 
was rejected; he then moved it be added to the section, and it was 
‘rejected. 

_ The section was then adopted. 

_ Sec. 19. There shall be elected in each county in this state, 
by the qualified electors thereof, a competent number of justices 
of the peace, who shall hold their office for the term of four years, 
‘and until their successors shall be elected and qualified, and who 
shall perform such duties, receive such compensation, and exercise 
such jurisdiction (not exceeding one hundred dollars) as may be 
hed by law. 

_ Mr. CROSS of Winnebago moved to: strike out the words 
aes: exceeding one hundred dollars.”’ 

Mr. KINNEY of Bureau and Mr. WHITNEY advocated the 
amendment. The latter gentleman said that there was not a man 
1 his county, but was in favor of extending the jurisdiction of the 


than one hundred dollars, and he fle hee : ee nim 
structed by his constituents to vote for the a endment 
a subject of universal corns Be and he felt 


to carry it out. 


structed their representatives to vote fot ik Ths 
but he had never heard of it. 


a. Mm. 
Mr. KNOWLTON proposed 6 a. m. 
Mr. CONSTABLE proposed § a. m. 
Mr. AKIN proposed 7 p. m. to-day. 


Paebit: Laid on the table. 
DERSON presented a petition from sundry citizens 


SBYSHELL presented a petition from sundry citizens 
‘county, praying that a residence of six months in a 
7 sl all be required before voting; and moved to lay it on the 


pi was lost, and the petition was referred to the com- 

| Elections. 

3ALLINGALL said, that he had heard his name an- 
as a member of the committee to draft an address to the 

¢ 1 the new constitution, and asked to be excused from 

g on that committee, because he did not, even by implica- 

ire to be considered as favoring the new constitution, so 


t had been adopted. 


THE JUDICIARY 


SCATES replied to Mr. Wuitney on the expediency of 
troying all the technicalities of the practice of the law. He 
ed with the gentleman, and in the spirit of the report of the 
Reform committee, would go farther, and would reform the 
e and technicalities of the medical profession. He cited 
al medical cases coming under his personal observation, 
technicalities were discarded by the medical attendants, 
the cases resulted happily—one of the patients dying. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said that he regretted much the course which 
debate had taken. The character of the Convention would 
nly elevated by the speech of the gentleman from Boone, 


787 


ee AA SE Pee on ae eee it ee pats ae 


o> weg 2a aed 


788 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


which was a most successful effort of Buncombe and nonsense, if 
the standard of character adopted by the gentleman was con- 
sidered a true one. The speech of the gentleman from Jefferson 
this morning, so far as decency and propriety were concerned, was 
in keeping with the other. 

Mr. C. opposed the amendment proposed. He considered 
that the jurisdiction of a justice of the peace over the sum of 
one hundred dollars was high enough, but in anyway he desired 
to have the jurisdiction fixed in the constitution, and the subject 
not left open to legislation. At the last Legislature over twenty 
thousand dollars was expended in time wasted by that body in 
legislating upon the subject of extending the jurisdiction of justices 
of the peace from the sum of one hundred to two hundred dollars. — 

Mr. WITT moved to amend the motion to strike out by adding 
to it—to insert “‘three hundred dollars.’’ 

Mr. DALE said, that he was in favor of the amendment to 
strike out the clause, which limited the jurisdiction of justices of 
the peace to one hundred dollars, not that he wished the Con- 
vention to increase the justices jurisdiction, but that he wished — 
the jurisdiction to be left open for the Legislature to increase or 
diminish hereafter, as occasion might require. 

This Convention had pursued a course, in relation to the 
judiciary, different from that to be found in the constitutions of 
most of the states. Instead of establishing by the constitution 
the higher tribunals only, and leaving to the Legislature the estab- 
lishing of inferior courts, as occasion and circumstances might call 
for them, this convention had established and determined every 
court that should exist in the state. Therefore appeared the — 
necessity of leaving some latitude to the Legislature to fix the ~ 
powers of these courts, and to alter those powers as the exigencies _ 
of the state might require. This latitude should particularly be — 
left in the case of justices; for from indications their courts were — 
growing in favor with the people, at the last session of the — 
Legislature a majority in the popular branch having cast their 
votes to enlarge the jurisdiction of justices. In some respects the 
justices’ court has advantages over all other courts. It is a court — 
always open. It is a court in which justice is administered with ~ 
less cost to suitors than in any other, and this is a consideration of — 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 17, 1847 789 


some importance. He differed widely from the gentleman from 
Wabash who had no sympathy for suitors. He had. For he 
bore in mind how often men were drawn into court against their 
wills, and when thus forced to defend themselves, he wished them 
to have the power to do it without being ruined by the expenses 
attendant on it. As to this matter of expense, the difference was 
marked between these two courts, the circuit and justices’. In 
the circuit court every cause must await its turn. The time when 
a case may be reached is uncertain. Suitors with a train of wit- 
nesses are, on that account, frequently kept for an entire week in 
anxious attendance, at much expense, and at great waste of time. 
In the justices’ court, on the contrary, the day and hour of trial 
is fixed, and at the time fixed the case is taken up, and, unless for 
cause is disposed of without delay or loss of time. In the 
justices’ court the merits of a case are developed and justice 
attained with as much and oftentimes more certainty than in the 
circuit court. The justice may determine the case or parties 
may have arbitrators or jurors as in the circuit court. In the 
circuit court, a case being entered upon, must be disposed of, there 
is no continuance allowed and if a suitor has neglected or omitted 
a link in the chain of his evidence he may suffer gross injustice and 
damage, whilst in the justices’ court, the justice, anxious to attain 
the merits of a case, will continue the cause, after entered into, till 
each party shall have furnished all his evidence and the case be 
fully and fairly presented. And thus more exact justice may be 
done in this court, though not done according to strict legal rules. 

If the justices’ court possess these advantages over other 
courts, the Convention should hesitate before [so] limiting its 
jurisdiction that it could not be extended in the future if necessary. 
There were cases over which its jurisdiction might safely now be 
extended. If neighbors have difficulties in their settlements in- 
volving the matter of several hundred dollars, and agree, in writ- 
ing, to refer the matter to a justice, there was no just cause why 
the justice should not determine it, enter up the judgment and, 
if necessary, by fixing a transcript, make it the judgment of the 
circuit court. So if a debter is willing to acknowledge in writing 
before a justice a judgment to his creditor for a like amount, he 
could see no reason why he should not have the power so to do, and 


ce et gh iy 


790 + ~*ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC’ 


in the circuit court, and what was of equal or more. e impor 
the delay be avoided which might be of some five, six, or seven 
months till the holding of a term of the circuit court. Aa 


bers exhibited. He believed that, as a general matted uk 
reflected the will of their constituents, and if the defining of 
powers of justices were entrusted to them there would be little 
fear of its abuse. So long accustomed to see this a court of lin 
ited jurisdiction they would be slow to extend its powers. : 
would extend them only when it was found preferable to ot 
existing systems, and when, on that account, the extension fo) 
jurisdiction was demanded by the people. 

Mr. WHITNEY replied to Mr. Scates, and amen over 
same medical cases cited by that gentleman. He repea € 
his views as expressed yesterday, in support of the motion, | 
urged that he was unanimously instructed to do so. 

Mr. HAYES said, he agreed with the gentleman from Wab: 
that the jurisdiction now was large enough, but would vot 
any sum to be fixed permanently in the constitution, to prev 
future legislation. He repelled the indirect sneering thrown w 
the report of the committee on Law Reform, by the member fi 
Jefferson. He informed that gentleman that the reforms | 
tained in the report of that committee had received the supp 
and sanction of the ablest j jurists of the country. He challer 


session been a source of much delay and loss of time vat 
ing applications for its extension. He thought one hh 
dollars sufficient. He could see no benefit to the people in 
larging it; litigation would be increased, and persons hi 


greater than if the suit was originally entered in the circuit ‘ts 
He pointed out several instances where large sums based u 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 17, 1847 791 


good and legal grounds were lost to poor men, in consequence of 
the ignorance and mistakes of justices of the peace. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, he was opposed to strik- 
ing out, and opposed to inserting three hundred dollars, and would 
be in favor of reducing the jurisdiction of justices of the peace to 
fifty dollars. He agreed with the gentleman from Wabash, and 
it would strike any man who had been an observer of the proceed- 
ings of the last Legislature, that this subject should not be left 
open to legislation, to be called up at any time by some member 
elected exclusively upon this question. How many days did you 
sit here at the last session of the Legislature listening to a pro- 
tracted debate upon the question of extending the jurisdiction of 
justices of the peace? And, after all, the subject was left as it was 
before. This would always be the case. He did not agree with 
the gentleman that it would be economical to the people to raise 
the jurisdiction of the justices. What man who had a claim of 
two or three hundred dollars and who was defeated in a lower 
court, and was informed by a lawyer, that the decision would be 
reversed, would not take an appeal to a higher court? Litigation 
would be increased by an enlargement of the jurisdiction of jus- 
tices of the peace. Appeals would multiply, and lawyers’ fees and 
business would increase. He could see no advantage to the 
people by increasing the jursidiction, but he saw that the lower it 
was reduced the cheaper it would be to the people. For then 
they would institute suits which were of any importance in the 
circuit court, and they would be tried by judges in whose com- 
petency and judgment the people had confidence, and with whose 
decision they would rest satisfied. He thought this was so evident 
that every man could see it. As to the lawyers, there was not one 
whose business and profits would not be increased by the extension 
of the jurisdiction of the justices. Cases would increase, appeals 
multiply, and consequently their fees would be more numerous. 

As to the debate going on at the other end of the hall he had 
nothing to say, except that he was opposed to destroying the 
technicalities of the law; he was opposed to striking down the great 
fabric of the common law, which has been the pride and glory of 
the world for ages. He was opposed to striking away the foun- 
dation of human liberty—the great and glorious common law—for 


391 ~‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO. 


when once shaken, once disturbed, the fabric will fall. He 
no desire to prejudice the report of the committee on Law Reform. — 
When that subject should come properly before them he, perha 
would say something about it; the report was creditable to 
author, as it would be creditable to any one, but he did not think 4 
_ the reform was proper. It was much easier to destroy than ag 
build up, and in this question it would be found true. be 
Mr. KNAPP of Jersey replied to Mr. Scates, and defended 
the medical faculty, alluding severely to the nature and character 
of that gentleman’s remarks. 4 E 
Mr. SCATES disclaimed any intention ' attack the medical 
profession. 
Mr. KNAPP asked him to request the reset not to Santislel 
certain portions of his speech. a 
Mr. SCATES said, he would not do so; every ‘thing he had 
said had been matter of evidence in a court of justice, and he ¥ 
would take none of it back. He would also state that there was — 
no fear of his speeches being published; the reporters never re- 
ported him. He had made no arrangements with them for that — 
purpose. i Coa 
The question was then taken on striking out “‘one mete 
and decided in the affirmative—yeas 79, nays 65. ‘ 4 
The question was then taken on inserting ‘‘three hundred, ie 
and rejected—yeas 51, nays 57. 4 
Mr. DAVIS of Massac moved to insert ‘‘two undeedst on, x 
which the yeas and nays were ordered, and ress 11s , 
nays 73. a 
Mr. GREEN of Tazewell proposed ‘‘$50.’’ 
Mr. DAVIS of McLean proposed “‘$150.”’ 
Mr. DEITZ proposed ‘“$400.’’ Lost. 
The question was taken by yeas and nays on inserting ‘ “$1 150)" 
and decided in the negative. 
Mr. ROBBINS proposed ‘““$500.’’ Withdrawn. 
Mr. BOSBYSHELL proposed ‘‘$110.’’ “a 
Mr. BROCKMAN moved to reconsider the vote ae out 
‘fone hundred;’’ and the Convention refused to reconsider—yeas 
55, nays 81. 3 


——s) ; ’ ° 
x x te 
of 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 17, 1847 793 


The question was then taken on inserting ‘‘$50”’ and ‘‘$100,”’ 
and they were rejected. 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved to reconsider the vote rejecting 
““$200;’’ and the Convention refused to reconsider. 

The question recurred on striking out the words “‘not exceed- 
ing hundred dollars;’’ the yeas and nays were ordered 
thereon, and resulted—yeas 103, nays 29. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved to insert after the word 
““state,” in the first line, the words, “‘in such districts as the 
Legislature may direct;’’ upon which motion the yeas and nays 
were ordered, and resulted—yeas 123, nays 7. 

Mr. WOODSON moved to strike out the section, and offered 
a substitute, but subsequently withdrew it. 

Mr. GRAHAM offered a substitute for the section as amended, 
and it was rejected. The section was then adopted. 

Src. 20. There shall be elected, by the qualified electors of 
this state, one attorney general, who shall hold his office for the 
term of four years, and until his successor shall be commissioned 
and qualified. He shall perform such duties and receive such 
compensation as may be prescribed by law. 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved to strike out the section. The 
office, said he, under the judicial system adopted by the Conven- 
tion, was unnecessary. Under that system the circuit attorney 
for the state in that district where the seat of government may 
be, can be appointed the constitutional adviser of the Governor, 
and the state’s prosecuting attorneys in the several circuits might 
be required, by the Legislature, to follow their cases up to the 
supreme court in their districts. 

The question being taken, the section was stricken out. 

Sec. 21. There shall be elected in each of the judicial circuits 
of this state, by the qualified electors thereof, one prosecuting 
attorney, who shall hold his office for the term of four years, and 
until his successor shall be commissioned and qualified, who shall 
perform such duties and receive such compensation as may be 
prescribed by law. 

Mr. ARCHER moved to add thereto: “Provided, that the 
Legislature may hereafter provide by law for the election, by the 
qualified voters of each county in this state, of one prosecuting 


ney ate RES? BS: 


494 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO , 


attorney for each county, in lieu of the circuit attonnene rc 
for in this section. The term of office, duties and com 
of which county attorneys shall be regulated by law.”” 


of the people i in each county, and they are meals acs ; 
at the examining courts. There, when a man is arrested on " 
any criminal charge, there is no person near to attend to the 
interests of the people. In case the criminal is called upon 
enter into recognizance, there is no one there to represent t 
people, and secure sufficient bail to require his appearance a 
court, and thus many criminals were suffered to iy 6 iy . 
mere want of such an officer. . 

On motion, the Convention adjourned till 3 p.m. 


“AFTERNOON 


prdered. When a quorum appeared, 

Mr. JACKSON moved a suspension of the rules, to enable 
to offer a resolution; which motion was withdrawn. i 

The question pending at the adjournment was on the amen 
ment offered by Mr. ARcHER. R 

Mr. PRATT said, that every one, he thought, should see t 
necessity of a prosecuting attorney in each county of the state 
and that the salary for the office should be sufficient to command 
the best talent. The salary of three or four hundred dollars f 
circuit attorney, for a man who is to travel around the circuit, 
absent from home for some time, and attend to the’ business of 
state, has not been a sufficient remuneration. And all will admi 
the truth of the fact, that the men of talent who have taken - n 
office of circuit attorney in the state, have done so, not so muc. 
for the salary or the service to the people, but for the purp 
making it a stepping stone to higher offices—to judgeships, 
Congress. This, sir, has been the fact, at least it has in the coun 


prosecuting attorney. The circuit attorneys cannot have 
necessary acquaintance with the people, their morals, the stat 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 17, 1847 795 


society, and the character of the parties concerned in the case. 
In many cases a nolle prosequi had been entered where, if the pros- 
ecutor had been acquainted with the circumstances, with the 
prosecuted, and the witnesses, this course would have been resisted, 
and criminals would have been brought to justice. When crim- 
inals were arrested they were generally carried before the examin- 
ing court, where the feelings of the people, and the witnesses and 
friends of the party were all in favor of the accused, and there was 
no party present to attend to the interests of the people—to bring 
the party to trial. 

Mr. PALMER of Marshall opposed the amendment. A 
county attorney would have too much sympathy for the people 
in the county, to become an efficient officer. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean thought that a circuit attorney—a 
talented one—would be much better than county attorneys. 

Mr. BROCKMAN was in favor of the amendment. In his 
portion of the country, of late, the district attorneys did not, it 
seemed, think it worth their time to come there, and the court 
generally selected some of the lawyers to act. If this was to be 
the case, the people may as well have the privilege of electing one. 

The question being taken by yeas and nays on the amendment, 
it was adopted—yeas 77, nays 61. 

Mr. THOMAS opposed the section as amended, and hoped 
it would not be adopted. 

Mr. ARCHER replied, and urged, again, the necessity that 
would arise hereafter, in consequence of the great increase of popu- 
lation and business, for these county prosecutors. 

Mr. KNOWLTON opposed the section. He was in favor of 
the circuit attorneys. It may have been the case that no good 
ones had ever been appointed to the Jo Daviess circuit, but such 
was not generally the fact. They had had very competent men 
in his circuit. He considered that none, but young practitioners, 
or old ones, not qualified either by education or talent to know 
their profession, could be induced to take the office of county pros- 
ecutor at the salary of one hundred dollars; and-in such case the 
state would never be able to convict, particularly with the talent 
of the bar in the defence. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, he had examined the section, 


was only giving the Legislature power to meet the wants of the 
people. He had never known any very distinguished talent filling 
the office of circuit attorney, none but what as good would be 
found for the office of county prosecutor. The office was gener- 
ally taken by young men who desired to become acquainted with | il 
the people, and get into practice; as soon as this was accomplished — * 
they gave way to others. He thought he saw many benefits aris- “q 
ing from this office. His own county would have saved money if ‘ 
she had had such an officer to attend to her business, and attend 
to have good and sufficient sureties on bonds given by her officers. 
This was the case in many other counties, and he hoped the section f 
would be adopted. 7 

Mr. SERVANT offered an amendment, that the salen of the ; 4 
officer should be fees, to be collected from the convicts, and in no . 
case to exceed five dollars. ay 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess was opposed to the section, 
and opposed, particularly, to the amendment of the gentleman 
from Randolph. He was opposed to fixing the prosecuting attor. 
ney’s pay in fees. He would as soon think of making the judge’s 
salary to be collected in fees. What would it produce? Why — 
these prosecuting attorneys would go mousing about the 
county or cities—particularly in the cities—and he would ferre 
out every petty violation of the criminal code; he would make ‘up 9 
a case, hunt up some witnesses, carry them before the grand jury, — 
and the party would be indicted. The criminal would employ a — 
lawyer to defend him, pay him fifteen or twenty dollars, and t 
case would come into court, and then the party would compromise : 
the case by paying the attorney his fee. This would be anything 
but creditable. He was in favor of a circuit attorney, to be paid 
a liberal salary; such a one as would command the best talent 
the circuit. If an attorney was chosen in each county, no lawyer, 
except one just commencing business, or one whom the people 
would not entrust their business with, would be induced to take 
the office. No lawyer, for the pitiful sum of one hundred dollars 


= a 
‘ 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 17, 1847 797 


a year, would give up the practice of defending accused persons, 
whereby, if he had any talent, he could make a living. It would 
be opening the door to corrupt practices on his part, for he cannot 
otherwise make a living. It was not true that in the Jo Daviess 
circuit they never had competent circuit state attorneys. They 
had many eminent men there who had held the office—one of them 
was now the Lieutenant Governor of the state, another was, at 
present, the representative of the district in Congress, and another 
was clerk of the canal board, at a salary of $1,000. And com- 
petent men could still be found to take the office. 

Mr. WITT moved the previous question; which was seconded. 

The question was then taken on the amendment of Mr. SER- 
VANT, and it was rejected. 

The question recurred on the adoption of the section, as 
amended, and [was] decided, by yeas and nays, in the afirmative— 
yeas 88, nays 49. 

Sec. 22. The qualified electors of each county in this state 
shall elect a clerk of the circuit court, who shall hold his office for 
the term of four years, and until his successor shall be commis- 
sioned and qualified, who shall perform such duties and receive 
such compensation as may be prescribed by law. The clerk of 
the circuit court in the county where the supreme court shall sit, 
shall be clerk of the supreme court. 

Mr. THOMAS moved to strike out all after ‘‘law.”’ 

The question was taken thereon, and decided in the affirma- 
tive—yeas 57, nays 56. 

Mr. THORNTON moved to strike out ‘‘commissioned’’ and 
insert ““elected;’’ carried. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to reconsider the vote striking out all 
after the word “‘law’’ and the motion was rejected. 

Mr. THOMAS moved to add to the section: 

““Provided, that no person shall be eligible to the office of clerk 
of any circuit court who shall not have obtained a certificate from 
the supreme court, stating that he is qualified to perform the 
duties of his office.”’ 

Mr. AKIN moved to lay the amendment on the table; carried— 
yeas 75, nays not counted. 


Mr. WHITESIDE offered the noe to be adc d 


section: 


pensation shall be provided by law.’’ 
The question being taken thereon, it was adopt yeas 6% 
nays 43. 
The question Secures on the adoption of the section, as 
amended, and it was adopted. 
Mr. MARSHALL of Mason moved the following as additional 
sections, and they were adopted. ow 
‘*All judges, clerks, justices of the peace, and prosecutin a, 
attorneys shall be commissioned by the Governor.’’ + 
“All process, writs, and other proceedings, shall run in the ‘ 
name of: “‘The people of the state of Illinois.’’ All prosecution: 
shall be carried on: ‘‘In the name and by the authority of the peop 
of the state of Illinois,’ and conclude: “‘against the peace and dig: 
nity of the same.’ 4 
Mr. MARKLEY offered an additional section, providing for 
the election of the judges by general ticket, and that such sectio 
and section 3, (the district system,) shall be submitted to th 
people for a separate vote; the one receiving the greater vote t 
become a part of the constitution. 
Mr. NORTHCOTT moved to lay it on the table; which mot 
by yeas and nays was decided in the affirmative—yeas 72, nays 57. 
Mr. PRATT offered an additional section, which was Lor are, 
as follows: Ans 
‘The Legislature may authorize the judgments, decrees can 
decisions of any local, inferior, court of record, of original, civil o 
criminal jurisdiction, established in a city, to be removed for 
view directly into the supreme court.’ 
Mr. THORNTON moved to reconsider the vote by which 1 
6th section was adopted. Carried—yeas 60, nays 53. 
Mr. LOGAN moved to reconsider the vote ordering the pre 
vious question thereon; and it was reconsidered. 
Mr. THORNTON oven to strike out all of the section, s so as 
to have it read thus: ‘“The supreme court shall hold one term 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 17, 1847 799 


annually in each of the aforesaid grand divisions, at such time and 


place, in such divisions, as the General Assembly shall by law 
direct.”” 

On which motion the yeas and nays were ordered, and re- 
sulted—yeas 89, nays 48. 

Mr. MARKLEY offered a proviso: ‘‘that after 1855 the Legis- 
lature may direct, by law, that said court shall be held in each 
judicial circuit.’” 

The question was taken thereon, by yeas and nays, and decided 
in the negative—yeas 40, nays 86. 

‘The Convention then adjourned till to-morrow at 8 o'clock. 


5 , Ny Sat ve 


LVIII. WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 18, 1847 


Mr. CHURCHILL, from the special committee on Agricul- 
ture, &c., presented two reports—a majority and minority report; _ 
which were laid on the table and ordered to be printed. 
Mr. KNAPP of Scott, from the committee on Law Refor: 
made a report; which was laid on the table and ordered to be 
printed. , 4 


THE JUDICIARY 


Mr. HARVEY offered the following, to be ak to the 6 
section: 
““Provided, that after the year 1850, the General Aaa 
may provide by law that a term of the supreme court shall be he 
in one or more places in any of the said grand divisions, if in th 
opinion the public good requires it.’ ‘ 
The yeas and nays were ordered thereon, and pesultad oa 
55, nays 77. . 
Sec. 7. The state shall be divided into twelve jade d 
tricts, in each of which one circuit judge shall be elected by 
qualified electors thereof, who shall hold his office for the te: 
of six years, and until his successor shall be commissioned a 
qualified; Provided, that the Legislature may increase the nui 
ber of circuits to meet the future exigencies of the state. 
Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to strike out ““twelve’’ wo 
districts, and insert ‘‘nine.’ - a 
Mr. WHITNEY said, that he was in favor of reducing it to nin 
circuits, because he had given the subject of the judiciary and t 
action of the Convention upon it considerable attention. ‘ile h 


800 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 18, 7847 801 


amounted to $40,000. Then came the justices of the peace for each 


_ county—one to be chosen from each precinct—say eight in 


7 


each county—to whom he allowed $1.50, half the price of that 
allowed at present to the county commissioners’ court—and say 
they sit one hundred days in the year, and their pay would amount 
to over $19,000 per annum. Add to this the fees for the probate 
business, which were not included.—Whole cost, including the pay 
of the supreme and circuit judges, and it amounted to the enor- 
mous sum of $75,000 a year, to be paid by the people for one 
branch of the government. The only credits to go to this account, 
the only reductions from the cost of the present system were— 
$300 on the salary of each of the supreme judges, making $2,700 
and the cost of the county commissioners’ court, of $2,400; mak- 
ing the sum of $5,100—leaving an increase in the cost of our new 
system over that at present in force of $70,300, a sum which he 
thought should be sufficient to pay the whole expenses of the gov- 
ernment of the state. The people looked at this matter, and 
would consider it long before they would vote for its adoption. 
He hoped the number would be reduced, and that the cost of the 
judiciary may be reduced. He did not desire to leave here with 
any prejudice against the new constitution, but these matters 
were well calculated to make a man pause before he gave his sanc- 
tion to any such system, requiring such a great amount of taxation 
to support it. 

Mr. SCATES asked a division of the question, so as to vote 
first on striking out. He made some remarks to show that the 
question should be divided; after which, the Convention refused 
to divide the question. 

The question was then taken on the amendment, and it was 
carried. 

The section was then adopted. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean moved to reconsider the vote, but sub- 
sequently withdrew the same. 

Sections 8 and 9 were adopted, as follows: 

Sec. 8. There shall be two or more terms of the circuit court 
held annually in each county of this state at such times as shall 
be provided by law, and said courts shall have jurisdiction in all 


Sane 


and insert ‘“$1,500.’’ The question was taken by yeas < 


802 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL C COLLECT! 0. 


cases at law and equity, and in all cases of ae 
ferior courts. 
Sec. 9. All vacancies in the supreme and circuit. 
be filled by election as aforesaid; Provided, however, ' 
unexpired term does not exceed one year, such vacancy 
filled by executive appointment. ch RRS as 
Section Io was taken up— Sa iae 
Src. 10. The judges of the supreme court shall eC 
salary of twelve hundred dollars per annum, payable 
and no more. The judges of the circuit courts shall - te 
salary of one thousand dollars, payable quarterly, and no 
The judges of the supreme and circuit courts shall not h 
other office or public trust in this state, nor the United 
during the term for which they are elected, nor for one year t 
after. All votes for either of them for any elective office (e 
that of judge of the supreme or circuit court) given C 
eral Assembly, or the people, shall be void. “ral 
Mr. SCATES offered an amendment; which was reje 
Mr. EDWARDS of Madison moved to strike out “ 


and decided in the negative—yeas 44, nays 104. 
Mr. HOGUE moved to strike out ‘‘$1, 200” and 
*‘$1,000.’ 7 a 
Mr. SIBLEY moved to strike out “gng0o nd ‘ 
“$1,400.” ma 
The question was taken and rejected. The question ° 
taken by yeas and nays on the motion of Mr. Epa ‘a 
rejected—yeas 50, nays 86. i 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved to strike | 
the words ‘‘no more,’’ where they occur the second ti 
In making the motion, Mr. C. said, that he would 
reasons for the motion in a few words.—He would not ha 
the motion had anything like an adequate salary been all 
judges of the supreme and circuit courts. But inasmuch 
had allowed them merely enough to live upon, he consid 
unjust to cut them off from holding any other office wh 
ambition might desire, or the people should feel disposed 
them to. He could see no reason why they should be 


3 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 18, 1847 803 


political preferment because they were judges of the state, and 
had the miserable salary we have allowed them. This was digging 
deep the grave of every man who would take the office and who 
had any aspirations to higher posts, or whom the people might 
desire to elevate, and that, too, without allowing him sufficient 
salary to pay for a decent grave after death. He doubted much 
the constitutionality of the provision, and was of opinion that it 
would be inoperative—a dead letter—The Senate of the United 
States would never inquire into the constitution of the state of 
Illinois, when called upon to appoint a man to any office; nor 
would either house of Congress ever ask a man who [had]come 
there with a certificate of his election, whether the constitution 
of his state allowed its judges to be chosen to any other office. 
The only question asked him would be, was he eligible, under the 
constitution of the United States? And if he were, then any pro- 
vision in the constitution of the state to the contrary would be 
disregarded. He opposed this part of the section on these grounds, 
and hoped it would be stricken out. He viewed it as forever 
denying men of mind or talent, of reputation and ability, the office 
of judge; for no man would ever take the office if every other door 
to honor and preferment was to be closed to him in consequence. 
He considered this provision in the constitution as forever exclud- 
ing from the bench in this state talent, and securing stupidity. 

Mr. CONSTABLE said, he agreed with the gentleman from 
Jo Daviess that this provision was of but ‘little use, and that it 
would never be operative, but still he would vote against striking 
out. 

The question was taken by yeas and nays on the motion to 
strike out, and decided in the negative—yeas 25, nays 110. 

Mr. WEST moved to strike out ““$1,000,’’ and insert ““$1,200.”’ 

Mr. PALMER of Marshall moved to strike out ‘‘$1,000’” and 
insert ‘“$800.’’ 

The motions were both rejected, by yeas and nays. The first 
vote standing—yeas 36, nays 101; the !atter—yeas 50, nays 86. 

Mr. SINGLETON offered an amendment; (which we did not 
hear) and it was rejected. 

The previous question was ordered and the section was adopted. 

Sec. 11. No person shall be eligible to the office of judge of 


804 


any court of this state who is not a citizen of the Unit 
and who shall not have resided in this state two years ne 
ceding his election, and who shall not, at the time of his « 
reside in the division, circuit or county in which he shall be 


years. And no person shall be eligible to the office of judge of t 
circuit court until he shall have attained the age of thirty y ars. 
Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough moved to strike out 
years,” and insert “‘five years.”’ Carried. 
Mr. KENNER moved to amend by adding after “elec ed 
‘two years preceding his election;’’ which motion was carried. 
Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to add: ‘‘and who shall not ha 
paid a state or county tax;’’ on which motion the yeas and n ne 
were ordered, and MS Ta 47, nays 95. 

The section was then adopted. 

Mr. LOGAN offered, as additional sections, the felon 

Sec. —. County judges, clerks, sheriffs, and other cor 
officers, for wilful neglect of duty, or misdemeanor in office, sh 
be liable to presentment or indictment by a grand jury, an 
by a petit jury, and upon conviction shall be removed from 

Sec. —. The election of all officers, and the filling of all vaca 
cies that may happen by death, resignation, or removal, not : 
wise directed or provided for by this constitution shall be 
in such manner as the legislature shall direct; Provided, bie 
such officer shall be elected by the Legislature. 

Sec. —. The first election for justices of the supreme c 
and judges of the circuit court, shall be held on the first Monc 
of October, 1848, after the adoption of this article. — . 

Sec. —. The second election for one justice of the supre 
court shall be held on the first Monday of June, 1852; and ever 
three years thereafter an election shall be held for one Be 
the supreme court. 

Sec. —. On the first Monday of June, 1855, and Seay six 
year thereafter, an election shall be held for judges of the c 
cuit courts; Provided, whenever an additional circuit is 
such provision may be made as to hold the second election of su 
additional judge at the regular election herein provided. 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 18, 1847 805 


And the question being taken thereon, the same was adopted. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess offered, as an additional sec- 
tion, the following: 

Sec. —. There shall be elected in each county in this state, 
by the qualified electors thereof, a sheriff, who shall hold his office 
for the term of two years, and until his successor shall be elected 
and qualified; Provided, that no person shall be eligible to the 
office more than once in four years. 

Messrs. Davis of Montgomery, CAMPBELL and Morcan sup- 
ported the amendment, and Messrs. Brockman and Bonp 
opposed it. 

Mr. WEAD advocated the term of four years, and moved to 
strike out ““two’’ and insert ‘‘four;’’ and the same was rejected— 
yeas 40, nays 68. 

Mr. AKIN moved a proviso. 

Mr. PRATT moved the previous question; which was seconded. 

The proviso was rejected. 

And the Convention adiourned till 3 Pp. m. 


AFTERNOON 


The Convention was called twice, and no quorum appeared. 
The absentees were sent for, and at 25 minutes past three a quorum 
appeared. 

The question pending at the adjournment was on the section 
proposed by Mr. Campse tt of Jo Daviess. 

Mr. ATHERTON moved to strike out “‘two years,’’ and in- 
sert “‘three.”” Withdrawn. 

Mr. WEST moved to amend the proviso, so as to make it read: 
“*Shall not be eligible to election more than four years in any six.”’ 

Mr. McCALLEN supported the amendment, because the 
office of sheriff for two years only would make the office of no value 
to the sheriff. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery replied, and urged the adoption 
of the section as first presented. 

The question was taken on the amendment, by yeas and nays, 
and decided—yeas 46, nays 93. 

Mr. ECCLES moved to amend, by striking out ‘‘two years’’ 
and inserting ‘‘four;’’ and the same was rejected. 


BANS hitiaad a eats SWUNG abhi | ae a all te Sb, 
y mK fa ek! whens a Re ie x ra S35 
: oN , 

‘ 


806 


The question was taken on the section, and aie 
yeas IOI, nays 45. 


wails was adopted. 

Sec. —. The clerks of the supreme and circuit courts s, 
state’s attorneys, shall be elected at the first special electio n | 
judges; the second election for clerks of the Supreme court sh 
be held on the first Monday of June, 1855, and every sixt 
thereafter. The first election for clerks of the circuit « x 


in what manner, the judges of the county courts of this s 
clerks of courts, justices of the peace, and prosecuting ato’ 
and other county officers, may be removed from office. 

A vote was taken thereon—yeas 57, nays 49- No quo: 
voting. i 

Mr. ECCLES offered the following, as a substitute ther : 

‘‘There shall be elected, at the general election in each 
in this state, by the qualified electors, a coroner, survey: 
collector. Also, in each justice’s district a competent numbe: 
constables, who shall hold their offices for the term of four ye 
and until their successors are elected and qualified, whos 
shall be prescribed by law.’’ : 

And the substitute was rejected—yeas 29. 

The question was taken on the section of Mr. Weap 
was rejected. ‘i 3 

Sec. 12. Any judge of the supreme or circuit court. 
removed from office by address of both houses of the Ge: e 
Assembly, if two-thirds of all the members elected of eac 
concur therein. 

Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to strike out the section, ad 
the following; which motion was carried: 

“‘For any reasonable cause, to be entered on . the j jou 
each house, which shall not be sufficient ground for impe 
both justices of the supreme court and judges of the circu 
shall be removed from office on the vote of two-thirds of th 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 78, 1847 807 


_ bers elected to each branch of the General Assembly; Provided, 
_ always, that no member of either house of the General Assembly 


shall be eligible to fill the vacancy occasioned by such removal; 
Provided, also, that no removal shall be made unless the justice 


_ or judge complained of shall have been served with a copy 


of the complaint against him, and shall have an opportunity of 
being heard in his own defence.”’ 

The section, as amended, was adopted. 

And, on motion, the article was referred to the committee on 


_ Revision. 


BANKS 


Mr. WEAD, from the select committee to whom had been 
referred the petition of sundry citizens of Fulton county, praying 
a prohibition of banks, and of the circulation of foreign paper, 
reported the following article: 


ARTICLE— 


Sec. 1. The Legislature shall pass no law creating any bank 
or banks, or authorizing the issue of bank paper; and shall pro- 
hibit, by adequate penalties, the circulation of all bank paper in 
this state. 

Sec. 2. The Legislature may provide by law that, at the 
expiration of ten years from the adoption of this constitution, the 
qualified electors of the state may vote for and against banks; if 
a majority of the votes so cast shall be ‘‘for banks,’’ then this 
article shall be abolished, if otherwise, this article shall be in force 
ten years more, when the same question may be again submitted 
in the same manner, and with the same effect. 

Sec. 3. This article shall be separately submitted to the 
qualified electors of this state for adoption or rejection, at the 
same election, and in the same manner, with the amended con- 
stitution. If this amendment shall receive a majority of all the 
votes cast for and against it at such election, then the same shall 
become a part of the constitution of this state, and supersede all 
other provisions upon the same subject. 

The same being before the Convention— 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough moved the previous ques- 


' tion; which was ordered. 


808: ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


questine cars should be given for consideeamere Faas.” 

Mr. CALDWELL said, the question had already been 
sidered, and the gentleman from Sangamon must be familiar wit 
the subject by this time. He hoped it would be settled at o 

The Convention refused to reconsider. 

Mr. PRATT demanded the yeas and nays; which were order 

The question being taken on the adoption of the section, 
sulted as follows: 

Yeas—Akin, Allen, Archer, Armstrong, Blair, Balli 
Brockman, Bosbyshell, Brown, Crain, Caldwell, Campbell 
Daviess, Campbell of McDonough, Carter, F. S. Casey, Za 
Casey, Colby, Constable, Cross of Winnebago, Cloud, Chure 
Dale, Dunn, Frick, Henderson, Hill, Hogue, Hunsaker, ne 
James, Jones, Kreider, Lasater, Laughlin, Lenley, McCully, 0 | 
Clure, McHatton, Manly, Markley, Moffett, Moore, M 
Nichols, Oliver, Pace, Palmer of Macoupin, Pratt, Peters, - 
ney, Powers, Robinson, Roman, Rountree, Scates, Sta 
Shields, Sim, Simpson, Smith of Gallatin, Thompson, T 
Tutt, Vernor, Wead, Webber, Williams, Whiteside—68. 

Nays—Adams, Anderson, Atherton, Choate, Church, D 
of Montgomery, Dawson, Deitz, Dummer, Dunlap, 
more, Edwards of Madison, Edwards of Sangamon, E 
Graham, Geddes, Green of Clay, Green of Jo Daviess, Green 
Thee Grimshaw, Harding, Harlan, Harper, Harvey, Hai 
Hawley, Hay, Holmes, Hurlbut, Jackson, Judd, Knapp of J 
Knapp of Scott, Kenner, Kinney of Bureau, Knowlton, 
Lander, Lemon, Lockwood, Logan, Loudon, McCallen, Ma he 
of Coles, Marshall of Mason, Mason, Mieure, Miller, Minsha 
Palmer of Stark, Rives, Robbins, Sharpe, Swan, Spencer, Servan 
Sibley, Smith of Macon, Shumway, Thomas, Thornton, T 
Tuttle, Vance, West, Witt, Whitney, Woodson, Worcester—6 

Absent—Blakely, Bond, Bunsen, Butler, Canady, Cross ; 
Woodford, Davis of McLean, Davis of Massac, Dement, E nc 

son, Evey, Farwell, Gregg, Hayes, Heacock, Hoes, Jenki 
Kinney of St. Clair, Kitchell, Matheny, Northcott, No 
Sherman, Singleton, Turnbull. ie 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 18, 1847 - 809 


Mr. SERVANT moved to take up the report of the select 
committee on Commons. Carried. 

It was read and adopted as follows: 

“Sec. —. All lands which have been granted, as a “‘Common,” 
to the inhabitants of any town, hamlet, village or corporation, by 
any person, body politic or corporate, or by any government hav- 
ing power to make such grant, shall forever remain common to 
the inhabitants of such town, hamlet, village or corporation; but 
the said commons, or any of them, or any part thereof, may be 
divided, leased or granted, in such manner as may, hereafter, 
be provided by law, on petition of a majority of the qualified voters 
interested in such commons, or any of them.”’ 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to take up the report of the com- 
mittee on Revenue as amended. Carried. 

Mr. HAYES asked leave to record his vote on the question of 
banks, just decided; he was absent at the time and would like to 
record his vote. 

Objections were made, and the Chair put the question—Shall 
the gentleman be permitted to vote? 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon raised a point of order, could 
the gentleman be allowed to vote after the result was announced, 
if so, why not allow every man who was absent to record his vote 


_ to-morrow or whenever he should come in? 


The PRESIDENT said, that after the vote he would make a 
decision. 

The vote was taken, and resulted—yeas 39, nays 54. 

The PRESIDENT ruled that the gentleman was precluded 
from voting under a rule of the Convention, and to allow him to 
vote required two-thirds; two-thirds not voting therefor, he 
could not vote. 

The Convention then resumed the consideration of the revenue 
report, section after section. The committee proposed to strike 
out all inserted in parentheses, and insert what is given in italics. 

Sec. 1. The Legislature (shall) may cause to be collected from 
all able-bodied free white male inhabitants of this state, over the 
age of twenty-one years and under the age of sixty years, who are 
entitled to the right of suffrage, a capitation tax of not less than fifty 
cents nor more than one dollar each, when the Legislature may deem 


seminary funds; and if in any year there shall remain any 
of said tax, after the payment of the interest due for tha 
such balance shall be paid into the state treasury.) 

The question being on concurring with the committee o 
whole on striking out “‘shall’’ and inserting “‘may’’ in the 
line, PRN ale 


Mr. WOODSON demanded the yeas and nays. 


committee to that effect; but he would now vote for ‘ shal” b 
such was the universal voice of his county. 
Mr. HAYES said, as this is one of the questions in 
have taken much interest, I desire to define my position . 
the vote may be taken. 


I then supported, instructed the committee on Revenue we 
an article giving the Legislature power to impose a poll tax 


the next General Assembly, would express that opinion befor 
people, and if aed would endeavor to carry it out. Ce, 


tion to tax the people. That is their own right—to hes exerc 
at their discretion through their representatives in the Ger 
Assembly. Let them hold the purse-strings of the state. 
not right to levy a tax upon the people by engrafting in the: oneal 
law a provision that it shall be levied. 

I repeat I am opposed to any and every proposition to ii 
a tax by a constitutional provision. I shall, therefore, vo 
concur in the amendment made in committee of the whole 


5 
4 


——— 


nt Me 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 178, 1847 SII 


ing out “‘shall’’ and inserting ‘‘may’’ in the first section of the 
report. 

Mr. ARCHER was opposed to the poll tax.upon principle, but 
would vote for the word “‘may’’ as acompromise. The people of 
his county were divided on the subject, and he would vote for 
giving the Legislature power to levy the tax when the people 
desired it. The word ‘‘shall’’ should never have been in the 
article; it was reported against the express instruction of the Con- 
vention to the committee, and he hoped that it would never be 
replaced. 

Mr. THOMAS opposed the last amendment of the committee— 
the striking out of the last part of the section—in parenthesis. 

Mr. KNOWLTON was in favor of a poll tax upon principle. 

Mr. HUNSAKER moved the previous question; which was 
seconded. 

The question was taken by yeas and nays on agreeing with 
the committee of the whole in striking out “‘shall’’ and inserting 
“‘may’” and resulted—yeas 96, nays 42. 

The yeas and nays were taken on concurring in the insertion 
of the words, ‘‘who are entitled to the right of suffrage,’ and 
resulted—yeas 78, nays 52. 

The other amendments were concurred in, and the section as 
amended, was adopted. 

- On motion the Convention adjourned till to-morrow at 8 A. M. 


LIX. THURSDAY, AUGUST 109, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. BerceEn. 

Mr. GREGG, from the select committee of twenty-s 
appointed to apportion the state into 25 senatorial and 75 repre- 
sentative districts made a report. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean said, he hoped it vee be laid 0 
table and ordered to be printed. 

Mr. GREGG thought that it may as well be phages no’ 
and adopted or rejected; members were familiar with the co 
composing each district, and were as ready to vote now as at a 
other time. He had no particular objections to the ae bu 
he saw no use in delaying the matter. teins 

Mr. KNOWLTON said, he would not vote for any thing 
he had had time to examine it. It had not been read yet, an 
still a desire was expressed to have it passed through the Cot 
vention. Hehoped it would be printed [so] that everyone could s 
how their districts were made up. At present no one a 
on the committee knew anything about it. 

Mr. BALLINGALL hoped it would be printed. He mo 
that 250 copies be printed. 


abe could understand it sufficiently ae by hearing i it rez 
say whether he would vote for it or not. 

The question was taken on the motion to print, and rest 
yeas e nays 67. 


talenc It was evident, he thought, that members shold 
an opportunity to examine the subject before voting upon it. 


further action be had upon it; they should at least know a tl 
were disputing about. ; 
The report was read by the Secretary. : 
The question was then taken on reconsideration, and result 
yeas 65, nays 71. ‘ igh 
812 i 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 79, 1847 813 


Mr. CALDWELL moved that that portion of the report, dis- 
tricting the counties composing the third judicial circuit be referred 
to a select committee of nine. 

At the last meeting of the committee, a change had been made 
in the districts, embraced in that circuit, and he hoped they might 
have an opportunity to restore it ‘to the position it had before. 

Mr. McCALLEN hoped the motion would prevail. This was 
a subject in which the people were deeply interested, and one in 
which every member had an interest, and he could not see why 
the committee should desire to rush their report, of which none 
knew anything but themselves, through the Convention without 
the least time for examination or consideration. He would vote 
against it if compelled to vote now. Why did the committee 
oppose the printing? Why were they afraid to have members 
examine their work? Their very haste and anxiety to have this 
matter rushed through the Convention, to force it upon members, 
would induce him to pause before voting for it, and to insist upon 
its being printed. 

Mr. DAVIS of Massac hoped the motion made by the member 
from Gallatin would prevail. The report of the committee, in 
relation to the counties embraced in the third judicial district, 
had been agreed upon and considered settled to the satisfaction of 
every delegate from that circuit; but at the last meeting, one 
member of the committee moved a reconsideration in order to 
make some alteration in respect to his own county. This was 
acceded to, but, in the absence of the other members from the 
circuit, not only was a change made to suit that one member, but 
in doing so, they had gone on and changed every district, senatorial 
and representative, in the circuit. The change we assented to, 
was in the district composed of Jefferson, Wayne and Marion, and 
he at the time considered it was to have gone no farther. He 
hoped the motion would prevail, and that the circuit might be 
constructed to suit the majority of its members, and not one single 
delegate. 

Mr. HOGUE said, he was the ‘‘one member’’ alluded to by 
the gentleman from Massac. He had made the motion to recon- 
sider because under the first arrangement he found Wayne county 
put out of its proper circuit, and taken away from those counties 


there was a community of feeling and interest. He had r 
movement in justice to his own county, and lar es 


in the community. 
The PRESIDENT edid} that upon reflectiag hee co 
the motion to refer a portion of the report to be out of ord 
Mr. EDWARDS of Madison moved that the report be d 
the table, and 200 copies be ordered to be printed. OA 
Mr. HARDING moved the previous question. — 
Mr. Z. CASEY moved the report be laid on the table. a 2 
Mr. EDWARDS moved that 200 copies be printed. Carrie 
Mr. LOGAN presented the report of the select committe 
nine, appointed to divide the state into three divisions for judi ! 
purposes; which was read. mn 
Mr. LOGAN moved that the report be amended so as ‘th 
Clark and Cumberland counties be added to the middle div’ io 
instead of the southern. He said that he made the motion at tl 
unanimous suggestion of the delegates from the southern divi 
And the motion was adopted. "3 
Mr. MARKLEY moved that the report be laid on ‘the tab 
and 250 copies ordered to be age Agreed Bie nay 


58. 


of the committee on Revenue. i! 
Sec. 2. The Legislature shall provide for. Leeann a 
valuation, so that every person and Aikiiboales te se at 


(in each county in the state), in such manner as the ie | 
shall direct, and not otherwise; but the Legislature shall have 
power to tax peddlers, auctioneers, brokers, hawkers, merci 
commission merchants, showmen, jugglers, inn-keepers, gre 
keepers, to/l-bridges, and ferries, and persons using and ex 
franchises and privileges, in such manner as they mic fro 
to time direct. | 
Mr. WOODSON moved to amend the same e by prefing 1 
to, as a separate section, the following: 


r. 
, 
= 
, 
: 
J 
of 


aP 


aS. 6 Se 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 79, 7847 815 


““Sec. —. The General Assembly shall cause to be collected 
from all free white male inhabitants of this state over the age of 
twenty-one years and under sixty years, a capitation tax of not 
less than fifty cents, nor more than one dollar annually, to be 
applied as the Legislature may direct. Said tax to continue until 


_ the payment of the public debt of the state. 


““Sec. —. At the election to which shall be submitted the 
constitution to the people for their ratification or rejection, a 


separate poll shall be opened for and against a poll tax, and if a 


majority of those voting on said question shall be in favor of such 
tax, then the foregoing section shall stand in lieu of the first section; 


_but if a majority of the votes polled shall be against the poll tax, 


then the said first section shall not be and remain a part of this 
constitution.’’ 

Mr. SCATES reminded the house that every proposition that 
had been offered to be submitted to the people separately had 
been voted down. If in order, he would move, as an amendment 
to the amendment, the alternate proposition of bank or no bank. 

Mr. GREGG said, that he wished merely to express his sincere 
hope that the amendment of the gentleman from Greene would not 
be adopted. On a former occasion he had explained his views on 
the subject, and did not intend to take up the time of the Con- 
vention now. He regarded a poll tax as wrong in principle, and 
unjust, grossly unjust, and oppressive in its operation. It was, 
he thought, anti-republican and contrary to the whole spirit of 
our institutions. Entertaining this view, he would vote for no 
proposition for a poll tax. It could not be presented in any phase 
or shape so as to be acceptable to him. He was opposed to it 
under all circumstances, and he trusted the Convention would not 
subject the people to the necessity of rejecting a measure which 
they could not but regard as an infringement of their rights, and 
a violation of justice. 

Messrs. PETERS, SHIELDS, PALMER of Marshall and McCat_en 
expressed themselves in favor of a poll tax. 

Mr. ATHERTON moved the previous question; which was 
ordered—yeas 59, nays 51. 

The question was taken, by yeas and nays, on the amendment 
of Mr. Woopson, and it was rejected—yeas 61, nays 77. 


816 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT. 


The section was then adopted. 


‘*The property of the state and roanaeel both real and sae 
and such other property as the Legislature may deem eg . 


7? 


from pea a 

Mr. WOODSON offered as an additional section to. sada a 
section three, the gulend mene just rejected, modified by the > 
omission of the word ‘‘not,’” where it last occurs. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess addressed the Convene if 
opposition to the poll tax. He opposed it upon every ground and 
principle of justice, and opposed it more particularly in its present — 
shape. He thought it time for gentlemen to stop in endeavors to - 
engraft these odious federal measures upon the constitution. — 
Already there had been adopted a banking system which could ~ 
not be shaken off, but which like the shirt of Nessus would stick _ 
to us forever. We had compromised on every subject, had given 
up everything, and such was the pertinaclitly of gentlemen 1 
urging these unjust measures that longer concession would be ~ 
degradation. He would yield no more. The Convention had 
placed unwarrantable restrictions upon the right of suffrage, i. 
had adopted measures, the tendency of which would be to exclude a 
foreigners from emigrating to our state, had adopted a sort of 
piebald judiciary, the like of which was never heard anywhe: 
else, and which no other set of men could be found to adopt, and — 
still they were not satisfied, but desired to force upon us this poll 
tax which has been voted down again and again. He warne 
gentlemen to pause in their course, to stop in their reckless 
endeavors to fasten these odious principles upon the constitution. 
They offer it now as a separate section to be voted upon by the 
people, and talk loudly of the right of the people to be heard upo 
the subject. A new light, it seemed, had broken upon them. 
Where was their principle yesterday when we proposed prohibitiot 
of banks to the people? Where has all this peculiar respect fc 
the wishes of the people been during the past months of the Con- a 
vention? Why did they refuse to present to the people the isolated - 


. THURSDAY, AUGUST 19, 1847 817 
question of bank or no bank? But thisis a favorite measure of these 
gentlemen, and having failed here in engrafting it upon the con- 
stitution, they desire to try it before the people, and forever fasten 
upon us a constitutional poll tax. He hoped it would be voted 
down. 

Mr. AKIN moved that the amendment be laid on the table. 
On which motion the yeas and nays were ordered, and resulted 


_ yeas 71, nays 71; rejected. 


Messrs. Haves, Davis of Massac, Davis of Montgomery, and 
Parmer of Macoupin continued the discussion in favor of a poll 
tax, and Messrs. ScaTEs, FARWELL and ARCHER in opposition to it. 

Mr. ATHERTON moved the previous question; which was 
ordered. 

And then, on motion, the Convention adjourned till 3 p. M. 


AFTERNOON 


The question was taken by yeas and nays on the amendment 
of Mr. Woopson, and it was rejected—yeas 61, nays 76. 

The section was then adopted as given above. 

Section 4 was read. It is the long provision submitted by 
Judge Lockwoop some weeks ago, and published then in the pro- 
ceedings, in relation to the mode of collecting taxes, and present- 
ing the requisites for the valid sale of land for taxes. 

Mr. DAWSON moved to amend, by adding the following as 
an additional section: 

“*The Legislature shall cause the several county clerks in this 
state, at the proper time, to make out in tabular form a list of all 
lands on which taxes remain due and unpaid for the year last past, 
and place the same in the hands of the assessor for the next year, 
whose duty it shall be, when he assesses lands, to compare the 
assessment with the delinquent list, and should they find any 
lands on the delinquent list which belongs to any citizen of their 
respective counties, they shall notify the citizen thereof, and no 
lands shall be offered for sale until the same be advertised for at 
least three weeks in some newspaper printed in this state, nearest 
where the lands lie, and after the time in which the assessment 
is to close according to law.”’ 


[Mr. DAWSON said, in cheres the amendaneel to ate 
of the committee of the whole on the revenue, he ‘had | do 
under a sense of duty he owed his constituents; he had nothing | 
in view but to secure them and others in their rights. The sectio ‘. 
as it now stands, does not secure the object I wish to attain. That — 
sir, only secures to the landholder certain rights after his land is 
sold for taxes. I wish sir, as far as possible to prevent citizens’ 
lands from being sold for taxes. The amendment I offer sir, for — 
the consideration of the convention if adopted, will secure that 
object. The proposition will carry the evidence to every man 
and that without cost, whether he has paid his taxes on his ow 
or some other person’s lands. This is the object I have in view 
this is the object I wish to accomplish. It is known by every — 
gentleman on this floor, that mistakes often occur in lands by the” 
assessors, clerks or sheriffs, in the transacting of their business as 
officers, and thereby many had as they thought, honorably paid 
their taxes; but sir, without any fault on their part, when too late 
they found their lads had been Sold! fon (eae in the hands of © 
the speculator. To obviate this, he had offered his amendment, 3 
and said Mr. Dawson, if this amendment is adopted you will — 
greatly prevent the sale of lands for taxes; you will place tl 
necessary information in the possession of every man, whether he — 
has paid in his taxes properly or not; you will sir, save all the co i; 
which must necessarily accrue befor the proposition to whic 4 
this is an amendment, can benefit any one but printers and officers. d 
By its adoption, you will save many the painful necessity of pur 
chasing at a heavy rate, their own lands from the speculator. 
With this plain common sense view of its importance, I hope 
if the convention does intend to adopt the section which alloy 
there does an evil exist in improperly selling land for taxes, x 
will adopt my amendment or some other that will secure the object 1 
desired. I will say, sir, that the section as adopted by the con 
mittee of the whole does not propose a proper remedy; that onl 
proposes a remedy after the evil exists. JI wish to prevent th 
evil, and then sir, there will be no need for the remedy proposed 
by the committee. Adopt the amendment I offer sir, and you ~ 
will hear but little more complaint of lands being sold for taxes.J* — 
This speech by Dawson is taken from the Sangamo Journal, August 2 


Sot 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 19, 1847 819 


_ And the question being taken thereon by yeas and nays, was 
decided in the negative—yeas 50, nays 84. 
Messrs. Cuurcn and Knapp of Scott offered some verbal 
_ amendments to the section, which were adopted. 
Messrs. Witttams, WeapD and Vance offered substitutes for 
q the section; which were rejected. 
; And the section was then adopted—yeas 76, nays 56. 
f Mr. LOCKWOOD offered, as an additional section, the follow- 
ing: 
_ **No lands in this state shall be assessed at less than one dollar 
and fifty cents per acre. 
Mr. McCALLEN opposed the section, and moved to strike 
out “‘one dollar and;’’ which motion was rejected. 
: Mr. MARKLEY moved to strike out $1.50 and insert $2. 
_ Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery requested those who made this 
proposition to point out its justice. How could they expect 
assessors, under the solemn obligations of an oath, to say lands 
were worth $2 an acre, when in fact it was not worth that? 
The question was taken, and the motion rejected—yeas 43, 
nays 87. 
Mr. LOCKWOOD modified his amendment by reducing the 
_ sum to $1.25. 
Mr. SCATES offered as a substitute for the proposed section: 
“Tn all elections all white male inhabitants, over the age of 
21 years, having resided in the state one year next preceding the 
_ election, shall enjoy the right of an elector; but no person shall be 
entitled to vote, except in the county or district in which he shall 
actually reside at the time of the election.”’ 
Mr. THOMAS moved the substitute be rejected. 
_ On which motion ensued a long discussion upon a point of 
order; and, finally, 
Mr. SCATES withdrew his substitute. 
. Mr. Z. CASEY moved to lay the proposed section on the table; 
which motion was rejected—yeas 67, nays 67. 
_ Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved a call of the Convention; 
_ which was ordered, and 142 members answered the call. 
Mr. LEMON moved to suspend all further proceedings under 


Se e s 


ig ee 


7. ee = 


: 
7 


820 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


the call, on which motion no quorum voted. A second vote w 
had, and go voted in the affirmative. 
Mr. McCALLEN offered, as a substitute for the aioe y 
section, the following: a 
“All taxation levied upon property shall be by oan apprais- 
ment valuation.’’ 
On which the yeas and nays were taken, and resulted-—yeas 
76, nays 63. ‘A 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon said, that as the Subseinate had 
accomplished its object—the defeat of the origi ane moved it 
be laid on the table. Carried. 
Sec: hi" lhe corporate authorities of counties, coun 
school districts, cities, towns, and villages, may be vested wi 
power to assess and collect taxes for corporate purposes, such tax 
to be uniform in respect to persons and property, within the j jun ee ; 
diction of the body imposing the same. A 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved to add to it the follayal 4 
ing; which was adopted: 
‘‘And the Legislature shall require that all the property with 
the limits of municipal corporations, belonging to individua 
shall be taxed for the payment of debts, contracted under t 
authority of the law.”’ 
Mr. TURNBULL offered an additional section; “which + was” 
laid on the table. 
Section six was read and adopted, as follows: 
Sec. 6. The specification of the objects and subjects of tax 
tion shall not deprive the General Assembly of the power to require 
other objects or subjects to be taxed in such manner as may 
consistent with the principles of taxation fixed in this constitution 
The article was then referred to the committee on 1 Re 
sion, &c. pe 
And then the Convention adjourned till to-morrow at 8 A. bi 


LX. FRIDAY, AUGUST 20, 1847 


The Convention was called, and 141 answered to their names. 

Mr. ECCLES moved to take up the report of the committee 
on the Division of the State into Counties, and their Organization; 
which motion was carried. ; 

Sec. 1. No new county shall be formed or established by the 
Legislature which will reduce the county or counties, or either of 
them from which it shall be taken, to less contents than four hun- 
dred square miles, nor shall any county be formed of less contents, 
nor any line of which shall pass within less than ten miles of any 
county seat already established. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to strike out all after ‘“contents,”’ 
where it last occurs. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison hoped the motion would prevail. 
The present county of Madison would probably be hereafter 
divided. Such was at present contemplated by the people of the 
county. In case it was divided, the city of Alton would, in all 
probability, be the choice and desire of the people as the seat of 
justice and of county business.—This section would, if passed, for- 
ever prohibit this object and desire of the people from being 
carried into effect. He was in favor of leaving this subject open, 
to be decided by the people, whenever they may choose to change 
the county lines, remove the county seat, or to divide the county. 
He sincerely hoped the amendment would be adopted. 

Messrs. Davis of McLean and Bonn declared themselves 
favorable to every project that would be advantageous to Alton, 
but they considered the section, which had been reported in 
obedience to instructions from the Convention, so highly beneficial 
to the whole people, so preventive of useless and expensive legis- 
lation, as had always been the case heretofore, that they felt 
constrained to support the subject. 

Mr. GRAHAM was in favor of the amendment. He thought 
the subject of division of counties, changing and locating county 
seats, was one properly belonging to the people of the counties in- 

821 


They had a right to petition in such cases fr ee an it wa 
desirable, and any constitutional provision denying them this righ : 
was unwarranted and unprecedented. ‘ 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess sincerely hope he: ame | 
ment would not pass. It was one the propriety of which he could” 
not see. It was intended for the benefit of one or two places 
the state, to the injury of the other portions of the state. It w 
it had been said, for the future benefit of Alton. He believed 1 
same city of Alton has occupied more of the time of the Legislat 
than any other town, city, or county in the state. Since he h 
been an observer of the action of the Legislature, this city of Alto 
has occupied a very considerable portion of the time of the Legis- 
lature every session. It would appear that there was a stro 
desire existing somewhere to build up that city by legal ena 
ments rather than by a dependence on its natural position, or its 
resources for business.—He would have no objection to this did i 1 
not prejudice the interests of other sections of the state, ani 7 
particularly the county he represented. That county was now a ~ 
large one, but had at one time been much larger. It was th 
mother of all the counties surrounding it, and the Legislature hai 
gone on continually cutting off county after county, and nov 
there is a desire felt to cut off still another slice. It is high tir mn 
this work should stop, and some permanency [be] given to our counties a 
and our county seats. It was a subject which had worked much — 
evil—had retarded more than any other cause the progress of. 
state. There was an universal fever to divide the counti 5 
created by the operations of a few designing men interested in 
change of county seats, or the creation of a new batch of cot 
officers. We must have some stability in our county lines. _ Fo 
instance, we have a county, and the county seat is established n'y 
the centre, men come there from other parts of the country, be- 
lieving that the county seat is fixed and permanent, they in 
their money in property, erect buildings and enter in|to] extensi 
improvements, all based upon the assurance that the county s¢ 
was fixed; but hardly have these things occurred, when a petiti 
is got up ae a few interested persons, and the first thing we he 
is that the county is divided, and the county seat changed, and 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 20, 1847 823 


_ these investments rendered worthless. This has been the experi- 

_ ence of all past legislation, and it is high time that it should cease. 

_ Once let a question of a division of a county be agitated, and the 
: people of the county lose sight of every other question, all elections 
_ turn upon the question of division, the members of the Legislature 
_ are elected with a view to that question, and the people are never 
quiet till that question is disposed of. He hoped this species of 
legislation would be stopped. He would infinitely prefer that 
many of the small counties should be boiled down into one, than 
_ that large counties should be divided up into small ones. Illinois 
now had counties enough. To divide them only increased the 
expenses of the people, and retarded the interests of the state by 
destroying all stability and confidence. The expenses of the 
government of a small county were nearly as much as those of a 
large one, and he earnestly hoped that for the interests of the 
people— for the welfare of the state—for the permanency of our 
_ county organizations, and to avoid the long waste of time by future 
_ legislatures in considering this subject, that the amendment would 
_ not pass, but the section [be] adopted as first reported. 

Mr. JENKINS defended the report of the majority of the 

committee, and argued against the section now before them as 
_ unjust in principle, and wrong in its practical results. 
Mr. WHITNEY favored the amendment, and desired that the 
report of the majority of the committee should be adopted in 
preference to this report made under instructions of the Conven- 
tion. 

The question was taken by yeas and nays on the amendment, 
and it was rejected—yeas 48, nays 91. 

Mr. ECCLES moved to make the last line read, ‘‘less than 
ten miles of any county seat of the county or counties proposed 
to be divided, already established.’’ Adopted. 

Mr. MARKLEY moved to add the following proviso: ‘‘Pro- 
vided, however, a county may be divided into two counties when- 
ever a majority of the legal voters shall be in favor of the same, 
when each of said counties shall contain not less than four hundred 
square miles.” 

Mr. MARSHALL of Coles moved to lay the amendment on 
the table. 


= 


804 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL a é 


and resale eas 70, nays 69. g 
Mr. ECCLES moved the previous question; whieh w was orders r, 
The section was then adopted. y 
Sec. 2. No county shall be divided or nee any part ACER. a 

therefrom without submitting the question to a vote of the people — 

of the county, nor unless a majority of oe the legal voters of the ; 
county shall vote for the same ~ 
Mr. HOLMES offered as an amendment, to insert “voting ong 
the question.’’ Carried. ¥ 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon offered the felons as an 4 ; 
amendment, to be added to the section: } 
*‘Nor shall any territory be taken from any county unless a ~ 
majority of the voters within the territory proposed to be cut off 
shall be in favor ‘of having their territory form any portion of 
another county.”’ ; 
Mr. CLOUD said, that upon this question he felt considerable a 

anxiety, and desired to say a few words which perhaps might as i: 

well be said now, as at any other time. The question involved il 

the section now before them, was one in which a large portion of 

his constituents felt much interest, perhaps they were more inter- 
ested in it than in any other that had come before the Convention, 

it was ¢he question with them, and on its decision depended in a 

great measure their support of the constitution. He believed 

that if this section be inserted in the constitution, that the people 
of his county and of a portion of the counties of Macoupin and ~ 

Sangamon would not support the constitution no matter how 

perfect were its other provisions, nor how much other provisions 

were in accordance with their sentiments and opinions. It had: — 
for a long time been the desire of a large portion of the people of 
his county, to be formed into a new county to be composed of 
parts of the counties of Morgan, Macoupin and Sangamon, and 
the desire to do so has generally obtained the approval of the large 
majority of the people residing in those parts of those counties, 
proposed to be so united. They have petitioned the Legislature 
for years to form the new county, but they have never been heard, 
their petitions have been unattended to, and they have been denied 
the right of forming themselves into that government which they 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 20, 7847 825 


desire, and which they should have. At the last session of the 
Legislature they again petitioned that body for the formation of 
this new county, their petition was heard and their claims were 
attended to; a bill passed the House of Representatives for that 
purpose, after considerable debate and a fair investigation of the 
facts, but it was lost in the Senate by one vote. 

Mr. C. would not trespass on the time of the Convention were 
not this a question in which the people he represented were more 
interested than in any other, because he thought that if he did not 
present their claims, insist on their rights, and endeavor to obtain 
for them the benefit of just laws, he would be derelict in his duty 
as a representative and unfaithful in the discharge of his duties. 
For these reasons, and in the hope of securing to his constituents 
and their interests and rights a safe protection by constitutional 
provisions, he had spoken upon the subject. He could not see 
why gentlemen pressed this section, which was so unjust in its 
operation upon the rights of minorities. By the section just 
adopted we had effectually secured the old counties from all danger 
of division and from the approach of county seats near their lines, 
they had been protected fully from being reduced or divided down 
to an area of less than 400 square miles, and were they not satisfied? 
There had also been an ample provision adopted, that no new 
counties should be formed of a less area than 400 square miles, 
and still they were not satisfied. What did gentlemen want? 
Not satisfied with protection against the formation of small coun- 
ties, not content with the provision that no new county shall be 
formed whose county seat shall come within ten miles of the county 
line of any county now established, which, in his opinion, amounted 
nearly to a total prohibition of any new county, but they must 
go farther, and forever crush the rights of the minority of the 
people. They must abandon all those principles of a free govern- 
ment, that declare, that while a majority shall rule, yet the rights 
of the minority shall be sacred. Do gentlemen desire that mi- 
norities shall have no voice, that their rights and interests shall be 
trampled under foot by a wild uncompromising majority? He 
hoped not, yet this provision was in effect a denial to the minority 
of the people of any county of the right to petition for a division of 
that county. Any person at all acquainted with the geography 


nt A 


yt Pie 


Macoupin and Morgan, would at once perceive how j fast was ee fl b 
demand of the people living in the outskirts of those counties and 
adjoining each other, that they should be formed into a new | y 
county. They were situated so far from the seats of their respec- ¥ 
tive counties, that they were cut off from all local interest, and — 
being near each other, a community of feeling and interest had 
grown up, which had created this strong desire to be formed into 
a new county, which would afford them greater facilities in attend- 
ing to their county business, than they possessed at present, be- 
cause now the county seats were twenty miles away. No one 
could deny the justice of their demand, yet they formed but a 
minority of the people of each county. Was this Convention. 
prepared to deny the just demands of minorities? Were they 
prepared to forever deny them the right of petition in a just cause? 
Has all regard for the rights of minorities of the people been lost, 
and were they to be reduced to the position of ‘‘hewers of wood 
and drawers of water’’ for overruling and tyrannical majorities? 
Were the Convention now ready to deny the people, or any Por- 
tion of them, in the organic law of the state, the right to. petition 
the Legislature on a subject which to them is of vital importance, 
and to deny the Legislature the power to grant them the relief, 
the right, and the justice they demand? He hoped these things 
would be well considered before the Convention would forever 
cut off the minority of the people of the counties from bein: 
heard by the Legislature. For the reasons given, and on th 
grounds that the whole was wrong in principle, and would be © 
oppressive in its operation, he hoped the section wiyees “not b Vi 
adopted. 

Mr. LOGAN replied to Mr. C., and urged the adoption of the: ! 
amendment. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin was in favor of the jacegeaae 
proposed by thegentlemanfromSangamon. Hedidnotbelieve that 
the inhabitants of any part of a county had the right to have. 
that part stricken off and added to another county without the 
consent of the people of the whole county. Such was the opinion 
of the people in his county. % 

Mr. SINGLETON was in favor of leaving the whole subject 


Pree 
%, 
. 


qe tts ote 2 ob * 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 20, 1847 827 


open to future legislation; and moved to lay the amendment on 
the table; which motion prevailed—yeas 57, nays 53. 

Mr. BROWN moved to amend the section by adding thereto 
the following: 

“‘Where a county, either now or hereafter to be established, 
shall be situated on the navigable waters of this state, the county 
seat thereof may be established on said navigable waters, where 
the county line may run within less than ten miles of a county 
seat, provided a majority of the legal voters of the county concur 
therein.”’ 

Mr. WEST said, that he was much opposed to the division 
of counties, and hoped that this convention would do something 
that would effectually check that evil. He regarded the past 
course of the Legislature on this subject as very objectionable, 
and as having given rise to much difficulty. [Illinois, with a ter- 
ritory less than many of the states, and with a population of not 
more than a third or fourth of some of them, had now more counties 
than any state in the Union, and would continue to make more by 
the division of some of those already established, unless the Legis- 
lature by constitutional provision should be restricted. The 
restrictions proposed by the committee would entirely fail in hav- 
ing any effect to prevent the establishment hereafter of any num- 
ber, however large. With such restrictions Illinois now might have 
178 counties, New York might have 468. 

He believed the sense of the Convention had been fully mani- 
fested when by a vote of a majority of all the members of this 
Convention, they had instructed the committee to report certain 
articles which that committee had seen fit to protest against. 

He could not vote for the proposition of his colleague (Mr. 
Brown) it looked to him as being unequal in its nature—it pro- 
posed to give to some counties privileges which were not to be 
given to all, and was for that cause, if no other, objectionable. 
He hoped his honorable colleague did not, in submitting that 
proposition, look to the future division of his county. What was 
her present situation? A large debt had been incurred for the 
purpose of making improvements, the Legislature had, by special 
enactment, authorized Madison county to levy and collect of her 
citizens a special tax to pay for certain bridges which had been 


828 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


built near the city of Alton. These bridges were necessary, and 
the tax was submitted to by her citizens and paid without a mur- 
mur. But he would ask, what fairness was there in giving to her, 


as a river county, the opportunity of dividing and thereby leaying # 


the old county to pay off, by onerous and heavy taxation, the 


large debt which had been contracted for the benefit of the whole 


county? Why should the county seat be removed to Alton, for 
the particular benefit of some of the legal profession at that place? 

Something had been said about the city of Alton. “He wished a 
to be understood as not being opposed to Alton in the least degree. _ 
He looked to her present and future prosperity with pleasure and 
with pride. The interest of the city of Alton was in a very great 
degree his interest. Amongst her citizens he numbered many of 
his personal and political friends, and the action of one of the 
citizens of the town in which he resided occupying a seat in the 
Senate of the state during the last session of the Legislature, had 
shown that the interest of Alton was regarded as the interest of 
the county. She must, however, look to her commercial situa- 
tion, and the energy, enterprise and generosity of her citizens to — 
advance in wealth and greatness. He believed she possessed all 
these, and the proposition of his honorable colleague was un- 
necessary to add essentially to her advancement. He was ready 
here, or elsewhere, to give his vote and lend his aid to every 
proper means to advance her interest that would be equal and 


just in its operation. But in voting against the proposition of 


his colleague, he did it from a sense of duty and hoped nt he i! 
would not be misunderstood. 
Mr. BROWN said, he was surprised to hear objections to 
the section proposed by him coming from his colleague, (Mr. 
West), and not less so at the ground of the objections urged by 
the gentleman from Jo Daviess (Mr. CampBett). Both his 
colleague and the gentleman from Jo Daviess had seen fit, in the 
course of their remarks, to treat the section under consideration 
as having been prepared by him, and its adoption urged, for the 
exclusive benefit of Alton. The section proposed by him, as an 
amendment to the report of the committee, was certainly any- 
thing but exclusive in its operation and upon its face ‘contained 
nothing but what would equally apply toall the counties border- 


_ FRIDAY, AUGUST 20, 1847 829 


ing upon the rivers in the state. Why, then, oppose a measure 
which was so well calculated to secure all the advantages which 
counties upon navigable waters enjoyed when their county seats 
were located upon the river? The gentleman from Peoria (Mr. 
Peters) had this morning spoken of the propriety of river counties 
disregarding the geographical centre, and of placing their county 
seats upon the river; and the reasoning of that gentleman, it 
appeared to him, was conclusive. Why, then, deny to counties 
similarly situated, the same.right, when the same reasons exist, 
and in many cases to a much greater extent. He said, that the 
course of his colleague (Mr. West) upon the subject of counties 
had appeared to him very strange, and, so far as Madison county 
was concerned, altogether unwarranted. No movement in that 
county, so far as he knew, had taken place, in reference to a divi- 
sion of that county, and certainly none, at any time, in the city 
of Alton. He had seen nothing which ought to call forth such 
active exertions from that gentleman, and he was afraid that the 
imagination of his colleague had become over excited, and that 
something serious might be apprehended from his mania on the 
subject of the division of counties. He regretted that Madi- 
son county had been mentioned in the discussion of his prop- 
osition. He could safely say for himself, and appeal to the 
knowledge of his colleague for confirmation, that he had always 
been opposed to a division of that county. He had seen no reason 
to wish for a division, and until he did he would always oppose it. 
He could say the same of his venerable colleague, on his left (Mr. 
C. Epwarps). Both himself and Mr. Epwarps, although at this 
time and always heretofore opposed to any division, were yet 
willing that a majority of that or any other county in the state 
should say whether a division should be had or not. He was un- 
willing to place any such restriction upon the right of the people 
to judge as to whether a division of their county should be made, 
or where their county seat should be located. These were matters 
not for constitutional restriction or arrangement, but of a proper 
character to be judged of and decided by the people whose con- 
venience, means and business made them interested. He had 
heard several gentlemen upon this floor regret that the state of 
Illinois had been cut up into so many small counties, and urged 


830 


that fact as a reason why a restriction should be placed uj : 
in future. He fully believed, and was ready to say with thos 
gentlemen, that it was an evil, but, at the same time, one which | 
it was now too late to remedy. At the time of the adoption ‘of.4 
the present constitution, in 1818, had a provision of the character — 


been inserted in the constitution, there is no doubt but thatit had been 
far better for our state, and would have been the means of in 
saving a large amount of money, which has been required to sus- ty 
tain so many separate organizations. But, now that the evil had 
been done, it is proposed to apply the remedy. The state now AN 
contains 99 or 100 counties, and in all that number there were not 
more than half a dozen that could ever be divided, should the a 
section just adopted be allowed to stand as a constitutional pro- 
vision. He urged that the adoption of his amendment would be — 
nothing more than an act of justice to those counties on the navi- — 
gable waters of the state, by allowing them, when a majority of 
the qualified voters of such counties should desire, to place their y: 
county seat upon the river, even at a less distance than ten miles — 
from the county line. If the wants, business facilities, and neces- — 3 
sities of the people are always to be governed by the geographical — 
centre, or by county lines, then, indeed, the proposed amendment 
would be unnecessary; but so long as the markets for the produce ‘ 
of the country, and a population more dense, are found upon the — 
rivers, it is but right and just that the people should have the — 
liberty of establishing their county seats where their local views, 
facilities for business, and general intercourse, might dictate. He, , 
’ therefore, hoped that gentlemen representing counties bordering © 
and having county seats upon the river would support the amend-— ~ 
ment he proposed, and not attempt, under color of remedying an oo 
evil which is beyond our reach, to do manifest injustice to those J 
counties which had not participated in the matters complained of. 4 
The gentleman from Jo Daviess (Mr. CamMpBELL) has seen fit 
to say, in the course of his speech, that the proposition now under — or 
discussion has been introduced for the future benefit of Alton, 
and that Alton is always seeking for something at every session 
of the Legislature. Coming as it does from that gentleman, above __ 
all others on this floor, representing the county of Jo Daviess, and — 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 20, 1847 $31 


himself a resident of Galena, it comes with a very bad grace. He 
(Mr. B.) being the only delegate from Madison county who re- 
sided in the city of Alton, hoped he would not be considered out 
of the way in saying a few words in reply. He said that Alton 
was thankful for any favors she had received, and had made a 
sufficient return to the state for any favor which had been extended 
to her. When it is recollected that Mr. CampBe.t himself, and 
others of his county, besieged the Legislature of the state, time 
after time, for the purpose of impeaching the judge of the circuit 
in which he resides, and after having spent several thousand 
dollars of the people’s money in such efforts but without success, 
came gravely forward and asked the Legislature to give them a 
county court, as their feelings would not allow them to practice 
in the circuit court. It was not even pretended, so far as he 
knew, that the circuit court could not do the business of the county. 
They obtained the court, and the state now pays the heavy ex- 
penses of its judge, attorney and jurors merely to save those 
gentlemen’s feelings. 

Mr. CAMPBELL explained and said, that the whole expense 
only amounted to $250. 

Mr. BROWN replied that he did not know what the expense 
was, but he thought it was more than the amount stated. The 
course of the city of Alton was very different. When the business 
of Madison county, in 1837, had increased to such an extent that 
the circuit court was unable to get through with it, the city of 
Alton asked for a municipal court, with concurrent jurisdiction, 
and agreed to pay the expenses of a separate judge, prosecuting 
attorney, and all other court expenses. She obtained her court, 
and was thus enabled to accomplish her business. How different, 
then, was her course from that of Galena, or Jo Daviess county! 
He thought it was only necessary to mention these facts, to show 
with what a bad grace the charge came from the gentleman from 
Jo Daviess. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, that he was opposed to 
the amendment. [If it prevailed it would completely nullify the 
most important and the most saving principles contained in the 
first section, which had been adopted. Why, sir, what will it lead 
to? To the complete nullification of that provision, that no 


832 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION 


county seat shall be established within ten miles of any county — 
line. There is scarcely a stream of any kind in the state, which 
has not, at some time or another, been declared by the Legislature 
to be navigable, and if this amendment of the gentleman from — 
Madison prevails, then in almost every county the county seat 
will be removed to these streams, and the whole purpose of the — 
first section would be defeated. It would appear from the source — 
whence this amendment came that its object was to benefit Alton — 
at some future time. He had no hostility to Alton, but was proud» i, 
to see her growing and increasing; but he desired to see her ad- q 
vance without the aid of laws and constitutional provisions, — 
which, while they were calculated to be of advantage to her, were ~ § 
vastly prejudicial to the other sections of the state. The gentle- — 
man last up had told us that Galena has occupied some of the — 
time of the Legislature, as well as Alton; that bills for the erection 
of a court there had been before the Legislature, and that there — 
are appropriations made annually to pay for her municipal-court. 
Well, sir, it is true, we have a municipal court there, but it was 
only called for when necessity demanded it, and the expense to 
the state is but $250 a year. Look at Alton—not a session of the _ 
Legislature passes by, sir, but there are demands made upon the — 
state to pay for committees to examine into, or for appropriations — 
for, the expenses of her penitentiary or repairs, &c. ; 

Mr. BROWN explained, that the people of Alton had nothing ~ 
to do with the penitentiary; it was not built for their benefit; tag 
was erected for the whole state, and Galena had her sphacie of i its Z 
occupants. 

Mr. CAMPBELL replied, that he knew that it was not baile ; 
for the benefit of Alton, but from the anxiety always manifested 
by the members from that place, in relation to it, he considered 
the city somewhat interested in the appropriations made for it. 
Mr. C. earnestly hoped the amendment would not be adopted. 
It would defeat all the good that we had done in the first section, 
and upset all the benefits we looked for so confidently from its’ 
results. That there was anxiety felt by those who opposed it 
was manifest, that they desired to carry out the private and local 
interests they represented was clear; and he hoped the Convention 
would frown down all efforts to benefit particular portions of the 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 20, 1847 833 


“state to the injury of others. This anxiety was manifest from the 
language and acts of the member whom we had chosen for our 
" president; manifest from his speech to-day, and from the 
_ character of the committee he had selected to act on this subject. 
’ He has shown to us that he is the representative of a few persons 
_ in his county who desire to break up old county lines and sub- 
' stitute others. He was speaker of the House of Representatives 
of the last Legislature, and as such used every means in his power, 
_ and all the influence of his position, to carry through his favorite 
scheme. We find him here again in this Convention—its Presi- 
_ dent—struggling and urging with all possible energy the same 
isolated and local measure. Has this Convention met for the 
_ purpose of carrying out the objects and aims of local matters? 
_ Have we elected our President with a view that he might use his 
position for that purpose? No, sir. We have assembled for a 
higher purpose; we have assembled to adopt such provisions as 
may best suit the whole people. This section now before us will 
carry out that view, and we should adopt it. We should throw 
_ aside all local, private and personal views, and adopt such as will 
benefit the people of the whole state. 
Mr. EDWARDS of Madison warmly repelled the attack upon 
Alton, and advocated the adoption of the amendment. 
Mr. SMITH moved the previous question; which was ordered. 
Mr. BROWN said, he desired his amendment should be tested 
on its own merits, and not to be endangered by the section to 
which it was to be attached. He inquired, therefore, of the chair 
if he could not withdraw it now, and offer it afterwards as an 
_ additional section. 
The CHAIR replied that he could do so. 
Mr. BROWN withdrew his amendment. 
The question was then taken on the adoption of the second 
section, and it was adopted. 
The Convention then took up the first section of the report 
of the majority of said committee, as follows: 
Section 1. No new county shall be established by the Legis- 
lature which shall reduce the county or counties from which it is 
_ taken, or either of them, to less contents than four hundred square 
miles, nor shall any county be established of less contents, unless 


834 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC’ 


Mr. BROWN offered the amendment, just ae 
amendment to this section, to follow it as a separate section, 2 
Pending which the Convention adjourn 


AFTERNOON 


agreed to. a 
The question pending at the sic ‘was on the 
amendment offered by Mr. Brown, and it was taken thereon, anc 
the amendment was rejected. 
Mr. WILLIAMS offered, as a cabaieues for the section, 
following: 
‘‘All territory which has been or may be stricken off, by le 
islative enactment, from any organized county or panna fi 


to take place, then such territory, so stricken off, Re be a 
remain a part and portion of the county, or counties, from whic 
it was originally taken, for all purposes of county and state g 
ernment, and to participate in all the immunities thereof, uni 
otherwise Hilde au law.”’ 


amendment; but disagreed as to the footie of the reoplee se 
land towards the counties of Brown and Adams. 


any other county, or form a new county; Provided, the count, 
lines are not thereby so altered as to run within ten miles. of | an. Ly 
county seat previously established.”’ 


; 


4 


Ss 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 20, 1847 835 


The question was taken thereon by yeas and nays, and re- 
sulted—yeas 35, nays 96. 

The substitute of Mr. Witt1aMs was then adopted. 

Mr. MARKLEY offered, as an amendment, the same prop- 
osition offered by him in the morning, and which was then 
rejected. 

Mr. WEAD opposed the amendment, which, he said, had far 
its object the division of Fulton county. 

The question was then taken by yeas and nays on the amend- 
ment, and it was rejected—yeas 62, nays 65. 

Mr. TUTTLE offered, as an additional section, the following: 

“There shall be no territory stricken from any county unless 
a majority of all the voters living in such territory shall petition 
for such division.”’ 


[Mr. TUTTLE said: Mr. President—I am among those who 
have not troubled this convention much with long speeches, nor 
would I now trespass on their patience, but that I feel myself 
bound to support the adoption of this section. A similar amend- 
ment to that now offered was unceremoniously laid on the table, 
this morning, and it seems to me that it was for want of proper 
consideration on the subject. I conceive this amendment to be 
of great importance, as great injustice has been done in many 
instances; among which is that of Highland county, which was 
taken off Adams, contrary to the wishes of the people living in 
the territory so divided off; and in consequence the people have 


refused to organize, and persist in their refusal. The territory on 


which I live, also, was stricken off DeWitt County, with every 
voter living in that territory remonstrating against it. These 
two instances, Mr. President, are sufficient, in my mind, to show 
that great injustice may be done, without some such provision as 
this. If a county, Sir, either for political or local purposes, can 
detach any portion without the consent of a majority of the free- 
holders living in such territory, it appears to me to leave great 
room for a county containing 400 square miles to do great in- 
justice to the extremes of the county. I know that my constitu- 
ents will have cause to complain without some such provision as 
I have the honor to offer. 


836 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS Ree 


Some gentlemen say it is not likely that any county would do" 
so. We see it has been done; and may be done again, hence, this’ q 
provision is offered, to prevent it in future without the expressed — 
consent of the people affected by it. I hope that every gentleman © 
on this floor will see the justice of this amendment, and vote for qi 
its adoption.]* . 


Mr. LEMON offered as an amendment thereto: _ ; 
““No territory shall be added to any county without the con- 
sent of the county to which it is added.”’ i 

Both of which were adopted, and the section, as amended, was | 
then adopted. } 
Sec. 2. No county seat shall be removed until the point to . 
which it is proposed to be removed shall be fixed by law, and a 


favor of its removal to such point. 
Mr. WHITESIDE moved to add thereto: 


shall be permanently established. 
““SEc. —. The foregoing, section shall be voted upon sepa. 


receive a majority of all the votes cast for and against it, — 
shall be a permanent provision, and supersede all others at 
in conflict with the same.’’ , 
Mr. SHIELDS moved the previous question; much was 
seconded. a 
The question was taken by yeas and nays on the Seaeiache al Dy: 
and resulted—yeas 29, nays 99. Ry. 
The 2d section was then adopted. “aS 
The balance of the reports were laid on the table, al the 
sections adopted were referred to the committee on Revision. 
Mr. WOODSON moved to take up the report, No. 2, of the — 
committee on Law Reform. Carried. ; 
The Convention then took up the report, and, after a fiohe ¥ 
amendment offered by Mr. Brown, it was adopted, as follows: _ 
55 This speech by Tuttle is taken from the Sangamo Journal, August 24. 2 


A 
te 
. 
v 
") 


oo 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 20, 1847 837 


PREAMBLE 


_ We, the people of the state of Illinois, in order to form a more 


perfect government, establish justice, insure domestic 
tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the 
general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to our- 
selves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this con- 
stitution for the state of Illinois. 


ARTICLE I 


Sec. 1. The boundaries and jurisdiction of the state shall 
continue to be as follows, to-wit: Beginning at the mouth of the 
Wabash river; thence up the same, and with the line of Indiana, 
to the north-west corner of said state; thence east, with the line 
of the same state, to the middle of lake Michigan; thence north, 
along the middle of said lake, to north latitude forty-two degrees 
and thirty minutes; thence west to the middle of the Mississippi 
river; and thence, down along the middle of that river, to its 
confluence with the Ohio river; and thence up the latter river, 
along its north-western shore, to the beginning. 


ARTICLE 2 


Sec. 1. The powers of the government of the state of Illinois 
shall be divided into three distinct departments, and each of them 
to be confided to a separate body of magistracy, to-wit: those 
which are legislative, to one; those which are executive, to another; 
and those which are judicial, to another. 

Sec. 2. No person, or collection of persons, being one of 
these departments, shall exercise any power properly belonging 
to either of the others, except as hereinafter expressly directed or 
permitted, and all acts in contravention of this section shall be 
void. 

Sec. 3. The Governor shall nominate and, by and with the 
advice and consent of the Senate (a majority of all the sen- 
ators concurring) appoint all officers, whose offices are established 
by this constitution, or which may be created by law, and whose 
appointments are not otherwise provided for; and no such officers 
shall be elected or appointed by the General Assembly; Provided, 
further, that officers, whose jurisdiction and duties are confined 


otherwise provided for, shall be appointed 5 
General wins! shall prescribe. 


before entering upon the duties det tak 
the constitution of the United States and of 
an oath of office. 


mittee on pr Ye Carried. 

Sections 1 and 2 were adopted, and section ; 3 
sideration, when the Convention ental: bya! 
8 a. m. ‘ 


; LXI. SATURDAY, AUGUST 21, 1847 


Mr. COLBY moved to suspend the rules, to enable him to 
offer the following resolution: 
\ Resolved, That 5,000 of the 50,000 copies of the constitution, 
ordered to be printed, be printed in the German language. 
; Mr. GREGG said, that in reply to the enquiries of gentlemen, 
he would state that there would be no difficulty in procuring the 
printing of the new constitution in the German language. It had 
been the practice, for several years past, to order the printing of 
_ the executive messages in that language, and it was always 
promptly done. There were several German presses in the state, 
and gentlemen need be under no apprehension that they could 
~~ not be procured to execute our order. 
4 He was in favor of a suspension of the rule to enable his col- 
_ league to introduce his resolution. There was a large number of 
_ Germans in our state, generally honest, intelligent and industrious, 
_ but very many of them have not yet attained to a thorough 
_ acquaintance with the English language. It was due to them 
that they should be afforded the proper facilities to judge cor- 
rectly of our action. We were submitting a new question of vast 
_ importance, for the determination of the people, and they had a 
_ right to demand the means of giving it a fair consideration. No . 
question of greater moment could be submitted to the popular 
decision. It concerned not the present, merely, but the future. 
_ The interests of generations yet to come, were involved—Did, 
then, the proposition of his colleague ask too much? Had not 
_ our German population the right to insist upon the privilege of 
- examining the new constitution in their own mother tongue? It 
_ had been intimated that the proposition of his colleague indicated 
_ a consciousness of ignorance on the part of the Germans. It did 
no such thing. He claimed that they possessed a fair amount 
_ of intelligence, and had a reasonable knowledge of the principles of 
_ our institutions—a much greater knowledge, he thought, than 
_ many of those who insisted upon their ignorance. Did it neces- 


: 839 


¥ 


' 


~ 


f 


. 

) 
ie 
ia 


i 


840 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION 


sarily follow that men must be ignorant because they had not a a 
thorough knowledge of the English language? Was all the wisdom 
of the world locked up in that language? Such was not his opinion. 
The German might comprehend the spirit and character of our 
institutions, and not know a word of English. He wished 
resolution to be adopted. It proposed nothing but justice, and he 
trusted the Convention would see the propriety of affording an 
opportunity to a large and worthy class of our inhabitants, o 
weighing our action, and judging for themselves of the character 
of the new,fundamental law, submitted for their adoption. 

Messrs. McCatien and Brockman opposed the resolution; 
and Messrs. Roman, Cosy and Mark.ey supported it. oe 


[Mr. ROMAN said, that from his peculiar position he felt 
called upon to make a few remarks upon the subject. In the 
first place, said Mr. R., I will state that one-third of the popula- 
tion of the county in Dak I reside are Germans, most of whom 
know nothing of our language. They are to be called on in a short 
time to vote upon the adoption of this constitution. i 

Is it right, sir, to compel this class of citizens to vote upon 
what they cannot possibly comprehend? I am informed that 
there is a German press at Quincy, and there will be no difficult a 
in having the requisite number printed in time to enable them tog 
vote understandingly on the subject. * 

I will remark to my friend from Harding, that if he is of opinion — 
that 1000 should be printed in wild Irish, I have no doubt the 
gentleman would make a good translator, and I will cheerfully ; 
recommend him for that office. a 

The gentleman seems perfectly familiar, from the specimens — 
he has given us, with the wild Irish and all other wild janenae 
except the English. 4 

Mr. ECCLES said—He thought if the convention ace reflect 
one moment, there could be no serious objection to the proposi- 
tion. It would be recollected that there were at this time within 
our borders several thousand Germans, who could not read the 
English language, and who in a short time would be called on to” 
vote for or against the adoption of our constitution. As a general © 
rule he was opposed to making any inroads upon the English” 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 21, 1847 841 


language, but in a case like the present, where so much was in- 
volved, as the adoption of an organic law; he thought an oppor- 
tunity should be afforded to all to understand fully what they 
were called upon to adopt or repeal. He should therefore support 
the proposition. ]|** 


The question was then taken on suspending the rules, and 
resulted—yeas 104. Carried. 

Mr. HURLBUT moved to amend, that 1,000 be printed in 
the Norwegian language. 

Mr. BOND advocated the adoption of the resolution. 

Mr. SERVANT opposed the resolution as a bad precedent. 

Mr. PRATT hoped the amendment of the gentleman from 
Boone would be adopted. There were many Norwegians in the 
state, and he hoped the amendment would be adopted. 

Mr. JAMES moved the previous question; which was seconded. 

The yeas and nays were ordered on the amendment of Mr. 
Hurzsut and resulted—yeas 97, nays 47. 

The question was then taken on the amendment as amended, 
and resulted—yeas 113, nays 33. 

Mr. McCALLEN moved a suspension of the rules to enable 
him to offer the following resolution: 

Resolved, That one thousand of the fifty thousand copies of 
the constitution, ordered to be printed, be printed in the Irish 
and French languages. 

The yeas and nays were ordered, and resulted—yeas 46, nays 
85. 

Mr. LOGAN moved to reconsider the vote adopting a resolu- 
tion to adjourn sine die on the 25th inst. 

Mr. Z. CASEY suggested that it would be better to postpone 
the reconsideration till Monday or Tuesday next. By that time 
we can be able to fix the proper day. 

Mr. LOGAN replied that there was scarcely any one present 
who believed that the business could be disposed of by the 25th, 
and the subject might as well be disposed of at once. 


5°These remarks by Roman and Eccles are taken from the Sangamo 
Journal, August 26. 


842 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO vS ae ag 


Mr. Z. CASEY moved to postpone the motion to reconsider. 
till Monday next. 
Mr. PINCKNEY asked for the reading of te resolution re- 
stricting speeches to fifteen minutes.—He considered that a part 
of it had been violated already, and therefore looked upon the’ 3 
resolution now, as null and void. He 
Mr. DAVIS of McLean was in favor of reconsidering now. 
He did not like to have the business rushed through in a hurry. — 
We should consider well everything we did, and not suffer our- 
selves to fix a day of adjournment, and then have all the business 
to do at the last hour. He hoped the reconsideration Bie oy 
had now. ahs a 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess was in hopes that the recon- ‘i r 
sideration would take place now—No one believed that the — 
Convention would remain in session one hour longer than neces- 
sary, and why, then, have any time fixed for adjournment? ‘The 
most important part of the duty of the Convention was about to 
be performed—the final adoption of the instrument, and the body — 
should not be hurried in its action. He was in hopes the reso- f 
lution would be reconsidered and rescinded, and that no time a 
would be fixed for the adjournment. a 
Mr. KINNEY of Bureau agreed with the gentleman from key ‘ 
Daviess. He looked upon it as useless to fix any time for adjourn- Ty 
ment. We would not stay here a day longer than was necessary, ‘ 
nor would we adjourn before the business that we came here to 
perform was completed. Why, then, fix a time for adjoehneenee 
Mr. Z. CASEY withdrew his motion to porpaaa the motion: id 
to reconsider till Monday next. ; 
And then the resolution was reconsidered. new 
Mr. LOGAN moved to strike out the 25th and insert oth. 
Mr. Z. CASEY thought, when he came here, that all. were 
prepared to carry retrenchment and reform into every branch of | 
the government, and to practise it ourselves. But it appeared — 
that such was not the case. He had listened to speeches here, — 
upon economy, that pleased him; but we had gone off into wild, 
extravagant and useless debate, upon every subject, and had pro- @ 
longed the session six weeks beyond the period when we should | 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 21, 1847 843 


have adjourned. He hoped all discussion would cease, and that 


we would proceed to close the business as soon as practicable. 


Mae on ee 


Mr. SIBLEY said, no one was more anxious to go home than 
he; but he agreed with the gentleman from Jo Daviess, that there 
Was no use in fixing any limit. We could not go home till we had 
done, and when that time came, he supposed there would be no ob- 


_ jection to adjourn. 


Mr. DAVIS of McLean replied to the gentleman from Jeffer- 
son, and said that if anything more than another had tended to 
prolong the session, and to retard the progress of the Convention, 
it was that gentleman’s interminable cry of adjourn! adjourn! 
That gentleman, from whom we all expected so much, on account 
of his age and experience, has kept quiet and silent in his seat; 
has never given us the benefit of one single suggestion and has not 
introduced a solitary provision which would redound to the honor 
and glory of his state. Nothing but continual croaking, adjourn, 
adjourn. He has deprecated the discussions that have taken place 
here, and says they were wild and useless. Was this so? We 
came here—one hundred and sixty-two men—all with views 
differing upon almost every subject. An interchange of opinion 
and sentiment was absolutely necessary, in order to arrive at any 
agreement. We have all had to abandon our own particular 
views to some extent, or else we could never agree upon a consti- 
tution. There was not a single provision in the constitution, that 
he, (Mr. Davis) approved of, taken by itself, yet he would support 
the constitution as a whole, because it embraces those views 
nearest his own that it was possible to get. In this way, we have 
compromised the views of all the members of the Convention, 
and it could only be done by a free and liberal discussion. During 
the whole of this time, the gentleman from Jefferson has not said 


one word on any of these subjects, has not opened his lips, has not 


even made a suggestion that would enable us to approach a con- 
clusion, save and except his eternal cry of adjournment. The 
only thing that gentleman ever offered, was a resolution to adjourn 
on the 3oth of July last. Mr. D. hoped the Convention would 
give full time to consider well what was going on, and not take 
any hasty steps, which perhaps could not be retracted. 


844. ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO 


Mr. E. O. SMITH moved the previous qusaneae ee was 
ordered. a 
The question was taken first on striking out “‘25th, of and 
decided unanimously in the affirmative. And then on inserting = 
““30th,’’ by yeas and nays, and decided—yeas 58, nays 89. 
The resolution (with a blank day) was adopted. is: 
Mr. LOGAN moved to suspend the rules, to enable him to. 
offer the following resolution: > 
Resolved, That the President of the Convention make out, and ’ 
file with the Auditor, his certificate of the pay due to each ce ' 
and officer of the Convention up to the 3oth inst. 


ae i members were allowed now to draw their pay up to chef ‘ 
30th, in a few days we would have no quorum. ~ a 
Mr. LOGAN then added to his resolution: “Provided that — 
the Auditor issue no such warrant until that time.’ 
Messrs. Z. Casey, Knowtton, J. M. Davis and CALDWELL ‘ 
further discussed the resolution. # 
Mr. WITT moved to lay it on the table; yeas 36, sarge not 
counted. 
And the resolution was adopted. a 
Mr. CROSS of Winnebago moved to reconsider tid vee: Ua). 
of a resolution, passed in June last, requiring the members to ~ 
certify, on honor, the number of days in attendance; and the same . 
was reconsidered, and laid on the table. 


that no new business be takenup,&c. And the Convention refused : 
to suspend the rules. “d 

Mr. GEDDES asked to suspend the rules, to offer the follow- q : 
ing resolution: cn 


this the eae important document that ever can oe bela i 
people, have given their reluctant consent. : 


resolucon was the ‘‘document’’, he Wola hardly give his ‘ecluc dy 
tant consent”’ to its going <HeFoke the people’’ as the ‘‘most im- 
portant’ ever heard of. 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 21, 1847 845 


Mr. GEDDES was understood to say, the resolution had 
reference to the constitution, in the Norwegian language. The 
Convention refused to suspend the rules. 

The Convention then resumed the consideration of the report 
of the select committee on the Organization of Townships &c. 

_ The whole action of the Convention had yesterday was on 
motion reconsidered. 

Mr. WEAD presented the following as a substitute for the 
report: 

“‘The General Assembly shall provide, by a general law, that 
the townships and parts of townships in the several counties of 
this state may become incorporated for municipal and local pur- 
poses by a vote of the majority of the qualified electors of such 
county.” 

Mr. KNOWLTON offered as a substitute for Mr. Weap’s 
amendment the following, which was adopted: 

“The Legislature shall provide by law, that the legal voters of 
any county in this state may adopt a township form of govern- 
ment within each county, by a majority of votes cast at any 
general election within said county.’ 

The section was then finally adopted by yeas gall nays—yeas 
87, nays 52. 

And the report of the committee was laid on the table. 

Mr. CALDWELL moved to add to the section the following, 
which was adopted: 

“*Provided, That the Legislature may, by the consent of thestate 
of Kentucky, provide for concurrent jurisdiction on the river Ohio 
as far as the same is a boundary of this state, or in the 
event the state of Kentucky shall consent that the jurisdiction of 
this state shall extend to the middle or some other suitable line 
along said river, as far as the same is a boundary of this state.’’ 

The whole was then referred to the committee on Revision. 

Mr. WOODSON moved to take up the report of the committee 
on the Bill of Rights; which motion prevailed. 

Sections one and two were read and adopted—when 

Mr. KNAPP of Jersey moved to go into committee of the 
whole on the report. 


Pte Oe aS RS AA RR Pee 
F ~ 2% et Mi Rey 


846 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT! T 


Messrs. LEMon and ALLEN opposed the motion. Me 
Cuurcu and McCatten supported it. SW ined 

And the question being taken by yeas and “nays, the motion 
was rejected—yeas 62, nays 65. ovens | a 

And then the Convention adjourned till 3 Pp. m. a 


AFTERNOON 2 Pres, 


Mr. THOMAS moved to reconsider the vote adopting the — 
two sections of the report; and the motion prevailed—yeas 77. 
nays not counted. 

Mr. THOMAS moved to lay the report on the table and take — 
up the old bill of rights (the 8th article of the present constitution. Jo Bt 

Messrs. ConsTaBLE and Knapp of Jersey opposed the motion a 
and Messrs. THomAs, THORNTON, ScATES and GREGG supported i It. 
And the motion was carried—yeas 88, nays not counted. __ m 

The old bill of rights was taken up and consi section by 
section. 

Section one was adopted. 


public good may require it.’ a) 
Mr. CALDWELL moved to insert in the amendment, after a 
the word reform—‘‘or abolish.’’ 
Mr. EDWARDS of Madison opposed the amendment. 
Legislature, under the provision, might hereafter assume the 
power, as representatives of the people, to set the constitution at 
defiance, and proceed to change or abolish the government, a: 
ri as their authority, this provision in the bill of rights. . 


which they were. The words contained in the armenian are 
expressly used in the declaration of independence. He could no 


tion of the power to exist in the people, any authority to change the 
government. On the contrary this declaration of rights was a 


—_) a 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 21, 1847 847 


restraint upon the Legislature. It declared the powers enumerated 
to be in the people alone, and therefore was a restraint upon any 
branch of the government exercising powers which were acknowl- 
edged to be vested solely in the people. All these provisions in 
the bill of rights are intended as restraints. upon government 
in the exercise of their powers. 

‘Mr. HAYES said, he agreed with the gentleman just up, and 
would vote for his amendment. He could not accept it, as he 
desired his own to be tested. If the Convention added it, he would 
gladly vote for it. 

Mr. GREGG advocated the amendment and read the follow- 
ing extract from the declaration of independence: 

““We hold these truths to be self evident—that all men are 
created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain 
unalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty and the 
pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments 
are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the 


consent of the governed; that whenever any form of government 


becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to 
ALTER or to ABOLISH it, and to institute a new government, laying 
its foundation on such principles, and organizing its powers in 
such form as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety 
and happiness.”’ 

Mr. HAYES accepted the amendment as part of his own. 

Mr. HARVEY moved, as he said to show how ridiculous the 
provision would read in the constitution, to add to the amend- 
ment—“in conformity to the mode prescribed by this constitution.” 

Mr. CALDWELL said, that he regretted his feeble health 
which would not permit him to address the Convention upon the 
subject. He was surprised to hear the gentleman from Knox, or 
any man professing his political opinions asserting such a principle 
as that the people had no right to change or abolish their govern- 


_ ment, save in that mode laid down by the government. The 


right of the people to change or abolish their government has been 
recognized and acknowledged by all men. It has never been dis- 
puted by those who acknowledge all power to,be derived from the 
governed. But lately, the principle contained in the ‘gentleman’s 
amendment has been asserted, and an attempt was made to en- 


charter. Men were then found who asserted the natural are 
of man, and for so doing they were seized, tried and imprisoned, 
and this by men whose principles are the same as those asserted 
by the gentleman from Knox. Men who claimed for the people, a 
the right of instituting a government of their own and of throwing 


branded as traitors. Mr. C. said, his strength would not allow ; 
him to proceed. 

The question was taken on Mr. Harvey’s amendment, pee iti 
was rejected—yeas 45, nays 68. i 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin thought the amendment unneces- 
sary. He considered the section as it stood as containing every- 
thing that was desirable. ‘‘All power is in the people.’’ Did not 
this secure everything which the gentleman’s amendment called — 
for? That the people had the right to change or abolish the — 
government was unquestionable. But in what way? What mode — 
did the gentleman desire to express by the amendment? If, by 
the amendment, he intends to assert that the people have the - 
moral right to overturn the government, without regard to the 
constitution, without regard to all the private rights of man, with- 4 
out regard to the rights of minorities, and all those other sacred — 
rights secured among men, than he was not in favor of the amend- 
ment, because it asserts a political heresy. He considered the — a 
amendment as useless. We are not a young state. We have had | . 
a government for years, and the people are familiar with the old E. 
Bill of Rights. They have lived under i it for thirty years, and have. < 


ing political remedies by way of experiment for diseases that haved Ss 
never been complained of. Let gentlemen apply themselves to 
the cure of evils under which the people do suffer, and leave off 4 
doctoring on subjects where no complaint has ever existed. " 

Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to strike out ‘“abolish.’’ d 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess was disposed to favor ae f 
amendment. He believed that all power was in the people, de- — 
rived from them, and delegated by them to those appointed as _ 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 21, 1847 849 


their governors. He believed that they had a right to change or 
abolish the form of that government. Suppose, for instance, that - 
this Convention were to repeal the old constitution, and adjourn 
without forming another, would not the government of the state 
of Illinois be abolished? If the people have the power to alter 
or change this constitution, they have, by the same right, the 
power to abolish it entirely. If they desire it, they have the same 
power and right to abolish the government entirely, as they have 
to change it in one single point. If this be so, what becomes of 
the objections to the amendment? They have, then, a right to 
do away with the government altogether, and substitute any 
other form of government, provided it be republican. The denial 
of this right, and the assertion of the principle that the people 
had no power to abolish or change their government, except by 
that mode pointed out by the government itself, and by its will 
and consent, was the doctrine of the federalists in Rhode Island 
where they resisted the efforts of the people to establish a demo- 
cratic government. This odious doctrine was the cause of the 
trouble in that state where federalism and federalists ruled with 
on iron hand the people, and crushed by its means the upright 
republican spirit of the masses. To sustain this principle, they 
manacled the champion of the people, and branded him as a traitor. 
Were gentlemen disposed to inculcate or preach this doctrine in 
Illinois? If so, and if he was not much mistaken, they would find 
to their cost that such tyrannical and federal sentiments met with 
"no response in the free people here. The federal leaders in Rhode 
Island denied the right of the people to change their government, 
until they conformed with the charter. The democratic party 
there, and everywhere else they were sustained, argued that the 
people, though they have yielded up certain powers for the pur- 
poses of government, have a perfect right to resume that power, 
and to change or abolish that government and to substitute another 
whenever it may suit them so to do. This was the democratic 
doctrine there, was democratic doctrine here, and was recognised 
_ by all except those federalists of Rhode Island, and their kindred 
spirits all over the country. 

Mr. GREEN of Tazewell replied, and defended Rhode Island 
from the charge of federalism. 


850 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI 
Mr. ARMSTRONG withdrew his motion. 7 ane 


_ tion te differed from some of the eae He laid j it Ais 7 
a fact that the people of the state of Illinois, having once forme 
a government, had the power to abolish that government; b 
that they could exercise this power in two ways only. The fi 
was, to abolish or change it in that manner and mode pointed 

by the constitution itself; and the other was, by a revolutior 
This was his view of the matter. Did gentlemen reflect to w. 
lengths their arguments carried them? Was it possible that w! 
they advanced the doctrine that the poeple had the right at . 
time to change the government, they fully apprehended what th 
principle was that they advocated? When he returned to Bon 
county, he would tell Mr. Waite that on the floor of this Conv 

tion there are gentlemen from the north who scout repudiation a 
a monster, but who are boldly advocating the very same doc 
that he is advocating in that county on the stump. He wot 
tell him that in this Convention there are men who are proc 
ing to the world that the people have the power and the right, 
any moment, to rise, overturn the government, break through a 
its obligations, erect another government, destroy every sole 
engagement entered into by their rulers, and at one fell sw 
wipe out the whole state indebtedness. He would tell him i 


principle contained in this amendment, were contending ee 
uously for the very doctrine of repudiation which that snes 
so openly advanced. ; 
Mr. GREGG. Will the gentleman from Montgomery all ) 
me to explain? I can set him right as to my views. _ : 
Mr. DAVIS. Let me Hones sir. When I have got thro 
you may explain. 
Mr. GREGG. I will let you iP alohee but I have a se oy to 
plain when you misrepresent me. 
Mr. DAVIS. I have not misrepresented you. ‘Tf: you sa 
have, then you say that which is not true. 
Mr. GREGG. Well you do misrepresent me. 
Mr. DAVIS. Then you lie. 
Mr. GREGG. And you are a liar. - 


4 


. SATURDAY, AUGUST 21, 1847 851 


} 


) 


__ Mr. DAVIS, (much excited, advanced a step towards Mr. G. 
“and took up a glass containing water from the desk before him, as 
if to throw at Mr. G. and then put it down again and) said, that 
_he had not misstated what the position of the member from Cook 
was. The ground had been taken here that the people had a 
right to break up the government at pleasure, that in so doing 
‘they would destroy that government, violate its contracts, and 
send its creditors away without any power or government from 
whom they could demand their just debts. This he said, was the 
doctrine advanced by the repudiators, and he said so still. 

So far as this difficulty was concerned he would settle that with 
the member from Cook, as soon as the Convention adjourned. 
He would have that matter disposed of at once. They would not 
‘go to St. Louis to settle the question. He had not charged any 
one with repudiation, but the doctrine was the same, whether 

advanced by repudiators on the stump or by men with gold templed 
spectacles here. He would trouble the Convention no longer. 

Mr. LOGAN could see no necessity for any excitement on the 
subject. Gentlemen all agreed that the people had the power 

to abolish the government, and only differed as to how that 
power was to beexecuted and really saw no necessity for any excite- 
ment on thesubject. He did not approve of putting this provision 
in the constitution, as it was one tending to destroy a constitution. 
The people had the power but there was no necessity for this pro- 
vision. ; 

Mr. CALDWELL rose to bring about an explanation, but Mr. 
Davis left the hall. 

Mr. CONSTABLE agreed with Mr. Locan, that the people 
had the power, but doubted the expediency of inserting it in the 
constitution. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon, advocated the amendment at 
some length, and cited the constitutions of nearly all the states in 
the Union to sustain it. 

Mr. KITCHELL offered as a substitute for the amendment 
and the section the following, which was accepted by Mr. Hayes: 

**That all political power is inherent in the people, and all free 
governments are founded on their authority and instituted for 
their peace, safety and happiness; for the advancement of these 


gs0 - ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


think proper.”’ 4 

Mr. HAYES defended the amendment, and pointed out the 
difference between its principle, and the principle of repudiation. 4 
We are compelled from want of room to omit his remarks. a 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, he rose for two purposes, one 
to say something in explanation of what had occurred, and the 
other to offer a few words upon the question. He did not intend — 
to make any apology for what had occurred. But he knew he 
was of an excitable temperament and often said things that were | 
wrong. He desired to say what he had said in the course of his a 
remarks when up last. (Mr. D. here repeated exactly what he 
had said down to the time of the interruption.) This was what 
he had said, and he said so still. He had said in connection with 


. 


what others had said, as to the power of the people and fre nea ; 


as to the doctrine of repudiation, and advocated the same ee 
ple. He did not when he had said this, desire to be ekcegiiee | 


He did not believe hete was a single man on this floor who 7 
tained views of repudiation, but he had alluded to the fact merely | 
to show that the doctrine was the same. 4 
Mr. D. then entered into the discussion of the amendment a1 
in reply to the member from Jo Daviess. i 
Mr. GREGG rose and said, that it was due to himself and due — 
to the Convention that he should make some few remarks upon — 
the difficulty that has taken place and upon the question now ~ 
before us. He had understood the gentleman from Montgomery 


of repudiation, which he scorned and held in abhorrence abo 
every thing. He rose to explain that such were not his views, wh 
thatgentleman told him to let him alone. Under some excitement, 
caused perhaps by that member’s manner, he told him he shoul: 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 212, 1847 853 


_ not misrepresent him. In answer to which was applied an epithet 


: that he felt bound to retort. He considered that the member 


from Montgomery had represented him as holding the doctrines 


_ of the repudiators, but was satisfied from what had fallen from 


the member just now, and from what his friends around him 


assured him was the fact, that such was not the case, and he was 


led to believe that he had not been so represented. 
Mr. G. then addressed the Convention in favor of the amend- 


ment. 


me 


om ee a mh 


Mr. SCATES and Mr. KNAPP continued the discussion upon 
other points, and | 

Mr. ROBBINS moved the previous question, which was 
ordered. 

And the question being taken, by yeas and nays, on the amend- 
ment of Mr. Hayes, it was rejected—yeas 50, nays 74. 

The second section was adopted. 

The Convention adjourned till Monday morning, at 10 o’clock, 
A. M. 


LXII. MONDAY, AUGUST 23, 1847 a 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Patmer of Marshall. 

Mr. DALE asked a suspension of the rules to enable res 
present a petition; and the rules were suspended. 

He then presented the petition of James Stafford and 32 other 
of Bond county, praying that constitutional provision be made f 
the appointment of a general superintendent of common schoo 
which petition was read. Bae 

Mr. D. moved that, as the committee on Education h 
already reported, the petition be laid on the table, to be consider 
when the committee’s report shall be taken up. ith 4 

Mr. HAY moved a suspension of the rules to enable hing to 
offer a resolution; and the Convention refused to tee: e 
rules. 


Rights. 

Section 3 was adopted as follows: i 

Sec. 3. That all men have a natural and indeleasinie 
worship Almighty God according to the dictates of their 
sciences; that no man can of right be compelled to attend, erec 
or support any place of worship, or to sustain any ministry again 
his consent; that no human authority can in any case whate’ 
control or interfere with the rights of conscience; and t! 
erence shall ever be given by law to any relhetone establis 
or modes of worship. ian 

Sec. 4. That no religious test shall ever be required asa q 
fication to any office or public trust under this state. = 

Mr. BALLINGALL moved as a substitute therefor the follo 
ing: hi 

““No religious test shall be required as a qualification for 2 

office or public trust, and no person shall be deprived of any of | 
rights, privileges or capacities, or disqualified from the perform 


10 PNAMOE 


ance of any of his public or private duties, or rendered incompete 
; i ; 


MONDAY, AUGUST 23, 1847 855 


_ to give evidence in any court of law or equity, in consequence of 
_ his opinions on the subject of religion.”’ 

_ Mr. GEDDES moved to lay the substitute on the table; on 
4 which motion the yeas and nays were ordered, and it was decided 
_ in the affirmative—g2 yeas, 42 nays. 

j Mr. THORNTON moved to amend the section by adding the 
following: ‘“‘And that the civil rights, privileges or capacities 
‘ of any citizen shall in no-wise be diminished or enlarged on 
_ account of his religion.’’ 

; Mr. JENKINS offered the following as a substitute for the 
_ section and amendment; which was rejected. 

“‘No person who shall deny the being of a God, or who shall 
hold religious principles incompatible with the freedom or safety 
of the state, shall be capable of holding any office or place of trust 

or profit in the civil department of this state.”’ 
; Mr. ECCLES offered the following as a substitute for the 
- amendment: 
“No person denying the existence of a Supreme Being, or a 
future state of rewards or punishments, shall be a competent wit- 
" ness in any court in this state.’’ 
Mr. CONSTABLE moved to lay the amendments on the 
table; and they were laid on the table. 
The section was then adopted. 
Sec. 5. That elections shall be free and equal. 
Mr. BOND offered, as an additional section, the following: 
Sec. —. The Legislature shall, at its first session under the 
amended constitution, pass such laws as will effectually prohibit 
free persons of color, from immigrating to and settling in this 
state; and to effectually prevent the owners of slaves, or any other 
person, from the introduction of slaves into this state for the pur- 
pose of setting them free; Provided, that when this constitution 
- is submitted to the people of this state for their adoption or re- 
jection, the foregoing shall be voted on separately as a section of 
said constitution; and, if a majority of all the votes cast for and 
_ against the same shall be for its adoption, then and in that case 
_ the same shall form a section of the new constitution, but if a 
majority shall be against its adoption, then the same shall be 
rejected. 


856 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Mr. SINGLETON offered the following as a substitute there- 
for: @ 

**No negro or mulatto shall hereafter be permitted to uci 4 
and exercise any civil or political rights, or residence within this ~ 
state; and the migration or introduction of all persons usually — 
denominated negroes or mulattoes into the state, is hereby forever — 
prohibited; and the Legislature shall at their first session, provide — 
such adequate penalties as will secure the fullest operation of the — 
foregoing provisions. This section shall be submitted to the 
people for their ratification or rejection, and to be voted upon as 
a separate section, and if more votes be cast for its adoption than ~ 
against it, it shall become a part of the constitution of this state.’’ — 

Mr. WHITNEY was surprised that such an abhorrent prop- 
osition should be introduced into a constitutional Convention — 
in the state of Illinois, in this enlightened age of civilization, — 
humanity, and christianity. Were gentlemen serious when they © 
propose to us to engraft such a cruel and abhorrent proposition © 
in the constitution? If the brightest seraph that stands at the 
foot-stool of the great Jehovah were to descend, by the order of ~ 
his master, and tell him that this constitution, in all other respects, x 
was the most perfect production of human intellect and this pro- 
vision were placed in it, he would place his right arm in a blaze — 
and burnit tothe shoulder, [rather] than sufferit tobe theinstrument 
in depositing a ballot in favor of the constitution. What new light — 
had broken on Illinois that in this day of civilization and humanity, ~ 
we were called upon to adopt, in our fundamental law, a provision 
that would disgrace the code of any government—the most des- — 
potical. He believed that the friends of the measure would be — 
able to carry it here, and carry it before the people, but did they — 
not endanger the constitution by it? Would not those who — 
feared and abhorred this provision, when once satisfied that it — 
would pass, in order to save the character of the state from sham: 
and obloquy in the face of the world, all vote against the consti- — 
tution? a 


[Mr. WHITNEY of Boone, rose and thus addressed the & 
chair: Mr. President,—The few minutes allowed for debate, by — 
the rules of this convention, precludes me from an investigation 4 


MONDAY, AUGUST 23, 1847 857 


of the subject under consideration; and I arise only to express my 
astonishment, at the introduction of the section and the proposed 
substitute, and my abhorrence of the principles they propose to 
incorporate into the organic law of the State. 

On this question I find myself singularly situated: compelled 
by principle to pursue a course that will brand me here as an 
abolitionist, while I know my own constituents, of every political 
cast, consider me anything but a political abolitionist. 

_I am not wanting in kind feeling and sympathy for the people 
in the southern portion of this State, nor of this nation; and I 
believe that misapprehension prevails among our brethren of the 
south in regard to the real sentiments entertained by the North; 
or such a section would never have been proposed to disgrace the 
constitution of the State of Illinois. 

And here in a few words I propose to define, now and forever, 
my position on the question of slavery and all laws affecting the 
colored race; and what I understand to be the position of the 
North on this exciting subject. 

We hold it to be the right, the duty of the citizens of every 
state, on all occasions and under all circumstances, by all reason- 
able and just means, to oppose the extension and perpetuity of 
slavery and its attendant evils; and the duty of every citizen of 
this boasted land of freedom, to oppose the existence of slavery 
in all the territories under the jurisdiction of the general govern- 
ment, and the further acquisition of slave territory, and to employ 
all constitutional means for confining slavery and slave laws, 
with all their attendant d/essings and curses to the States in which 
slavery now exists. 

I listened with attention to arguments of members on this 
subject, some week since; I heard their dolorous complaints of 
certain counties in the State being overrun with an idle and 
vicious colored population; and I then believed, and now believe, 
they told the truth. But sir, when they told us of the evils, did 
they tell us that efforts had been put forth to elevate these unfor- 
tunate persons in the scale of being? No sir, no. No one told 
us that the Gospel had been carried among them; that schools 
had been established for their improvement; nor that amy means 


of intellectual culture had been put within their reach. Hence 


Se Ne RL TT OREN Oye RL eee en Se ORT ye : 
RRS SAF bY PUIG a cay abhi ie Ne 


858 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


the cause of the evils is obvious and their parentage certains 
equally obvious and certain are the means of cure. owes: ‘ 
Mr. President, the spirit of fanaticism and misguided zeal on 4 
this subject is passing away, and the spirit of liberty, humanity _ 
and philanthropy, 1 is seeking its natural and healthful channels; Be: 
but zs sending its currents deep and strong through all the Northern 4 
soil! ‘a 
And it is not sufficient for me that a separate submission of this | 
section is proposed. It is wrong in principle; it is in violence ofa ait 
truth, justice and humanity, and I am opposed to itsgoing forth. } 
to the world in any form, the inhuman and crowning error of this. 
august assembly. is 
The report from the committee on the bill of poe As for which | 
this substitute is proposed, incorporates the principles, contained q " 
in the substitute, into the constitution without a sian sub-_ 4 
mission to the people. - 
It has, Mr. President, been frequently and tauntingly remarked 
on this floor, of several of the small counties, that they are not 
of the State of Illinois. This has been gratuitously said of the © 
county I have the honor in part, to represent. Now, sir, I do not F 
claim that the county of Boone exercises any very considerable in- — 
fluence in the State, nor do I claim to exercise any controlling 
influence over that county; but I thank Heaven there is ove vote 
in that county I do control; and it is of that vote 1 speak whenI 
declare before Him that /ives forever and ever—and I call Heaven i 
and earth to record; that if the highest Seraph that waits before — 
the Omniscient Throne should descend, and declare to me that ~ 
all of the constitution, beside, was as perfect as human ingenuity 
and wisdom could make it, I would doom my hand to the fames — 
before it should bear to the polls a vote for a constitution embrac- 
ing the principles contained in the section now under considera % 
tion. : 
And it should not be thought strange that a few of Ve mem- 
bers of this convention, who were raised in States that have long 
since wiped the foul blot of slavery from their constitutions, and 
from their statute books all laws that oppress the colored race, 
should express, by their votes, their abhorrence of the dase prop- 
osition on which we are now called to deliberate. Nor should © 


MONDAY, AUGUST 23, 1847 859 


honorable gentlemen be surprised to find that some of us who have 
been, from our infancy, accustomed to hear the 4th of July break 
from valley, from hill side, and mountain top, with 
‘“My native country, ¢hee, 
Sweet land of liberty! 
Of thee I sing, 
Land where my fathers died, 
Land of the Pilgrim’s pride, 
From every mountain side 
Let freedom ring,” 
should by our votes, on this question declare our eternal opposi- 
tion to injustice and oppression. Nor should they be surprised 
that a few of us, who in childhood were pointed to that proud era 
when the heroes of ’76 flung to the breeze the standard sheet, and 
the bird of Jove soared from her tempest rocked eyrie on the 
mountain pine and perched upon its ample folds—that we who 
have been taught, and believe, the doctrine proclaimed by the 
Continental Congress in a voice that shook the political universe, 
““That all mankind are created equal and are endowed by their 
Creator with certain inalienable rights, among which are life, 
liberty, and the pursuit of happiness;’’ dare, amid the whirlwind 
of slavery that is this hour raging through this convention, record 
our votes against the inhuman principles of the section before us, 
let them be presented when, and in whatever form, they may. 
Numbers may triumph, and this convention may, and undoubt- 
edly will, declare by. an overwhelming majority that humanity, 
truth and justice are strangers to the State. Yet, sir, I believe 
that truth is omnipotent and will ultimately prevail; and though, 
““Crushed to earth she will rise again; 
The eternal years of God are her’s, 
While error, wounded, writhes in pain, 
And dies amid her worshipers.’’ 

And I thank God that I am this day well enough to be in my 
seat; and I thank Him for the opportunity I have, standing in 
the Capitol, amidst the assembled wisdom of the State,—the free 
representative of a free constituency, to declare of this section, 
by my vote, ‘‘out damned spot, out I say.’’ And though I may 
be forced, from surrounding circumstances, to the painful con- 


is not filled by a vindictive Being who delights to wreathe his 

brow with oppression and human misery—I look down the dark — 

vista of coming years, and behold the dawn of the auspicious day, + 
“‘When prone to the dust oppression shall be hurled, ~ 
Her name, her nature, withered from the world.” ]*” — 


Mr. AKIN said, that he understood this was a compromise _ 
question, and also understood that there was to be no debate; — 


therefore, he moved the previous question. 


At the urgent request of many gentlemen, the call for the 


previous question was withdrawn. 


Mr. McCALLEN said, that he was not prepared to travel A 


over the broad field of poesy that the gentleman from Boone had 


traversed, but would take a less beautiful, but a more common _ 
sense view of the subject. One would suppose from the remarks — 


of the gentleman, that the stars that gem the heavens, and shine 
like brilliants in the canopy above, if this proposition be passed, 


would be blotted out; that the heavenly bodies would be obscured, 7 
that the evolutions of the globe and all the luminaries of creation 


would be stopped still in their orbits, and all nature would be 
reduced to one chaos of darkness and deep obscurity. What an 


awful state of affairs! He believed no such thing, but would say ~ 


to those gentlemen that the people of the south would not suffer 


the evils and vices attendant on a negro population any longer. 
He warned gentlemen that the south had borne with them long ~ 
enough—had suffered them to remain there—had endured all 
species of inconvenience and injury from them, and could bear 
it no longer. He warned them that unless they now came for- — 


=y 


ward and permitted adequate protection to the south from being 


overrun by these swarms of free negroes from every state in the 
Union, that the people of the south would take the matter into 


their own hands, and commence a war of extermination. Were 
they to sit quietly and witness this degraded population, these 


idle, thieving negroes, who were driven from other states, or set 


8’ This account of Whitney’s speech is taken from the Sangamo Journal, 
September 3. 


MONDAY, AUGUST 23, 7847 861 


free on condition of their coming here, overrun the whole south, 
and raise no voice to call for protection, for fear of shocking the 
humane feelings of such men as the gentleman from Boone and a 
few others? The south had already given up much, by allowing 
this matter to be submitted separately, and he demanded its 
passage in justice to her people. 

Mr. PRATT said, that this subject needed no discussion; 
and, as much time would be spent in crimination and recrimin- 
ation, and all to no good, he moved the previous question. On 
which motion the yeas and nays were ordered, and the Convention 
refused to second the demand for the previous question—yeas 59, : 
nays 76. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery said, the people at the south— 
the constituents of the southern delegates upon this floor—are 
all in favor of an unqualified prohibition of negro immigration; 
they do not, as their delegates well know, want any such provision 
to be submitted to them separately, they want it to be embodied 
in the constitution. But, sir, the southern delegates here, in a 
spirit of compromise have yielded the well known desire of their 
constituents, and have agreed to submit to the people the pro- 
vision in a separate form, in order that if the north had the numeri- 
cal strength to let them vote it down. Under these circumstances 
he thought that there would have been no discussion upon the 
subject, he believed with the gentleman from Jo Daviess, that not 
a single vote will be changed if we discuss the subject for a month, 
but the south was willing to vote silently upon the subject, and 
the gentleman from the north refused todo so. They have taken, 
as he considered, the wrong course and have gone into a discussion. 
He would say a word or two upon the subject which had been 
alluded to—slavery. These gentlemen come here and upbraid us 
as the friends and advocates of slavery and the unfeeling and 
tyrannical oppressors of the poor degraded negro. We are no 
such thing. We are men who have come here from southern and 
slaveholding states, we are men who have seen the evils of a negro 
population, we came here to escape them, and we wish to prevent 
the increase within this state of that class of population more 
Vicious and more degraded than even slaves—free negroes. 

It came with ill grace from the gentlemen from the north, to 


: 


862 


charge those at the south with being oppressors of the n 
Where did they come from, who were their ancestors? They, sir, 
are the sons of New England and of New York. They are the — 
descendents of those men, who, when their states adopted the 
scale of years for the emancipation of the slaves within their limits, 
carried off their negroes to the southern market and sold them. 
for cash, and returned to invest the price of human souls, directed ii: 
by law to be emancipated at a certain time, in land, in cattle and oe 
other property. These charges come from men who have become 
heirs to property purchased with the price of human blood and 
immortal souls! How can they then charge us with being the — 
oppressors of negroes, when we only ask that we may be allowed 
to keep them from our midst, to be rid of their evils and their 
thieving, while they are enjoying the proceeds of negroes sold by 
their ancestors, the price of human blood and degradation. i 

Mr. PINCKNEY opposed the amendment as unjust and 
oppressive, and as calculated to excite against the constitution 
the opposition of a large class of people who had some regard for 
humanity and justice. 

Mr. WEAD could not see, in the proposition now baie them, 
any of those unjust, inhuman or abhorrent features, that other 
gentlemen seemed to have discovered. It could not work injury 
to any person. It would not operate upon the rights, privileges 
and property of those negroes residing here at the adoption of the 
constitution; it had for its object only the prohibition of negroes 
immigrating here for the future, and the crowds of that race 
flowing in upon our state, filling up our southern counties with an 
idle, worthless and degraded population, which not only were a 
trouble and a nuisance to the communities near which they settled, 
but also prevented a better population from occupying the lands — 
covered by them. That we had the right to exclude them he con- 
sidered a plain question. We had the right to exclude from our 
soil any race or class of persons, no matter what their color, their 
creed, or their place of nativity. The first duty of every govern- 
ment was the protection of its own citizens, and to do so, if 
such were necessary they may exclude the immigration of any 
people. The question was then one of expediency, and not one 
of humanity, christianity, or benevolence. Such was but the 


a ee eee 


MONDAY, AUGUST 2}, 1847 863 


_ miserable, false and absurd veil thrown over the true question by 


those who, desirous of other ends, attempt to hide them by their 


_ loud cries of sympathy and humanity for the human race. Gen- 


tlemen from the south have told us of the evils and wrongs in- 
flicted upon the southern part of the state, in consequence of the 
crowding in upon them of this negro population, which is emphati- 
cally the refuse of humanity. It was then the question, shall we 
protect the white inhabitants of this state from any further evils 
and wrongs from this wretched population, which other states 
were driving out of their limits and forcing into our own. 
Will any man refuse to give the people the privilege of voting upon 
a provision that will afford them protection? Mr. W.said that when 
this subject was up before, he considered that the Legislature 
had the power to impose adequate barriers to the immigration 
of these negroes, but as the question now before them submitted 
the question to the people, he was willing to allow them to vote 
upon it. 

Mr. SINGLETON advocated his amendment and pointed out 
its more practicable and efficient points as compared with the 
amendment of Mr. Bonp. 

Mr. WILLIAMS opposed both propositions. 

Mr. PALMER of Macoupin defended his position upon the 
question. He would vote for the proposition. While up, he 
administered a rebuke to those members on the floor who had 
represented him at home as having voted with the abolitionists. 

Mr. BLAIR moved the previous question; which was ordered. 

Mr. LOGAN moved the Convention adjourn. Lost. 

The question was then taken by yeas and nays on the substi- 
tute offered by Mr. SINGLETON, and it was rejected—yeas 14, 
nays 127. 

The question recurred on the amendment of Mr. Bonn, was 
taken by yeas and nays, and decided in the affirmative—yeas 97, 
nays 56. 

And the section was then adopted. 

And the Convention then adjourned till 3 P. m. 


864 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS = 


AFTERNOON 


Sec. 6. That the right of trial by jury shall remain inviolate. — 
Mr. SWAN moved to amend the section by adding thereto: 
~“*The Legislature shall pass no law, nor shall any law be in ~ 
force after the adoption of this constitution, that shall prohibit the a 
citizens of this state from feeding the hungry, or clothing the naked, 
or restrain them from exercising the common principles of philan- 
thropy or dictates of humanity. Nor shall any law remain in ~ 
force that recognizes the principle that a person of color is pre- 
sumed to be a slave until he has proved himself to be free; or that — 
prescribes whipping as a punishment for offences. But the 
Legislature shall provide by law for the support of schools for the — 
education of colored children, and shall adopt such other measures — 4 
as they may deem expedient | for the benefit and iat, ree of 
colored persons in this state.’ 
Mr. McCALLEN moved to lay the ainendiment on che table. 
Mr. WHITNEY asked the yeas and nays; which were ordered | 
and resulted—yeas 97, nays 28. "4 
Mr. CHURCH offered the following, as an amendment to the — 
section: a 1 
‘‘The Legislature shall pass no law preventing any citizen of — 
any one of the United States, from immigrating to or settling 
within this state.’ ; 
Mr. AKIN moved to by the amendment on the table. i 
On which motion the yeas and nays were ordered and re- 
sulted—yeas 84, nays 49. 
Mr. WHITNEY offered as a substitute for the section: 
‘*Trial by jury shall be allowed in all suits at law, but a jury @ 
trial may be waived by the parties in all civil cases in the manner 
prescribed by law.’’ Rejected—yeas 30, nays not counts 
The section was then adopted. 
Section seven was adopted, as follows: i 
Sec. 7. That the people shall be secure in their persons, houses, 
papers, and possessions, from unreasonable searches and seizures; 
and that general warrants, whereby an officer may be commanded 
to search suspected places without evidence of the fact committed, 
or to seize any person or persons not named, whose offences are ~ 


RS J 
v 


MONDAY, AUGUST 23, 1847 865 


not Fe tdcularly described and supported by evidence, are dan- 
 gerous to liberty, and ought not to be granted. 

Sec. 8. That no freeman shall be imprisoned or disseized of 
his freehold, liberties or privileges, or outlawed or exiled, or in any 
manner deprived of his life, liberty, or property, but by the judg- 
ment of his peers or the law of the land. 

Mr. CROSS of Winnebago: moved to strike out ‘‘freeman,”’ 
in the first line, and insert “‘person;’’ and demanded the yeas and 
nays, which were ordered. The motion was rejected—yeas 26, 
- nays 100. 

The section was then adopted. 

Sec. 9. That in all criminal prosecutions, the accused hath 
a right to be heard by himself and counsel; to demand the 
nature and cause of the accusation against him; to meet the 
witnesses face to face; to have compulsory process to compel 
the attendance of witnesses in his favor; and in prosecutions 
by indictment or information, a speedy public trial by an im- 
partial jury of the county, or districts, wherein the offence shall have 
been committed, which county or district shall have been pre- 
viously ascertained by law; and that he shall not be compelled 
to give evidence against himself. 

Mr. PALMER of Marshall offered, as an additional section, 
a proposition in relation to the pay of members of the Legis- 
lature, &c. 

Mr. DALE moved to lay it on the table. 

Mr. PALMER withdrew his motion. 

Mr. SIM offered an amendment; which was adopted. 

Mr. Kitcuei and Mr. Haw ey offered amendments; which 
were rejected. 

The section was then adopted. 

Sec. 10. That no person shall, for any indictable offence, 
be proceeded against criminally by information, except in cases 
arising in the land or naval forces, or the militia when in actual 
service, in time of war or public danger, by leave of the courts, 
for oppression or misdemeanor in office. 

Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to substitute therefor, the follow- 
ing: 

“No person shall be held to answer for,a criminal offence 


866 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


unless on the presentment or indictment of a grand jury, e 
in cases of impeachment, or in cases cognizable by justices of the 
peace, or arising in the army or navy, or in the mee when : 
in actual service in time of war or public danger. ; 
And the question was taken thereon—yeas 65, nays 39. No 
quorum voting. 4 
Mr. THORNTON moved to strike out the words: vor in : 
cases cognizable by justices of the peace, or.’ 
Mr. LOCKWOOD added to his amendment:— ‘Provided 
that justices of the peace shall try no person, except as a court 
of inquiry, for any offence punishable with imprisonment or by 
death, or by fine above $100.’’ ¥ 
Mr. THORNTON then withdrew his motion to amend. 
And the substitute was adopted. A, 
Sec. 11. No person shall, for the same offence, be twice put 
in jeopardy of his life or limb; nor shall any man’s property be 
taken or applied to public use, without the consent of his repre-_ 
sentatives in the General Assembly, nor without just compen 
sation being made to him. 
Mr. KITCHELL offered the following, as an additional 
section: oh 3 
‘‘That no person ought to be detained or pees to atte d 
as witness in any case without just compensation, nor shall aa 
man’s particular services be demanded, or property taken ot 
applied to public use, without just compensation, and in accord. 
ance with law.’’ fi 
Mr. CONSTABLE moved that it be laid on ree table, 
Carried. a 
Mr. KITCHELL moved to amend by addin? “And the! . 
Legislature shall make provision, by law, for the payment of | 
witnesses in criminal cases, where they are relainee to atten 
courts out of their own counties.”’ 
Messrs. Locan and ConsTaBLeE opposed the pave ts est 
Mr. HARVEY moved that it be laid on the table. Carried. | “a 
The section was then adopted. + 
Sections twelve and thirteen were adopted as follows: ros 
Sec. 12. Every person within this state ought to find a cer — 
tain remedy, in the laws, for all injuries or wrongs which he 


MONDAY, AUGUST 23, 1847 867 


may receive in his person, property or character; he ought to 
obtain right and justice freely, and without being obliged 

_ to purchase it, completely and without denial, promptly and with- 

out delay, conformably to the laws. 

_ Sec. 13. That all persons shall be bailable by sufficient sure- 

_ ties, unless for capital offences where the proof is evident or the 

_ presumption great; and the privilege of the writ of habeas corpus 

_ shall not be suspended, unless, when in cases of rebellion or inva- 

sion, the public safety may require it. 

Sec. 14. All penalties shall be proportioned to the nature of 

_ the offence, the true design of all punishment being to reform, 

“not to exterminate mankind. 

__ Mr. McCALLEN moved to amend the section, by making 

_ it read thus: 

a “All penalties shall be proportioned to the nature of the 

petence, the true design of all punishment being to reform, not 
to exterminate mankind, therefore punishment by death shall 
not be inflicted.’’ 

4 Mr. HAYES moved, as a substitute for the ations amend- 
ment, the following: ‘“‘It shall be in the discretion of the jury, 
in capital trials, to substitute confinement in the state’s prison for 

on punishment.’’ 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough moved to lay both amend- 

"ments on the table; on which motion the yeas and nays were 

"ordered, and resulted—yeas 83, nays 49. 

The section was then adopted. 

Section fifteen was adopted, as follows: 

Sec. 15. No person shall be imprisoned for debt, unless upon 

refusal to deliver up his estate for the benefit of his creditors, in 

“such manner as shall be prescribed by law, or in cases where there 

"is strong presumption of fraud. 

Mr. HARVEY moved to add, as a different section, the follow- 

“Ing; which was adopted: 

_ “There shall be neither slavery nor involuntary servitude in 

Ethis state, only as a punishment for crime, whereof the party 

shall have been duly convicted.’’ 

Sec. 16. No ex post facto law, nor any law impairing the 


ee ee ee a 


validity of contracts shall ever be made; and no con 
work corruption of blood or forfeiture of estate. 


danniine a party of any remedy for enforcing a con 
existed when the contract was made.’’ Lad 
Mr. WITT moved to lay the amendment on the ‘ables 
motion was rejected. Bo aah Pe iste 
The amendment was then rejected. 
Mr. LOGAN moved to strike out ‘‘validity,”’ and i 
“‘obligation.’’ Carried. 
Mr. WILLIAMS offered, as an additional sections (in a me 
fied form) an amendment which had been ssacior cee 
by him before, and was rejected. 
Mr. EDWARDS offered a proviso, to be added to its whic 
was adopted. eee 
Mr. HARVEY offered another proviso, hicks was ado 
And without taking a vote, the Convention adjourned Ht 
morrow at 8 A. M. ; 


LXIII. TUESDAY, AUGUST 24, 1847 


The question pending at the adjournment yesterday was on 
the amended amendment of Mr. WIL.iaMs. 

Mr. WHITESIDE moved to add to it the following: 

Provided, further, That this amendment shall not apply to 
fugitives from labor. 

Mr. HARVEY moved to lay the whole on the table; which 
motion was refused. 

The question was then taken by yeas and nays on the amend- 
ment of Mr. WuirTesipg, and it was adopted. Yeas 73, nays 58. 

Mr. HARVEY offered an additional proviso. 

Mr. TURNBULL moved to lay it on the table. Yeas 58, 
nays 58. 

And Mr. H.’s amendment was adopted. 

Mr. KNAPP of Scott offered an additional proviso. 

Mr. WILLIAMS inquired if he could not withdraw his amend- 
ment; and was answered he could not, the same having been 
amended. 

Mr. WILLIAMS moved to lay the subject on the table; and 
the whole was laid on the table. 

Mr. BROWN offered the following, as an additional section: 

“If any person shall hereafter challenge another to fight a 
duel, with any deadly weapon or in any manner whatever, the 
probable issue of which might resultin the death of either of the par- 
ties; or if any person shall accept or shall be the bearer of achallenge, 
or an acceptance of a challenge, whether the same be verbal or 
written, knowing the same to be such; or if any person shall be 
present at the fighting of any duel as aforesaid as the second or 
aid of either party, every person so offending shall thereafter be 
rendered incapable of holding or being elected to any office of 
honor, profit or trust, either civil or military, under the govern- 
ment of this state.”’ 

Mr. GRIMSHAW offered, as a substitute therefor, the follow- 
ing: 


869 


donerirelant fight a duel, or lend or en: a choficaes for t that 
purpose, or be aider or abettor in fighting a duel, shall be deprive d 
of the right of holding any office of honor or profit 1 in this: state; 
and shall be punished otherwise in such manner as a or may | beg 
prescribed by law. i 
Mr. WHITESIDE moved to lay them both: on the table. 
And demanded the yeas and nays thereon, which were taken, a nd 
resulted—yeas 7, nays 126. f 
The substitute was then adopted, and the section was adopted. 
Sec. 17. That no person shall be liable to be transported ow A 
of this state for any offence committed within the same. 
Mr. WHITNEY offered, as an additional section, the follo 
ing, which was ruled to be out of order: ' 
Resolved, That the substitute for section six, article eighty! i 
offered yesterday by Mr. Wuitney, be, and the same is hereby é 
expunged from the journals of this Convention, and that the ‘ 
secretary write across the face of said substitute, the word ‘ ‘ex 
punged;’’ and that the public printer print the word ‘ ‘expunged 
on the face thereof. ie 
Mr. BROCKMAN moved to add to the section, the follow : 
ing: 
Provided, That the word freeman, as employed in thie cons! 
tution, shall not extend to any negro or mulatto, nor shall the _ 
Legislature, ever hereafter, extend the right of suffrage to negroes 
or mulattoes of African blood. Boge a 
Mr. ADAMS moved to lay it on the table. a 
Mr. SINGLETON demanded the yeas and nays on the motion, | 
and they were ordered, and resulted—yeas 60, nays a St M 
The section was then adopted. De 
Mr. WITT moved to reconsider the vote idvent yesterday : 
rejecting the proposition of Mr. Wuirney, to amend the six 
section, (in relation to jury trials); and the vote was reconsidere Ri. 
Mr. WHITNEY modified his amendment to read as follow: 
and to be added to the sixth section as it stood: 
‘*And shall extend to all cases at law, without regard to hel 
amount in controversy.’’ 
And the amendment was adopted—yeas 64, nays 50. 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 24, 1547 871 


Section eighteen was then adopted, as follows: 

Sec. 18. That a frequent recurrence to the fundamental prin- 

ciples of civil government is absolutely necessary to preserve the 

a blessings of liberty. 

i Mr. KNAPP of Jersey offered, as an additional section, the 

cm following, and it was adopted: 

if “‘The military shall be in strict subordination to the civil 

power.”’ 

Sec. 19. That the people have a right to assemble together, 
in a peaceable manner, to consult for their common good, to in- 
struct their representatives, and to apply to the General Assembly 
for redress of grievances. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery offered, as an additional section, 
the following, to follow section nineteen: 

“The Legislature shall pass laws, with adequate penalties, 
preventing the intermarriage of whites with blacks; and no colored 
person shall ever, under any pretext, hold any office of honor or 
__. profit in this state. 

3 Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, he did not think we had 

any right by the constitution to interfere with the particular 

__ tastes of people; if whites felt disposed to marry blacks it was a 

mere matter of taste, and we ought not to interfere with it. 

Hf Mr. DEITZ moved to lay it on the table. Rejected—yeas 55, 

my nays 63. 

‘ia Mr. WITT moved the previous question; ordered. 

a The question was then taken by yeas and nays on the adoption 
of the section, and was decided in the affirmative—yeas 79, nays 
33- 

Section 19 was then adopted. 

Sec. 20. The mode of levying a tax shall be by valuation, so 
that every person shall pay a tax in proportion to the value of the 
property he or she has in his or her possession. 

Mr. BOSBYSHELL offered as an additional section to follow 
section twenty, the following: 

““The people at all times have a right to alter, reform or abolish 
their form of government, whenever the public good may require 
fo 


Mr. HURLBUT moved to lay it on the table. On which 


* ey TOE uel Rarerage | Reyes Mi Ye 


872 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS - 


motion the yeas and nays were ordered and taken, and result 
yeas 77, nays 47. a 
Mr. TURNBULL offered an amendment to section 20, whic h 
Mr. Z. CASEY moved to lay, together with the oe on the | 
table; and the motion was carried. a 
Section 21 was laid on the table. , 4 4 
Mr. KNAPP offered the following as an additional sectiORag : 
and it was adopted: aa 
““No soldier shall, in time of peace, be quartered i in any hous 2 . 
without the consent of the owner; nor in time of war except in 
manner prescribed by law.”’ : 
Mr. SERVANT offered the following as an additional sectior a 
which was adopted—yeas 72, nays 44. a 
‘‘That from and after the adoption of the constitution, every 
person who shall be elected or appointed to any office of profit, | 4 
trust, or emolument, civil or military, legislative, executive, or 
judicial, under the government of this state, shall, before he j 
enters upon the duties of his office, in addition to the oath pre- ; 
scribed in this constitution, take the following oath: “I———, ~ 
do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I have not fought a duel, nor 
sent or accepted a challenge, the probable issue of which might — 
have been the death of the challenger or challenged, nor been 
second to either party, nor in any manner aided or assisted in 
such duel, nor been knowingly the bearer of such challenge or 
acceptance, since the adoption of the constitution; and that I will 
not be so engaged or concerned, directly or indi ecnens in or ab 
any such duel during my continuance in office, so help me God. a é 
Src. 22. The printing presses shall be free to every person 
who undertakes to examine the proceedings of the General Assem- — 
bly or of any branch of government; and no law shall ever be made — 
to restrain the right thereof. The free communication of thoughts — 
and opinions is one of the invaluable rights of man; and iver 4 
citizen may freely speak, write, and print on any sabicce bein 
responsible for the abuse of that liberty. 
Mr. SHUMWAY offered as an additional section: 
“‘No branch or branches of any United States bank shall b 
located in this state.”’ 


} 


4 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 24, 1847 873 


Mr. ECCLES moved a call of the Convention; which was 
ordered and made. 

Mr. DEITZ moved to amend by adding—“‘unless first having 
obtained the consent of the Legislature.”’ 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough moved to lay the whole sub- 
ject on the table. Carried—yeas 74, nays 63. 

Section twenty-three adopted. 

Mr. WILLIAMS moved a reconsideration of the vote adopting 
the section prohibiting intermarriage of whites with negroes. 

Pending which the Convention adjourned till 3 p. m. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. WILLIAMS withdrew his motion to reconsider pending 
when the Convention adjourned. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon moved the bill of rights, as 
amended, be referred to the committee on Revision, with the 
following preamble and resolution in the shape of instructions to 
that committee: 

WHEREAS, so much of section nineteen of the bill of rights as 
provides for the restriction upon blacks, in connection with certain 
civil rights, privileges and immunities, is an implied admission of 
their possession of such rights, as citizens of this state and the 
United States, in the absence of such constitutional restrictions; 
and, whereas, the directions therein given to the Legislature pre- 
supposes that any portion of the people of this state would be in 
favor of conferring such rights and privileges (as is therein denied) 
to colored people; and whereas, the Legislature would have no 
power to allow to persons of color to hold office and without any 
constitutional prohibition have already passed laws with severe 
penalties, not only making intermarriage and marriage contracts 
between them and the whites a criminal offence, but null and void, 
therefore, 

Resolved, That said article be committed to the committee on 
Revision with instructions to omit so much of said section as refers 
to persons of color. 

Messrs. Epwarps of Sangamon, CampBELL of Jo Daviess and 
Locan advocated the instructions; Messrs. Lockwoop and PALMER 
of Macoupin opposed them. 


874 


Ana the instructions were adopted eat 71s nays ry 
Mr. ARCHER moved to take up the report of the comm 
districting the state into senatorial and representative districts. 
_Mr. CALDWELL said, there was other business es the | co 


to re-apportion that district. 
Mr. ARCHER withdrew his motion. vat . 
Mr. CONSTABLE renewed the motion. PG: 
Mr. ECCLES opposed the motion on the same grounds io 
by Mr. CatpweELt. 
Mr. 
ordered, and the report was taken up—yeas 68, nays ren . 
Mr. WITT moved to refer the report to a select canta 
one from each judicial circuit. 
A long debate ensued upon what disposition should be made 
of the report, in which many gentlemen expressed their disappro 
bation of the report. i 
The question was taken, and the reference was refused. __ 
Mr. CRAIN moved to refer to a select committee of 9, tha 
portion of the report referring to the 2d and 3d judicial circuits. 
Mr. HOGUE moved to add the 4th. \ 
Mr. ARCHER moved to add the sth. F 
Mr. AKIN moved to lay the reference on the table; on whic) 
motion the yeas and nays were ordered, and resulted—yeas 
nays 49. : 
Mr. McCALLEN moved as a substitute for the report | the 
following: 
“Until there shall be a new apportionment of sehiatots’ a 
representatives, the state shall be divided into senatorial and re 
resentative districts; and senators and representatives shal! 
apportioned among the several counties of the state in accord 
with the provisions of an act of the General Assembly enti 
“An act to apportion the representation in the several counties 
this state,’’ approved February 25, 1847. vik 
Mr. WITT moved to amend the 22d and 23d districts, 
making them form one district with two representatives. — 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 24, 1847 875 


_ Mr. AKIN moved the previous question; which was ordered— 

eas 84, nays 57. 

The question was then taken, by yeas and nays, on the amend- 

_ ment of Mr. Wirt, and it was rejected—yeas 65, nays 68. 

___ The question was then taken on the substitute of Mr. Mc- 

_ CALLEN, by yeas and nays, and it was rejected—yeas 46, nays 92. 

_ Mr. BOSBYSHELL moved to adjourn. Lost. 

_ The question was then taken on the adoption of the report, 

4 and it was adopted as follows—yeas 99, nays 36. 

> Section 1. Until there shall be a new apportionment of sen- 
ators and representatives, the state shall be divided into senatorial 

_ and representative districts, and the senators and representatives 

_ shall be apportioned among the several districts as follows, viz: 


SENATORIAL DISTRICTS 


a _ The counties of Alexander, Union, Pulaski, Johnson, 
5 ae. Pope and Hardin. 
_ 2. + ‘The counties of Gallatin, Saline, Williamson, Franklin and 
_ White. 
3- The counties of Jefferson, Marion, Wayne and Hamilton. 
: 4. The counties of Washington, Perry, Randolph and Jack- 
son. 
* 5. The counties of St. Clair and Monroe. 
6. The counties of Madison and Clinton. 
a) 47. The counties of Christian, Shelby, Montgomery, Bond and 
_ Fayette. ; 
____—‘&._:«~The counties of Effingham, Jasper, Clay, Richland, Law- 
rence, Edwards and Wabash. 
_-  g. The counties of Edgar, Clark and Crawford. 
i. to. The counties of Vermilion, Champaign, Piatt, Moultrie, 
_ Coles and Cumberland. 
"11. +The counties of Tazewell, McLean, Logan, DeWitt and 
_ Macon. 
12. The counties of Sangamon, Menard and Mason. 
13. The counties of Macoupin, Jersey, Greene and Calhoun. 
14. The counties of Morgan, Scott and Cass. 
15. The counties of Adams and Pike. 


876 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


16. The counties of McDonough, Schuyler, Brown and High- 
land. ‘ 
17. The counties of Hancock and Henderson. 
18. The counties of Fulton and Peoria. a 
1g. The counties of Rock Island, Henry, Mercer, Warren, 
Knox and Stark. 4 
20. The counties of LaSalle, Bureau, Putnam ee 
Woodford, Livingston and Grundy. 
21. The counties of DuPage, Kendall, Will and Troquois.. 
22. The counties of Ogle, Lee, DeKalb and Kane. q 
The counties of Jo Daviess, Stephenson, Carroll and | 
Whiteside. b 
24. The counties of McHenry, Boone and Winnebago. 
25. The counties of Cook and Lake. 


REPRESENTATIVE DISTRICTS 


The counties of Union, Alexander and Pulaski. 
The counties of Massac, Pope, and Hardin. 
The counties of Gallatin and Saline. 

The counties of Johnson and Williamson. 

‘The counties of Jackson and Franklin. 

The counties of Marion, Jefferson, Wayne and Hamilton, 
with three representatives; Provided, that no one in said dis- rm: 


Abe pn. 


to a representative residing in said county. 
7. The county of White. 
8. The counties of Wabash and Edwards. 
g. The counties of Lawrence and Richland. | 
10. The counties of Crawford and Jasper. 
11. The county of Coles. 
12. The county of Clark. 
13. The counties of Cumberland, Effingham and Clay. 
14. The county of Fayette. 
15. The counties of Montgomery, Bond and Clinton, with 
two representatives. 
. 16. The counties of Washington and Perry. 
17. The county of Randolph. 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 24, 1847 877 


The county of Monroe. 

The county of St. Clair, with two representatives. 

The county of Madison, with two representatives. 

The county of Macoupin. 

The county of Jersey. 

The county of Greene. 

The county of Scott. 

The county of Morgan, with two representatives. 

The counties of Cass and Menard. 

The county of Sangamon, with two representatives. 

The counties of Mason and Logan. 

The county of Tazewell. 

The counties of McLean and DeWitt. 

The county of Vermilion. 

The county of Edgar. 

The counties of Champaign, Piatt, Moultrie and Macon. 
The counties of Shelby and Christian. 

The counties of Pike and Calhoun, with two representa- 


The counties of Adams, Highland and Brown, with three 


representatives. 


37- 
38. 
39- 


40. 
41. 


#2. 
43- 


The county of Schuyler. 

The county of Hancock, with two representatives. 

The county of McDonough. 

The county of Fulton, with two representatives. 

The county of Peoria. 

The county of Knox. 

The counties of Mercer, Warren and Henderson, with two 


representatives. 


A Re 
45. 
46. 


47- 


1s 48. 
; 49. 
50. 


The counties of Rock Island, Henry and Stark. 

The counties of Whiteside and Lee. 

The counties of Carroll and Ogle. 

The counties of Jo Daviess and Stephenson. 

The county of Winnebago. 

The counties of Putnam, Marshall and Woodford. 

The counties of LaSalle, Grundy, Livingston and Bureau, 


with two representatives. 


878 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE ; 


st. The counties of DuPage, Kendall Will : 
with three representatives. 

52. The counties of Kane and DeKalb, with two represen 
tives. 

53- The counties of Boone and McHenry, wie two fap pees 
atives. PARE 

54. The county of Lake. : 

55. The county of Cook, with two representatives. 

Sec. 2. Until the General Assembly shall otherwise provi 
the clerks. of the coun commissioners’ courts in each of 


conform to the laws, on the subject, in force at tthe time ue 
adoption of this constitution. > 
Mr. AKIN moved to refer the report, together vine ‘that or 
the Legislative Depareneats to the committee on Revis 
Carried. y 
. Mr. EDWARDS of Madison offered a rescue a xt 
use of the hall, on Wednesday evening, to Prof. net ie) 
Virginia; which was carried. A 
The Convention then adjourned. 


ae ad 


LXIV. WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 25, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Barcer. 

Mr. J. M. PALMER presented the following resolution: 
Ordered, by the Convention, that the committee on Revision, 
© whom, on yesterday, the report of the select committee to 
vide the state into senatorial and representative districts was 
_ referred, be instructed to so modify said report, that the same shall 
~ stand as follows: 
_ “The counties of Jersey and Greene shall constitute the 
twenty-second representative district, and shall be entitled to 
" two representatives, and that they arrange the succeeding part of 
said report so as to correspond thereto.’’ 
Mr. WOODSON said, that he desired to trouble the Conven- 
tion with a few remarks on this subject. When the motion was 
_ submitted yesterday by his colleague (Mr. Wirt) to amend this 
. _ report, it was immediately followed by a motion for the previous 
st question, and it being sustained by the house, cut off all opportu- 
_ nity forexplanation. There being no other mode of bringing the 
- question fairly before the Convention, but in the form now pro- 
_ posed, he embraced the occasion respectfully to call the attention 
of the Convention to the injustice done the county of Greene by 


that apportionment reported by the committee. If he were to 
neglect to present the matter in its true light here, he should be 

_ recreant to the trust reposed in him by his constituents. A simple 
E statement of facts will satisfy this Convention that we are asking 
4 for nothing more than we are justly entitled to. By reference to 
the map and the census, it will be perceived that Greene contains 

_ a population of 11,522, whilst Jersey contains only 5,637, being 
4 eles: than one-half of the reported population of Greene by 752[?]. 
But, although we are governed by the population of Greene, as 
teported to the Convention by the returns of the census of 1845, 
_ yet he would unhesitatingly assert, that even that is not the true 
}Population of the county by several thousand. Great i injustice has 


879 


880 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


not only in denying her her true strength in the Legislatu 
but in other respects. In view of those facts, what justice is there 
in giving to Greene but one representative, whilst a county adjoin- — 
ing her, with less than one-half her population, has also one? 
Make the proposed change and both counties will be equally ‘ 
represented; the entire population will be represented and no in- 
justice will be done to either. He wished to do no injustice ton 
Jersey. Towards her he had the kindest feelings. He was under 
great and lasting obligations for kindness to him personally, and 
for the confidence she has, on former occasions, reposed in him; - 
but he had duties to discharge to his constituents paramount to — 
all other considerations. He would, if he could, accommodate i 
that county, but he could not do so at the expense of the county he — 
represented, to the people of whom he was under so many obliga- - 
tions. He hoped the motion would prevail. It was unnecessary 
for him to say more, as he desired to consume no time. a 
Mr. KNAPP of Jersey opposed the instructions. He thought re 
that Jersey and other small counties, to whom was given the excess: 
of larger and adjoining counties, should be entitled to a separate 
representative. It was the only safety they had. 
Mr. WILLIAMS offered the following as an amendment to 1 
instructions: a 
‘‘And also that they so change the thirty-sixth section as 4 
give Adams, including Highland, two representatives, and Brown — 
one, and that they form two separate districts.’’ 4 
Mr. WILLIAMS urged the adoption of the aihiadec in 
justice to the county that he represented. In the course of | 
remarks he said, that the committee had been induced to form 
district as it now stood, in consequence of a statement made to — 
it by the gentleman from Knox, (Mr. Harvey) who stated to the 
committee that six of the seven members of the Convention from ‘ 
the three counties were in favor of the arrangement, and preferred | 4 
it to any other. That the two members from Brown, and his fou 
colleagues, all were in favor of it, and preferred it to a distr 
which gave Adams two and Brown one. Since then, he had been © 
better informed and knew that the members from Brown desired ~ 
no such thing, they both desired, if possible, that Brown 
should have a representative. 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 25, 1847 881 


Mr. KINNEY of Bureau moved to amend the amendment by 


adding to it the following: 


“That said committee arrange the report, that the counties of 
Marshall, Woodford, Livingston, and Grundy shall constitute the 
forty-ninth reptesentative district, and be entitled to one represent- 
ative; the county of LaSalle shall be the fiftieth district and have 
one representative; the counties of Bureau and Putnam shall form 
a separate district.”’ 

Mr. SINGLETON, in relation to the matter of arranging the 
district composed of Adams, Highland and Brown counties, made 


an explanation, the substance of which was, that he and his col- 
league were both very anxious to have a representative from 


Brown; that he used all his endeavors to get some whig on the 
committee to attend to the interests of the county. Not one of 


‘that party could be induced to interfere; they even declined voting 


on the question. The gentleman from Schuyler (Mr. M1nsHALL) 
refused to have anything to do with it. After repeated and 
urgent requests, they succeeded in obtaining the gentleman from 


Knox to attend to the interests of the county and to endeavor, if 


_ possible, to have a separate district formed of the county of Brown 


and the eastern range of the townships of Highland county, for 
Brown alone had not a sufficient population to be entitled to a 
member. The committee refused to form a district of that kind; 
refused to divide a county. There was then no alternative but 
to be attached to Highland and Adams as one district. To this 
we had to submit, and to it we consented. There was never at 
any time a proposition before the committee to form a district of 
Adams and Highland, and one of Brown. Such a thing was sug- 


gested by the gentleman from Morgan, who was considered as the 


representative of the gentleman from Adams, but he had no 
authority for so doing and it could not be passed. The represent- 
atives from Brown never refused to accept a member from Brown, 
and had done every thing they could to obtain such. The Con- 
vention had refused to give Brown and part of Highland a member. 
They were satisfied that the gentleman from Knox had acted 
fairly and had done all he could to forward their views, and that, 
too, when all others had refused to have anything to do with the 


_ matter. 


882 © ILLINOIS HISTORICAL -conLnent i ih 


Mr. HARVEY made a statement of his agency in ee mat 
He had engaged in the subject only after repeated and ur, 
solicitations on the part of the gentlemen from Brown, who were 
anxious to have a district formed of their county and a portion 
Highland. The members from Adams county and the memb 
from Highland opposed the division of that county. Brown | 
not a population sufficient to be entitled to one representative. 
others on the committee refused to interfere; the gentleman fro 
Schuyler who was from that circuit refused to have anything to do 
with the subject. The only mode then that was left was to unite 
the three counties, and let Brown have her chance to secure one of 
these at the election. To form this district he had the consen 
as he understood and believed at the time, of six-sevenths of the 
delegation—of them all except the gentleman from Adams (I r. 
WivuraMs). Whom was he to follow? To follow one member, or 
follow six. He cared nothing about the district—it was one hu 
dred miles from his county. He had acted only as he would co 
sider himself bound to do under all circumstances—follow t 
desire of six-sevenths of those whom he represented. He expect 

this attack upon him this morning. He had been threatened 
the gentleman from Adams, when this district was formed th; 
he would receive a scorching for his agency in the matter. | 
had received the scorching, and cared but little, at any time, for 
a scorching for following the request of six men in preference tc to 
that of one. He would refer the Convention, as a: proof that suc h 
was the fact, to a letter in the Quincy Whig, over the signature ¢ of 
the gentleman, wherein he himself stated that six out of the seven 
members agreed to this district. The two gentlemen from Brown, 
and the three colleagues of the gentleman from Adams, consent 
to this district. One of them, Mr. Powers, expressed himself 
decidedly opposed to severing Highland from Adams, and in favo 
of the district. The gentleman from Highland (Mr. Stmpso: 
cared but little either way, he was only anxious for his own county 
and desirous to retain the territory. 


on the “tale. which motion was lost—yeas 54, nays 88. 
Mr. WILLIAMS replied to Mr. Harvey, and urged ae 
did oppose the districting of the counties so as that Brown mig 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 25, 1847 883 


have one representative, and Adams two, and that he had stated 
‘that six of the members had declared themselves in favor of such 
n arrangement. He had been informed by the gentleman from 
Brown, and by his colleagues, Messrs. Simpson and Nicos, that 
‘such was untrue! And he would leave the question of veracity 
to be settled between them. 
_ Mr. HARVEY asked the gentleman to give way and enable 
Bi those members to make a statement of what were the facts. 
‘a Mr. WILLIAMS said, he hoped the gentleman would not 
if ‘interrupt him. He was not going to settle the question of veracity 
ie between the gentlemen. As to the letter that was in the Quincy 
4 Whig, he would state that he wrote that letter and based the 
assertion therein contained upon the assertion of the member from 
Knox, made before the committee, which since then he had learned 
to be untrue, and therefore had written another letter correcting 
_ the erroneous statement. He had stated to the member from 
_ Knox in committee, that a day would come when this subject could 
_ be. investigated, and when members might assert their rights. 

This had been construed into a threat. Mr. W. followed the 
matter for some time longer. 

Mr. BROCKMAN said, he rose for the purpose of correcting 

a false statement, which had been made in regard to himself as 
- connected with this subject. He had, at all times during the 
sessions of the committee, attempted to get a representative for 

Brown. He would, in justice to the gentleman from Knox, say 
_ that he had strongly solicited him to obtain a representative from 
_ the county of Brown and the east tier of townships of the county 
i of Highland, which passed before the committee, and was at a 
x subsequent session changed, at which time he was not present. 
: If it had been stated before that committee, that he had ex- 
_ pressed a desire not to vote separately for a representative from 
_ Brown, those statements had been made without any authority 
- from him. He said it was his desire that if Brown could not get a 
representative, then he was desirous to vote with Adams and High- 
land as one representative district for the election of three repre- 
sentatives by general ticket. It is the wish of the citizens of Brown 
to get one representative. ; 
Mr. SIMPSON said, that he had never authorized anyone to 


884 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


say that he was opposed to giving Brown a representative. 
had been opposed to dividing Highland county and wished her to 
vote with Adams. Brown county then, not having enough popu- 
lation to be entitled to a member, he was anxious that she sho Id 
be joined to Adams and Highland as at present, and had said sO 
to every one. He was in favor of the district. i 
Mr. Tuomas and Mr. SincteTon further explained. 
Mr. TURNBULL moved the previous question; which was 
ordered. a 
Mr. WILLIAMS then withdrew his amendment, and with t 
fell the amendment of Mr. Kinney. 
The question being taken, by yeas and nays, on the instruc- 
tions in relation to Greene and Jersey counties, it was carried— 
yeas 91, nays 465. “2 Z 
Mr. KINNEY renewed his proposition to instruct the com- 
mittee. 
Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to lay it on the table. Catal - 
yeas 96, nays 35. a 
Mr. BROCKMAN renewed the instructions offered by } 
Wi.14Ms in relation to Adams, Highland and Brown counties. 
Mr. LAUGHLIN made some remarks, understood to be app 
batory of the district as it stood, and moved to lay the instr 
tions on the table. And the motion was carried—yeas 72, nays | 
Mr. ECCLES moved to take up the report of the commit 
on Miscellaneous Subjects, exempting a homestead of 80 acres 
land, not exceeding $500 in value, and of a town lot, to the he 
of each family, not exceeding in value $500, from execution 
forced sale for debts contracted after the adoption of the consti 
tion; and securing to married women all real estate owned by thi 
at the time of their marriage, against all debts contracted by 
husband &c. And the same was taken up and read. 3 
Mr. SHIELDS moved to lay the whole report on the table. — 
Mr. CRAIN asked for the yeas and nays and they were ordere 
taken, and resulted—yeas 70, nays 56. * 
Mr. MARKLEY moved to take up the report of the committe e 
on Finance. Carried. It was read as follows: 


@ i 


a 
ya 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 25, 1847 885 


ARTICLE— 
The General Assembly shall provide for, and there shall be 


annually levied, a tax of not less than three mills on every dollar’s 
worth of personal and real property within this state; to be ascer- 
_ tained by valuation; the proceeds of which shall be applied to the 
_ payment of the indebtedness of the state; Provided, said tax shall 


be levied no longer than is necessary to discharge the principal 


and interest due and to become due on the present state debt. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison moved to strike out the section 
and insert, 

Section 1. There shall be annually assessed and collected, in 
the same manner as other state revenue may be assessed and 
_ collected, a tax of two mills upon each one dollar’s worth of tax- 
able property, in addition to all other taxes, to be applied as 
follows, to-wit: The fund so created shall be kept separate, 
and shall annually, on the first day of January, be apportioned 
and paid over pro rata upon all such state indebtedness, other than 
the canal and school indebtedness, as may, for that purpose, be 
presented by the holders of the same, to be entered as credits 
upon, and, to that extent, in extinguishment of the principal of 
said indebtedness. 

Sec. 2. Hereafter any tax payer may have an estimate 
made at any time, of his proportion of the state indebtedness 
above provided for, by taking, as data, the whole of said indebted- 
hess, principal and interest, due at the time of making the estimate— 
the then last assessment of the taxable property of such tax payer, 
and the aggregate of the then last assessment for the whole state, 
and may pay into the treasury the amount of such estimate, either 
in money or in such state indebtedness, and, upon so paying, 
shall be forever discharged from any and all further assessments 
on account of such state indebtedness, in respect of so much per- 
sonal property as he then has, and of all such real estate as may be 
included in the estimated assessment, and such real estate shall 
_ be forever discharged from any and all further assessments, on 
_ such account, into whose hand soever it may pass. 

Sec. 3: Any state indebtedness coming into the treasury, by 
virtue of the above section, shall be simply cancelled and destroyed, 


836 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIC 


and any money so coming in shall be added to and eee 
part of the aforesaid mill fund. 

Sec. 4. This article shall be submitted to a vote of the people, 
and if voted for by a majority of all voting on the question, shal f, 
become a part of this constitution, and shall remain in force un 
the whole of the indebtedness therein provided for shall be paid, 
and longer; and interest shall be counted only upon the original 
principal of said indebtedness, and the extinguished portions of 
said principal shall cease to draw interest, at and from the respec a 
tive times of their extinguishment. And it shall be the duty ¢ of | 
the General Assembly to make all necessary provisions for carry- 
ing this article into effect in good faith. 

He said, that he regretted the apathy, so evident in the C 
vention, upon this subject of the state debt, one in which they 
should feel so much interest, and which was of so vital importance - 
to the interests, feelings and character of the people of the state 
He thought that he could demonstrate to the satisfaction of a 
one that there was a plan whereby, with the sanction and approval - 
of the people, the whole internal improvement debt may be paid, 
interest and principal. This plan was based on. the iclewi ( 
calculation: ae 

The conclusion to which I have come is that the aopeon of 
this section, will, within twenty-five years from the beginning of 
1848, and without much 1 increasing our aggregate burden of taxa- P 
tion beyond what it now is, totally extinguish that part of our 
debt, principal and interest. I reach this conclusion as follows: 
The principal of that part of the debt is $6,245,280. I assu 
that a two mill tax will in 1848 produce $200,000, because the t 
mill tax now collected, rose from $163,437.45 in 1845 a 
$175,135.92 in 1846—a ratio of increase which will bring it. 
to the assumption. I next assume that this fund will, by the 
crease of taxable property in the state, have an average ann 
increase of seven per cent upon the original $200,000 through t 
twenty-five years. I make this assumption, because the popu . 
lation of Illinois rose from 478,429 in 1840 to 662,150 in 1845— 
period of extreme discouragement to settlement in the state, bei 
an increase of 7 2$-I00 per cent. per annum; because ; 
increase of the two mill fund, between 1845 and 1846, is 7 15-100 


1 
t 


SS 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 25, 1847 887 


per cent.; and, with reference to the continuance of increase, 
because Ohio, the only much older state which is otherwise very 
" similar to ours, rose in population from 581,432, in 1820, to 1,515 
895, in 1840, an average of 8 34-Ioo per cent. per annum. 
Upon these two assumptions, first, of $200,000 from the fund in 
“ 1848, and second, an increase of 7 per cent. per annum, it is the 
best calculation to discover that we have, at the end of nineteen 
_ years $6,194,000, which leaves of the principal only $51,380. 
_ There is, however, already accrued of interest on this part of our 
_ debt $2,248,372, which will be swelled to about $3,000,000 before 
_ this provision can operate. There will accrue upon it during the 
nineteen years $3,559,916, making together $6,559,916, which wili 
be lessened by the application of three-fifths of the mill and a 
half fund now in operation during the nineteen years, $2,784,300, 
reducing it to $3,775,616. To this add the $51,380 of the principal, 
making $3,826,996 the amount, mostly without interest, which we 
have still to overcome at the end of the nineteen years. To do 
this, we now have the joint force of the two mill and the 
three-fifths of the mill and a half funds, which, insix years more, in 
_ all twenty-five years, produces $4,358,700 covering all, and leaving 
- asutplus of about a half million. This shows how the debt can 
be paid in twenty-five years. But I have said it can be done with- 
_ “out much increasing our aggregate of taxation. I say this simply 
_ because we shall, by the new constitution, lessen the aggregate of 
state and county expenditures to an amount almost, if not quite, 
equal to the two mill tax. 
Mr. CONSTABLE said, that as the subject was most impor- 
__ tant, he moved the plan of Mr. Epwarps be laid on the table and 
_ printed and made the special order for to-morrow at 3 P. M. 
Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to take up the report dividing the 
_ state into three grand divisions for judicial purposes; which 
motion was carried. 

The report was read: 

Sec. 1. The first grand division, for the election of judges of 
the supreme court shall consist of the counties of Alexander, Pul- 
aski, Massac, Pope, Hardin, Gallatin, Saline, Williamson, Johnson, 

Union, Jackson, Randolph; Perry, Franklin, Hamilton, White, 
_ Wabash, Edwards, Wayne, Jefferson, Washington, Monroe, St. 


ae Go ee ote 


< 


+ 


ees 


a eee 


ay 
— 


888 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS ies 


Clair, Clinton, Marion, Clay, Richland, Lawrence, Crawford, 
Jasper, Effingham, Fayette, Bond, Madison, Jersey amd Calhoun. — 
The second grand division shall consist of the counties of Edgar, — 
Coles, Moultrie, Shelby, Montgomery, Macoupin, Greene, Pike, ~ 
Adams, Highland, Hancock, McDonough, Schuyler, Brown, Ful- 
ton, Mason, Cass, Morgan, Scott, Sangamon, Christian, Macon, 
Piatt, Champaign, Vermilion, DeWitt, Logan, Menard, Cumber- 
land and Clark. 
The third grand division shall consist of the counties of Hen-_ 
derson, Warren, Knox, Peoria, Tazewell, Woodford, McLean, 
Livingston, Iroquois, Will, Grundy, Kendall, LaSalle, Putnam, — 
Marshall, Stark, Bureau, Henry, Mercer, Rock Island, Whiteside, — 
Lee, Carroll, Jo Daviess, Stephenson, Winnebago, Ogle, DeKalb, a 
Boone, Kane, McHenry, Lake, Cook and DuPage. y 
Sec. 2. The term of the supreme court for the first division” 
shall be held at Mount Vernon, in Jefferson county; for the second — 
division, at Springfield, in Sangamon county; for the third di-— 
vision, at Princeton, in Bureau county, until some other place in - 
either division is fixed by law. 3 
Sec. 3. Appeals and writs of error may ee taken from the _ 
circuit court of any county to the supreme court held in the di- — 
vision which includes such county, or to the supreme court in the 4 
next adjoining division. c 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved to strike out “Prince- _ 
ton, in Bureau county,’ and insert ‘‘Ottawa, in La Salle moe 4 
Carried unanimously. 
Mr. DAVIS of McLean moved to strike out ““McLean anal a 
Tazewell counties’’ from the 3d division, and add them to the 2d 4 
division. ey 
Mr. ARCHER opposed the motion. The population now, he 
was informed, of the middle division was greater than of either of 
the other two divisions. He was willing to take the report as it © 
now stood, but if the change was made he would vote for changing — 
the place of holding the court from Springfield to Jacksonville. 
Mr. MARKLEY was opposed to the change.—The northern ~ 
district now had the smallest population, and if these counties — 
were changed and put to the middle district, the northern district ~ 
would be still smaller. 


bi 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 25, 1847 889 


Mr. LOGAN advocated the motion on the ground of conveni- 


ence to the people of the counties of McLean and Tazewell, who 
3 would prefer to come to Springfield, than to go to Ottawa. View- 
i ing the question politically, the district would still be democratic 


by 1,500 majority, although he was informed that the present 
_ judge of this circuit, who was a democrat, and who would prob- 


ably be the candidate of the party, was opposed to bringing these 


counties into the district because they were whig. 

Messrs. CaMPBELL of Jo Daviess, PALMER of Macoupin, ArM- 
stronc, Davis of McLean, CatpweELt and Epwarps of Sanga- 
mon continued the discussion. 

Without taking the question, the Convention adjourned till 


4 P> M. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. COLBY asked a suspension of the rules to enable him to 
offer a resolution; which, after being amended, was adopted as 
follows: 

_ Resolved, That a committee of three be appointed to procure 
the translation and printing of the copies of the constitution 
ordered by this Convention to be printed in the German language, 
and, also, a committee for the same purpose in relation to the 
publication in the Norwegian language. 

Mr. DAVIS of McLean withdrew his amendment pending at 
the adjournment at noon. 

Mr. LOGAN moved to add to the report: 

““The foregoing districts may, after the taking of each census 
by the state, be altered if necessary to equalize the said districts 
in population; but each alteration shall be made by adding to such 
districts such adjacent county or counties as will make said dis- 
trict nearest equal in population; Provided, no such alteration 
shall affect the judge then in office.”’ 

Mr. CAMPBELL of McDonough moved to substitute there- 


_ for: “That all the counties in the first and third grand divisions be 


added to the second, and elect the supreme judges by general ticket.” 
Mr. ECCLES moved to lay the substitute on the table; and 
the motion was carried. 
Mr. DEMENT offered as a substitute for the amendment: 


890 ~‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT. 


- \ y i 

‘“The qualified voters of each of the three grand divisions 
vote for the three supreme judges, one of whom ened reside i in 

be taken from each of said divisions.”’ : 

Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to lay the same on the ena 

the motion prevailed. 


amendment, and it was carried. . 
The report, as amended, was referred to the committee | on 
revision &c. 
Mr. HAYES moved to pe up the report of the commit 

on Law Reform; and it was read as follows: 
ARTICLE— ot 

Sec. 1. It shall be the duty of the General Assembly tp pig 
vide for a codification of the laws, and after the year 1870, neither 
the common law, nor any English statute, not re-enacted, shall ; 
in force, or regarded by the courts, except to aid in the ape: 
and construction of the laws of this state. =. 

Sec. 2. All the laws shall be published for the iniinmetone of 
the people; and no foreign statute shall hereafter be passed | or, 
adopted by the General Assembly unless the same be first reduced b 
to writing. . Mi 

Sec. 3. No official writing, or executive, legislative, or judicial 
proceeding shall be had, conducted, preserved, or published in 2 
other than the English language. 

Sec. 4. In all suits in chancery the evidence shall be taken 
in suits at law. m 

Sec. 5. The General Assembly shall never Bi any law of f 
primogeniture. 

Mr. HAYES said, the late day of the session, the fifeces minute 
rule, and the evident impatience of members to return to their 
homes, all warned him that he was asking the attention of the Co 
vention under the most unfavorable auspices. When he reflect 
on his deficiencies, his want of that extensive learning and pro-— 
found wisdom which are the rewards of long study and experience, — 
it was with diffidence and apprehension that he stood forth 
discuss before that able and enlightened body, a subject so d 
cult as that under consideration. ! 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 25, 1847 891 


I would, said Mr. H., that I could call to my aid the ready 


_ gentleman from Jo Daviess. But I much fear that they, with 
_ others as able, are arrayed against me on this measure. 

It is with serious hesitation and reflection that I have taken 
_ the position I occupy. I was not free from prejudice. I had 
_ studied, with some attention the common law, remarked its 
_ gothic strength, its breadth of outline, the elaborate finish of its 
: ‘details, and like one who has lived only among the costly struc- 
; tures and ingenious contrivances of art, I lost sight of the grandeur 
_ and simplicity of nature. An anxious investigation of the subject 
a has wrought a change in my views, and convinced me of the 
"necessity and propriety of an extensive reform. 

___ The idea of codification has elsewhere excited much attention, 
_ and drawn to its support some of the greatest men of the country, 
but here it is new, and will, therefore, by many, be denounced as 
_ dangerous. We do propose an innovation. When Martin Luther 
a raised the cry of reform, and endeavored to free Europe from the 
‘4 religious despotism which had fettered her for ages, he advocated 
an innovation. When Galileo invented the telescope, by which 
: the wonders of the heavens were brought near to human observa- 
_ tion, he was imprisoned as an innovator. When Harvey declared 
_ the circulation of the blood in the human system, the great fact 
4 which has become the basis of the science of medicine, he was 
q the advocate of innovation. When Faust and others invented 
_ printing with types, the great art which was to preserve and dis- 
y seminate through the world the fruits of genius and the products 
of intellect, they introduced an innovation. When Columbus, 
_ standing on the verge of an unexplored sea, at the limit of the 
B known world, declared that the earth was round, and that beyond 
_ that sea were regions as fair and as fertile as any the eye of civi- 
_ lized'man had rested on, he was an advocate of innovation. When 
_ Thomas Jefferson and the other framers of the declaration of 
independence, pronounced the great truth that all men are by 
nature free and equal, and have a right to govern themselves, they 
_ were the advocates of an innovation. 

I, for one, am willing to take the responsibility of advocating 


ees ‘ i i me z 
892 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


a reform in our system of laws, though I may be misunderstood 
my notions misrepresented, and my proposition denounced as 
startling innovation. 

It has been said on this floor that there are prejudices agai 
lawyers—a disposition to exclude them from the halls of legislation 
That is true, but gentlemen have much mistaken the cause of the 
feeling. It is not because the people dislike the profession. They 
give them the highest place in their esteem. They know them to 
be, in general, men of honor and character, intelligent and pat . 
otic, the class which furnished Jefferson, Adams, Madison and — 
Jackson to the country in time past, and from whose ranks many 
of the wisest living statesmen have been taken. They appreciate ‘4 
all this, but there is a fear of lawyers in the state legislature, be- 
cause they doubt whether their habits of thought, their intimacy 
with a complicated and artificial system, will promote that sim-_ 
plicity and plainness which they are anxious to see in their laws. © 

I trust that the lawyers in this Convention will convince them 4 
that their fears are unfounded; and I believe that many of them : 
will be found advocating this reform. I take it to be the first 
principle of American politics that the people have the right of 
self-government, the right to know the laws under which they live. — 
If this be a correct principle, the importance of a codification must — 
be admitted by all. I do not suppose the laws which are to govern 
civilized men in all the relations of society, can be embraced 1 
one book or two. They might occupy many volumes. 


they can. Neither do I suppose that they can be made so sim 
that every man will be his own lawyer in different cases. I only 
inquire, can they not be made more simple, more plain of com 
prehension, more easy of access than they now are? I believe - 
they can. That the landmarks by which civil society is regulated — 
can be so far exposed to the public eye as to furnish right thinking, 
even with a guide in the transactions of life, a knowledge of the 
general rules of law which are to operate on his interests. I a 
answered, that, although the principle be right, such inconven 
iences will follow its enforcement in practice as to require us t 
disregard it. I have never been able to see that a thing right i 
theory becomes wrong in practice. Correct principles are to an 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 25, 1847 893 


_ individual the compass by which alone he can steer his bark in 

safety over the rough and uncertain sea of life. Without them he 
_ will be driven by the storms of passion, and drifted by the currents 
of temptation, till his career is ended in shipwreck and ruin. So 
with nations. If guided by no principle of national policy, un- 
certainty attends their course, despotism or anarchy witnesses 
their downfall. When, to the contrary, they are consistent in 
their adherence to fundamental principles, their march is certain, 
and onward for good or for evil. 

[The PRESIDENT here announced to Mr. H. that his fifteen 
minutes had expired; but he was, by the unanimous consent of the 
Convention, permitted to proceed.] 

Mr. HAYES proceeded: We have organized government upon 
a particular view of the nature and rights of man—upon certain 
axioms of self-government. When we depart from them no one 
can tell how soon our greatness may have a disastrous end. 

But the inconveniences which may result from a codification 
of our laws have been greatly overrated. Gentlemen assume that 
there are certain glorious, intangible principles of the English law 
which are all important to our welfare, and cannot be touched 
without danger. J will not detain the Convention by a discussion 
of the evils of which we complain. I have referred to them at 
some length in the report which I presented some days since, and 
which has been published. I will say to gentlemen that it is not 
my wish to attack the principles of the common law. Those 
principles, so far as they are the rules for judicial interpretation, 
ate admirable. They are neither more nor less than the rules of 
common sense, which are necessarily developed by the exercise of 
reason. 

But, sir, let me draw your attention to a distinction between 
those principles and the provisions of the English law which we 
have adopted by the statute of 1819. Bear in mind that we have 
taken the English law, so far as applicable and of a general nature, 
down to the 4th James J, in the year 1607. The wise reforms 
which have taken place since then in England, we have entirely 
discarded. Yet some learned lawyers have said that the common 
law has almost entirely grown up from decisions made after the 
accession of William and Mary in 1688! How much of this can 


894. ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION 


our courts legally adopt under the act i 1819? ce d 
wise and good men have lived in every age, men whose hearts 
beat with a love of liberty, but L do say that the BENS, of 5 


a much later day. Whatever free and liberal provisions may rf. 
been a part of the common law in the times of the Saxon kings, i 
is certain that from the time of the Norman conquest, in 1066 
down to 1607, its provisions, both as a system and in its detail 
were opposed to liberty, and entirely inadequate to our wan 
They began at the wrong end. Instead of acknowledging 
sovereignty and rights of the people, and legislating for thei 
wants, the king was assumed to be the true source of power. 
Mr. ANDERSON said, he was obliged to insist on the enfor 
ment of the rule. The Convention had never before extenc 
the time of any member, and the importance of an early seth 
ment forbade it to do so now. . 
Mr. HAYES remarked, that it was far from his wish to tresp 
an instant longer on the time of the house, than authorized by t! 
rules, or by their unanimous consent. He had understood th 
Convention to express a wish to hear him. The gentleman tt | 
now objected, he would take his seat. A 
Mr. EDWARDS of Madison moved that Mr. HAYES ete 
have leave to continue his remarks. Leave was given. “ 
Mr. HAYES continued. I feel deeply sensible, Mr. Presiden “i 
for the mark of favor and kindness just shown me by the Con a 
vention. I will not abuse it, but will bring my remarks speedily 
to a close. I was saying that the English law, as it existed i 
1607, did not recognize the sovereignty of the people, or regar 
their interests. This fact is apparent in nearly all its Maes 


the condition of society the same as it is here. Then dna chia 
distinction between the principles of judicial exposition and inte 
pretation, as developed in the decisions, and the provisions of t 

English law, it seems to me, with all due deference, that th 
great body of those provisions should be examined and the valu 
able part of them preserved in a code, with these pine whil 
all the rest should be thrown aside. 


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 25, 1847 B95 


I think we have some. If we have not, it is a severe satire upon 
_ the judges who pronounce the law from the bench—for I conceive 
_ it as easy to do so in one way as in another. 

“a An important end to be gained is the imposition of a restraint 
~ upon judicial legislation. Not that it can be entirely prevented. 
Perhaps it will be necessary to a certain extent under any system. 
. But if the entire body of laws should be placed within reach, the 
ie powers and duties of the bench would be better understood, and 
_ aremedy would easily be found for any evils which might spring up. 
R The importance of the subject, the fact that the Legislature 
can at any time repeal the act of 1819, and the further fact that 
- this Convention was called to reform abuses, furnish to my mind 
_ the strongest arguments for immediate action. But, sir, without 
attempting to discuss further a subject, which is exhaustless, I 
must conclude by expressing my thanks for the kind and patient 
attention which has been extended to me. 

_ Mr. WOODSON said, that he felt himself called upon, before 
_ making the motion he intended, to say a few words in explanation. 
_ He was a member of the committee on Law Reform, and when 
_ this report was before them the majority of the committee were 
opposed to it, but, out of courtesy to the chairman, they had con- 
sented that he should make the report. He and the majority of 
the committee were opposed to the codification of the laws—he 
believed it impracticable. If at any time such a thing should 
become necessary, the Legislature had the power to provide for 
it. He was opposed to any constitutional provision requiring it. 
_ From the little knowledge he had of the common law he was satis- 
fied that any codification of it was entirely impracticable. In the 
New York convention a proposition was started to codify the laws, 
_ and commissioners were appointed for that purpose— 

‘ Mr. PRATT said, it was to re-model the practice. 

< Mr. WOODSON. Well, perhaps it was. But whatever it 
_ was, the commissioners made a report that it was impossible to 
_ perform the work For these reasons, and not out of any want 
_ of respect for the chairman of the committee, he moved to lay 
_ the first section of the report on the table. 

* Mr. CALDWELL asked the gentleman to withdraw the motion 
_ for one moment, (the motion was withdrawn) and said, that he 


896 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS. Bk 


intended to make no speech on the subject. His belch was s 
that he could not do so, and he regretted it exceedingly. 
desired merely to state that he had given the subject a calm ¢ 
sideration for a long time, and was perfectly satisfied as to t 
practicability of codifying the common law, as much so as 
other legal department. He felt so feeble that he could not 
more, other than that he hoped the motion would not prevail. 
Mr. HAYES said—in reply to the gentleman from Greer 
that he understood the committee on Law Reform to stand 
in favor of the report, five against it, and one undetermined. 
majority of the committee were, it was true, opposed to ea repor t- 
ing of the ‘‘reasons,’” which he had prepared. q 
The question was taken by yeas and nays on laying the first 
section on the table, and was decided—yeas 69, nays 53+ pa 
Section two was adopted, and me 
Mr. SCATES moved to reconsider the vote; and it was recon- 
sidered. 
Mr. HAYES moved to amend the 2d BS: by strikincde out 
the three first words, and prefixing to the section the following: — 
‘*The General Assembly shall provide for such a codification 
of the laws now in force as to them may seem practicable a 
expedient, and such code with all the laws hereafter passed’” 
Mr. PRATT moved, as a substitute: ‘a 
‘‘The Legislature, at its first session after the adoption of this 
constitution, shall provide for the appointment of one or more 
commissioners, whose duty it shall be to revise, reform, simplify 
and abridge the rules and practice, pleadings, forms and proceed 
ing, of the courts of this state, and to report thereon to the Legis i 
lature, subject to their adoption and modification from time to time.’” 
Mr. LOCKWOOD moved to lay the amendments and th 
whole report on the table. 
And the motion was carried. a 
Mr. GRIMSHAW offered a resolution that the use of the 
Senate chamber be granted to the ladies of the Presbyteriz 
church, on Friday next. Carried. 
And the Convention adjourned till to-morrow at 8 A. M. 


LXV. THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 


= by the Rev. Mr. Barcer. 
i Mr. CANADY offered for adoption the following: 
Ordered, That the committee on the adjustment and revision 
1, the articles of the constitution be instructed so to amend the 
article on the organization of counties, by striking out of the first 
tion the following words: ‘“‘Nor any line of which shall pass 
thinless than ten miles of the county seat of the county proposed 
to be divided, already established.’’ 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon raised a point of order. How 
g after the Convention had acted finally upon the different 
ticles could these resolutions of instructions be sent to the com- 
ee? When would the Convention get through with their 
ness? Every subject could be revived and renewed at any 
ne in this way. The articles had passed from the convention, 
| were now in a state of preparation, and were they ever to be 


_ The PRESIDENT, on the authority of certain precedents in 
the New York convention, decided the resolution to be in order. 
Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon appealed from the decision of the 
A debate ensued, in which Messrs. ConsTaBLeE, CAMPBELL of 
: Pe ce and Epwarps participated, and before any vote, 
Mr. CANADY withdrew his resolution. 
| Mr. CALDWELL offered the following, as additional rules: 
4 RULES 
i _ 1. The various articles referred to the committee on Revision, 
@c., as well as those hereafter referred, shall not be changed, 
“altered or amended, except to revise and correct the language 
i thereof. 
_ 2. The report of the committee of Revision, when made to 
the Convention, shall be taken up, and the amendments of such 
committee first considered, and after the action of the Convention 


897 


898 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


upon such amendments, the question shall then be upon the adop- 
tion of the whole report, and no division shall be had. a 
3- No further business shall be considered, except the repo 
now on the table, the report of the committee on Revision, and 
reports of the committees on Schedule and on Address. 
Messrs. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess, DEmMENT, ScaTes and WE: 
opposed the rules. Messrs. CatpwELL, Epwarps of Madisdl yn, 
Epwarps of Sangamon and ConstaBLe advocated their adoption n. 
Mr. ECCLES moved the previous question, and it was ordere 
The yeas and nays were ordered on the adoption of the rules, 
and they were adopted—yeas 113, nays 32. 
Mr. SCATES said, that he considered the vote just taken. 
the final adoption of the parts of the constitution now in 
hands of the committee; he moved that the committee be direc 
to hand the articles as they revised them to the printer, and t 
they be printed. 
Mr. Dement and Mr. Tuomas opposed this motion, ha 
was rejected. 
The report of the committee on Education was then taken up, 
and read as follows: 


ARTICLE— 


Section 1. The moneys received from the United Sta 
under the provisions of the act of Congress of the 18th day 
April, 1818, for the encouragement of learning, constituting ‘“ 
school fund,’” and that bestowed on a college or university, 
stituting ‘‘the college fund,’” as well as that arising from the s 
of lands granted for the use of a seminary of learning, constitutin 
“‘the seminary fund,’’ with all additions which have been or t 
may hereafter be made to said funds, or any of them, shall rem 
perpetual funds, and be held by the state for the uses and p 
poses aforesaid, the annual interest only to be applied to. 
support of schools, a college, or seminaries, under the authority ¢ 
the General Assembly. 

Sec. 2. Officers and trustees having the care or control of 
school, college, or seminary funds, or any school funds of : 
township in this state, for investment, may purchase therewii 
or invest the same in the bonds of this state, at their market 


ed ee 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 899 


value, under such regulations as the General Assembly may pre- 


scribe; and it shall be the duty of the General Assembly to 


provide for the prompt payment of the interest on such bonds so 
purchased as aforesaid, as the same becomes due; Provided, that 
the General Assembly may hereafter prohibit or restrict such in- 
vestments, as the public good may require. 

Sec. 3. It shall be the duty of the General Assembly to pro- 
vide for a system of common schools which shall be as nearly 
uniform as may be, throughout the state; and such common schools 
shall be equally free to all the children in the state, and no sec- 
tarian instruction shall be permitted in any of them. 

Sec. 4. The superintendency of public instruction in this state 
shall be vested in an officer, to be styled “‘the superintendent of 
common schools,’’ and such county and local superintendents 
-as may be established by law. 

Sec. 5. At the first session of the General Assembly after the 
adoption of this constitution, and biennially thereafter, it shall be 
the duty of the Governor, by and with the advice and consent of 
the senate, (a majority of all the members elected thereto con- 
curring therein), to appoint a superintendent of common schools, 


_who shall hold his office for the term.of two years and until his 


successor is qualified, and who shall perform such duties and receive 
such salary as the General Assembly may prescribe; Provided, 
that vacancies occuring in said office by death, resignation, refusal 
to act, or otherwise, may be filled by the Governor; and persons 
thus appointed shall continue in office until the end of the next 
session of the General Assembly. 

Sec. 6. The preceding section shall continue in force for the 
term of six years from and after the time at which such first ap- 
pointment is made in pursuance thereof, and no longer; after which 
time, the General Assembly may provide for the continuance of 
said office, or for the election of such officer by the people. 

Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess moved to strike out the 4th 
and sth sections, and insert the following: iss 

“*The supervision of public instruction shall be vested in a state 
superintendent, and such other officers as the General Assembly 
may direct. The state superintendent shall be elected by the 
qualified voters of the state, who shall hold his office for the term 


goo ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI ons - 


hundred dollars. The General Assembly shall provide for th 
filling of vacancies in the office of state superintendent. T 
duties and powers of the state superintendent shall be prescribed 
and defined by law.’’ 

Mr. CAMPBELL said, that he approached this question with 3 
no inconsiderable embarrassment; he was perfectly aware of the — 
impatience of the Convention and eae desire to hasten the adjourn- 
ment. The experience of the last week, and the hurry with which — 
it has disposed of business, shows that the Convention is but little — 
disposed to hear discussion upon any subject. He also deemed — 
it necessary to,explain the reasons of this report not having been — 
made by himself, as he was the chairman of the committee on 
Education. Entertaining different views from the majority of the — 
committee, he could not coincide with them in the report which — 
has been submitted. He had requested Mr. Parmer, secretary of — 
the committee, to report to the Convention the conclusions of the — 
committee. It was, however, well known to the Convention that a 
this subject has not been discussed here, that at no time has it been 
considered in this body; and it was also well known that no other — * 
question has ever occupied more of the public attention, or has — 
excited more discussion among the people at large than this—the — 
creation of the office of state superintendent of public instruction, — 
with an adequate salary. From all sections of the state, the people — 
have presented, by their representatives, their petitions for this 
purpose. If it be the wish of the delegates here, if it be the desire 
of the Convention to meet the wishes of the people, and to secure — 
for the instrument we are about to frame a favorable reception, — 
it becomes us to make such provisions as they can approve of, and ~ 
which above all others they desire at our hands. He knew dis- 
cussion was not wanted here by many; he knew that the great 
body of the Convention were anxious to hurry through with the © 
business, and go home; and he knew that there were many here ~ 
who would vote against the provision, without having any dis- — 
cussion upon it. But he had a solemn duty to perform, a duty 
that he could not, would not, disregard, and one that could not ~ 
be performed in the limited time allowed by the fifteen minute ~ 


x 


rule. He would, therefore, apply himself to that duty as well as — 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 gol 


his feeble efforts would permit, though he knew the fifteen minute 
tule of the Convention would not afford sufficient time for that 
purpose. He would not propose to discuss this question now, had 
it been discussed here at any time before, or had the subject been 
submitted to the committee of the whole, like other questions, for 
a general discussion; but he felt the importance of the subject, 
and the anxiety of the people in regard to it, and he hoped that 
time would be allowed. He well knew, and gentlemen must admit, 
that when they went home and mingled with their constituents, 
spoke of the proceedings of this Convention, and of the debates, 
and told them that the great subject of education, when before 
this body, came under the operation of the fifteen minute rule, 
the people would not be satisfied, would not be content that a 
subject in which they were so much concerned, in which their 
children were so deeply interested, had come under the operation 
of that rule, and discussion cut off. It may be said that these 
petitions that have been presented here, praying the appointment 
of this officer, are not entitled to any weight, that they have all 
come from one source, and that that fact should be a cause for 
opposition to it. It was perhaps true that these petitions were all 
sent out from the office of the Prairie Farmer, and that. they 
obtained a circulation and an influence in consequence of the 


exertions of that office, but was that any argument against the 


thing itself? Because a paper had taken a course on this sub- 
ject which was good and beneficial, and which had for its object 
the benefit of the people, was that object to be denounced in con- 
sequence of the party character of its advocates? No, sir; no! 
As the soul rises into immortality when the body falls into decay 
and perishes, so does the cause of education rise in splendor and 
grandeur above all party schemes and factions. It is the cause 
he advocated, he cared not who were its supporters; he looked to 
the object sought by these petitions, and not at the source whence 
they came. Much as he desired to discuss the general question 
fully and thoroughly, he would, for the present and under the 
circumstances, confine himself to the importance of the office of a 
state superintendent, with what he considered a sufficient salary. 
By way of illustrating the importance of the office, and of the various 
duties of the superintendent would-have to perform, he would 


AAS arty Ay So) Rd) te ot Valitse 
‘ CU hn 


go2 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI ons. 


and make such comments as would appear necessary. 
Ist. To visit as often and as far as practicable every | coun 


as widely as possible, by public addresses and personal communi- — 
cation with school officers, teachers and parents, a knowledge of — 
existing defects and desirable 1 improvements in the administration — 
of the system, and the government and instruction of the schools. — 

This would be one of the first duties of the superintendant, ft 
to visit the several portions and counties of the state in ord 
to discover the defects, and by practical information point out — 
the remedies. It was unnecessary for him to refer to the present ~ 
system as now organized. It was useless. Does not every one ~ 
admit that although our statute books are filled with law after — 
law, yet no single good has been effected in the system, and all ~ 
efforts to adopt or prove a good standard have failed. Does not 
every one admit the glaring truth that thousands upon thousands _ i 
of dollars have been ‘squandered in the name of. education, and a 
yet no mark has been left for its practical benefit. The cause of 4 
this is that there has been no head, that no one has been charged 
specially with the duties of superintendant, but it has been 
left in the hands of other persons who had other duties to perform. 
Such had been the case when the report of the last superintend- 
ant, then Secretary of State, was presented to the last Legis- 
lature; he was charged with other and primary duties, his time 
was fully engaged with the duties of his office; and [he] could not visit 
the different sections of the state, examine into those matters of 
difficulty and cause of failure, nor [was he] able to point out the 
proper mode of avoiding evils, and of promoting good; he could not 
bring himself into communion with the teachers and parents of the 
children, nor make those suggestions so necessary; he was only 5 
able to address a few circulars to the commissioners upon general 
matters, and there, so far as he was concerned, the subject dropped. 

Another particular he would call the attention of the Conven- 
tion to was, that this officer would travel over the state, visit 
every county, make addresses on the subject at every school dis- 
trict and awaken public sentiment upon the subject of educa- 
tion.—From a well directed public sentiment the most beneficial a 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 903 


‘effects would flow, and until that was excited it was in vain to 
k of the benefits of common schools. Appoint this officer 
and let him commence his visits. In each county it will be known 
| for weeks before hand that he is to come there and address them, 
and the people will gather to the county seat on that day, teachers 
and parents, and they will go away with feelings roused and 
directed to the promotion of the ends of education. In this way 
' that public sentiment, so necessary, will be excited in behalf of 
‘the cause; they will go home after these addresses, with their 
" minds drawn to the subject; school associations will be formed in 
each district, having for their end the benefit and advancement of 
the cause, and immense and incalculable benefits will follow. 
_ And are gentlemen prepared to say that all this is of no good? 
_ That the efforts of this officer in this respect will be of no beneficial 
be result? There is not a county in the state that he may not visit 
‘= the space of two years, and his visits, if he be a good, a faithful 
and a competent officer, will always produce these results. As 
Ms Bian evidence of the experience of this fact in another state, he read 
a) the Convention an extract from the report of Mr. BARNARD, 
J a talented and accomplished gentleman, who had held this post in 
the state of Rhode Island. Speaking of these visits, he says: 
‘ “Immediately after entering on the duties of my appointment, 
, I commenced holding a series of meetings, of such persons as ~ 
_ were disposed to come together on public notice, in the several 
_ towns of the state, for familiar and practical addresses and dis- 
_ Cussions, on topics connected with the organization and adminis- 
' tration of the school system, and the classification, instruction 
_ and discipline of public schools. (Appendix, Number m). These 
meetings which I have continued from time to time as frequently 
B as my strength would allow, have been numerously attended, and 
‘. the addresses have proved useful in awakening public interest, 
_ and disseminating information as to the best modes of improving 
. popular education. When the meetings already appointed have 
been held, more than five hundred addresses will have been made 
_ by myself, and others invited by me; and at least one meeting will 
_ have been held in every large neighborhood in every town in the 


904 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


ions as any one, who has ever written on the subject; and he s: 
that the people will attend and take interest in these addres 
And will gentlemen say that the people of Illinois are different 
their feelings and sentiments from the rest of the Union on this 
subject—that they are less conscious and awake to the i importan ce 
of the subject as regards the welfare of their children and of 
state, than the people of any other state? Will they cont 
that the moment a man places his foot upon the soil of Ilin 
that he becomes lost to all those sentiments of refinement, of virtu 
of honest pride and satisfaction, in beholding the improvement of 
the mind, and the expansion of the intellectual resources of his 
fellowmen? If so, then they cast unjust reflection upon 
character of the people of Illinois. 

2d. To recommend the best text books, and secure 2 
uniformity as far as practicable, in the schools of at least every 
county in the state, and to assist, when called upon, in the estab- 
lishment of, and the selection of books for school libraries. — 4 

Here is another and important duty, which the Legislat 
will, undoubtedly, provide for, to enable him to furnish t 
books of an uniform character, throughout the state, or at leas 
each county.—This reform is most certainly called for, and by no 
one can it be effected so well as by this superintendent; who, fr 
the information he will derive from a constant intercourse w 
the people, can accomplish that which hitherto has been i impossi- 
ble -—Again, public prejudices will be consulted, and if there are 
sections of the state where people have a preference for one kind 
of books over that of another, and believe that the ends of edu- 
cation can be accomplished better by them, than others, why 
they will be allowed to retain them, and the uniformity can 
gradually effected. Much good will result from this uniformi 
in the textbooks of the schools throughout the whole state. ~ 
superintendent was required, when called upon, to aid the district 
associations, in selecting a library for the use of the people. There 
was, in his opinion, no branch of the system of education of [m 
practical benefit than these libraries. What is the use of teaching a 
man how to read, unless you give him the means of turning that 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 905 


3 knowledge to advantage, of improving himself by practising what 
_ you have taught him. It is like rearing a young man to a trade, 


sending him for a term of years to learn the mysteries, and acquire 
a knowledge of some art or trade, and then deny him the means 


_ of carrying on that trade. Like teaching a man the trade of a 


blacksmith, or some other such art, and then bid him go without 


_ tools. Take away from him the tools and implements, necessary 


to his trade, and you place him in the same situation as the man 
whom you have taught to read. Of what use is the learning you 
have bestowed upon him if there is not placed within his reach 
the means and opportunity to turn that information to some use 


| _ and benefit to himself. He contended, then, that this branch, 


the duties which he would have to perform in aiding these library 
associations to make selections of good and useful books, had 
much to*do with the subject of education, and the promotion of 
general knowledge among the people. He, a man of information 
and taste, will be of great advantage to them; his selections will 
be such as will be beneficial to those who read them; not altogether 
children’s books, but historical, scientific, and other valuable 
books, calculated to be of general use, will be chosen by him to 
fill these libraries. In this way, as these books will be in the reach 
of all, you will create, throughout the state, a general desire for 
reading and information, which will be a successful consequence 
following your common schools. These libraries will not be 
dependent alone on the resources of the districts, they will 
be enlarged and increased by donations of books from men who, 
having the means, will feel proud to contribute to anything cal- 
culated to be beneficial to the people, and to increase their infor- 
mation, and advance the march of mind. 

3d. To appoint such and so many inspectors in each county, 
as he shall, from time to time, deem necessary, to examine all 
persons offering themselves as candidates for teaching public 
schools. 

Here we find another and most important duty which this 
superintendent will perform and one which has led to much 
trouble and dissatisfaction. Last year the Legislature was of 
opinion that the qualifications of teachers were, as fixed by law, 
too high, and that it was difficult to find men of the required quali- 


906 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS ‘ 


fications who would become teachers. When he, as Secretary ia a 
State, was ex officio superintendent of schools, he ‘received : 
many letters on this subject from different sections of the state, — 
all complaining that the law had fixed the qualifications too high, 
and of the difficulties in the way of getting teachers. They also — 
stated that the people had men not possessing the tps rp. ane ; 


and in whose competency for that office they had cohianecenle 

What is the difference on this point, in the eastern san 
‘The same. reason that causes them to have plenty of teachers, — 
competent and qualified to the task, would also exist in Illinois. — 
They have established in every state, normal schools, where there - 
are annually a number of young men and women, prepared for the ~ 
important duty of teachers. He did not propose that such schools. 4 
shall be established by the state at the present time; the condition | 
and circumstances of the state were not such as. would. support © 
them to any advantage, for the state has not the means to carr 
it out. But there was a mode, in which, to some extent, the © 
advantages of these schools, might be realized. Teachers’ insti- 
tutes might be established in the different sections of the state, — 
where the persons who perform this important task, could assembl 
together, at some convenient point in the spring and autumn 
During the vacation time of each year, they can select som 
person, distinguished for his competency and qualifications as a 
teacher, to preside over them and their studies, who will give 
such instruction, advice, and make such suggestions as will render — 
them competent and qualified teachers.—These institutes will hold — 
regular sessions for a fortnight or more, and this person, whom ~ 
they will select to preside over them, will deliver lectures to them; _ 
they will form themselves into classes, study lessons, and prepare 
recitations, as is done in our schools. In this way, until such 
time as the state may, be in a condition to establish these normal 
schools, these teachers’ institutes may be formed. The duty o 
a teacher was one of the greatest importance to the character o 
the people.—It is not the most talented, or the most learned, that 
make the best teachers. To become a teacher, qualified to im- 
part instruction to the youth, requires long practice, training o 
the mind, and close application to the attainments of these requ 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 907 


tes, so necessary to become a useful teacher. It has become an 
t which requires study and training of the mind to a peculiar 
t _ turn, independent of mere learning, and cannot be acquired with- 
X -out.—Who now choose your teachers? Who exercises that dis- 
_ crimination and care, so important in selecting proper persons 
to advance your youth in the paths of education? School com- 
missioners. They are but rarely chosen for that office with a view 
; to their competency in selecting the best or most qualified and 

"competent men as teachers. And hence the importance of this 

duty of the superintendent, whose particular duty it will be to 

"provide each district with competent persons to select teachers 

_ qualified for the importance of their undertaking. 

i 4. To grant certificates of qualification to such teachers as 
have been approved by one or more county inspectors, and shall 
' give satisfactory evidence of their moral characters, attainments 
and ability to govern and instruct children. 

_ 5. Tosubmit to the General Assembly at each regular session 
a report, containing, together with an account of his own doings, 
a statement of the condition of the public schools, and the means 

_and progress of popular education in the state; plans and sugges- 
tions for their improvement; such other matters relating to the 

duties of his office as he may deem useful and proper to communi- 
Beate. 

It will be his duty, at the meeting of every General Assembly, 

_to make to them a report of everything connected with his office. 

‘He will have been in correspondence with persons in all sections 

of the state, in correspondence with the teachers, with those per- 
" sons selected in each county to examine the teachers, with parents, 
and with all those persons who feel an interest in the question, and 
will be able, from the information derived from all these 
“sources and from his visits and personal observation, to discover 
such improvements in the system as will be salutary and bene- 
- ficial to the advancement of the great cause of education, and the 
i ‘dissemination of its benefits throughout the state—The Legis- 

“lature at the present time have not the means to acquire this 

information, nor this opportunity of receiving those suggestions 

_ that will be likely to produce salutary measures that are necessary. 

ete, i in the performance of the various duties of the office, will 


,) 


if 


908 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


travel over the whole state, from county to county, gathering 

each place all such information as may be practically benefici 
and communicate it all to the Legislature, upon which then tl 
can base their action. And this, in his opinion, is the only wi: 
that we can ever arrive at any just conclusions, at any correc 
system of common schools, and one that will accomplish its gr 

object. 4 

6. To adjust and decide without appeal Ee without cost to 
the parties, all controversies and disputes arising under the school 
law, which may be submitted to him for settlement and decision. 

This, sir, is also an important feature in the duties which this 
superintendent will be required to perform. This is taken from 
the New York school system, and in that state has been found 
productive of the very best results. Do we not all know the 
frequent occurrences of these quarrels and disputes in relation to 
this matter in the different townships and counties? We - 
know how these controversies arise, with what feeling they 
carried on, to what lengths they are extended. In this way t 
will all be settled without cost to the parties, and before they a: 
ripened into feuds between neighborhoods, or produced liti 
tion, cost and excitement, which, as is frequently the case, 
destroyed and broken up the schools entirely. Under this suj 
intendent’s care, these disputes are stopped in their incipi 
stage, and they are submitted to him for decision, and his decis 
is final, and this, too, without cost to either party. How much 
better is this state of things than the present system. This super- 
intendent can settle all complaints, and by this means avoid 
those quarrels which tend so much to injure the cause of edu 
tion, and retard the progress of learning, virtue and morality. 
this way all cost is saved, and useless litigation obviated. 

4. To prepare suitable forms and regulations for making 
reports, and conducting all necessary proceedings under the law, 
and to transmit the same, with [such] instructions as he shall d deem 
necessary and proper for the uniform and thorough administration 
of the school system, to the school commissioner of each cou 
for distribution among the officers required to execute them. 

In this branch of the duties of this superintendent we hav 
an important duty for him to perform. In this particular t 


a 
tO 
i 

| 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 7847 909 
4 ! ; 

‘system that we now have has been much deficient, and will tend 
much to reform and improve any system. Heretofore all infor- 
mation from the school commissioners and teachers has been re- 
ceived in answer to interrogatories addressed them, and of necessity 
incomplete and unsatisfactory, and but little calculated to convey 
correct bases on which to found or suggest improvements. 

_ 8. To submit plans and directions for erecting and fitting up 
school houses. 

This duty will be found to be one most intimately connected 
‘with the advancement of education. The building and erecting 
of suitable school houses for the instruction of the youth of the 
State, has been a source of much difficulty to all concerned.— 
Tn the erection of the school houses in this state convenience and 
‘comfort has never been consulted. When you send a boy to 
school with the expectation that he will learn something, you 
must have him comfortable. You must not require him to sit 
there for three or four hours at a time, upon an oak bench, full of 
knot holes, without anything for him to rest against, with, per- 
haps, a hot stove in front of him, burning him up on one side, while 
the open door or the apertures between the logs admit the cold and 
biting air, freezing him on the other. In such school houses your 
children cannot be comfortable. He is compelled to sit there 
half the day, under the fiat of the teacher, unable to move his 
limbs, until his turn arrives to recite his lessons, and as soon as 
that is over, returns to his seat.—Boys will not learn in such places. 
They will not, cannot, study when they are not comfortable; they 
soon acquire a hatred for the school, become dissatisfied with it, 
and when they do so, it is impossible for them to study, and the 
result is, that they either stay away one-half the time, or go there 
with minds indisposed to study or to application. In this way 
the intention of the schools is defeated, and the desires of parents 
are disappointed. On no point is a reform more needed than on 
this, as school houses erected with a view to comfort and conven- 
ience are essentially necessary for the practical advantages of 
your school system. 
These are only a few of the most important duties which this 

‘state superintendent will be required to perform; but, he asked, if 
even those he had enumerated were carried out and performed, 


red 


% 


gio a it 


would he not work great benefit and advaneane ie system, 
those concerned in its results, and to the character of the w 
people? And that this superintendent will perform the va: 
duties of his office there could be no doubt. No one could do 
but he will do all his duty, will take a pride and an interest in 
doing, for his actions, his efforts in the cause, will be under a 
ever open to the welfare and success of the great cause in which 
the whole body of the people are interested, and who will expect 
so much from him, and he, knowing this, will not dare to negl 
any opportunity of advancing the interests of education, nor 
in the least important point, derelict in his duty. eh 
In connection with this subject he read an extract fror 
letter written to the Hon. John Henry on the subject of comr 
schools, as follows: 
“‘t. In this state we began at the wrong end.—We have spent 
millions to pay the miserable teachers whom we found in 
exercise of the profession, when the common school system 
adopted, and to carry out the expensive details of a complic 
system, but never gave a dollar or a thought to the indispens 
prerequisite of teaching the teachers. Hence, the slow progres 
our system into public favor. 
““9. In the next place, we hitched on the supervision 0 
system the political office of Secretary of State, and have thus sul 
jected its fate to the political fears of every administration. Thi 
though no officer has been base enough to prostitute the syste 
to political purposes, yet, scarcely anyone has been brave eno 
to encounter political risk or odium in its behalf.’’ 
Here, sir, is the opinion of a distinguished citizen of Pe 
sylvania, who has given much attention to the subject, and 
says that they have squandered millions of money without ] 
ducing the least good, because no thought was ever given to 
important point of selecting competent teachers. And ft 
the cause has been retarded and the interests of education injure 
because the superintendency of the system has been hitched 
to the political office of a Secretary of State. This, sir, is what 
have done in Illinois. Instead of making an independent depart 
ment, whose whole attention would be devoted to the subjec 
we have hitched it on to the political office of our Secretary 


letter further says: 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 gli 


_ State; and unless we make this superintendent an independent, 
constitutional officer, it will always be attached to the office of 
_ Secretary of State or some other political office, and we will find 
_ that no one will hold the office more than two years, for he will 
be under the control and dictation of party influences. The 

“Tnstead of bringing the powers of an able and zealous press 

to bear in its favor, nearly all the papers in the state have from 
the same political fears, held aloof from its advocacy, or only 
_ afforded an occasional cold word of praise. From our mistakes 
I would say learn wisdom.’’ 
. This remark, sir, will apply as truly to the press of Illinois; 
__ we, too, have had our press engaged in political strife, in party 
_ warfare, in working dissensions among the people, in urging 
them to party measures and advancing their political schemes, 
while the great question of education has been lost sight of by 
them, and it has been abandoned to its private friends. This 
subject would, however, be taken up by them, it will be discussed, 
and the great influence of their power will be felt, if we but carry 
out this reform. 

Mr. C. here read further extracts from a letter’ written by a 
gentleman in Boston, in relation to the establishment of good 
primary schools in the west, and the means of acquiring good 
teachers both male and female from the east. He also read the 
following from a report made by Professor Stowe of Ohio, 
who was appointed by that state to visit and report the various 
systems of common school education in Europe, after detailing in 
full the information he received, he speaks of what has been done 
in Ohio, and says: 

“To follow up this great object, the Legislature has wisely 
made choice of a superintendent whose untiring labors and dis- 
interested zeal are worthy of all praise. But no great plan can 
be carried through in a single year; and if the superintendent is to 
have opportunity to do what is necessary, and to preserve that 
_ independence and energy of official character which is requisite to 
the successful discharge of his duties, he should hold his office for 
the same term and on the same conditions, as the judges of the 


supreme court. 


g12 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS  —_— 


should receive a suitable compensation for his services. This — 
justice requires, and it is the only way to secure Seay | and eff- 
ciency.” } 
Here we have the opinion of this distinguished deere see who { 
has devoted a long life to the study, who has visited all Europe, a 
and examined and enquired everywhere into the various systems ~ 
of the world, and he says ‘‘the state has acted wisely in appointing — 
a state superintendent.”’ And why not? This is an anbertaa ; 


seers as that we should have an executive or Pah Aral 
gentlemen prepared for the mere saving of a few dollars to abandon ~ 
this? Are they prepared to place in the scales a few paltry dollar 
and cents, with the enlightenment of the human mind, and permit 
them to weigh it down? He hoped not. He would regret that ~ 
the Convention, under the pretext of saving a few dollars, would © 
forego the immense benefits this superintendent would produce in ~ 
their system of Education. If he were selected by the state to — 
devise the best, the surest, the most effectual way of clearing the © 
state from her debt, he would seize upon the whole of the r - 
sources of the state, and turn them all to the one great current— 
the education of her people, to the enlightenment of the public — 
mind, and to the dissemination of knowledge, of virtue, of moral- _ 
ity. They would then be filled with an honest, an anxious desire” 4 
to rise in their strength of moral force and power, urged on by its K; 
instinctive moral principle; they would not cease in their exertions ~ 
till the whole of the vast debt was cleared away, and the dark ~ 
gloom that overhangs them was dispelled. It is the policy of © 
governments to educate their children. Let us educate the people. — 
One bad legislator will do more harm—tear down and destroy 
more than ten good ones can build up and erect. Let us educate © 
the people for the important task of being their own legislators. — 
In a republican government like the one in which we lived, he © 
considered it a paramount duty to instruct and educate the people 
for the social and civil conditions. of society; every person was ~ 
called upon to discharge his share of duty to his country, and ah 
it was a proper obligation on the government to educate him tha 


aie 


- THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 913 


“he might do so with honor to himself and his state. Educate the 
people and no bad legislators will be chosen, and the state will 
"realize far more benefit than by such saving of expense as is con- 
tended for here, when you oppose this office on account of the 
‘salary. Mr. C. then read the following extract of a letter from 

Governor Slade, addressed to him since the meeting of the Con- 
vention: 

“Nothing, it seems to me, in laying the foundations of a repub- 

_ lican state, can be of more importance than a provision for secur- 
‘ing the devoted application of some single mind to the special 
purpose of advancing the interests of education. With all the 
interest felt in New England on this subject, we have greatly failed 
in this particular, and have wasted hundreds of thousands of 
dollars upon defective systems of instruction, and unqualified, 

inefficient teachers, for the want of that systematic attention to- 
the subject which can be secured only by a superintendency of 
public instruction, such as the states referred to have wisely pro- 
vided for in their constitutions. It has not been until within a 
few years that we have discovered the error, and taken measures 
to remedy it. I hope that Illinois will not follow the example of 
our long neglect of our true interests in this particular.”’ 

This, sir, is from a gentleman who has been appointed secre- 
tary of the board of education, at Cincinnati, to furnish teachers 
for such places as may require them. A man who has given the 
subject the benefit of a long and thorough examination, and whose 
experience is sufficient to demand for his opinion every weight 
and consideration. Is his opinion to have no weight upon this 
question? It has been said that his opinion should have no weight, 
that it is valueless, and should be disregarded because he has inter- 

ested motives in recommending what he does. Sir, we should 

care nothing for the motive. I care not who is the deviser of the 
system, who it is that recommends it, provided that I am satisfied 
the thing itself is good in its operation—good in all its results. 
I care not, if they send us good and competent teachers to in- 
struct our youth, to light up in their minds the fires of intellect, 
what their motive may be. Nor do I stop, when satisfied that 
the result will be productive of good to the people, whether their 
motives be interested or not. What should we care if they be 


> ty At pe ha A ete Ae eae) Se ha 


Dray ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC’ 


interested, they are certainly interested in a at cause, eae 
the motives for which are honorable and praiseworthy. y 
then, should we care if they do make money by sending forth, o ve 
the land, men and women to enlighten the minds of their fello 
men, so the object to be attained, and the grand result to. b 
accomplished, is one of so much good. They are perfectly w 
come to do so. . 
As an example of the benefits of the system under the supe 
vision of this state superintendent, let us take the sum of $100, 
and appropriate it for educational purposes and measures, in the 
manner we have done for years, and are doing at ‘Present, with ne 
particular person charged with its distribution, its appropriati or 
to the particular objects intended that it should be applied to, and 
how far does it go—what good will it accomplish? Take $50, 
and disburse it throughout the state to proper persons, appointed 
and selected by this superintendent as men qualified to act ; 
agents, to be applied by them, under his supervision, to the spe 
fied duties, objects and measures prescribed by law, and a 
account of which to be rendered to him, and by him to the Gene 
Assembly, and my word for it there will be ten times the amor 
of good effected, as would be by the $100,000 under the pres 
loose and irresponsible system, as now practiced and in operati 
Why, sir, the ordinary business of life is carried on by agent 
selected for their competency and capacity to discharge 
duties, and they are all under the supervision of some head—so 
principal. A man in business—does he not select his book-kee 
with an eye to his competency and qualification, and exercise o 
_him a supervision. Clerks and agents to transact our business z 
discharge their duties in this mode, and why should we have 
in all other affairs except this—the most sacred of all, the edt 
tion of our people. In the amendment he had offered he ha 
fixed the salary of this superintendent at what he considered 
adequate compensation to secure a good officer and a strict atten 
ance to his business, the sum of $1,500 a year. And will gen atl 
men complain of it as too high? Will gentlemen say that 
people of the state will complain if they raise this office, | 
provide that the salary shall be $1,500 a year?—Are t 
prepared to go home to their constituents and tell them t 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 915 


they refused to provide in the constitution this office, because 
of the expense it would incur. Is any man upon this floor afraid 
- that when he goes home, after voting for this amendment, and 
= with his constituents, that they will say to him, why did 
_ you vote for this; we would rather you should vote $1,500 dollars 
" [sic] a year to a superintendent of our schools [than] have our 
children remain under the deep and dark gloom of ignorance which 
. at present hangs upon them. Does any man here fear the people 
will say this to him? No, sir. Is there a single delegate in this 
- Convention who will pretend that if he votes for this superintend- 
ent, with a salary of $1,500 a year, that his constituents will 
_ murmur or complain of his vote; that they will for a moment 
an hesitate to approve of the act; that they will say to him, ‘‘we sent 
_ you to the Convention for no such purpose as this, we wanted, we 

_ desired, we asked for no such office; we wanted you to attend to 

: ~ the other business, and not to provide an officer, with sufficient 
_ salary, to promote the cause of education, and the instruction with 
advantage to our children? Does anyone pretend that they will 
Say we wanted no improvement in our system of commonschools, 

_ no reform in their operation, no change for the better in their 
_ practical effect? No, sir; there is not a man who will dare to 
utter such a reflection upon the character of the people. The sum 
_ of $1,500 is not too much. This officer will be engaged the whole 
year, he will have to travel from one end of the state to the other, 
will have to deliver lectures and addresses in every county (one 
_ hundred in number) in the state, will be absent for a great portion 
_ of his time from home and his family, and this sum will not be_ 
found too much. Compare, then, the salary of $1,500 a year with 
_ the immense benefits that will flow from his administration of the 
_ duties, with the great improvements that he will make, with the 
complete reform of our present inefficient system, and above all, 
with great saving from the inconsiderate expenditures now made; 
Bs and then will you say that $1,500 a year is too much? Suppose, 
_ sir, that the vast number of children of this state who have not 
Ris the benefits of education, and on whose infant minds its light 
has never dawned, were arrayed in one body before this conven- 
i tion, would not the sight elicit the warmest emotions of the soul, 
and cause the mind of every one here to make the inquiry, is it 


oO ree 


( 


916 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


not our duty, our highest duty, to provide for the education a 
moral cultivation of this mighty power that is rising up and soon 
will stand in our places in this hall? Such a spectacle is not possi 
ble, however, but the mind may picture it; arid before the mind of 
every delegate they may be arrayed, in all their growing streng 
and ignorance. Look at the returns of the last census of this state; 
in the large number who have no education, you can see a fa 
that points out too clearly the necessity for this state superintend 
ent. This office of state superintendent, in his opinion, would 
be the saving clause of this constitution. Many provisions h 
been inserted in it that were obnoxious to many portions of the 
people. Already do we find them taking sides against its adoption, 
we find their presses out in opposition to many of its provision: 

and this opposition, too, came from a quarter where the cause of 
education has been much neglected. Adopt this, and we hav 
one feature which the whole people will rejoice and be glad 
support—one which will be to them, perhaps, a sufficient reas 
to overlook other provisions to which they are hostile, and whi 
they would be content with rather than lose this. This considera- 
tion reminded him of another, equally important. What would be- 
come of the constitution itself, unless it was sustained by the 
intelligence and morality of the people, which depended on their 
means of education. The rights of men had for their sole protec: 
tion the creation of just laws, and they could only be founded and 
sustained upon the dissemination of virtue and knowledge amo 
the people. And shall it be said that one of the states of 
greatest republic that has ever existed, in Convention to frame t 
organic law of the land, has adopted a constitution without 
single provision in it for the promotion of education, or for t 
instruction and enlightenment of the minds of the people? Let 
gentlemen look abroad over the land, let them see what other 
states have done, what other nations, governed by a widely 
different policy, have done for the education of their people, a: 
it is calculated to bring the blush of shame to our cheek. L 
them look at the monarchies of Europe and see what they 
doing to strengthen themselves by the education of their people. 
Let them look at Prussia, famed all over the world for the 
extent and benefit of her common schools, and the liberality 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 917 


_ her views upon education; and Prussia is an absolute monarchy! 
_ The same spirit has prompted the government of Bavaria, and 
_ she has taken steps that will eventually lead to the education and 


instruction of her people. 

All over Europe, from Poland to Siberia, from the shores of 
the White Sea, to the regions beyond the Caucasus, there is a 
system of complete common school education established. The 
sun of education is pouring down its refulgent rays upon that 
benighted and frozen region. France, too, has her normal schools, 
and her system of common schools. Austria is not behind the 
educational spirit that is characterizing the age. She, too, has 
her system in full operation. The Sultan of Turkey, and Pacha 


_ of Egypt have been moved by its power and the calling for teachers. 


In Constantinople, there has been established a society for the 
diffusion of knowledge, and there are, at this time, in Paris and 
London, Turks and Greeks, and Arabs, preparing themselves for 
the important task of teaching in their respective countries. In 
those countries, the office of a teacher, of an instructor of youth, 
is an honorable one, respected by the people and the laws. In 
Prussia, when these teachers get old, unable to perform their sacred 
duty longer, or when they die, a pension is conferred upon their 
children. Suchis not the casehere. We hold out no inducements, 
either by social or public laws, for making the office of a teacher 
an honorable or a profitable one. 

In this question he felt a deep and abiding interest, and felt 
satisfied that the whole people were as equally interested. To 
test the question before the Convention he had drawn up his 


amendment. Why [did] not then the gentleman from Jefferson 


either vote for or against the amendment, and not embarrass it with 
his motion to amend. He can as well accomplish his end by vot- 
ing against it, as by encumbering the constitution with any 
useless provision that the Legislature ‘‘may’’ do this &c., 
which they have the power to do without any such provision. 

He well remembered that but a short time ago gentlemen were 
loud and pertinacious in placing upon the Legislature every kind 
of restriction; that they then declared the necessity of providing 
in the constitution in express terms what the Legislature should 
not do, and prescribing also what they should do, for they said 


fe eds ptr ash a ce Fs da Ore eT TN OT ea 


eo 


918 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIC 


that no confidence was to be placed i in the Legislature, 
could not be reasonably expected it would ever do anything 
was good, and would be continually running into evil if not re- 
strained. This had been the position of gentlemen, and the - 
gentleman from Jefferson among others. Why. then does he em- 
barrass this amendment with his proposal to insert “ ‘may’ instead | 
of “‘shall?’’ Why do gentlemen desire on this question so impor 
tant, and so necessary to be carried into effect, why do they desi 
to leave the whole matter open to the Legislature? What moi 
auspicious moment than the present to adopt this system—whe 
will you have such another opportunity? Why delay the goo 
work? Iowa, Wisconsin and Ohio have this state superintenden 
and must Illinois be behind all the rest? New York has not adop 
ed it. Why she has not done so, can be accounted for, she has — 
a system of education and common schools perfect in itself and it 
requires no hand to reform it, as does our own. We propose thi 
office of state superintendent as an experiment. It is not proposed as _ 
a permanent thing in the constitution to be fixed there unalter. 
ably, it provides that the office shall exist for six years, and ie, 
if the people are not satisfied with it, it may be abandoned. [ 
thought that six years would not be sufficient time to test t 
question, that in that period the superintendent would not be able ~ 
to produce such results as would show the benefits of his adminis- 
tration, but the committee say that it will, and have reported this — 
period and he was willing to go for it, and to risk the question. — 
Will not gentlemen allow us to try the experiment even for this _ 
period; will they not lay aside their prejudices and permit us 
try it, and if it does not succeed it may be abandoned. 

He was of opinion that this superintendent should be elected 
by the people; that he should be perfectly independent of tl 
other branches of the government, and that the choice should b 
left with the people themselves; but the gentleman from Madison 
(Mr. Epwarps) and the rest of the committee says that he should 
be appointed by the Governor and Senate, and if this be the 
opinion of the majority of the Convention, he would n 
hesitate to vote for it in that shape. If those who have the cau 
of education so much at heart think the superintendent should be 
appointed by the Governor and Senate he ahi. agree, but he 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 919 


appealed to the Convention to give them the office in some way. 
His only object, his only desire, was that the superintendent 
_ should be provided for, and cared but little how he was chosen. 
_ He only desired to have the office created by the constitution, 
fixed permanently, made an independent department, above and 
beyond interference, and cared nothing particularly how you 
provided for his choice. 

In behalf of this object he appealed to the friends of economy 
and retrenchment, they who desired to carry them into all the 
_ departments of the government, to come forward and give their 
- support to this superintendent. If they sincerely desired to pro- 
mote retrenchment and economy let them vote for this great 
auxilliJary in the cause of educationand enlightenment of the people. 
Prodigality, extravagance and dishonesty were the results always 

_ attendant upon ignorance; but virtue, economy and justice were 
_ the sure results of intelligence, when lighted up by the holy glow 
of education. Therefore he appealed to the friends of retrench- 
- ment to come to his aid and support this proposition, whose object 
___was to increase the intelligence, the morality and virtue of the 
13 people. If he were called upon for a scheme to promote the prin- 
_ ciples of economy and retrenchment, to present them in all their 
_ truth and importance to the people, he would advocate this system 
having for its end the education of the whole people, the increase 
_ of their intelligence, the enlightenments of their mind, and the 
_ dissemination of moral and virtuous knowledge among them. 

He appealed to those among the delegates in the Convention, 
who were so nobly and generously the advocates of temperance, 
to come forward and support this. Nothing could be a more 
_ powerful aid to their efforts in the advancement of their benevo- 
_ lent cause than the education of the people, and the increase of 
their intelligence. 

i, To those engaged in the sacred cause of christianity, to 
_ those who are laboring to spread abroad over the land its light and 
its glory, he would earnestly appeal to come forward and support 
_ this proposition. They would find that it would aid them more 


de 1 Oe) & t 
“) an 


ARAT \ ONPRWe RT Sere ore, 


Oe WEAR Caney ieee tie i 
AMUN ne Dal RAT 


920 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS — 


above to its author and founder, with feelings awakened by 
influence of education and moral instruction. He asked them th 
to come forward and adopt this. 

Oh! that he had a voice that would reach in tones of persuasiv 
eloquence the ears of all the parents within the bounds of the 
state, he would implore them to awake from the long night of | 
sleep, and fly to the support of education and to the rescue of their 
children. Oh! that he could present to their view, the destiny c of 
those, who were bone of their bone, and flesh of their flesh, when n 
they left their parental roof with minds shrouded in ignoranc te) 
and morals shaped for vice, with no enlightened perception t to 
select the path of virtue from the path of evil; stepping from crim e 
to crime, until their course closes in the prison cell of degradatior 
or perhaps the parent, in seeking his child, tracks him in blood to 
the scaffold of execution. It is then that the never dying worm 
of remorse seizes upon the aching conscience, it is then, when a 
is lost, that duties unperformed rise up in hideous array, and ve 
with horrid tortures the parent who has thus neglected the « e 
cation of his children. 

Look, said Mr. C., at the other side of the picture, and you 
see, traced in colors upon which the moral eye delights to dw 
the man whose mind has received the early impress of educati 
and the moral direction and tone which knowledge gives to charac- 
ter. His course through life is marked with purity, virtue and 
honor. If even poor the path of preferment has been opened I 
pointed out to him, there is no place or position to which he n 
not aspire. And when in after years he has clambered up fr. 
shelf to shelf, until he has reached the nakedest pinnacle of the 
all, he can look back and trace his starting point to the distri 
common school, and to the kind parent whose ever waking solici- 
tude for the welfare, prosperity and happiness of his child, did r 
permit the beneficial opportunities which the glorious system 
common schools affords to pass unimproved. With what call 
composure and resignation can such a parent shuffle off the mort 
care which binds him to earth and sever with ease the dearest | | 


with the realization of his brightest and pune antewareeel th 
hope itself, that great sunshine principle and might incentive 


THURSDAY, AUGUST 26, 1847 921 


virtuous. action, folds its downy pinions in sublime and lofty re- 
pose. 

Let then the sun of education be made to shine upon this 
people, and its enlightening rays will soon dispel the murky fogs 
of ignorance and superstition through which so many of our people 
are compelled to creep, in abjectness and in misery from the cradle 
to the grave. 

Mr. ATHERTON made some remarks in opposition to the 
state superintendent, urging that we had not the means to pay 
him, and that the people could get along well enough under their 
present system, had they more means. And closed by moving to 
lay the subject on the table. 

The question was divided so as to vote first on laying the 
amendment of Mr. CampBELt on the table, and rejected, and then 
on laying the 4th and sth sections on the table, and it was also 
rejected. 

Mr. GREEN of Tazewell advocated the adoption of a provi- 
sion for a state superintendent of instruction, and in the course 
of his remarks congratulated the gentleman from Jo Daviess upon 
his better judgment, as expressed to-day in relation to the 
intelligence and principles of education of the people of Rhode 
Island, and assured the gentleman that the adoption of a system 
of education followed by that state would result in the inculcation 
of the same liberal and patriotic political principles of that state. 

Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved to amend the substitute 
by making it read, ‘“The Legislature may provide for the appoint- 
ment of a state superintendent of public instruction.”’ 

Mr. SCATES opposed the whole system, and then on motion 
of 

Mr. EDWARDS of Madison the Convention adjourned till 


' to-morrow at 8 A. M. 


LXVI. FRIDAY, AUGUST 27, 1847 


Prayer by Rev. Mr. Barcer. 
The question pending, at the adjournment yesterday, was on — 
the amendment offered by Mr. Davis of Montgomery. i ; 
Mr. BOSBYSHELL said, the general system of com 
school education, as adopted by our state, will do more insuppress- _ 
ing vice and immorality throughout this country, than all th 
punishment that can be inflicted upon the transgressor by o 
statutes. Yes, sir, all attempts that are made to improve 
general condition of the human family, will fail in the end, o 
be but partially accomplished, until the dark cloud of ignorance 
removed from the human mind, and man be made to feel the im- 
portance of a good character, reputation, -and the good he ow 
to himself, to all around, and to the great Author of his exis 
ence, and that virtue and happiness are most likely to be th 
legitimate attendants of that knowledge that orders and influen 
aright the practices and actions of men. And, sir, it is, from awak 
ening this inclination for the diffusion of useful knowledge of ever 
sort among the body of mankind, that we derive one of our strong- f 
est grounds of hope for human nature, and for the world; and it” 
is for this reason that we should hail with delight the establishment _ 4 

of this general system of common school education, upon a solid 
and firm foundation; and it is, sir, with the same hope and interest, ~ 
that we should now look for the dissemination of such principle 
as will contribute to our happiness, and the happiness of thos 
who may come on the stage of life after us. But what earthh 
glory, sir, is there of equal lustre and duration to that conferr 
by education? What else could have bestowed such renown up 
the philosophers, the poets, the statesmen, and the orators of 
antiquity? What else, sir, could have conferred such undisputed 
applause upon Aristotle, Demosthenes and Homer; on Virgil 
Horace and Cicero? And is learning less interesting, sir, now — 
than it was in centuries past, when those statesmen and orator: 
charmed and ruled empires with their eloquence? Sir, let it n¢ 
922 


RTOS TL Nowhere HN Se SD ee mL ai 
aa 2 * '- rs ; 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 27, 1847 923 


be thought that those great men acquired a greater fame than is 
_ within the reach of the present age. Many sons of this country, 
sir, possess as high native talents as any other nation of ancient 
or modern times! Many of the poorest of our children possess 
bright intellectual genius, if they were as highly polished, as did 
_ the proudest scholars of Greece and Rome. But too long—too 
_ disgracefully long, has coward, trembling, procrastinating indif- 
_ ference upon this subject, permitted them to lie buried in dark 
_ _unfathomed caves. Sir, it was a ray of the light of education that 
first actuated our forefathers to leave the land of their nativity 
_ and seek an asylum from oppression in this, then wilderness land. 
And it was the still farther illumination of the human mind, by a 
proper direction and cultivation of its faculties, that we, as a nation 
have prospered, and only can prosper. Thus, we see that in pro- 
portion, as the light of knowledge has dawned on the human mind, 
__ have correct principles been inculcated, and the happiness of the 
_ human family increased. To see the result in our state, we have 
_ only to glance at its condition. We behold ourselves as a state, 
though yet in our [in]fancy, in a prosperous condition; teeming with 
the fruits of a bountiful Providence, and with numerous institu- 
tions of learning, founded by the liberality and wisdom of an 
enlightened people. Whose prosperity, at home and abroad, 
is founded on the useful knowledge that is disseminated in every 
_ class in the community. 
y Messrs. Mason and Hurtgut both advocated the appoint- 
‘ ment of the state superintendent. | 
4 Mr. CALDWELL and Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon present- 
__ €d propositions in relation to the state debt, which were laid on [the] 
_ table, and ordered to be printed. : 
‘i Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess said, that he was exceedingly 
_ anxious to have a direct vote upon the question, whether they 
_ would have a superintendent or not and did not like to see 
_ it choked down with any such ridiculous amendment as that 
_ the Legislature may do what everyone knew they had the power 
_ to do without any provision on the subject. He liked no such 
_ evasive proposition, it was nothing more than holding out to the 
_ people a sort of pretended desire on the part of the Convention 
_ to give them what they looked for so anxiously. Why tell the 


924 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Legislature that they ‘‘may’’ do this? Do not the gentle: 
know that they have the power to create this office without thi 
provision, and why then burden the constitution with a recital 
of what the Legislature may do? If we do so in one instance why 
not in all, and where then will we stop?—When will this Conven- 
tion adjourn if we go on and insert in the constitution everythi 
that the Legislature may do, when we know they can do it as well 
without as with such provision. The object, however, was clear; 
they propose this ‘‘may’’ proposition in order to deceive the oon 
ple, and to avoid the responsibility of voting directly on a questio 1, 
which if they rejected, they knew the people would hold them 
responsible for. He was of opinion, anyway, that they aad be 
held responsible if this question was defeated, no matter how they 
managed to avoid and shrink from it. He hoped the amendment t 
would be withdrawn and the single isolated question of a state 
superintendent or not, would be voted upon, and either ee or 
rejected. “4 
Mr. ARMSTRONG moved to lay the amendment of | 
Davis on the table; whereupon 
Mr. DAVIS said, he would withdraw his anon 
moved the previous question. 
Mr. LOGAN appealed to him to withdraw it, and it was with 
drawn. 
Mr. LOGAN then renewed the amendment just withicaeae By 
Mr. Davis. 4 
Mr. PRATT moved to lay the amendment on the talile: a A. 
Mr. CAMPBELL of Jo Daviess modified his substitute so 
that the superintendent should be appointed by the Governor a 
two-thirds of the Senate. 
The question was taken by yeas and nays on ae ne amet 
ment of Mr. Locan on the table, and the motion was lost— 
64, nays 79. 
Mr. ATHERTON moved the previous question; ordered. 
And the question being taken on the amendment of } 
Locan, to the substitute of Mr. CampBELt, it was adopted—y 
82, nays 63. ‘% 
The question then recurred on inserting the substitute s 
amended in lieu of the 4th and sth sections of the report. 


es Sere 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 27, 1847 925 


Mr. PRATT asked for a division of the question so as to vote 
first on striking out those sections; and the division was refused. 

Mr. CAMPBELL said, that he hoped now the whole subject 
would be laid on the table; there was no use in swelling the con- 
stitution with a useless recital of powers in the Legislature, that 
no one doubted, but they had at present. 

The question was taken by yeas and nays on striking out 
4th and sth sections and inserting the amended substitute, and it 


_ was decided in the affrmative—yeas 82, nays 62. 


Mr. ARMSTRONG moved that the report be now taken up, 
section by section; adopted. 

Mr. LOGAN offered as an additional section to follow section 
one, the following: 

“All money hereafter received from the government of the 
United States, on account, or for the benefit of, the school, college 
and seminary fund, or either of them, be appropriated to the 
payment of the bonds of this state held by the government of 
the United States in trust for the Smithsonian Institute until said 
bonds are discharged: and the amount so paid shall be added to 
the school fund, and interest thereon shall be promptly paid.’’ 

Mr. DEITZ offered the following substitute therefor: 

““All moneys hereafter received from the government of the 
United States, on account or for the benefit of the school, college 
and seminary fund, or either of them, shall be invested in the 
outstanding bonds of this state at their market value, so long as 
any bonds are outstanding, and it shall be the duty of the General 
Assembly to make provision for the punctual payment of the 
interest on the bonds so purchased.”’ 

Mr. MOFFETT moved the previous question; ordered. 

Mr. DEMENT moved a call of the Convention;—refused. 

The question was taken on the substitute, and it was adopted. 
Yeas 75, nays 70. 

The amendment, as amended, was then adopted—yeas 72, nays 
69. 

Mr. SCATES moved to add to the end of the second line of 
the first section: ‘‘and also the moneys arising from the sale of 
the sixteenth section.”’ 


AY Soh Orda oe Pret hun ‘Te, We, 


ft 


‘ file : é# sy 
926 «ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC’ TONS Ke 


Mr. TURNBULL moved to lay the amendment “on the. ; 
Carried. 4 
Mr. DAVIS of Montgomery moved to amend by adding 
following additional section: i 

‘The interest due to the several counties of this cee ‘og 
the school, college and seminary fund, shall be paid annually, 
the proper officers of said counties, in gold and silver”? 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved to reconsider the vote, by whi ' 
the report was taken up by sections; and the motion, By Lia an 
nays, was carried—yeas 72, nays 59. 

The whole report being then before the Convention, 

Mr. CONSTABLE moved to lay the whole subject: on t 
table. Carried—yeas 73, nays 58. a 

Mr. SCATES said, that one of the members of the eee com n 
mittee on preparing a schedule, had gone home and would not 
return. He therefore moved that the President fill the vacancy Q 
on that committee, occasioned by the absence of att Many, 
from the 4th circuit. Me 
Mr. SMITH of Macon moved the Convention adjourn. ie 
jected. et 
Mr. SCATES said, the committee wand have a meeting a ; 
2 o'clock, and the vacancy ought to be filled now. 

Considerable time was consumed and much confusion pr 
vailed, during which, motions to adjourn were continually made 
by Messrs. THomas, SmirH, Woopson, Dawa KENNER an d 
KNowLTon; which were rejected. Jz 

Mr. HAYES contended that the chair had the power, ihe 3 
any motion, to fill the vacancy; but he hoped the motion would 
be persisted in, to see how long the whigs would struggle to prev 
the vacancy being filled. 

Messrs. THorNtoN, KNowLton and Woopson opposed 
motion, and argued that there was no evidence that Mr. Ma 1 
was absent. ' 

Messrs. Z. Casey, ARCHER, and others informed the house th 
Mr. M. had gone home. ‘g 

After various motions to aici had been voted down, ~ 

Mr. LOGAN said that he hoped the opposition would be wit h- 


drawn. 


a a es a 


y 


sien 


ery 


ie. al ee of en, Sede . A i a 


ee a - Salt ty 
4 Ae Me aoe 2 ae - 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 27, 1847 927 


The motion was put, and no quorum voted, (one side of the 


_ house refusing to vote). The motions to adjourn were renewed, 


and again rejected. 
And finally, the motion of Mr. ScaTes prevailed, and Mr. 


Hayes was appointed to fill the vacancy. 


And then the Convention adjourned till 3 P. M. 


AFTERNOON 


_ Mr. EDWARDS, from the committee on Revision, to whom 
had been referred the subject, made the following report: 

Sec. —. Whenever two-thirds of all the members elected to 
each branch of the General Assembly shall think it necessary 
to alter or amend this constitution, they shall recommend to the 
electors at the next election of members to the General Assembly, 
to vote for or against a convention; and if it shall appear that a 
majority of all the electors of the state voting for Representatives, 
have voted for a convention, the General Assembly shall, at the 
next session, call a convention, to consist of as many members as 
the House of Representatives, at the time of making said call, to 
be chosen in the same manner, at the same place, and by the same 
electors, in the same districts that choose the said General Assem- 
bly, and which convention shall meet within three months after 
the said election, for the purpose of revising, altering or amending 
this constitution. 

Mr. KENNER offered the following substitute therefor: 

Sec. —. Any amendment or amendments to this Constitution, 
may be proposed in either branch of the General Assembly, and 


‘if the same shall be agreed to by two-thirds of all the members 


elect in each of the two houses, such proposed amendment or 
amendments shall be referred to the next regular session of the 
General Assembly, and shall be published at least three months 
previous to the time of holding the next election for members of 
the House of Representatives, and if (at the next regular session 
of the General Assembly after the said election) a majority of all 
the members elect in each branch of the General Assembly shall 
agree to said amendment or amendments, then it shall be their 
duty to submit the same to the people at the next general election, 


_ for their adoption or rejection, in such manner as may be pre- 


928 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


scribed by law, and if a majority of the electors voting at suc 
election for members of the House of Representatives, shall vote — 
for such amendment or amendments, the same shall become a part 
of the constitution. But the General Assembly shall not have - 
the power to propose an amendment or amendments to more than 
one article of the constitution at the same session. 


moved to add the foregoing to the report ae the comnmieee. | 
Mr. McCALLEN moved to lay it on the table. 
The amendment was then adopted. “a 
The report, as amended, was adopted and referred to the a 
committee on Revision. “a 
Mr. WOODSON moved to take up the report of the com- . 
mittee on Finance. Adopted. o 
The question pending was on the substitute offered by Mr. j 
Epwarps of Madison. ‘h 
Mr. CALDWELL offered the followin as a substitute for q 
the substitute: 


¥ 
ARTICLE — 4g 


Section 1. There shall be levied upon all the taxable propert 
of the state, a tax of three mills upon every dollar’s worth of such 
property; which, as collected, shall be faithfully applied to the a 
payment of the internal improvement debt of this state. % 

Sec. 2. The collectors of the several counties of this state, in 7 
making collections of the tax provided for in the last section, shall 
receive in payment of said tax the indebtedness of this state in- ~ 
curred on account of the internal improvement system, or specie 
in payment of said tax, on an assessment of two mills upon ever 
dollar’s worth of all taxable property in this state. 

Src. 3. The General Assembly shall, by law, make such pro- 
vision as will enable the holders of such indebtedness to depo 
the same with the Auditor of Public Accounts, and receive in lie 
thereof certificates in suitable sums, which shall be received in 
payment of the tax provided for in the first section. we 

And the question being taken thereon, it was rejected. 

Mr. EDWARDS of Sangamon offered the following as a sok : 
stitute for the one pending: 


FRIDAY, AUGUST 27, 1847 929 


: Sec. —. It shall be the duty of the Legislature to ascertain 
“upon what terms a satisfactory arrangement can be made with 
our creditors for the payment of the state debt, and if any agree- 
‘ment can be entered into, that meets with the approbation of the 
General Assembly, the law containing the terms of such compro- 
“mise shall be submitted to the people, and if approved by a majority 
voting for and against the same, shall be irrepealable; and it shall 
be the duty of the General Assembly to pass all laws necessary 
to enforce its provisions and continue the same in force, until the 
stipulations on the part of the state shall have been complied 
with. 
Messrs. Locan and Hayes opposed the last, and advocated 
the proposition of Mr. Epwarps of Madison. 
Mr. EDWARDS of Madison withdrew the 2d and 3d sections 
of his substitute. 
Mr. LOGAN moved to lay the substitute of his colleague on 
the table. Yeas 92, nays 38. 
Mr. AKIN moved to lay the whole subject on the table. 
Lost. 
Mr. CALDWELL offered the following as a substitute for the 
one now pending; and it was rejected. 
_ Sec..1. There shall be levied upon all the taxable property 
‘in this state, an alternate tax of two mills, in state indebted- 
‘ness, and of one mill in specie, on every dollar’s worth of such 
‘property; which, as collected, shall be faithfully applied to the 
‘payment of the internal improvement debt of this state. 
Sec. 2. The collectors of the several counties of this state in 
making collections of the two mill tax provided for in the last 
section, shall receive on payment of said tax the indebtedness of 
this state, incurred on account of the Internal Improvement 
“system, or specie in payment of said one mill tax, and the payment 
of either of said assessments shall be a discharge from the other. 
Sec. 3. The General Assembly shall by law make such pro- 
‘Vision as will enable the holders of such indebtedness to deposit 
‘the same with the Auditor of Public Accounts, and receive in lieu 
thereof certificates in suitable sums, which shall be receivable in 
‘payment of the two mill tax above provided for; provided, that 
the foregoing sections shall be submitted as a separate article to 


voting for and against the same. 
Mr. CONSTABLE moved the p1 
Seas 
r. BALLINGALL moved to rec 01 

Hee See question. |’ Carnied:).\0 793 
And then the Convention adjourne 


LXVII. SATURDAY, AUGUST 28, 1847 


Mr. EDWARDS of Madison, for the committee on Revision 
and Adjustment of Articles, &c., reported back to the Convention 
the several articles adopted by the Convention with numerous 
verbal amendments. 

The same was read, section after section, which occupied two 
hours and more, and the amendments were concurred in. 

The Convention then resumed the consideration of the report 
of the committee on Finance, and the pending substitute therefor. 

Mr. WHITESIDE offered an amendment, a copy of which 
we did not get, but its purport was, that the collectors of the tax 
proposed might receive in payment thereof the stocks and other 
indebtedness of the state. 

Mr. CONSTABLE opposed the amendment. The Auditor of 
this state, in the discharge of his duty at the seat of government, 
with all the means and facilities of discovering the genui[ne]ness 
of the bonds, had received over $40,000 in forged bonds. If 
this occurred here, how much more of these forgeries would be 
received by these collectors, who had not the means of testing their 
_ genuilne]ness; it would be but giving those who had those forged 
_ bonds an opportunity of putting them upon the state. None but 

forged papers would be received, for the persons holding the 
"genuine ones were not indebted to the state. 
Mr. DEMENT opposed the amendment of Mr. WuiTEsIDE, 
for additional reasons, than had been urged by others. He did 
not believe, that in practice, the proposition could be carried out 
in a way that would be beneficial to the mass of tax payers. 
None but large tax payers would find any advantage from 
the proposition; while large landholders could apply the stocks 
and evidences of our state indebtedness in payment of their taxes, 


__ so as to reduce the rate of taxation from 50 to 70 per cent.; the 


mass of the tax payers could not avail themselves of it at all. 


_ Therefore its operation upon the tax payers would be partial, 
__ and discriminate in favor of the large property holders. While 


931 


932 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


on the floor he would avail himself of the occasion to ree a few 
objections to the main proposition, which urged themselves with — 
great force upon his mind, and which would, perhaps, influence — 
him to vote against it, and would also apply to many other sub- — 
jects that had been brought before the Convention, and were | 
proposed to become parts of the new constitution. This is, that — 
he thought this proposition to levy an additional tax of two mills — 
upon each dollar’s worth of property, should not form any part of — 
the permanent organic law of the state. It was a mere question — 
of policy, applying to a peculiar condition of our state, over which © 
circumstances, variable and changeable, have great influence, — 
and a policy which would seem very proper to-day within a short — 
period might become very unwise and inconvenient. He did not — 
doubt the willingness of the people to submit to the imposition — 
of any just and reasonable rate of taxation for the purpose of pay- — 
ing the obligations and indebtedness of the state, and would, from — 
year to year, support the levying of such a rate of taxation as 
would be satisfactory to our creditors, and calculated to sustain 
the credit of the state in the estimation of the good and just of 
every section. He did not feel sure, however, that a proposition — 
to fix irrevocably in the constitution an article imposing an addi-— 
tional tax of twenty cents on each one hundred dollars’ worth of © 
property, when encumbered by such objectionable features and — 
principles as the proposition of the gentleman from Madison ~ 
(Mr. Epwarps) contained, would meet with the approbation and ~ 
support of the people; and while the people are as fully resolved _ 
upon paying the state debt by taxation as men could be upon any 
subject, they might, in his opinion, very justly vote down chil 5 
proposition on account of the arbitrary and unjust mode upon ~ 
which we here seem to determine upon making this payment. 

meant the application of the money in the payment of the pri 
pal only of the debt, leaving our first and solemn obligation, | 
pay the interest on the debt, unprovided for in the constitution. — 
The proposition contains a speculation determined on, if adopted, : 
by the Convention, without consulting our creditors. This pro 
osition requires this large sum of money to be kept separate 
to be applied to the payment and extinguishment of the princip 
(original only) of the debt. It may be said that our creditors ne 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 28, 1847 933 


not take it unless they are willing.—This was true, and they will 
not take it, (at least many, in his opinion, will not) and then what 
is to be done with this large sum of money, which must, of neces- 
sity, accumulate and lie useless in our state treasury, while the 


‘interest on the debt remains unpaid. 


- Mr. BOND followed in a speech in favor of the substitute, and 
explained that his course in advocacy of a poll tax had been 
dictated by a desire on his part, and the part of his constituents, 
to raise a revenue to pay off the debt. 

Mr. GREGG said that he did not propose to enter into a dis- 


cussion of the subject under consideration—The proper period 


for discussion had gone by. The session of the Convention was 
too near its close to permit such full and free consideration on the 


_ proposition that had been offered as was desirable. He regretted 


that this was the case—he regretted that the subject had not been 
brought forward at an earlier period, so as to enable members to 
give full expression to their views and feelings. Had this been 
done he thought the action of the Convention would have 
been wiser than it was now likely tobe. Hewouldhave beenglad to 
discuss this subject fully, and enter at large into an exposition of 
what he thought to be the proper financial policy of the state; but 
now he proposed to confine himself to a brief statement of the 
course he intended to pursue. Gentlemen had undoubtedly made 
up their minds as to their votes, and he did not intend to occupy 
their attention when they were so anxious for a settlement of the 
question. He was not prepared to give his support to the amend- 
ment offered by the gentleman from Monroe. The reason[s] which 
had been assigned by others as the ground of their opposition 
were satisfactory to him. He did not think it wise or expedient 
to permit any tax that may be imposed to be collected in scrip, or 
other evidences of indebtedness. It has been well said that frauds 
might be committed, which no precaution would be able to pre- 
vent. Besides, might we not be treating the public creditors with 
injustice?—Nor did the proposition of the gentleman from Madi- 
son altogether suit his views. It proposes to apply the avails of 
the two mill tax towards the extinguishment of the principal of 
the debt. He would prefer a provision more in accordance with 
our obligations to the public creditors. We have contracted to 


charged before we attempt to extinguish the principal. Ree 
of paying off the whole will not be much prolonged if that course — 
is taken. According to the calculations of the gentleman fro 
Madison, a period of only twenty-five years will be required t 
liquidate, in the manner proposed by his substitute, all that po 
tion of the debt incurred for internal improvement purposes. _ 
did not doubt the accuracy of his calculations. If an error h 
been committed it consists in estimating the annual increase o 

our taxable. property at too low a rate. He thought the increase 
considerably beyond seven per cent. From 1842 up to the present 
time it has been over twelve per cent. Many gentlemen seem to 
think that we may reasonably calculate an annual increase of t 
per cent. during the next twenty-five years. If they are correct, — 
there will be no difficulty in discharging, in that time, first the — 
interest now due, and then the accruing interest and principa 

But however objectionable may be the proposition of the gentle- 
man from Madison, he was satisfied that it cannot be amended 
the manner he had just suggested. There is an evident dispos f 
tion on the part of members of the Convention to go for it as. it : 
stands. The report of the Finance committee has not the slightest 
chance of favorable consideration. Under these circumstances he 
was inclined to go for the proposition of the gentleman fro 
Madison as the best measure likely to be of any effect in providi 
for the payment of the public debt. He did not sustain it as h 
first choice, but because he was convinced that nothing better ca 
be obtained. The proposition to submit the question of a t 
mill tax separately to the people for their approval did not meet 
his views of propriety. It implied a doubt of the popular willing . 
ness to make provision for the payment of the public debt. What- : 
ever provision may be adopted should be placed in the body « 
the constitution, and take the same fate as that instrument. — 
people of this state have a proper sense of what is due to the 
selves and the public creditors. There is no spirit of repudiatio 
at work in any part of this state. From every quarter we hea 
the same honorable sentiments expressed. All are desirous 
discharging our obligations in good faith and justice. There is 
general expectation that this Convention will make some ade- 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 28, 1847 935 


quate constitutional provision on the subject. If we fail to do 
this, we shall not do what is plainly required of us. Mr. G. con- 


tlemen predicted. 
_ Mr. DAVIS of Massac said, that he deemed it due to himself 
and the people he had the honor to represent to express his views 
‘on the question now before the Convention. There was no sub- 
ject in which he took a livelier interest than that then under 
sideration; there was none indeed in which the people of the 
tate feel so deeply as that of the state debt. This debt, sir, 
‘was contracted by the representatives of the people at a time 
when all men seemed to be mad on the subject of internal 
But, sir, it is wholly immaterial how or under 
hat circumstances the debt was contracted. It is enough for 
| honest man to know that we are in debt, and that the sacred 
faith of the state is pledged for the payment of that debt. Upon 


ate. Shall we, the representatives of the freemen of Illinois, 
ove recreant to the solemn duty which we owe to ourselves and 
“to posterity?—Shall we forget, sir, that the eyes of the world are 
upon us, and that if we act wisely we will be hailed as public bene- 
factors. But that if we shrink meanly from the performance of a 
olemn duty we will be branded as cowards and traitors to the 
est interests of our countrymen. 

We are in debt, sir. I repeat we are in debt, and should pro- 
de for its payment! The question then arises in what way shall 
: do this? We know of but one plain and practical way, and 
at was by taxation. You may talk, sir, about funding the 
bt, but when you attempt to do that you will find that you 
‘cannot fund without money, and to raise money you are com- 
led to resort to taxation. If you would pay the debt then you 
t tax the people, or at least you must allow them to tax them- 
s. The people, sir, are honest, they desire to see some pro- 
ion made for the payment of what they owe, and are willing to 


submit to reasonable taxation to accomplish that end. Let th 
once know, that they must tax themselves or suffer the debt t 


or require heavier taxes to meet it, and they will tell you t 
procrastination is unstatesman-like and ruinous. They will 
to you, sir, that you should have made your best endeavors to g 
rid of this great evil of a public debt, at the earliest possible d 
The proposition on the table, was to his mind unexceptionabl 
What is it, sir? It is a proposition, to be submitted to the peo 
for their approval or rejection. Rejection, did I say? No, 
not for their rejection, for the people never can reject, they ne 
will reject such a proposition. Their good sense teaches th 
that they must tax themselves to pay the debt of the state, 
repudiate it; and knowing this, they will cheerfully submit — 
taxation, that the honor of the state may be preserved, untarnish 
by the stain of repudiation. What, sir, is the amount pro- 
posed to be levied? Two mills on the dollar’s worth of property — 
This sir, is a trifling tax when compared with the magnitude of 
object to be secured by its payment, the prevention of the gro 
of the present amount of debt, and the maintenance of the ho 
and faith of the state. And how is this tax of twenty cents on 
hundred dollars’ worth of property to be imposed? By the vol 
tary consent of the people. It is not to be an arbitrary tax, 
acted from the people without or against their consent, but sir, 1 
to be a free offering of the people made on the altar of their count 
honor.—What, sir, are the present condition and future prospect 
of this state. Now, only twenty-nine years old, she owes abou 
eleven millions of dollars, (canal and internal improvement 
taken together) the former of which is said to be provided f 
the latter being six millions of dollars only. What is this, st 
a state such as Illinois is destined under Providence soon t 
She, sir, comprises within her constitutional limits, fifty 
thousand square miles, of the most fertile and productive lan 
the habitable globe. Her population is rapidly increasing in 
ber and resources. She numbered at the taking of the last c 
more than seven hundred thousand souls—the increase 
almost a hundred per cent in the short period of five years. / 
what, sir, is the amount of her taxable property?—one hund 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 28, 1847 937 


millions, while yet in her infancy. Is there a delegate from any 
county in the state on this floor who will hesitate to give his vote 
in favor of the proposition? There may be some such, but why 
so?’—Are they afraid to submit this proposition to the people? 
Certainly there are none such here. All acknowledge that the 
debt ought to be paid, and that there is but one way to pay it 
Why then hesitate? Do gentlemen suppose it would be wiser to 
leave this subject to future Legislatures, than to submit it to the 
people? If they do, let me remind them that Legislatures are not 
always willing to assume the responsibility of taxing their constit- 
uents, and that they are sometimes behind the people in matters 
of this kind. The representatives of a free people should be 
cautious how they tax them and for what purpose, and so they 
ever are.—Again, sir, should this subject be left where it is, with 
the Legislature—the representatives of the people might not 
know, and indeed it would be difficult for them to know the real 
sentiments of the people in relation to it. But, sir, let the subject 
be submitted to a vote of the people, and all doubts would be 
removed; they are the source of all political power, and their voice 
will be heard and obeyed. Are there any here who will vote 
against this proposition because they fear that the people may 
possibly refuse by their votes to adopt it? If there are any such 
he would say to them discard your fears, trust the people in this 
momentous affair, they will decide it right. But suppose they 
should vote against the two mill tax, would our condition be worse 
then than now? Not at all, sir. We do not pay now—we would 
not pay then. But what reason have we to fear that the people 
would reject this proposition? Are the apprehensions of gentle- 


‘men on this score not contradicted by the experience of the last 


three or four years? What, sir, was the voice of the people in 
relation to the tax imposed with a view to the completion of 
the canal? It was the voice of approval. The proceedings of the 
meetings of the people of several of the southern counties furnish 
evidence of the sentiments of the people of that quarter on this 
subject. But, sir, the gentleman from Lee, though individually 
in favor of the proposition of the gentleman from Madison, if he 
understood him aright, thinks it possible, that demagogues may 
tell the people that it is wrong, and induce them to go against it. 


938 


What, sir, are demagogues to give tone to the public Gate in| 
this state? Where, sir, will be the patriotic sons of Illinois then? 
Will there not be enough left to silence the tongue, of Hemedpgiomt) 
Yes, sir, and they will silence it. ay 


Again, the gentleman from Lee says that the Aeeple may ‘ 
desire to have the tax repealed, but if you insert it in the consti- 
tution, it will be irrepealable; and although it may operate oppres- 
sively, the people cannot get rid of it. The tax proposed to be 
submitted for the adoption of the people, is only two mills on the — 
dollar. Is it probable, nay, is it possible, that such a tax — 
could ever become oppressive? I think not, sir. I hope not. In Bh: 
conclusion, sir, said Mr. D., I hope that the amendment of | the * 
honorable gentleman from Wantage will be rejected. It is wrong— i 
I cannot support it. Should it be adopted, the wealthier tax 
payers would be benefited, they might pay their taxes in state M 
indebtedness; poor men could not command state bonds, and would — iM 
therefore be compelled to pay their taxes in gold and silver or their iy 
equivalents. I hope, sir, that the proposition of the gentleman % 
from Madison will be sustained by the Convention. © Ny 

Mr. WHITESIDE withdrew his amendment. 

Messrs. Locan and Epwarps continued the discussion. a 

Mr. HURLBUT moved the previous question. . abe’ 

Mr. PRATT desired to express his views, and hoped the call 
for the previous question would be withdrawn; which was re- 
fused. om 

The yeas and nays were taken on ordering the previous ques- 
tion; and it was ordered—yeas 65, nays 53. ie 

Mr. HOGUE moved the Convention adjourn. tee ‘ 

Mr. DEMENT moved a call of the Convention. Refused. 

Mr. ARCHER asked a division of the question, so as to vote, 
first on striking out the Finance committee’s report. Refused. 

The question was then taken on substituting Be Plan. “a 


Br 
W 
ae 


in the afirmative—yeas 96, nays 27. 
Mr. PRATT said, he was a member of the Fi inance committee 


SR Se Ie ee a URE, TEC TOR Te ne 


SATURDAY, AUGUST 28, 1847 939 


‘to pay the state debt, as no other could be presented, he would 
v ote for it. 

_ Mr. BROCKMAN said he, too, was a member of the com- 
mittee, and for the same reasons expressed by the gentleman from 
‘ Jo Daviess, he would vote for the substitute. 

_ The question recurred on the adoption of the substitute, as an 
eeicle of the Constitution; and resulted—yeas 97, nays 23. 

a The article was then ebeteed to the committee on Revision. 
And the Convention adjourned till 3 p. m. 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. THOMAS moved to reconsider the vote by which a 
resolution ordering 50,000 copies of the constitution to be printed 
_ was passed. 
_ He then moved that the number be changed to 150 copies for 
each member; which was changed to 200 copies for each member; 
and was then passed. 
_ Mr. KITCHELL offered the following, which was adopted: 
Resolved, That the number of copies of the’ new constitution, 
dered to be printed in the German and Norwegian languages, 
hen printed, be distributed equally among the German and 
Norwegian population of the state; and that the several members 
of this Convention report to the respective committees appointed 
to procure the printing of the constitution in said languages, the 
number of such German or Norwegian population in their respec- 
ve counties. 
_ The reports of the committee on Internal Improvements, 
é Agriculture, &c., was taken up, the first section adopted, and after 
the rejection of various amendments upon different subjects, the 
emainder was laid on the table. 
Mr. SCATES, from the select committee on the schedule, re- 

ported several sections, to compose that schedule. 
" Mr. THORNTON, from the minority of the same committee, 
ya so made a report. 

_ Mr. PETERS moved they be laid on the table, and printed. 
Rejected. 

_ The majority report was taken up by sections, and down to 
he eleventh section was adopted. 


She SS og Be ees 
fs hy ? 


voted on separately by the ae and to nae a ee 
report. After a short debate, the motion was carried—ye 
nays 61. 

Mr. WOODSON proposed a substitute for the e twelfth: se 
which was adopted. 

The thirteenth section was read. 

Mr. DEMENT moved that the Convention adjourn. — 

Section thirteen was laid on the table. : Hi 

-Mr. BOSBYSHELL moved the Convention adjourn. — ioe 

Section fourteen (proposing that the first election for sta 
officers shall be held in August, instead of November, He4ih) Ww 
read. 

Various motions to adjourn, for a call of the Convent n, 
were made, and lost. i 

Mr. LOGAN moved to strike out Augdee! aaa insert 
ver, 1848. Pe 

Pending which motion, und after the utmost confusio fi 
hour, nearly one hundred members on the floor at a time, all} 
of missiles (harmless) flying from one end of the house to th ot 1e1 
everybody speaking, nobody listening, the PRESIDENT 
unable to be heard in his demands for order, the question te 
adjourn was again put, and as all the members were on their 
at the time of the division, the “ayes” had it. os ee 


LXVIII. MONDAY, AUGUST 30, 1847 


__ The question pending at the adjournment on Saturday was on 
_ the motion of Mr. Locan, to strike out ‘‘August’’ and insert 
~ *‘November.”’ 
4 Mr. HAYES moved the previous question. 
Mr. LOGAN moved a call of the Convention.—Refused. 
% The previous question then was ordered. 
A division of the question was asked, and refused. 
2 The yeas and nays were ordered on the motion of Mr. Locan, 
and resulted—yeas 66, nays 77. 
% The section was then adopted—yeas 79, nays 65. 
¥ Section 15 was struck out, and section 16 adopted. 
: Mr. PRATT offered an additional section; which was laid on 
_ the table. 
BY Mr. J. M. DAVIS offered an additional section, providing that 
2 all elections should be held in August; which was rejected—yeas 
35, nays 95. 
; Mr. SCATES offered an additional section; to which 
Ke Mr. LOGAN moved to add, that the judges should be elected 
fs in November, 1848. 
n Mr. HAYES moved to insert ‘‘September;’’ which was accept- 
_ ed, and then the section passed. 
; The schedule was then referred to the committee on Revision. 
___ Mr. CONSTABLE, from the select committee to prepare an 
address to the people, made a report; which was read. 

Mr. DEMENT excepted to a remark in it in relation to the 
" provision in relation to the two mill tax, and was replied to by 
Messrs. Constasie, Epwarps and Loeay. 

Mr. ARCHER moved the previous question; which was 
ordered, and the address was adopted—yeas 113, nays 29. 
__ Mr. CONSTABLE moved the address be referred to the com- 
‘mittee on Revision. 
Mr. LOGAN moved that the address be added to the constitu- 

tion, and that it be printed therewith. 

941 


Sa 
bs 


. a _ 
Mr. BROCKMAN said that the motion was unnecessary; | 
resolution to raise the committee on the address required if 
address to accompany the constitution. Atm 
Mr. ARCHER moved that the address be referred to the 
mittee on Revision, and that it be printed with the consti 
excepting in the 250 ordered to be printed for the use of the 
vention. m ' 
And the motion was carried—yeas 94, nays 29. 
Mr. LOCKWOOD offered a resolution that the committe 
Revision be instructed to correct and supply all pence 
and omissions in the constitution. Carried. es, 
Mr. LOGAN moved that two copies of the journal be 
each member of the Convention, and that 200 copies be mis ef 
in the office of the Secretary of State. Carried. 
Mr. KNAPP reported back various papers that had bee 
referred to the committee on the Bill of Rights. _ cal 
Mr. HURLBUT moved the Convention adiouts till s P. 
Carried. : 


rh 


AFTERNOON 


Mr. THOMAS moved that the Convention adjnuins till 
morrow morning. He said that the enrolling clerks were at v : 
that the committee on Revision had not yet completed t 
work, and that it was impossible to have the constitution re 
to sign till morning. 


Mr. ARCHER hoped the Convention would adjourn to o7 


morning. 
Both motions were withdrawn, and oh 
Mr. ECCLES offered a resolution that joe T. Ew! 
assistant secretary, be allowed the same compensation 
to the assistant secretary. * 
Mr. NORTHCOTT moved to nee it on the table. ‘Refi ed 
The question was taken by yeas and nays on the adoption 
the resolution, and it was passed—yeas 85, nays 32. p 
Mr. DEMENT offered a resolution that the President of t 
Convention deliver the constitution, when signed by the memb 


Cae a . Wy, vex 
* Wn iyi ert 5 -7s 3 Ieee * d 
“a 9 oi P el Sei a, ; A; : ; Ts ? ae 
_ MONDAY, AUGUST 30, 1847 943 


resolution; which was unanimously adopted. 


ident, Hon. Newron Croup, for the dignified, impartial 
‘teous manner in which he has presided over its deliber- 


manner in which they have discharged their duties as 
Be) 
then the Convention adjourned till to-morrow morning 


d, That the thanks of this Convention be tendered to 


Seep aa 


sen tan 


re” 
’ 


cnt 


Pte ae 
ee ee eT 


Me se ne! oe 


we ie 


4 


se i er 


LXIX. TUESDAY, AUGUST 31, 1847 


The committee on Revision reported back to the Convention, — 
the schedule and address, with various verbal amendments; which — 
were read, and adopted. “4 

They also reported an enrolled copy of the constitution and 
schedule; which were read over, and some amendments, erasures, _ 
and interlineations were made. , 

The constitution was then adopted, by yeas atid nays, as 
follows: a 
Yeras—Adams, Armstrong, Atherton, Blakely, Bad! Bosby-_ ‘ 
shell, Brockman, Brown, Campbell of McDonough, Campbell of a 
Jo Daviess, Zadoc Casey, Choate, Church, Churchill, Constable, — 
Crain, Cross of Winnebago, Cross of Woodford, Dale, Davis of — 
McLean, Davis of Montgomery, Dawson, Deitz, Dement Damnineal 
Dunn, Dunsmore, Eccles, Edmonson, Edwards of Madison, — 
Edwards of Sangamon, Evey, Farwell, Frick, Graham, Geddes, © 
Green of Clay, Green of Tazewell, Grimshaw, Harding, Harlan, ~ 
Harper, Hatch, Hawley, Hay, Hayes, Henderson, Hill, Hoes, 
Hogue, Hunsaker, Hurlbut, Huston, Jackson, James, Jenkins, 
Jones, Judd, Kenner, Kinney of Bureau, Kitchell, Knapp of Jersey, 
Knapp of Scott, Knowlton, Knox, Kreider, Lasater, Laughlin,. 
Lemon, Lenley, Lockwood, Logan, Loudon, McCallen, McCull 
McClure, McHatton, Markley, Marshall of Coles, Marshall 
Mason, Mason, Matheny, Mieure, Miller, Minshall, Moor 
Morris, Northcott, Norton, Oliver, Pace, Palmer of Macoupi: 
Palmer of Stark, Peters, Pinckney, Pratt, Rives, Robbins, Robi 
~son, Roman, Rountree, Scates, Servant, Shields, Shumway, Si 
ley, Sim, Simpson, Smith of Macon, Spencer, Stadden, Swa 
Thomas, Thompson, Thornton, Trower, Turnbull, Turner, Tutt, © 
Tuttle, Vernor, Wead, Webber, West, Williams, Witt, Whiteside, 4 
Whitney, Woodson, Worcester, Mr. President,—131. ig 

Nays—Akin, Ballingall, Bunsen, Colby, Gregg, Kinney of 
St. Clair, Smith of Gallatin—7. Re 

Absent—Allen, Anderson, Archer, Blair, aa Caldwell, 


944 


TUESDAY, AUGUST 31, 1847 945 


anady, Carter, F. S. Casey, Davis of Massac, Dunlap, Green of 
o Daviess, Harvey, Heacock, Holmes, Lander, Manly, Moffett, 
ichols, Powers, Sharpe, Sherman, Singleton, Vance. 

f Mr. SCATES moved that the various interlineations and 
erasures be noted at the end of the constitution before it shall be 
signed; which motion was concurred in. 
He also moved, that as soon as the same was done, that the 
_ constitution be signed by the President, and then by the members 
in alphabetical order, and the whole to be attested by the Sec- 
_retaries. Adopted. 

. Mr. ECCLES moved that members having authority from 
absent delegates to sign for them, be allowed to do so. Carried. 
mh 4 - Mr. GREGG moved that members not present be allowed 
gy to sign the constitution, at any time before the first Monday i in 


x Mr. ‘WOODSON moved that Mr. N. W. Epwarps and the 
So of State be directed to compare the printed copy with 
_ the enrolled one, and that when correct they certify to the same. 
Bi Mr. CONSTABLE moved to add to the committee Mr. 
a BrayMAn, esq. Agreed to, and the motion [was] adopted. 

The erasures and interlineations were then noted by the clerks 
at the foot of the constitution, and at half-past twelve o’clock the 
President signed the instrument. The members then in alpha- 
betical order signed the constitution, many of the names of the 
absentees being written by their authority by members present. 
_ The same being concluded, the President delivered the con- 
stitution into the hands of the Hon. Horace S. Coo ey, Secretary 
of State, to be by him preserved in the archives of his office. 

No other business being before the Convention, 

_ The PRESIDENT rose, and in a few brief, but feeling remarks, 
congratulated the Convention upon the happy result of their labors, 
and wishing them a safe return to their families, health and pros- 
perity, he bid them an affectionate farewell, and pronounced the 


APPENDIX 


BroGRAPHICAL SKETCHES OF OFFICERS AND MEMBERS OF THE 
CoNSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION 


Adams, Augustus: born May Io, 1806, in Genoa, Cayuga County, New York; 
1817, thrown on his own resources by his father’s death; spent summers on farm, 
ted spare time to study, and taught school during four winters; 1829-1837, 
acted foundry and machine shop at Pine Valley, New York; 1838, came to 
n, Illinois; returned to New York in spring of 1839, and in 1840 removed with 
ly to Elgin; 1841, established at Elgin the first foundry and machine shop west 
of Chicago; manufactured first harvester on which grain was both bound and 
ed; in collaboration with Philo Sylla invented the hinge sickle bar now used 
all mowing machines; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1850-1852, 
‘representative in General Assembly; 1854-1858, state senator; 1856 (1857), closed 
ness at Elgin and established himself at Sandwich, DeKalb County, in the 
ufacture of Adams’ Corn Sheller; 1867, organized and became president of 
; wich Manufacturing Company; 1869, appointed by Governor Palmer as one 
of the commissioners to locate Northern Hospital for the Insane; 1870, organized 
nd became president of Marseilles Manufacturing Company; in politics a Whig, 
d thereafter a Republican; died 1892. United States Biographical Dictionary, Illinois 
Betas, 353-354; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 362-364; Past and Present of 
e County, 392; Gross, Past and Present of DeKalb County, 2:217-218; Portrait 
nd Biographical Album of DeKalb County, 473-474; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the 
embers. 
_ Akin, George W. (John W.): born 1814, in Tennessee; 1818, brought to Ili- 
nois; farmer near Benton, Franklin County; 1842-1848, sheriff of Franklin County; 
r 1847, United States deputy marshal; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
aa a Democrat. History of Gallatin, Saline, Hamilton, Franklin and Wiil- 
Tiamson Counties, 369, 385; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
a Allen, Willis: born December, 1806 (1807), in Wilson County, Tennessee; 
829, removed to Franklin (now a part of Williamson) County, Illinois, and engaged 
ee 1834 (1836)-1838, sheriff of Franklin County; 1838-1840, represent- 
ve in General Assembly; 1840, removed to Marion; 1841-1845, prosecuting 
attorney for the old Third District, elected before his admission to the bar; 1841, 
mitted to the bar; 1844, presidential elector; 1844-1848, state senator; 1847, 
me Bete: of Constitutional Convention; 1851-1855, member of Congress; 1859, 
judge of the Twenty-sixth Judicial Circuit; died in office June 2 (April 19), 1859; in 
tics a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 15; 
Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 2:856-857; Blue Book of Illinots, 1913-1914, 
PP- 192, 201, 216, 353, 357, 358; History of Gallatin, Saline, Hamilton, Franklin and 
Williamson Counties, 369, 845; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 


4 949 


e 
al 


950 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIO . 


Anderson, Samuel: born 1801, in New York; 1833, came to Illinois, | fai : 


near Naperville, DuPage County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conve 
in politics a Democrat. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 357; Thomp 
Illinois Whigs before 7846, p. 137; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Archer, William R.: born April 13, 1817, in New York City; February. 
admitted to New York Bar; 1838, settled in Pittsfield, Pike County, Illi 
August, 1838, admitted to Illinois bar, and soon had extensive practice; — 
member of Constitutional Convention; 1856-1860, circuit clerk and reco 
1860-1862, 1886-1888, representative in General Assembly; 1869-1870, mem 
Constitutional Convention; 1877, member of joint commission appointed by. 
lature regarding claims for damages to private property from dams on Wabash 
Illinois rivers; 1872-1884, state senator; in politics a Democrat. Biograg ) 
Encyclopedia of Illinois, 128-129; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 367) 
376, 378, 380, 382, 384, 389; History of Pike County, 670-671; Massie, Pa 
Present of Pike County, 97, 101; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Armstrong, George W.: born December 9, 1812 (December 11, 181 
Licking County, Ohio; 1830, in charge of a woolen factory; April, 1831, ¢ 
Putnam (now Marshall) County, Illinois; July, 1831, came to ‘LaSalle Cou 
1832, soldier in Black Hawk War; 1833, settled on farm near Seneca; 1837-1 
contractor at Utica; 1841, returned to farm near Seneca, where he a’ 
resided; 1844-1846, 1870-1878, representative in General Assembly; 1847, r 
ber of Constitutional Convention; 1852-1858, 1864-1866, 1868-1876, etc., co 
supervisor; 1854-1856, commissioner of highways; 1858, as Douglas Demo 
defeated by Owen Lovejoy in congressional election; 1869, defeated as cant 
for election to Constitutional Convention; 1882, chairman of LaSalle C Cor 
Court House and Jail Building Committee; one of original promoters of 
Kankakee and Seneca Railroad; in politics a Democrat. _ United States Bio, 
ical Dictionary, Illinois Volume, 57-58; Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclop 
of Illinois, 23; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, PP: 357s 3733 375» 377s 5133 , 
graphical and Genealogical Record of LaSalle County, 1; 121-122; History of 1 6 
County, Inter-State Publishing Company, 2:47, 49-51, 53-545 Hollingswort h, 
List of the Members. 7” 
“Atherton, Martin: born 1801, in Kentucky; 1818, came to Tlinois: 
near Unity, Alexander County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conventi yn; 
politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, A List of the Members. ' 
Ballingall, Patrick: born 1814, in Scotland; 1832, came to Illino 
defeated as candidate for county clerk (McHenry County); 1839-1843, circ’ 
of DuPage County; 1844-1849, state’s attorney (Lake County); February, 
December, 1848, state’s attorney; November 13, 1846, helped arrange River 
Harbor Convention called for July, 1847; 1847, city attorney of Chicago; 
member of Constitutional Convention; 1854-1855, city attorney; in pi 
Democrat. Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 2:634; Moses, History of C 
1:103, 109, 114, 132; 2:157; Andreas, History of Cook County, 350; Goods 
Healy, History of Cook County, 2:222, 224; Bateman and Selby, Historical 
pedia of Illinois, DuPage County, 2:642; Richmond, History of ee: 6 
45;. Halsey, History of Lake County, 57, 605. 


APPENDIX 951 


’ Blair, Montgomery: born 1809, in Ohio; 1828, came to Illinois; 1847, member 
of Constitutional Convention; farmer near Barry, Pike County; 1850-1851, 1867- 

_ 1870, county supervisor; 1872, one of first vice-presidents of the Old Settlers’ 
f Association; in politics a Democrat. Massie, Past and Present of Pike County, 
"3 89-90, 92, 114; History of Pike County, Charles C. Chapman and Company, 213, 
» 3l0, 314; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

. Blakely, William H.: born 1810, in New York; 1834, came to Illinois; mer- 
_ chant at Ewington, Effingham County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven- 
_ tion; 1850-1852, 1872-1874, representative in General Assembly; in politics a 
_ Democrat. Blue Book of Iilinois, 1913-1914, pp. 361, 375; Hollingsworth, 4 List 

of the Members. 
: Bond, Benjamin: born 1807, in Indiana; youngest son of first governor of 
"Illinois; 1826, arrived in Illinois; 1830, county clerk during June term; 1830, 
Ss ‘census commissioner; 1831-1866, practiced law in Clinton County; 1834-1836, 
ie 1856-1858, state senator; 1836, Whig candidate for presidential elector; 1836, 1846, 
1857, state’s attorney for Clinton County; 1837, probate justice; 1838-1840, 
secretary of state Senate; 1844-1846, editor of Carlyle Truth Teller; 1847, member 
_ of Constitutional Convention; 1850, appointed United States marshal by President 
_ Fillmore; 1851, established and edited the Prairie Flower; March to July, 1853, 
_ editor of Age of Progress; 1854-February, 1858, editor of the Calumet of Peace; 
| 1862, arrested on account of anti-war views but “paroled” because in poor health; 
died 1866, at O'Fallon, St. Clair County; in politics a Whig, later a Democrat. 
Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp 349-350, 352; Scott, Newspapers and Periodicals 
- of Illinois, 35, 42-43; Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1: 3; Pease, The Frontier 
| State, 238-239; Cole The Era of the Civil War, 228, 302; Thompson, J/inois 
tess before 1846, p. 132; History of Marion and Clinton Counties, 82, 85, 92, 
95; 102, 110; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

of Bosbyshell, William: born 1800, in Pennsylvania; 1840, came to Illinois; 
.~ at Milan, Calhoun County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
in politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

4 Brockman, James: born 1814, in Kentucky; 1833, came to Illinois; physician 


_ politics a Democrat: Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
___ Brown, George T.: born 1821, in Scotland; 1837, came to Illinois; lawyer and 
+ editor at Alton, Madison County: 1843-1847, justice of the peace; 1846-1847, 
mayor of Alton; 1847, member of the Constitutional Convention; 1852-1860, 
} founder and editor of Aiton Courier; 1854-1856, secretary of state Senate; 1856, 
one of leaders in formation of Republican party in Illinois; formerly a Democrat; 
4 _Sergeant-at-arms of the United States Senate for many years; died 186-, in 
_ Washington. Scott, Newspapers and Periodicals of Illinois, 7; Cole, Era of the 
Civil War, 145; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 363; History of Madison County, 
| 165, 167, 210-211, 383 389; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Bunsen, George: born February 18, 1794, at Frankfort-on-the-Maine, Ger- 
"many; served in Peninsular War; 1819, graduated from University of Berlin; 
_ 1819-1833, founded and maintained a boys’ school at Frankfort; 1833, implicated 
; ‘in the republican revolution and forced to leave the country; 1834, came to St. Clair 


962 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS. 2 


County, Illinois; farmer near Belleville; 1839, naturalized; AE in the publ > 
schools; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1855-1861, school commis- et 
sioner of St. Clair County; 1855, removed to Belleville and conducted a private 
normal school there; 1857-1860, member of first state school board; 1857, tool cf 
part in establishment of the Illinois State Normal University; 1859, ‘elected 
member of Belleville School Board and continued as member and president for 
several years prior to his death; died November, 1872; in politics a Democrat, _ ; 
later a Republican. Bateman aud Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 66-675 
Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, St. Clair County, 2:682, 
691, 873, 880; History of St. Clair County, Brink, McDonough oe Company, 6 
66, 79, 111, 188; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. . 4 
Butler, Horace: born 1814, at South Deerfield, New Hanveaee 1836, came to 
McHenry County, Illinois; 1839, moved to Libertyville, Lake County; lawyer at 
Libertyville; 1843-1855, justice of the peace; 1843-1845, probate justice; Decem- 
ber 15, 1843-August 24, 1844, April 22, 1853—January 22, 1861, postmaster 
Libertyville; 1844-1846, representative in General Assembly; 1847, member 
Constitutional Convention; 1858, defeated for state senator; died March 16, 1861; 
in politics a Democrat. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 357; Bateman a 
Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Lake County, 661-663, 666; Hals 
History of Lake County, 86, 110, 455, 584, 603, 606; Hollingsworth, 4 List of | 
Members. 
Caldwell, Albert Gallatin: born 1817, in Shawneetown, Illinois; ‘educated 
Shawneetown; leading member of Gallatin County bar; 1847, member of Constit 
tional Convention; 1850-1851, representative in General Assembly; died in o 
1851; in politics a Democrat. Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 2:855-8: 
Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 361; History of Gallatin, Saline, Hami 
Franklin and Williamson Counties, 530-531; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Mem 
Campbell, James M.: born August 22, 1803, in Frankfort, Kentucky; 1 
brought by parents to Shawneetown, Illinois; 1815, returned to Frankfor 
educated in Frankfort Seminary; 1822-1828, deputy postmaster at Frankfo 
1828, went to Lexington, Shelby County, Kentucky; August, 1829, arrived 
Galena, Illinois; 1829-1831, worked with uncle and in office of circuit and coun 
clerk at Galena; 1831, went to McDonough County; 1831-1848, circuit cle : 
1831-1846, county clerk; 1831-1846, postmaster of Macomb (except for ti 
months in 1841, when he was removed and reinstated); 1832, served in Black Hi 
War; 183 5, appointed county recorder; 1846, defeated as candidate for represi 
ative in General Assembly; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1852 
1856, state senator; delegate to every Democratic state convention but two sin 
1836; 1856, 1860, delegate to Democratic national conventions; 1856-1857, 
of first aldermen of Macomb; county supervisor; died 1891, in Macomb; in pol 
originally a follower of Henry Clay Republicanism, but after 1832 a con 
Democrat. United States Biographical Dictionary, \llinois Volume, 13} 
Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 362-363; Bateman and Selby, Histo 
Encyclopedia of Illinois, McDonough County, 647, 651, 745, 841; Clarke, His 
McDonough County, 27, 30, 32) 327-331, 400-404, 616, 619; Bet AL Li 
of the Members. 


ae ad 


APPENDIX 953 


Campbell, Thompson: born 1811, at Kennett Square, Chester County, 
_ Pennsylvania; attended school in Butler County; educated at Jefferson College, 
Canonsburg, Pennsylvania; read law and was admitted to the bar in Pittsburg; 
1837, removed to Galena, Illinois; March 6, 1843—December 23, 1846, secretary 
of state; wrote first public school report of the state; 1847, member of Constitu- 
tional Convention; 1851-1853, representative in Congress; 1853, removed to 
California as a member of United States Land Commission of California; 1855, 
resumed practice of law in San Francisco; 1859, visited Europe; 1860, returned to 
Illinois and established practice at Chicago; 1860, defeated as candidate for presi- 
dential elector-at-large on Breckenridge ticket; 1861, returned to legal practice in 
_ California; strong Union man and Republican leader; 1862-1863, representative 
in California General Assembly; 1864, delegate to Republican National Conven- 
_ tion at Baltimore; died at San Francisco, December 6 (7), 1868; in politics a 
~ Democrat till 1861, then a Republican. Greene and Thompson, Governors’ Letter- 
_ Books, 1840-1853, p. 64n; Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois; 
_ 76-77; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 140, 192; Palmer, Bench and Bar of 
Illinois, 1:518—-519, 522; Biographical Congressional Directory, 1774-1911, p. 528; 
California Blue Book, 1911, p. 241; The Works of Hubert Howe Bancroft, 24:305n; 
Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Canaday (Canady), John: born 1800, in Tennessee; 1821, came with father 
to Vermilion County, Illinois; spring of 1822, returned to Tennessee for the sum- 
mer; farmer near Georgetown, Vermilion County; 1840-1844, representative in 
General Assembly; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1851, county 
supervisor; in politics a Whig. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 354, 356; 
Thompson, J//inois Whigs before 1846, p. 138; Beckwith, History of Vermilion 
County, 562-564, 586; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Carter, Thomas B.: born 1805, in New York; 1842, came to Illinois; farmer 
near Freeport, Stephenson County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
in politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Casey, Franklin S.: born 1805, in Tennessee; 1823, came to Illinois; farmer 
near Mt. Vernon, Jefferson County; 1832, lieutenant in Black Hawk War; 1847, 
member of Constitutional Convention; in politics a Democrat. Wall, History of 
Jefferson County, 119; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
~~ Casey, Zadoc: born March 17, 1796, in Georgia; about 1800 brought to 
_ Tennessee by his parents; 1817, came to Jefferson County, Illinois, and settled 
near Mt. Vernon; farmer, pioneer Methodist preacher, and politician; 1819, 
_ member of first board of county commissioners of Jefferson County; 1820, defeated 
as candidate for General Assembly; 1822-1826, 1848-1852, state senator; Decem- 
ber 9, 1830—March 1, 1833, lieutenant-governor; 1832, served in Black Hawk War; 
bi) 1833-1843, representative in Congress; 1842, defeated in congressional election by 
i John A. McClernand; 1847, member and president pro tem of Constitutional 


iN Convention; 1848-1850, speaker of House in General Assembly; died September 4 
Dk 
i 


_ (12), 1862, before expiration of his term as senator; in politics a Democrat. Bate- 
_man and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 83; Biographical Encyclopedia 


of Illinois, 439-440; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 139, 190-191, 344-346, 
366; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 


cu ia ts Wl ga UA aa pasts, tis AS 


- 


oe 954 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Choate, Charles: born 1803, in Massachusetts; 1839, came to Illinois; ph 
cian at LaHarpe, Hancock County; 1847, member of Constitutional. Conventic ns 
in politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. : ie % 

Church, Selden M.: born March 4, 1804, in East Haddam, Connecticut; 1804 
taken by his parents to New York, where he was reared; 1825 (1828), went to Ci 
cinnati, Ohio, and was there one of the earliest teachers in the public schools; 
1835, in mercantile business in Rochester, New York; 1835, came to Ch 
thence to Geneva, Kane County; 1836, removed to Rockford, where he afterw 
resided; 1840-1847, county clerk; August, 1841—August, 1843, postmaster 
Rockford; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1849-1857, county jud; 
and judge of probate; 1859-1864, 1866-1867, chairman of Board of Supervi 
1862-1864, representative in General Assembly; (1868) 1869, member of 
State Board of Public Charities; 1873, reappointed to this board, (term four yea 
one of commissioners to assess damages for the government improvements at 
Island and to locate the government bridge between Rock Island and Daven D0 Lor 
president of Rockford Insurance Company; one of originators, and for many y 
managing director of the Rockford Water Power Company; died June (21), 
1892, at Rockford; in politics a Whig, thereafter a Republican, Bateman a 
Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 104-105; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1 
Pp 368; History of Winnebago County, H. F. Kett and Company, 352, 386, 389- 

472; Portrait and Biographical Record of Winnebago and Boone Counties, 1296-1 
Church, History of Rockford and Winnebago County, 41, 62, 167, 171, 191, 222 
264; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Churchill, Alfred: born 1800, in New York (Vermont); taken in early | 
Batavia, New York, where he was reared; 1834, came to Illinois, and set 
Warrenville, DuPage County; February—August, 1836, county commissio 
Cook County; fall of 1837, came to Kane County, and purchased a large cla 
Kaneville Township; 1845-1846, school commissioner of Kane County; 
various other minor township and county offices; September 27, 1845—Augus 
1849, postmaster of Avon; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
removed to Rockford, and subsequently to Dade County, Missouri, where 
chased 1,500 acres of land; 1861, driven out of Missouri because of hi 
sentiments, and went to Pine County Minnesota; remained there one year, 
on account of the Indian danger returned to his old home in Kane County. 
October 18, 1868, on his farm in Kaneville Township; in politics a De 
Andreas, History of Cook County, 352; Bateman and Selby, Historical Ency 
of Illinois, Kane County, 669,714; Past and Present of Kane County, 254, 424- 
Commemmorative Biographical and Historical Record of Kane County, 8455. 
1059-1060; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Cline (Kline), William J.: 1846-1848, sergeant-at-arms of Senate; 1 
doorkeeper pro tem of Constitutional Convention; lived in Kane County. | 
Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 358; ‘fournal of the Convention, 1847, volume 

Cloud, Newton: born 1805, in North Carolina; 1827, settled near W 
Morgan County, Illinois; 1830-1832, 1834-1840, 1842-1844, 1846-1848, 187 
representative in General Assembly; 1844-1846, clerk of House; 1846-1848, 
of House; 1847, member and president of Constitutional Convention; 18: 


APPENDIX 955 


state senator; fall of 1855—April, 1856, temporary principal of Illinois Deaf and 
Dumb Institute at Jacksonville; preacher of Methodist church; farmer; in 
politics a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 108; 
Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 348, 350-351, 353, 356-357» 359-361, 3733 


Rummel, I//inois Hand-Book and Legislative Manual for 1871, pp. 178, 186; History 


of Morgan County, 322; Eames, Historic Morgan and Classic Facksonville, 59, 78, 
97, 110, 114, 121, 181, 268; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Colby, Eben F.: born 1815, in Vermont; 1843, came to Illinois; farmer near 


_ Wickliffe, Cook County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; died 


August 24, 1884; in politics a Democrat. Andreas, History of Chicago, 3:397; 
Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. i 

Constable, Charles Henry: born July 6, 1817, at Chestertown, Maryland; 
attended Belle Air Academy; 1838, graduated from the University of Virginia; 
studied law and admitted to the bar; (1839) 1840, came to Mount Carmel, Illinois; 
1844-1848, state senator; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1852, 
removed to Marshall, Clark County; 1852, defeated as Whig candidate for Congress 
by James C Allen; 1856, presidential elector-at-large on the Buchanan ticket; 
July 1, 1861—October 9, 1865, judge of circuit court; March, 1863, arrested at 
Charleston because of his anti-war action in releasing four deserters and holding to 
bail, on charge of kidnapping, two Union officers who had arrested them; although 
he was released, the affair contributed to the causes of the Charleston riot of March 
22, 1863; died in office, October 9, 1865; in politics a Whig until 1854, thereafter a 
Democrat, Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 117; Blue 
Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 201, 214, 357-358; Cole, The Era of the Civil War, 
149, 302; Combined History of Edwards, Lawrence and Wabash Counties, 132; 
History of Crawford and Clark Counties, part 2, pp. 291-292; Hollingsworth, 4 
List of the Members. 

Crain, John; born 1803, in Tennessee; 1810, brought to Illinois; farmer near 
Nashville, Washington County; 1836-1842, representative in General Assembly; 
1842-1846, state senator; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; in politics 
a Democrat. Ford, History of Illinois, 194-195, Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, 
PP: 3513 353-3555 357; Lhompson, [/linois Whigs before 1846, pp. 133, 139; Hollings- 


worth, 4 List of the Members. 


Cross, Robert J.: born October 1, 1803, in Newburgh, Orange County, New 
York; spent greater part of minority in Bethel, Sullivan County, New York; 1825, 
went to Tecumseh, Lenaine County, Michigan; 1830, removed to Coldwater, 
Michigan; 1835, came to Winnebago County, Illinois; one of earliest settlers in 
Roscoe Township; farmer all his life; assisted in organization of Winnebago 
County; 1836, one of first judges of election in Winnebago County; 1836, elected 


justice of the peace; 1836-1839, first county treasurer; 1841, first vice-president of 


Winnebago County Agricultural Society; 1846-1848, 1872-1873, representative in 
General Assembly; 1847, 1869-1870, member of Constitutional Convention; 1861, 
defeated as candidate for election to Constitutional Convention of 1862; 1862, 
delegate to Union State Convention; 1868-1872, chairman of Board of Supervisors; 


4 township school fund trustee over thirty years; died February 15, 1873; in politics 
-a Whig, later a Republican. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914,-Pp. 359 3753 


956 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI TIONS. ” 


History of Whee County, 236, 245, 353, 386, 389, 391-392, 618-619; Chu 
History of Rockford and Winnebago County, 39, 53, 121, 172, 191, 2645, Tih 
State Fournal, September 25, 1862; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Cross, Samuel J.: born 1806, in Pennsylvania; 1839, came to Illinois; 184: 
1852, first circuit clerk of Woodford County; lived at Metamora, Woodford Count 
1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1859, first president of Board 
Trustees of Metamora; in politics a Democrat. Moore, History of Woodfo fi 
County, 97, 146, 182; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Dale, Michael G.: born November 30, 1814 (1816), in Lancaster, Palio tecel , 
attended West Chester Academy; 1835, graduated from Pennsylvania College at 
Gettysburg; 1837, admitted to the bar; 1838, came to Illinois; settled in Green a 
ville, Bond County; 1839-1853, probate judge of Bond County; 1844, comm is- 
sioned major of state militia; 1847, member of military court at Alton; 1847, 
member of Constitutional Convention; 1852, delegate to Democratic National 
Convention; 1853, removed to Edwardsville, Madison County; 1853-1857, register 
of United States land office at Edwardsville; 1855-1863, master in chancer 
December, 1857—-December, 1865, January, (1876) 1877—December, 1886, count 
judge of Madison County; president of Board of Education of Edwardsville; 
died April 1, 1895 (1896), at Edwardsville; in politics a Democrat. Bateman an 
Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 126-127; Biographical Encyclopedia of 
Illinois, 292-293; Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1:2, 526; 2:697-699; Perri 
History of Bond and Montgomery Counties, 171-172, 177, 339, History of Maa 
son County, 192, 360-361; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Davis, David: born March 9(19), 1815, in Cecil County, Maryland; 1 
graduated from Kenyon College, Ohio; studied law at Yale; 1835, came to Peki 
Illinois; 1836, settled at Bloomington, and practiced law; 1840, defeated as cand 
date for state senator by John Moore; 1844-1846, representative in General 
Assembly; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; December 4, 1848— 
November 1, 1862, judge of the Eighth Judicial Circuit; 1860, delegate—at-l 
to Republican National Convention; 1861, member of commission to investig 
- Department of the Missouri; November, 1862—March, 1877, United Stat 
Supreme Court justice; 1872, nominated for president by Labor Reform party, 
one of leading candidates for the Liberal Republican nomination; 1877-1883, 
United States senator; October, 1881-March 3, 1883, president pro tem of th 
United States Senate; died June 26, 1886, at his home in Bloomington; in politi 
a Whig, later an Independent Republican. Bateman and Selby, Historical Ent 
clopedia of Illinois, 128; United States Biographical Dictionary, Mlinois Volun 
16-20; Encyclopedia of Biography of Illinois, 1:9-14; Palmer, Bench and Bar 
Illinois, 1:154, 541-549; Illinois Handbook for 1870, p. 181; Blue Book of Titi 
1913-1914 pp. 154, 215, 357; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Davis, James M.: born October 9, (1793) 1803, in Barren County, Kentuc 
1817, settled in Bond County, Illinois, where he is said to have taught the first s 
ran a store in Greenville; 1842-1844, 1858-1860, representative in General A 
bly; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention from Montgomery and 
eounticss 1849, register of the land office at Vandalia; practiced law at F 


i 


APPENDIX 957 


his home; in politics a Whig; later a Democrat and a bitter opponent of the war 
_ policy of President Lincoln. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Ili- 
| mois, 128; Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1:526; 2:967-969; Blue Book of 
_ Tilinois, 1913-1914, pp. 356, 366; Perrin,History of Bond and Montgomery Counties, 
part 2, p. 72; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
; Davis, Thomas G. C.: born 1814, in Virginia; (1842) 1843 (1844), came to 
Illinois and settled in Golconda, Pope County; lawyer; one of the most popular 
_ orators in the state; 1846-1848, state senator; removed to Metropolis, Massac 
_ County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1850, independent Demo- 
cratic candidate for Congress, but defeated by Willis Allen; removed to Paducah, 
ff Kentucky, afterwards to St. Louis, Missouri; leading Jawyer there many years; 
late in life established a home in Denton, Texas; died in Texas, 1888; in politics a 
Democrat. Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 2:857, 1211; Blue Book of Illinois, 
‘1913-1914, p. 358; Page, History of Massac County, 71-73; Hollingsworth, 4 List 
of the Members. 
) Dawson, John: born 1791 (1792), in Virginia; 1827 (1828), removed to San- 
_ gamon County, Illinois; 1830-1832, 1834-1840, representative in General Assem- 
bly; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; farmer; died November 12, 1850; 
| in politics a Whig. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 129; 
Blue Book of Iilinots, 1913-1914, pp. 348, 350-351, 3533 Hollingsworth, 4 List of 
the Memters. 
7” Deitz, Peter W.: born January 29, 1808, near Oneonta, Otsego County, New 
York; educated in common schools and Cazenovia Seminary; 1833, left for the 
_ West, spending time in Michigan and Indiana surveying, teaching, and reading law; 
__ 1836, admitted to the bar at Rushville, Indiana; returned to New York; 1837, 
"came to Illinois; began farming near Marengo, McHenry County; 1842, defeated 
| as candidate for representative in General Assembly; 1843-1845, county school 


ow 


commissioner; 1845, moved to Marengo; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven- 


4 Visors; 1868-1870, representative in General Assembly; in politics a Whig, later a 
1. Republican. History of McHenry County, Inter-State Publishing Company, 219, 
_ 222-225, 759-760; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 372; Hollingsworth, 4 List 
of the Members. 
____ Dement, John: born April 26, 1804, in Gallatin, Sumner County, Tennessee; 
rr 1817, accompanied his parents to Franklin County, Illinois; 1826, elected sheriff of 
Franklin County; 1828-1832, 1836-1837, representative in General Assembly; 
1832, served with distinction in Black Hawk War; February 1, 1831-December 3, 
1836, state treasurer; removed to Vandalia; 1837, removed to Galena; 1837-1841, 
1845-1849, 1853—till office abolished, receiver of public money, United States 
_ Land Office, by appointments of Presidents Van Buren, Polk, and Pierce; 1840, 
_ removed to Dixon, Lee County, where he afterwards resided; 1844, Democratic 
_ presidential elector; a farmer in 1847 but became a successful manufacturer and 
capitalist at Dixon; 1847, 1862, 1870, member of Constitutional Convention, 
_ temporary president in 1862, 1870; 1859, elected mayor of Dixon, but failed to 
qualify; 1869-1872, 1878-1879, mayor of Dixon; died at his home at Dixon, 
_ January 16 (17), 1883; in politics a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical 


958 


PM 


Encyclopedia of Illinois, 132; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, 
347-348, 351; United States Biographical Dictionary, Illinois Volume, 78 : 
Biographical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 267-268; Bateman and Selby, Hi. 
Encyclopedia of Illinois, Lee County, 648, 650, 672, 7703 Hollingsworth, A Lis 
the Members. 


from Bowdoin ates studied law at Conbade ine Sehgal 1832, cam 
Springfield, Illinois, where for a time he was a law partner of John T. Stuart; 
removed to Beardstown, Cass County; 1843-1847, 1849-(?), judge of proba 
served as alderman and city attorney; 1847, member of Constitutional Conventi 
1860-1864, state senator; 1864, delegate-at-large to Republican National Con- 
vention at Baltimore; 1864, removed to Jacksonville, where he practiced 
died August 12, 1878, in Mackinac, Michigan; in politics a Whig, later a Republ 
Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 606; Palmer, Bench a 
Bar of Illinois, 1:3, 166, 338-339; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 366-3 
Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Cass County, 2: 703; Perr 
History of Cass County, 57-58, 116-117; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members 

Dunlap, James: born October 30, 1802, in Fleming County, Kentucky; ( 
(1831) (1834), arrived in Illinois and engaged in general merchandise busi 
1834-1837, trustee of town of Jacksonville; 1838, contracted to build the first 
road in Illinois, Meredosia to Springfield; 1845, road completed; 1846, colon 
Mexican War; 1847, bought with others the Northern Cross Railroad at p: 
auction; dealt largely in real estate and was prominent farmer and stock de 
1847, member of Constitutional Convention; instrumental in securing 
institutions for Jacksonville; member of first Board of Trustees of the Ce 
Hospital for the Insane; member of first Board of Trustees of the ‘School for | 
Blind; 1857, opened the “Dunlap House”; 1861, became strong Union man 
1861-1864, served as chief quartermaster of Thirteenth Army Corps; in politic: 
Democrat. Biographical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 301-302; Greene and Thom 
son, Governors’ Letter-Books, 1840-1853, p. 106n; Eames, Historic Morgan 
Classic Facksonville, 78, 97, 102, 105, 111, 123, 126-127; Hollingsworth, 4 List of 
the Members. a 

Dunn, Harvey: born 1806, in New York; in boyhood went to Indiana, la 
to Ohio; 1835 (1837), came to Morgan County, Illinois; 1839, moved to I 
County; 1840, engaged in general merchandise business in Chambersburg, | 
a farmer near Chambersburg; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; | 
various local offices; 1858, county supervisor; 1861, unsuccessful Rep 
candidate for county clerk; died December, 1869; in politics a Democrat, 
Republican. Massie, Past and Present of Pike County, 90, 468; History 
County, Charles C. Chapman and Company, 312, 409, 883; Hollingsworth, 
of the Members. 

Dunsmore, Daniel: born:1793, in New York; 1816, came to Illinois: fa 
near Exeter, Scott County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; my 
a Whig, Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Eccles, Joseph T.: born January 7, 1807, in Mercer County, ree 
educated chiefly in Harrodsburg, Kentucky; 1830, came to Fayette 


APPENDIX 959 


Illinois; 1830-1832, taught school at Vandalia; 1832, served in Black Hawk War; 
lerked in store one year, then engaged in mercantile business for himself for 
eral years; farmed near Vandalia about nine years; 1847, member of Constitu- 
onal Convention; removed to Hillsboro, Montgomery County, where he again 
engaged in mercantile business, and retired after several years; justice of the peace 
"for several years at Vandalia and Hillsboro; assistant assessor and United States 
deputy revenue collector; 1860, nominated Richard Yates for governor; recruiting 
_ Officer at Hillsboro during the war; 1862, delegate to Union State Convention; 
“in politics a Whig, later a Republican, Perrin, History of Bond and Montgomery 
ounties, part 2, p. 103; Illinois State Fournal, September 25, 1862; Hollingsworth, 
_ A List of the Members. 

4 Edmonson, J. William F.: born 1816, in Maryland; 1840, came to Illinois; 
_ merchant at Vandalia, Fayette County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven- 
tion; in politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

' Edwards, Cyrus: born January 17, 1793, in Montgomery County, Maryland; 
‘1800, removed to Kentucky; 1815, admitted to the bar at Kaskaskia, Illinois; 
1815-1827 (1829), resided alternately in Kentucky and Missouri; 1827 (1829), 
i ‘took up residence at Edwardsville; engaged in business and later moved to Upper 
a - Alton; 1832, served in Black Hawk War; 1832-1834, 1840-1842, 1860-1862, 
ve representative in General Assembly; 1834-1838, state senator; 1838, defeated as 
7 candidate for governor; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1852, received 
‘degree of LL.D. from Shurtleff College; died September, 1877, at Upper Alton; 
a patron of education and public charities; in politics a Whig and later a Republi- 
‘can. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 152; Blue Book of 
Illinois, 1913-1914, Pp. 349-350, 354, 367, 452; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the 
_ Members. 

ig Edwards, Ninian Wirt: born April 15, 1809, at Frankfort, Kentucky; family 
_ temoved in same year to Illinois, where his father became territorial governor; 
‘spent boyhood at Kaskaskia, Edwardsville, and Belleville; 1832, married Elizabeth 


University; 1834-1835, attorney general; 1835, removed to Springfield; 1836- 
"1840, 1848-1851, representative in General Assembly until resignation because of 
_ change from Whig to Democratic principles; 1844-1848, state senator; 1847, 


is public instruction by appointment of ews Matteson; 1861 (1862)—June, 
1865, captain commissary of subsistence, by appointment of President Lincoln; 
June, 1865, retired to private life; 1870, published History of Illinois, 1778-1833, 
_ prepared at the request of the State Historical Society; died at Springfield, Sep- 
tember 2, 1889; in politics a Whig until 1851, thereafter a Democrat. Bateman 
ind Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 152-153; Palmer, Bench and Bar of 
 Iinois, 1:174-175; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 142, 351, 353» 357-358, 
} Bo, 362; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

__ Evey, Edward: born (1813) 1815, in Maryland; 1837, came to Illinois; lawyer 
tt Shelbyville, Shelby County; 1839-1849, probate justice of the peace; 1847, 


960 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT. 


member of Constitutional Convention; 1848-1850, representative in ; 
Assembly; 1854, went to Los Angeles, California; 1862, member of C 
Assembly as Union Democrat; 1878, member of second California Constitu 
Convention; in politics a Democrat. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 

Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Shelby County, 2:686, ¢ 
7333 California Blue Book, 1911, p. 252; The Works of Hubert Howe Bancroft 
294n, 404; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Ewing, James T.: born 1828, in Illinois; clerk at Vandalia, Fayette Co 
1847, assistant secretary of Constitutional Convention. Hollingsworth, 4 Lisi 
the Members. airy 

Farwell, Seth B.: born 1810, in New York; went from New York to 
came to Ottawa, Illinois, (1834) 1835; lawyer; 1838, 1841-1842, 1842-1 
state’s attorney; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; residence in 
in Freeport, Stephenson County; removed to California and elected judge the 
died on way from Kansas to California; in politics a Democrat. Baldwin, . 
of LaSalle County, 218, 231-232; Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia r) 
Illinois, Kane County, 670; Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of ml 
Kendall County, 2:760;, Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Frick, Frederick: born 1797, in Pennsylvania; 1838, came to Illinois; fa 
near Bluff, Mercer County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Geddes, Thomas: born 1805, in Pennsylvania; 1835, came to Hlinois; fa 
near Fountain Green, Hancock County; 1847, member of Constitutional Cor 
tion; in politics a Whig. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. ; 

Graham, James: born 1792, in North Carolina; 1836, came to Illinois; fe 
near Carlinville, Macoupin County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven 
in politics a Whig. Hollingsworth, A List of the Members. 

Green, Henry R.: born 1788, in Rhode Island; 1837, came to fillevois 
near Delavan, Tazewell County; 1841, laid out the city of Delavan; 1846, on 
first deacons of Baptist Church of Delavan; 1847, member of Constitutional 
vention; 1862, delegate to Union State Convention; 1863, county sup 
referred to in Convention as “the reverend member from Tazewell”’; in po! 
Whig, later a Republican. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Ili 
Tazewell County, 2:826, 829, 840; Illinois State Fournal, pete Gi 25 
Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Green, Peter: born 1807, in Kentucky; lived many years in Salem, Ind 
where he ran a furniture shop, ox-mill and distillery, and was expelled from t 
Methodist church on account of the latter occupation; also studied and prac 
medicine while in Indiana; 1827, came to Illinois (1829 to Clay County); 
in Mayville, (now Clay City), where he practiced medicine, ran a hotel, and 
a general store; 1836-1844, representative in General Assembly; platted t 
Louisville, influential in securing removal of county seat there, and went the 
continue the practice of his profession; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven 
invested largely in Louisville land, at one time owning six hundred acres; a p 
cian of more than ordinary ability; a leader and politician of some note; di 
Louisville, 1870; in politics a Democrat. Blue Book of Illinois, 19 


APPENDIX 961 


pp 352-354, 356; Thompson, Illinois Whigs before 1846, p. 142; History of Wayne 
and Clay Counties, 376, 379-380, 397; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

_ Green, William B.: born 1807, in Ohio; 1822, came to Illinois; 1847, member of 
nstitutional Convention; engineer in Galena, Jo Daviess County; in politics a 
Whig. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

_ Gregg, David L.: born 1815, in New York; (1839) emigrated from Albany to 
oliet, Illinois, where he began the practice of law; 1839, editor of Foliet Courier; 
142-1846, representative in General Assembly; removed to Chicago, where he 
served as United States district attorney; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven- 
_ tion; 1849, professor of Rhetoric and Belles Lettres in the University of St. Mary’s 

of the Lake at Chicago; April 2, 1850—January Io, 1853, secretary of state; 1852, 
defeated for Democratic nomination for governor by Joel A. Matteson; 1852, 
: ~ Democratic presidential elector; 1853, appointed commissioner to the Sandwich 

Islands; later acted for a time as minister or adviser of King Kamehamaha IV; 
_ returned to California; appointed by President Lincoln as receiver of public 
_ moneys at Carson City, Nevada; died December 23, 1868, at Carson City. Bate- 

man and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 209; Greene and Thompson, 

vernors’ Letter-Books, 1840-1853, p. 233n; Scott, Newspapers and Periodicals of 
Winois, 207; Cole, The Era of the Civil War, 102; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, 
PP. 140, 201, 356-357; Andreas, History of Chicago, 1:298; Hollingsworth, 4 List 
9 the Members. 

Grimshaw, William A.: born June 1, 1813, at Navin-on-the-Boyne, County 
Meath, Ireland (Bateman and Selby say Philadelphia); 1815, brought by parents 
to the United States on vessel bringing to Charleston, South Carolina, the first 
_ news of the Treaty of Ghent; father of English descent but born in Belfast, and 
Tater: a member of the Philadelphia bar and a distinguished historian; 1832, admit- 
ted to the bar in Philadelphia at age of nineteen; 1833, came to Pike County, 
Illinois, lived at Atlas for a short time, afterward resided at Pittsfield; 1833, ap- 
1 ointed adjutant of the seventeenth militia regiment; commissioned by Governor 
_ Reynolds as public administrator of Pike County; 1840, 1848, unsuccessful candi- 
7 . ate for representative in General Assembly; 1847, member of Constitutional 
Convention, and author of the article prohibiting dueling; 1864, delegate to the 
epublican National Convention; for twelve years trustee of the state Institution 
r the Blind at Jacksonville; 1877-1882, member of State Board of Charities; for 
‘Many years trustee and school dy rector of Pittsfield; 1880, Republican presidential 

elector; president and director of Pike County Agricultural Society; one of origin- 
ators of Old Settlers’ Association; died January 7, 1895, at Pittsfield; in politics 
a Whig, thereafter a Republican. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of 
Illinois, 212; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 202; Massie, Past and Present of 
ike County, 174-181; Hi: tory of Pike County, Charles C. Chapman and Company, 
82-683; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
_ Harding, Abner Clark: born February 10, 1807, in East Hampton, Middlesex 
_ County, Connecticut; 1$15, removed with parents to Plainfield, Herkimer County, 

New York; educated in public schools and academy at Hamilton, New York; 
, enlisted in the navy, but rejected on account of small stature; 1821-1825, 
gaged in teaching and other vocations; 1826-1827, read law at Bridge- 


962 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC 


water, New York; 1828, removed to Pennsylvania and waited ‘to 
at Lewisburg; 1836, elected member of Constitutional Convention of P 
sylvania; 1838, came to Illinois, and established a home: at Mon in 
Warren County; practiced law, became active in politics, and was regarc 
leader of the Whig party; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 184) 
county school commissioner; 1848-1850, representative in General A 
1851, abandoned practice of law on account of failing eyesight, and unt 
1860, engaged in traveling for his health; interested in railroad enterprises; x 
instrumental in organizing Eighty-third Illinois Volunteer Infantry; enlisted 
private, was elected and commissioned colonel, and on May 22, 1863, made 
dier-general, probably because of his skill and gallantry in defending Fort Done 
after its capture by the Union Army; 1865-1869, Republican representa 
Congress; May-October, 1871, traveled in Europe; accumulated a fortune 
about $2,000,000; one of first trustees of Monmouth College; endowed a pr 
ship; died July (10) 19, 1874, in Monmouth. Bateman and Selby, Hi 
Encyclopedia of Illinois, 220; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 19 
Biographical Congressional Directory, 1774-1917, p. 703; Bateman and 
Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Warren County, 2:706, 708, 761, 8 8 
Portrait and Biographical Album of Warren County, Chepnee Brothers, 5 
Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Harlan, Justin: born December 6, 1800, in Warren County, Ohio; educa: 
the public schools; taught school; studied law in Cincinnati under Judge Mc 
later associate justice of the United States Supreme Court; 1825, came to D. 
Clark County, Illinois; 1832, served in Black Hawk War; 1835-1861, 
judge; 1840, removed to Marshall, where he afterward resided; 1847, mi 
Constitutional Convention; 1862-1865, Indian agent under President 
1873-1877, county judge of Clark County; died March 12, 1879, while visitin 
daughter in Kentucky; in politics a Whig, thereafter a Republican. Batem 
Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 221; Blue Book of Illinois, 19% 
p- 214; History of Crawford and Clark Counties, part 2, p. 288, part 3, p. 253 
worth, 4 List of the Members. ra 

Harper, Joshua: born 1801, in Virginia; 1836, came to Illinois; fala n 
Morristown, Henry County; 1842-1846, representative in General As 
1847, member of Constitutional Convention; in politics a Whig. Blue 
Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 356-357; Thompson, Illinois Whigs before 1846, p. 
Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. +S 

Harvey, Curtis K.: born 1815, in Vermont; 1836, came to Knoxville 
pioneer member of Knox County bar; 1840-1847, school commissioner of 
County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; in politics a D 
died suddenly, 1847. Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1:450; Baten 
Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Knox County, 633; Hollingswo: 
List of the Members. in 

Hatch, Jeduthan: born 1809, in New Hampshire; 1836, came to I 
‘farmer near Naperville, DuPage County; 1842-1844, representative in 
Assembly; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1851, county su’ 
1852, county judge; in politics a Democrat. Blue Book of Illinois, 19 


APPENDIX 963 


; Thompson, Illinois Whigs before 1846, p. 142; Bateman and Selby, 
ie Encyclopedia of Illinois, DuPage County, 2: 643, 645, 654, 656, 682-683; 
i ond, History of DuPage County, 44, 46, 51; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the 
bers. 

Hawley, Nelson: born 1809, in Vermont; 1839, came to Illinois; physician at 
Palestine, Crawford County; 1845-1853, county school commissioner; 1847, 
‘member of Constitutional Convention; in politics a Democrat. History of Craw- 
for rd and Clark Counties, part 1, p. 51; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

' Hay, Daniel: born 1781, in Virginia; 1816, came to Illinois; July 15, 1816, 
_sppsined county treasurer of White County; January 14, 1817—August, 1818, 
tice of the peace for White County; June 17, 1817, appointed captain of Rifle 
Sompany, Fifth Regiment; January, 1818, appointed census commissioner; 1824— 
1828, state senator; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; a farmer; in 

ae a Whig. Blue Book of Lilinois, 1913-1914, pp. 344-345; Territorial Register, 
99-1818, pp. 42, 45, 49, 54, 60; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Hayes, Samuel Snowden (Snowdon): born December 25, 1820, in Nashville, 
‘nnessee; educated in Nashville and Cincinnati; 1837, employed in drug store in 
lisyille, Kentucky; August, 1838, removed to Shawneetown, Illinois; 1838- 
1840, engaged in drug business at Shawneetown; 1842, admitted to the bar and 
led in Mt. Vernon; shortly afterward removed to Carmi, White County; 1843, 
‘stumped southern Illinois for the Democratic ticket; 1845, delegate to 
phis Commercial Convention; 1846-1850, representative in General Assem- 
1847, raised company for service in Mexican War, but was never mustered in; 
5 1870, member of Constitutional Convention, the youngest member of 
- Convention of 1847; 1848, Democratic presidential elector; appointed by 
or French as honorary aide de camp with rank of colonel; winter of 1850- 
th removed to Chicago; as friend of Douglas, opposed the repeal of the Missouri 
c mpromise, but supported Buchanan; 1860, delegate to Democratic National 
Jonvention at Charleston and Baltimore, and canvassed the state for Douglas; 
grted the Union cause, but opposed the government war policies; 1858-1861, 
4-1865, member of Chicago Board of Education; 1862-1865, 1873-1876, city 
ath (1866), member of United re Revenue Commission, and brought 


niversity; 1872, appointed one of first directors of the Chicago Public Library; 
876 defeated as candidate for presidential elector. Bateman and Selby, Historical 
ncyclopedia of Illinois, 226-227; Biographical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 465-467; 
almer, Bench and Bar of Iilinois, 1:5; 2:647-648; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913- 
4, Pp. 201, 359-360; Moses, History of Chicago, 1:218, 220; Andreas, History 
icago, 2:103-105; 3:847, 860; Powell, Semi-Centennial History of the Uni- 
‘of Illinois, 1:338, 344; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Heacock, Reuben E. (B.): born 1818, in Illinois; son of Russell E. Heacock; 
r near Summit, Cook County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
first commissioner of highways of Lyons Township; 1852, overseer of the 
_in AL a Democrat. Bateman and Siang Historical ee of 


22 aia 


PALE OR ser, PUP tn cea Re *. 


Ber. ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Henderson, Hugh: born 1810, in New York; 1836, came to Illinois; la 
Joliet, Will County; 1839, one of founders and publishers of Foliet Courier; 
appointed by Governor Ford as counsel for the state to aid the appraisers of dam 
on the canal; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1849-1854, circ 
judge; died in office, 1854. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 215; Sco 
Newspapers and Periodicals of Illinois, 207; Greene and Thompson, Gove r 
Letter-Books, 1840-1853, p. 80; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Hill, George H. (W.): born May 20, 1810, in Rensselaer County, New 
1835, came to Illinois; farmer near Genoa, DeKalb County; 1835, one of co 
tee of five to settle disputed titles to claims; justice of the peace for many 
1837-1839, first treasurer and assessor of DeKalb County; 1846-1850, co 
commissioner; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; (1849-1855) 
master of Kingston; associate county judge four years; 1854-1862 (1857 
county judge; county supervisor for five years; township treasurer thirty 
died 1890, on his farm in DeKalb County; in politics a Democrat, later a Re 
can. Gross, Past and Present of DeKalb County, 1:59, 79, 81-82, 96, I 57-15 
302-303, 327; Portrait and Biographical Album of DeKalb Couey: Cha: 
Brothers, 351-352; Hollingsworth, A List of the Members. 

Hoes, Abraham: born 1814, in New York; brother of John V. A. Hoes; 
came to Illinois; lawyer at Ottawa, LaSalle County; 1847, member of Cons 
tional Convention; died (1856); in politics a Democrat. History of . ; 
County, Inter-State Publishing Company, 1:392; Palmer, Bench and Bar ¢ 
nois, 2:818; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Hogue, James M.: born 1812, in Tennessee; 1817, came to items ; 
near Fairfield, Wayne County; 1839-1841, circuit clerk; 1847, member o 
stitutional Convention; in politics a Democrat. History of Wayne anc 
Counties, part 2, p. 337; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Holmes, William H.: born 1809, in New York; 1834, came to Illinois; _ 
at Pekin, Tazewell County; 1838-1839, village clerk of Pekin; 1841, asses 
Pekin; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; in politics a Whig. Bate: 
and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Tazewell County, 2:900; Ho 
worth, 4 List of the Members. t 

Hunsaker, Samuel: born 1795, in Kentucky; 1810, came to Illinois; 
near Jonesboro, Union County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven: 
politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. Ny 

Hurlbut, Stephen Augustus: born November 29, 1815 (1819), at Che 
South Carolina; received thorough liberal education; 1837, admitted to 
(1838) (1845), removed to Belvidere, Boone County, Illinois; 1847, member of 
Constitutional Convention; 1848, defeated for presidential elector; 1858 I 
1866-1868, representative in General Assembly; May, 1861—July, 1865, seri 
war as brigadier-general and major-general; 1868, presidential elector; 1869 
minister resident to the United States of Columbia; 1873-1877, represent 
Congress; 1876, defeated for reélection as Independent Republican; 18 
minister resident to Peru; first commander-in-chief of the Grand Army ¢ 
Republic; died March 27, 1882, at Lima, Peru; in politics a Whig un til 
thereafter a Republican, Bateman and Selby Hiseniea Enea of 


PRO ee a yee Pe i ae, PP at gh 5 Fr 


APPENDIX ys 


1; Biographical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 480; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913- 
» PPp- 194, 202, 366-367, 370; Biographical Congressional Directory, 1774-1911, 
749; Church, History of Rockford and Winnebago County, 264, 330-331; Hol- 
worth, 4 List of the Members. 
Huston, John: born May 17, 1808, near Sparta, White County, Tennessee; 
1828 (1829), came to Illinois and settled near Jacksonville; 1830, removed to farm 
‘near Blandinsville, McDonough County, where he afterward resided; September, 
438 830-March 17, 1831, first county treasurer of McDonough County; 1847, 
ri member of Constitutional Convention; 1850-1852, representative in General 
MW; Assembly; 1852, defeated for reélection; died July 8, 18 54; in politics a Democrat. 
eman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinots, McDonough County, 669, 
6; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 362; Clarke, History of McDonough 
ey, 23, 32, 376-380, 402-404; Fialitteewortk: A List of the Members. 
Jackson, Aaron C.: born October 29, 1800, in Morristown, New Jersey; 1805, 
ken to Fort Pitt, Pennsylvania; later taken to Knox County, Ohio; 1837, 
emigrated to Illinois; farmer near Union Grove, Whiteside County; 1839, com- 
; oned justice of the peace; 1842-1844, representative in General Assembly; 
5 member of Constitutional Convention; 1852-1857, county supervisor; 
master of Morrison during Lincoln’s administration; in politics a Whig. 
Bent, History of Whiteside County, 67, 104, 292, 295, 298-299; Blue Book of 
Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 356; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
_ James, James A.: born 1794 (1798), in Maryland (Kentucky); 1803 (1804), 
to Illinois; attended college at Beardstown, Kentucky; farmer near Harrison- 
Monroe County; 1827, colonel of state militia; 1840-1844, state senator; 
, member of Constitutional Convention; in politicsa Democrat. Blue Book of 
inois, 1913-1914, pp. 354-355; History of Randolph, Monroe and Perry Counties, 
, 413-414; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
_ Jenkins, Alexander M.: born 1802 (1803) in South Carolina; 1817, came to 
# ackson County, Illinois; learned trade of carpenter; served as constable; 1830- 
' 1834, representative in General Assembly; 1832-1834, speaker; 1832, captain in 
; ¢ Hawk War; 1834-1836, licutenant-governor; 1836, president of first Illinois 
Central Railroad Company; 1836-1838, receiver of public moneys in land office at 
wardsville; studied law during residence at Edwardsville and practiced at 
arphysboro; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1855, edited Fackson 
mocrat; 1855, established Murphysboro Sentinel; August 27, 1859—February 13, 
4, Circuit judge of Third Judicial Circuit; died in office, February 13, 1864; in 
olitics a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 304; 
e Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 139, 214, 348-349; Scott, Newspapers and 
riodicals of Illinois, 256-257; History of Fackson County, 14, 17, 22, 57; History 
f Madison County, 186; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Jones, Humphrey B.: born 1799, in Christian County, Kentucky; (1819) 
| i came to Illinois, and settled in Brownsville, ‘Jackson County; 1827, removed 
Pinckneyville, Perry County; physician, later a lawyer; 1827, one of commis- 
ners to lay out county seat; 1827, commissioned one of first justices of the peace 
Perry County; first postmaster of Pinckneyville; first master in chancery in 
Perry County; 1827-1839, 1841-1855, first county clerk; 1827-1843, first clerk o 


Si 
ir 


PA ee oe 
: 


39, county - 

1847, member of Constitutional Convention; died November 18, 18 55 in 
ville; in politics a Whig. History of Randolph, Monroe and Perry 
162-167, 178-179, 188, 191, 335, 337-338; Hollingsworth, A List of th 

Judd, Thomas: born September 4, 1812, in East Charlemont, Frankl 
Massachusetts; 1835, came to Chicago, Illinois; later engaged in farming 
Page County; removed to Kane County and opened first blacksmith ‘sho 
traveled with the government survey for a short time; fall of 1836, _ began 
in Sugar Grove Township, Kane County; assisted in building Chicago a 
Railroad through Sugar Grove Township; first station agent at Sugar G 
county supervisor for two years; 1847, member of Constitutional Conver 1 
November 13, 1849—October 20, 1855, October 26, 1857—October 1 
postmaster of Sugar Grove; one of founders of Sugar Grove Normal. and In 
Institute; in politics a Whig; died January 11, 1881. Bateman an 
Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Kane County, 831; Past and Present 
County, 413, 420-421, 658; Commemorative Biographical and Historical 
Kane County, 928, 1103; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. pie 

Kenner, Alvin R.: born 1809, in Ohio; 1825, came to Illinois; far 
Albion, Edwards County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conyention 
delegate to Union State Convention; in politics a Whig, later a Repul 
Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. . 
_ Kinney, Simon: born 1786, in Pesnsyira 1836, came to Lincs; 


vention; in politics a Whig. Matson, Map of Bureau County, with Sketches 
Early Settlement, 50; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. : a 
Kinney, William C.: born 1819, in Illinois; son of former Lieutenant $0’ 
Kinney; 1839, began practice of law at Belleville; 1839, 1856, 1858, prose 
attorney; 1841-1846, circuit clerk and ex-officio recorder of deeds; 1847, n 
of Constitutional Convention; 1848, state’s attorney; 1854-1856, represent: a 
- General Assembly; 1857-1858, adjustant-general; died in office, 1858; 
a Democrat, later a Republican, Bateman and Selby, Historical En 
Illinois, 317-318; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 144, 3645 B 
Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, St. Clair County, 2: 684, 6 ( 


77-19 90, 943 ee ce 4 List of the Mantes 
Kitchell, Alfred: born March 29, 1820, at Palestine, Craw! ord 
received his education at Hillsboro Academy and Indiana State U: 
admitted to the bar; 1842, began practice of law at Olney, Rich 
1843-1853, state’s attorney; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven 
1852, judge of Richland County; 1849-1850, edited Olney News, firs 
established in Olney; 1859-1861, circuit judge of the Twenty-fifth Judicial 
promoter and director of the Ohio and Mississippi Railroad; 1866, rem« 
Galesburg, where he died, November 11, 1876; in politics a Democrat unt 
thereafter a Republican. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia / 
319-320; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 216; Palmer, Bench and Ba 
nois, 1:126; Biogrephical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 481; Scott, Newsp. 


APPENDIX 967 


cals of Illinois, 265; Counties of Cumberland, Fasper, and Richland, Historical 
iphical, 639, 657; 712; Perrin, History of Crawford and Clark Counties, 
57-58. 
, Augustus R.: ‘born 1801 (1802), in Connecticut; removed in youth to 
and studied medicine in New York City; 1823-1839, physician in 
: City; 1839, went to Kane, Green County, Illinois; 1844, removed to 
e, Jersey County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1849, 
a California as a gold hunter; 1854, returned to Jerseyville, where he died 
3, 1862; in politics a Whig. History of Greene and Fersey Counties, 152, 

( 7 7s 725-726; Cooper, History of Ferseyville, 78-79; Hollingsworth, 4 List of 
mbers. 

pp, Nathan Morse: born March 4, 1815, in Royalton, Vermont (New 
hire); 1837, came to Naples, Scott County, Illinois; 1837-1838, edited 
‘the West, and taught school; 1838, removed to Jacksonville; 1839, settled 
inchester, Scott County; served as county clerk and read law during term in 
fice; admitted to the bar; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 


Seianvcstion: 1862, delegate to Union State Convention; _ 1863-1865, 
pa aymaster with rank of major; 1865, appointed by President Johnson 


Republican. United States Biographical Dictionary, Illinois Talaincs 810- 
e Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 361; Scott, Newspapers and Periodicals 
, 258; Illinois State Fournal, September 25, 1862; Hollingsworth, 4 List 
nbers. 

witon, Lincoln B.: born (1804) 1813, in Shrewsbury, Massachusetts; 
‘Union College, Schenectady, New York; studied law with Governor 
flonest John Davis” of Massachusetts; 1839, went to Peoria; known as one of 
brilliant and prominent lawyers of his day, the Henry Clay of the Illinois 
delegate to Whig National Convention that nominated Clay; 1846, 
candidate for state senator; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven- 
52, Free Soil candidate for governor; 1854, nominated for Congress; 


James: born July 4, 1807, in Canajoharie, Montgomery County, New 
1827-1828, attended Fiamilton College, New York; 1830, graduated from 
1833, admitted to the bar; 1836, came to Knoxville, Illinois; one of prime 
_ construction of Peoria and Oquawka Railroad and its first president; 
sured charter for Knox College at Galesburg; 1840, engaged in mercantile 
and continued for several years; 1847, member of Constitutional Con- 
1853-1857, representative in Congress; 1857-1861, 1865-1869, 1872- 
sited in Berlin, seeking medical aid; liberal in his donations to various 
at © institutions; died October (8) 9, 1876; in politics a Whig until 1854, 


968 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTION. 


thereafter a Republican. Biographical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 502; Blue 
Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 192; Biographical Congressional Directory, 1774-1911, 
787; History of Knox County, Charles C. Chapman and Company, 686-687; B 
man and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Knox County, 873; Holl 
worth, 4 List of the Members. 

Kreider, George: born me 5, in Ponieyieaure 18 3 5, came to nos fa 


politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Menke 

Lander, Samuel: born January 21, 1798, in Clark County, Kesaeeet Oc 
1835, came to Bloomington, Illinois; farmer and stock-raiser; 1847, memb 
Constitutional Convention; removed to Denison, Texas; died January 8, 1 
in politics a Whig, later a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encycl 
of Illinois, McLean County, 2:1147; Portrait and Biographical Album of Mi 
County, Chapman Brothers, 736-737; Duis, The Good Old Times in a C1 
County, 318-320; Hollingsworth A List of the Members. 

Lasater, James M.: born 1817, in Tennessee; 1820, brought to I 
farmer near McLeansboro, Hamilton County; sheriff of county; 1847, membe 
Constitutional Convention; in politics a Democrat. History of Gallatin, . 
Hamilton, Franklin, and Williamson Counties, 259-260; Hollingsworth, 4 
the Members. 

Laughlin, William: born 1800, in Kentucky; 1832, came to Illinois; 
near Marcelline, Adams County; 1840-1842, representative in General As 
1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1870, one of first vice-presi 
Old Settlers’ Association of Adams and Brown counties; in politics a Demo 
Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 354; History of Adams County, 3 ve 
Thompson, Illinois Whigs before 1846, p. 144; Hollingsworth. 4 = 
Members. hy 

Lavely, William: 1847, justice of the peace; 1852, mayor of Spri 
1853, defeated for county clerk; 1861, defeated for county treasurer; 1869, 
of Springfield Board of Trade; member of Masonic Order; in politics a Dem 
Power, History of Springfield, 64, 101; History of Sangamon County, In 
Publishing Company, 274-275, 566; Fournal of the Convention, 2847, p. 6. 

Lemon, George B.: born 1810, in Ohio; 1836, came to Illinois; farmei 
Marion, DeWitt County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1854 
associate county judge; 1861-1863, county supervisor; in politics a Whig. & 
of DeWitt County, 1:127-130, 134, 139, 432; Hollingsworth, A List of the Men 

Lenley (Linley), Isaac: born 1807, in Kentucky; 1833, came to Il 
farmer near Astoria, Fulton County; 1839-1842, county commissiont a 
member of Constitutional Convention; 1850-1852, representative in 
Assembly; 1854, county supervisor; in politics a Democrat. Blue Book of 
1913-1914, p. 362; History of Fulton County, Charles C. Chapman and C 
968, 988; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Lockwood, Samuel Drake: born August 2, 1789; at Poundridge, Wi 
County, New York; February, 1811, admitted to the bar at Batavia, Nev 
January 1812, removed to Sempronius; there appointed justice of pez 
master in chancery; November, 1813, removed to Auburn; 1818, came t 


APPENDIX 969 


ttled at Carmi; 1821, prosecuting attorney; February 26, 1821—December 28, 
22, attorney-general; December 18, 1822—April 2, 1823, secretary of state; 
3, receiver. of public moneys at Edwardsville; agent of the first Board of Canal 
Commissioners; January 19, 1825—November 3, 1848, judge of Supreme Court of 
Illinois; 1828-1853, trustee of Illinois College, Jacksonville; 1829, removed to 
_ Jacksonville, Morgan County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
_ 1851-1874, state trustee of the Illinois Central Railroad; 1853, removed to Batavia, 
<ane County; died April 23, 1874, at Batavia; in politics a Whig, later a Republi- 
‘can. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Lilinois, 341-342; Palmer, 
_ Bench and Bar of Iitinais, 1:22-23; 2:1094-1095; Biographical Encyclopedia of 
- Minois, 398-399; Blue Book of Lilinois, 1913-1914, pp. 140, 142, 210; Bateman 
and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, St. Clair County, 2:703; Hollings- 
worth, 4 List of the Members. 
he Logan, Stephen Trigg: born February 24, 1800, in Franklin County, Kentucky; 
1820, admitted to the bar; 1832, emigrated to Sangamon County, Illinois; 1833, 
pened law office at Springfield; 1835-1837, circuit judge; 1839, elected circuit 
judge but declined to serve; 1841-1844, partner of Abraham Lincoln; 1842-1848, 
854-1856, representative in General Assembly; 1848, defeated for representative 
in Congress; 1855, nominated without his consent for judge of Supreme Court of 
Illinois; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1860, delegate to Republican 
National Convention; 1861, commissioned by Governor Yates to represent Illinois 
in the Washington Peace Conference; retired to private life; 1872, presided over 
Republican State Convention; died July 17, 1880, at Springfield; in politics a 
Whig, later a Republican. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 
re 3433 Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1:166-172; Encyclopedia of Biography of 
Winois, 1:149-153; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 213-214, 356-357; 3643 


Loudon, John Tineri: born 1819, in Illinois; farmer near Bainbridge, William- 
son County; became prominent member of Marion bar; 1847, member of Con- 
-stitutional Convention; 1849-1856, circuit clerk; in politics a Whig. Erwin, 
History of Williamson County, 235, 250; History of Gallatin, Saline, Hamilton, 
| Franklin, and Williamson Counties, 458, 470; Hollingsworth, A List of the Members. 
e. McCallen, Andrew: born October 29, 1813, at Palmyra, Indiana; 1814, 
brought to Illinois; 1843, came to Shawneetown (Elizabethtown); 1846, began 
_ practice of law; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; August 17, 1849— 
May 3, 1853, register of land office at Shawneetown; successful criminal lawyer; 
died February 10, 1861 at Shawneetown; in politics a Whig. Palmer, Bench and 
_ Bar of Illinois, 2: 857; History of Gallatin, Saline, Hamilton, Franklin and William- 
son Counties, 112; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

McClure, William: born 1807, in Pennsylvania; 1844, came to Illinois; 
_ farmer near Joliet, Will County; in politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List 
of the Members. 

__-~McCulley, John: born 1799, in North Carolina; 1816, came to Illinois; 
farmer near Belleville, St. Clair County; in politics a Democrat. Hollings- 
worth, 4 List of the Members. 


970 ‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC 


McHatton, Alexander: born 1787, in Kentucky; iene 
farmer near Camden, Schuyler County; in politics a Democrat. Hoollin SV 
A List of the Members. st Os. 

Manly, Uri: born 1807, in Massachusetts; 1832, came to Illinois; ve 
Marshall, Clark County; 1834-1836, 1852-1854, representative in General As 
bly; 1835-1843, county judge of Clark County; first postmaster of M 
1837-1842, clerk of circuit and county commissioners’ courts; 1847, me 
Constitutional Convention; 1847, one of board of commissioners for disbursem 
of military fund; 1848-1850, state senator; in politics a Democrat. Blue 
of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 350, 360, 363; Thompson, Illinois Whigs befor 
p. 145; Perrin, History of Crawford and Clark Counties, 51, 256, 259, 289, 3 
French Manuscripts, McKendree College Library, Lebanon, Ulimois. en ir 
worth, 4 List of the Members. 

Markley, David: born 1791, in Pennsylvania; colonel in War of nseane cou 
judge in Champaign County, Ohio; 1835 (1836), came to Illinois; 1836— 
engaged in mercantile business in Canton, Fulton County; 1837, president o! a 
Board of Trustees of Canton; 1838-1850, state senator; 1844, removed to 
near Monterey in Banner Township; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven 
1850, county supervisor; 1856, removed to Nebraska; soon returned to I 
settling in Stark County; in politics a Democrat. Blue Book of Illinois. 
1914 PP. 3525 354-355, 357-358, 360; Greene and Thompson, Governors’ 
Books, 1840-1853, p. to4n; History of Fulton County, Charles C. Chapm 
Company, 476, 523-524, 527-528, 987; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Marshall, Franklin S. D.: born 1819, in Kentucky; 1831, came to Cass Cou 
Illinois; removed to Bath, Mason County, where he practiced law; 1845-15 
circuit clerk; 1853, first master in chancery; 1847, member of Constitu’ 
Convention; died, 1854 (1855); in politics a Whig. History of Menard and I 
Counties, 435, 437-438, 568; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Marshall, Thomas A.: born 1818, in Kentucky; 1839, came to Illinois; 
at Charleston, Coles County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
1862, state senator; 1860, delegate to Republican National Conventi 
president pro tem of Senate and acting lieutenant-governor; 1861-1862, co 
of Fi irst Illinois Cael: in politics a Whig, later a aay Moses, / 


first Kane County en, siusuecbuced Gauaitiare for reponse in G 
Assembly; 1838, though he carried his own county, defeated by William Ste 
in election for state senator; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
near Newark, Kendall County, in 1847; 1850-1854, one of editors of Lacon 
in politics a Whig, thereafter a Democrat. Scott, Newspapers and Peri 
Illinois, 217; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 352; Past and Pr 
Kane County, 244, 248; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. ‘i 

Matheny, James H.: born October 30, 1818, in St. Clair County 


ic 2h St SN ie hae ARE eb tians W acre bide a i, ba SANS Ga NC la 


Par 


_ APPENDIX 971 


ar; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1852-1856, clerk of 
court; October, 1862, commissioned lieutenant-colonel of One Hundred 
enth (One Hundred Thirtieth) Illinois Volunteers; after siege of Vicksburg 
as judge-advocate until July, 1864, when he resigned and resumed the 
of law; 1873-1890, county judge of Sangamon County; in politics a Whig, 
r a short time with the American and Republican parties, thereafter a 
crat; died September 7, 1890. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia 
Mlinois, 356; Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1:191-192; Blue Book of 
inois, 1913-1914, P. 4325 Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Mi ure, John: born 1800, in Virginia; 1824, came to Lawrence County, 


stitutional Convention; in aie a Whig; died Tene 3, 1849. Bateman and 
Sih, Illinois Historical and Lawrence County Biographical, 719; Combined History 
y dwards, Lawrence and Wabash Counties, 108, 110, 113; Hollingsworth, 4 List 


Hino is, and took up practice of law; 1832-1834, 1836-1838, 1840-1842, representa- 
ve in General Assembly; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1849- 
udge ee the Circuit Court for the Fifth Circuit; died in office, November is 


4 

Es... of Illinois, McDonough County, Oe: Hollingsworth, 4 List of the 

bers. 

iN offett, Garner: born January, 1807, in Virginia; 1836, came to Illinois, and 
gan farming near Cherry Grove, Carroll County; 1839, one of first county 

nmissioners; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; county superin- 

dent of schools for many years; held many other offices; died October, 1856; 


ee) 
b 


litics a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 


480; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

oore, Henry W.: born 1816; 1840, removed to Illinois; lawyer at 
lity, Gallatin County; 1845, prosecuting attorney for circuit; 1846-1848, 
tary of Senate; 1847, secretary of Constitutional Convention; in politics a 
erat. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p- 358; History of Marion and 
on Counties, 95; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Moore, William S. (George S. Moore in roll of Convention): born 1807, in 
: ware; 1836, came to Illinois; farmer near Carthage, Hancock County; 1847, 
mber of Constitutional Convention; in politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 
List of the Members. 

_ Mortis, Richard G.: born 1800, in Virginia; 1833, came to Illinois; farmer 


972 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT. 


near Hutsonville, Crawford County; 1844-1846, 1848-1850, represen i 
General Assembly; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1853-11 
county judge; in politics a Democrat. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, 
360; Thompson, Illinois Whigs before 1846, p. 145; Perrin, History of Craw) 
Clark Counties, part 1, 50, 51; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Nichols, Jacob M.: born 1806, in North Carolina; 1832, came to I 
farmer near Payson, Adams County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conve 
in politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. ; 
Northcott, Benjamin F.: born 1817, in Kentucky; 1839, came to 
farmer near Athens, Menard County; 1847, member of Constitutional Con‘ 
in politics a Whig. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Norton, Jesse Olds: born December 25, 1812, at Bennington, Vermon 
graduated from Williams College; 1839, settled at Joliet; taught school in 
ing, Virginia, and Potosi, Missouri; studied law at Potosi; 1840, admitted 
bar and began the practice of law; (1845) city attorney; 1846-1850, count 
1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1850-1852, representative in 
Assembly; 1853-18 575 1863-1865, representative in Congress; 1857-1861, 
judge; 1866-1869, United States district attorney for the northern di 
Chicago; served as corporation council of Chicago; died August 3, 1875, in| 
in politics a Whig, thereafter a Republican. Bateman and Selby, Histo 
Encyclopedia of Illinois, 405; Biographical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 5: 


Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 192-193, 215, 362; Biographical Congre. 
Directory, 1774-1911, pp. 893-894. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Oliver, John: born 1798, in North Carolina; 1818, came to Illinois; 
near Vienna, Johnson County; 1834-1836, 1849-1842, representative i 
Assembly; 1847, member of Constitutional Conve in ae au 


1846, p. 146; Hollingsworth, 4 List Ce the Meee 
Pace, George W.: born December 18, 1806 in Kentucky; 1822, cal 
Jefferson County, Illinois; 1832, served in Black Hawk War; moved to fai 
Salem, Marion County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conventio 
engaged in furniture business, also a tailor for some time; died June x 
politics a Democrat. Wall, History of Fefferson County, 120, 241, 244; Br 
History of Marion County, 236; Biographical and Reminiscent History of Rici 
Clay and Marion Counties, 43; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Memiers. # mi 
Palmer, Reverend Henry D.: born April 19, (1791)1782,in Oland | 
North Carolina; 1783, taken by parents to Winsborough County, South ( 
from there in a few years to Wilson County, Tennessee; 1809, ordained as ar 
of the Christian (Campbellite) church; collected colony and emigrated to 
County, Illinois; 1818, moved to Indiana and founded a church near 
1822-1824, represented Sullivan County in Indiana House of Repres 
assisted in formation of first revised code for Indiana; 1835, again emi 
“Half Moon Prairie,” Marshall County, Illinois; 1847, member of Cons 
Convention; oldest member of Convention; 1859, delivered last sermon; 
to Eureka, Woodford County; in politics a Whig. 


Re. we ey ee EP ee ae ee er sty ae 1 ee 


APPENDIX | 973 


Chicago Democrat, 
August 17, 1847. 


August Io. 
business of today and yesterday was opened by prayer by the Reverend 
ae a Delegate from the county of Marshall. (Mr. Palmer is a plain, 
honest man, by his acts here manifesting a strong desire to do that 
al i be for best interest of State. His age is 66. He has frequently been 
upon to serve as chaplain. His language is plain, words few and expressive, 
unassuming, and he is listened to respectfully by all; and to many his 
reverential and expressive prayer is more than acceptable.’’) 
; “Hack Driver.” 


#7 Indiana Legislatice Manual for 1973, pp. 249, 284; Ford, History of Putnam 
arshall Counties, 155; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. r 


almer, John McAuley: born September 13, 1817, in Scott County, Kentucky; 
(831, resided with parents in Christian County, Kentucky; 1831, came to 
dison County, Illinois; 1834, entered Shurtleff College at Upper Alton; Decem- 

1838—March, 1839, taught school and studied law; December, 1839, admitted 
the bar and began practice of law at Carlinville; 1843-1847, 1848, probate judge 
‘Macoupin County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1849-1851, 
ity judge; 1852-1856 state senator; 1856, president of the first Republican 


ed for Congress; 1860, Republican presidential elector; 1861, member of 
ston Peace Conference; May, 1861, commissioned colonel of the Fourteenth 
Volunteer Infantry; November, 1861, advanced to rank of brigadier- 
ral; later major-general; September, 1866, resigned from military service; 
‘removed to Springfield; 1869-1873, governor of Illinois; three times un- 
Democratic candidate for United States Senate; (1877, 1883),1884, 
te to Democratic National Convention; 1888, unsuccessful candidate for 
9; 1891-1897, United States senator;. 1896, candidate of National (Gold) 
rats for president; last years spent in writing personal recollections; died 
ptember 25, 1900; in politics a Democrat till 1856, a Republican till 1872, 
ereafter a Democrat. Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1:429-441; Bateman 
d Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 412; United States Biographical 
jonary, Illinois Volume, 7-8; Biographical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 56-57; 
lopedia of Biography of Illinois, 2:407-409; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-19145 
138, 201, 361-363; Biographical Congressional Directory, 1774-1911, p- 906; 
ngsworth, 4 List of the Members. 


ed to the bar; 1837, settled at Peoria, Illinois; 1840, one of first vice-presi- 
of Illinois State Educational Society; 1847, member of Constitutional Con- 
; first president of Peoria County Educational Society; 1853-1856, judge 


C.; in politics a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of 
inois, 422; Palmer, Bench and Bar of Iilinots, 1: 306; Biographical Encyclopedia 
Q os 360; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 215; Bateman and Selby, 


974 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC’ 


Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Peoria County, 2:115-116, 1: 
worth, 4 List of the Members. — yn" 
Pinckney, Reverend Daniel J.: born 1817, in New York; professor 
Genesee Wesleyan Seminary; 1842, came to Illinois; 1842-1845, ; 1846-1847, 
1855, principal of Rock River Seminary (Mt. Morris); 1842-1858, 
Board of Trustees of Rock River Seminary; 1847, member of Constitu 
vention; 1850-1851, editor of Mt. Morris Gazette; 1854-1858, 1864-186) 
sentative in General Assembly; 1866-1870, state senator; 1876-1877, | 


Whig, later a Republican. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 364-365, 
Scott, Newspapers and Periodicals of Illinois, 252-253; History of Ogle 
H. F. Kett and Company, 475-477; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Powers, William B.: born 1811, in New Hampshire; 1838, came to 
mechanic at Quincy, Adams County; in politics a Democrat. History 7) 
County, 399; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Pratt, O. C.: born April 24, 1819, in Ontario County, New York; 18 
attended West Point, but resigned in order to complete study of law; 
mitted tothe barin New York; 1843, came to Galena, Illinois; lawyer at 
Jo Daviess County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1848, 
plains to Santa Fe, thence to California in service of government; 1848, 
associate justice of Supreme Court of Oregon; United States district | 
Territory of Oregon, later lieutenant-governor of Oregon; 1856, removed 
Francisco and engaged in private practice; 1859, elected judge of Twelfth 
District of California; died in Oregon; in politics a Democrat. Palmer, B 
Bar of Illinois, 1:514; The Works of Hubert Howe Bancroft, 24:223n ; 
IoIn, 102, 159, 162, 164, 167n; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Reynolds, Harmon G.: born December 21, 1810, at Moreau, Saratoga 
New York; reared in Berlin, Washington County, Vermont; 1837, | 
the bar at Montpelier, Vermont; 1837, came to Rock Island, Illinois; — 
school in Rock Island and Hampton; 1838, elected magistrate in 
1839-1847, probate justice; 1844-1846, editor of Upper Mississippian 
Island County; 1847-1849, postmaster of Rock Island; 1847, assistant 
of Constitutional Convention; 1849, 1861, assistant clerk of House of 
tives; 1850, removed to Cambridge, Henry County; 1850-1854, state 
1851, removed to Knoxville; 1853-1857, county judge of Knox Co 
appointed postmaster of Knoxville; 1858, removed to Springfield; 
editor of Masonic Travel; 1866-1867, editor of Odd Fellows’ Union; 
Blue Rapids, Marshall County, Kansas, where he spent remainder S 
politics a Democrat. Scott, Newspapers and Periodicals of Illinois, “30 
Portrait and Biographical Album of Rock Island County, 711, 747; Bater na 
Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Rock Island County, 1:644, JO 
712, 735; 2:971; History of Knox County, Charles C. Chapman and 
456, 464; Power, History of Springfield, 85-86; Hollingsworth, 4 List of 
bers. 


>< 


be 


Rives, George W.: born 1815, in Virginia; 1842, came to Illinois 


boy iit Sealab ON Ie a eR ai i ee ol) eee een Y 


“ 


¢ 


APPENDIX 975 


pe Ezekiel Wright: bias aot in New York: 1841, came to Tiitioss: 
er near Chester, Randolph County; 1844-1846, representative in General 


tics a Democrat. Blue Book of Illinois, 191 3-1914, p. 358; History of Randolph, 
fonroe, and Perry Counties, 124-126; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
"Robinson, Benaiah: born 1797, in North Carolina; 1809, came to [IlIlinois; 
ner near Edwardsville, Madison County; 1837-(1849) surveyor of Madison 
ty; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; removed to Oregon; in 
ics a Democrat. History of Madison County, 149-150, 154, 168, 348; Hollings- 
; A List of the eae als 


at ie Sacun: SE Clair County; uoice in Rin as 1838-1840, eee 
esentative in General Assembly; 1842, defeated for reélection by Gustave 
erner; 1851, 1854—1862, physician to the poor house; 1857-1861, county clerk; 
n office September, 1861; in politics a Democrat till 1842, thereafter a Whig. 
1e Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, Ppp. 353, 365; Memoirs of Gustave Koerner, 1:464; 
ten man and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, St. Clair County, 2:690, 
, 834; History of St. Clair County, Brink, McDonough and Company, 77-79; 
sworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Rountree, Hiram: born December 22, 1794, in Rutherford County, North 
olina; brought in infancy to Kentucky; in War of 1812, ensign under General 
lby, first governor of Kentucky; studied law in Bowling Green, Kentucky; 
1817, came to Madison County, Illinois; 1817-1821, taught school near Edwards- 
y eg} 1819, removed to Vandalia, Fayette County; 1821, removed to Hillsboro, 
mtgomery County; one of commissioners to organize the county; held the 
a) owing offices: first clerk of county commissioners court, first clerk of the circuit 
, first county recorder, justice of the peace, notary public, master in chan- 
ery, udge of probate, and postmaster of Hillsboro; 1826-1832, enrolling and 
ing clerk of the House of Representatives; 1832, captain in Black Hawk 
: 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1848-1852, state senator; 
852-1869, county judge; died March 4, 1873, at Hillsboro; in politics a Democrat, 
ra Republican. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 460; 
+, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 2:965-967; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, 
» 348, 360-361; Perrin, History of Bond and Montgomery Counties, part 1, 
5 206, 216, 222, 229, 245, 391; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

ates, Walter Bennett: born January 18, 1808, in South Boston, Halifax 
, Virginia; taken in infancy to a farm near Hopkinsville, Kentucky, where 
ineteen years of age, he worked with his father and attended school during 
winters; learned printer’s trade at Nashville; studied law at Louisville in the 
ce of Charles S. Morehead, later governor of Kentucky; 1831, admitted to the 
and removed to Frankfort, Franklin County, Illinois; county surveyor for a 
April, 1831, April, 1832, April, 1833, October, 1833, April, 1834, October, 
State’s attorney pro tem; January 18, 1836—December 26, 1836, attorney- 


976 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT 


general; lived at Vandalia, then the state capital, during that time; ‘De 
1836—February 15, 1841, circuit judge residing at Shawneetown; 1841, remov 
Mt, Vernon; February 15, 1841—January 11, 1847, June 6, 1853—June 28, 
judge of supreme court; 1855-1857, chief justice; 1847, member of Consti 
Convention, where he served as chairman of the Committee on Judiciar 
1853, engaged in mining and railroad enterprises; 1857, resumed practice to) 
in Chicago; 1862, volunteered in the army, commissioned major, and assi 
staff of General McClernand; was made assistant adjutant-general, mustere: 
in January, 1866, and afterwards brevetted lieutenant-colonel, colonel, and 
dier-general; July, 1866—July, 1869, collector of customs and ex officio cu 
of United States funds at Chicago; in politics a Democrat; died October 26, rf 
at Evanston, Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 466 
United States Biographical Dictionary, Mlinois Volume, 690-692; Palmer, 1 
and Bar of Ilinots, 1:35-36; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 142, 210 
Combined History of Randolph, Monroe and Perry Counties, 1805 Hollings 
List of the Members. 

Servant, Richard B.: born 1803, in Virginia; 1831, emigrated to Ranc 
County, Illinois; settled at Chester; 1835, first president of Board of Tru: 
Chester; 1835-1840, state senator; 1843-1845, receiver of public moneys at 
office at Kaskaskia; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; during pe 
1849-1874, served several terms as judge of Courity Court of Randolph Cou 
1855-1857, probate judge; in politics a Whig, later a Democrat. Combined 
of Randolph, Monroe and Perry Counties, 118, 121, 124-126, 286-287, 
Blue Book of Iilinois 1913-1914, Pp. 349, 351-352; Hollnetee A Lis 
Members. 

Sharp (Sharpe), Thomas C.: born 1818, in New Jersey; (1834, came to. 
lawyer at Warsaw, Hancock County; 1841-1843, 1844-1847, editor o 
Signal; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1853-1855, editor of 
Express; 1864-1865, editor of Hancock New Era; in politics a Democrat | 
later a Republican. Scott, Newspapers and Periodicals a Illinois, 3. 
Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. = 

Sherman, Francis Cornwall; born September 18, 1805, i in Newton, 
cut; April 7, 1834, arrived in Chicago; engaged principally in brick-maki 
building; 1835-1836, member of Board of Trustees of Chicago; 1837, 0 
aldermen; 1840-1845, county commissioner; 1841, 1862-1865, mayor of Cl 
1844-1850, representative in General Assembly; 1847, member of Cons: 
Convention; 1851-1853, chairman of Board of Supervisors; 1856, 18 
unsuccessful candidate for mayor; 1862, defeated in congressional electi 
November 7, 1870; in politics a Democrat. Biographical Encyclopedia of 
423; Currey, Chicago, Its History and Builders, 5:148-154; Andreas, Hi. 
Cook County, 348, 352; Moses, History of Chicago, 1:96, 103, 114-116, 133) 
138; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp- 358-359, 361; ae 
the Members. 

Shields, William: born 1812, in Tennessee; 1827, came to Illinois; 
near Paris, Edgar County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conventions 


yay, Dorice Dwight: born September 28, 1813, at Williamsburg, 
etts; 1834, went to Zanesville, Ohio; 1837, removed to Montgomery 
by y Hino, where he engaged in the mercantile business; June 3, 1841, 
d daughter of Hiram Rountree; county commissioner of Montgomery 

1843, removed to farm near Taylorville, Christian County; 1846-1848, 
tative in General Assembly; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
(858, merchant in Taylorville; major of state militia; 1857-1861, county 
of Christian County; 1857-1870, master in chancery; 1860, admitted to the 
formed law partnership with H. M. Vandeveer; died May 9, 1870; in 
>a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 
Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 359; History of Christian County, 64-65, 
5 124; McBride, Past and Present of Christian County, $3, 372-373; Hollings- 
worth, 4 List of the Members. 

_ Sibléy, John: born 1792, in Massachusetts; 1841, came to Illinois; farmer 
Richmond, McHenry County; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
3 1855-1857, county supervisor. History of McHenry County, Inter-State 
I hing Company, 219, 223; Hollingsworth, A List of the Members. 

; Sim, William: born 1795, in Aberdeen, Scotland; 1817, came to America; 
7) 1818, came to Illinois; first physician to settle at Golconda, Pope County; 
$28, representative in General Assembly; 1847, member of Constitutional 
ntion; died (1858) 1868; in politics a Whig. Bateman and Selby, Historical 
eyclopedia of Illinois, 480-481; Biographical Review of Fohnson, Massac, Pope 
lardin Counties, 287-288; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 345-3463 
History of Massac County, 48, 152-153; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
mpson, Lewis J.: born 1793, in Kentucky; 1807, came to Illinois; farmer 
iberty, Highland (now Adams) County; 1847, member of Constitutional 
ation; in politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Singleton, James Washington: born November 23, 1811, in Paxton, Virginia; 
ated at the Winchester Academy; 1829, removed to Indiana; (1830), settled 
Sc er County, Illinois, where he practiced medicine and studied law; 1833, 
ne to “Mt. Sterling, Brown County; lawyer and stock-raiser; 1844, elected 
er-general of the Illinois militia and identified with the “Mormon War”; 
1862, member of Constitutional Convention; 1850-1854, 1860-1862, repre- 
ve in General Assembly; 1852, removed to Quincy, Adams County; con- 
ous leader of peace party during the Civil War; 1868, defeated as candidate 
ess; 1879-1883, representative in Congress; 1882, defeated for reélection 
dependent Democrat; constructed the Quincy and Toledo (now part of the 
ash, and the Quincy, Alton and St. Louis (now part of the Chicago, Burlington 
y) railways, president of both companies; died April 4, 1892, at Baltimore, 
ryland; in politics a Whig, later 2 Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical 
eyclopedia of Illinois, 481; Palmer, Bench and jBar of Illinois, 1:2-3; Bio- 
ical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 484; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp- 195, 
363, 367; Redmond, History of Quincy and Its Men of Mark, 285-287; Bio- 


‘ se 


a sa bd ‘uy eA Tee ey 


Members. EN 
Smith, Edward O.: born (1817) 1818, in Minion County 
1837, came to Illinois; mechanic at Decatur, Macon County; 18475 
Constitutional Convention; 1848-1850, state senator; 1853, removed to 
where he became farmer and trader near San Jose; 1878, member of C 
Constitutional Convention; in politics a Whig. Blue Book of Illinois, 19 
p. 360; The Works of Hubert Howe Bancroft, 24:4043 aie A Lis 
Members. 
Smith, Jacob: born 1812, in Pennsylvania; 1839, came ra Tinois: 
at Galatia, Gallatin County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conventior 
politics a Democrat. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. er, 
Spencer, John Winchell: born July 25, 1801, at Vergennes, Vermont; 
came to St. Louis, but on account of slavery in Missouri removed to Green 
Illinois; 1820-1827, farmer in Greene County; 1828, removed to Morgan 
1829, removed to farm near Rock Island; 1831, first lieutenant in Bla 
War; 1833-1838, county commissioner of Rock Island County; 1841, r 
dam at Moline; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1849-185 
judge; 1852, became chief proprietor and manager of ferry between Rock 
and Davenport; died February 20, 1878; in politics a Whig. x 
Encyclopedia of Illinois, 295-296; Portrait and Biographical Album of ae 
County, 545-546, 704; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. : 
Stadden, William: born December 5, 1800, near Newark, Ohio; 
to LaSalle County; millwright by trade; 1834-1836, sheriff of LaSa 
1836-1843, state senator; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
October 13, 1849; in politics a Whig. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, 
352, 354; Thompson, Illinois Whigs before 7846, p. 136; History of LaSalle 
Inter-State Publishing Company, 1:217; 2:101; Baldwin, History @ 
County, 216, 221, 271-272; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Swan, Huchat born, June 9, 1797, in Lime, Connecticut; 1845, came 
County, Illinois; farmer in Fremont Township, near Libertyville; 18475 1 
of Constitutional Convention; 1850-1852, 1859-1860, 1868, county 
1868, chairman; 1850-1852, 1854-1856, representative in General 
1861, township assessor; died May 15, 1876; in politics a Whig 1 
became a Free esol later a Republican. Halsey, Hsin a Lake c 


1913-1914, pp. ee 364; Hotlnlesworehe A List of the Members. 
Thomas, William: born November 22, 1802, in Warren (now A i 
Kentucky; 1820-1822, deputy sheriff of Allen County; studied law at Br 
Green in office of James T. Morehead, afterward governor of Ken 
admitted to the bar; 1823-1826, practiced law in Bowling Green; 18: 
Jacksonville, Illinois; taught school; 1827, private in Winnebago 
1829, reporter for Vandalia Intelligencer; 1828-1829, state’s attorne 
Judicial Circuit; 1831-1832, quartermaster and commissary in Black | I 
1831- ae school Dist saga of ee ae te — t 


1839-1869, trustee of the Institution for the Deaf and Dumb at Jacksonville; 
> of first trustees of the Esra for the Insane at Jacksonville; 1847, 


d eel supporters a Illinois Female College. Bateman and Selby, Historical 
yelo edia of Illinois, 522; Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1:337; 2:1095;3 
States Biographical Dictionary, Mlinois Volume, 827-830; Blue Book of 
, 1913-1914, Pp- 213, 259, 261, 349, 351-352; Eames, Historic Morgan and 
ane 123, mays 243) 323-326; Pua A List iy the as 


9, moved to Peoria County, Illinois; 1842-1846, state senator; 1844, 
in educational convention at Peoria; 1847, member of Constitutional 
in; died February 24, 1850, at Brimfield, Peoria County; a farmer; in 
es a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 
ria County, 2:469; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 355, 357; Hollings- 
th, 4 List of the Members. 
ornton, Anthony: born November 9, 1814 (1817), near Paris, Bourbon 
Kentucky; 1831-1833, attended high school at Gallatin, Tennessee, and 
ollege, Danville, Kentucky; 1834, graduated from Miami University, 
6, admitted to the bar; 1836 (1838), settled at Shelbyville, Illinois, where 
ractice of law; 1847, 1862, member of Constitutional Convention; 
-1852, representative in the General Assembly; 1865-1867, representative 
“ones gress; 1870-1873, judge of Supreme Court of Illinois; 1873, first president 
ta ar Association; 1879, removed to Decatur; 1881, returned to Shelbyville; 
mber 10, 1904; in politics a Whig, then a Democrat; (later a Repub- 
eman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 522; Palmer, 
Bar of Illinois, 1: 458-459; Biographical Congressional Directory, 1774- 
Pe 055; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 193, 210, 362; Bateman and 
ce storical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Shelby County, 2:686, 689, 729-730, 
ollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
rower, Thomas B.: born November 15, 1806 (1809), in Albemarle County, 
a; taken in infancy to Kentucky; (1826-1829), studied medicine and taught 
0, removed to Shelbyville, Illinois; 1830-1836, engaged in practice of 
e at Shelbyville; 1836, removed to Charleston, Coles County, 1834-1836, 
: esentative in General Assembly; 1839, resumed headed of medicine at Charles- 


980 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTI 


assessor of Warren County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conventi 
1850, representative in General Assembly; in politics a Whig. Blue 
Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 360; Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of J 
Warren County, 2:738, 753; Portrait and Biographical Album of Warre 
Chapman Brothers, 708; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. ; 

Turner, Oaks: born 1809, in Maine; 1834, came to Illinois; 1834-1848, 
clerk of Putnam County; 1838-1847, circuit clerk; 1839-1847, county reco 
1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 1848-1849, 1855-1859, 
treasurer; in politics a Whig. Ford, History of Putnam and rie feo Cou 
148; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Tutt, William: born 1811, in Virginia; physician; 1830, came ae 
County, Illinois; practiced medicine; 1838, removed to Marshall; 1847, r 
Constitutional Convention; in politics a Democrat. Perrin, History of Ci 
and Clark Counties, part 2, pp. 294, 303, 344. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the 

Tuttle, James: born 1806, in Ohio; 1840, came to Illinois; fa: 
Waynesville, DeWitt County; 1847, member of Constitutional Conven ‘ior 
politics a Whig. Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Vance, John W.: born 1782 in Germany; in (1822) emigrated to the 
States; brother of Governor Joseph Vance of Ohio; 1823, came from Ol 
Danville, Vermilion County, Illinois; 1823 (1824), leased and developed salt 
very prominent in affairs of county at an early day; 1832-1838, state s 
1847,:member of Constitutional Convention; died 1856 (1857); in politi 
Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 348-349, 351; Jones, History of 
County, 1:137, 405; 2:113; Beckwith, History of Vermilion County, 
Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 

Vernor, Zenas H.: born 1808, in North Carolina; 1829, came to 
farmer near Nashville, Washington County; 1847, member of Consti 
Convention; 1848-1850, representative in General Assembly; in politi $a 
crat. Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, p. 360; Hollingsworth, 4 List of # 
bers. (iy Se 

Wead, Hezekiah Morse: born June 1, 1810, in Sheldon, Frankli 
Vermont; attended winter term of village school until seventeen years old 
six months attended academy at Castleton, Vermont; clerk for merch; it 
Rutland, Vermont; worked passage on canalboat to Pittsford, New Yo: 
he taught school and began study of law; 1832, admitted to the bar; ta 
in Akron, Ohio; 1836-1837, practiced law in Vermont in partnership y 
Seth Cushman; 1837-1840, taught school in New Jersey; 1840, came to 
Fulton County, Illinois; 1845, aided in preparation of memorial to Ge: 
bly on common-school education; 1847, member of Constitutional | 
1852-1855, circuit judge of Tenth Circuit; 1855, removed to Peoria, w 
successful career as a lawyer; 1861, moved to farm near Peoria; died M. 
in politics a Democrat; allied himself with Anti-Repudiationists; oppos 
and supported government in war, but continued allegiance to Democra 
Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1:4, 310, 315-320; Blue Book of Iilinos: 
1914, p. 215; History of Fulton County, Charles C. Chapman and Compa 


' APPENDIX 981 


an Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Peoria County, 2: 635; Rice, 
ry of Peoria, 2:171-172; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
a lebber, Thomson (Thompson) R.: born October 6, 1807, in Shelby County, 
ucky; 1824-1832, taught school; 1832, came to Illinois; 1834-1837, engaged 
BE dantile business in Urbana; first postmaster in Urbana, appointed by Jack- 
p rved for fifteen years; 1833-1853, clerk of county court; 1833-1846, clerk of 
‘court; 1834-1874, master in chancery; 1847, 1862, member of Constitu- 
Convention; close friend of Lincoln and David Davis; died December 14, 
‘in politics a Democrat. Biographical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 110-111; 
an and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, Champaign County, 2:669, 
94, 1050; Portrait and Biographical Album of Champaign County, Chapman 
ers, 946; History of Champaign County, Brink, McDonough and Company, 
108; Hollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
_ West, Edward M.: born May 2, 1814, in Botetourt County, Virginia; 1818, 
ght to Illinois; 1829-1831, clerk in recorder’s office and deputy postmaster at 
ingfield; 1833-1835, clerk in United States land office at Edwardsville; 1835- 
3 54) 1867, engaged in mercantile business at Edwardsville; 1839-1845, county 
rer; 1845-1851, county school commissioner; papeain in Illinois National 


nember of Methodist church; died October 31, aia in politics a Whig, 
a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of Illinois, 583; 
of Madison County, 150, 152-154, 168, 170, 172, 180, 338, 356-357, 556; 
llingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 
Whiteside, John Davis: born 1794 (1795) (1798), at Whiteside Station, Mon- 
roe County, Illinois; farmer; 1824-1828, county commissioner; 1825-1828, clerk 
0 f Circuit Court; 1830-1836, 1844-1846, representative in General Assembly; 1836, 
dential elector; 1836-1837, state senator; March 4, 1837—-March 6, 1841, 
‘treasurer; 1842, second to General Shields in Lincoln-Shields duel; appointed 
esident Polk as commissioner to confer with British government regarding 
nois bonds; 1846, adjutant-general, organizing and training volunteers in 
san War; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; died 1850, at place 
th; in politics a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of 
401s, 139, 586; Greene and Thompson, Governors’ Letter-Books, 1840-1853, p 
6n; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 141, 201, 348-351, 358; Combined 
History of Randolph, Monroe and Perry Counties, 160-161, 449; Hollingsworth, 
List a the Members. é 
itney, Daniel Hilton: born 1808, in New York; 1834, came to Illinois; 
ian at Belvidere, Boone County; 1836, first census enumerator of Winnebago 
munty; 1836-1837, recorder of Winnebago County; 1840, favored Wisconsin’s 
mnexation of disputed territory; 1847, member of Constitutional Convention; 
died February 17, (1862), 1864, at Belvidere; in politics a Whig. History of 
Vinnebago County, H. F. Kett and Company, 239-240, 244-245, 391-392, 404; 
hurch, History of Rockford and Winnebago County, 53-54) 75-76, 163, 202, 2643 
ollingsworth, 4 List of the Members. 


Senate; 1854, defeated as candidate for Congress; because. of advanc 
declined seat on United States Supreme Bench; 1861, appointed Un ed L 
district judge for Kansas; died September 21, 1863, at Quincy; in po 
later a Republican. Bateman and Selby, Historical Encyclopedia of 
Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1:2, 182-183; 2: 880; Blue Book of 7 
1914, PP. 348-349, 352-353; reed of Adams ee 415, cate 


doorkeeper of the House; 1847, doorkeeper pro tem and sergeant-at-arms ; 
stitutional Convention; 1852-1854, 1856-1858, representative in Gener 
died in Eitan in politics a a Democrat. Blue Book of Illinois, 19137 i D) 


ven 302, 7533 iallincaworeh, A List of the Members. ; 3 

Witt, Franklin: born 1804, in Tennessee; 1814, brought to Pop 
Illinois; 1826, settled in Cass County; 1827, removed to farm near | 
County; justice of the peace; es iSiee representative in General 4 


672, aan Miner, Past and Present of Gis Caan 308; Hollingswor 
the Members. i! 
Woodruff, Ralph: born 1806, in New York; 1834, came to Illini 
near Ottawa; March—August, 1839, county commissioner of LaSalle C 
one of commissioners to locate county seat of DuPage County; 
1847, assistant doorkeeper of Constitutional Convention; died 1850; 
Democrat. Baldwin, History of LaSalle County, 215, 217, 2333; Histor; 
County, Inter-State Publishing Company, 1:216; Bateman and ae i 
Encyclopedia of Illinois, DuPage County, 2:640; Holiness ae 
Members. 
Woodson, David Meade: born May 18, 1806, in Teseuatteet 
tucky; educated in private schools and at Transylvania University 
with his father; 1832, member of Kentucky legislature; 1834, remo 
ton, Greene County, Illinois; 1835, returned to Transylvania | 
graduated with honor; 1837-1839, county judge; 1839-1840, sta 
1843, Whig candidate for Congress against Stephen A. Douglas; 18 
member of Constitutional Convention; November 1, 1848—Dec 
judge of the Supreme Court of Illinois; 1848, judge of the First Judic: 
died 1877; in politics a Whig, later a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Hi 
Encyclopedia of Illinois, 599; Palmer, Bench and Bar of Illinois, 1:4 
1096; Blue Book of Illinois, 1913-1914, pp. 210, 214, 355, 371; Histor 


APPENDIX 98s 


-502; Miner, Past and Present of Greene County, 61, 338-342; 
of the Members. 


drug, farm he hI and lumber ae 1843-1848, 

1843- 1855, postmaster of White Hall; 1847, member of 
oe 1852-(1885), township school trustee; 1853-1859, 
y justice, 1856-1858, 1862-1866, state senator; 1859-1871, trustee 
or the Deaf and Dumb at Jacksonville; 1860-1891, one of the 
‘acksonville branch of the Chicago and Alton Railroad; 1873- 
dge; 1876, delegate to Democratic National Convention; died 
pests in politics a Democrat. Bateman and Selby, Historical os 


; Be cits, 591-592, 655-657, 660-661, eae es 691, 1101; 
List of the Members. 


BIBLIOGRAPHY 


= / 
a 
- , 


vO @ oe 


BIBLIOGRAPHY 


I 
Srate PusicaTions AND DocumMENTS 


of the State of Illinois, 1913-1914. Compiled and published by Harry 

ds, secretary of state (Danville, 1914). 

ja Blue Book or State Roster, 1911. Compiled by Frank C. Jordan, secre- 

of state . . . . (Sacramento, 1913). 

Book of Information for the Year 1870, giving a general view of the State 

linois and its government . . . . Compiled by Edward Rummel, secretary 

: (Springfield, 1870). | 

nund J. (ed.), The Territorial Records of Illinois (Springfield, 1901) 

State Historical Library, Publications, number 3}. 

! e Convention, Assembled at Springfield, Fune 7, 1847, in Pursuance of an 
the General Assembly of the State of Illinois . .. . for the Purpose of 

tering, Amending, or Revising the Constitution of the State of Illinois (Spring- 

Id, 1847). 

lof ‘the House of Representatives of the Fifteenth General Assembly of the State 

f Ii inois . . . . 1846-1847 (Springfield, 1846). 

‘the Senate of the Fifteenth General Assembly of the State of Illinois .... 

847 (Springfield, 1846). 

‘State of Illinois . . . . 1846-1847 (Springfield, 1847). 

Edward, Rummel’s Tilinois Hand-Book and Legislative Manual for 1871 

. (Springfield, 1871). 

ndiana Legislative Manual for 1973. . . . Compiled. . ... by Demarchus 

own, state librarian (Indianapolis, 1913). 

. (ed.), I/inois Constitutions (Springfield, 1919). [Collections of the 

‘State Historical Library, volume 13]. 


— 


II 
NEWSPAPERS 


legr aph and Democratic Review, 1847-1848, Alton. 
Beacon, 1847-1848, Aurora. 

Gazette, 1847, Beardstown. 

Advocate, 1847-1848, Belleville. 

: Fournal, 1847-1848, Chicago. 


987 


988 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLEC t 


Sangamo Fournal, 1847, Springfield. September 23, 1847, then name became 
Fournal. 

State Register, Tri-weekly, 1847-1848, Springfield. 

Western Citizen, 1846-1848, Chicago. 


Ill 


BiocrapuHicaL Works 


Bench and Bar of Chicago, Biographical Sketches, American Biographical Put 
Company (Chicago, n.d.). ing 
Biographical Congressional Directory, with an outline history of the national 
1774-1911 . . . . Government Printing Office (Washington, 1913). 
Biographical Enaelanene of Illinots of the Nineteenth Century, oar BE 
Company (Philadelphia, 1875). 
Caton, John D., Early Bench and Bar of Illinois... _(Ciitensey 1893). : 
Encyclopedia of Banas of Iilinois, The Century Publishing and tac 
pany, 2 volumes (Chicago, 1892). 
French Manuscripts, letters to Augustus C. French in McKendree College [ 
Lebanon, Illinois. {a 
Koerner, Gustave Phillip, Memoirs of Gustave Keener 1809-1896, | 
written at the suggestion of his children. Edited by Thomas J. McC 
. . « . (Cedar Rapids, 1909). ne 
Lincoln, Abraham, The Writings of Abraham Lincoln, federal edition. E 
Arthur B. Lapsley, 8 volumes (New York, 1905-1906). ! Ye 
Nicolay, John G., and John Hay, Abraham Lincoln, a History, 10 volum 
York, 1890). 
Nicolay, John G., and John Hay (ed.), Abraham Lincoln, Complete works, ail - 
his speeches, letters, state papers, and miscellaneous writings, 2 vole 
York, 1894). 
Palmer, John M., Personal Recollections of Fohn M. Palmer, The story f an 
life (Cipeae 1901). 
Palmer, John M., (ed.), The Bench and Bar of Lilinois, pisvoriedl ands remii 
volumes (Chicago, 1899). b. 
Peck, John M., Forty Years of Pioneer Life, Memoir of Fohn Mason Pec 
Edited frie his journals and correspondence by Rufus et 
1864). a 
Reynolds, John, My Own Times: Embracing also the History of my His SA 
(Chicago 1879). 5 % 
Sturtevant, Julian M., Fulian M. Sturtevant: An Autobiography, edited iy 
Sturtevant, Jr. (New York, 1896). 
United States Biographical Dictionary and Portrait Gallery of Eminent aed 
Men, Illinois Volume, American Biographical Publishing bao. c 
1883). 
White, Horace, The Life of re Trumbull (Boston and New York, 1913). y. 


BIBLIOGRAPHY 989 


IV 


Speciat Works 


nthony, Elliott, The Constitutional History of Illinois (Chicago, 1891). 


: :, John Williston, Bacaional History of Illinois; growth and progress in educa- 
al affairs of the state from the earliest day to the present (Chicago, 1912). 
son, Alexander, and Bernard Stuvé, 4 Complete History of Illinois from 1673 
7884... . (Springfield, 1884). 

Niels H., The Veto Power of the Governor of Illinois (Urbana, 1917) [University 
of Illinois Studies in the Social Sciences, volume 6]. 

e, George W., The Development of Banking in Illinois, 7817-1863 (Urbana, 
13) [University of Illinois Studies in the Social Sciences, volume 2). 

» Lhomas, 4 History of Illinois from its commencement as a State in 1878 to 1847, 
containing a full account of the Black Hawk War, the rise, progress and fall of 
Mormonism, the Alton and Lovejoy riots, and other... . events (Chicago, 


ie, Evarts B., and Clarence W. Alvord (ed.), Governors’ Letter-Books 1818- 
1834 (Springfield, 1909) [Collections of the Illinois State Historical Library, 
olume 4]. 

e, Evarts B., and Charles M. Thompson, Governors’ Letter-Books, 1840-1853 
(Springfield, 1911) [Collections of the Illinois State Historical Library, volume 7]. 
ne, Evarts B., The Government of Illinois, its history and administration . . 
(New York, 1904). 

is, Norman D., History of Negro Slavery in Illinois and of the Slavery Agitation 
in that State (CiiGco. 1906). 

: John, Illinois, Historical and Statistical, comprising the essential facts of its 
growth as a Province, County, Territory and State, 2 volumes (Chicago, 1880). 

e, Theodore C., The Frontier State (Springfield, 1918) [Centennial History of 
Illinois, volume 2]. 

, Burt E., The Movement for Industrial Education and the Establishment of the 
University, 1840-1870 (Urbana, 1918) [Semi-Centennial History of the University 
of Illinois, volume 1]. 

Franklin W., Newspapers and Periodicals of Illinois, 1814-1879 (Springfield, 
110) eaiecrions ae the Illinois State Historical Library, volume 6]. 

nson, a E., “The Constitutional Conventions and the Constitutions of 
a iiss State Historical Society, Transactions, 1903 (Springfield, 


Andreas, A. T., History of Cook County, Illinois, from the earliest Pe r 


Bateman, Newton, and Paul Selby (ed.), Historical Be 


Les (Chictuos 1884-1886). 


Time (Chicago, 1884). 


(Chicago, 1900). Following the publication of the Encycloy 


which the Encyclopedia constitutes the first, the county hiseoeyh 
The following histories of this series have been used in the Da 
volume: . 
History of Carroll County, Edited by Charles L. Hostetler frolume 
1913). 
History of Cass County, Edited by Charles A. E. Martin rol 
1915). i 
History of Champaign County, Edited by Joseph O. Cunningh L 
(Chicago, 1905). 
History of DuPage County .... by special authors and contribut 
(Chicago, 1914). 
Historical Encyclopedia; History of Fulton County. Edited: by J 
Chicago, 1908). 
Illinois, Historical; Lawrence County, Bigrapheee Edited by it 
McCleave (Chicago, I9io0). t 
Historical Encyclopedia; History of Kane County. Edited by Joh 
(Chicago, 1904). ; ; 
History of Kendall County .... by special authors and contribu 
(Chicago, 1914). 

Historical Encyclopedia; History of Knox County, Edited by 
and George Candee Gale (Chicago, 1899). PS 
Historical Encyclopedia; History of Lake County. Edited” Yi 
Partridge (Chicago, 1902). 
Historical Encyclopedia; History of Lee County. Edited by A 6: 
(Chicago, 1904). hanya: 
Historical Encyclopedia; History of McDonough County. “Bui 
McLean (Chicago, 1907). 
History of McLean County. Edited by Ezra M. Prince and John Fy 
[volume 2] (Chicago, 1908). al 
History of Peoria County. Edited by David McCulloch volume 2 
and Peoria, 1902). i 


St. Clair County. Edited by A. S. Wilderman and A. A. Wilderman 
; 2] (Chicago, 1907). 


Encyclopedia; History of Schuyler County. Edited by Howard F. 
‘Chicago, 1908). 
of Shelby County. Edited by George D. Chafee [volume 2] (Chicago, 


of Tazewell County. Edited by Ben C. Allensworth [volume 2] (Chi- 
905). 

of Warren County. Edited by Hugh R. Moffet Ao Thomas H. Rogers 
e 2] (Chicago, 1903). 

t a W., History of Vermilion County, together with historic notes on the 
st, gleaned from early authors, old maps and manuscripts, private and 
ial corespondence . .. . (Chicago, 1879). 


a 8 (ed.), History of Wieae County, Illinois . . with numerous 


) ical and Reminiscent History of Richland, Clay and Marion Counties, 
, B. F. Bowen and Company (Indianapolis, 1909). 

1 Review of Fohnson, Massac, Pope and Hardin Counties, Illinois, con- 
biographical sketches of prominent citizens ........ Biographical 


S. J., History of McDonough County, Illinois, its cities, towns and villages, 

with early reminiscences, personal incidents . . . . (Springfield, 1878). 

d History of Edwards, Lawrence and Wabash Counties, Illinois, with illus- 
/ ations descriptive of their scenery and biographical sketches of some of their 

p minent men and pioneers. J. L. McDonough and Company (Edwardsville, 


Fi es ot Randolph, Monroe and Perry Counties, Illinots, with illustrations 


d pioneers. J.L. McDonough and Company (Edwardsville, 1883). 
‘ative Biographical and Historical Record of Kane County, Illinois, con- 
ing full page portraits and biographical sketches of prominent citizens, together 
th portraits and biographies of the governors of Illinois . . . Beers, Leggett 
id Company (Chicago, 1888). 

arshal M., History of Ferseyville, Illinois, 1822 to rgor (Jerseyville, 1901). 
Cumberland, Fasper and Richland, Illinois, Historical and Biographical, 
jattey and Company (Chicago, 1884). 


992 + ~‘ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECT! 


Currey, J. Seymour, Chicago: Its History and lis Builies a Century 
Growth, 5 volumes (Chicago, 1912). ‘ 

Duis, E., The Good Old Times, McLean County, Illinois, fonitasane two hu 
sixty-one sketches of old settlers . . . . (Bloomington, 1874). 

Eames, Charles M., Historic Morgan ahd Classic Facksonville. Compiled oe 
Charles M. aines . ... with introduction by Prof. Harvey W. Mil 
(Jacksonville, 1885). 

Erwin, Milo, History of Williamson County, Illinois, from the aten nies down 
the present, with an accurate account of the secession movement... . 
1876). ‘4 

Ford, Henry A., History of Putnam and Marshall Counties; embracing an acco 
the eclameie early progress and formation of Bureau and Stark Counties; 
an appendix, containing notices of old settlers .... (Lacon, 1860). ae 

Goodspeed, Weston, and Daniel Healy (ed.), History of Cook County, Illinoi. 
@ general survey of Cook County history, including a condensed history 9 
and special account of districts outside the city limits . . . ¢ 20 volumes < 
1909). : 

Gross, Lewis M., Past and Present of DeKalb County, Illinois, 2 volumes 
1907). ug 

Halsey, John J. (ed.), 4 History’of Lake County, Illinois, (Oded: ig » ae 

History of Adams County, Illinois, containing a history of the county, its cit 

. . @ biographical directory of its citizens... . general and local 
portraits of early settlers and prominent men .... Murray, Willi 
Phelps (Chicago, 1879). 

History of Carroll County, Illinois, containing a history of the county, its citi 

. a biographical directory of its citizens, war record of its volunteers ti th 
rebellion ....H.¥F. Kett and Company (Chicago, 1878). 

History of Champaign County, Illinois, with illustrations descriptive of its sce: f 
biographical sketches of some of its prominent men and pioneers, Brink 
Donough and Company (Edwardsville, 1878). - 

History of Christian County, Illinois, with illustrations descripittes of its sce 
biographical sketches of some of tts prominent men and pioneers. “ 
_ Donough and Company (Edwardsville, 1880). 


citizens of the county. Pioneer Publishing Company (Chicago, 1910) 
History of Fulton County, Illinois; together with sketches of its cities . . 

tional, religious, civil, military, and ict history, portraits... 

raphies of representative citizens .... Charles C, Moore sy : 

(Peoria, 1879). 

History of Gallatin, Saline, Hamilton, Franklin and Williamson Cian 

from the earliest time to the present; together with . . biographical 

. The Goodspeed Publishing Company (Chicasa! 1887). 

History of Greene County, Illinois, . . . containing a history of the county; 

. a biographical directory of its citizens . . . . portraits of its early 

and prominent men ... . Donnelley, Gassette anal Loyd, Publishers ( 


1879). 


BIBLIOGRAPHY 993 


tory of Greene and Fersey Counties, Illinois, together with sketches of the towns 
_. ... educational, civil, military and ieee history; portraits .... and 
_ biographies of representative men... . Continental Historical Company 
ASS (Springfield, 1885). 
ye History of Fackson County, Illinois, with illustrations descriptive of its scenery, and 
_ biographical sketches of some of its prominent men and pioneers. Brink, Mc- 
Donough and Company (Edwardsville, 1878). 
History of Knox County, Illinois; together with sketches of the cities . . . . record of 
its volunteers in the late war, educational, religious, civil and military history 
_,... and biographical sketches . . . . Charles C. Chapman and Company 
_ (Chicago, 1878). 
tory of La Salle County, Illinois, together with sketches of its cities... . educa- 
| tional, religious, civil, military and political history . . . . Inter-State Publish- 
ing Company, 2 volumes (Chicago, 1886). 
‘ory of McHenry County, Illinois, together with sketches of its cities .. . . educa- 
tional, religious, civil, military, and political history, portraits... . and 
biographies of representative citizens . . . . Inter-State. Publishing Company 
(Chicago, 1885). 
istory of Madison County, Illinois, with biographical sketches of many prominent 
_ men and pioneers, W. R. Brink and Company (Edwardsville, 1882). 
story of Marion and Clinton Counties, Illinois, with illustrations descriptive of the 
scenery, and biographical sketches of some of the prominent men and pioneers, 
_ Brink, McDonough and Company (Edwardsville, 1881). 
istory of Menard and Mason Counties, Illinois, containing a history of the counties 
.... portraits of early settlers and prominent men... . O. L. Baskin and 
Company, Historical Publishers (Chicago, 1879). 
istory of Morgan County, Illinois... . containing a history of the county... . 
a biographical directory of its citizens ... . portraits of its early settlers and 
prominent men .. . . Donnelley, Loyd and Company (Chicago, 1878). 
istory of Ogle County, Illinois, containing a history of the county, its cities... . a 
biographical directory of its citizens . . . . portraits of early settlers and promi- 
_ nent men ....H.F. Kett and Company (Chicago, 1878). 
History of Pike County, Illinois; together with sketches of its cities . . . . educational, 
_ religious, civil, military, and political history . . . . Charles C. Chapman and 
‘Company (Chicago, 1880). 
History of St. Clair County, Illinois, with illustrations of its scenery, and biographical 
sketches of some of its prominent men and pioneers, Brink, McDonough and 
Company (Edwardsville, 1881). 
tory of Sangamon County, Illinois; together with sketches of its cities... . edu- 
- cational, religious, civil, military, and ee history; portraits... . and 
biographies of representative citizens . . . . Inter-State Publishing Company 
- (Chicago, 1881). 
istory of Wayne and Clay Counties, I: Ilinois, Globe Publishing Company, Historical 
Publishers (Chicago, 1884). 


994 ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLE 


History of Winnebago County, Illinois . . . . containing a 
. . @ biographical directory of its citizens... . ; 
prominent men ....H.¥F. Kett and Company (Chicago, rf 
Jones, Lottie E., Bisa i Vermilion County, Illinois, a tale of its evo 
ment and progress . . . . 2 volumes (Chicago, 1911). ( 
McBride, J. C., Past and Present of Christian County, Ting 
1904). 


Shaves oh many of its prominent ... . citizens and ilstrious de 
1906). i 
Matson, Nehemiah, Map of Bureau County, Illinois, with sketches oe its 
ment (Chicago, 1867). 
Miner, Edwards, Past and Present of Greene County, Illinois (Chicago, 1 
Moore, Roy L., History of Woodford County, a concise history of the se 
growth of Woodford County (Eureka, 1910). 
Moses, John, and Joseph Kirkland, History of Chicago, Illinois, 2 vale 
1895). oh 
Page, O. J., History of Massac County, Illinois, with life sketches and 
(n.p., n.d.) 
Past and Present of Kane County, I. Hinois, containing a history of the county 
directory of its citizens... . portraits of early settlers and prom: 
. William LeBaron, ea and Company (Chicago, 1878). a 
Parting William H., (ed.), History of Bond and Montgomery Countie 
(Chicago, 1882). 
Perrin, William H., (ed.), History of Cass County, Iinbis (Chicago, 188 
Perrin, William H., (ed.), History of Crawford and Clark Counties, Illinois 
1883). 
Portrait and Biographical Album of Champaign County, Illinois, donde 
portraits and biographical sketches of prominent ... . citizens... 
with portraits and biographies of all the governors of Illinots . . 
Brothers (Chicago, 1887). 


portraits and biographical sketches of prominent... . citizens. Baie 

’ with portraits and biographies of all the governors of Illinois... . 

Brothers (Chicago, 1883). 

Portrait and Biographical Album of McLean County, Iinois, containing. 

portraits and biographical sketches of prominent... . CBTERS mt 

with portraits and biographies of all the governors of Illinois . 
Brothers (Chicago, 1887). 


portraits and biographical sketches of prominent... . citizens .. . 
with portraits and biographies of all the governors of Illinois... . Bio 
Publishing Company (Chicago, 1885). 

Portrait and Biographical Album of Warren County, Illinois, containing 
portraits and biographical sketches of prominent .... hie Ve siete 
with portraits and biographies of all the governors if Illinois... e 
Brothers (Chicago, 1886). 


1a p) Sad Record of Winnebago and Boone Counties, Illinois, contain- 
xl sketches of prominent... . citizens, together with biographies 
gvernors of the state... . Biographical Publishing Company 
2). RS 
roll, History of Springfield, Illinois, its... . advantages for 
nufacturing, etc. (Springfield, 1871). 
: H., History of Quincy, and its Men of Mark, or facts and figures 
advantages and resources, manufactures and commerce (Quincy, 


coria, City and County, Illinois, a record of settlement, organization, 
achievement, 2 volumes (Chicago, 1912). 

ed.), History of Du Page County, Illinois, (Aurora, 1877). 
“all s History of Fefferson County, Illinois (Indianapolis, 1909). 


INDEXES 


zustus, amendments, 203, 
18; appointment to committee 
e, 65; biographical notice of, 
arks, 617; resolutions, 43. 
e W. (John W.), amend- 
,702; appointment to com- 
6; biographical notice of, 
rks, 754, 860. 
lis, appointment to commit- 
5, 66; “igen notice of, 


appointment to 
Baa biige; 65; biographi- 
ice of, 950. 

William R., addresses, 98—99, 
434-438; amendments, 23, 
4542 615, 77% 793; appointment 
mm mittees, 65, 66, 159, 774; bio- 
ical notice of, 950; remarks, 23, 
> 127, 155, 183, 462, 540, 621, 
9s 795» 811, 888; reports, 190; 
utions, 46, 71. 

ig, George W., amendments, 
6545 V Gases 766, 772, 784, 800, 
appointment to committees, 
biographical notice of, 950; 
551, 723; resolutions, 24; 

tes, 520, 763-764, 767. 

n, Martin, amendments, 805; 
ent to committee, 65; bio- 
al notice of, 950; remarks, 


LOR AT SEIT Car hee 


INDEXES 


INDEX OF NAMES 


Ballingall, Patrick, addresses, 534-539; 
amendments, 309, 608-609; appoint- 

“ment to committees, 65, 514, 775; 
biographical notice of, 950; remarks, 
532 59, 62, 86, 519, 521, 542, 549, 787; 
resolutions, 7-8; request to with- 
draw, 66; substitutes, 854. 

Bargar, John S., biographical notice of, 
gn. 

Bergen, John G., biographical notice of, 
22n, 

Blair, Montgomery, address, 123; ap- 
pointment to committee, 66; bio- 
graphical notice of, 951. 

Blakely, William H., appointment to 
committee, 65; biographical notice of, 
951. 

Bond, Benjamin, addresses, 417-419, 
933; amendments, 353, 855; appoint- 
ment to committee, 66; biographical 
notice of, 951; remarks, 3, 13, 
287, 723, 724; resolutions, 3, 201, 722. 

Booth, Louis M., appointment to office, 
¥. 

Bosbyshell, William, addresses, 651- 
654, 922-923; amendments, 444, 610, 
871; appointment to committees, 65, 
514, 777; biographical notice of, 951; 
petitions, 787; resolutions, 201. 

Brockman, James, amendments, 67, 
303, 644, 870; appointment to com- 
mittee, 65; biographical notice of, 
951; remarks, 112, 182, 200, 202, 219, 
397, 516, 883, 942; petitions, 395; 
remarks, 58, 176, 939; resolutions, 9, 
48; substitutes, 731. 


999 


1000 


Brown, George T., addresses, 828-831; 


amendments, 774, 827, 834; - appoint- 
ment to committees, 65, 769; bio- 
graphical notice of, 951; remarks, 
110, 832, 833; resolutions, 350, 447. 

Bunsen, George, appointment to com- 
mittee, 66; biographical notice of, 
951; resolutions, 284. 

Butler, Horace, addresses, 566-569; 
amendments, 514; appointment to 
committee, 66; biographical notice 
of, 952; petitions, 305; remarks, 371, 
618, 643; 763; resolutions, 300; 
substitutes, 655. 


Caldwell, Albert G., addresses, 680-683, 


689-693, 757-759; amendments, 285, 
333> 499s 623, 644, 703, 772, 845-846; 
appointment to committees, 65, 66, 
769; biographical notice of, 952; 
remarks, 108, 507, 617, 623, 630, 659, 
7035 711, 724, 742, 757, 776, 780, 808, 
846; request to withdraw from com- 
mittee, 66; substitutes, 498, 507, 709, 
710, 729, 928-929. 

Campbell, James M., amendments, 613, 
804, 889; appointment to committee, 
66; biographical notice of, 952; 
remarks, 298; resolutions, 47, 83, 196, 
298. 

Campbell, Thompson, addresses, 31-37, 
76-78, 451-452, 475-481, 516-518, 
572-577, 816-817, 822-823, 831-833, 
848-849, 900-921; amendments, 22, 
83, 385, 389, 475, 802, 888; appoint- 
ment to committees, 65, 775, 7773 
biographical notice of, 953; remarks, 
68, 88, 156, 241, 247, 362, 384-386, 
479, 488, 516, 521, 557-558, 796, 
842, 848, 923, 925; resolutions, 46, 
71, 250, 349; request to withdraw 
from committee, 238; substitutes, 
379, 899. 

Canaday, John, appointment to com- 
mittee, 66; biographical notice of, 
953; resolutions, 251, 897. 


Carter, Thomkel B., es 


committee, 65; biographic 


of, 953. 7 
Casey, Franklin S., amendoaell 
appointment to committee, 6 
graphical notice of, 953. 
Casey, Zadoc, appointment to con 
tees and offices, 1, 65, 770, 
biographical notice of, * 95 
marks, 513, 630, 841, 844; 
250, 3403 par re 276, 3345 
628. 
Choate, Charles, appointment 
mittee, 66; biographical notice 
Church, Selden M., amendment: 
453, 515, 819, 864; appoi 
committee and office, 66; 
cal notice of, 954; remar! 
160, 204, 219; resolutions, 8 
Churchill, Alfred, amendment 
393, 404, 626, 644; appoi 
committee and office, 66; 
cal notice of, 954; remarks, 


166, 241, 618, 723; reports 
resolutions, 196; request tow 
248. 


Cline, William J., paninte 
door-keeper pro tem, I. 
Cloud, Newton, addresses, 

826; biographical notice 
elected president, 4; petiti 
Colby, Eben F., amendmen 
appointment to committee, 
graphical notice of, 955; 
540; resolutions, 889. 
Constable, Charles H., amen 
186, 401, 443, 778; appoi 
committee, 65, 775; biog 
notice of, 955; remarks, 
195, 196, 200, 241, 2445 7 
787, 803, 851, 887; resolu on 
190, 201, 721, 775; substitu 
Crain, John, amendments, 649 
ment to committee, 66; bi 
notice of, 955; remarks, 72 
628, 640, 730. 


bert J., amendments, 307, 
405, 785; appointment to 
ee, 65, 777; biographical 
of, 955; petitions, 324, 457, 
resolt tions, 250. 
amuel J., appointment to com- 
66; biographical notice of, 956. 


ichael G., addresses, 375-378, 
jo; amendments, 361, 375, 454; 
tment to committees, 65,775; 
graphical notice of, 956; petitions, 
arks, 128, 788, 854. 

avid, addresses, 461-462, 753- 


appointment to committees, 66, 
_ biographical notice of, 956; 
tions, 171; remarks, 113, 120, 
ot 218, 661, 7355 753, 812, 842, 8435 
esol ion, 82. 

ames M., addresses, 128-130, 
9-371, 569-572, 850-851, 861-862; 
endments, 24, 100, 309, 393) 449, 
7 (ona 648, 739, te 871, 921, 


. biographical notice of, 956; 
n rks, 19, 51, 58, 60, 63, 75, 92, 100, 
12, 120, 128, 161, 163, 166, 196, 339, 
391, 401, 510, 522, 618, 624, 650, 
672, 756, 780, 795, 805, 850-852, 
; resolutions, 44, 84, 291. 

homas, G. C., addresses, 28-29, 
0-434, 494-497, 558-566, 748-751, 
938; amendments, 453, 514, 792; 
ointment to committees, 65, 159, 
5; biographical notice of, 957; 
narks, 75> 95> 327s 3393 479» oe 


sc John, addresses, 818; amend- 
ents, 357, 444, 608, 626, 628, 632, 
5,817; appointment to committees, 
5; biographical notice of, 957; 
arks, 818; reports, 673; resolu- 


INDEXES 


IOoI 


Deitz, Peter W., amendments, 152, 174, 
200, 308, 727, 736, 772, 8733; appoint- 
ment to committee, 66; biographical 
notice of, 957; petitions, 424; substi- 

' tutes, 925. 

Dement, John, addresses, 16-19, 177- 
179 491-494, 683-685, 751-753, 931- 
933; amendments, 612, 688,721; 
appointment to committees, 65, 514; 
biographical notice of, 957; remarks, 
50, 51, 53, 67, 68, 163, 177, 214, 240, 
642, 649, 658, 661, 663, 669, 670; 
reports, 124, 189, 673; resolutions, 
67,71, 942; substitutes,89o. 

Dresser, Charles, biographical notice of, 
42n. 

Dummer, Henry E., appointment to 
committees, 65, 159,774; biographical 
notice of, 958; petitions, 524. 

Dunlap, James, amendments, 668; 
appointment to committee, 65; ap- 
pointed teller, 4; biographical 
notice of, 958. 

Dunn, Harvey, appointment to com- 
mittee, 66; biographical notice of, 
958. 

Dunsmore, Daniel, appointment to 
committee, 66; biographical notice 
of, 958; resolutions, 42. 


Eccles, Joseph T., amendments, 200, 
498, 805, 823; appointment to com- 
mittee, 65; biographical notice of, 
958; remarks, 193, 506, 840; report, 
90; resolutions, 636, 942; substitutes, 
806, 855. 

Edmonson, John W. F., amendments, 
71; appointment to committees, 65, 
159; biographical notice of, 959; 
resolutions, 70, 109, 943, substitutes, 
520. 

Edwards, Cyrus, addresses, 171-174, 
346-349, 885-887; amendments, 511, 
802; appointment to committees, 65, 
66, 513; biographical notice of, 959; 
remarks, 52, 54, 249, 398, 512, 623, 


1002 


Edwards, Cyrus (cont.) 

821; reports, 673, 927, 931; request 
to withdraw, 247; resolutions, 7, 21, 
43» 345-346, 878; substitutes, 5, 354, 
885. 

Edwards, Ninian W., amendments, 303, 
310, 356, 482, 728, 773, 820, 824, 868; 
appointment to committee, 66; bio- 
graphical notice of, 959; petitions, 
787, remarks, 89, 162, 332, 358, 385, 
407; substitutes, 5, 334, 700, 928. 

Evey, Edward, appointment to com- 
mittees, 65, 514; biographical notice 
of, 959; remarks, 185; resolutions, 44. 

Ewing, James T., biographical notice 
of, 960. 


Farwell, Seth B., amendments, 649, 760 
7723 appointment to committee and 
office, 65, 66, 159, 514; biographical 
notice of, 960; petitions, 82, 395, 498; 
remarks, 449, 624, 671, 706, 756. 

Frick, Frederick, appointment to com- 
mittee, 65; biographical notice of, 960. 


Geddes, Thomas, addresses, 227; | 


amendments, 119, 386, 703, 713, 720, 
765; appointment to committee, 
65; biographical notice of, 960; re- 
marks, 99, 155, 196, 485, 647, 762; 
resolutions, 48, IgI. 

Graham, James, appointment to com- 
mittee, 66; biographical notice of, 
960; remarks, 438, 821; substitutes, 
793 

Green, Henry R., appointment to com- 
mittee and office, 65; biographical 
notice of, 960; remarks, 39, 301, 371, 
850, 921. 

Green, Peter, appointment to commit- 
tee, 65; biographical notice of, 960. 
Green, William B., appointment to 
committee, 65; biographical notice 

of, 961. 

Gregg, David L., addresses, 165, 438- 

440, 528-534, 675-677, 839-840, 933- 


1595 feet Bits al 
~ remarks, 86, 166, , 2395 


47%, 508, 539 545, 548, 5 


45n; resolutions conce 
457- pik 
Harding, Abner C., add 
amendments, 154, 
appointment to comm 
graphical notice of, 96 
195, 245; substitutes, 3 
Harlan, Justin, appoi 
mittees, 65, 159, 514, 
ical notice of, 962. 
Harper, Joshua, appointm 
mittee and office, 65, 774 
ical notice of, 962. © 
Harvey, Curtis K., addresses, 
amendments, 94, 310, 323, ¢ 
657, 720, 728, 800, 868, 8 f 
ment to committees 


103, 156, 195, 268, 
647, 732, 776, 780, 8825 
314, 3153 resolutions, 43 
498, 508. 
Hatch, Jeduthan, appein 
mittee, 653 biogra 
962; remarks, 388. 
Hawley, Nelson, amendr 
appointment to co: 
graphical notice of, 9 
356; a, ee 


895; amendments, 455, 846, 


4425 790, 810, 847, 852, 926; 
(I, 267, 289, 730; resolu- 


euben E., appointment to 
ee, 65; biographical notice 
. Hugh, amendments, 291; 
t to committees, 65, 514, 
raphical notice of, 964; 
ns, 7; remarks, 168, 362, 581. 
ge H., appointment to com- 
f . 159; biographical notice 


es M., amendments, 443, 

765, 802; appointment to 

s, 65, 159; biographical 

964; remarks, 152, 623, 813; 
ates, 170, 637, 767. 

Wil am H., amendments, 824; 


| notice of, 964. 
Samuel, appointment to 
e and office, 65, 159; bio- 


y , 786. 
John, appointment to com- 
s, 65, 66; biographical notice of, 


n, Aaron C., appointment to 
mittees, 66, 159; biographical 


Pore) INDEXES 


1003 


9 addresses, 99, 810- | Jenkins, Alexander M., addresses, 220- 


221; amendments, 448; appointment 
to committee, 66; biographical notice 
of, 965; petitions, 636; remarks, 89, 
II2, 119, 220; reports, III, 315, 469; 
resolutions, 45, 315; substitutes, 855. 

Jones, Humphrey B., amendments, 488, 
514, 773; appointment to committee, 
65; biographical notice of, 965; peti- 
tions, 104; remarks, 619; reports, 186. 

Judd, Thomas, appointment to com- 
mittee, 65; biographical notice of, 
966. | 


Kenner, Alvin R., amendments, 123, 
200; 403, 444, 484, 514, 645, 699, 720, 

- 804; appointment to committee, 66; 
biographical notice of, 966; remarks, 
148, 176; resolutions, 195, 201; sub- 
stitutes, 927. 

Kinney, Simon, amendments, 881; ap- 
pointment to committees, 66, 514; 
biographical notice of, 966; remarks, 
396, 623, 843; substitutes, 68, 297. 

Kinney, William C., addresses, 524-527; 
amendments, 47, 508; appointment 
to committees, 65, 66, 514; biographi- 
cal notice of, 966; petitions, 457; 
remarks, 47, 89, 643; reports, 314; 
resolutions, 250. 

Kitchell, Alfred, addresses, 677-680; 
amendments, 47, 310, 455, 488, 613, 
865, 866; appointment to committee 
and office, 66, 159; biographical 
notice of, 966; remarks, 60, 154, 507, 
619, 677; resolutions, 195; substi- 
tutes, 200, 633, 851. 

Knapp, Augustus R., addresses, 661— 
666; appointment to committees, 
65, 159; biographical notice of, 967; 
remarks, 792, 880; resolutions, 457; 
substitutes, 359, 375, 631. 

Knapp, Nathan M., amendments, 392, 
819; appointment to committee, 66; 
biographical notice of, 967; resolu- 
tions, 48, 83, 388. 


1004 


Knowlton, Lincoln B., addresses, 222, 
582-607; amendments, 22, 386, 726; 
appointment to committees, 65, 66, 
775; biographical notice of, 967; 
petitions, 395; remarks, 38, 78, 97, 
180, 185, 246, 332, 339, 581, 795, 812; 
resolutions, 290; substitutes, 765, 
845. 

Knox, James, amendments, 397, 608; 
appointment to committee, 65; bio- 
graphical notice of, 967; remarks, 
180; resolutions, 170. 

Kreider, George, appointment to com- 
mittee, 66; biographical notice of, 
968. 


Lander, Samuel, appointment to com- 
mittee, 66; biographical notice of, 
968. . 

Lasater, James M., appointment to 
committees, 65, 66; biographical 
notice of, 968. 


Laughlin, William, appointment to 
committee, 65; biographical notice 
of, 968. 


Lavely, William, biographical notice 
of, 968. 

Lemon, George B., amendments, 361, 
836; appointment to committee, 66; 
biographical notice of, 968. 

Lenley, Isaac, appointment to commit- 
tee, 66; biographical notice of, 968. 
Lockwood, Samuel Drake, amendments, 

361, 403, 488, 628, 702, 726, 806, 819, 
866; appointment to committee, 65; 
biographical notice of, 968; remarks, 
362, 384, 405, 733, 7633 reports, 111; 
resolutions, 108, 387, 942; substitutes, 

764, 865. 

Logan, Stephen T., addresses, 13-17, 
39-41, 365-367, 396-397; | amend- 
ments, 24, 49, 119, 160, 170, 174, 307, 
335s 360, 369, 407, 445, 448, 514, 630, 
637, 658, 674, 784, 868, 889, 924, 9253 
appointed teller, 4; appointment to 
committees, 65, 66, 514, 769; bio- 


26, 33» 395 48, 495 51, 57 
121, 123, 156, 163, 167, 20 
287, 301, 331, 358, 402, 40°. 
659, 826, 841, 851, 889, 926; 
wre resolutions, 5, 768; snd 


Lona John T., addresses, 
amendment, 202; poi 


appointment to committees, 
biographical notice of, 969 
155, 520, 542, 548, 550, 61 
776, 805, 813, 860; 
44, 201; substitutes, 09, 
874. 

McClure, William, appointmen 
mittees, 65, 1595 esi) 
of, 969. 

McCulley, John, appoineiene a 
mittee, 66; biographical - nc 
969. 

McHatton, Alexander, appoin 
committee, 66; be 
of, 970. 

Manly, Uri; appointment ' 
tees, 65, 514, 7743 biogray aphit 
of, 9703 Wer <— 
926. ee 

Markley, David, ache 
695, 708, 729, 766, 799) | 81 
835; appointment to commit 
biographical notice of, 97: 
120, 643, 888; resolution, 2 
tutes, 656, 785. 

Marshall, Franklin S. D., 
ments, 84, 444, 488; appoii 
committees, 65, 7753 st 
notice of, 970; petitions, 6 
tions, 250. 


Phomas A., appointment to 
mmittee, 65; biographical notice 
970; substitutes, 767. 


aphical notice of, 970; 
[; resolutions, 43. 


remarks, 


e, John, appointment to commit- 
65; biographical notice of, 971. 
Robert, appointment to com- 


all, William A., addresses, 409- 
al 744-748; amendments, 2, 335, 
I; appointment to committees, 65, 
: biographical notice of, 971; 
be _ remarks, 2, 12, 59, 74, 138, 203, 287, 

341, 410, 618; resolutions, 42, 153; 


et appointment to com- 
paeaphical notice of, 


is core, Henry W., appointment to 
7% am 1, 55 biographical notice EF 971. 


chols, Jacob M., appointment to com- 
ittee, 66; biographical notice of, 971. 


sag Jesse O., addresses, 210-212; 
_ amendments, 94, 210, 386; appoint- 
_ment to committee, 66; biographical 
_ Rotice of, 971; remarks, 63, 95, 110, 
163, 362. 


a te ie Biel ed ° ee Rae 


INDEXES 


1005 
Oliver, John, appointment to commit- 
tee, 65; biographical notice of, 971. 


Pace, George W., appointment to com- 
mittee, 65; biographical notice of, 
971. 

Palmer, Henry D., amendments, 803, 
865; appointment to committee, 65; 
biographical notice of, 971; remarks, 
20, 53, 57> 73> 182, 618, 795. 

Palmer, John M., addresses, 754-756; 
amendments, 46, 488, 771; appoint- 
ment to committees, 65, 159; bio- 
graphical notice of, 973; remarks, 49, 
51, 61, 118, 169, 199, 317, 330 704, 
754, 762, 763, 764, 776, 790, 826, 848, 
863; reports, 769; resolutions, 8, 44, 
389, 446. 

Peters, Onslow, addresses, 458-461; 
amendments, 392, 458, 515, 698, 726; 
appointment to committees, 65, 769; 
biographical notice of, 973; remarks, 
27, 79, 407, 458, 522, 616, 723; 
resolutions, 43; substitutes, 482, 762. 

Pinckney, Daniel J., addresses, 205- 
207; appointment to committees, 65, 
159; biographical notice of, 974; 
remarks, 105, 241, 842, 862. 

Powers, Williams B.; amendments, Io0o, 
736; appointment to committee, 65; 
biographical notice of, 974; resolu- 
tion, 250. 

Pratt, O. C., addresses, 552-555, 578- 
580, 713-715; amendments, 24, 702, 
739741; appointment to committees, 
65, 159, 769; biographical notice of, 
974; remarks, 52, 161, 242, 401, 762, 
794, 861, 895, 925, 938; substitutes, 
69, 85, 741, 764, 896. 


Rives, George W., appointment to com- 
mittee, 65; biographical notice of, 
974- 

Robbins, Ezekiel W., addresses, 79-81; 
amendments, 43, 54, 488, 611, 648, 
771,775; appointment to committee, 


1006 


Robbins, Ezekiel W. (cont.) 
65; biographical notice of, 975; peti- 
tions, 104, 312, 446, 722; remarks, 67, 
649; resolutions, 24, 46, 199. 

Robinson, Benaiah, appointment to 
committee, 66; biographical notice 
of, 975. 

Roman, William W., amendments, 516, 
626; appointment to committee, 65; 
biographical notice of, 975; remarks, 
840. 

Rountree, Hiram, amendments, 90, 285, 
307, 511; appointment to committee, 


65; biographical notice of, 975;  re-. 
marks, 59, 68, 181, 193; 195, 630; | 


resolutions, 45, 192; substitutes, 68, 
383. 
’ ow 
Scates, Walter B., addresses, 29-31, 90— 
92, 138-143, 743; amendments, 124, 
190, 307, 309, 361, 515, 625, 627, 644, 
732, 802, 925; appointment to com- 
mittees, 4, 65, 66, 514, 774;  bio- 
graphical notice of, 975; remarks, 1, 
25 35 13) 47 515 79, I10, 137; 193, 2445 
262, 324, 327, 3325 5425 732s 742s 7875 
792, 801, 898, 926; reports, 106, 108, 


383, 939; resolutions, 1, 43, 44, 
45, 191, 250, 774; substitutes, 
785. 


Servant, Richard B., amendments, 190, 
456, 484, 796; appointment to office, 
65, 774; biographical notice of, 976; 
petitions, 312, 340; remarks, 56, 57, 
185, 244, 407, 475; reports, 498; 
resolutions, 250, 302; substitutes, 
761. i 

Sharp, Thomas C., amendments, 354; 
appointment to committee, 65; bio- 
graphical notice of, 976; resolutions, 
250; substitutes, 359. 

Sherman, Francis C., amendments, 152, 
654; appointment to committee, 65; 
biographical notice of, 976; remarks, 
6, 52, 153, 519, 555, 617, 646, 658, 
667, 713; reports, 106, 775. 


ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLL. 


-Stadden, William, amendme 


A Byry NIK, 
pe he 
cr ONS 
Gj 


Shields, William, amend 
pointment to iy 0 
graphical notice of, 97 
242; resolutions, 46. 

Shumway, Dorice D. 
To1, 488, 499, 514, 
appointment to com ? 
biographical notice o: 9775 
52, 246, 287; resolu ns, 65, 
83, 301; substitutes, 9, 83 


Bait 


Sibley, John, amendment, O25, 


petitions, 761; biograp! 
977; substitutes, 353+ 
Simpson, Lewis J., appoint: me 
mittee, 66; biographical 
977; remarks, 883; r 
Singleton, James W., 
I Eh 2095-2075 : 


251; substitutes, 768, 8 
Smith, Edward O., addresses 
amendments, 773; aj 
committee, 66; oe hic 


pointment to c 
biographical noticé of, 
tions, 83.00) / Wm ,: 
Spencer, John W., appelae ent 
mittees, 65, 514; biograph al ni 
978; petitions, 356; 


appointment to commit 
777; biographical notice of, ¢ 
Swan, Hurlbut, amendments, 
pointment to committ : 
graphical notice of, 978. 


am, address, 186-188; 
t to committees and 
66, 769; biographical notice 
» 978; amendments, 356, 385, 454, 

726,727, 7973 ¥ emarks, 2, 53, 62, 
1 166, 169, 193, 521-522, 617, 
543, 733; reports, 186, 289; sub- 
es, 160, 626, 


aendments, 210, 309, 323, 393, 
My » 855, 866; aPpoiengne to 
biographical 


! Piiecaphical notice of, 979. 
asia ngs 3925 


53 fein, 357. 
er, Oaks, appointed to committee 
nd cae 66; poerphical notice of, 


»Vv illiam, appointment to commit- 
: tips . biographical notice of, 980. 

| James, addresses, 835-836; ap- 
ent to committee, 66; bio- 


ment to committees, 65, 159; 
hical notice of, 980; substi- 


s H., appointment to com- 
5; biographical notice of, 
lutions, 201, 250. 


jah, addresses, 9-11, 116- 
2, 399-401, 621-623, 862— 
amendments, 72, 308, 309, 484, 


INDEXES 


Wead, Hezekiah (cont.) 
456, 489, 805; appointment to com- 
mittee and office, 65, 514, 775, 7773 
biographical notice of, 980; petitions, 
312, 457, 775; remarks, 38, 73, 78, 
155, 317, 358, 512, 670, 776, 777, 
862; reports, 395, 807; resolutions, 
9, 48, 191, 290; substitutes, 819, 
845. 

Webber, Thompson R., appointment to 
committee, 65; biographical notice 
of, 981. 

West, Edward M., addresses, 827-828; 
amendments, 633, 771, 803, 805, 868; 
appointment to committees, 65, 159; 
biographical notice of, 981; remarks, 
III, 191, 214, 388, 619, 827; resolu- 
tions, 160. 

Whiteside, John D., amendments, 308, 
644, 727, 798, 836, 869, 931; appoint- 
ment to committees, 66, 159; bio- 
graphical notice of, 981; remarks, 49; 
reports, 289; substitutes, 403. 

Whitney, Daniel H., addresses, 145- 
147, 856-860; amendments, 170, 556, 
870; appointment to committee, 159; 
biographical notice of, 981; remarks, 
38, 60, 154, 159, 616, 790, 800, 856; 
substitutes, 864. 

Williams, Archibald, addresses, so1- 
505, 882-883; amendments, 307, 308, 
323; 360, 660, 868, 880; appointment 
to committees, 65, 514, 777;  bio- 
graphical notice of, 981; remarks, 4, 
7T> 195 525 555 57> 59, 635 95, 148, 315, 
323 542, 643, 646, 650, 660, 732, 783, 
880, 882-883; resolutions, 284; sub- 
stitutes, 819. 

Wilson, J. A., appointment to offices, 1, 
s; biographical notice of, 982. 

Witt, Franklin, amendments, 162, 456, 
628, 728, 788; appointment to com- 
mittee, 65; biographical notice’ of, 
982; substitutes, 778, 779. 

Woodson, David M., addresses, 92-94, 
419-423, 424-425, 879-880; amend- 


Wes) NOH Ap Vite ; 


1008 ILLINOIS: 


of 


AL C 


Woodson, David M. (cont.). 
ments, 196, 401, 404, 625, 636, 675; 
814; appointment to committee, 66; 
biographical notice of, 982; remarks, 
37-38; 50, 63, 64,92, 401; 547,677,705, | 
879, 895; resolutions, 42, 43, 69, 71; | 485 


a? 
‘* 


II 


INDEX OF ARTICLES AND SECTIONS 


Article 1, boundaries, state. 
Article 2, distribution of powers of 


government, section 1, distribution of 
powers; section 2, no department to 
exercise powers of others. 


Article 3, the legislative department, 


section I, general assembly, legisla- 
tive power; section 2, general assem- 
bly, members, election of; section 3, 
general assembly, qualifications, rep- 
resentatives; section 4, general as- 
sembly, qualifications, senators; sec- 
tion 5, general assembly, senators, 
terms of; section 6, general assembly, 
members, number of; section 7, gen- 
eral assembly, members, disabilities 
of; section 8, general assembly, ap- 
portionment according to population; 
section 9, general assembly, senato- 
rial and representative districts, for- 


- mation; section 10, general assembly, 


senatorial and representative dis- 
tricts, excess population; section 11, 
general assembly, time of meeting; 
section 12, general assembly, officers 
of, quorum; section 13, general 
assembly, journal, yeas, nays; sec- 
tion 14, general assembly, right of 
protest; section 15, general assembly, 
general rules, punishment of mem- 
bers; section 16, general assembly, 
vacancies; section 17, general assem- 
bly, privileges; section 18, gen- 
eral assembly, punishment, power 
of; section 19, general assembly, ad- 
journment and open sessions; sec- 
tion 20, general assembly, laws, 
style of; section 21, general assembly, 


1009 


Article 3 (cont.) 


procedure on bills; section 22, general 
assembly, fees and salaries, restric- 
tions; section 23, general assembly, 
requirements for bills and acts; 
section 24, general assembly, mem- 
bers, compensation of; section 25, 
general assembly, members, pay; 
section 26, appropriations, for ex- 
penditures; section 27, impeachment, 
power of; section 28, impeachment, 
officers liable to judgment; section 
29, general assembly, ineligibility; 
section 30, oath, officers; section 31, 
officers, disqualification by crime; 
section 32, general assembly, general 
laws on divorce; section 33, compen- 
sation, no extra; section 34, suits 
against state; section 35, lotteries, 
state banks or bank charters not 
authorized by general assembly; 
section 36, special legislation pro- 
hibiting sale of lands; section 37, 


' appropriations, deficiency of; section 


38, credit of state not to be given; 
section 39, contracts for supplies; 
section 40, apportionment of senators 
and representatives by district; sec- 
tion 41, canvass of votes for general 
assembly; proposed section, general 
assembly, prohibition of special privi- 
leges or exemptions. 


Article 4, the executive department, 


section I, executive power; section 2, 
governor, election; section 3, gover- 
nor, term of office; section 4, gover- 
nor, qualifications for; section 5, 
governor, residence and salary; sec- 


IOIO 


Article 4 (cont.) 
tion 6, governor, oath; section 7, 
governor, message to general assem- 
bly; section 8, pardon, power of; sec- 
tion 9, governor, power over other 
offices; section 10, general assembly, 
special sessions; section 11, gover- 
nor, army and navy, commander-in- 
chief; section 12, governor, power of 
appointment; section 13, governor, 
power to adjourn general assembly; 

“section 14, lieutenant governor, elec- 
tion, term, qualifications; section 15, 
lieutenant governor, rights of; section 
16, speaker of the senate; section 17, 
lieutenant governor, compensation; 
section 18, lieutenant governor, suc- 
cession to; section 19, governor, suc- 
cession to; section 20, governor, 
vacancy; section 21, governor, veto 
power; section 22, secretary of state; 
section 23, auditor of public accounts; 
section 24, state treasurer; section 25, 
seal of state; section 26, impeach- 
ment, officers subject to; proposed 
section I, attorney general, proposed 
to abolish; 
officers, no life term; proposed section 
3, Offices, one lucrative office at a 
time. 

Article 5, the judiciary department, 
section 1, courts, judicial power 
vested in; section 2, supreme court, 
members, quorum; section 3, supreme 
court, grand divisions; section 4, 
supreme court, judges, term of; sec- 
tion 5, supreme court, jurisdiction; 
section 6, supreme court, terms; 
section 7, circuit courts, judges and 
districts; section 8, circuit courts, 
terms and jurisdiction; section 9, 
supreme and circuit court, vacancies; 
section 10, judges, salaries and eligi- 
bility to other offices; section 11, 
judges, eligibility; section 12, judges, 
removal; section 13, judges, election, 


proposed section 2,- 


Article 6, election and A 


Article 5 (cont.) 
time of; section 14, si 
time of election; 
courts, judges; se 
courts, provided for. 
county courts, judges, electi 
term of; section 18, 
jurisdiction; section - 


constitution; 
peals from local courts; s 
officers, county, removal; 
process, form of; section 275 J 
of the peace; section 28, 
attorney; section 29, Ci 
supreme courts, clerks, term 
compensation; section 30, | 
court, grand division for elec 
judges; section 31, sup! em 
places of meeting; section 32 
and writs of error; secti 


¥ 


sion for alters 


cation for; section rage 
ballot; section 3, electo: 
section 4, electors, exemp 
tary duty; section 

residence not lost by ak 


dence; section 8, pare) 
cation, infamous crime; secti al 
elections, general, cher in 


INDEXES IOII 


Article 7 (cont.) 

counties striking off or adding terri- 
tory; section 5, county seats, re- 
moval; section 6, township organiza- 
tion; section 7, sheriff, term of; pro- 
posed section, county officers, coroner, 
surveyor, election of. 

Article 8, militia, section I, persons 
subject to service; section 2, exemp- 
tions; section 3, officers, election; 
section 4, officers, election of generals; 
section 5, commissioned by governor; 
section 6, privileges. 

Article 9, the revenue, section 1, taxa- 
tion, capitation tax; section 2, taxa- 
tion, uniform rule, special taxes; 
section 3, taxation, exemption; sec- 
tion 4, taxation, redemption from tax 
sales; section 6, taxation, powers of 
general assembly; proposed section, 
form of payment. 

Article 10, corporations, section 1, 
corporations, organization of by 
general law; section 2, corporations, 
dues; section 3, banks, no state 
banks; section 4, banks, liability of 
stockholders; section 5, banking cor- 
porations, referendum required; sec- 
tion 6, corporations; proposed sec- 
tion, acts of incorporation, amend- 
ment to or repeal of. 


Article 13 (cont.) 


section 2, sovereignty of the people; 
section 3, conscientious objectors, 
exempt from jury; section 4, office, 
no religious test for; section 5, elec- 
tions, free and equal; section 6, jury, 
trial by; section 7, searches and 
seizures; section 8, due process of law; 
section 9, accused persons, rights; 
section Io, grand jury; section 11, 
double jeopardy and eminent domain; 
section 12, justice free and prompt; 
section 13, habeas corpus; section 14, 
penalties proportional to offense; 
section I5, imprisonment for debt; 
section 16, slavery and involuntary 
servitude; section 17, ex post facto 
law, contracts, obligation of, and bills 
of attainder; section 18, banishment 
prohibited; section 19, government, 
principles; section 20, civil power, 
military subordination; section 21, 
assembly and petition, right; section 
22, soldiers, quartering; section 23, 
press and speech, freedom; section 
24, evidence, jury in libel suit; section 
25, dueling, punishment; section 26, 
dueling, special oath concerning; 
proposed section, taxation. 


Schedule, section 1-26, section 6, 


county commissioners’ court; section 


18, English language to be used; pro- 
posed section, seat of government, 
change of. 

Article 14, negroes, immigration and 


Article 11, commons, section 1, rights 
in common in certain lands. 

Article 12, amendments to the consti- 
tution, section 1, constitutional con- 


vention, how called; section 2, 
amendments to constitution. 

Article 13, liberty and free government, 
section 1, life, liberty and property; 


emancipation of in State; proposed 
section, restrictions in marriage and 
office. 


Article 15, state debt tax. 


. Accused person, rights (art. 13, sec. 9), 


865, 944. 

Amendments to constitution (art. 12, 
sec. 2), 199, 200-201, 927, 928, 944. 
See constitutional convention. 

Appeals and writs of error (art. 5, sec. 
32), 888, 890, 944. 

Appointments, see governor. 

Apportionment, see general assembly. 

Appropriations, deficiency (art. 3, sec. 
37), 66, 71, 353, 728-729, 944; for 
expenditures (art. 3, sec. 26), 67, 308, 
699, 944. 

Arbitration tribunal, 108. 

Assembly and petition, right of (art. 13, 
sec. 21), 871, 944. 

Attorney general, 793. 

Auditor of public accounts (art. 4, sec. 


23), 190, 514-515, 741. 


Ballot, see suffrage. 

Banishment prohibited (art. 13, sec. 18), 
870, 944- 

Banking laws, system of, 85-98, 101, 
104, 109. 

Banks, banking corporations, referen- 
dum required (art. 10, sec. 5), 301, 
313-314, 640, 648-657, 669-673, 675- 
688, 695, 703, 729, 944; charters from 
general assembly (art. 3, sec. 35), 109, 
721, 944; liability of stockholders 
(art. Io, sec. 4), 313-314, 641, 645, 
688, 693, 9443 no state banks (art. 10, 
sec. 3), 69-70, 85-89, 101, 164-170, 
251, 252-266, 267-283, 289, 291, 312, 
314, 640, 645-648, 695, 703-719, 729, 
734, 944; (proposed section) 251, 
314, 614, 660, 668, 807, 872. 


III 


INDEX OF SUBJECTS 


Bills, see general assembly. 

Bills of attainder (art. 13, sec. 17), 867, 
870, 944. 

Boundaries, state (art. 1), 837, 944. 


Canvass of votes for general assembly 
(art. 3, sec. 41), 878, 944. 

Capital punishment, 85, 111. 

Circuit courts, clerks: compensation, 
duties, terms of (art. 5, sec. 29), 83, 
797-798, 944; election of (art. 5, sec. 
21), 83, 806, 944; 

judges: district apportionment of 
(art. 5, sec. 7), 83, 499, 500-513, 800- 
801, 944; time of election (art. 5, sec. 
15), 804-805, 944; 

terms and jurisdiction (art. 5, sec. 8), 
83, 801, 944; vacancies, 801-802, 944. 

Civil power, military subordination (art. 
13, sec. 20), 871, 874, 944. 

Committee, of the whole: convention 
resolved into, 62, 251, 267, 276, 284, 
291, 297, 302, 305, 307, 308, 315, 319, 
334s 350, 356, 360, 375, 383, 391, 392, 
395» 403» 424, 442, 448, 453, 458, 462, 
469, 488, 490, 498, 514, 515, 5245 540, 
551, 581, 613, 615, 625, 629, 632, 637, 
640, 651; resolutions referred to, 50, 
170, 267; 

on bill of rights, 65, 83, 84, 191, 201, 
305, 485, 521, 688, 787, 942; on 
division of state into counties and 
organizations, 65, 111, I91, 284, 315, 
469; on education, 65, 82, 171, 174, 
238-250, 284, 289, 290, 305, 356, 3955 
424, 457, 485, 498, 524, 615, 769, 898; 
on elections and right of suffrage, 65, 
84, 105, 158, 170, 446, 787; on execu. 


1013 


1014 


Committee (cont.) 
tive department, 65, 71, 111, 250; on 
finance, 43, 65, 70, 106, 170, 191, 4575 
775, 884; on incorporations, 65, 69, 
85, IOI, 109, 164, 251, 289, 291, 300, 
301, 312-315; on judiciary, 65, 71, 
82, 106, 108, 109, 159, 250, 315, 383, 
424; on law reform, 65, 160, 195, 267, 
289, 312, 446, 730, 890; on legislative 
business, 43, 65, 71, 83, 124, 162, 189, 
195, 201, 284, 305; on militia and 
military affairs, 65, I91, 289; on 
miscellaneous subjects and questions, 
65, 290, 628, 636, 638, 640, 730, 884; 
on organization of departments, and 
officers connected with executive 
department, 65, 84, 159, I90, 250, 
305; on revenue, 65, 71, 83, 90, 186, 
192, 250, 289, 340, 809; on revision 
and adjustment of the articles of the 
‘constitution adopted by this conven- 
tion, and to provide for the alteration 
and amendment of the same, 65, 199, 
515, 695, 742, 807, 836, 873, 878, 890, 
927, 9315 939» 9425 9445; on rules, 7; 
special and select: on agriculture, 
other resources and internal improve- 
ments, 196, 800, 939; on commons, 
340, 809; on judiciary, 513, 673; on 
schedule, 774, 926, 939; on senatorial 
and representative districts, 159, 722, 
812, 874, 879; on townships, 43, I91, 
395; to compare printed copy of con- 
stitution with enrolled one, 945; to 
divide the state into grand divisions, 
768-769, 887; to prepare address to 
people, 775, 941; to procure trans- 
lations of constitution resolutions, 
889. 
Commons, rights in common in certain 
lands (art. 11), 201, 809, 944. 
Compensation, no extra (art. 3, sec. 33), 
67, 310, 720, 944. 
Constitution, copies for distribution, 
775; delivery to secretary of state, 
942; signing of, 945; submission of, 


‘Constitutional convention, 


Constitution een ho 
43, 839, 841, 9395 vo 
of, 944. 

Conscientious ahjeciees 
jury (art. 13, sec. 3), 2 
944. ° > , : 

Constable, see county officers. ~ 


12, sec. 1), 927, 928, 944. 
Contracts for supplies (art. 3 
190, 356-359; 732s 9445 © 
(art. 13, sec. 17), 944. 
ail Benes 3 


pated 345, aie 701; 
thanks, 388, 943; 
committees: appointment 
65, 159, 191, 196, 340, 513), 
777; requests to withdraw | 
238, 247, 926; resolutions 
445 46; vacancy in, 926; « 
46-47; hall, use of, 298, 323, 
896; journal, 160, 487, 942; 
members: compensation o 
199, 298, 301; leave of < pow 
288, 289, 298, 299, 350, 38 
551, 581, 628, 698, 707, ’ 
personal privileges, 338; 
190, 301, §21-522; 
officers: address of pre: 
tem, 4-5; assistant sec 
160, 942; election of, pro tem, 
23; number and compe! 
4) 9-21, 23-41; secretary, 5; 
organization, oath of 


powers and duties: 
debate, 25-41, action, . 


adjournment, 628-629, 
assembly, 1; order of | 
23s 37, 4355» 65> 67; 69, ' 


points of order, 75, 174) 
705, 706, 707, 708, 729, ” 


- Convention business (cont.) 


requests for information, 43, 44; 
sessions, 42, 43, 3025 

records: absentees, 636; newspaper 
reporters, 8; publication of debates, 
71-81, 153, 160-161; resolution, 46; 

rules: amendment of, 43, 50-55, 
340-345; committee on, 7, 21; limita- 
tion on speeches, 628, 629; new rules 
proposed, 48, 50, 201, 340, 395, 8973 
printing of, 65; quorum, 43, 383, 
387. See amendments to constitution. 


Corporations, dues (art. 10, sec. 2), 312, 


640, 644, 695, 944; for encourage- 
ment of internal improvements (art. 
To, sec. 6), 641, 944; organization by 
general law (art. 10, sec. 1), 300, 312, 
314, 640, 641-644, 695, 944. 


Council of revision, 7o. 
Counties, division (art. 7, sec. 2), 824- 


833, 944; formation of new (art. 7, 
sec. 1), 48, 111-124, 821, 824, 897, 
944; government for unorganized 
(art. 7, sec. 3), 834-835, 944; county 
seats, removal of (art. 7, sec. 5), 836, 
944, striking off or adding territory 
(art. 7, sec. 4), 835-836, 944. 


County courts, provided for, (art. 5, 


sec. 16), 45, 767-768, 770, 9445 
judges: compensation of (art. 5, 
sec. 20), 785, 944; election and terms 
of (art. 5, S€c. 17), 77°, 7715 9443 
jurisdiction of (art. 5, sec. 18), 771, 
772, 9443 
personnel (art. 5, sec. 19), 50, 778- 
7855 944. 


County commissioners court (schedule, 


sec. 6), 106-107. 


County officers, coroner, surveyor, etc., 


election of (art. 5), 806; recorder, 109, 
removal of (art. 5, sec. 25), 804, 806, 


944- 
Courts, appeals and writs of error (art. 


5, sec. 32), 888, 890, 944; appeals 
from local courts (art. 5, sec. 24), 794, 
798, 944; judicial officers, commis- 


INDEXES 3 IoIs 


Courts (cont.) : 
sions (art. 5, sec. 22), 798, 944; 
judicial power vested in (art. 5, sec. 
1), 448, 449-453, 760, 944; of equity, 
testimony in, 85. See county courts, 
county commissioners court, supreme 
court. 

Credit of state, not to be given (art. 3, 


sec. 38), 83, 729, 944. 


Debt, state, see appropriations and state 
debt tax. 

Distribution of powers (art. 2, sec. 1), 
55, 62-64, 837, 838, 944; no depart- 
ment to exercise power of others (art. 
2, sec. 2), §5, 836, 837, 944. 

Double jeopardy, eminent domain (art. 
13, sec. 11), 866, 944. 

Due process of law (art. 13, sec. 8), 84, 
732, 865, 944. 

Dueling, punishment (art. 13, sec. 25), 
191, 869, 871, 944; special oath con- 
cerning (art. 13, sec. 26), 872, 944. 


Elections, general, change in time of 
(art. 5, sec. 9), 46, 612, 944. 

Electors, privileges (art. 6, sec. 3), 609, 
612, 944; exempt from militia duty 
(art. 6, sec. 4), 609, 612, 944. 

Eminent domain, see double jeopardy. 

English language to be used (schedule, 
sec. 18), 890, 944. 

Evidence, in chancery suits, 890, 896; 
jury in libel suit (art. 13, sec. 24), 873, 
944- 

Executive power (art. 4, sec. 1), 45, 360, 
734s 944- 

Ex post facto laws (art. 13, sec. 17), 867, 
870, 944- 


Freedom, see conscientious objectors. 


General assembly, adjournment, (art. 3, 
sec. 19), 304, 698, 944; apportion- 
ment according to population (art. 3, 
sec. 8), 334-335, 944; fees and sala- 


1016 
General assembly (cont.) 
ries, restrictions (art. 3,sec. 22), 304, 
698; 944; general laws and divorce 
(art. 3, sec. 32), 108, 720, 944; gen- 
eral rules, punishment of members 
(art. 3, sec. 15), 304, 697, 944; ineligi- 
bility (art. 3, sec. 29), 309, 719, 9445 
journal, yeas, nays (art. 3, sec. 13), 
303, 697, 944; legislative pawer (art. 
3, sec. 1), 44, 66, 195, 284, 695, 944; 

members: apportionment by dis- 
tricts (art. 3, sec. 40), 874-875, 879- 
884, 944; compensation of (art. 3, sec. 
24), 44, 45, 76, 84, 124, 306-308, 699, 
944; disabilities of (art. 3, sec. 7), 83, 
308, 700-702, 944; election of (art. 3, 
sec. 2), 45, 285-288, 291-292, 695, 
944; number of (art. 3, sec. 6), 71, 
124-152, 153-158, 293-298, 302-303, 
696, 944; pay (art. 3, sec. 25), 308, 
699, 944; privileges of (art. 3, sec. 17), 
304, 6945 9445 

officers of, quorum (art. 3, sec. 12), 
303, 697, 944; open sessions, (art.3, 
sec. 19), 304, 698, 944; procedure on 
bills (art. 3, sec. 21), 195, 304, 698, 
944; prohibition of special privileges 
or exemptions (proposed section), 
311, 315-333, 359-360, 725; punish- 
ment, power of (art. 3, sec. 18), 304, 
698, 944; 

qualifications: representatives (art. 
3, sec. 3), 292, 695, 944; senators (art. 
3, Sec. 4), 292, 696, 9445 

requirements for bills and acts (art. 
3, sec. 23), 305, 698, 944; right of 
protest (art. 3, sec. 14), 304, 697, 944; 

senatorial and representative dis- 
tricts: excess population (art. 3, sec. 
10), 124, 153-157, 158, 335, 336-3375 
350-353, 727, 944; formation (art. 3, 
sec. 9), 48, 124, 335, 726, 9445 

senators, terms of (art. 3, sec. 5), 
45, 292, 696, 944; special sessions (art. 
4, SEC. 10), 393-403, 737, 944; time of 
meeting (art. 3, sec. II), 71, 84, 124, 


ILLINOIS ia COI af T. 


- Impeachment, officers liab 


303; 697, 9443 vac 

16), 304, 697,944. 
Government, a 2 | 

18), 871,944. 


in-chief (art. 4, sec. 11), 4 07 
election (art. 4, sec. 2) 360, 
filling vacancy (art. 4, sec. 
944; messages to g 
(art. 4, sec. 7), 736, 9. 
sec. 6), 736, 9443 Po 
general assembly 
944; power of appo: tment | 
_ Sec. 12), 837, 9445 ‘power over 
officers (art. 4, sec. 9) 737 
qualifications for (art. 4 4, 
3755 a 9445 Fem le 


944- 


Habeas corpus lat 3p Ses 


867, 944. 
Homestead and exempt 


ment (art. 3, sec. 2 
_ officers subject to (art. 
944; power of (art. 3 se 
702, 944. 
Imprisonment for debt (ie 
867, 944. A 
Indebtedness, see state del 
Indictment, see grand jury. 
Internal inprove t= se 
(art. Io, sec. ma 


sec. 11), 803, uy 94 
5, SEC. 12), 806, 807, 944 


eligibility to other offices (art. 5, sec. 
10), 71, 83, 802, 803, 944. See 
supreme court. 

Jurisdiction, see courts. 

Jury, trial by (art. 13, sec. 6), 864, 944. 
Justice, free and prompt (art. 13, sec. 

12), 866, 944. 
Justices of the peace (art. 5, sec. 27), 


785-786, 787-793) 944. 


Laws, codification and publication, 890- 
896; style (art. 3, sec. 20), 306, 699, 
944. See general assembly, special 
legislation. 

Legislative power (art. 3, sec. 1), 44, 66, 
195, 284, 695, 944. 

Legislature, see general assembly. 

Lieutenant governor, compensation 
(art. 4, sec. 17), 738, 944; election, 
term, qualifications (art. 4, sec. 14), 
403, 737, 944; rights of (art. 4, sec. 
15), 403, 737) 9443; succession to (art. 
4, sec. 18), 404, 738, 944. 

Life, liberty and property (art. 13, sec. 
1), 83, 846, 944. 

Lotteries, authorized by general assem- 
bly (art. 3, sec. 35), 109, 721, 944. 

Lucrative office, see offices. 


Message, see governor. 

Mileage, see general assembly, members: 
compensation of. 

Military, see civil power. 

Militia, exemptions (art. 8, sec. 2), 191, 
324, 613, 944; persons subject to 
service (art. 8, sec. 1), 324, 613, 9443 
privileges (art. 8, sec. 6), 324, 613,944. 

officers: commissioned by governor 
(art. 8, sec. 5), 613, 944; election (art. 
8, sec. 3), 613, 944; election of gener- 
als (art. 8, sec. 4), 324, 613, 944. 


Navy, see militia. 
Negroes, immigration and emancipation 
of in state (art. 14), 47, 201-228, 855— 


INDEXES 


1017 


Negroes (cont.) 
863, 873, 944; restrictions in marriage 
(proposed sections), 180, 871, 873. 


Oath, officers (art. 3, sec. 30), 310, 729, 
944. 

Officers, county, removal of (art. 5, sec. 
25), 804-806, 944; disqualification by 
crime (art. 3, sec. 31); 720, 944; elec- 
tion of not provided in constitution 

' (art. 5, sec. 23), 804, 805, 944; no life 
term (proposed section), 251. 

Offices, one lucrative office at a time 
(proposed section), 201; qualifica- 
tions (art. 6, sec. 7), 836, 944. 


Pardon, power of (art. 4, sec. 8), 71 
391-393, 736, 944- 

Penalties, proportioned to offense (art. 
13, sec. 14), 867, 944. 

Poll tax, see capitation. 

Preamble, 837. 

Press and speech, freedom of (art. 13, 
sec. 23), 389, 872, 944. 

Primogeniture, law prohibiting (pro- 
posed section), 890. 

Probate justice, (proposed section), 109. 

Process, form of (art. 5, sec. 26), 798, 944. 

Protest, see general assembly. 


Revenue, see taxation. 


Salaries and fees, see compensation. 

Sale of lands, see special legislation. 

Schedule (sec. 1-26), 944. 

School fund, 170-185, 191, 289, 809, 
898, 899, 925. 

Seal of state (art. 4, sec. 25), 741, 944. 

Search and seizure (art. 13, sec. 7), 864, 
944. 

Seat of government, change of (schedule 
proposed section), 290. 

Secretary of state (art. 4, sec. 22), 442- 
4445 739-7413 944. 

Sheriff, term of (art. 7, sec. 7), 71, 106, 
250, 805-806, 944. 


1018 


Slavery and involuntary servitude (art. 
13, sec. 16), 83, 867, 944. 

Soldiers, quartering. (art. 13, sec. 22), 
872, 944. 

Sovereignty of the people (art. 13, sec. 
2), 846-853, 871, 944. 

Speaker of the senate (art. 4, sec. 16), 
7385 944- 

Special legislation, prohibiting sale of 
lands (art. 3, sec. 36), 310, 721, 944. 

Speech, freedom, see press. 

State’s attorney (art. 5, sec. 28), 190, 
793-797» 944- 

State debt tax (art. 15), 48-50, 305, 457, 
885, 928,929, 931-939, 944. See 
appropriations and debt. 

State treasurer (art. 4, sec. 24), 190, 
514, 515, 741, 944. 

Suffrage, disqualifications (art. 6, sec. 8), 
609, 612, 944; qualifications (art. 6, 
sec. I), 47, 105-106, 170, 515-518, 
524-608, 611, 944; residence not lost 
by absence from United States on 
business of the state (art. 6, sec. 5), 
609, 612, 944; residence of soldiers, 
seamen and marines (art. 6, sec. 6), 
609, 612, 944. 

Suits against state (art. 3, sec. 34), 310, 
720, 944. 

Superintendent of public instruction 
(common schools), 48, 899, 900-925, 

Supreme court, appeals and writs of 
error (art. 5, sec. 32), 888, 890, 944; 

clerks: election of (art. 5, sec. 21), 
83, 806, 809, 944; terms, duties, com- 
pensation of (art. 5, sec. 29), 83, 7973 
798, 9445 

judges: grand divisions for election 
of, provided for (art. 5, sec. 3), 82, 


ILLINOIS HISTORICAL COLLECTIONS 


Supreme Court (cont.) 
456-484, 488, 743-759, 762-765, 887, ~ 
provision for altering (art. 5, sec. 33), 
889, 890, 944; named (art. 5, sec. 30), 
887-890, 944; terms of (art. 5, sec. 4), 
82, 488, 489, 765. 

jurisdiction (art. 5, sec. 5), 82, 454, 
765, 944; members, quorum (art. 5, 
sec. 2), 82, 454-456, 761, 944; number 
of cases tried, number of pending, 106, 
110; places of meeting (art. 5, sec. 31), 
88%, 890, 944; salaries and eligibility 
to other offices (art. 5, sec. 10), 71, 
83, 802,803; terms (art. 5, sec. 6), 
489-499, 767, 799, 9443 time of elec- 
tion (art. 5, sec. 14), 804, 805, 944; . 
vacancies (art. 5, sec. 9), 801, 
802. 


Taxation, capitation tax (art. 9, sec. 1), 
45-71, 90-100, 611, 615-626, 809, 
815-817, 944; corporate taxes (art. 9, 
sec. 5), 638, 820, 944; exemptions 
(art. 9, sec. 3), 633, 637, 816, 9445 
(proposed section), 201; form of pay- 
ment (proposed section), 635; powers 
of general assembly (art. 9, sec. 6), 
638, 820, 944; redemption from tax 
sales (art. 9, sec. 4), 634, 819, 9445 
uniform rule, special taxes (art. 9, 
sec. 2), 70, 92, 106, I91, 192-195, 250, 
627, 629-632, 814, 816, 871, 944. 

Township organization (art. 7, sec. 6), 
845, 944. 


Veto power (art. 4, sec. 21), 83, 404-442, 


739 944- 
Voting by ballot (art. 6, sec. 2), 48, 84, 


608, 612, 944. 


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